BMW 3-Series Lease Questions

tennis_rus

travis, get 500 over invoice and .00175

that is what i am aiming for in md

what is your montly payment coming up to?

gearwhore

ragtops01

I just pick up the car today and this is my number and would like to share with everyone. I found this website very helpful and hope this info can help others. I also uses a website call fighting chance (www.fightingchance.com). They send me step by step how to get a good deal. There is alot of planning and prep work but I think it's worth it. Enjoy!

2009 335i Sedan, Space Gray Matallic, Premium Package, Sport Package, iPod/USB adapter, Manuel Transmission

MSRP $46,675
Invoice $43,525
Sale Price $43,525
Term 36/12K
Money Factor 0.0020 (Dealer Buy Rate is .00175)
Residual % 62% (Some dealer quoted me 58%)
Local Sales Tax 8.25%
Bank Fee $925.00 (Dealer Mark up from $625)
MACO/Doc Fee $400.00
Training Fee $180
DMV Fee $408.75
Security Deposit: $650.00

Down: $0
Driveoff: 1638.75 (MACO, Training, DMV, Security Deposit)
Taxes $47.66
Monthly Payment $577.66
Monthly Payment + Tax $625.32

goldenmeeko

wow gearwhore where are you located to get the car at invoice

kyfdx

As of October, BMWFS has raised the base acquisition fee to $725.

$200 is still the maximum markup.

regards,
kyfdx

Travis_Y

Here are the numbers I was given.

MSRP $46350
price $44999
59% resi.
.00175 m/f
$696 includes tax

gearwhore

Bay Area, California

gearwhore

Yes, and legally if the dealer mark up to one customer, they will have to mark up across the board to everyone for this bank fee. non-discriminating, so I was told by third party leasing expert.

kyfdx

Your leasing expert is wrong..

Dealers are free to markup, not markup, etc, etc..

I'm sure they aren't allowed to break the law regarding discrimination by creed, sex, race, etc, etc... but, the markups are negotiable... I've made deals both ways, with the same dealer..

Dealers like to use that line... most often with document fees ("I have to charge everyone the same amount"). But, it isn't true.

regards,
kyfdx
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gearwhore

Thank you for your information.

ichochochooseu

Hi CarMan and everyone,

First off I would like to thank you all for all of the hard work that is put in to this forum. It has been extremely helpful for researching a new car lease.

I am looking at doing a 3 year lease for a 2009 335i Sedan and would like your opinions on the offer I was given below:

2009 BMW 335i Sedan
MSRP $49,050
Sale Price $47,650
Sales Tax $0 (BMW will cover sales tax for the month of December)
Lease Term 12k miles / 36 months
Residual 62%
Interest Rate 2.30%
Misc fees $725 Acquisition, $130 Doc Fee (There may be another <$100 fee or two I am missing)
Monthly Payment $680 per month

I would appreciate anyone's opinion on the terms above.

Thanks,

IChoChoChooseU

tennis_rus

i am in md, dealers tell me i have to pay the whole tax upfront on the whole price of the car, even on the lease so 40,000 car would cost me about 2k extra of taxes... so my drive off + 2k ,.... is it true?

tennis_rus

i think u can get it down 20-30 bucks if you get a better negotiated price.... like 500-1000 less... mf and residual are correct

kyfdx

I believe that is the case for Maryland.. they tax the entire selling price, not the payment.

tennis_rus

does it make sense to lease if i pay 2.5k in taxes to drive a car for three years?

kyfdx

Tough question..

Of course, it makes less sense than if you were in a state where the total taxes were only $1100-1200..

But, it always helps to do the math... What is the residual amount on the car you are considering leasing, and what do you think you can actually get for that car in three years?

Most BMWs have pretty high residuals, when comparing them to real-world trade-in values. If you only keep a BMW for three years, then you'll almost always come out ahead by leasing, even with your taxes.. But, if you are likely to keep the car for five years if you buy it, then the tax thing might sway me some...

When doing your math, don't forget about the acquisition fee... you won't pay that if you are financing..

regards,
kyfdx

tennis_rus

in three years I will drive 45k and turn the car back in.... the most important part for me is the payment around $450.... if I were to buy that car and pay the taxes I would have to put around 12k down to make payment around $450

The MSRP of the vehicle I am ordering is $39045 and they will be selling me the car at $36909.46. With taxes and MVA at $2418.57 plus $3000 my payment will be $460.30 per month for 36 months X 15,000 miles per year. 1st month payment is included. The MF is .00175 and the residual is 59%.

so I spent 5.4 k drive off and have my payment where I want it........ or I am getting ripped off?

dt78

Based on a post I read in October, the lease rates on remaining 2008 335 sedans were:

2008 BMW 335i Sedan
24 Month &#150; Residual 61% of MSRP &#150; .00085 Base Rate
36 Month &#150; Residual 56% of MSRP &#150; .00085 Base Rate
48 Month &#150; Residual 37% of MSRP &#150; .00285 Base Rate
60 Month &#150; Residual 31% of MSRP &#150; .00285 Base Rate

Does anyone know if these rates still apply in December, and if not, what the current rates are?

Based on the above, a 36 month, 36,000 mile lease is a pretty sweet deal compared to a similarly priced 2009 335 sedan. I have the opportunity to do an early lease turn in on my current car, so leasing a 2008 3 series (if the numbers are right) is a definite option.

My other question is whether or not I could realistically get a 2008 model sitting on the lot at or below invoice. Not sure if BMW is willing to slash prices to move 2008 inventory, and I have never leased or purchased a BMW, so I don't know if they are like other car companies who are giving customers $5K or more below invoice just to get cars off the lot.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

davidt1

Car_man,

Can you please let me know what money factors and residuals are being offered by BMW FS for the 2009 328CI convertable? I am looking at a 12K/36 month term.

Thanks
David T

bcampbell001

Well it's that time again, haven't been around for about 36 months If car_man or any other forum member can assist, that would be great. I searched through many pages, however I couldn't find MF and Residual for the 2 variations of the same car below

'09 328i Sports Wagon

MSRP: 41,695
Sell: 39,385
36 / 15K lease
Los Angeles Ca. - South Bay BMW

or

MSRP: 45,750
Sell: 43,075
36 / 15K
Los Angeles, Ca - South Bay BMW

Thanks in advance

Brian

CarMan@Edmunds

Hi Travis. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor for the 2009 328i Coupe is .00175 for returning BMW FS customers and new ones that pay a security deposit at lease signing. If the dealer that you are working with tries to charge you anything other than this, they likely are marking up your car's factor to add additional back-end profit to your deal.

Car_man
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CarMan@Edmunds

Yep David, just about everyone's sales have really fallen off of a cliff over the past two months. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 328i Convertible with 12,000 miles per year are .00200 and 61%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical 2008 model are .00175 and 58%.

Car_man
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CarMan@Edmunds

Hi goldenmeeko. Typically manufacturers and dealers make a big push at the end of the year to squeeze every last sale into their annual total. This makes December a great time to purchase a new vehicle. It is difficult to say what BMW's lease program for the 335i will look like in January. If auto sales stay as bad as they are it certainly is possible that BMW would enhance its lease program...but there certainly is no guarantee that it will.

If I was in an area that had a decent level of competition, I definitely would shoot for $500 over dealer invoice and see what happens, but it's tough to say whether BMW's January lease program will be better than its current one.

Car_man
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cdnpinhead

In the "go to msg #" box, put in 2137 & have a look. Some of what's there is outdated (the $625 fee is now $725, for example), but it may help you. The most important thing there is how to find the lease MFs & residuals on Bimmerfest.

For either car you're interested in (328 wagon) the MF is 0.002 and the residual is 58% for 36 months & 15K miles. Go all the way to the bottom, and there's other useful stuff -- formulas, definitions, etc.

I used to be interested in a wagon also, and I see it's still the same -- the wagon has the highest MF and lowest residual of any of the 328s. The sedan and coupe have better numbers, but I wanted a wagon.

Good luck.

CarMan@Edmunds

Hi ichochochooseu. When you said that this car's money factor is 2.3%, did you mean .00230? If so, the dealer is marking your car's factor up to add additional hidden back-end profit to your deal. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor for the '09 335i is only .00175.

As far as this car's selling price goes, a base 2009 335i has a spread of around $3,200 between its full MSRP and its dealer invoice price. You are only being given a $1,400 dealer discount on this car. I personally would want a larger discount than that. Make sure to stop by the "BMW 3-Series Prices Paid and Buying Experience" discussion to see how much other community members have paid for similar cars lately.

Car_man
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CarMan@Edmunds

Hi dt78. Here is BMW Financial Services' December program for this car:

2008 BMW 335i Sedan
24 Month &#150; Residual 61% of MSRP &#150; .00085 Base Rate
36 Month &#150; Residual 56% of MSRP &#150; .00085 Base Rate
48 Month &#150; Residual 36% of MSRP &#150; .00280 Base Rate
60 Month &#150; Residual 30% of MSRP &#150; .00280 Base Rate

Given the dealer credit for a free automatic transmission that BMW is currently providing and how late it is in the model year, I don't see why you wouldn't be able to get this car or a little below at dealer invoice, but not five grand under. Make sure to stop by the "BMW 3-Series Prices Paid and Buying Experience" discussion to see how much other community members have paid for similar cars lately.

Car_man
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CarMan@Edmunds

Here you go, David. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 328Ci Convertible with 12,000 miles per year are .00200 and 61%, respectively.

Car_man
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CarMan@Edmunds

Welcome back Brian. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2009 BMW 328i Sports Wagon with 15,000 miles per year are .00200 and 58%, respectively.

Good luck in your quest for a new ride and make sure to let us all know how everything turns out.

Car_man
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bcampbell001

Running the numbers.....

$594.75 / mo....yikes....looks like no Bimmer for Brian!

Thanks cdpinhead & car_man for your help...

car_man....I'll see you in another lease forum shortly

xxoo
Brian

hana80

Dear Car_Man,

I have never posted before and would really appreciate your help and advice. I want to lease a 2009 328i sedan in monaco blue. I have never leased a vehicle before. I recieved one quote today for 4000 down, 368 per month but I was not sent the msrp, sale price, residual percentage, invoice price or money factor. I am requesting that info but would really appreciate advice from you on what I sould shoot for in terms of a good deal. Any advice you can give would be much appreciated! I am in southern california.

thank you so much!!

plasmator

My 2007 Maxima lease is coming due in February 2009, and I've started shopping for a replacement. My favored option is a 2009 328i Wagon. I put less than 10,000 miles per year on my vehicle, so if they offer a 10,000 mile lease that would be what I'm after. My questions are as follows:

1. What are the money factors and residual on this vehicle right now?

2. I know that nobody has a crystal ball, but would your best guess be for these to stay the same, go up, or come down by February?

3. What incentives are currently being offered? The vehicle I'm looking at has a list price of $39,995 and an invoice of $36,880.

4. Generally speaking, how would a lease on a 1-year old used vehicle compare?

Thanks for the help!

Travis_Y

hana80,

I have collected all the numbers myself looking on this board. You need to know the MSRP, Lease selling price, money factor, and residual.

2009 BMW 328i Sedan
24 Month &#150; Residual 67% of MSRP &#150; .00150 Base Rate
36 Month &#150; Residual 60% of MSRP &#150; .00150 Base Rate
48 Month &#150; Residual 41% of MSRP &#150; .00285 Base Rate
60 Month &#150; Residual 34% of MSRP &#150; .00285 Base Rate

It seems from this board you should shoot for $500 over invoice and shop it around till someone bites.

joesao

First of all, thanks to everyone for the great info on these boards. I think I've collected most of what I need but wanted to double check and get any updates for December. I've put together a spreadsheet with the options (MSRP and invoice) for these cars, where I can just check them off and they add up to the total. The main variables are the money factor and residuals.

What's the latest residual and money factors for (I'm in South Florida, not sure if that matters...):

2008:
328i, 36mo lease, 10k miles
335i, 36mo lease, 10k miles
2009:
328i, 36mo lease, 10k miles

Thanks a lot!

AggieKnight

Howdy Edmunds Forums!

I'm planning on ordering a 335xi before the end of the year and leasing it. First, thanks for the residuals and base rates, yall. Very helpful.

This is my first Beamer (previously an Acura family), and I was thinking about taking European Delivery. From yalls experience, does taking European Delivery cut out your ability to negotiate?

sraga

If you have not done a deal yet , you may find this info useful.

I have a 2007 328xi with $26600 lease buyout at the end of my lease in Feb, 2009.
I was able to successfully negotiate a lease buyout of $21300 + they took care of my remaining 2 months payment. BMW FS will negotiate with you, but you have to do it thru a dealer. I went with the dealer I went with to do the lease originally...

You should be able to negotiate a current buyout minus about 20 to 25%. Tell them you will walk away from the deal. Only thing is they do not have any good financing on 2007 BMW purchase. I financed thru my bank at about 5%.

Hope you find this helpful...

earth777

This is very helpful. I called BMWFS and they told they will not negotiate. I spoke with the dealer and they were not interested and referred me back to BMWFS so i gave up. Which dept at the dealer i should approach?

also, my car has low miles so maybe this is why they are no interested in giving me a break on the buyout price.

cdnpinhead

Couple things:

1) BMW motorcycles are referred to as Beemers. BMW cars are Bimmers.

2) Some dealers are very willing to work with you on ED cars. You need to look up the European invoice price and work up from that. Some stores are willing to do a deal for $500 - $1000 above European invoice. Yours may or may not be one of them. You may need to throw a fairly wide net.

There's a board devoted entirely to BMW European Delivery. Go to the list of 3-series discussions, and I think you'll find it.

You can save many thousands of dollars if you're willing to do your research & take possession of the car wherever you need to in order to get a good price.

Good luck.

dmwong

Thanks for all the great post. I just wanted to share a deal I have just closed. This is my first lease, so I was caught a little off guard by the mark-up in the lease finance in the end. This is in San Francisco bay area.

MSRP: $41xxx
Sales: $33xxx ( this is a demo car with ~4k miles )
12k/yr, 36 mth lease, residual: 58%
Acq: $925 ( the finance lady swore this is amount BMWFS charges them, not $725 )
MF: 0.00091 after 7 multiple deposits ( yea, the crazy markup, but after half day of negotiation, I found out too late, and was too tired to just walk out when most paper works are done )
down: first month, deposit, title.... so no cap cost reduction
monthly: ~350/m + tax

I think I did ok. I am pretty sure people can do better with all the new discount emails I am getting now from different dealers. Best of luck car buying in year end !

conrad2612

My first post to this forum: I thought it was a good deal - let me know your thoughts...
negotiated a lease on a 36-month/15k per year, 2009 328x sedan w/ non-metallic paint

premium;
nav;
cold weather;
ipod adaptor

for $480 over edmunds invoice for this build of $39,535. Residual at 60%, mf .0015. Payment of $457 after cap cost reduction of $2k and following non cap-cost reducing fees:

acquisition fee $725 (down from $925);
reg fee: $75;
5% sales tax on $2k cap cost reduction: $100;
doc fee: $295 (thought this was high);
and first payment

Total cash down: $3652; monthly payment $457

I've built an easy spreadsheet calc that you can use real time to negotiate - I'll post it if anyone can tell me how to post files...

jun2

Hi there, I just thought about this.
Since the fed rate is down and I leased BMW 3Series on May of 2008 for 36mths (around 6%). I wonder if I can redo the lease contract to lower down my interest rate so I can have lower monthly payment. If I call BMW Financial services wil they re-negotatiate? Anyone done it before? Thanks for any advise, i appreciate it.

kyfdx

If I call BMW Financial services wil they re-negotatiate?

No.. what would be their motivation?

john7548

Regarding the previous post....BMWFS is not going to re-negotiate any lease...not only do they have no motivation but that would open a real "can of worms"....The big question is what is BMWFS going to do on January 3, 2009...All the great financing ends on the 2nd....For whatever reason I couldn't pull the trigger by the 2nd and I'm anxious to see if I made a mistake. I know the remaining 08 3 series are really being discounted...BMW in Concord sent out an e-mail offerring to sell at $2500 under dealer invoice on remaining 08 3 series. I think BMW is going to have to offer some greater incentives on 08 335s...there are alot of those in dealer's inventory. That is a great car but priced a little too much above the 328s..

armenh

Hello everybody this is my first post here. I am interested into leasing a small luxury sedan not sure yet which one but likely a 2009 328i ( i have test driven that and the is250 so i have the a4 and c300 remaining, acuras are really ugly now). I am a bit confused about leasing. The BMW i am looking at has an MSRP of 39,600, it is auto w/ premium package and metallic paint. The money factor seems to be 0.00150 but with an MSD planning on 7(idk is it a good idea? for 3150 i am saving 1000 and so bucks total or 30 per month on the lease, and getting around 10 percent interest?) so its
0.00101. MF
Residual is 62%
12k miles/yr
Invoice ~ 36k
better than tier 1 credit haha
I want a base lease of around 360 plus tax so around $400. I will likely put 2500 towards cap cost red. So first I go to the dealer and try to negotiate the price of the car down? So for example i tell them lower the cars MSRP to 38k or 37k? Is it possible. And then i put my down payment of 2500 on top of that which should or shouldnt includes the acqui fee, doc fees and first months payment? (are those even legitimate fees?) so the gross cap cost is around 35500. Am i correct so far? I do my calculations and w/out tax i get around 363, which is excellent. Can I get this deal or am i too optimistic? Should i work more to lower the price? So many questions, but I would appreciate if you can answer. Thanks in advance!!

nexyaja

FYI BMW just extended their CPO financing offer till Mar 02.
0.09% (don't know if it is for upto 60 months) plus two free payments. I am glad I did not get pressured into buying an 05 X5 today to beat the deadline.
I am sure they will extend financing deals for new cars also...

john7548

Armenh...I didn't go back through our numbers regarding the dealer invoice value of the car. Nor do I know anything about the 7 payment thing. What I do know if you can buy the car for close to dealer invoice...I think someplace they are going to have to make something so you can expect that they will make some money on finance fees, document fees etc. I've been offerred an 09 328i at $200 over invoice and I didn't push that harder because to do so who have meant I would have had to be prepared to buy the car. I want to buy the car from my local dealer and I was only preparing for discusions with him. So for sure you should not pay more than $400 over dealer invoice for the vehicle. Just don't get too excited and be prepared to work on the deal for a while...In my opinion you can't compare the BMW driving experience with any of those other vehicles you are considering.

armenh

Thanks for the reply, I am planning on leasing so the cap cost w/ out putting anything down should be around 36500 so even lower than 37k, which i was thinking would be amazing? If so thats really good, thing is they are advertising $429 on their site w/ 3500 down or so... seems like a rip off then

tennis_rus

how many miles a year u going to drive.... dont forget the taxes, fees etc....
it's a different story when u get to the dealer, try going and closing the deal...

i got 09 328 coupe 39045, negotiated 36900... with 3k down $460 a month

i had to pay taxes and dmv separatelly

armenh

So you negotiated down about 2100 and then on top of that you put the 3k down? Did it include all the fees and first months payment?

armenh

One more thing is it possible to tell the dealership to order the car to your specifications without you just picking it up from the lot on the same day? If so would they charge you extra and how long would it take?

joesao

I've been going through some dealers to get quotes on new 328i's (2009) lease and they always want to stuff you with a ~$1,500 inception fee even if you tell them you want to put $0 down. When asked what are those fees they all reply, "You know, first month's payment, tag, title, taxes."

But it turns out they're probably making money on those inception fees.

What's legitimate to have in those fees?
- I'm adding the $825 "destination charge" to the invoice cost of the car
- One of the dealers had a $950 "bank fee" inside that inception fee -- what a scam! (Or is this legit?)

I also learned that if you currently lease a BMW, you can order your custom car from the dealer at no additional cost (it makes no difference to them -- it's just one fewer vehicle from their allocation), and BMWfs will extend your current lease at your current payment for up to 6 months -- pretty sweet.

Also, if anybody could help with Jan '09 money factors on a 2009 328i, leased for 36 months with 10k miles, I would appreciate it.

Thanks a lot!

tennis_rus

hi, i ordered my car in mid december, takes 4-6 weeks...all my specs.... they dont charge extra... 3k included first month payment, 100$ doc fee and refundable 500$ sec. deposit.... so really 2k down... also in my state MD, i must pay taxes upfront on the whole car , that kinda sucks so around 2k for taxes extra, which is law... most states it will be around $40 months extra.... for me it was important to have my payment around $450 a month for 40k car, with 3k down + taxes seemed like a good deal, now I can see some people can negotiated $500 over invoice but in the end the monthly payment comes up about the same with the 3k down....also remember my total drive off is $5200...... 15k miles 36 month so leasing this car is not cheap...if u were to buy similar car it would be $12k down and 450 a month + tax ..............