Mike: When you get on the "auto Insider" site you will see a list of all the stories for the last seven days or so that appeared in the paper. Or just search for Mel Farr.
Mike: Sorry, I tried to pull that article up with no luck. Used their archives link for yesterday and not it was not there I'll keep trying and report back.
Search Mel Farr on the internet and you will get thousands of references. Unfortunately, his dealership network fell apart in the 2001-02 timeframe when Ford pulled most of its dealerships.
A few years ago in Chicago, Boss Daley attempted to close all of the pay-day loan places as he believed that they ripped off a lot of the poor folks in Chicago. For that, he was lambasted by thousands of the poor and their advocates as cutting off their supply of credit.
BHPH lots are here to stay for prettty much the same reasons.
Mike: lawrence is correct about Farr. He was / is being sued by everyone on the planet it seems. Lost most of his dealerships in and around Detroit and northern Ohio but his BHPH empire is pretty much intact. Runs screamer ads "we will finance ANYONE" The story cited several horror stories about 60 month leases on a car worth $2100 and god father -like interest rates, preditory lending practices etc.
He puts a device on the car that will allow it to be disabled by remote control if the customer misses a weekly payment and most of the folks he sells to pay weekly. The story citing customers standing in long lines on pay day to make a payment to keep the car operational for another seven days. Selling leases on 10 year old cars that if payed out total three to four times the worth of the vehicle.
Living in Florida I've never heard of this guy but I guess folks around Detroit know him all to well. I don't follow pro football but appearantly he was a big NFL star years ago and parlayed his "fame" into a dealership empire that finally collapsed in part due to all the shady wheeling & dealing.
That article on the Detroit News Auto Insider web was there as a lead story with photos on 5-3-05. It was gone today and could not be pulled up from their archives ( at least I could not get it done). Could it be that the story was too controversial and they pulled it ? Dunno !
Let's be real honest about Mel Farr - the good, the bad, and the ugly. I am very familiar with him as I lived in Detroit and had many employees who purchased a vehicle through him.
You accurately stated the cast against Mel Farr who is the favorite whipping boy of both the Detroit News and the Detroit Free Press. You may notice that they are far more vocal these days as Mel is not spending as much with the two newpapers. In fact, throughout the 80's, he was their favorite "local boy done good" and being African-American to boot, they were always stating how great he was.
Mel Farr services a market that NOONE else does. He will sell a car to ANYONE who needs one even if they have very bad credit. These are not people who have a record of paying their bills. However, as anyone who has tried to live in Detroit without a car knows, they need a car to have gainful employment. Very few people used public transportation even in the central corridor as it exposed them to crime.
I would be the first to tell anyone to avoid BHPH lots, check cashing places, sub-prime lenders, HR Block Refund anticipation loans, etc as they are complete rip-offs. However, I am not one who has to worry about COMED shutting off my electric, nor am I facing foreclosure, repo, etc. However, I have spent some of my free time over the years with people who are facing these difficult choices.
Personally, I like the automatic shutdown feature. I think that it is creative and does less harm than quick repos. Many years ago, I had a landlord with a simple (and similar) philosophy. The rent payment was in his hands by 8pm on the first of the months or your stuff would be on the curb by 8am the following morning.
For the record, I pay cash for nearly everything - twenty years without a car note and five without a mortgage.
I will see if I can find the article from other sources.
lawrence: As repugnant as this BHPH business is it does fill a need. I'm curious as to why the story disappeared from the Insider site. It may have been a reprint of an actual story from the pages of the paper. It was clear from the graphics that Mr. Farr is indeed Afro-American. In deference to the fanatic adherence to the "politically correct" phobia the whole country is currently infected with I don't think I remember any reference of his ethnicity was mentioned in the text.
I hope you can find that article as the rest of the "crew" here would get a bang out of it.
Mel was a football player for the Detroit Lions - I believe a wide receiver.
Ford recruited him as one of their first minority dealers. In the early years of the company, Ford had a bad reputation in a number of minority communities due to the founders's personal political views. In the sixties, they made a conscious effort to recruit and develop minority-owned dealerships.
Mel ran a lot of ads on TV under the caption of "Mel Farr, Superstar" where he had a caricature of himself going across the screen.
His dealerships started in Detroit and he added several throughout the midwest.
The sub-prime activity started in the early '90s as far as I remember. He was featured in a couple of articles in the Wall Street Journal as a model of sub-prime lending.
I am not going to spend hours debating on each one of the practices that he is alleged to have instituted. Some are bad and some have been exaggerated in the press repeatedly because, let's face it, nothing sells newspapers better than "Dealer ABC is a crook".
Mathias has a phrase that fits here, "It is expensive to be poor." That is one of the reasons that I hand out Dave Ramsey's "Financial Freedom" to a lot of people that I counsel.
Alright heres my question, I lately turned 16 and my dad agreed to buy me a 2000 jetta. Thing is we planned on buying from a dealer and he would have payed with a credit card. But I found a few nice jetta's im interested from private parties, so how do we pay for this without having a solid 8-10grand in a bank account? Are there loans for this or what?
the credit card my dad would have used would be 0% apr for a year and we would easily pay it off by then. But the problem is not how I would buy it off a dealer but how I would pay a private party, we just need some money to pay with for now, we would easily pay it off in a year
What I would do, given my options, is to get a cash advance on the credit card from my credit union. No fee, which is rare, but 12% interest or thereabouts. Then pay that balance as quickly as I can with the 0% card -- read the fine print; if a "balance transfer fee" applies, just forget it and get a car loan. Many times, though, the fee is waived for a period of time, so you pay the 12% on 30 days or however long it takes for the money to arrive,and after that it's 0% and smooth sailling.
It's a great deal IF you know what you're doing. Most people do not.
Oh, and I would argue against a Jetta if money is at all an issue. It's not the $1200 alternator, it's what that $1200 may do to your finances. But only you can answer that question.
Those 0% deals on credit cards can come back to bite you. Be one day late making your payments and as Emeril says "BAM" you're at 24% APR !! I agree with all the above guys. A Jetta can be a bottomless money pit. No disrespect but what does a 16 year old NEED a Jetta for anyway ? Get a nice Civic and put a loud muffler on it lika everybody else. LOL.
...whatever happened to young kids buying cars with good old-fashioned CASH? I bought my first car for $650 in 1981 and the car was still running 11 years later.
lemco: I'm an "old geezer" and my life's experience with kids and cars taught me that they have a lot more respect for their "wheels" if they bought and paid for it with the sweat of their own brow, NOT daddy's. Plus (and this will raise a LOT of hackles) a 16 year old does not need to be driving anyway ( let the hate mail begin) eighteen is soon enough. Many states are tightening up the ages and restrictions on teen drivers. I'm all for it !!
.... **whatever happened to young kids buying cars with good old-fashioned CASH?** ....
They're living with their parents who have been living in a $300,000 home for the last 2 years and can't even afford a new living room set --- where do you think they get it from.? ..l.o.l.....
"whatever happened to young kids buying cars with good old-fashioned CASH?"
Lem, you would be happy to know the good old days of young people paying cash are still alive.
We sold our 1994 Altima to a young guy from Guatemala for $800 cash this weekend. He couldn't speak English too well, but an older friend who came with him could speak it well, so the transaction was very smooth.
These recent immigrants in our area work hard for thier money and seem to know the value of a dollar.
Recently had to pick my cousin's kid up from work. He's close to getting his license, and he told me he's "saving up" for a car. If the kid makes more than $150 a week, I'll eat my hat. He may be able to save up even a couple thou, but that's not going to get him much, never mind the insurance (which will probably run at least $125/month for a 16 yr old) or the gas or the maintenance. I just said "uh huh".
royce: Don't know where you live but the housing market here in Florida is on a rampage. My son recently (just over one year ago) completed a new home @ just over 200K. Just sold it for over 300K and now is building one in the 400K range. At this point they are not too concerned about new living room furniture LOL ! A home is the best possible investment anyone can possibly make. Where else can you make that kind of return on your money and get to live in it too ? No kids to worry about at their house tho.
But let's be honest, it doesn't take a genius in todays world, just cheap interest rates because they're "buying" a payment, just like cars ..l.o.l... .. but it does amaze me on how many folks buy these homes and they don't have enough money to even furnish them - kinda sad ..... . lets see what happens in the next 2/3 years when the balloon breaks .. California twice.
...a home equity loan on account of such a scenario. Could you imagine somebody borrowing money on a home equity loan only to have the bubble burst and his property value plummet?
Isell: I agree on the ticking time bomb if you'd happen to be sitting on a big mortage and home values go into the tank. In the case of my son his present home already is under contract and the new $400K one will be "free and clear" no mortage ! Not bad for a 28 year old "kid"
.......... You gotta be pretty proud of that "kid" ........
But as time goes on, I have a funny feeling he's going to be the minority .... most homeowners I've seen in the last 2/3 months (and I've seen a bunch in the SE) can't buy steam off a hotdog, let alone have some real equity -- and by the way, where the heck is the dining room table.? ..l.o.l....
Please see the discussion title for more information on what this discussion is about
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
Sure thing. How about this: new house builders really want to be "Buy Here, Pay Here" places, offering discounts and perks if the buyer chooses the "preferred" or "approved" lender.
The discussion title did not say what the items bought and paid for were :P
Ah, yes... but we ARE an automotive message board. If that's not 100% clear, then one has to wonder how you ended up here in the first place
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As Kirstie has implied, seems to be alot of stereotyping going on here. Most of you people are living in a very sheltered world, if you think all BHPH customers are below the poverty line, and uneducated. The bad credit world has changed, and any of you could be in it, despite your 6 figures and leased Bimmer 5-series.
Six Figures? In D-Mark, maybe... There is a lot of stereotyping here, of course. There was also a good discussion with some different point of views.
I would argue that the leading cause of bad credit is not living within your means. And its prevalent at all income levels. I'd also argue that it's a lot harder to pay your bills when you're poor.
But the stories around the campfire here have centered on people digging themselves nice, deep holes, and living close to the edge when things are going well. Then, a little something goes wrong, and poof... the house of cards comes down.
Of course, if a big something goes wrong, say a liver transplant, then everyone south of Bill Gates would be in trouble. So have a seat, join the fun.
And oh yeah, happy payday everyone. George should be by the office today with a wad of bills...
That's my point. If that person loses that income, his credit is ruined. And if he doesn't own a car outright, he won't be getting a legitimate car loan anytime soon. Don't think all used car buyers are trailer trash or ghetto dwellers, who work in fast food.
bls, I think you're barking up the wrong tree here...
"That's my point. If that person loses that income, his credit is ruined." Well, that's the point, isn't it? If I lose my job, my credit will be just fine so long as I continue to meet my obligations. And since I haven't backed myself into a corner like so many people do, I can survive at least in the short term. Bad credit does not follow from job loss in and of itself.
"Don't think all used car buyers are trailer trash or ghetto dwellers, who work in fast food" Come again? I'm a used car buyer myself, thank you very much. And some of my friends are (or were) trailer 'inhabitants'. Is there anything wrong with that?
I have a lot more respect for someone who lives responsibly on a limited income than fro someone with the aforementioned six-figure income who lives hand to mouth.
It appears to me that you are stereotyping, and I don't care for it. Ghetto dwellers...???
I just sense alot of condescending attitudes towards people with credit problems here. We have the credit card companies screwing people everyday, identity theft, vengeful ex-spouses, etc. If you have the income and self-discipline to never use credit, and stay out of George Orwell's database, more power to you. Most people don't live that way.
Ghetto dwellers and trailer trash can be of any ethenicity. You should go back earlier in the dialogue where posters are talking about "bling" and pimped out 10 year old SUV's. Don't persecute me, I'll put my proactive attitudes towards racial diversity up against anyone. You don't know me, so don't judge me.
***We have the credit card companies screwing people ***
Unless the credit laws were changed in the last week or so, no credit card company can issue a credit card without a borrower's signature.
***If you have the income and self-discipline to never use credit, and stay out of George Orwell's database, more power to you. Most people don't live that way. ***
Maybe they should. They's be better off living lifestyles that they can afford. It is kind of a sign of maturity.
I've been reading these forums for several years, never posted before this thread, and after being gang attacked here, will never post again.
I come to this site because I enjoy cars. I've noticed a certain elitism on these forums. People always talking about Land Rovers and Lexus', and how they would never own a Ford Taurus because all American cars are junk.
The moderator starts a thread about the BHPH dealers, and I could about guess what responses would follow. Instead of having a meaningful dialogue concerning these dealers. The posters commenced to criticize the patrons of such dealerships, even going as far as using the term "credit criminals". I would say most of you people have sufficient income, that your credit rating is an afterthought to you. It's easy for you to criticize those less fortunate. You've obviously never had to use a credit card to by groceries, because it's the only currency you have, all the while wondering what will happen when you reach the credit limit. You folks, as I said earlier, are completely out of touch if you think people are using credit to live a luxurious lifestyle. You probably see things that way, because in your social circle, those with credit problems are high income earners who bought too much stuff. The economic reality is that there are people out there who have maintained stellar credit ratings for decades, who have a catastrophic job loss, disability, etc. I guess these 50 some things are immature because they have to default on their loans in order to buy food. These aren't rare cases either, get out of your subdivisions and look around. Meanwhile, enjoy your luxury imports.
does serve a need in America's society- it lets people who are in a dire financial situation (whatever that may be) have something to drive in. It's just a set of wheels.
Although some places employ some very sleazy tactics, hey, they're (the BHPH lots) just trying to make a living too, just like the rest of us.
And there's nothing wrong with a Ford Taurus- its a reliable, fairly safe, boring, affordable automobile that Ford never really paid much attention to. I plan to get one for my kids because they're cheap and reliable.
Actually, we buy most of our groceries using a credit card - because it pays us a percentage back in cash - we might have even maxed out the annual cash dividend amount on one card by now.
But then again I pay off the balance in full each month!
...guys buying groceries with credit cards. I feel bad for them as they obviously don't look like people who've been living beyond their means. They've passed a draconian new bankruptcy law about a month ago. It goes into effect in October. If you're sitting on the fence contemplating bankruptcy - file now before it's too late! Hopefully, this wicked new law will be repealed if our politicians ever come to their senses. In the meantime, we'll see a surge in crime and homelessness.
Also - beware of a clause in your credit card agreement called "universal default." It means that if you're late on ANY bill, (i.e. telephone) - not just your credit card, the credit card company can raise your interest rate. It's pure unbridled evil greed.
...guys buying groceries with credit cards. I feel bad for them as they obviously don't look like people who've been living beyond their means.
I do it all the time. Why do you feel bad for me? :confuse: I use my Citibank card which gives back 5% of each grocery purchase and then I pay back the bill in full every month. Advantages: 1) No messing with change 2) Get to use bank's money for free for a month 3) Get 5% cash back on your grocery bill 4) One consolidated bill for all purchases (I use it for everything) - makes budgeting much easier
I feel bad for people who are unable to take advantage of this opportunity.
I charge groceries, gas, $4 lunches, and anything else I buy. I do it for reasons similar to tulip's. I dislike having to go to ATMs, I hate to touch cash for hygienic reasons, and I am far too lazy to write checks.
I also just financed the entire purchase price of a new car. I didn't do this because I needed to; I did it because I preferred to and it made financial sense to me.
Sure, I use credit cards for all purchases as I cannot hold on to a checkbook if I carry it on my person and I rarely carry more than $20 in cash (call it years of working/living in the innercity).
There is a whole lot of difference between using credit cards when you have the money in the bank AND carrying a balance month to month at 18%+ per annum interest.
Do realize that if you use cards, most people tend to spend more per transaction than cash users. banks count on that and want people to charge more on average.
Having said all that (and bringing the subject back on topic), I am personally tired of counselling people considering bankruptcy to hold on to a vehicle that they CANNOT afford. Does a single woman with one child and a <$25k income really need a 2 year old Expedition to drive five miles a day to the office? My old beater does a lot more for a whole lot less.
I think that Mathias is right on target, like usual.
I use my Discover Card for almost everything- gas, groceries, school supplies, computers, airplane tickets, if you can name it, theres a good chance a credit card was involved.
Even with my recent car purchase I used a credit card. I have a card called the CitiBank Driver's Edge where I can earn a small rebate ($1000) to be applied towards my car. I just fill out a form, make sure I've earned the limit, and send off the form with my automotive proof of purchase. A check arrives in the mail about 5 weeks later, and I've spent $1000 less on my car. It can only be used when you've purchased a new car. They used to give you a bonus if you bought a Ford product, but they stopped that a few years back.
Takes me about 2 years to earn $1000 in rebates.
My Discover Card gets me free movie tickets, free office supplies and a few other goodies.
So using a credit card has its advantages, especially for those who pay them off in full each month (people like me)
Comments
Believer
believer
A few years ago in Chicago, Boss Daley attempted to close all of the pay-day loan places as he believed that they ripped off a lot of the poor folks in Chicago. For that, he was lambasted by thousands of the poor and their advocates as cutting off their supply of credit.
BHPH lots are here to stay for prettty much the same reasons.
He puts a device on the car that will allow it to be disabled by remote control if the customer misses a weekly payment and most of the folks he sells to pay weekly. The story citing customers standing in long lines on pay day to make a payment to keep the car operational for another seven days. Selling leases on 10 year old cars that if payed out total three to four times the worth of the vehicle.
Living in Florida I've never heard of this guy but I guess folks around Detroit know him all to well. I don't follow pro football but appearantly he was a big NFL star years ago and parlayed his "fame" into a dealership empire that finally collapsed in part due to all the shady wheeling & dealing.
That article on the Detroit News Auto Insider web was there as a lead story with photos on 5-3-05. It was gone today and could not be pulled up from their archives ( at least I could not get it done). Could it be that the story was too controversial and they pulled it ? Dunno !
You accurately stated the cast against Mel Farr who is the favorite whipping boy of both the Detroit News and the Detroit Free Press. You may notice that they are far more vocal these days as Mel is not spending as much with the two newpapers. In fact, throughout the 80's, he was their favorite "local boy done good" and being African-American to boot, they were always stating how great he was.
Mel Farr services a market that NOONE else does. He will sell a car to ANYONE who needs one even if they have very bad credit. These are not people who have a record of paying their bills. However, as anyone who has tried to live in Detroit without a car knows, they need a car to have gainful employment. Very few people used public transportation even in the central corridor as it exposed them to crime.
I would be the first to tell anyone to avoid BHPH lots, check cashing places, sub-prime lenders, HR Block Refund anticipation loans, etc as they are complete rip-offs. However, I am not one who has to worry about COMED shutting off my electric, nor am I facing foreclosure, repo, etc. However, I have spent some of my free time over the years with people who are facing these difficult choices.
Personally, I like the automatic shutdown feature. I think that it is creative and does less harm than quick repos. Many years ago, I had a landlord with a simple (and similar) philosophy. The rent payment was in his hands by 8pm on the first of the months or your stuff would be on the curb by 8am the following morning.
For the record, I pay cash for nearly everything - twenty years without a car note and five without a mortgage.
I will see if I can find the article from other sources.
I hope you can find that article as the rest of the "crew" here would get a bang out of it.
believer
Mel was a football player for the Detroit Lions - I believe a wide receiver.
Ford recruited him as one of their first minority dealers. In the early years of the company, Ford had a bad reputation in a number of minority communities due to the founders's personal political views. In the sixties, they made a conscious effort to recruit and develop minority-owned dealerships.
Mel ran a lot of ads on TV under the caption of "Mel Farr, Superstar" where he had a caricature of himself going across the screen.
His dealerships started in Detroit and he added several throughout the midwest.
The sub-prime activity started in the early '90s as far as I remember. He was featured in a couple of articles in the Wall Street Journal as a model of sub-prime lending.
I am not going to spend hours debating on each one of the practices that he is alleged to have instituted. Some are bad and some have been exaggerated in the press repeatedly because, let's face it, nothing sells newspapers better than "Dealer ABC is a crook".
Mathias has a phrase that fits here, "It is expensive to be poor." That is one of the reasons that I hand out Dave Ramsey's "Financial Freedom" to a lot of people that I counsel.
I guess Farr, as you say, fills a need that few others would want to wade into. so does a undertaker. LOL !
believer
Also, most dealers won't let you charge a car on a CC because of the high service fees.
If you MUST use a credit card, you can get a cash advance.
It sounds like, just maybe, you should set your sights a bit lower and more affordable.
Lastly, if you must buy a Volkswagen prepare for a lot of repair bills compared to a lot of other cars out there.
Good Luck!
Then pay that balance as quickly as I can with the 0% card -- read the fine print; if a "balance transfer fee" applies, just forget it and get a car loan. Many times, though, the fee is waived for a period of time, so you pay the 12% on 30 days or however long it takes for the money to arrive,and after that it's 0% and smooth sailling.
It's a great deal IF you know what you're doing. Most people do not.
Oh, and I would argue against a Jetta if money is at all an issue. It's not the $1200 alternator, it's what that $1200 may do to your finances. But only you can answer that question.
-Mathias
Believer
Believer
They're living with their parents who have been living in a $300,000 home for the last 2 years and can't even afford a new living room set --- where do you think they get it from.? ..l.o.l.....
Terry
Lem, you would be happy to know the good old days of young people paying cash are still alive.
We sold our 1994 Altima to a young guy from Guatemala for $800 cash this weekend. He couldn't speak English too well, but an older friend who came with him could speak it well, so the transaction was very smooth.
These recent immigrants in our area work hard for thier money and seem to know the value of a dollar.
Well, ok, either that or an older townhouse or "small starter home."
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Believer
But let's be honest, it doesn't take a genius in todays world, just cheap interest rates because they're "buying" a payment, just like cars ..l.o.l... .. but it does amaze me on how many folks buy these homes and they don't have enough money to even furnish them - kinda sad ..... . lets see what happens in the next 2/3 years when the balloon breaks .. California twice.
Terry
Nearly drove off the road a few Saturdays back when listening to one of those "brokered" interest only loan shows.
Believer
But as time goes on, I have a funny feeling he's going to be the minority .... most homeowners I've seen in the last 2/3 months (and I've seen a bunch in the SE) can't buy steam off a hotdog, let alone have some real equity -- and by the way, where the heck is the dining room table.? ..l.o.l....
Terry.
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The discussion title did not say what the items bought and paid for were :P
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Maybe they wanted to add a porch onto their house and mispelled it Porsche when they did a web search.
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Alot of elitism here.
There is a lot of stereotyping here, of course. There was also a good discussion with some different point of views.
I would argue that the leading cause of bad credit is not living within your means. And its prevalent at all income levels. I'd also argue that it's a lot harder to pay your bills when you're poor.
But the stories around the campfire here have centered on people digging themselves nice, deep holes, and living close to the edge when things are going well. Then, a little something goes wrong, and poof... the house of cards comes down.
Of course, if a big something goes wrong, say a liver transplant, then everyone south of Bill Gates would be in trouble. So have a seat, join the fun.
And oh yeah, happy payday everyone. George should be by the office today with a wad of bills...
-Mathias
I see hundreds of credit reports a month and alot of those Bimmer drivers are so broke, they can't even pay attention ...
Terry :sick:
"That's my point. If that person loses that income, his credit is ruined."
Well, that's the point, isn't it?
If I lose my job, my credit will be just fine so long as I continue to meet my obligations. And since I haven't backed myself into a corner like so many people do, I can survive at least in the short term. Bad credit does not follow from job loss in and of itself.
"Don't think all used car buyers are trailer trash or ghetto dwellers, who work in fast food"
Come again? I'm a used car buyer myself, thank you very much. And some of my friends are (or were) trailer 'inhabitants'. Is there anything wrong with that?
I have a lot more respect for someone who lives responsibly on a limited income than fro someone with the aforementioned six-figure income who lives hand to mouth.
It appears to me that you are stereotyping, and I don't care for it.
Ghetto dwellers...???
-Mathias
Ghetto dwellers and trailer trash can be of any ethenicity. You should go back earlier in the dialogue where posters are talking about "bling" and pimped out 10 year old SUV's. Don't persecute me, I'll put my proactive attitudes towards racial diversity up against anyone. You don't know me, so don't judge me.
Unless the credit laws were changed in the last week or so, no credit card company can issue a credit card without a borrower's signature.
***If you have the income and self-discipline to never use credit, and stay out of George Orwell's database, more power to you. Most people don't live that way. ***
Maybe they should. They's be better off living lifestyles that they can afford. It is kind of a sign of maturity.
Mathias is right on the mark.
I come to this site because I enjoy cars. I've noticed a certain elitism on these forums. People always talking about Land Rovers and Lexus', and how they would never own a Ford Taurus because all American cars are junk.
The moderator starts a thread about the BHPH dealers, and I could about guess what responses would follow. Instead of having a meaningful dialogue concerning these dealers. The posters commenced to criticize the patrons of such dealerships, even going as far as using the term "credit criminals". I would say most of you people have sufficient income, that your credit rating is an afterthought to you. It's easy for you to criticize those less fortunate. You've obviously never had to use a credit card to by groceries, because it's the only currency you have, all the while wondering what will happen when you reach the credit limit. You folks, as I said earlier, are completely out of touch if you think people are using credit to live a luxurious lifestyle. You probably see things that way, because in your social circle, those with credit problems are high income earners who bought too much stuff. The economic reality is that there are people out there who have maintained stellar credit ratings for decades, who have a catastrophic job loss, disability, etc. I guess these 50 some things are immature because they have to default on their loans in order to buy food. These aren't rare cases either, get out of your subdivisions and look around. Meanwhile, enjoy your luxury imports.
Although some places employ some very sleazy tactics, hey, they're (the BHPH lots) just trying to make a living too, just like the rest of us.
And there's nothing wrong with a Ford Taurus- its a reliable, fairly safe, boring, affordable automobile that Ford never really paid much attention to. I plan to get one for my kids because they're cheap and reliable.
But then again I pay off the balance in full each month!
Also - beware of a clause in your credit card agreement called "universal default." It means that if you're late on ANY bill, (i.e. telephone) - not just your credit card, the credit card company can raise your interest rate. It's pure unbridled evil greed.
You aren't being gang attacked.
You've just found a few people that disagree with you..
Me, personally.. I'm a clown school graduate, as Mathias can attest..
regards,
kyfdx
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I do it all the time. Why do you feel bad for me? :confuse:
I use my Citibank card which gives back 5% of each grocery purchase and then I pay back the bill in full every month.
Advantages:
1) No messing with change
2) Get to use bank's money for free for a month
3) Get 5% cash back on your grocery bill
4) One consolidated bill for all purchases (I use it for everything) - makes budgeting much easier
I feel bad for people who are unable to take advantage of this opportunity.
I charge groceries, gas, $4 lunches, and anything else I buy. I do it for reasons similar to tulip's. I dislike having to go to ATMs, I hate to touch cash for hygienic reasons, and I am far too lazy to write checks.
I also just financed the entire purchase price of a new car. I didn't do this because I needed to; I did it because I preferred to and it made financial sense to me.
I do it all the time. Why do you feel bad for me?
I think that was sarcasm on Lemko's part, sometimes hard to read on the monitor.
And I will be hurrying on down to the courthouse to get my BK papers in now.
There is a whole lot of difference between using credit cards when you have the money in the bank AND carrying a balance month to month at 18%+ per annum interest.
Do realize that if you use cards, most people tend to spend more per transaction than cash users. banks count on that and want people to charge more on average.
Having said all that (and bringing the subject back on topic), I am personally tired of counselling people considering bankruptcy to hold on to a vehicle that they CANNOT afford. Does a single woman with one child and a <$25k income really need a 2 year old Expedition to drive five miles a day to the office? My old beater does a lot more for a whole lot less.
I think that Mathias is right on target, like usual.
Even with my recent car purchase I used a credit card. I have a card called the CitiBank Driver's Edge where I can earn a small rebate ($1000) to be applied towards my car. I just fill out a form, make sure I've earned the limit, and send off the form with my automotive proof of purchase. A check arrives in the mail about 5 weeks later, and I've spent $1000 less on my car. It can only be used when you've purchased a new car. They used to give you a bonus if you bought a Ford product, but they stopped that a few years back.
Takes me about 2 years to earn $1000 in rebates.
My Discover Card gets me free movie tickets, free office supplies and a few other goodies.
So using a credit card has its advantages, especially for those who pay them off in full each month (people like me)