Do you need to carry 4-5 people often? If yes, - BMW 3 series is too small, if no - S80 is too big.
As I said - choose your side first, and I do not mean any offence.
For me the first step in the decision making tree is what KIND of car I need - everything else comes after that.
It does not matter, for instance, whether I get a super deal on 335i, it is just too small for my family.
And did enjoy reading your long postings, I could only wish that it would not be just cut and paste from some marketing brochure, but reflect your own impressions.
Do you need to carry 4-5 people often? If yes, - BMW 3 series is too small, if no - S80 is too big.
80-90% of the time, lev_berkovich it's myself, my wife, my 2 yr. old son, and my 10 month old daughter. I also plan on buying my G'Ma's 2002 Old's Aurora, which will fit 4 adults comfy and 5 in a squeeze.
As said - choose your side first, and I do not mean any offence
I guess The Volvo dealership obstacle makes the decision easier to choose my side. OTOH, that doesn't make me dislike Volvo brand or the S80.
For me the first step in the decision making tree is what KIND of car I need - everything else comes after that.
Well I'm in the situation where I can be a tad more flexible, since I will have the Aurora this September. If I want a BMW or a S80, when the time comes I can do so. However the Bimmer would be more of a toy and yes it will more than likely be a sedan. OTOH a I could make a coupe work for me also if I chose to do so.
It does not matter, for instance, what kind of super deal I can get on 335i, it is just too small for my family.
Well if you can afford it, do like I'm doing and get ya a inexpensive family car, and then you can choose whatever car you's like.
How big is your family ? What about a 335i sedan ? If you have 5 people in your family then perhaps yes a S80 is the best way for you to go.
I also might not even get me a 335i if I can't get a decent deal on it. My dream car as a kid was a 1990' 25th Ann. Ford Mustang 7-up convertible with a 5-speed manuel. I would hop it up and probably keep it forever for my son or daughter as a heirloom.
And did enjoy reading your long postings, I could only wish that it would not be just cut and paste from some marketing brochure, but reflect your own impressions.
Sorry, about that. I was trying to point out that the 2006 S80, couldn't hold the 2006 STS's jockey strap in features and/or technology. I guess I could of just pointed out the highlights, but that would of took me a long time to accomplish. :P
when he said choose a side, I'm pretty sure he meant choose a class of vehicle, not a manufacturer.
If you are looking at the 335, then why not the S60R as a competitor? It can be had for ALOT less than the 335 will AND adds AWD and adjustable suspension.
As far as the cut and paste garbage, I don't believe you picked the items exclusive to the STS. I didn't read through it all because I don't feel like taking the time, but I noticed a paragraph on AWD ... the S80 has that, too. And then a paragraph on side curtains ... uh, need I point that out on the S80?
I mean, come on, you quoted this? It features four-wheel disc brakes integrated with four-wheel anti-lock braking and traction control.
Good grief, I've had that on my $20k cars, as well as $40k cars.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I like Volvo's and always will. The dealership obstacle for service is to much to overcome. I don't think the S80, is worth 3 hrs. of my time to drive to Lubbock from Dumas after thinking about it. I'd have to use a good portion of my lease miles for service. I don't think their are many others that would do this to own a specific car.
The Edmunds article is consistent with just about all other previews/first drives on the new S80, very positive, lukewarm on the engine, super on the safety and the creature comforts. I look forward to a paper/road comparison of the S80 (especially the V8) with any or all of its competitors: Infiniti M35X, Lexus GS350 AWD, Audi A6, BMW 530xi, MB E350/E550 4matic. I hope anyone who sees such a review will tell us about it here!
Nice enough article, what I find amusing is the price description vs the Euro competitors. The S80 V8 will be $10,000 or more less than its European competitors. This months Car and Driver has a test between the 550i, E500 and M45. The 550i was $70,000 as tested!! The Mercedes was about $60k I believe.
I believe what they were trying to say (but not doing it clearly) is that its competitors compete performance-wise with their smaller engines. So a V8 S80 is comparable to a 6-cylinder competitor, and therefore those are the prices you compare.
Of course, where I think this comparison fails is when you factor in AWD. There is no such thing as a BMW 550xi and the 530xi is quite a bit slower than the S80 will be. Even the M35x loses about a half second to the S80 estimates (and, like bmw, there is no AWD V8 combo in the Infiniti).
Plan to see unfair comparisons in most of the media since, when you take price and drivetrain into consideration, there are little-to-no direct competitors.
The Acura RL is about all there is, I think.
EDIT: I just reread the article ... so they do say its the Asian V6s and Euro V8s that are just as good or better ... for the same price. That's obviously incorrect. As you've pointed out, Vmax, the Euros are more expensive, and as I've just pointed out, the 6-cylinder AWD combos are not up to the performance (except the RL).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
The other thing to consider is the fact that we are going off Volvo's performance estimates, which are likely to be quite conservative. The XC90 V8, which is 1000 lbs heavier reaches 60mph in 6.8 sec. If launched properly, the S80 V8 should reach 60mph in under 6 sec.
Ya know, interesting side note about this, though. I sometimes feel like the press either can't or won't launch a volvo to its fullest potential. If you look for the tested numbers for the S70 and S60, for example, you'll find they are on the slow side. Real-world track numbers from owners (and I've seen the timeslips) have been quite a bit quicker. This is the complete opposite with what you see with just about every other car tested by the mags. Most folks can never get their cars to go that quick, mostly for fear of breaking them.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I'd guess mid to high 50's looking at the prices of loaded options from Lexus, BMW and Infiniti. Reports are that the technology goodies will be bundled into a package, and I can't believe that will be less than $5K if they include satnav. We'll see soon enough (next month, says my dealer).
all prices shown are base prices and I even went outside the standard competitors for a bigger sampling.
Volvo S80 AWD V8 = $50k Acura RL (no V8) = $49,300 Audi A6 4.2 quattro = $55,300 BMW 550i (no AWD) = $58,500 Infiniti M45 (no AWD) = $49,100 Jag S-type 4.2 (no AWD) = $55,335 Lexus GS430 (no AWD) = $52,375 MB E550 4matic = $61,500
Did I get them all? The only one that comes close, IMHO, is the RL, and, really, I feel like that's less of a car. Don't get me wrong, I'm an Acura fan, but the RL is pretty small for its class (which is the only reason it can get away with a V6 in a field of V8s). The Audi would have to be 2nd runner up since it offers everything the Volvo does at $5k more. Then, if you have no desire for AWD, there is always the Infiniti at about the same starting price as the Volvo.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
You are probably very much right. I might be better off waiting for the MKS, since it will be close to the Volvo experience and be a bit cheaper and I could get it serviced in Amarillo. We will see.
Question. How much of a discount could I expect you think ? If Volvo was a GM, car I'd buy one for sure because of my GM discount.
Well, for starters the MKS won't use any of the Volvo engines or technology. Second, if the MKS is anything like the 500, it won't use the Volvo high strength steel in its construction. You will end up with a faint copy of the real thing. Like buying a knockoff Louis Vuitton handbag.
the MKS won't use any of the Volvo engines or technology
well, i guess that's technically true. It won't use a volvo engine. It will use the same Yamaha V8 as the S80, however. At least, that's what all the reports I've read have said.
And, since both have AWD and a 6-speed tranny, I'd be surprised they wouldn't defray costs by using the same parts in both cars ... but I guess its not beyond Ford to waste money and build separate components.
The other thing I will have to look at is residuals on the new S80. Without much of a discount I wouldn't beable to get out of the $50K range with a fully optioned V-8
Maybe the MKS, will be "almost" as good and a bunch cheaper ? I'm not going to jump to conclusions until I get some sound data.
Guys I love the car, but I was hoping it wouldn't be so expensive. Probably a fully loaded one will be $52-55K Volvomax. Probably no deals either :sick:
Yeah, I did go overboard, but that's the way I like my cars. I'm a gadgetologist, and want the best. If I'm spending $55K for a Volvo, I would think all those features were going to be standard. The car is a rip-off without em.
I was under the impression this whole time, a fully loaded version would be $55K at the top end with all the bells and whistles.
I read about all the features and yes I wanted em' I was very very surprised they weren't standards and the option boxes were so long.
Rocky
P.S. If you can afford it I'm sure it will be a nice vehicle. The $2800 rims were chrome, and it sets the car off. Agree it was a rip-off, but $2K won't make any difference since $55K was my limit. I'd rather buy a Acura RL and have thousands left over to blow on a chip or Supercharger/Turbo, or gas and a nice Vacation
The RL is smaller and has a V6, so it SHOULD be cheaper.
Well the S80, only has a unproven Yamaha V-8. Has Yamaha ever made a car engine before ? On a side note the V-6 in the RL, only lacks 21 hp. So is the $15,000 savings worth the 21 hp. deficit ? I'd say yeah. Or better yet one could wait another yr. or so and get a V-10 from Honda. Not a bad idea either.
If it fits your needs and wants, then, by all means, save the money.
It does fit most of my wants and needs, but so does a few other alternatives.
Like I said love the S80, but boy I was sticker shocked.I assumed the car would come fully loaded with ever option for around $54 or 55K. Boy I was dead wrong on my assumption.
From what I read, you can get both the parking assist and the camera. Three reasons, I think, for getting both. First, if you're short and have trouble gauging the front end, the rear camera doesn't cover that. Second, I've heard that some people really never get into backing up by looking at the screen, and having the beeping to confirm that you're OK is not a bad idea. Third, sometimes if a camera or a radar sensor gets obscured, it would be nice to have the other.
Once you get used to "park assist," you feel a little lost without it, but honestly, we really should all be able to park this car without this kind of help, shouldn't we?
Really...... :surprise: ..... I always wondering who made that dead horse. I guess I'm glad now that I can't afford a S80. Of course they do make a nice Jetski, and stereo/music equipment. Maybe they are better now, than they use to be ?
Well the S80, only has a unproven Yamaha V-8. Has Yamaha ever made a car engine before ?
uhhh... yeah, its in the XC90. But I suppose that's technically not a "car."
So is the $15,000 savings worth the 21 hp.
In my configuration, its only $5k difference. And, as I've stated, its not JUST about the engine. Some folks obviously like to have a bigger car, too.
I always wondering who made that dead horse
huh? just because something isn't made any more does not mean it was bad. The SHO is actually a somewhat revered car (not by me, personally, but that's beside the point).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
People, this is inline with what the market offers. Price out a 5 series or an E class w/ the same options and see where you end up. NOBODY offers a V8 sedan with all these goodies for under $50k. With the std AWD I think the V8 will do very well in the cold markets. This is not a car for everyone, most S80's will probably be the 3.2 model.
Like I said love the S80, but boy I was sticker shocked.I assumed the car would come fully loaded with ever option for around $54 or 55K. Boy I was dead wrong on my assumption.
You CAN get a nice S80 for that price. Heck, if you just want the engine and driveline you can get one under $50k. Just don't expect the GM desperation discount.
oh, come now. I'm not one to defend GM, but volvo is also guilty of big-time firesales. glass houses ... ya know?
I HOPE they won't have to discount them that much ... but we'll see ... as I've said before, I didn't think they'd have to discount the R cars, and that proved wrong. Same with the new S40.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Comments
If yes, - BMW 3 series is too small, if no - S80 is too big.
As I said - choose your side first, and I do not mean any offence.
For me the first step in the decision making tree is what KIND of car I need - everything else comes after that.
It does not matter, for instance, whether I get a super deal on 335i, it is just too small for my family.
And did enjoy reading your long postings, I could only wish that it would not be just cut and paste from some marketing brochure, but reflect your own impressions.
If yes, - BMW 3 series is too small, if no - S80 is too big.
80-90% of the time, lev_berkovich it's myself, my wife, my 2 yr. old son, and my 10 month old daughter. I also plan on buying my G'Ma's 2002 Old's Aurora, which will fit 4 adults comfy and 5 in a squeeze.
As said - choose your side first, and I do not mean any offence
I guess The Volvo dealership obstacle makes the decision easier to choose my side. OTOH, that doesn't make me dislike Volvo brand or the S80.
For me the first step in the decision making tree is what KIND of car I need - everything else comes after that.
Well I'm in the situation where I can be a tad more flexible, since I will have the Aurora this September. If I want a BMW or a S80, when the time comes I can do so. However the Bimmer would be more of a toy and yes it will more than likely be a sedan. OTOH a I could make a coupe work for me also if I chose to do so.
It does not matter, for instance, what kind of super deal I can get on 335i, it is just too small for my family.
Well if you can afford it, do like I'm doing and get ya a inexpensive family car, and then you can choose whatever car you's like.
How big is your family ? What about a 335i sedan ? If you have 5 people in your family then perhaps yes a S80 is the best way for you to go.
I also might not even get me a 335i if I can't get a decent deal on it. My dream car as a kid was a 1990' 25th Ann. Ford Mustang 7-up convertible with a 5-speed manuel. I would hop it up and probably keep it forever for my son or daughter as a heirloom.
And did enjoy reading your long postings, I could only wish that it would not be just cut and paste from some marketing brochure, but reflect your own impressions.
Sorry, about that. I was trying to point out that the 2006 S80, couldn't hold the 2006 STS's jockey strap in features and/or technology.
Take care pal, and see ya on the boards.
Rocky
If you are looking at the 335, then why not the S60R as a competitor? It can be had for ALOT less than the 335 will AND adds AWD and adjustable suspension.
As far as the cut and paste garbage, I don't believe you picked the items exclusive to the STS. I didn't read through it all because I don't feel like taking the time, but I noticed a paragraph on AWD ... the S80 has that, too. And then a paragraph on side curtains ... uh, need I point that out on the S80?
I mean, come on, you quoted this?
It features four-wheel disc brakes integrated with four-wheel anti-lock braking and traction control.
Good grief, I've had that on my $20k cars, as well as $40k cars.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Do not be too hard on Rocky. I think he is genuinely believes in what he writes or quotes, unlike, unfortunately, many others on Edmunds forums.
i think rocky knows he and i are "cool." Sometimes we've been on opposite sites of the fence and sometimes on the same. Its all good.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Rocky
Rocky
WOW !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :shades:
Volvo. for life
Rocky
Rocky
Rocky
The S80 V8 will be $10,000 or more less than its European competitors. This months Car and Driver has a test between the 550i, E500 and M45.
The 550i was $70,000 as tested!!
The Mercedes was about $60k I believe.
Of course, where I think this comparison fails is when you factor in AWD. There is no such thing as a BMW 550xi and the 530xi is quite a bit slower than the S80 will be. Even the M35x loses about a half second to the S80 estimates (and, like bmw, there is no AWD V8 combo in the Infiniti).
Plan to see unfair comparisons in most of the media since, when you take price and drivetrain into consideration, there are little-to-no direct competitors.
The Acura RL is about all there is, I think.
EDIT: I just reread the article ... so they do say its the Asian V6s and Euro V8s that are just as good or better ... for the same price. That's obviously incorrect. As you've pointed out, Vmax, the Euros are more expensive, and as I've just pointed out, the 6-cylinder AWD combos are not up to the performance (except the RL).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
The XC90 V8, which is 1000 lbs heavier reaches 60mph in 6.8 sec.
If launched properly, the S80 V8 should reach 60mph in under 6 sec.
Rocky
Rocky
Rocky
should we start a pool?
Ya know, interesting side note about this, though. I sometimes feel like the press either can't or won't launch a volvo to its fullest potential. If you look for the tested numbers for the S70 and S60, for example, you'll find they are on the slow side. Real-world track numbers from owners (and I've seen the timeslips) have been quite a bit quicker. This is the complete opposite with what you see with just about every other car tested by the mags. Most folks can never get their cars to go that quick, mostly for fear of breaking them.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Volvo S80 AWD V8 = $50k
Acura RL (no V8) = $49,300
Audi A6 4.2 quattro = $55,300
BMW 550i (no AWD) = $58,500
Infiniti M45 (no AWD) = $49,100
Jag S-type 4.2 (no AWD) = $55,335
Lexus GS430 (no AWD) = $52,375
MB E550 4matic = $61,500
Did I get them all? The only one that comes close, IMHO, is the RL, and, really, I feel like that's less of a car. Don't get me wrong, I'm an Acura fan, but the RL is pretty small for its class (which is the only reason it can get away with a V6 in a field of V8s). The Audi would have to be 2nd runner up since it offers everything the Volvo does at $5k more. Then, if you have no desire for AWD, there is always the Infiniti at about the same starting price as the Volvo.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Rocky
Rocky
Rocky
My "guess" is mid 50's for a loaded V8.
Question. How much of a discount could I expect you think ?
If Volvo was a GM, car I'd buy one for sure because of my GM discount.
Rocky
Prob won't be much discount on the initial S80's.
Maybe if you wait till the end of model year 07.
Rocky
Second, if the MKS is anything like the 500, it won't use the Volvo high strength steel in its construction.
You will end up with a faint copy of the real thing.
Like buying a knockoff Louis Vuitton handbag.
All New Volvo S80 V8 priced from $47,350*
* pricing does not include destination charges of $695.
well, i guess that's technically true. It won't use a volvo engine. It will use the same Yamaha V8 as the S80, however. At least, that's what all the reports I've read have said.
And, since both have AWD and a 6-speed tranny, I'd be surprised they wouldn't defray costs by using the same parts in both cars ... but I guess its not beyond Ford to waste money and build separate components.
UNLESS, this report I just found is true and they won't even have a V8 MKS:
http://www.leftlanenews.com/2006/08/21/ford-cancels-new-v8-for-lincoln-mks/
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Sad days for Lincoln.
Rocky
Maybe the MKS, will be "almost" as good and a bunch cheaper ? I'm not going to jump to conclusions until I get some sound data.
Rocky
Guys I love the car, but I was hoping it wouldn't be so expensive. Probably a fully loaded one will be $52-55K Volvomax. Probably no deals either
Rocky
My MSRP comes in at $64,685
Well I guess I can scratch that one off my list !
I might as well buy a Cadillac Esclade ESV Hybrid if I'm going to spend that kind of dough.
I guess it's not meant to be, for me anyways. For y'all that can afford one I'm very jealous.
Rocky
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
And did you add both the parking assist and parking cameras? Both are not necessary and I'd be surprised if you could even get them together.
You really gotta take it easy on those checkboxes. Read the suff. You may find there are some things you just don't need to opt for.
By the way, mine came to $55k. And I even went overboard, in my opinion, with the audio package, sport package, and navigation.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
I was under the impression this whole time, a fully loaded version would be $55K at the top end with all the bells and whistles.
I read about all the features and yes I wanted em' I was very very surprised they weren't standards and the option boxes were so long.
Rocky
P.S. If you can afford it I'm sure it will be a nice vehicle. The $2800 rims were chrome, and it sets the car off. Agree it was a rip-off, but $2K won't make any difference since $55K was my limit. I'd rather buy a Acura RL and have thousands left over to blow on a chip or Supercharger/Turbo, or gas and a nice Vacation
The RL is smaller and has a V6, so it SHOULD be cheaper. If it fits your needs and wants, then, by all means, save the money.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Well the S80, only has a unproven Yamaha V-8. Has Yamaha ever made a car engine before ? On a side note the V-6 in the RL, only lacks 21 hp. So is the $15,000 savings worth the 21 hp. deficit ? I'd say yeah. Or better yet one could wait another yr. or so and get a V-10 from Honda. Not a bad idea either.
If it fits your needs and wants, then, by all means, save the money.
It does fit most of my wants and needs, but so does a few other alternatives.
Like I said love the S80, but boy I was sticker shocked.I assumed the car would come fully loaded with ever option for around $54 or 55K. Boy I was dead wrong on my assumption.
Rocky
Well the S80, only has a unproven Yamaha V-8. Has Yamaha ever made a car engine before ?
Ford Taurus SHO
Once you get used to "park assist," you feel a little lost without it, but honestly, we really should all be able to park this car without this kind of help, shouldn't we?
Rocky
uhhh... yeah, its in the XC90. But I suppose that's technically not a "car."
So is the $15,000 savings worth the 21 hp.
In my configuration, its only $5k difference. And, as I've stated, its not JUST about the engine. Some folks obviously like to have a bigger car, too.
I always wondering who made that dead horse
huh? just because something isn't made any more does not mean it was bad. The SHO is actually a somewhat revered car (not by me, personally, but that's beside the point).
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
You can get them together. It still beeps, even with the reverse camera on. Very helpful.
hell, some folks need all the help they can get.
personally, i wouldn't opt for either.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
People, this is inline with what the market offers.
Price out a 5 series or an E class w/ the same options and see where you end up.
NOBODY offers a V8 sedan with all these goodies for under $50k. With the std AWD I think the V8 will do very well in the cold markets.
This is not a car for everyone, most S80's will probably be the 3.2 model.
You CAN get a nice S80 for that price.
Heck, if you just want the engine and driveline you can get one under $50k.
Just don't expect the GM desperation discount.
oh, come now. I'm not one to defend GM, but volvo is also guilty of big-time firesales. glass houses ... ya know?
I HOPE they won't have to discount them that much ... but we'll see ... as I've said before, I didn't think they'd have to discount the R cars, and that proved wrong. Same with the new S40.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S