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Comments
The dealer won't do anything - they say it is Chryslers problem. Chrysler says, it is the dealers problem.
This happened in British Columbia Canada. They visit California and in CA if you have a lemon the manufacturer has to fix the car, replace it, or give you cash back, and they do it all in just a few weeks. They say it is the only way to put enough pressure on the manufacturers - if you don't the manufacturers will do nothing for you.
After watching this program, I would not buy a Chrysler product!
Marketplace-Dodge Journey Lemon
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I know what you mean explorer. I will say this, it is best to pay cash and not to have car payments. But, if you have a good job, are responsible with your money, then I think it is alright to buy a car that way.
Most of us couldn't buy a house unless we paid for it monthly. Cars are the next biggest item on the list, and sometimes it's the only way to make it possible to buy a car.
It would be nice to pay cash and not have payments, but, if responsible people have a good plan, monthly payments can work out.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Congrats on the purchase of your new Escape and thanks for doing your part for the economic recovery. My daughter has one and she is very happy with it. Don't know if you have tried it yet but when I tried to play my music from a flash drive, it said it was an incompatible format. By the way, does it have the self-parking gizmo? It is amazing to watch how well it does the parallel parking.
And speaking of monthly car payments. Why not? Interest rates are so low that financing at these low rates is like free money. In this economic environment it makes sense to use Other Peoples' Money (OPM) and hold on to your hard cold cash for higher and better uses.
Enjoy the ride.
Richard
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------- - - ----------
HOPE THIS MIGHT BE A RECIPE THAT YOU ALL WILL ENJOY AND USE ON
A REGULAR BASIS.
A Great Turkey Recipe
Here is a turkey recipe that also includes the use of popcorn
as a stuffing - imagine that! When I found this recipe, I thought it as perfect
for people like me, who just are not sure
how to tell when poultry is thoroughly cooked, but not dried
out.
Give this a try.
BAKED STUFFED Turkey
6-7 lb. baking turkey
1 cup melted butter
1 cup stuffing (Pepperidge Farm is good.)
1 cup uncooked popcorn (ORVILLE REDENBACHERS LOW
FAT) Salt/pepper to taste
Preheat oven to 350 degrees. Brush turkey well with
melted butter, salt, and pepper.
Fill cavity with stuffing and popcorn. Place in
baking pan with the neck end toward the back of the
oven. Listen for the popping sounds.
When the chicken's rear end blows the oven door open and
the turkey flies across the room, it is done.
And you thought I couldn't cook
Happy Thanksgiving to all!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Do you find the invoice price available here on Edmunds to be accurate? I remember once while shopping I asked how close to invoice he could come. His response was "it depends on what invoice you mean". When I mentioned Edmunds invoice number he seemed relieved.
I know that the actual dealer invoice involves things like holdback, mfg. incentives and that famous double secret handshake money so what a customer understands as invoice may not be the same as a dealer's.
Also, what source would be best for determining the wholesale value of your trade?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Smart move if you want a long marriage. :P
When I got 0% financing on a $26k auto loan I invested the money I would have spent. The car will be paid off in January 2013 and I'll have made thousands off the investments.
Maybe your wife has a tip on a hot stock.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
WOW, I at least told ‘tjc’ to drain (not use the drippings) and not make my recipe until after his honeymoon because Mrs. jmonroe wanted him to at least get that far into his marriage. If she saw your recipe she’d flip.
But it is in keeping with the Southern tradition of cooking and sounds damn good to me.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
The more I think about it, the more pointless it seems to me to argue what invoice is and what it is not. Best is to hear their offer, counter with "XX,XXX", and if they as why say nothing, but "I think that's what I want to pay", or something similar - no need to get into "it's your invoice plus $500", or whatever. They don't like it, walk away and find somebody who does - if nobody likes it, need to raise the offer.
There is really no point (nor it is appropriate) discussing somebody else's business markup, what is their appropriate profit margin. That discussion is between the management and shareholders/owners, and in some cases, regulators (like utilities, insurance and other industries that have to file pricing with the governmnent). We can only say we like/don't like the price and possibly offer ours.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Sounds nice in theory but when you have to return to the dealership after shopping around. Then what? You are pretty much screwed as you have lost much of your bargaining power--and that's when they apply the boa constrictor maneuver. Squeeze every dime out of you until it hurts to the nth. degree. Though matter how clever or how elegant your strategy the dealer never loses.
*dino, there are three different kinds:
*Dealer Invoice
*Factory Invoice
*Triple Net Invoice
The invoice you see on Edmunds is the Factory Invoice. Dealer invoice is lower than that and includes "hold-back" as well as special incentives the dealership has coming to it.
There is something called "TRIPLE NET" which is "dead" cost to the dealership and is what the dealer actually paid, in cash, for the car to the manufacturer - after all incentives, hold back, advertising fees, etc. Employees of dealerships often (but not always) pay "triple net" for cars they purchase from the dealer they work for. This means there is no profit in the deal. Some owners of dealerships sell their employees cars at Triple Net + 500, but whenever I worked for a dealership, as sales or manager, I paid Triple Net!!!
This is all very confusing to the average buyer. If you use the Edmunds "invoice" figure, you will be very close to actual cost, but does not include hold back, incentives, etc. So if a dealer sells a car at Factory Invoice, they are still making money on incentives and holdback.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
There is no shame in saying I was wrong, here is new offer, if this new offer would have been acceptable in the first place. I think people sometimes simply attach way too much to their perception of face (or whatever you call it) that somehow by changing offer they'd look weak and the other people would walk all over them. If such a thing happens, there is no shame in walking again.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
That's the world famous bobst method but you need a starting point for your calculation. Otherwise you could either insult the dealer or leave money on the table. Not to mention spending a lot of extra time.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
The hold back was passed seperately, and most monthly promo incentives weren't passed until the car was punched (reported sold). Some qualifying market funds were even passed quarterly. So it does vary by make, and can be very hard to pin down.
To clarify my point, walking away outright "bobst" way is not necessary - it was ust an example. One can as well have opening offer and target price and negotiation range as well, and still say no "invoice" word. All of that can be done without discussing whether the particular number is $100 or $1000 over invoice, or perhaps $500 under , even if prior walking into the dealership one actually knows what they are.
This is mostly because for different cars (brands, models), different profit levels would be appropriate targets. Unpopular, not selling models would be selling at small profit or even a loss, market hits would command really good margins, presumably by small or no discounts from retail price levels (not so many cars like that these days), most would probably sell in between, and that's how it should be.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
Excellent info - and yes, even more confusing. When my dealer shows me "invoice" when I buy a car from him, it is usually a little higher than Edmunds, which is exactly what you said. That is why I recommend Edmunds invoice prices to calculate your offer to the dealership. I know there must be other incentives or my dealer could not sell me my cars for what I pay them.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
I know Houston (IAH) and Frankfurt (FRA) have that as well.
As a kid, I loved it when a plane went by as we were driving underneath. Who am I kidding? I still love it.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
As I originally posted, FLL's "main' runway (9L/27R) will actually be extended "over" US1 in Ft. Lauderdale, something I've never seen anywhere else! Sure, many airports have taxiways that run over a highway, but to have the main east/west runway to run over a highway is unusual, to say the least. The runway (as planes take off to the east over the ocean) begins to rise halfway down as it crosses runway 30/12 and by the time it gets to the east end, it will be elevated several stories high. Takeoffs should be interesting, but landings to the west should even more interesting.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
2018 430i Gran Coupe
I'm all for globalization. While it creates both winners and losers in every country, overall globalization is good, BUT everybody has to be playing by the same rules.
China (the worst offender) doesn't play by any rules (environmental, workers' rights, intellectual property rights, state subsidies, civil rights, protectionism, etc., etc.)
That is not fair.
If this makes me a meanie, so be it!
Amen! And I say this as somebody who immigrated here.
I won't say anymore since I don't want this discussion to be shut down.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
*dino, the reason the are extending the runway to the east is because I-95 runs north and south adjacent to the western end of the runway they are extending - 10 lanes of traffic! That is why they are extending the runway to the east where there are 8 lanes of US1 running north and south. It has nothing to do with environmental concerns - it's just that the airport is "land-locked" on the east and west by major highways. So, the only answer is to go up over US1 where there is less of an impact than over I-95. The county already bought up the necessary land to the east if US1, which is adjacent to the Atlantic Ocean where the will build a raised runway.
I understand your position, but the only environmental concerns associated with the runway extension is noise. So the county had to pay for soundproofing for businesses and residences adjacent to the extension. Port Everglades is also adjacent to the east of the extension where loads of cruise ships and gasoline tankers dock.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
No way do I tip 20% at a buffet. I agree with your friend that 10% was reasonable.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
How about my wife's new Audi...does it have good genes too?
I'm assuming you are joking, right?
Yes, your wife's Audi has the same good genes as the Passat.
I fully understand that if everybody plays by the same rules, prices will be higher. I'm ok with that.
Say if everything was made in the US product A would cost 100. When it's made in China (as it's right now,) it's 40. If it's made in China when playing by the same rules, let's say it costs 90.
I'm ok with that. Then again, I already avoid (as much as possible) buying made in China stuff.
It is only when it really hits you, you can actually say if you'll be willing to take it. So far, the market's verdict is quite clear.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
In other news, I rented a car for the two weeks I was here ($11/day through Priceline for a Midsize with Alamo). They gave me a 2012 Ford Fusion SE 4-cylinder. My impressions are, first, that Alamo takes terrible care of their cars. The drivers side has a major gash in it where it looks like a previous renter scraped a parking garage pole. Moving on, the car itself is...adequate. I love the size and interior, but the 4-cylinder engine is woefully underpowered.
Luckily for me, Seattle drivers seem to be some of the slowest I have ever encountered - I was told to "slow down" by a state trooper on my drive home from the airport for doing 65mph in a 60. An hour into living in my State and I already had drawn the attention of law enforcement for driving what would otherwise be considered "slow" on the East Coast.
Anyway - I'll be lurking here, as always. Congrats to Explorer on the new Escape!
As a kid my dad would take us out to the airport to watch the "new" DC-7s take off and land. You could stand right at the end of the runway and watch them take off and land right over your head. When dad traveled on business the planes would taxi right up to the terminal with only a 4 foot chain link fence between you and the plane.
I was still able to do this with my kids when they were very young. Now, the airport is like a fortress with razor wire and security patrols. Sad.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I, too, remember those days. I was born and raised in New York and as a kid would frequently fly a Super G Constellation from LaGuardia or Idlewild (JFK) to Miami to visit my grandparents in Coral gables. It was a 4-1/2 hour flight at that time. The DC-6 & DC-7 were a little faster at 4 hours. Then they came out with the Lockheed Electra which shortened it to 3-1/2 hours. I also remember the 4' fences at the gates.
Up until 1998, I remember Palm Springs Airport had fences between you and the MD-80 and you as you sat on a chaise lounge waiting to board your plane. FLL has a road adjacent to the east end of runway 9L (most often used runway because it heads east over the ocean and our winds are usually from the east down here. You can still park there and watch the planes coming in for a landing on 9L. Still excites me as a retired private pilot. I am still amazed, even knowing the physics behind flight and lift, how a 747 or the new larger planes can get off the ground with all that weight.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
firefighter....congrats on the new job and move. Glad it's working out. I agree with you about Alamo.....they do not usually take good care of their rentals.
As far as car negotiations are concerned, everyone has their own way that they're comfortable with. Some like the "grind'em down" method (practiced by both the individual, as well as some dealerships). Personally, I don't have the time, nor the patience to do the "if we, will you?" routine with dealerships.
I come up with an all inclusive figure (incl price of car, tax, tags, reasonable paperwork fees). I look at the car's popularity, the dealership's stock of the model I'm interested in, time of year, time of month. I also look at invoice, holdback, incentives, newspaper ads for the model I'm interested in. Then, I mull it over, put a number on a sheet of paper, stating it's an "all in" number.
If the dealer accepts it, I've bought a car. If not, I thank them for their time and move on to another dealer. It's not foreign for me to travel 5 hours to find a dealer who accepts my offer.
No magic formula. It's just the way I buy a car. The more research up front you do, the less time you spend at the dealership.
It always amazes me when folks ask here at Edmunds "What should I pay for X car?". I dunno.....where do you live? Do you have a trade? Is there a lot of competition around for the car you're interested in? Are you flexible with options and colors? In short, the dynamics of any deal isn't static, but dynamic.
We really can't do that research. IT varies from model to model, car to car, location to location, time of year to time of year.
Just as an example, I can make a "back of invoice" deal at the end of the model year, that I couldn't make at the beginning of the model year.
There are buffet restaurants and there are buffet restaurants.
This wasn't like Golden Coral, KFC or Pizza Hut. This is a very high class Indian restaurant and the waiter has a suit and tie. He picks up your plates immediately, is attentive, tells you what the different foods are.
I would say the waiter in this case does as much if not more than what a waiter/waitress would do in a regular type of restaurant.
In this case, I really think $5 would be insulting on a $50 meal, for what is very professional service. Besides, the food was pretty inexpensive for the quality, so I let the staff have that difference I should have paid. Also, I believe if the waiter/waitress adds enjoyment to your meal, by being friendly, efficient, answers questions he/she should be compensated fairly.
In many cases people who tip generously had jobs that relied on tips earlier in life. I waited on tables at a lodge and drove taxi cabs. You barely can make a living even with tips in some jobs.
I'd rather go through life knowing I paid fairly for a meal, rather than be a miserable cheap skate .....ha ha!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
LOL! That recipe is definitely not for the faint of heart---or stomach. I'll tell you something that would cause Mrs. Jmonroe to faint dead away. When my wife and I were growing up, every home in the South had a small grease pot that sat on the stove. No home could be without it. We even got one as a wedding gift at a kitchen shower. If you fried chicken on a Monday night, you drained the grease into the grease pot. On Tuesday night, you would use the same grease from your pot to fry up the pork chops. On Wednesday night, you would use the same grease to fry up some country style steak. By Friday night's fish fry, it was time to get rid of the week's grease and begin again. Can you imagine what we did to our bodies?! By the mid 1970s most grease pots had disappeared from the stoves. People don't fry things nearly as much now. My family and friends still say that my fried chicken is the best that they have ever eaten. I used to cook it once a week; now I'm lucky if I fix it once every three months. The secret is the iron skillet and the timing for turning the pieces---and of course the grease.
Richard
Do you fry it in lard? I've seen that done on some TV shows focusing on southern style chicken.
We have fried chicken in a cast iron skillet. It comes out really good.
Thanks for your kind words earlier. We are starting to stress a little with all we have to do (and I really miss my Grandfather and wish he was going to be here this week), but I know it will be a great affair. We saw family over the weekend and everyone is very excited for it.
28,
I've driven in Seattle and they do drive slow. If you have ever read anything by Fintail in the inconsiderate drivers forum you would see you aren't alone in your observation.
2025 Ram 1500 Laramie 4x4 / 2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Icon I6L Golf Cart
Very quiet for me today as my boss lives in Ottawa.
On the automotive front, my daughters' MINI gave a warning that the right front tire was low. Put air in it on Friday night; Saturday she drove to Denver and back and the warning returned. Visibly low on air.
Took it to my local tire shop this morning, where they discovered that the source of the leak was the TPMS monitor itself. They replaced it and reset the tire pressure on all four tires.
Cost to me? $0
ff28 - congrats on the move. Will you now become a Seahawks fan? When I moved from CA to CO 19 years ago it took me a little while to drop my allegiances to the LA teams. Of course, '93 was the first year of the Colorado Rockies, so it was cool to jump on the bandwagon there.
Yeh, I worked for an American company for 16 years. Of course, I took off all the Canadian holidays, but, I liked to be respectful of my American employer and friends, so I liked to take those holidays off too!
On the automotive front, does Mini have a 4 year bumper to bumper warranty?
After seeing that episode of Marketplace the Dodge Journey had a warranty, but the dealer refused to honor it and Chrysler wouldn't honor it. What's the use of a warranty if no one honors it? The mechanic checked the system to see what code registered when the car stalled, and the computer didn't register the fault, so that was another problem the car had, which the dealer couldn't fix. That is why, I would rather pay more for a car, but have engineering and technology that actually works.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Richard
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
I gave that up some years ago and switched to vegetable oil. It does just fine.
"...wish he was going to be here this week."
Believe me. He is.
Don't stress. The planning is done. Try to go with the flow and grab a short nap or two. You'll feel more refreshed and prepared to enjoy yourself. I've directed a few weddings, though it's my least favorite thing to do. People get so stressed, excited, and emotional. Still, they went off like clock work---with one exception. I did one wedding where the groom didn't show up. Talk about emotional! I told the bride's father to just go down front and tell the guests that the plans had changed. I then told him to invite all of the guests to the reception as planned. After all, he had paid for the reception and the band was sitting there waiting. People went to the reception and actually had a pretty good time. I don't know how the bride's parents got through the reception, but they were very gracious hostesses. My heart really went out to them. Naturally, the bride didn't attend. I was so proud of her though. After about a week, she hand delivered each gift back to the giver. For the out of town gifts, she did a hand written note to go into each box. It must have been agony for her. A few years later, she married a really nice guy in a private ceremony.
I had one other wedding incident. The groom fainted during the exchange of vows---two much fun at the bachelor's party the night before. It was actually funny. I'm standing in the back of the church and suddenly the groom disappears from view. It turned out fine. They took him to the church parlor down the hall and revived him. I simply told the organist to play some pretty music for about 20 minutes. When the groom returned, the entire congregation stood and applauded. I still see the groom at times. We always have a good laugh about their wedding day.
Richard
Wow, must be one hell of a buffet restaurant if the waiter does more work than a waiter at a regular restaurant. :P
I work for a multinational corporation, so a lot of the folks I deal with have different holidays. I had a phone call today with some folks in South America, but found that today is Columbus Day in Argentina, too, so our one participant from that country didn't make the call. Another contact in the UK has "bank" holidays scattered throughout the year.
Heck, even here in the US different states celebrate different holidays. Each site for my company can set its own holiday schedule. For example, my wife gets MLK Day in January and President's Day in February as holidays, where I do not.
On the automotive front, does Mini have a 4 year bumper to bumper warranty?
I think so. The MINI dealer is so much farther away from the house, however (35-45 minutes), so I thought I'd start with the local tire dealer in the hopes that they could solve the problem. They were, and the no cost part was just an added bonus! Also, it's tough to schedule service at the MINI dealer since it is only one of two in the entire state of Colorado.
Boy, you rich people have the best of everything. We regular folks used a coffee can.
My wife and her mother trade coffee cans of grease all the time. My wife uses it to make a kind of suet cake for the birds but I suspect her mother cooks with it. Mom is well into her 90s so that grease can't be too bad.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
The waiter explained many of the dishes at the Indian buffet. For example, they had 4 Chinese/Indian dishes and he explained how since the countries were close together Indian people actually love Chinese food, so they adapted some Chinese dishes into Indian dishes. There was more information as well, so this waiter was part of the entertainment......some servers may be good and efficient and they deserve a tip, but rarely are they part of the entertainment.
I would rate this restaurant as equivalent to a hotel buffet, and this is what tipping.com suggests;
hotel buffets For business breakfasts, tip $1-$2. At high-end hotel brunch buffets, 15%-20% frequently is the norm and sometimes automatically added..
Learn all about tipping at;
Tipping.com
(who would have thought there would be a site devoted to tipping?
If you don't like tipping, I hear it is an insult to tip in Iceland. :P
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Should they?
If you were to invest several million dollars and open a business, wouldn't you expect to make a decent profit?
" You have lost much of your bargaining power"
Yep, you have! You should have offered a reasnoble amount in the first place. You outsmarted yourself and now you talk about "boa constrictor maneuvers?"
I never was able to understand how some "smart" buyers would agonize over buying a car and how afraid they would be at the horrible thought that just maybe, someone, somewhere may have paid 100.00 less.
If it really "hurts to the nth degree, then walk out and buy a different car somewhere else.
It really doesn't have to be a painful process!
Good point, *isellhondas! When a customer enters a dealership with the intent of buying a car (as opposed to "shopping/looking), it is the buyer who has the power, not the seller. The buyer uses the word "no" and it is up to the seller to evoke a "yes"! So, who has the upper hand? Obviously it is the buyer.
Timing is of utmost importance to buying a car at a great price - either the last day of the month or the last week of the year - especially at dealerships who are tops on sales nationwide or regionally.
I worked for 2 dealerships who were both number one in sales nationally for their brand. At one dealership I bought a car for $1965 below invoice and at another, $945 below invoice at the end of December in both cases - they were in a battle to remain #1. But this really only works at dealers who are big and vying for maintaining #1 or #2 status or reaching tops in the nation.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Money isn't making anything in the bank right now, but 2.25% for a loan is pretty cheap.
Yes, it does have the parking technology package. We didn't really want it, but it had everything else she wanted, which was pretty much everything!
So now we now have 3 black Escapes. My kids drive the other 2.
We don't use ipods or other external media other than a phone.
Sat radio is good enough. We (both of us) like listening to games on road trips.