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Current lease is up December 2006 so hopefully it will be available then.
Al Gore did not invent the Internet and this car looks like an Altima, which in turn
looks a lot like the Passat. I do like the idea of an Altima / Passat. Less to buy,
and reliable, it is a really good deal. Parts should cost less than the German
car. I guess the Saturn will cost less too. Went to the Saturn dealership, while
en route to the Pontiac store, a block away, just to see if they had any interesting
looking cars. Looks like it is the Ion. Hummm? I walked back to my car and
drove off.
Loren
Sales like a new PT for $12.5K or the Stang V6 a couple years back for $14,888 brand new... that is tempting indeed!
Loren
Loren
did they stop making the pontiac GTO?
Loren
-end quote-
Ummm, no a Mustang can be had for $20K, and not around $30K like the GTO. I was thinking of driving two like priced, sporty cars, and in GM, I guess that means the G6 FWD is the closest thing to the RWD Mustang V6. As far as I know, unless something came in under the radar, GM has no RWD sporty or pony car for a good price, like the Mustang. The G6 Coupe, though a FWD, is sporty looking and worth a test drive. Will check it out. For RWD V8 excitement, I bet a Stang GT a few years old can be had for say $13K to $15k with fairly low miles on her. Move it out five years and it gets even cheaper. If I compromise twice over, and went FWD and 4dr. the Aura is worth a look, as is the twin looks wise, Altima, or the Mazda6, which is said to handle the best. Coupes are hard to come by. Also found that many of the new coupes, like the Scion tC have these rather odd, too tall doors, with those high window sills - yuk! - Loren
As swell as the V6 Mustang is for the price, most new Mustang sales are V8. And those sales are easily high 20s to mid 30s, with a wait list to boot.
Sure, you could buy an old Mustang for a lot less. The old Mustang is on a lessor platform, has a lesser engine, is ugly, and had quality issues out the nose. An old Mustang is no competitor either for the current Mustang or for the GTO.
You can buy a Mustang under $20K. The V6 outsells the V8 GT and always has done so. The new one is more likely to have problem areas than is last years model. Take a look at Consumers Reports data from the owners of Stangs. It is a very reliable car. As for looks, I do believe hundreds of thousands of buyers would differ with you on it being ugly. The torque of the old engine is pretty close to the new one in the V8, and the old V6 at 190 or 193HP is not bad. About the same as the original 289 V8 back in 1964-65. This new Aura will go head to head with the original copy car, the Altima, so we shall see how they compare. Hope the electric steering is not all screwy. Why on earth GM wanted to mess with that in the midst of other problems, who knows. I don't care for throttle-by-wire, and hope that is not coming with this new model. - Loren
i thought i read somewhere that the target car was the TL. not that the aura will be considered a near luxury car but i hope its interior (which it appears to be) and refinement will be closer to the TL than the altima. i'll be disappointed otherwise.
Loren
The old Mustang sold well primarily because of the rental car companies. Most of the old Mustang sales were V6. The fact the enthusiasts are coming back to the Mustang, I think, makes my point that this is a far different car than what was.
GM, Toyota, Honda, and most of the other manufacturers with big time r&d are going to electric steering on many of their models. Electric steering uses less energy and has fewer parts than hydraulics, making it less expensive to manufacture, more reliable, and easier to maintain.
So far no one has quite got the steering response feel right. On models intended to be enthusiast cars - such as the Cobalt SS, GM continues to go with hydraulic. I think the Aura is going more for mid-level luxury and refinement, meaning it will probably be electric steering. You will have to hope the 3rd generation feels better than gen 1 and 2.
The Aura will be metal sided.
See our discussions about dealership issues in the News&Views GM topic for why GM wants to keep Saturn. The dealership arrangement between GM and Saturn dealers allows GM far more authority than with its other dealers. The fact Saturn dealers typically rank first or second to Lexus in customer satisfaction is not a coincidence. GM knows it can leverage this satisfaction if Saturn has better cars.
Pontiac and Buick, with their old line dealer arrangements, are simply not as attractive to the future GM.
Loren
Opels are much improved over the mid-90s. Opel has been improving its EU sales and challenging VW for market share in many countries.
As with most EU mid-market brands, Opels are largely fwd.
The Catera was not a bad car. It just was not a Cadillac.
The Aura will, however, have the new 3.6 litre, which is most likely better than any thing Isuzu can make.
Opel has some very nice cars.
Loren
GM's next generation of cars are slated to be global. If the process succeeds, Saturn has a chance to be what VW was in the '90s.
the jetta's electric steering is said to be pretty good.
perhaps for the enthusiasts. but for high volume cars, there's not a lot of appeal for RWD cars especially in the northern climates. AWD may be a bigger trend.
of course the 300, magnum and the new dodge charger may be changing that.
Guess I have not seen any reviews for it yet. I'll keep my eyes own.
It stands to reason someone will get it right. It really is just a matter of programming and hardware.
Nonetheless, I would prefer AWD because of the snow in Philly. It doesn't happen often and when it does, we drive the truck. But with the advances in AWD as seen in the Acura RL, Infiniti G35 and Subaru (of which GM has a stake) AWD would be an appealing choice for me.
My next ride I wanted to be AWD. But when I saw the Aura, I wanted it bad even tho there were no plans for it. Perhaps before the model run is over it will be provided as an option.
Say What??? Everybody I've talked to about cars hates FWD! And AWD.... Whats the point? For me I want power to the rear wheels period!
The fact is, RWD stinks in the ice. Not so much snow, but even the ESP systems on a lot of cars will still have you sliding around a bit. FWD is cheaper to make than RWD, and a rear-biased AWD is good for performance (might add some weight compared to RWD) and it gives great traction. Each has their time and place. Up North in the winter, though, I can understand why AWD and FWD cars sell.
But my thing is this; If GM really wants to compete with Acura they need to include some of those gotta have features that Acura has, such as satelite navigation. The cars are already equipped with On-Star so why is GM not offering Satellite Navigation when the competition is?
GM's got to come with the entire package -- looks and content. The days of glitz and no gutz and vice versa are gone. Competition is too stiff to skimp on content and charge the same price as your rival.
I have always told myself that I'd never buy an import. Then in 99 I bought an Infiniti G20. I was very pleased with this car until now. Having to replace almost all of my exhaust system for 1400 bucks is just unthinkable, and the car only has 70k miles on it.
But now that GM has gotten so much better in the reliability department Im ready to come home but the interiors and content (one2one stated) are key factors. I have a friend that has a 2002 TL and it has satellite navigation and another friend that has a BMW X5 and the navigation systems in those cars are top notch.
I wanna see that in GM offerings. It doesn't even have to be standard but at least offer it.
Although, granted domestic vehicles need to keep up with their German/Japanese counterparts technology and feature wise.
Offering nav system, xenon lights, premium stereo, refined engines and other luxury touches would actually show that GM is serious about their vehicle competing.
The only GM family car to offer nav that I know is the Grand Prix..
Saturn will be a higher end car than Chevy but it's not going to be a luxury mark. If someone at GM said that, they are in LaLa land.
However, the point I was making is that if GM truly wants to compete with the competition they have to stop thinking so small minded and go a few steps farther by adding features that people will find useful like satellite navigation. If all GM cars are gonna come On-Star ready why not also equip them when a nav system that operates through On-Star?
It makes nothing but good sense. Whats so shocking about this is that not even the 61K STS does not have Satellite Navigation ............ but it has XM Satellite Radio. However, I should point out that it does offer DVD Navigation
Aura should not be competing with Acura and Caddy though, Saturn should be competing with top notch sedans like V6 Accords, Passats and Altimas.
Cadillac makes mainly rear wheel drive vehicles, all of which at least have V8 top of line performance options.
Acura makes fwd and awd V6 vehicles.
Buick has some similar vehicles, but they are more softly sprung. More Avalon ES than anything Acura makes. Pontiac on the other hand does not make vehicles at the price or quality level as Acura.
An Aura with an agressive fwd suspension and the 3.6 high output V6 has a chance to be very similar to what Acura does.
To show my point, just look at the Chrysler 300. That one car fits into about 4 of the segments I defined: 300, 300 Touring, 300 C, 300 SRT8. Back in the day, if you got a Buick LeSabre, it was full-sized. Want something lower, get a Century. Not so anymore.
Acura dances at the low end of the luxury market -- for the most part -- with only the RL competing against Lexus and Infiniti.
Lexus tries to stradle the fence with entry luxury and high end while Infiniti seems not to care too much about entry level luxury.
All this is to say that I think Aura could compete against Acura (but not Infiniti) if they package it properly. After all, Chrysler isn't hurting doing the same thing with the 300. The problem I see is the internal politics as Daimler/Chrysler has much fewer divisions with clearly defined target markets.
So great that I purchased one from the makers of NeverLost . It's a little annoying when you know where you're going with all the shortcuts (after all, most people figured out the shortcuts shortly after they moved in). But if you don't know where you're going, you just want to joyride or take a spur-of-the-moment trip, it's great.
A really nice feature of this one is Points of Interest. It contains restaurants from cultures I've never heard of. In addition to the address and directions, it provides the phone number so you can call ahead. The wife and I are going to use it check out different eat spots for fun. You can also plan a trip with all the stops you want to hit along the way.
Now that I've finishing plugging a product for a company I don't work for or have stock in :P , the reason I mention all this is to say that while it's nice to have it built into the car, it's certainly not necessary. But, if I could have one PLUS the other features the competition doesn't or the same features for a lower price, why not?
Aftermarket NAV and GPS tend to be better, and significantly less expensive than OEM. Buying aftermarket often means you do not get stuck buying the often expensive lux-packages Navs are bundled with.