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The Big 3 and the domestic issues that will affect them
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Rockylee - what I'm laughing at are your statements.
1. The capitalist market is failing?
Really? REALLY? REALLY? Uhm right.
The Elites are not putting back
What does that mean, exactly? They're keeping all their money in banks and not investing it? What should they be doing to "put it back"?
allowed to monopoly's to run a muck. (sic)
To which monopolies are you referring? General Motors?
Ma Bell? Oh.... I know! BIG OIL!!!!!! They're the reason that GM can't make any money! They want people to buy cars that use less gas, not SUV's like GM makes! Of Course!
The essentials that consumers need to live are bankrupting average folks
That darned inflation! Why it's ruining America! That ruinous annualized Inflation Rate between 2000 and 2006 of 2.66% Horrible! If only we could have a GOOD Democratic president like Carter so we could have 9.67 % annualized inflation again!
bankrupting average folks
Uhm, no. Unemployment is at an all time low, Home ownership is at 69% of the population. Finally, as I've posted above, we have one of highest per capita incomes in the world.
those average folks are beginning to revolt.
Uhm. Yeah. Every vote for a Democrat is a vote for THE REVOLUTION!
Where's Norway?
I have no idea - perhaps you could do your own research?
Rocky - Come on! The people are in revolt? The middle class is bankrupt? Essentials are priced beyond the reach of the average consumer?
I am supposably (sic) in the top 20% in this country but that's hard for me to believe when I know so many people that make as much or more than I do
The economy is NOT a zero-sum game where someone making more money than you do takes that money out of your pocket. It just doesn't work that way. Oh, and maybe those people are buying their toys on credit and bankrupting -themselves-.
Not all Union workers make the kind of money you think
From the 2003 UAW's web site: a UAW-represented assembler earns $25.63 per hour of straight time. A typical UAW-represented skilled-trades worker earns $29.75 per hour of straight time. That's $53,000 average for the assemblers, and the SKILLED workers average $61,800.
That's the average Joe - 4 years ago. You really have to quit whining about the poverty of the poor UAW workers. It's annoying when they are making so much more that the average family.
The bottom line is people are taking more out of their pocket to make ends meet. Housing cost might be at 69% but how many young people are taking out 60 year loans or interest only notes for homes on the left coast ?
My suggestion is look beyond the numbers and you will see some hidden truths. Our economy isn't as great as the numbers leave you to believe. 4 million manufactoring jobs are gone and millions of service jobs have as well have left.
lokki, you might laugh at my statements but I'm doing the same at yours. I think you have rose colored glasses on when you view the world. I respectfully disagree with you but that's okay.
Rocky
Let's see what Hillary/Obama can do with the aforementioned Economy to help the middle class.
At the end of the day, there are NO Excuses for bad decisions in the Big 3 auto story. None. The other guys are hitting the marks "on all cylinders".
Regards,
OW
Rocky
Rocky
I, for one, have huge faith that the U.S. workers will adapt and lead in this new information/service age just like we once did in the Industrial Age.
Did you hear about the Construction Company owner who sold his company for multi-million dollars and made sure that the acquiring company hired ALL of the staff (part of the deal)? He also split most of the profit to those folks as well!
This is the type of corporation that will survive and prosper in the future America, not the "greed speed" in corporate culture today. You need to truly care about your staff not just provide lip service and walk the other way.
Health Care is next!
Regards,
OW
Rocky
http://www.philly.com/dailynews/opinion/20070424_Letters___Wholl_stop_the_job_dr- ain_.html
Rocky
The sailing ship replaced the camel caravan.
The steam ship replaced the sailing ship.
Petroleum oil replaced whale oil as lamp oil.
The railroad replaced the Erie canal
The steam hammer replaced John Henry
As for closed markets, the Japanese had a good thing going by keeping out the foreigners until 1853 - when Admiral Perry (yup, an American) forced them to join the (1853 version) future. THEY got with the program.
You can't go back and you can't stand still. You have to face the reality. If the economy is bad where you are, you have to leave. If the mountain won't come to Mohammad, Mohammad has to go look for a different job.
You can't wait for the fish to come to your hook; you have to go where the fish are.
You can't sit in your cold dark cave and wish the dinosaurs would come back and give you easy pickin's again. It ain't gonna happen.
You can sit and mutter about how dark and cold it is, or or you can learn to make fire.
How else can I say this?
The rest of the world is not going away. You can "look beyond the statistics" all you want.
She's gone within a year and half--took 9 months to get rid of her and her cheese. But she loved the book. Too bad her cheese kept getting her into trouble with rules and laws.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
US SHOPPERS ARM CHINA
War with the USA is “inevitable,” Red China’s Defense Minister, Chi Haotian told Hong Kong’s Cheng Ming newspaper. “We cannot avoid it,” he said. “Chinese armed forces must control the initiative in this war.”
According to right-wing Rand researchers, China’s military is narrowing its technology gap with the US armed forces, using US technology transfers to prepare for a future war with the US. “And the really sad and ironic part is that the American people are paying for their own demise with each and every purchase of merchandise “Made in China,” says Internet commentator Jim Welch.
The CIA estimates the China’s long-neglected military budget is now attempting to modernize at $60 billion a year—about a seventh of US weapons expenditures. With US hard currency, says David Chu of the China Support Network, the Red Chinese are buying Russian Sovremenny-class “stealth” destroyers equipped with nuclear-capable “Sunburn” supersonic cruise missiles primarily designed to sink US aircraft carriers.
American shoppers are also helping China purchase Russian “rocket” torpedoes. Called the Shkval (“Squall”) “this torpedo travels so fast that the US has no defense against it,” Chu claims.
The Chinese strategy—if it comes to a fight between the Eagle and the Dragon—is as simple as it is suicidal: Knock out the carriers, defeat the subs, and blind defenseless satellites. [AP Jan 26/05; Libération Feb 24/05]
And get nuked.
All union employees, not just the UAW, need to have a reality check regarding salaries and wages. They simply do not understand, or appreciate, how good they have it within the private sector of business.
Guess what field I chose to re-train in? Health care!
Since this is an automotive forum I won't go in to the multitude of problems in my new field but suffice it to say that there needs to be some changes that invoke more financial sharing or more financial breaks to allow more people to be able to afford medical coverage.
And how is that drug companies can charge astronomical prices for their Russian Roulette-with-numbers-inspired drug discoveries? Because nobody is stopping them.
Point is, if your car maker or car parts maker isn't paying you what you need or want, you might need to move to something else.
Ronald Reagan was asked that during the early 80's "tough times." They were pretty tough for some, indeed. But Ronald said "yes, they might need to move to get ample employment," or words to that effect.
Staying close to family is nice, but does it pay your high pick-em-up truck or American SUV payment? Spose it depends on the family.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Rocky
Rocky
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
I'm going to try to be optomistic and believe some automobile related jobs will come back.
Rocky
Rocky
I notice the local rag has two reporters (copiers) who sound almost gleeful that Toyota is #1 they shout; but they never mention sales in the US. Did someone post that Chevrolet still sells more vehicles here than Toyo does?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
When they realize that this is a global economy and competition now is about using their brains to compete rather than relying on the "way it was". Everything changes. The challenge is to make sure you are looking ahead, not in the rear-view mirror.
For GM, FORD, DCX, this change has FINALLY taken root. Let's consider if they started in the '70's what would exist today.
Regards,
OW
I posted that remark as someone had the numbers oh about 3-6 months ago.
I'm sure Rick Wagoner, will be glad the target is off his company now and he can slip under the radar while toyota, perhaps finally starts taking the bullets GM, once got.
Rocky
Agreed, but now is the opportunity to make products that blow away all competition. Let's see what the commitment will be.
Regards,
OW
Depends on how you want to count it. Toyota sells more cars than Chevrolet, while the Silverado puts Chevy up top for total vehicle sales by maybe 10% (but that lead is steadily shrinking).
I agree he needs to take Toyota's approach of making superior products and let Toyota, get the microscope treatment and then just maybe GM, can recapture it crown of being #1 accidentally. Everyone likes a good old fashion american comeback story.
Rocky
Rocky
Regards,
OW
Toyota's lead should only widen as 2007 rolls on. GM's foothold in Asia is for certain, though. The plot thickens.
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
SHANGHAI, China -- General Motors, Ford and DaimlerChrysler announced Wednesday they will provide training for their suppliers in China on how to keep their working conditions safe, healthy and legal.
The plan has the backing of the China Association of Automobile Manufacturers, a government-supported industry group, the three automakers said in an announcement.
General Motors Corp. has more than 20,000 employees in China and relies on suppliers employing thousands more. Ford Motor Co. and German-American automaker DaimlerChrysler AG similarly have many suppliers based in China.
Senior executives of the three automakers were in China's commercial capital for the weeklong 2007 Shanghai Auto Show, which ends Saturday.
The automakers will use training designed by the Automotive Industry Action Group aimed at educating suppliers about Chinese labor laws and improving compliance with safe working standards, the statement said.
"The single most important resource at any of our member companies is people," J. Scot Sharland, the action group's executive director, said in the statement.
"Given the tremendous growth of North American investment in the developing Chinese automotive supply chain, it is imperative that these companies are cognizant of local labor laws and fundamentally understand that Ford, GM and DaimlerChrysler expect 100 percent compliance."
The training is due to begin by the middle of 2007, it said.
The statement cited an unnamed official from the Chinese automotive industry group noting the need for companies to abide by domestic labor laws.
Multinational companies operating or sourcing in China are under intensifying scrutiny for labor conditions at their factories and those of their suppliers.
Meanwhile, China has been urging foreign-invested companies to let employees join the government-sanctioned labor federation.
What labor laws ???? :confuse:
Rocky
A must read....... :surprise:
Rocky
Here are the sales for the "Big 6" Sept 06-Feb 07, the percentage of the total sales that were fleet sales, the number of fleet sales, and total sales minus fleet sales.
Total Sales %Fleet Sales Fleet sales Total Less Fleet
General Motors 1,812,510 21.6% 391,502 1,421,008
Ford Motor 1,240,243 32.8% 406,800 833,443
Toyota Motor Sales 1,200,339 9.1% 109,231 1,091,108
Chrysler Group 1,048,670 34.3% 359,694 688,976
American Honda 675,890 2.1% 14,194 661,696
Nissan NA 499,087 14.9% 74,364 424,723
The shocking thing is that Ford and Chrysler both had 30% of their sales go to fleets, compared to 2% for Honda. Those fleet sales are not only non-profit sales, but when these cars are resold at fire sale prices a year later, they serious depress resale values. As a result of that, retail buyers aren't willing to buy them without massive profit killing rebates. As a result of that, these companies have to try to make these cars cheaper so that they can make a profit on them (or at least limit their losses), and so as these cars are re-engineered to be cheaper inside and out they become less pleasant and less reliable, therefore depressing sales further, and making sure they never win a comparison test in a car magazine.
That vicious cycle seems like something that could eventually drag one of the big three completely under. What would happen if one of these companies flat out died? I mean, they might limp along, bankrupt, for a while, but what if in 4 years Chrysler, for instance, didn't exist at all, and shut down almost all of its factories? I'm not sure Toyota and Honda could build new factories fast enough to meet the need. Is it vaguely possible that rather than the overcapacity to produce cars that has existed in the US for so long that a lack of capacity could crop up?
Probably not. I guess imports could make up the difference.
It's sad to think of one of the big three going away. But I'm not sad enough to buy one of their cars. My 2000 Ford Focus taught me a lesson I won't soon forget...
Another voice in the long result of 30 years of arrogance and inattention to real market forces!
Regards,
OW
Now Cooksey is the manager of the Bowling Green plant, where his 1,200 employees crank out about 20 Corvettes an hour, as well as about six Cadillac XLRs a day. Cooksey himself owns five Corvettes, plus a full-blown drag-racing Corvette that will, he says, "run 9-second quarter-miles all day." Cooksey says he owns an XLR, too. "I'm probably one of the few plant managers who buys his own products," he tells us.
Will Cooksey was a Nam Vet and bought a '69 and then joined GM long ago.
This passion was lost long ago on the other nameplates.
Regards,
OW
Lemko, this is your kind of a story pal.
Claires, got the link finally from the website.
http://www.foxnews.com/video2/launchPage.html?042407/042407_yahoo_market&Cavuto%- - - - - 27s%20Taking%20Stock&Yahoo_Cavuto&Are%20risky%20subprime%20mortgages%20hurting%2- - - - - 0auto%20sales%3F&FOX%20Business%20Now&-1&Cavuto%27s%20Taking%20Stock&Video%20Lau- - - - - nch%20Page&Business
Click on Video: Cavuto's Taking Stock - 62vetteefp, gagrice, this is a story that might anger you guys a lil' bit !
-Rocky
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070428/AUTO01/704280312/1148- /AUTO01
Oh awesome our GM Axel's are going to be made in Mexico.
American Axel, is located down by Kalamazoo, Mi. and was known as a good job like GM. I guess no more. :sick:
-Rocky
That's a very evenly written article. I'm sitting musing at the last point that Toyo now has 20 years in US and its workers are getting older. I wonder what kind of retirement plans they have. Are they going to be dependent on us (US) and have Medicare and social security? Or will their healthcare be better than the great plans we pay for through Medicare? I'll bet their plans are way below what the UAW/IUE workers even now currently retire with.
I'm also interested in how many of those workers will be dismissed early to avoid responsibility for them under the plans that cost the company anything... It's like a local national company that dismissed workers in the last year before they were entitled to full retirement benefits.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I love the guy's self-righteous comment at the very beginning about buying his daughter a Honda or Toyota and that's that. He wouldn't think of anything else. I used to meet people with his same attitude in my work.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I forgot to mention you might be offended also.
Rocky
The real problem is that nobody is looking at the actual economics problems. The government just keeps compounding the problems by not starting to work on them as long as they can puff the economy or hurt the economy, depending on which group in DC you're talking about, enough to have an impact on the next general primary or election. And the US voters let them get by with not handling the problems. Look at the illegals problem. Someone breaks into your house, then tells you that you have to pay for their healthcare, make any children part of your family, pay for education for them, give them social benefits just for being in your house, and you're not allowed to say that they shouldn't be in your home to begin with. Makes Imus & Sharpton look like saints, doesn't it?
The US automakers need healthcare/retirement relief which their competitors have. The only problem is they caused themselves their own problems in negotiations with the unions. How do you gain relief?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Just a idea........
Rocky
link title
Regards,
OW
I see the unions taking retirement and benefits corrections to bring them more in line with everyone else. The government has no intentions of fixing the drug cost in the US problem. The government has no intention of fixing gasoline prices either. But the unions need to make GM and the other US plants more cost effective--the retirement plans for employees have been extremely overgenerous. I'm not saying they don't deserve them, but it wouldn't hurt them to have $20 copays like most others. And $500 deductibles for the year. And paying a monthly cost toward their healthcare along with copayments on the UCR reduced costs. The drug plans also need fixing but the government needs to fix overpricing by the drug companies.
I have been skeptical of the retirements benefits since my State Farm agent was talking about his mother paying $0 for anything, drugs, vision, dental, medical. Nada. Zero. Nichts. She was a spouse of a deceased retiree. Those costs may have changed since then a few years back. I'd like to know.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
That my friend was a great story. I only know of one other company that did that and that was "Prince Corporation" now known as Johnson Controls Interiors my former employer which moved most of it's interior division to Mexico. :sick:
-Rocky
Remember last year pal:
http://www.detnews.com/2005/autosinsider/0510/21/A01-356532.htm
This is the deal.......
Rocky
Regards,
OW
JCI, is a money hungary greedy corporation owned by GE stake holders. GE, also owns a stake in Honeywell still. Neutron Jack's poisonous business philosophy has corrupted a lot of minds. When Jack, finally retired from GE, he received a retirement package that could be worth a Billion dollars. :mad: He might be worse than Roger Smith, as a human being. :sick:
-Rocky