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Comments
RE: #167. I had already attempted to eliminate duplicates based on your criteria (the numbers are based on non-duplicates), but I hope you realize that if the update was given and then it failed again, then either there was a different software problem, or the dealer didn't install the software updates the first time. I used the VIN number where available to eliminate duplicates.
Re: #167. I am not guessing at all (I looked it up), but I don't really have enough interest in the subject to peruse the NHTSB database again to look for those where the car died. However, based on my reading, I would say that the majority of the cars simply died. I define "died" as an instance where the car stop functioning. In some cases the traction battery continued to power the car (the ICE failed), in others it was a massive electrical system failure and the entire car just stopped. A few cars restarted later, but this is cold comfort if the car stalled on the freeway. One lady got into an accident as the result of her car stalling. I suppose that particular Prius didn't restart afterwards...
In my opinion, the numerous types of failures are worrisome. If everyone had experienced the (almost) identical problems, then it would indicate that a single software glitch was at fault. Having so many different symptoms causing the car to "die" opens the possibility that there are multiple problems that can somehow be triggered unexpectedly. Hopefully the NTHSB investigation will garner more information.
In any case, I think it is becoming clear why this forum exists...
There was a local and national news report on this today or radio and tv. Maybe they will get to the bottom of all of this.
charlie
I saw Susan Wornick's commentary on the news here in MA and she said that there is an investigation beginning despite Toyota'a denial.
My new Prius is en route to my dealer and should arrive today or tomorrow and believe me I am going ahead with the purchase with enthusiasm and confidence. but the i was willing to continue to drive my Chrysler Town & Country minivan after the transmission began to slip which I found exciting and added some excitement to my otherwise ho hum existence. I loved that car and it was sad when it was towed away from my driveway. I wanted to put in a remade transmission but my wiser wife said no one in his right mind does that with a car that has 179,000 miles on it!
If the blue death strikes the car will still be moving and give you time to get it off the highway.
WHo would think to hold down the start button for a full minute?
Toyota is not on record anywhere as "denying" anything. They are investigating the problem. They have not denied anything.... :confuse:
Never the less, Toyota is minimizing the situation
"It is important to note there is no recall nor has NHTSA opened an investigation regarding this issue," Toyota said.
For the exact URL : http://www.thebostonchannel.com/buyerbeware/4554961/detail.html
That is kind-of sort-of denying that a real problem exists, so ojogalt was right on in his statement!
no stalling , just cruis'n in 6th :shades:
MidCow
Toyota is INVESTIGATING the problem. You would not investigate a problem which you DENY exists.....:)
However, the possibility that one can 'reset' the computer does not make up for the problem (if verified) of the vehicle stalling, or just dying.
Toyota is on slightly new ground here. While it is true that all cars use software modules to run various components, the Prius does so to a new level, which leaves it open to all kinds of software interaction problems that do not occur on simpler implementations. In some respects, Toyota is facing a software problem, not a mechanical problem, with the Prius. Toyota is an auto manufacturor, not a software development house. They still think like an auto manufacturor, which is evidenced by the fact that they don't post their software version on the screen when the vehicle powers up.
Not to mention that it would allow everyone to simply say "I'm using version so-and-so" when talking with other owners, and thus be immediately aware of the need for an update.
Toyota said ""It is important to note there is no recall nor has NHTSA opened an investigation regarding this issue".
But that isn't true according to Ms. Wornick's article because she said NHTSA has opened an investigation. Toyota is not investigating
Mov'n On
MicCow
Can you imagine Bill Gates building cars ? Then we would have constant critical security updates and have to connect a bluetooth internet cell phone all the time to keep anti-virus software current.
No-DDOS or blue screen of death er stall for me,
MidCow
"Toyota is investigating complaints from US drivers about its hybrid Prius cars stalling.
Company officials say a few owners of 2004 and 2005 Prius models are saying their cars stalled. The Japanese automaker says it's looking into the number of complaints, technical issues and possible causes."
http://www.kotv.com/main/home/storiesNL.asp?whichpage=1&id=83389
http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/worldbiz/archives/2005/05/18/2003255517
http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=technologyNews&storyID=8506801
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2005-05-16-prius_x.htm
So Toyota is definitely investigating. I'm sorry that the lady writer with the opinion piece did not know that or mention it.
What foolish company could possibly NOT investigate such a problem? Not the most profitable car company in the world, for sure. They are all over it....:D
You are right! Thanks for the links.
cruis'n in 6th :shades: ,
MidCow
That would be Friday the 13th of May. So if they never knew about the stalling problem until May of 2005, how did they already have TSBs to cover the problems in 2004? The article continues:
The reports of problems with the Prius are an embarrassment for Toyota at a time when the hybrid has become a status symbol favored by Hollywood movie stars and is a major success for Toyota, the world's No. 2 automaker.
Who is worried about Leonardo breaking down on the 405? That would make the headlines across the country.
Hopefully it will be covered by warranty and not ding your insurance company. It would have to be some kind of electrical defect if you did not add any devices to the electrical system. Or a lightning strike!
Honda NAV is outstanding ( also have Garmin 2610) Only thing I don't like is not being able to rename Waypoints.
versus TL
less cost (8K$) got for a coupe hundred over invoive
excellent 2.9 % financing.
regular gas
smaller engine 3.0 versus 3.2 with bascially same pwoer to rate, thus better gas mileage.
very very low insurance rate.
fold down seat
removable roof rack for bikes and Kayaks
Only negativs is not having heated mirrors in Houston. Would have liked Xexon lights; still toying with aftermarket for about $400.
Great combination of power, mileage ( very tall 6th gear get 29.6 mpg on highway trip, 23.5 commuting), luxury, relaibility and low total cost of ownership.
other to contender were S2000 (decided I wanted NAV and luxury fetures), G35 Coupe and 350Z roadster and 6-speed Nissan Altima SE-R. The radios in the entire Nissan/Infinti line are the worst I have ever seen. My 93 ES300 has a radio ten times better.
I probably would have bought a HAH if it had a 6-speed manual transmission option.
cruis'n in 6th :shades: ,
MidCow
Good One M !!!
Heck, out here in LA, almost everyone is in their '60s. 1960's, that is...
We do not know that Toyota still has a problem. It appears that they may have resolved your concerns way back in January and May 2004. See here:
blane, "Toyota Prius Software Problems" #126, 18 May 2005 7:07 am
All of this recent talk MAY be about vehicles that were not brought in for the appropriate updates when their owners were notified early last year.
I have driven 95,000 miles with my two Prius. No engine trouble whatsoever. None of my Prius owning friends have ever had any either.
The real problem is the lack of detail in these reports, causing people to speculate & worry. If they would report what the month/year their car was built (found on the driver's door-jam) and which updates they've had done (documented using stickers placed inside the hood or door-jam by the mechanic), they'd we'd have something actually helpful to work with.
JOHN
P.S. Kinda enjoyed seein' my car in the movie.."Kicking & Screaming" Ha!Ha!
RAILROADJAMES(Trust in Toyota)
Was the movie any good? Or were you watching for your car? I'm not a Will Ferrell fan. I do like Robert Duvall. Is it out on DVD yet?
The reason this stalling issue got blown out of proportion was due to poor dealer service training. If you take your car to 3 dealers and they are all clueless about the TSBs it just adds to the confusion. The media eats that up. Almost every article on the Prius stalling is a cut and paste from another media source. Not much investigation by reporters on this deal. Then you add Toyota's poor customer service to the mix and you got BAD news. Even CR rates Toyota customer service sub standard. Hopefully the informed Prius owners on this Forum have all insisted on getting the repairs done.
Except for special reports, all news reports come from one of three sources: Reuters, API, UPI. So they all tend to read the same.
To summarize the fix, for those having the screen-lockup problem, the definitive answer is message #79: , the TSB is EL002-05 "Multi-Display Functions are Inoperative" .
Thanks tempusvn and thanks to toyota for promptly replacing mine which fixed it!
By the way... this screen-lockup problem seems to be a problem ONLY with hardware, and not software issue. I'm guessing some of the other issues in this forum may also be blaming problems on software, rightly or wrongly, especially with the Prius/NTSB in the news this week. I work with computers for a living, and as with any diagnostic work, you have to proceed carefully and methodically to isolate issues to hardware or software. This forum is named "Toyota Prius Software problems", and like many forums, tends to branch out into other areas, which can be good and bad. But in this case, it seems the problem had nothing to do with software: we are just used to Microsoft Windows locking-up/misbehaving that a similar experience in my car was (wrongly) guessed to be a software problem.
#79 of 205 Screen Failure not a Prius-Only Problem by tempusvn United States of America Apr 28, 2005 (8:52 am)
JOHN
(At above website are) Short-term (First-Aid) steps posted by prius owners that have gotten them going or out of a tough spot. Print it out and keep in your glove box! (There seems to be good advice out there, but it is scattered: I'm hope this wiki will distill and self-organize the steps an ordinary owner can take BEFORE calling the tow-truck/dealer.
The idea is if you find some gem of info when plowing thru the internet, anyone can add it to this wiki -website. I've started it out with 2 postings from this forum 158 and 174. Hopefully there will be more added by you!
WISHILIST. If someone is ambitious, perhaps a nice website on taking more preventative steps, how to contact Toyota and find out about recalls, TSB's etc.
What else is there outside of normal care for a vehicle? And all the routine stuff is already documented and available online from several sources.
JOHN
He suggested that the stopping could be due to Operator Error.
The explanation was that if the gas tank was empty, the electric engine could take over for a certain amount of time. When the gas engine was due to kick in, there would be no fuel and the car would stop.
He also told me the gas engine takes over at about 10 mph. This would not necessarily explain how a car could get to speed without gas and then stop.
As only a Soon-to-be-Prius Owner, I don't know if this is a possibility or salesmanspeak. Busy driving a car with which I was unfamiliar, I didn't ask questions about the explanation.
What do you experienced Prius drivers think?
What do you experienced Prius drivers think?"
Well, I'm not an experienced Prius driver, but I can research stuff on the internet. There have been about 3 dozen cases of propulsion failure in the Prius reported to the NHTSB. There has been one case repored (in the media, not to the NHTSB) about a person running out of gas.
Your salesman was wrong; Toyota has released at least two TSBs to cover engine computer updates to correct stalling problems.
However, I wouldn't let it keep you from buying your Prius. The odds appear to be quite long that you will have any stalling problems. We are all hoping that Toyota has fixed the errors by this time. But we don't know; car companies are not all that upfront about their fixes...
We have not had any of the stalling problems described in other posts, and we have had all the updates done.
About a month ago, we started having INTERMITTENT problems, where the battery level would drop down to 1 red bar and would not charge. When this happens, our average MPG drops down to the low 30's (I filled up, reset the Average MPG, drove a good mix of HWY and CTY driving to get this number). Also, when this problem happens, the car looses power and cannot take off very quickly, my wife actually pulled out into traffic, the car wouldn't accelerate and she almost got into a wreck
I've taken it into Toyota 3 times now, and they can't find anything wrong, I've even called Toyota Corp and escalated this, with out any success.
Has anyone else experienced this? I just can’t believe the incompetent mechanics at Toyota, that are telling me that this is normal behavior.
http://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/problems/recalls/recallsearch.cfm
Does the Battery charging behavior sound normal like the dealer says?
It's not charging and behaving like it did when I bought it, does not seem right.
Thanks for re affirming that I'm not crazy... well at least where the car is concerned
Despite this, the Prius is a remarkable techno-wonder...I expected some degree of early-adopter blues...
Ken