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Comments
That's as bad as having a car with a weak heater in northern Maine.
A) You get what you pay for.
A) Seriously, some people are under budget restrictions with the kind of car they drive, and a Kia or Hyundai makes perfect sense. If you can afford a luxury car or can work it into your budget, then you might as well enjoy what your hard work has allowed you to buy....or else you can just leave it all to a nephew or fez.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I don't think so. I would look at comparatively priced cars and then decide what I am really looking for. I am not going to only shop performance cars like a VW GTI, compared to a Taurus SHO, compared to a Maxima, compared to a Corvette, compared to a BMW, compared to a Miata. Just because I like a BMW doesn't mean I drive it because of speed. I just appreciate the engineering, the steering, the handling, the attention to details, the styling etc. Who do they make an ES 350 for, little old fuddy duddies who just want a reliable comfortable way to get from A to B. Even if that was true, how would I know until I tried one out? In fact, I would probably want to compare a CTS and a Lincoln as well. I am really looking for a balance between handling and comfort as well as styling.....not just speed and performance.
It was politely pointed out that the BMW and E350 were two differnt type of cars. I logically thought they are both premium cars, so they must be similar in many respects, and trying an E350 would be a logical car to compare. Besides, if I did try it that would only confirm it isn't the right car for me, and I would be certain the BMW is the right car for me.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I used to think the same thing. My 79 Continental and 89 Town Car you could hang meat in the car in 100 degree heat. However, as I mentioned above my Yotas were fantastic and I have no complaints with my Genesis. The one car I owned that I always felt had substandard A/C was my 98 Olds 88.
In the 60s and 70s the compressors looked exactly the same in both GM and Fords and were large. Today, the compressors look so much smaller.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
At one time or other I have owned several different brand of cars. GM, Ford, Dodge, BMW, MB, Honda, Toyota, Lexus, Nissan. Sedans, coupes, convertibles, pick ups, SUV's and I liked all of them, but none were perfect.
I was especially fond of a 1979 4 door accord and a 1978 MB 240D, but by far the best car I have owned is my current 2006 LS 430. It is perfect for me.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
I like the way you think!
Once again, "E350" is a Mercedes Benz designation. Weren't you talking about the ES 350? I'm sure that if I remind of this a couple of more times, you'll get it.
In any case, the only Lexus models that can be logically (your word) compared to the BMW 3-series are the IS 250/IS 350. After all, they were specifically designed to compete with the BMW 3. That's their corporate mission - their reason for existing. If you spent 10 minutes on the Lexus website, you'd grasp this.
And, if you picked up one of the car mags, you'd see that the Japanese car most frequently compared to the BMW 3 is the Infiniti G37. It's the Japanese car that Car & Driver selects when it runs any comparison test that includes the BMW 3.
For the life of me, I can't figure out why anyone would compare a FWD luxo-cruiser to an RWD sport sedan. Maybe someone, somewhere is doing just that, but I haven't met that person & probably never will.
You might have better luck checking out the Veracruz :P
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
I called it an ES 350 once and an E 350 2X. Sorry, if they are going to use silly letter and number mixtures that people can't remember then they have the problem. Besides, this isn't my full time job, I don't do too much research to find out that Mercedes has a E 350. When I saw the car I was going by memory when I wrote about it 4 hours later.
If you spent 10 minutes on the Lexus website, you'd grasp this
I thought if it walks like a duck it is probably trying to be a duck. They copied the design of the 3 Series so I assumed they would try to copy the engineering.
G37. It's the Japanese car that Car & Driver selects when it runs any comparison test that includes the BMW 3.
I don't have time to read C&R these days. I read 2 newspapers, work and read books. It isn't a priority.
I saw the ES 350 and thought I would take a look in the window to see what all the fuss is about a Lexus. It looked pretty bland inside. I like the trim exterior, but I don't think the design will hold up like a BMW or Audi. Not every one is as knowledgeable as you are, so I think there are people who would think the two are sports sedans, and it would make sense to compare them. If my priority was to buy strictly a performance car then yes, the ES 350 would not be a good choice (but I haven't even done any research yet), but my preference is a car that handles well but is also comfortable - about 60%/40% ratio, but, if I wanted an all out performance car then I might compare the bimmer to an IS 250/IS 350 - I'll keep that in mind. Though I doubt it will get that far unless they make those models in a hardtop convertible!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Not quite true, one person sure does! But, I agree with you, you look for what your priorities are. Performance though high on my list is not the only priority, I like handling, overall feel of the car, driving experience, fit and finish and superior engineering along with comfort...in no particular order. "Ultimate" high performance won't even be on the list. So, it is a free country and I'll compare a 3 Series to whatever I want to - I might even want to evaluate it against an SUV and decide what suits me more. I might decide the extra room and all wheel capability would suit me better than having a convertible. I don't know, and since my current car is a 2008 with about 25k miles, it will be awhile before I am in the market again, unless I win a lottery. I just checked out the ES 350 because I was curious and thought it was a 3 Series rip off car....and I really don't know anything about it mechanically.
I do like those MB 240Ds though and I would put that on my list if I saw a nice one - though it probably isn't a "high performance" car either.;
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
They do!!
More Info
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I love the LS. A new one is completely out of my price range, however, I have tinkered witih maybe getting a used one when my Genesis comes off lease. I guess an 08 by then. How has it been on maintenance, etc?
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tjc....my cousin bought his used (I think after it came back to the Lexus dealership after a 3 year lease). His is certified. Had it roughly for a year. No service work on it, nor warranty work, for that matter.
I've never driven it, just rode in it. You certainly couldn't tell it was used. You want a quiet, powerful, comfortable cruiser, I don't think you could do much better than a used LS, personally.
Don't know what he paid for his, but those sell for...what?....$65K new? To me, anything in that mid-high $30K range would be a good buy on a certified used one.
I have a tad over 50,000 miles on it now with no issues. Just change the oil about every 4,000 miles and I just bought a set of new tires. The car is fantastic with a big V8 that is a real gas sipper. On a recent trip to St. Louis we averaged 28+ mpg on the interstate. Usually around 22 mpg in mixed driving. I have never reset the computer for the function that shows total mpg and this is what it shows. 2006 was the last model year for this style and I like it better than the newer model.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
I would be interested in looking at this model but probably wouldn't actually buy it, because of some facts in the article you passed on.
*Driving the IS C is a bit isolated. The steering is numb,
*To be frank, the IS250C is a dog compared to the 350. It suffers a huge loss of acceleration (0-60 in 8.4 seconds, versus the 350’s 5.8 seconds), and seemed to struggle up the hills around Laguna Beach.
*With the IS C, Lexus takes aim at the BMW 3-Series, Volvo C70, and Infiniti G37 convertibles. While the IS C may be priced competitively for a luxury hard-top convertible, we would be hard-pressed to say that this car could ever outperform its rivals.
*Although we expect this car to appeal especially to Lexus loyalists, and to buyers looking for an entry into the luxury droptop segment, it doesn’t offer the type of driving experience true enthusiasts seek
I think I just talked myself out of this car, but I appreciate the information.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
Kinda what I thought. Thanks for the info.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
Your Ford pic didn't show up, but my 79 Continental had the same one as your GM pic.
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I think I just talked myself out of this car, but I appreciate the information.
I am sure that the Lexus IS would be plenty of fun to toss around. Does it have the direct, precise steering of a BMW? Probably not, but what does?
I saw an IS vert the other day, I really like it. I wouldn't own one, simply not my type of car, but very nice.
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Richard
Richard
That little emblem on the grill is pretty expensive.
Richard
As for changing the oil in a car, I don't intend to ever leave oil in a car for 10,000 miles---engineered to do so or not. Then again, that's just me.
Richard
No worries. It's a city in Mexico, so it's pretty easy for me to remember.
Richard
Yes he does and he makes comparisons his way too.
Like what he said in post 56678:
So, it is a free country and I'll compare a 3 Series to whatever I want to - I might even want to evaluate it against an SUV and decide what suits me more.
That's almost like saying all tires are round and black so they must be equal. :confuse:
The next thing you know he'll try to compare his 3 to my Genny. :mad:
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
You are joking...right? Taste is an individual thing, but I prefer the understated look of the BMW. I will say thet I prefer the Jeep to the XLT, but the BMW has less flash and a more classic look, that will always look good, and won't change with whatever style happens to be at the time...which seems to be techno today.
The Mercedes GLK is even more classic, looks like it is out of the 60s, but I prefer that to the ghetto blaster techno look of most of the cars on the road today. That Mercedes a few posts back is a 1982, and it looks better than most of the cars on the road today....even has color coded wheel discs!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Well, at least I am willing to try something outside my comfort zone, unlike some prospective buyers. :P :P
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
That little emblem on the grill is pretty expensive.
There's a lot more to it than the emblem on the grill. If that was the case I'd be driving a Sonata.
If getting from point A to point B at the
cheapestlowest possible cost is your mission in life, I would agree with that statement.2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Richard
That's wonderful and I am glad there are people like that. I guess I am just spoiled and it is all about "me". I do pay a lot of taxes, I do employ about 15 people, I do give generously to charity, I did send money for Haiti....but I would like something for myself. We have a nice home, and nice cars and a good little dog, but we don't have a cottage, or a boat, or drink to excess, or gamble, or care to support grown children, or leave a big wad of money to fezno (sorry fez) but I do feel like I deserve a nice car to drive. One bad habit, I have seen Jersey Boys 5 times but 3 times were when tickets were on special for $25.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
That's almost like saying all tires are round and black so they must be equal.
Interesting you should mention that. When I traded in my X3 the first car I looked at was a Land Rover LR2 - I think I got it right.
I like the square boxy look, it is very comfortable, great design for vision etc, and it would be a change. Then, we thought, we won't be hauling around books or display units any more, and we are going to slow down our working schedule and enjoy life more. So, we thought I should try out a convertible. We did try a few but the BMW had all the features at a reasonable price....and the handling and characteristics were unbelievable. Hard to explain but it feels like a car fom the 70s because of the long hood and the heaviness, but it handles like a sports car.
So, the point is, I did try out a few cars, Audi (comes in only a softop), Mercedes 2 seater, but need a back seat for the dog, and the Rover...an SUV!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Fair enough, keep telling yourself that......but there are a lot of people who would disagree with you...mainly any one who owns a BMW or an MB. It is European craftsmanship, like comparing a Rolex to a Timex, they both keep time, they both look good, but one is special and will look good 30 or even 50 years from now,....and I think you know which one I mean.
I know it is difficult for many people to justify the extra cost of a luxury car, and they can say all kinds of things to make it seem that it is silly to spend more on a car than what is necessary. Maybe it is even guilt feelings like I am not worthy of owning a car that costs that much. I was that way myself except I truly couldn't afford a better car than my 1992 Cavalier when I bought it...but I said to myself why would I need anything more? But, let's not kid ourselves, if you truly appreciate fine wine and you can afford it spend $50 a bottle, I am happy with an $8 bottle, but I don't want to settle for a car that I won't enjoy as much, just because I can save some money....which is probably false economy any way because the MB will be worth a lot more when you go to trade it in.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
I don't think anyone is saying that you shouldn't have what you want. It is just that for some the added cost of owning a BMW isn't worth it. IMO they are terrible, stiff riding cars and I wouldn't own one at any price. Its all what you like. I am sure there are just as many people who wouldn't dare drive a Lexus ES or LS saying they are too floaty.
any one who owns a BMW or an MB. It is European craftsmanship, like comparing a Rolex to a Timex,
I have to disagree on that too. The European makes aren't the only ones who produce nice interiors....
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As for looking good 30 or 50 years from now, no one is going to change the design of the car in your garage. If you think that it looks good now, it will look good later. That would be true of XLT's, BMW's, MB's, etc. The idea of looking good is in the mind of the beholder. Example: If I had one billion dollars and loved cars, I wouldn't buy a BMW because I personally think that they look ugly---with the exception of the larger convertible or perhaps the models from the 1960's and 1970's. No amount of road feel or engineering is going to convince me to drive what I perceive to be an ugly car. Then again, that's just me.
If you want to keep telling yourself that the BMW is the most wonderful automobile ever manufactured on the planet, that's fine. Believe it or not, plenty of people feel that way about other makes and models---domestic and foreign. I felt that way about my Lincoln TC. Still, if it makes a person feel good, then why not?
Richard
More like they enjoy the prospect of catching a husband. :shades:
Richard
Or maybe they just have excellent taste and like a car that can handle well...maybe they have good taste in men too....like my wife!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Understated elegance. Not much chrome, classic round dials. Simple design without a big ugly control panel protruding from the middle.
As for looking good 30 or 50 years from now, no one is going to change the design of the car in your garage. If you think that it looks good now, it will look good later.
1982 BMW:
1981 Buick
Some cars getbetter with age, and some don't.
I wouldn't buy a BMW because I personally think that they look ugly---
That's the first time I have ever heard that. You certainly have a right to your opinion,....but BMW sales keep increasing and I am sure all those women who you see driving them would probably disagree.
If you want to keep telling yourself that the BMW is the most wonderful automobile ever manufactured on the planet
Whatever car you buy, you think that is the nicest car that you can afford...so, yes, to me it is the best car on the planet...for me. Some people like a floater, so I am sure they would choose something else.
Most cars look pretty good these days, including the XLT and the Jeep. Interiors are all reasonably good too, but most people who like European cars like the low key elegance. Remember the huge fins, the gobs of chrome on some old cars especially Buicks, the plastic cladding on Pontiacs, the leather look landau roofs, phony wire wheels, well, it didn't happen on European cars because they were the style of the day for American cars.....that is what dates cars, that type of thing.
Now, I guess I have lost my invitation for dinner.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Now you know why I like richard better.
Smart man. You suck up to Richard, but I wouldn't start spending any of that money until it is in your hot little hand.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Wood that looks like plastic is equally useless to me. Wood that looks like wood (dull/matte finish) works in my world. It often costs extra, lots extra, plus which actual maintenance is required.
I prefer things that look like what they are, not things that pretend to be something else.
But that's just me.
He's going to outlive me anyway so I don't have reason to suck up. I'm playing the odds. If I tell a million people to include me in their will and one person with money takes me up on it I'm home free!
Here's what his will will look like:
"To fezo who I promised to mention in my will - hi, fezo."
see what you started, houdini?
First place went to the Audi Q5, which in C&D's view did almost everything right. FWIW, many car fans think that Audi interiors are the best in the biz.
If I were a top-level BMW exec, Audi would be my reason for losing sleep. Several long-time BMW owners in my German car loving NYC suburb have switched to Audi with no regrets.
Finally, if you're looking for an SUV & you want to stay in the BMW family, wait until the next generation X3 reaches showrooms in January. Word is that it's a big improvement over the current X3.