Midsize Sedans Comparison Thread

elroy5

The chances of getting over the Kelly Blue Book for an Accord are very good. The chances of getting over the Blue Book for a Sonata are not very good. The seller can not influence the resale value (it is worth what it is worth). You can ask for more than the resale value, but then the seller will be the one refusing to pay the inflated price.

backy

The chances of getting over the Kelly Blue Book for an Accord are very good. The chances of getting over the Blue Book for a Sonata are not very good.

Why is that? Doesn't KBB know anything about how these cars depreciate? Do you have any real-world data to share on actual resale prices of '06 Sonatas vs. their KBB value?

elroy5

I checked the listings for 2006 models. The Accord sells for about 4 to five thousand dollars more than the Sonata. There goes the money you thought you saved. A Sonata is not worth as much as an Accord. That's just the way it is. Whether you like it, or not.

bhmr59

The chances of getting over KBB or NADA book values for all makes & models, for a well maintained car, are very good since these book values are supposed to represent the "average" value.

Obviously some cars of all models, incuding Accord, will be below book value.

bobad

The chances of getting over the Blue Book for a Sonata are not very good. The seller can not influence the resale value (it is worth what it is worth).

All used vehicles sell in a range. You can get top dollar, average, or bottom. Which would you rather have Elroy? I rather have top dollar, so I work for it. I take good care of my vehicles, and always get a good price. That's a fact. Barring a significant wreck, I have no doubt my 2006 Sonata will fetch a decent price on the private market in 10 years... as 10 year old cars go! Sorry if that doesn't fit your broad vision of the used car world.

Backy is right. You can't compare moderately priced and high priced car resale value on a dollar basis. You must go by the percentage of the actual new price paid. Since I only paid $18,600 OTD, I don't expect my 10 year old car to fetch as much as a $25K car.

Nor do I even care. I'll take the $6K up front over the $1-2K on the back end every time, thank you!

jimmy81

An entry level luxury performance car doesn't mean upper crust bro. I think (styling aside) the high end Accord defintely approaches this next step up more than any other car in this comparo. Defintely moreso than a Hyundai.

I can hear the snickers now at the Nordstrom valet parking stand. " You take the Hyundai...."

elroy5

Which would you rather have Elroy? I rather have top dollar, so I work for it.

That's right, it's a range. But if you can sell a Sonata in the top of this range, you can also sell an Accord in the top of the range. So your point is pointless. The fact is, you can sell a 2006 Accord for about $5,000 more than you can sell a 2006 Sonata for. Check the listings yourself.

backy

The Accord should sell used for $4000-5000 more than a Sonata, since it costs at least that much more as a new car than a Sonata. No one is saying a Sonata magically gains value as it ages. But if someone thinks the great depreciation rates on cars like the Accord or Camry will save them money in the long run, they may be in for a nasty surprise.

In the insurance industry, there is a saying: "Buy term [insurance] and invest the difference." In the mid-sized car field, we could say instead, "Buy a Sonata and invest the difference."

ctc1

If you invest the difference instead of pay interest on the $5000 the numbers get even better with the less expensive car.

elroy5

"Buy a Sonata and invest the difference."

Yea, sure. Everybody is going to do that.

I can buy an Accord say for $25,000 and sell it 10 years later for $9,000. You can buy a Sonata for $20,000 and sell it 10 years later for $4,000. Guess what, we both both ended up spending $16,000 for our cars. But the clincher is, I drove around in a better car, for 10 years, than you did. You can say my numbers are off, but they are probably pretty close to reality.

backy

The problem with your example is that it's very unlikely you will be able to sell a 10 year old Accord for anywhere near $9000. According to Edmunds' TMV for a 1996 Accord EX V6 (which would have cost about $25k new), the private party price for a car in good condition and 120,000 miles is less than $5000. The 1996-98 Accords advertised in my local paper today ranged in asking price from $3250 to $5995.

So I'd rather be selling the Sonata in 10 years than the Accord. And I prefer how the Sonata drives to the Accord.

P.S. If I take that $5000 up front savings you mentioned and use it to pay down my mortgage, I would save lots more money over the next 10 years.

bobad

If you invest the difference instead of pay interest on the $5000 the numbers get even better with the less expensive car.

Since money for the new car comes out of my savings and credit union, it's the same as investing the difference. The less I withdraw, the less interest I lose.

elroy5

In 10 years from now, a 2006 Accord will be worth much more than a 96 Accord is worth now. Ever heard of something called "INFLATION"? Everything is going up, especially in a 10 year span.

bobad

I can buy an Accord say for $25,000 and sell it 10 years later for $9,000. You can buy a Sonata for $20,000 and sell it 10 years later for $4,000. Guess what, we both both ended up spending $16,000 for our cars. But the clincher is, I drove around in a better car, for 10 years, than you did. You can say my numbers are off, but they are probably pretty close to reality.

$4K for a 10 year old 06 Sonata should be no problem when the day comes. $9K for a 10 year old Accord in today's dollars? Possible, but that would probably be some kind of world record or something. They go for about $6K around here, but only if they are 1 owner, <150K miles, and in excellent condition.

The question of who drove the best car after 10 years is unknowable until the 10 years are up. You may be right, the Accord may be better, but not likely $5K better OMHO.

backy

I can say the same for a ten-year-old 2006 Sonata.

A 1996 Accord EX V6 cost $25,100 new. Even if you could have gotten a big discount on it, say you could have saved $3000 off list and gotten the car at invoice, no small feat in 1996 on an Accord (no rebates back then either), the car would have lost over $17,000 in value in ten years according to Edmunds.com. Why wouldn't a 2006 Accord lose at least that much in dollar value in ten years, and probably more since it would cost more?

It looks like the value equation is still tilted in favor of the Sonata, especially when considering interest charges avoided and the value of any interest earned on the purchase price difference.

m1miata

Hey, you forgot to tell him you can take the $5K difference and buy stock in Honda (HMC). Actually, you both will like your own buys the most. If [elroy5] bought the Sonata and had any problems he would be miserable. The Honda is what he likes and the difference, if any, is well worth it. Each of you need to buy what you end up adding up as the best car and best deal of car to be happy. Honda has a good history, and Hyundai is having the greatest comeback in history and offering great product, price and content. Honda is an excellent engine designer, and has had lots of reliable cars over time. Hyundai is showing great reliability figures recently. There is no wrong choice here. Now go buy a Nissan, Toyota, or Fusion --- just kidding

I like Honda. I like what I have seen of Hyundai lately. I will look over lots of different cars. Actually, I may buy something totally different, as I do like cars with some character to them. Looking for cars with some soul. The Dodge Stealth just grabbed me when I saw her in the showroom. Most cars these days are too bland, or too expensive if not bland. I 'm thinking, I'm thinking. In sedans the Altima, then the CTS and perhaps now the Fusion seem to have a little spice to them. The Azera? Not sure. The Sonata, nice package - maybe too Accord in looks. And I would test drive the i4 Accord, then the Sonata i4 and/or the V6 in the same day to see how they compare. I know some will like the Sonata better after the test drive, while some may not. And again, where is the spice? Saw a 2003 CTS for $25K today. Told the salesman that it was too expensive, and that it is priced like a brand new Azera.
-Loren

maxamillion1

Only problem I have with what you are saying is that every vehicle in Lexus's lineup (except maybe the GS) screams "ME TOO" as well, yet those cars definitely have PANCHE.

Styling means absolutely squat, its the refinement that matters, and that's where the Accord seriously packs the bunch.

Think about it, Toyota redesigns the Camry and can only beat the Accord by less than a point in a comparison test. Now that's refinement.

As the driver of an 05 Altima, I feel both the Accord and Camry, especially in higher trim levels, have more panche than say the Altima 3.5SE or 3.5SL, Sonata or even Mazda6, but you'll pay for it

goodegg

Styling means absolutely squat, its the refinement that matters, and that's where the Accord seriously packs the bunch.

I couldn't agree more.

elroy5

Saw a 2003 CTS for $25K today. Told the salesman that it was too expensive, and that it is priced like a brand new Azera.

With a Cadillac, you are paying some of the price for name recognition ("class" points). Many people don't even know what an Azera is. Just depends how much saying "It's a Cadillac" is worth to you. To me, the name Cadillac doesn't mean very much. Everyone is different. I would not pay the extra money for an Acura TL, just for the "Style points". Some people do.

mazda3indc

There seems to be far too many "Google-Fu" experts in this thread that haven't driven a Hyundai since the mid-80s Excel.

The new Sonatas are every bit as good as the Accord and Hyundai recently ranked 3rd in build quality behind Porsche and Buick.

elroy5

The new Sonatas are every bit as good as the Accord.

No, they are not. You have your opinion, and I have mine.

booyahcramer

There also seems to be far too many pro-Hyundaiers on this thread when the desire for a Hyundai in the 'real non-Edmunds' world is a fraction of what those here want to make it appear to be........

joe97

To be fair, please elaborate with your own observations. State your case, instead of a blantant rejection ("No, they are not [/end]" ) of what the other poster had to say - post some substance to form your opinion. By the same token you have your opinions, everyone else is also entitled to his/her opinions, which I would agree with. However, posts like "No, they are not [/end]" - this doesn't exactly sound like accepting other's opinion. Now, isn't it? Due us all a favor and go drive some competitions before posting igorance/hate/bash everywhere.

Anyway, in my opinion, I feel the gap is closing and is very small now between the leaders and the challengers; especially in the midsize category. I don't think there is such a thing anymore as one car being more superior than another; every model is ver competitive now. Car A might have an edge in one area; while car B is better in another area. Bottom line, all great cars, and consumers cannot go wrong with any model they choose.

m1miata

Technically, an opinion doesn't make one car a better one than another. Unless there is some sort of data to prove a benefit or an element of the car proven to be worse than another car, it is all just personal preference, perception, and a whole lot of guessing. I think the Sonata supporter would agree the Accord supporter has an auto with a good track record. Now the Accord supporter must realize IF the Sonata is reliable, and is similar to the Accord is most every respect as time goes by, then it too is as good. There is no way of telling. The engine is new, the car is new, the plant is new, and well you get the point. Hyundai is saying here is a car at a low price, with stuff like ESC with a long warranty. What more can they do? While you can not with any certainty say that they are the same as an Accord, there is NO way to prove they are not.

Now there are a half dozen other good choices in sedans, no doubt. Each has something a little different, or better to offer. Lots of things are just subjective. And your neighbor may be just as happy with his or her new LaCrosse and you are with your new Kia, or Jetta--- it really doesn't matter, as it is all opinion.

When it comes to facts, it matter only as much as you value those elements of the buying decision. I do it myself, and should know better. Telling people one car is so much better for them, when there are to many different things going on in their mind as to what they desire and need in a car to ever come with up any certainty that I know the best car for them is impossible. I can give them my OPINION of what I would buy based on how I see the car(s) in question, and that's about it.
-Loren

bobad

I feel the gap is closing and is very small now between the leaders and the challengers; especially in the midsize category. I don't think there is such a thing anymore as one car being more superior than another; every model is ver competitive now. Car A might have an edge in one area; while car B is better in another area. Bottom line, all great cars, and consumers cannot go wrong with any model they choose.

I couldn't agree more, and I think most reasonable people could agree. It makes it a little difficult to chat about cars here when someone says they prefer brand "A", the others think "They hate brand B". Well, that's not true in most cases. I think 97% of the posters here like something about all the midsize cars. The other 3 like only their favorite brand, and all others are called "junk" or similar. Another big problem is that some people made up their mind years ago that they hate a certain make, and even if it would magically become perfect, they would not change their mind. It's their loss. People that consider all makes are the only winners. I would be 95% happy with any of them.

beantown

One way I would use to measure the cars themselves is the following:

Take all these midsize cars and line them up. Offer them at the same price to the world. Now look at the sales numbers.

How many people who would have bought a Camry and Accord before this would now switch to a Hyundai or Kia? Zero, because they would've been able to get one for less money before this leveling of the playing field.

How many people who would have bought a Hyundai or Kia before this would now switch to a Toyota or Honda? Some number greater than zero (most likely each and every person who bought one because they wanted a midsize car but couldn't afford the Camry or Accord).

wolverinejoe80

honda homers need to stop thinkin that the accord is unbeatable. you can say accord is a better car, but not by much. i like sonata because of the exterior looks, cabin quietness & roominess, and the 10 warranty.

backy

It is not just a measure of the cars, but of other factors such as brand equity/loyalty, long-term reliability considerations (and misconceptions), and perceptions vs. reality.

I think a better measurement would be to have people do "blindfolded" test drives of the mid-sized cars, i.e. with identities/brands masked. That may not be practical, but it would allow people to rate the cars without preconceptions getting in the way.

louiswei

accept that the Sonata isn't up to the benchmark set by the CamCords?

Is Sonata a decent midsize sedan? YES
Is Sonata a biggest bang for the buck in this segment? Highly Likely
Is Sonata the best car in this segment? NO IMO

It took Accord/Camry 20 years and series of successful models to establish its reputation and they deserve every bit of it. Now with only 1 successful model and you put Sonata in the same league as the CamCords that is just totally rediculous. Is it possible that we are seeing history repeating itself with the Sonata? Very likely. But we won't know it until Hyundai proved itself again and again like the Toyota/Honda did back in the 80s and 90s.

You bought the Sonata because its cheaper and it serves you same purpose as the other midsize sedans so you think you got the best deal and good for you. But whatever you do please do not pretend you just got a cheaper CamCord because you didn't. In order to be in the same league as the Accord/Camry the Sonata needs to do EVERYTHING as good not just SOMETHING. Also, CamCords didn't establish the benchmark by doing everything as good as the domestics, they did everything BETTER, period. Until Hyundai can come up with a Sonata that performs better than CamCords in many areas they will always be just another midsize sedan whom is trying to chase down 2 very fast moving targets.

I also think that although the current Sonata is decent, the exterior design is a total rip-off of many other cars:

front end: last generation Honda Accord
Roof: Audi A4
Rear end: current generation Honda Accord (before the 06' modification)

Before they can come up with their own design, they won't earn my respect at all.

bobad

In order to be in the same league as the Accord/Camry the Sonata needs to do EVERYTHING as good not just SOMETHING.

Sonata owner here. I generally agree, but there are some things the Sonata does better than the Accord & Camry. The engine felt smoother and quieter, the ride was smoother, and the accelrator felt more positive than both, and the body fit and paint was a tad better on the ones I looked at. I actually liked the handling better on the Camry, but the Accord was a bit better than both. There are quite a few things about the A&C that are better than the Sonata, but only slightly... certainly not deal killers.

I also think that although the current Sonata is decent, the exterior design is a total rip-off of many other cars:

You can say the same thing about every current car in the world. These little midsized cars are so well defined by interior, exterior, suspension, safety, etc. there is only so much wiggle room for styling. It's all been done before on every car made since 1960. And believe me, no car maker wants to copy another. Designs are locked in 2-3 years before release, and kept secret. All the makers rule out "radical" designs right up front, so that narrows styling down even further. This makes occasional coincidences inevitable, and dreaded by the manufacturers.

backy

As noted, the Sonata does some things better than the Camcord. Does that mean the Camcords are not in the same league as the Sonata? Of course not. Being in the same league doesn't mean that one car has to do EVERYTHING as well as another car. Overall, it has to be competitive. The '06 Sonata is competitive with the best in class, at a much lower price. That is what makes the Sonata compelling--not that it does everything as well as or better than an Accord or Camry.

BTW, since Honda copied the rear end of the current generation Accord (before the '06 modification) from Buick, does that decrease your respect for Honda at all?

maxamillion1

can we talk about something else beside the Sonata (and it's merits versus the Camcords)

The car is COMPETITIVE..without a doubt...and we all should be glad that we have so many different choices. For example, the Sonata nor the Accord particularlly thrill me, but I find both to be respectable sedans in this class, along with the Camry, Altima and Mazda6.

How about the fact that pricing for the Aura has been announced (check out Saturn.com) and the fact that we have other cars in this class like the Fusion and Milan and others.

Sometimes I think we should rename this forum Accord vs. Camry vs. Sonata because that's all we basically hear about in this forum and it has become oh so boring...I miss the early days of Edmunds.com.

pat

If you or anyone else wants to refocus the topic, I'm sure there are many of us who would be most grateful!

louiswei

If you have read my post I said that Sonata is a very decent midsize sedan but it's just not in the same league as the CamCord. Why? Because this is only its first successful model. In order to be the same league it'll need to prove itself year after year like the CamCord did back in the 80's and 90's.

As for the new Accord's rear end I personally don't think it's a copy from Buick. But if you insist, that's fine by me. It won't decrease my respect for Honda because it already proved itself with the 4th gen, 5th gen and the 6th gen. I am pretty sure Honda didn't copy from anybody to come up with those designs (same goes for the Camry).

louiswei

Sometimes I think we should rename this forum Accord vs. Camry vs. Sonata because that's all we basically hear about in this forum

It's because Accord, Camry and Sonata are currently the most popular midsize sedans on the market. Since this is a midsize sedan forum, I am not surprised to see the most popular cars in this segment being discussed the most.

maxamillion1

This may be true..but the Altima outsells the Sonata..and we hear basically NOTHING about those cars.

The best selling sedans in this class are the Camry, Accord, Impala, Altima then Sonata thus far this year.

The Malibu and Impala are big sellers, and the Fusion is selling well also, but we hear nothing, nada about them in this forum compared to the Camcordnata.

The Sonata could eventually outsell the Altima (this year anyway) but then with the next generation Altima will probably continue to outsell the Sonata based on the fact that it will be new.

badgerfan

Well, maxamillion, good luck, but you are fighting a losing battle. This discussion always reverts back to Sonata vs Camcords, no matter that Fusion/Milan, Altima, and possibly Saturn Aura are valid contenders.

Truth is few of those who post here seem willing to admit that the competition is so close these days, any one of the top 5 or 6 brands in this class is a very good vehicle, and most of those who post for or against any one of them generally are exagerrating past and present reliability perceptions.

maxamillion1

A bit of history on the Accord I guess...
The Accord proved itself back in the late 1980's when it became the best selling car in America (aka the 3rd generation). The 1986 Accords (with those flip up lights) were the benchmark cars of their class during those years and paved the way for the 4th generation (1990-92) that also sold in record numbers. While the 3rd was a good benchmark, the 4th generation went on to higher heights and really propelled the Accord in its class. Competition from Ford and Toyota ended the 4th gens reign as the best selling car in America. The 5th generation was actually considered a step back by many magazines and consumers because of its small size relative to the Camry and Taurus and in the beginning a lack of V6 power. The V6 came in 95 though.

Honda had a wild idea that folks would move to smaller sedans, but the attempt failed, and the 5th generation was a bit of a setback for Honda, that's why the 6th was so major for a while. The 6th generation was seen as moving back in the right direction because of the proper (at the time) 3.0V6 and roomy (for the time) interior dimensions.

My favorite generation of Accords have been the 4th and 6th generations. So the Accord basically established itself at the 2nd generation model, which my parents owned (a 1984 and 85 model) and Accords were considered good cars back then(not so sure about the 1st generation) but it was the third that gave the Accord its benchmark standards. Rarely has the car ever been rated any less than benchmark standards since this time even during the low selling times of the 5th generation.

Will the Sonata have similar success? I most definitely think it will.

I'm sure Alpha (who knows a great deal about Toyota's products) can give a brief history on the Accord if he feels so inclined.

pat

Why don't you give us some food for thought on the vehicles you see as major contenders to the two or three dominant ones in this conversation?

joe97

"Take all these midsize cars and line them up. Offer them at the same price to the world. Now look at the sales numbers."

I would not exactly speculate since we all know this will never happen.

"How many people who would have bought a Camry and Accord before this would now switch to a Hyundai or Kia? Zero, because they would've been able to get one for less money before this leveling of the playing field.

How many people who would have bought a Hyundai or Kia before this would now switch to a Toyota or Honda? Some number greater than zero (most likely each and every person who bought one because they wanted a midsize car but couldn't afford the Camry or Accord)."

Very much an incorrect assessment, especially the 1st quoted paragrah. Keep in mind, Camrys and Accords are no longer superior than their compeitions. As mentioned previously, every car is more than competitive and each with own merits.

badgerfan

If you want, you can type in badgerfan in the search box and read my past posts in this discussion.

It seems no matter what a few less zealous people post, the discussion goes right back to Camcord vs Sonata.

For my money, Fusion gets the vote as having the best combination of precise handling combined with a firm but not punishing ride, reasonable price, styling, and trunk space. My past experience with Ford products has been very good, so no reason to switch brands on that basis. The V-6 Duratech is a very decent reliable engine, and the whole package can be bought close to or under $20K (for a V-6 Fusion SE).

Resale value? I could care less as I keep my cars at least ten years, and at that point condition of the vehicle counts more than brand regarding its remaining value. I never trade my cars in, I sell them outright, usually to the first buyer who actually comes over to check the vehicle out in person buys it due to it's excellent condition given it is a ten or more year old car.

ace35

Im interested to here from people in here, whats your take on the new Saturn Aura, do you think it will compete well with the others in the class? Since Gm is touting how important this vehicle is and how competitive it will be. I like the looks of it, not to pleased that gm is putting a pushrod V6 and a 4sp as the standard powertrain. The upgrade engine seems nice however. How's pricing compared to the others in the class ?

joe97

I personally like the Aura a lot - it den. gets my vote

The only shortfall I see is not having a I4 option.

badgerfan

Aura looks promising, and I am not bothered that much by the 3.5 pushrod V-6 and four speed in the base model. It is quite a fuel efficient engine, and since pushrod engines generally develop most of their torque and peak power at somewhat lower engine speeds than OHC engines, the returns are diminishing when applying 5 or 6 speed transmissions to pushrod engines. GM four speeds are known for smoothness and are pretty reliable.

If GM sticks to the no dicker pricing on these Auras, for $20K I would still be inclined to shop the competition unless they hit it out of the park in all other areas, such as handling, interior quality, etc.

wolverinejoe80

have you seen the new rear of accord? it looks like maxima. and look at the rear of last gen camry and look at the 1997-1999 sonatas. also look at the last gen odyssey's to 2nd gen sonatas. it's a clone.

before disrespecting hyundai look at the other hyundai models. hyundai has many current original designs-elantra, santa fe, tucson, and tiburon. azera does resemble mazda in front, but looks sleek and orginal from the rear and side.

bobad

azera does resemble mazda in front, but looks sleek and orginal from the rear and side.

If one really thinks about it, there are too many cars, and too few styling possibliities. The math catches up, and the car makers simply run out of permutations.

alpha01

Has Nissan resolved the engine fire issue and have all sales of the 2.5L models of the Altima and Sentra been cleared as "good to go"?

I remember reading about the 17 fires that prompted the sales halt of a large portion of the current inventory, but I've not read of the solution or what happened with those vehicles.

Also, I'm interested to know the cause, as likely near a million of those engines are on the road since late '01 (including my Sentra), I'm not sure why this issue would crop up now....

Here's Nissan's own press release, but there has not been a follow-up on nissannews.com.
"GARDENA, CA (June 2, 2006) &#150; Nissan North America, Inc., today directed its dealers to stop selling certain 2006 model year, four-cylinder Altimas and Nissan Sentra SE-Rs because of reports of excessive oil consumption while it continues to investigate potential causes.

The condition, if not detected or addressed properly, could lead to the potential for engine damage, or failure which could result in a fire in extreme cases. The National Highway Transportation and Safety Administration has been advised of Nissan&#146;s action.

Nissan estimates that about 100,000 Altimas and Sentra SE-Rs built between January and May 2006 may be subject to excessive oil consumption. There have been about 215 reports of excessive oil consumption, mostly from rental-car fleets, and 17 reports of engine fires, resulting in one minor injury.

Nissan is aggressively working to find a definite cause and solution for the condition.

Nissan is advising owners of these vehicles that they should frequently check and maintain the engine oil level. If the engine oil level is kept at the proper level, there should be no engine damage and no risk of engine failure or a resulting fire. If the engine oil level is not registered at all on the dip stick, customers are urged to immediately add oil and bring their vehicle to a Nissan dealer.

In the interest of customer satisfaction, Nissan has extended the engine portion of the Powertrain Coverage of the vehicles&#146; warranty on Altimas and Sentra SE-Rs built during the January to May 2006 period to 84 months or 100,000 miles, whichever comes first.

Nissan is taking these actions as part of its commitment to provide the highest levels of product quality and customer satisfaction.

In North America, Nissan\'s operations include automotive styling, engineering, consumer and corporate financing, sales and marketing, distribution and manufacturing. More information on Nissan in North America and the complete line of Nissan and Infiniti vehicles can be found online at www.NissanUSA.com and www.infiniti.com."

I think this shows impressive committment to the customer in some ways.

With that said, I think the reason that conversation frequently turns to Camcord vs. Sonata is that the Camry and Accord are generally top sellers and held in highest regard in the segment. The Sonata is the first serious threat since the '02 Altima, and quite frankly, there's not a lot of buzz on the new Altima given that its not available for drive yet, pricing isn't out, etc...

~alpha

ace35

i agree, it seems like now the hot styling detail seems to be the "bangle butt" everyone has it from, Merc S550, Camry, Azera, ect... I for one like the bangle look, it adds dimension and presence to the rear of the car.

m1miata

Or in many cases like they forgot to add the trunk lid in the design and had to slap one on later which doesn't fit. It is like we can add another couple of cubic feet of space with a little taller butt here, so lets make a hump on that baby in the back. Yes, if done with enough grace, it is OK I suppose. Mr. Bangle went overboard on that 7 series.
-Loren

choe13

first the reason why impala and fusion sale is because they are american cars in american soil. Same as bimmers in germany and hyundai in korea.

If this was a neutral country i don't know how the impala can have a chance with a sonata(honestly what one thing does it do better, it is not in the same neighborhood as in quality and priced higher(pretty crazy)

What awards has the altima won? i think nil. Interior was below par in tightness and quality material, spectacular engine, good handling, size, looks cool, so so overall quality, priced almost as high as camcords

camry, accord and now the sonata are winnign alot of awards, good quality(jd power)etc. These cars i feel nail down the fundamentals of what a good mid size car should be, but of course the sonata is winner in my books with its pricing, tremendous value, high in safety(abs, esc, awsome brake grips), respectable performance and of course the sharpest dressed sedan currently