"There is a whole lot of difference between using credit cards when you have the money in the bank AND carrying a balance month to month at 18%+ per annum interest."
I tried that with buying gasoline for my vehicle because I sometimes have to fill-up late at night where there are a lot of seedy characters hanging around. However, there always seems to be a small finance charge tacked-on even if I pay the balance in full. What's going on?
You should call up customer service and ask them that question. My statement always shows a finance charge of 0.0.
There is a whole lot of difference between using credit cards when you have the money in the bank AND carrying a balance month to month at 18%+ per annum interest
Who pays 18%? I do not carry any balance , but if I do, I am sure to accept one of the 4-5 daily offers that I get for 0-4% interest for the life of the loan. As to late payments, since I use online banking, all payments are electronic and thus, never late.
18% not a particularly high rate. I have seen them as high as 24-26%.
I have also seen cards that start out at 10% but if you miss a payment on ANY of your cards, there is an accelerator clause that allows them to raise the rates substantially.
As to late payments, since I use online banking, all payments are electronic and thus, never late.
Late payments refer to payments made AFTER the due date ... it is more often a case where the payor does not have the money to pay rather than due to the much misaligned post office.
"Also - beware of a clause in your credit card agreement called "universal default." It means that if you're late on ANY bill, (i.e. telephone) - not just your credit card, the credit card company can raise your interest rate. It's pure unbridled evil greed. "
That's insidious! I saw that on a chase advertisement and tore up that offer (I generally tear up every offer now since I have more cards than I need anyway).
But that's just plan rude :mad:
Now as to why they are charging you, you have to pay the entire balance by their due date at least twice in a row or else they'll hit you with a finance charge. The "grace period" that we all used to know and love has pretty much been vaporized by the card companies.
"I have also seen cards that start out at 10% but if you miss a payment on ANY of your cards, there is an accelerator clause that allows them to raise the rates substantially. "
That's the universial default that lemko wrote about - nice little bit of fleecing being done by the credit card issuers! :mad:
"As to late payments, since I use online banking, all payments are electronic and thus, never late.
Late payments refer to payments made AFTER the due date ... it is more often a case where the payor does not have the money to pay rather than due to the much misaligned post office."
It's some of both. Before I went to online payments of my credit card bills, I was always getting them mailed in late because of travel, etc. Now, I'm (almost) never late, however, some of the card websites are notoriously slow in processing even on-line payments! :mad:
My irritation with Chase was that their lock box to which the bill was to be mailed was in Phoenix. Why would you place your lockbox that FAR from a customer in Chicago. Most businesses set up lockboxes regionally to process the money a lot faster.
On-line payments (for the ONE payment I make each month) don't work well with my cash management system.
I promised a monthly update for my little BHPH operation, for good or for ill. Well, the 31st was payday, and I didn't see George. He's on the night shift now. Neither did I see him today, so I'm thinking, oh boy, the money's gone for this month.
Just to see where we stand, I swung by the lab tonight... and G pulls out $640 in lettuce. Two days he's been carrying it in the back pocket, talk about restraint. I told him it's too bad I can't report to TransUnion...
**I hate to touch cash for hygienic reasons** ......l..o..l...
I can relate to that, my wife has OCD and refuses to touch change. She's not at the glove wearing stage, but I can see her cringe whenever a cashier hands her money.
Sort of back on topic. That was the main reason she would not buy a used mini-van, I tried to explain to her how much a better deal a 1-2 year old would be. She would just shudder thinking of who was driving it before and the "cooties". Used the Chrysler financing , so it was not BHPH.
My wife says she doesn't like used cars because she says people have been passing gas and doing who knows what else in the seats. I can live with used cars because I figure there is no avoiding the contamination. When I recently bought a new car, it looked like they had a homeless guy moving cars around on the lot. Not to mention that he would start up each car and immediately rev it up to about 7,000 rpms. To further add to the contamination, our salesman had on about a gallon of High Karate cologne and a likewise amount of hair gel.
OK, we've gone long & far enough off the topic of BHPH - we're not talking about general credit card usage. Thanks!
MODERATOR /ADMINISTRATOR Find me at kirstie_h@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name. 2015 Kia Soul, 2021 Subaru Forester (kirstie_h), 2024 GMC Sierra 1500 (mr. kirstie_h) Review your vehicle
IMO, bh/ph serves an important purpose, along with cehck cashing stores, etc., that service the portion of society that doesn't deal in "normal" credit and financing sources.
They get a bad rap for "ripping off" poor people, and in some cases likely are predatory, but the press, etc. misses the point. If you eliminate BHPH, you aren't saving poor people from the evil car dealers, you are taking away their access to transportation (and only source of financing).
Sure, some basic regulation/oversight is probably a good thing. And some lots are certainly nicer than others. But it is important that people that don't qualify for 1.9% financing from FMC can still buy a car to get to work.
Also, poor people aren't neccasarily any less savvy then rich folks. If a local BH lot is out of control, people will know, and go elsewhere, the beauty of free market compitition.
another point that is often lost while folk are screaming rip-off..... many BHPH lots have repo rates that are so high that a standard prime banker would drop dead looking at the repo ratio
"If a local BH lot is out of control, people will know, and go elsewhere, the beauty of free market compitition."
You must not get out much. There are plenty of people who are so out of it they wouldn't know a bad deal, never mind a bad dealer, if it was shown to them in a movie.
You just gotta cruise Edmund's to see how cluelessly many people go about their business. I've had the dubious pleasure of listening to some BHPH negotiations at a friend's lot. Many folks have no idea how anything works.
Free market competition my foot, it's great when big companies deal with each other, but taken to its extreme, every purchase becomes a dissertation.
I guess it is true that there is probably an endless supply of fresh suckers coming to get fleeced. I was thinking more of the locals getting ripped off enough and comparing notes, and going to some other hoopties lot to get fleeced.
As a side note, there is a car lot in my area named "Hoopties". Must be an inside joke.
I see a few lots in town here (yes, we have a lot of them in Tennessee) that carry some nice clean 2-3 year old luxury cars. I see I35s, ES300s, TLs, almost anything with a luxury nameplate I will see it somewhere.
Some BHPH lots for some reason like to cater to those people. People who want to look rich but have bad credit and can't afford to pay cash for the brand new version.
Odd, eh?
There are many BHPH lots within 1 mile of the local Lexus dealer. Seems strange to me why Lexus of Nashville-North picked that specific spot across the street from a seedy looking BHPH lot.
...... Most BHPH lots make their money from regular used cars sales ..
Now I'm not saying 02 Bimmers or an 03 Lexus ES300 .. but on the overall they do well with cargo vans, hi miler pick-ups and mostly the $5,0/$6,000 range sedan types .. nothing seedy about that.
Keep in mind that there are many reputable lots that do some BHPH. Not all of them are in crappy neighborhoods, and selling nothing but flood cars.
There is one place near my old house that comes to mind. On a busy road, but a nice area. Family owned (dad buys/repairs the cars, mom sells them). They have been there at least 15 years, very clean place, all the stock looks very nice. They also advertise regularly on the local access channell (one of those infomertials where the host walks them around asking about each car).
Anyway, normal stock for them is mid-late 90's domestics, Toyotas, and a smattering of other stuff. Basically solid, normal used cars (basic transportation in other words), probably mileage in the 60s-80s.
They will sell outright, and on many cars offer BHPH. All short term (1 year or so). Typical might be $3,450 cash, or $1,000 down and 50/week. Most cars are in the 3-5K range.
Everything goes through the shop for inspection, gets detailed, and even comes with a third party PT warranty.
Having seen them over the years, I wouldn't hesitate to shop there. I wouldn't pay there, and probably wouldn't buy anything since they don't really sell what I am interested in, but would shop there.
Can't say the same about some of the cheesy places down in Camden though.
...a Suzuki Esteem with a J.D. Byrider decal on the back. A J.D. Byrider lot just opened up in a somewhat marginal neighborhood I pass through to get onto I-95 on my way to downtown Philadelphia. I've read some very negative articles about J.D. Byrider and could help but feel sorry for the owner of this Esteem. However, the car didn't LOOK bad. I hope he didn't pay too much.
Most of the more recent luxury cars (say, a 2003 Infiniti QX4 or a 2002 Jaguar X-Type) show up at a Car-Smart lot in a far better part of town than the other BHPH lots. I don't know if they do BHPH, but they carry some fairly nice clean cars.
I drove by a BHPH lot a few days ago that only carried two cars. A late 80's Corolla advertised at $2295 (I think) and an equally old Cadillac advertised at around $3,000, although I'm not exactly sure.
Fill a need to be sure. Lots of people simply have no choice and as with all things, some are better/more honest than others.
I guy I went to high school with owns (I think) the largest check cashing chain in California. At a recent reunion,we chatted about this. His stores are located, for the most part, in marginal areas. His customers have no regular bank. He charges them a very reasnoble fee and they are very grateful to be able to do this since they pay cash for everything.
It must be working...the number of his stores has increased greatly in recent years.
not all places are honest. Some prey on the credit challenged and take 'em for a ride and take all the money they can before repossessing the car and selling it to another credit challenged guy.
I salute all honest BHPH dealers (and for that matter, honest check cashing places) as they're helping the credit challenged get what they need. (whether its cash or a set of wheels to get to work)
Then again, the shady BHPH dealers are just trying to make a living, just like the rest of us, so I guess I can give them some sympathy, but wouldn't they generate more business by being an honest dealer people can go to for quality cars at decent prices and payments that people can afford?
If I decide to buy a car from a dealership and I dont use their financing, do they still have to do a credit check? I understand they dont want to give the car away with just a personal check from me. What if I give them a banker's check? Isn't that as good as cash? How do I avoid a credit check?
If you plop down cash in excess of 10K the dealer is required to notify the feds anyway. I 'd rather have a credit check than the guys from Washington nosing around in my business. LOL !
The one problem with that is that if you came in and said that was the price you would pay, it could be viewed as a "suspicious transaction" and should be reported likewise. It all depends upon how careful the dealer is.
That wouldn't work either. Any related purchases in a 90 day period exceeding $10,000 have to be reported. You have to get up pretty early to fool big brother.
"If you plop down cash in excess of 10K the dealer is required to notify the feds anyway. I 'd rather have a credit check than the guys from Washington nosing around in my business. LOL !"
If you bring the cash in the form of of a cashiers check, there is no reporting requirement.
If you purchase a cashiers check in excess of $10,000, the bank is required to report it.
What I don't understand is that if this money isn't acquired illegally, why would you care if it is reported. If you have nothing to hide, don't worry.
If you should run afoul of the cops here in Florida with a wad of cash like that in your kick they will seize it and you'll have one hell of a time getting it back ! The reasoning is that it just HAS to be illgotten money (drugs, money laundering etc.) Some folks found this out after being stopped on I -10 in Florida and Alabama. They claimed they were going to buy building supplies for hurricane repair. The cops just laughed"yeah right, tell us another one". After many months of legal battles in court some did get most of it back, not all tho, and of course those that could not prove the source lost it all. Southern justice at it's best LOL !
It's my understanding that banks, etc can actually report about any amount to the govmint. If your left eye is twitching a lot, or that lump in your back pocket rather resembles a 9mm, them boys can send in $5,000, $7,000, whatever you are wanting to have counted out (or in). It's just a REQUIREMENT to report $10,000 or more.
A couple of years back a big dealer in Naples Fla. was busted when it came to light they were selling luxo vehicles for cash, no questions asked. The owners were not at fault. The sales staff was moving the iron in this manner. Several are still in the Federal lock-up for money laundering.
Well... ... July was shaky with George and me missing each other due to schedule issues until 3 days after payday. But all was well. ...August is still questionable, me having been on vacation last week... but it's the 9th, and I haven't had my installment yet for the month.
Overall, I'd say it's a B- I've collected $1200 out of $2000 so far but I think there'll be a payment holiday for August.
I still have a key; should I move the car a few spots across the parking lot ? :P
Comments
I tried that with buying gasoline for my vehicle because I sometimes have to fill-up late at night where there are a lot of seedy characters hanging around. However, there always seems to be a small finance charge tacked-on even if I pay the balance in full. What's going on?
You should call up customer service and ask them that question. My statement always shows a finance charge of 0.0.
There is a whole lot of difference between using credit cards when you have the money in the bank AND carrying a balance month to month at 18%+ per annum interest
Who pays 18%? I do not carry any balance , but if I do, I am sure to accept one of the 4-5 daily offers that I get for 0-4% interest for the life of the loan.
As to late payments, since I use online banking, all payments are electronic and thus, never late.
I have also seen cards that start out at 10% but if you miss a payment on ANY of your cards, there is an accelerator clause that allows them to raise the rates substantially.
As to late payments, since I use online banking, all payments are electronic and thus, never late.
Late payments refer to payments made AFTER the due date ... it is more often a case where the payor does not have the money to pay rather than due to the much misaligned post office.
That's insidious! I saw that on a chase advertisement and tore up that offer (I generally tear up every offer now since I have more cards than I need anyway).
But that's just plan rude :mad:
Now as to why they are charging you, you have to pay the entire balance by their due date at least twice in a row or else they'll hit you with a finance charge. The "grace period" that we all used to know and love has pretty much been vaporized by the card companies.
That's the universial default that lemko wrote about - nice little bit of fleecing being done by the credit card issuers! :mad:
Late payments refer to payments made AFTER the due date ... it is more often a case where the payor does not have the money to pay rather than due to the much misaligned post office."
It's some of both. Before I went to online payments of my credit card bills, I was always getting them mailed in late because of travel, etc. Now, I'm (almost) never late, however, some of the card websites are notoriously slow in processing even on-line payments! :mad:
On-line payments (for the ONE payment I make each month) don't work well with my cash management system.
Well, the 31st was payday, and I didn't see George. He's on the night shift now. Neither did I see him today, so I'm thinking, oh boy, the money's gone for this month.
Just to see where we stand, I swung by the lab tonight... and G pulls out $640 in lettuce. Two days he's been carrying it in the back pocket, talk about restraint. I told him it's too bad I can't report to TransUnion...
Relieved,
-Mathias
I must have cooties all over me ........ :P
Terry.
Terry.
I can relate to that, my wife has OCD and refuses to touch change. She's not at the glove wearing stage, but I can see her cringe whenever a cashier hands her money.
Sort of back on topic. That was the main reason she would not buy a used mini-van, I tried to explain to her how much a better deal a 1-2 year old would be. She would just shudder thinking of who was driving it before and the "cooties". Used the Chrysler financing , so it was not BHPH.
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Review your vehicle
They get a bad rap for "ripping off" poor people, and in some cases likely are predatory, but the press, etc. misses the point. If you eliminate BHPH, you aren't saving poor people from the evil car dealers, you are taking away their access to transportation (and only source of financing).
Sure, some basic regulation/oversight is probably a good thing. And some lots are certainly nicer than others. But it is important that people that don't qualify for 1.9% financing from FMC can still buy a car to get to work.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
... **To further add to the contamination, our salesman had on about a gallon of High Karate cologne**
...... hey now, whats wrong with High Karate.?
Terry :P
You must not get out much. There are plenty of people who are so out of it they wouldn't know a bad deal, never mind a bad dealer, if it was shown to them in a movie.
You just gotta cruise Edmund's to see how cluelessly many people go about their business. I've had the dubious pleasure of listening to some BHPH negotiations at a friend's lot. Many folks have no idea how anything works.
Free market competition my foot, it's great when big companies deal with each other, but taken to its extreme, every purchase becomes a dissertation.
-Mathias
As a side note, there is a car lot in my area named "Hoopties". Must be an inside joke.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
Some BHPH lots for some reason like to cater to those people. People who want to look rich but have bad credit and can't afford to pay cash for the brand new version.
Odd, eh?
There are many BHPH lots within 1 mile of the local Lexus dealer. Seems strange to me why Lexus of Nashville-North picked that specific spot across the street from a seedy looking BHPH lot.
Now I'm not saying 02 Bimmers or an 03 Lexus ES300 .. but on the overall they do well with cargo vans, hi miler pick-ups and mostly the $5,0/$6,000 range sedan types .. nothing seedy about that.
Terry.
There is one place near my old house that comes to mind. On a busy road, but a nice area. Family owned (dad buys/repairs the cars, mom sells them). They have been there at least 15 years, very clean place, all the stock looks very nice. They also advertise regularly on the local access channell (one of those infomertials where the host walks them around asking about each car).
Anyway, normal stock for them is mid-late 90's domestics, Toyotas, and a smattering of other stuff. Basically solid, normal used cars (basic transportation in other words), probably mileage in the 60s-80s.
They will sell outright, and on many cars offer BHPH. All short term (1 year or so). Typical might be $3,450 cash, or $1,000 down and 50/week. Most cars are in the 3-5K range.
Everything goes through the shop for inspection, gets detailed, and even comes with a third party PT warranty.
Having seen them over the years, I wouldn't hesitate to shop there. I wouldn't pay there, and probably wouldn't buy anything since they don't really sell what I am interested in, but would shop there.
Can't say the same about some of the cheesy places down in Camden though.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I drove by a BHPH lot a few days ago that only carried two cars. A late 80's Corolla advertised at $2295 (I think) and an equally old Cadillac advertised at around $3,000, although I'm not exactly sure.
I guy I went to high school with owns (I think) the largest check cashing chain in California. At a recent reunion,we chatted about this. His stores are located, for the most part, in marginal areas. His customers have no regular bank. He charges them a very reasnoble fee and they are very grateful to be able to do this since they pay cash for everything.
It must be working...the number of his stores has increased greatly in recent years.
Fina a need and fill it.
I salute all honest BHPH dealers (and for that matter, honest check cashing places) as they're helping the credit challenged get what they need. (whether its cash or a set of wheels to get to work)
Then again, the shady BHPH dealers are just trying to make a living, just like the rest of us, so I guess I can give them some sympathy, but wouldn't they generate more business by being an honest dealer people can go to for quality cars at decent prices and payments that people can afford?
do they still have to do a credit check? I understand they dont want
to give the car away with just a personal check from me. What if I
give them a banker's check? Isn't that as good as cash?
How do I avoid a credit check?
Believer
Smarter Cash Buyers could arrange for a payment plan where they paid the dealer $9,999.99 each month until they paid off the car.
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If you bring the cash in the form of of a cashiers check, there is no reporting requirement.
What I don't understand is that if this money isn't acquired illegally, why would you care if it is reported. If you have nothing to hide, don't worry.
believer
Terry.
It's covering their behind actually to report it.
believer
The FBI ran in and closed the entire place down for a day while they carted off files.
The sales manager and a couple of salesmen went up to the big house.
Hopefully no news is good news
... July was shaky with George and me missing each other due to schedule issues until 3 days after payday.
But all was well.
...August is still questionable, me having been on vacation last week... but it's the 9th, and I haven't had my installment yet for the month.
Overall, I'd say it's a B- I've collected $1200 out of $2000 so far but I think there'll be a payment holiday for August.
I still have a key; should I move the car a few spots across the parking lot ? :P
-m
George came by on his day off and paid up like the good customer he is.
-m
I would hate to see him get his , I mean your car repoed.
Yeah, right. :P
Terry.