Project Cars--You Get to Vote on "Hold 'em or Fold 'em"

bhill2

Wasn't the Colt the one that had a 4-speed trans and also a high and low range splitter? I assumed so that you had your choice of accelerating (low range) or hearing yourself think (high range).

jlflemmons

that's the one. Low range made it scat like a scared cat, but with a top speed of maybe 80mph, IIRC. But then you just shifted into high range and the engine came back to earth.

omarman

After several re-listings that SCCA 1970 Mustang BOSS 302 A Sedan race car sold on ebay with 1 bid at $10K.

boomchek

but the listing received a whopping 14000+ views!! Curious to see if it will be relisted for less.

tjc78

If you are trying to get the most out of that lot, wouldn't make sense to hire a mechanic on the side to look them over? I am sure for a modest amount of money you could get fresh gas in the ones that look good, get them running, and then spend a few bucks on a quick detail. After that list them one by one giving an honest description. I just don't see them selling as a lot.

Edit: I just went back and looked at them again. What a mess, second option... put them up at no reserve and take the poor soul who takes on the project out to dinner! :P

steine13

I think you're looking at this the wrong way.

The issue here is not so much the right way to sell this, uh, collection.... The unfathomable lunacy is winding up with the collection in the first place ;->

-Mathias

ghulet

....like I said (as did many others), just because one lunatic decided to own (and has space for) umpteen non-running XKEs doesn't mean that a.) anyone else in the U.S. would want them, b.) even if they did, probably wouldn't have the space to store them, and most importantly, c.) certainly wouldn't want to part with two-hundred thousand dollars for the, ahem, privelege of doing so.

It's totally a matter of wishful thinking, with a total disconnect from reality, that the seller thinks he can just dump them off and end up with a Little Lotto amount of money in the end.

boomchek

for the same starting price :surprise: but in a different category (Jag-others vs Jag-X-type).

Ummm, maybe someone should break the news to the seller that it wasn't the wrong category that resulted in 0 bids, especially after 14000 people saw the listing, but rather the price.

eBay Jags

danbone111

Crazy. I just google'd the phone number in the ad. This guy owns a body shop.
"http://www.personaltouchautobodyny.com/"....on his website, he mentions that his business is much slower than previously. If that is the case, why doesn't he at least build value in these Jags and do work to them? Wouldn't that make more sense? Unless he has already realized that any money invested in these Jaguars will never see a 'return on investment', and he has just given up.....

Mr_Shiftright

$500 bucks apiece to be spent on professional detailing would do wonders for those cars and $1000 apiece would probably get someone to bite on the lot.

qbrozen

Pretty sharp looking. At least if you don't open the hood, that is.

fintail

Doesn't look bad...small bumpers, decent engine size, inoffensive color...just really needs a good cleaning under the hood and inside. Doesn't look rotten or dented up. Those /8 coupes are pretty unloved...his price would reflect a car detailed to concours standards...I'd knock off a grand anyway for a good price, if every single thing checks out.

ghulet

....then again, I've always been a fan of simple-and-boxy, it's kind my thing.

Mr_Shiftright

Decent-looking old Benz. These models are pretty spartan, and you'd best get used to neck-snapping transmission shifts and putting your foot to the floor to get any power out of it (which is what Benz wants you to do anyway).

Pretty scary engine bay, though. I think I'd walk away just based on looking at that. One engine problem and this car is totaled.

You can't treat a Benz like that.

Mr_Shiftright

Just thought I'd share this with you. I know it sounds a bit self-serving but that's not my intention.

My friend wanted to sell his '89 Toyota 4Runner. 4X4 Decent body, filthy interior, some rust spots on the removable rear cabin trim, dirty engine, 300K miles.

I told him sell it as is for $1500. He says, no, these are desirable trucks because they are 4X4 and this is last year for the removable rear section (turning it from an SUV into an instant pickup truck). This is true, people do like 'em.

So, he pays for a massive detailing $300. We buy all the materials to repaint the wheels---a good thorough job---- (+ our labor) and also install new chrome lug nuts. ($100). He buys a jack $35. He buys seat covers (the old seats were pretty bad) $60. He buys carpeting for the back (all rotted away) + glue, snaps, etc + labor ($100 materials). He buys new wiper blades (old ones hanging off), buttons for the door locks (missing), one chrome strip for windshield (missing, very ugly, leaks)---so another $150 bucks.

Then, the truck really looks GOOD, for what it is....and he advertises for $2900.

First buyer comes, says yes, backs out next morning.

Some tire kickers come, go for rides, no takers.

Another buyer comes, wants to take truck for inspection 35 miles away. Does this, comes back with long list of defects, offers $2000. My friend says no.

Another buyer comes, truck finally sells for $2500 if my friend pays for smog ($80).

SUMMARY: In my opinion, he should have just sold it for $1500 in the first place. Putting lipstick on a pig is difficult and expensive.

ghulet

.....sounds like after all the $$ he spent on stuff to fix it up ($735 if my math is correct) and all the labor and time involved, he netted exactly $185 ($2500-735-80 for smog) over the original $1500. Probably not worth the hassle....but some people have to be 'right', y'know.

tjc78

I guess I don't know the market very well because no way in you know what I am paying $2500 for a 21 year old truck with 300K on the odometer.

He basically netted $175 for all his and your labor. This sounds a lot like a Wheeler Dealer's episode!

Mr_Shiftright

That's what I thought. But you know, there were lookers even with 300K.

I guess this fits in with the Shiftright "Basement Theory".

This theory suggests that there is an imaginary "basement floor" for ANY basically decent-looking used vehicle that is registered, passes a safety check, and has no presently horrible problems. It looks okay, it starts, it stops, it goes.

For a car in 2010, my opinion is that this basement floor is about $1500 to $2000 for a decent "grocery getter" (not a cross-country car).

Now for a 4X4 pickup, this might be a bit higher.

In the Basement Theory, mileage becomes irrelevant because the fact that the vehicle is running and decent looking defeats cheaper cars, even with 1/2 the mileage, that look worse and don't run very well.

ghulet

....haven't had my 528e looked at, it's basically sitting in the garage, waiting for me to get a check in the mail (I'm not taking it in til I have the $$, otherwise it basically becomes a hostage). Anywho, I mention this to a friend (well, a co-drinker at my bar) and he says, "why don't you just buy another car, you can get a GREAT car for two thousand bucks" (I love these people: those who suggest you buy things, never mind they're not offering to pay, and this guy doesn't even own a car, and runs a tab for a month at a time at the cheapest pub in the neighborhood, and rarely tips). I try to explain to him that $2k is not going to get a 'great car', and at that price it'll likely have problems, too. :lemon: It's the devil-you-don't-know theory. Ugh.

Mr_Shiftright

"great" car? No.

Car that can get you to 7-11 and the gym (or bar)....sure.

stickguy

Ghulet, what happend to the 525? I have been a bit out of touch.

makes me feel better about the last care I bought (12/08), which coincidentally, I paid exactly $2,000 for.

2000 Acura TL. 1 owner, always dealer serviced. Some scratches (although I think it got most after my son drove it to HS!).

So far, only needed an oil change and new tires, and that was just bacause my son whammed a pothole, and bulged a sidewall, so I decided better safe than sorry. We have put about 3-4K miles on it I think in the 15 months, so not exactly wearing it out.

150K on it, but it runs like 1/2 that, and the interior (other than drivers seat) looks like new.

No idea what I could get for it, but I suspect if I detailed it all up, with the new sneaks, that I could advertise at $3,995 and get plenty of action?

Certainly helps that it was a family deal (my sisters car), and she offered it to me for the same price that the dealer was giving her as a trade in!

ghulet

.....are you saying you paid $2k for a 2000 Acura TL? Sign me up!

The trans in the 528e is slipping (barely moves under its own power, but will shift gears, I've driven it VERY short distances) again: I had this problem in December, but had the fluid, filter and gasket changed ($120) and it ran/shifted fine for a couple months. So, like I said, I'm just waiting for a check (401k money I didn't even know I had....yeah, I know I should roll it over, but I'm unemployed and just need it) to at least have it looked at; clearly, if it needs a new trans, it's going bye-bye (maybe the BMW shop will buy it as a parts car, though at its age, they probably don't see much need). I'm just kinda bummed, cuz everything works, it has nice tires, runs great, brakes and steering are fine, and it looks OK, at least for 22 years old. I guess I'm saying if it were plagued with a bunch of other problems, I wouldn't mind so much the prospect of dumping it and possibly getthing another car.

I did have a guy stop me on the street, give me his number and offer another '88 528e (tan with tan leather, I guess) but we didn't get around to condition/price, etc. Plus, if I were to buy another car, it probably wouldn't be that!

As for that Acura, Stick, unless it's more beat up than I can imagine, I'd think you could get at least $5k for it, even with 150k (which isn't really all that many on a 10 year-old car, especially not a Honda). Kinda shocked a dealer would offer your sister only $2k on trade, that's laughable. FYI, just checked autotrader, cheapest TL of that era--it's a 2000--within 100 miles is $4495 and it has 220k (though a new timing belt and water pump, at least). All others are $5500-9900, the latter having 52k miles.

boomchek

Good story and so true. It's very easy to get buried in something that old by pouring endless amount of money to make it look nice.

texases

So much for 'these are desirable because' nonsense! Here's a super clean one that only got bid up to $3050, 'reserve not met' of course because, well, EVERYONE knows that 'these are desireable'...
clean '89 4Runner

Mr_Shiftright

They were good vehicles (obviously, if my friend could drive one to 300K without opening up the engine--he's the original owner), but I think the Ebay bid was absolutely market correct for that particular one.

xwesx

I absolutely agree with you there and see that all the time here in Fairbanks. Here, you basically cannot buy a working automobile for less than $1500. If you see one advertised for that, it is either being sold by an ignorant military kid that just came from a saner place (usually the South) where old vehicles sell for next-to-nothing or it is just a pile of metal and bolts. The first case will often end up as a good buy for someone, but the second is simply the transfer of a nightmare from one owner to another.

Actually, I was thinking I would sell my '98 DGC (213K) for $1500 this Spring if I can figure out the darned electrical problem that has it hobbled right now. Otherwise, even though the mechanical, body, and interior are all in beautiful condition, it is essentially worthless.

Mr_Shiftright

Remind us --what are these electrical problems (if the re-telling is not too painful) :P

stickguy

bummer on your BMW. But, if it really is good otherwise, and you can only get a couple hurdred $$ out of it, it might make sense to throw a tranny in it.

If, of course, your indy can find a reasonable deal on a used one that checks out. Just do the math. If you can get it replaced for 2K, or sell it for $200, you are looking at having an effective $2200 in the BMW.

Or, you can have $2200 in cash, and have to find another car for that which will be as good (and non-needy!) as the 525. Might not be that easy.

I would have the same dilema on the TL if the tranny went south (also a possibility with a V6 Honda!). rest of car is very clean, engine runs strong, so if I put a rebuild in it, I would likely still be ahead of the game over what I could otherwise get for the money.

xwesx

Basically, when I turn the key to "on," I will either hear the fuel pump whir and the vehicle will start right up, or I will not hear anything, followed by a single "click" a second later. If the "click" occurs, the van will not start and I also do not have any current to the fuel injectors, ignition coil, or fuel pump. From the information I have, those things are controlled by something called an Automatic Shutdown circuit, which apparently gets its input from the crankshaft and camshaft sensors. If the computer does not detect feedback from those sensors, it shuts down that circuit. Well, I checked those sensors and they get power.... I replaced the sensors and no change.

If it starts, the van works perfectly until it is shut off. After that, it is back to the same old game. I am thinking it may be related to the Body Control Module, which is, apparently, notoriously faulty in the third generation Chrysler vans, but the link is not entirely clear to me.... :confuse:

Okay, so the re-telling was not to painful for me - was it for you?! :P

Mr_Shiftright

no I hardly suffered at all. Well the BCM idea doesn't sound right. That thingie mostly controls driver interface items.

A failure to get a signal from your distributor pickup will shut down the ASD relay.

qbrozen

These models are pretty spartan, and you'd best get used to neck-snapping transmission shifts and putting your foot to the floor to get any power out of it

Yup. Sounds exactly like my 190E. :P

Actually, the neck-snapping has been reduced greatly since I discovered you can adjust a vacuum switch to "soften" the shifts.

xwesx

Hmm.... okay, I'll look at that, too. I am constantly amazed at all the problems owners report (seemingly unrelated to driver interface items) that are cleared up by replacement of the BCM. In addition, I occasionally have the 'dead instrument cluster' problem, but have since buying it and it never affected the vehicle's performance otherwise. So, whether or not they are related, I don't know. I figured I would pull the cluster and re-solder the main connector to hopefully fix that issue. The BCM is spendy, so rather than replace, I was planning to pull the connector(s) and clean/grease them to start.

Another complicating factor is the quarters-in-the-CD-player incident (kids, you know...) that preceded all these lovely happenings by a few weeks. That stunt fried the radio, but the radio fuse didn't separate when it blew... it essentially fused together such that current passed through it. As a result, it blew a little 10A fuse in the main fuse/relay box under the hood. When the fuse was blown, things such as the power door locks would not work unless the car was "on." When the fuse was replaced, the locks were fine until it blew again. I eventually tracked down the radio fuse and removed it, so I think that issue is at least temporarily resolved.

Mr_Shiftright

Have you considered parking it on an ice lake or in an avalanche area.....I was just sayin'.....

qbrozen

This sounds a lot like a Wheeler Dealer's episode!

LOL! That it did.

And that example is exactly why I sold my pickup "as is" when I had the chance.

qbrozen

Speaking of the Benz, I think we may be keeping it unless we need the money. Last Thursday, I blew a coil on my volvo just as I left my house, and it was ever so convenient that I could go right back home, transfer the kids to the spare car, and still get to work on time.

Had to order parts and wait for a free moment to fix it, so I drove the Benz Thurs, Fri, Mon, and Tues. I was so grateful to be back in the Volvo today. God I love this car.

And, in just 9 months, I can put the Benz on my Hagerty policy.

xwesx

Hahah; yeah, I've considered it. The problem is that it only starts once in a blue moon.... and we did not have any of those this winter. :P

omarman

SUMMARY: In my opinion, he should have just sold it for $1500 in the first place. Putting lipstick on a pig is difficult and expensive.

Did the $300 detail include all the parts (paint, jack, seat covers, carpet, etc) plus another $150 for the windshield strip? So, maybe $500 + labor ?

Is that the same 4Runner from post #19835?

If so, I thought the original post was a 'yes' vote on spending the money to spiff up an old vehicle like that. :confuse:

The 4Runner fans must consider it "desirable" if not collectible since they were still interested despite 300K miles. Still, I would have chosen the advice for a quick-sale at $1,500.

ghulet

....I think Shiftright's point was that it could have sold, quickly and easily, as was for $1500. Instead his friend put out ~$800, and a considerable amount of labor, and got $2500, thus not netting a big difference. In other words, 'spiffing up' (making it clean and presentable without spending hundreds of dollars) is one thing, but trying to fix every little thing on a twenty year-old car is kinda pointless......at least that's what I got out of the story.,

steine13

Man, here I was questioning all I know about buying old cars... until we got to...

[..] she offered it to me for the same price that the dealer was giving her as a trade in!

All is right with the world after all.
-Mathias

Mr_Shiftright

Yes the same vehicle. The PROBLEM is that he wouldn't stop with the original list.

As you may know, if you spiff up one part of the car, the part NEXT to the spiffed up part looks like crap.

When we washed and waxed it....well, it looked pretty dull next to those nicely painted wheels----so then it was buffed out professionally. That looked great, until you opened the hood and saw a grimey, greasy engine that contrasted sharply with the exterior---so that needed doing.

Then, when we washed it, we noticed the chrome strip missing and water leaking into the interior (he always parks in a car port and NEVER took it to a car wash).

So, you know, "the best laid plans of mice and men...etc."

stickguy

lets see, mixed messages: Blew a coil pack, but love the car anyway..

Good enough for me!

Now what about the red 5 speed? Whatta you think it's worth going through the auction?

texases

Well, now you get the satisfaction of the new owner enjoying a nice vehicle! At least, that's what the guy says on Wheeler Dealers, when their 40 hours of labor yield 50 quid!

fintail

Mike has to be the worst negotiator when he sells, too.

qbrozen

Blew a coil pack, but love the car anyway..

Repairs are gonna happen on a $6800 near-luxo car. You won't hear me crying about it. It doesn't detract from getting in, hitting the road, and my back is thanking me for the wonderful seat, my right foot is thanking me for the wonderful power, my ears are thanking me for the quiet ride and wonderful stereo, and my hands are thanking me for the wonderful feel of the wheel.

explorerx4

i posted a couple of weeks or so about my explorer blowing the #20 fuse, which shut a lot of things down and allowed the radio to stay on unless you shut it off.
after replacing the fuse, everything was fine until my wife washed it.
anyways, i disabled the programming for the easy entry seat, it slides back when you open the driver's door, put in a new fuse and so far, so good.
if the fuse goes again, i have 3 left in the pack of 5 i bought and am willing to invest another $5 for another pack of 5, before i will consider having someone else look at it.

omarman

When we washed and waxed it....well, it looked pretty dull next to those nicely painted wheels----so then it was buffed out professionally. That looked great, until you opened the hood and saw a grimey, greasy engine that contrasted sharply with the exterior---so that needed doing.

Ah, okay got it.

It's funny how things work out. Sometimes the seller can look at his car with the optimism of an interested buyer who really wants to like it.

"Just needs a bit of TLC and cleaning and then it will fetch a good price."

The old guy who sold a 1939 Plymouth to the American Pickers TV show had a different approach. He made his old car more appealing by turning down a generous offer until the next offer was just too good to ignore.

Turned down a $5K offer, asked something like $6K and accepted $5,500.

fintail

The Plymouth guy was a good bargainer...that old thing was probably worth $2500 on a good day.

ghulet

....I was thinking the number of people who want a pre-War Plymouth has to be quite limited, though I could be wrong. Actually, it seems the market for pre-War anything, other than Ford coupes apparently, is limited. Whad'reya gonna do with the thing?

hpmctorque

This makes sense. does the $1,500-$2,000 assume that the vehicle will pass the state inspection as is, or with some but not much work?

Mr_Shiftright

Yeah that would assume passing a state inspection as is, or very close to passing---maybe a burned out license plate light or some such.