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2013 and earlier BMW X5 Lease Questions

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Comments

  • Thanks for the reply. After I finished typing and sending the message, I thought "that's not going to be enough information", but you helped me out. Also, are the deals "really" going to be that much better in the next couple of days, before the end of the year? I find myself pushing hard to get something closed before then, and am wondering if it is really worth the rush.
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited December 2011
    The end of year cash incentive for 1k ends soon. That only is available in nov to dec. Also, lease residuals change january 1. They could stay the same or go up or down. Your dealer should know the answer by now.
  • Hi all, does anyone know current incentives on 2012 X5s - diesel, and regular models. I was hoping to find out about incentives as well as buy rate on MF for 36 month lease 15k miles. I am a current BMWFS customer in case that helps ... I'm in California. Thanks so much.
  • Hi lvit. The answer to your question is no, I don't believe that BMW is offering any money factor reductions for loyal customers in the new year.

    Car_man
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  • Hi alexkoper. BMW Financial Services' January buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36-month lease of a base 2012 X5 with 15,000 miles per year are .00195 and 57%, respectively.

    The January numbers for an otherwise identical lease of an X5 Diesel are .00195 and 56%.

    I do not believe that BMW is providing a money factor reduction for loyal customers any longer.

    Car_man
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    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • Thanks Car_Man! Really appreciate it. Are you aware of any manufacturer to dealer or manufacturer to consumer incentives? Am I better off waiting? Seems like I could get the same car for much less in 2011 ...

    Very grateful for your help.

    P.S. when you say base model, do the extra packages, etc change the residual much?
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited January 2012
    Alexkoper - residual percentages don't change when you add options. The residual rate is set according to the model, number of lease years, and the number of miles per year on the lease.

    The residual percentage normally decreases by 1% for each increment in annual lease miles (10k, 12k, 15k). Each increment in annual mileage allowance will cost you about $16/month for a 36 month lease. ((1% x negotiated final price) / 36).

    When you add options, the payment changes because you are paying the same depreciation rate (100% - Residual) on a more expensive car.

    For a 36 month lease with 15k miles, payments generally change by about $30/month per $1,000 increase/decrease in price. Add 10k of options, and your lease payment will increase by $300/month. That's very easy to do on a BMW.

    Ask your salesman to show you the lease residual chart from BMW. Sometimes you will find that a particular model has a much higher residual and you can get a nicer more expensive car for almost the same lease payment because the residual value is higher.
  • You're very welcome alexkoper. Options don't directly affect your vehicle's residual values, but its trim level does. The residuals for the base, Premium, and Sport X5 models are all slightly different.

    Your assessment of the current programs is spot on...they definitely were better in December than they are now. It's difficult to say what BMW's future incentives will be like, but I doubt that they'll be much worse than the current programs.

    Car_man
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    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • Hi All!

    I think I may have missed the boat, great deals were happening last month. I stopped into a dealership yesterday inquiring about leasing a 2012 x5 35i, but was told really no difference in the leasing deals. These cars don't seem to be sitting at dealerships and have to be ordered, which waiting a few weeks is not a problem for me. BMW is advertising lease specials for x5 models. Are these deals negotiable? For example, they have:

    Well equipped including great features such as iPod/USB Adapter, Hi-Fi Sound System, Roof Rails, BMW Assist, Cargo Cover and Destination charges. A car with an msrp of $48,895
    $569*/month for 36 months

    • $569 First months payment
    • $3,000 Down payment
    • $0 Security Deposit
    • $725 Acquisition fee
    • $4,294 Cash due at signing

    Or: For the premium trim x5 with an msrp of $56,095.

    Well equipped including features such as Auto Closing Tailgate, Lumbar Support, Heated Front Seats, Park Distance Control, BMW Assist, and Cargo Cover and Destination Charges.
    $629*/month for 36 months

    • $629 First months payment
    • $3,000 Down payment
    • $0 Security Deposit
    • $725 Acquisition fee
    • $4,354 Cash due at signing

    Are these good deals? What if anything is negotiable? I am a current BMW owner and not sure if there are current incentives for owners? Any help is appreciated.
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited January 2012
    ShortyRock32, I confirmed with my dealer that owner loyalty is no longer available, but don't be too disappointed about missing the Nov/Dec BMW sales event and owner loyalty. ("I think I may have missed the boat, great deals were happening last month.")

    That's because sometimes you can still end up with close to the same lease payment or even better after the promotions end.

    The sales event that ended January 3rd had cash and owner loyalty that would give you a combined $2,000 cash on an X5. But the lease residuals on some X5 models/trim levels were lower in Nov/Dec 2011. If you compare Nov/Dec lease residuals to 2012 residuals, you will find that some of the residuals increased on January 3rd. BMW pays for sale campaigns in part by tinkering with residuals.

    So don't assume that you missed out and have to wait until the next "sale" a year from now. You may not see much difference in your payment if you properly negotiate the deal (described in detail in this forum last month.)

    Ask your salesman to show you the lease residual chart and look for models/trims that have higher residual value. A few points of residual are more valuable than a couple thousand cash back.

    For example, I leased a 2012 X5 5.0 last month for the same payment as a comparably optioned 3.5d (my first choice) even though the 5.0 was more expensive and the diesel had an additional $2,500 credit. That's because the residual on the 5.0 was several points higher than the diesel.

    Are you a BMW Car Club member? Members still get a check for $1,000 on an X5. I don't know why more BMW owners don't maintain a membership if they plan to buy/lease a BMW. A $50 membership gets you a $1,000 check.
  • Thank you so much for taking the time to respond to my message!!! Great information! I wasn't aware about being a car club member?!? I will have to look into this, assuming I can find that information on the BMW USA site??? Definitely worth it! So basically, I shouldn't go by the advertised numbers/deals so much? In the end, it's the higher the residual points, the better the deal? This is so new to me. This will be the 2nd car I will have ever leased. Went into the first one without knowing a thing (Cayenne). This time, I feel like I want a little more knowledge on my side. Can you tell me if ALL BMW dealers all have the same residual chart or does it vary?
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited January 2012
    No matter what terms are advertised, my recommendation is to always negotiate the deal. The advertised lease terms are only an example and include a lot of assumptions for things like how much the dealer will discount the car off MSRP. You can almost always do better. If you ask for the advertised terms, the dealer will gladly give you that deal because they'll make more money than if you negotiate the lease.

    The December posts in this forum offer a lot of tips on how to negotiate a lease. The residual is important, but other things are important too: discount off MSRP, money factor, options, etc.

    Residuals are set by BMW. All the dealers in your area should be using the same residuals if you're financing through BMW Finance. The terms would be different if you lease through a different bank.

    Note that the BMW Car Club membership must be active for at least one year before you buy your car. They changed it back in the late 1990s because people were signing up for a membership on the same day they bought their car, taking the rebate, and then letting their membership lapse. So it won't help you today if you're not already a member, but it's something that every BMW owner should be aware of if they ever plan to buy/lease another BMW.
  • My dealer told me that $2000 is the most they are going off MSRP because the car is completely sold out and needs to be ordered? Do I have any leverage anywhere else in the cost of the vehicle, to negotiate a lower price? This is for a lease with 15,000 mi. per year.

    PS. Thanks again for that BMW Car Club information. I was able to find out how to sign up and contacted their customer service who told me I would have to be a member for 1 year before purchasing a new vehicle. Too bad for now, but GREAT to know for future leases.
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited January 2012
    Was that your dealer's opening price in the negotiation or their "final" price?

    I custom order all my BMWs and my dealer does not offer me less discount off MSRP because an order has to be placed. Roughly 80% of X5 and X3 orders are placed by the customer. BMW's sales process and the plant in Spartanburg, SC are built around custom ordering. It's how they operate and it's not a valid justification to charge you more (if that's what is happening.) I'm sure your dealer would prefer that you buy something off the lot, but that line about being "completely sold out" is just a sales tactic. He wants you to think that the car is so hot that you should pay more.

    To know if you are getting an acceptable price, ask the dealer to tell you how much above invoice they want to charge. Don't judge the deal by how much they are discounting off MSRP. There are different opinions on how much above invoice is reasonable to pay for a BMW, but a common range to my experience is $750 - $1,250 above dealer invoice (and then subtract incentives from that number.)

    In general, BMW dealers will not sell at or below invoice when you are placing an order, so don't expect that unless you're a really good negotiator. And it is winter, so X5s are in demand.

    There are some very detailed posts here in December that describe how to negotiate a lease.

    But keep it all in perspective. Don't let worry about a couple hundred dollars of purchase price ruin the excitement or convince you to take a car that's not your first choice. $250 difference in price is about $7/month on a 36 month lease payment. It's not the end of the world if you didn't fine tune the last penny out of the deal.

    You always have leverage because you can shop their deal around and buy from another dealer. Or, consider a buying service (USAA, Costco, credit union, American Express, etc. etc.) that can help you with the negotiation. When I asked my dealer last month about the Costco buying price, he said it was about $1,250 above invoice minus incentives. That might serve as a benchmark for what's reasonable. If the price is too high and the dealer won't budge, tell him you're not happy with the price and you plan to use a buying service and shop around at other dealers. Ask him to beat the buying service price to keep you from ending up at another dealer. Hopefully it won't come to that.

    Carman might be able to give you some better tips.
  • shortyrock302shortyrock302 Posts: 7
    edited January 2012
    This was the opening. Met him Saturday, but didn't have an actual car to test drive, showed me one that was going out to a new owner. These numbers were all via email communication this evening. We never really started any talk until today. For example, quoted me on a 35i premium, MSRP $60,695, dealer cost 56,895. Looking at about $871.58, taxes and fees included. Taxes 3.75%, plus rolling in some tax credit (approx $1219) from trading in my lease there. Have an appointment to go in Thursday.
  • Hey there Car guy. Just got a quote from BH BMW in Los Angeles and wanted to pass it buy you. MSRP 61,625
    Residual 58.00%
    Lease end value,35742.50
    Initial cap coast 56,008.32
    cash cap reduction 408.81
    sales tax 2,402.13 (ouch)
    adds to cap 45.00
    adjusted cap cost 45,644.51
    money factor 0.00195
    term 36
    miles 12,000/year
    base monthly 731.03
    total with everything 795.00
    Drive off 2,500
    Annual fees 465.00

    what's up with the adjusted cap cost? and should I get the dealer invoice #
    THANKS!!
  • Just out interest what package/options was this?
    And does anyone know if we can still apply for Government Tax rebate on X5 Diesel and if so what is that?

    Thanks
  • chad39chad39 Posts: 4
    Just got offered the following after alot of negotiations. Is it a fair deal?
    2012 x5d

    Msrp $69,375
    Selling Price $63,245
    Money factor .00195 :)
    Residual $38,500
    36 months
    15,000 miles
    5,000 down
    Monthly payment $786

    Please advice!
  • This was with a premier package. I'd also like to know the answer to the Government Tax rebate. Thanks
  • chad39chad39 Posts: 4
    Car man - does this appear to be a fair deal?

    MSRP $69,375
    Residual $38,850
    Money Factor .00195
    Money due at signing including all fees, first month payment, etc $5,000
    Received $2,500 ECO Credit
    Selling Price $63,245
    Monthly Payment $786

    Thanks
  • cybopalcybopal Posts: 4
    edited January 2012
    Hi,
    I hired a auto consultant and they gave me these numbers for a new 2012 bmw x5 sport activity lease (these numbers are before any negotiation , so all based on MSRP). I tried running these with my own calculations I have or online calculators and many things don't match, such as Cap cost (this should be based on MSRP, and Interest Rate is 1.95??? So is really the money factor is 1.95 /2400 = 0.0008125? That seems really low and good?!

    If anyone can please direct me to any online site that can generate these same cap cost, monthly payments, or how to do it manually it would help:

    Here are the numbers:

    MSRP: 67745

    CAP COST 64928.00

    CAP RED 0.00

    M.S.R.P. 67745.00

    Residual VAlue $ 36292.10

    WARRANTY 0.00

    TERM 36

    TRADE ACV: 0.00

    PAY OFF: 0.00

    CASH DOWN: 0.00

    INT RATE: 1.95

    TAX RATE: 8.25

    BASE PYMT : 1016.46

    1ST PYMT: 1100.32

    SEC DEPOSIT: 0.00

    LIC. FEE: 598.00

    PRORATA: 55.00

    BANK FEE:795.00

    DRIVEOFF: 1757.86
  • chad39chad39 Posts: 4
    I am in the process of leasing an X5d and I believe the money factor is .00195 and the residual is 56%. The way to calculate the interest rate is to take the money factor and multiply it by 2,400. See with a money factor of .00195 you get an interest rate of 4.68%.
  • Thanks, I got it now. One last help is greatly appreciated. Is is possible to see how they got this cap cost of 64,928 and residual of 36,292.10? I tried punching in the numbers and I know the sport activity model residual % is 49%. But that doesn't add up the residual number here! I thought the residual should be based directly on the MSRP here (with all required optoins included) which is $67,745 . Once I get the numbers right, I've to work on what to negotiate and how much below from the MSRP. Any advise on that? Does any of these fees look sketchy?
  • Ok. I got an explanation for that too from the lease agent. He said usually the residual is set at 58% and he had to deduct $3000 because I asked for 20k miles instead of 15K. That's 58% of MSRP minus $3000 (at 20 cents a mile for 5000 miles addtional a year for 3 years)
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited January 2012
    That is an expensive way to buy 5000 extra miles per year. All BMW finance leases allow you to buy extra miles at 16 cents per mile up to three months before the end of the lease. This deal is costing you about $90 per month ($30 per month per extra $1k) extra and you are locked into that expense even if you don't drive the extra miles. Your first 15k miles don't cost you 20 cents per mile. Consider the option to lease at 15k miles and buy the extra miles at a discount if/when you need them.
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited January 2012
    Also, don't negotiate off or down from MSRP. Negotiate a price above dealer invoice. It's the best way to know if you're getting a fair deal. Get as close to invoice as possible, but $750 to $1,250 above invoice is common. don't let them charge you more than that because buying club prices are usually $1k to $1250 over invoice.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 134,115
    Not positive, but I think the more expensive models now have a higher price per extra mile....

    That's a recent change, and probably why the OP was quoted a higher per-mile rate...

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited January 2012
    Purchase of lease miles during the lease period is still discounted at 20% off the contract rate. From a finance perspective, the question is whether it is cost effective to lock in the extra miles and pay finance charges in an extra $90 per month payment if there's a chance that they might not use all those miles and they can pay for the actual excess miles in month 32. Keeping your money and making a payment in 3 years at a discount is cheaper than financing the payments for 3 years. The individual would have to weigh that tradeoff.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 134,115
    Agreed... no point in paying for miles that might not be used...

    But, miles that are added upfront only reduce the residual.... they aren't added to the CAP.... So, the amount subject to finance charges is actually reduced by adding more miles, not increased..

    regards,
    kyfdx

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • cybopalcybopal Posts: 4
    edited January 2012
    Hi,

    Pl. let me know if this is good to go through FOR 2012 x5 50 36 month, 20000 miles/year

    MSRP - $69195 (options: Tech package, running boards, bmw app). The model comes with the premium pkg (which is standard that includes navigation etc., )
    Cap cost - $64775. The dealer said it's just $500 above invoice and I was send to the manager through some recommendation.
    money factor - 0.00195 (or) 4.68 (current APR)
    Residual (39208) - Additional 5000 miles per year added here in residual at 20 cents per mile . which reduces the residual by $3000. After reading some recommendation here from my previous post, I'm thinking of making it 15K miles and then if it's only 16 cents/mile over for additional miles, then that might be a good choice.
    Down payment: $4000. Due at signing : $1757

    Comes around to : $877/month
  • habsonehabsone Posts: 46
    Always go with Zero down. Do not pay any upfront money when leasing. You will not get your money back if your vehicle get totaled. Yes you will reduce your monthly payment but it is not wise thing to do.Do this instead, There is a program run by BMW I forgot the name or term for it ( may be abmwfan or Host or members can help ) where you put your $ 4000 toward that program and you will earn interest on it, at the end of the lease you will get your $ 4000 back with interest. Good Luck.
    Regards,
  • It's called MSD (Multiple Security Deposits). One can out a maximum of 7 MSDs to reduce the lease rate. So assuming you payment was coming to $700 without the sales tax per month, if you put in $4900 in terms of MSD, you lease rate will go down by 7*.07 = .49 which is significant.
  • Hi duncansmom3. The money factor that you were quoted looks great. So let's take a look at the selling price.

    After the diesel credit is taken into account, it looks as though you are being given a $3,100 dealer discount on this truck. There's probably a spread of around $5,000 between this truck's dealer invoice price and its MSRP. So you're looking at right around $2,000 or so over invoice. That's not bad, but there's still some room there. If you're in an area that has a decent level of competition, I wouldn't be surprised if you were able to negotiate another grand give or take off of this price, assuming that there is a decent supply.

    Car_man
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  • Hi chad39. The money factor looks good. Is the selling price that you mentioned before or after the deduction of the $2,500 credit. If it's before the credit is taken into account, this is an excellent deal. If not, it's still not bad...probably $1,500 or so over invoice.

    Car_man
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  • chad39chad39 Posts: 4
    This was after the $2,500 credit so probably around $1,500 over invoice. I ended up doing the deal because I was not sure how much more I could push as the car had to be located in Utah and shipped to Portland as there were no models around this area with all the options I wanted.

    Thanks for the feedback.
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    Why go through all that trouble when you can order the exact X5 that you want with your choice of options? The order and delivery process can take as little as 3 weeks and you get a completely fresh vehicle.
  • Thanks so much Car Guy. Ill give a go.
  • I have wondered about ordering one as well (as opposed to settling for one with features I don't want). Big question is, do you approach the negotiation of price the same as you would for a unit that is sitting on someones lot? $1,000 or so over dealer cost? To me it seems almost easier for the dealer this way, they don't have to worry about moving the unit, but I wonder. Thoughts?
  • abmwfanabmwfan Posts: 47
    edited January 2012
    You're right that ordering can be better for a dealer in several ways. All BMWs are made to order and BMW's production process is completely built around custom ordering (roughly 80% by the end customer and about 20% by dealers.) It's pretty much the norm for them. A dealer doesn't mind placing an order because it's a guaranteed sale and they know you'll be anxious to pick up your new car as soon as it arrives. The car doesn't sit on the lot with all the expenses that entails. And they also want you to be happy. If a custom order will make you happy, then most dealers won't give you grief about it.

    The price negotiation for placing an order is exactly the same as buying off the lot. You sit down with your sales rep and select the model, trim level, color, options, etc. You negotiate your price as if you were taking the car that day and you lock in your finance terms. Your finance application is submitted and approved that day. Sometimes they want you to place a small refundable deposit. The sales rep will assign your vehicle to the dealership's next available production slot at the Spartanburg SC factory.

    As an added benefit of ordering, you have the option of taking advantage of incentives and financing programs on the day of delivery if they're better than the programs available when you placed the order. You can also make other changes on delivery day like switching to a 24 month lease instead 36.

    Now, some less-than-honest sales reps will tell you that you can get a better deal if you take something off the lot. If so, call their bluff or find another sales person. You should not be forced to accept a smaller discount on an order unless they're trying to sell you a heavily discounted left-over. I always place a custom order. Most recently, I ordered a 2012 X5 5.0 and took delivery in December. The negotiated price was $800 over dealer invoice less incentives.

    A new vehicle can be delivered in as little as 3 weeks. My experience has been an average of a little over 4 weeks from placing an X5 order to driving it off the lot. Delivery time depends on a number of factors such as factory schedule, availability of dealer slots, transition to a new model year, your location, etc. (My previous X5 was delayed by the March/April 2010 volcano in Iceland because transmissions from Europe were delayed.) If the next available open slot is too far in the future, usually the dealer will re-assign an earlier dealer order to you. They would rather have that vehicle go to a guaranteed sale than for it to sit on the lot waiting for the right person to buy it.

    The other thing that I think is cool is that the dealer (and you) can track your new vehicle at every step of the process from the exact second that production begins until it shows up at your dealer. That's true of vehicles produced here and in Europe.
  • Missed Dec window for X5; Jan - high money factor, and no BMW promotions.
    For 12,000, 15000 mile lease, what is MF, residual for X5?
    Any promotions? What about X5?
    ...promotoins, in general, such as year-end, or for existing BMW owners, or recent Lexus owners?
    Thanks.
    Last question -- for Feb, do any quality SUVs or crossovers have good promotions or good MF?
    We consider Mercedes -- attractive deals ,but no xenon lights available...
  • 2012 BMW X5

    Vehicle Price - $ 59,895.00
    Discount - $4,000
    Total Selling Price - $55,895

    Tax + Title + $ 55,895 = $ 59,781.45

    Special Offer Lease X5
    Cash Due - $ 7,400
    10,000 miles = 36 months

    Monthly payment - $ 679

    Is this a good price to take ?

    Thanks
  • 7,500 is a lot of cash upfront for a leased car. I learned many years ago not to put any down payment for a lease as you can lose it if you total the car.
  • This is the special lease offer they are running on BMW. I am planning to put an extra $1,000, since I will be getting off from BMW Club USA.
  • Still too much money to put down on a lease. If there is an accident and the car is totaled that money is gone and you will not get it back from insurance. Car guy can explain it better and there are some posts recently that detail the specifics of this situation.
  • ab10000ab10000 Posts: 127
    This is the worst deal I have seen, you broke the record.
    So if they put the 7K down, back into the lease your payment will be about $800.
    For what? Are you buying the 5.0 X5? They are play a nice game with you.
  • mbtexmbtex Posts: 9
    edited February 2012
    Dear bmwvica,
    as someone who recently leased a BMW, I can tell you that this is not a good deal at all; rather than putting money down in order to finance less, I would use the Multiple Security Deposit program from BMWFS: you can put up to 7 payments in an escrow account and they will reduce your money factor by 0.00007 times the number of security deposits (up to 0.00049); this lowers your interest and will make your payment lower. This money is yours at the end of the lease (you can either take it back minus the disposition fee, excess miles, etc. or use it to buy the car if you choose to do so). This program also protects you in case you total the car (others on this forum explained this already).
    If you live in a state that charges sales tax upfront on lease (like Texas), ask if they don't have sales tax credits: those don't always exist with BMW but you can ask.
    Good luck!
  • Is there any BMW officail website ? I am searching for one inside bmwusa.com, but can;t find.
  • Down Payment of $1000 comes to $878/per month.
  • You're very welcome duncansmom3.

    Car_man
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  • Hey asteinberg. According to the latest information that I have seen, BMW Financial Services' February buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36-month lease of a base 2012 X5 35i with 15,000 miles per year are .00195 and 57%, respectively for consumers who qualify for its top credit tiers.

    The residual value for a lease with only 12,000 miles per year would be 2% higher.

    BMW is not currently providing any cash incentives on the 2012 X5 that I am aware of, not loyalty nor conquest.

    The attractive deals that were available in December just aren't there right now. The fact that January sales ended up actually being fairly strong probably won't encourage manufacturers to pour on the enhancements either.

    Car_man
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