Stories from the Sales Frontlines

abacomike

"So you got a much better car with more equipment for less than $10K. "

Thanks, driver. The new car MSRP'd at about the same as the 2013 did. I just didn't have to pay the extra $790 for diamond white metallic and I did not get the fold down rear seats, which was the same cost as the ventilated seats. So, with the 900 price increase in the base car, the new one was about the same MSRP. But the new one has tweaked the technology and increased standard safety features and improved fuel economy.

Yesterday, we drove to Sawgrass Mills (about 45 miles round trip) and averaged 32.6 mpg, and the car isn't broken in yet. That's excellent mpg's for a 302 hp engine. Fuel economy increase from 20/30 to 21/31 with 24 combined mpg. The gross weight of the car is close to 4000 pounds.

graphicguy

sandman....I haven't seen any of the new Fusions at the airport rental lots, yet. That's the only way I'd get to test drive them. And, probably not a fair comparison given the abuse rental cars take.

I know I'm seeing an awful lot of them on the road. That tells me Ford has been selling a lot of them right from the start.

Every once in a while, since I'm a loyal customer, Hertz will slip me into a new car that just hit their rental fleet. Every once in a great while, they'll slip me into one of their "Prestige" collection rentals (i.e. Mercedes, Caddy, etc).

You alluded to the Hyundai. One of my golf buddies had a Lincoln LS that was getting a little long in the tooth. Last year, he was all set to buy another Lincoln, until he went to their showroom and was quite underwhelmed at the current crop.

He ended up looking at Caddys and a Lexus. Then, he test drove a Genesis and was all set to buy one. Much to my surprise, he showed up for our normal tee time in a Sonata. He said it drove nice and was every bit as good as his LS, and saved him a ton of money, which he could give to me to pay for his "skins";).

He's been very happy with it.

tjc78

That is a surprise going from an LS to a Sonata. Two really different cars. I'm surprised the Genesis wasn't just the ticket for him. RWD, powerful and fairly sporty. The LS had similar characteristics and actually is what Lincoln needs now, rather than rebadged Fords.

jayrider

2 months ago got a brand new camry as a rental. I was very disappointed with the ride. Way too firm -- way too much road feel in a bad way. Remember test driving a 2003 Camry and it rode like my Buick. Times sure have changed.

dino001

From your description, it seems this may be first Camry I'd ever like. To each their own.

driver100

"‘driver’ would have justified a new car purchase for an outlay like this, and believe, I thought of it too. "

Yes, you spent enough on tires that if you were Mike you would have a brand new car instead of brand new tires.

In a later post you said something to the affect that you got about 30K miles on the last set of tires, then you mentioned taking off the snow tires....I just wanted to be sure, did the last set of tires go 30K or was it 30K minus the mileage with the snow tires?

That would be a very interesting fact to know - how can a certain brand of car be so hard on tires? The main variable I would think is suspension system and weight distribution, but then i don't know about these matters.......

driver100

"2 months ago got a brand new camry as a rental. I was very disappointed with the ride. Way too firm -- way too much road feel in a bad way."

Dino got it right when he said this Camry actually sounds a lot more interesting to drive. Toyota is really trying to make their cars more appealing in the handling and steering areas. The new Lexus is supposed to be a huge improvement in this department.

Sorry jayrider, you will just have to find a 2003 Camry or an old Buick when it is time for a new car.

robr2

Are the Genesis V8 tires a high performance tire? If so, that's probably the issue. High performance tires aren't known for long life.

salesguyjay

Typically they are a Michelin 235-50 R18 tire... Its typical with these tires - My svc department replaces them QUITE often.

verdugo

Congratulations Mike.

I think Monroe and I should get 3 months credit on our dues for calling it.

Best luck with your shoulder surgery recovery. Hope to have you back in no time at all.

driver100

Are the Genesis V8 tires a high performance tire? If so, that's probably the issue.

That's true....I think Mike got only 15K on a set of tires...one reason he needs a new car every year.

That would bother me, needing new tires that often. I like the E Sport edition but only if it came with regular tires.

Out of curiosity, I guess you can get a sport edition with AWD, but, then you need snow tires and new tires almost every year, unless you live in Florida. Might as well buy a tire store, you'd be spending half of your life getting tires changed all the time.

tjc78

Typically they are a Michelin 235-50 R18 tire

J's Genny came from the factory with Dunlop SP Sport 5000s. They are somehow considered an all season tire, but certainly were useless in the bad weather and wore quickly. He replaced them with Bridgestone Serenity which is usually a very good wearing tire yet only got 30K out of them.

My V6 Genesis went 27K on the Dunlops (in a 17" size) and had a little life left. Based on this I can only think the V8 suspension (which is a little different) combined with the lower profile is hard on the tires. J is not alone in this. There were countless threads about tire life on a Genesis specific forum.

abacomike

Out of curiosity, I guess you can get a sport edition with AWD, but, then you need snow tires and new tires almost every year, unless you live in Florida.

Yes, *driver, the E350 comes in a 4MATIC Sport Sedan (AWD). The tires they use on the AWD version are all weather tires. Living where you live, are snow tires a necessity even with AWD?

driver100

" Living where you live, are snow tires a necessity even with AWD? "

We live about 30 miles west of Toronto, about 60 miles North-East of Niagara Falls. Most winters we get about 4 fair sized snow storms where there could be 6 to 8 inches of snow on the ground.

Buffalo, on the other side of Lake Ontario gets hit with constant big snowfalls all winter long. We have AWD on the 535 and on the A4 and that seems to be sufficient. Some people like to be overly cautious and get snow tires along with their AWD.

If I had to travel longer distances or had to be at work every day I might consider snow tires, but not for our driving. Hopefully if our new pattern keeps up, we will drive to Florida in early Nov and come back in late March so will miss most of the snow anyway, that would be fine with me.

I had to have snow tires for the 2008 Cabriolet, they don't come with AWD. That car couldn't budge an inch if there was any snow on the ground. I really don't want to spend time getting tires changed around twice a year.

How many miles do you expect to get from your tires with the new car? Your gas mileage is spectacular. The 535 gets 27-28 mpg highway and 23-24 city in regular Comfort Mode, not using on/off.

jayrider

So maybe the new camry is the old 3 series. My 2 current cars are a 2010 Prius [ smooth and comfy -- never boring at 50 mpg] and a 2012 Buick LaCrosse AWD [big, quiet and solid} I just turned 67 -- Take note you young whipper snappers, and remember when you join the medicare club,who told you so. :P

abacomike

How many miles do you expect to get from your tires with the new car? Your gas mileage is spectacular. The 535 gets 27-28 mpg highway and 23-24 city in regular Comfort Mode, not using on/off.

I was told to expect 17-20K miles. The car came with Continental Contacs and remember, the front tires are a different size than the rears. I had 6600 miles on the 2013 with the same brand of tires and they looked hardly worn at all. I don't abuse the car or the tires, so I expect to get at least two years on the tires or 20,000+ miles.

driver100

Take note you young whipper snapper (yea!! Emotocons are back!!! )

I just turned 66, not that much of a younger whipper snapper.

I do think that soft cushioning ride feeling is going to be harder to find going ahead. Even the Lexus which was supposed to be an Asian Buick or Cadillac has become sportier, with a firmir ride and better handling. Buick and Cadillac are starting to go in that direction, and now Camry.

What will be left for us older geezers when we will want soft springs and big cushiony seats?

driver100

I expect to get at least two years on the tires or 20,000+ miles.

I guess the Genesis with a V8 isn't out of line then with 30K. I am just surprised tires don't last longer. The 535 has 25K miles on it (I know you don't keep cars that long) and the tires seem to have about normal wear. I don't want to jinx myself, but I really hope they last for 40K miles. (Run Flats cost more too, note to self - check out MB and Audi next time).

I don't enjoy buying new tires. At least a new car or TV gives you some enjoyment and betters your life....tires, well, boring, no one even notices you have new tires!

abacomike

What will be left for us older geezers when we will want soft springs and big cushiony seats?

I suspect the South Koreans will come up with something soft and cushy for those "seniors" who prefer a softer, cushier ride. They've come up with just about everything else, haven't they? :shades:

driver100

the South Koreans will come up with something soft and cushy for those "seniors"

Yes, the South Koreans will usually capitalize on any potential market segment.

This list may be of interest, Top 10 cars for older drivers:
Eager to avoid being labeled an "old person's car," the car companies stress that features that make cars attractive to older people -- like buttons and controls that are easy to reach, simple and legible -- are attractive for everyone.

Here are our picks of 10 of the best cars when it comes to having features that appeal to older drivers:
10 best cars for older drivers
1. BMW 7 Series 6.Hyundai Veracruz
2. Cadillac SRX 7.Mercedes-Benz E-Class
3. Chrysler 300 8.Nissan Cube
4. Ford Taurus 9.Toyota RAV-4
5. Honda Odyssey10. Volvo XC60
6.Hyundai Veracruz
7.Mercedes-Benz E-Class
8.Nissan Cube
9.Toyota RAV-4
10 Volvo XC60
Read more:
Top 10 cars for older drivers

You and Richard made the list.

jmonroe

I just wanted to be sure, did the last set of tires go 30K or was it 30K minus the mileage with the snow tires?

I have dedicated snow tires for the rear since February 2010. Since I have the tires rotated and balanced twice a year the wear on the tires were just about the same for the front and rear. Because, even though I use the snow tires only on the rear, the all season tires have been on all for corners at one time or another due to how I have them rotated. I don’t run the snow tires longer than I have to. I’d say they have less than 10K miles on them in the 4 winters that I have used them and the Bridgestone’s were not on the car the first winter (2010). The snow tires are pretty good (Nokian Hakkapeliitta R). They ought to be, they cost enough.

The OEM Dunlop’s (P235/50R18) are categorized as Ultra High Performance All-Season tires. That description pretty much tells you their DNA is not conducive to good mileage. They are a very good tire for grip and a smooth quiet ride and I’m sure Hyundai chose them for the Genesis because of that. They just did not wear well for me at all. Gone at 17K miles and they were pathetic in the snow.

FWIW, the Bridgestone Serenities had closer to 31K on them not 30K.

Hey...the emotorcons are back. Who was it that was holding out on their dues?

jmonroe

abacomike

This list may be of interest, Top 10 cars for older drivers

Oh, Praise the Lord, I finally made a "list"!

When I read the article about why the E350 attracts older drivers, they claim the buttons and switches are easier to operate and understand. Then I looked at the year of the E350 they were talking about, and it is a 2007, not the newer ones.

Trust me when I say that your average "older driver " (classified here in Florida Condo Associations as those who are about to be deceased), could never figure out how to use the multitude of buttons and switches in the new Mercedes E350. If you can pull up a photo of the front dash, steering wheel, and the dash above the console, not to mention the fact that the car has two redundant computer access points, you will see what I mean.

Just on the steering wheel, there is a voice control button, make and end phone calls using bluetooth, audio volume controls, arrow controls for the speedometer computer read outs and car settings, enter buttons to enter your choice from the readout, etc. Then, above the console, you have 10 buttons for entering phone numbers, rear sun screen button, two rear headrest buttons, two buttons for heated seats, 2 buttons for ventilated seats, ECON start/stop button, and 8 buttons below that for Automatic Climate Control Settings + 2 buttons for raising and lowering the temperature, a button for emergency flashers, etc.

Then there is the lighting controls on the left dash, push button start button, controls below the steering wheel for adjusting the wheel up, down, in, out, and the cruise control stem with four directions settings, and the direction signal stalk which has brights, flash brights, windshield washer and wiper settings, etc.

And those are just the buttons. Then, there is the "controller" for accessing the NAV, AUDIO, etc., settings through the NAV screens. Then, above the console on the front of the roof, there are 12 buttons, 4 for the Mbrace functions and 8 for the ambient, rear, front, etc. interior lighting.

There are still buttons I haven't figured out yet. However, it is still not as complicated as the Lexus GS350 system I had on that car. You need at least 8 hours of training in many of today's cars in order to access systems and subsystems.

I saw an older driver in a training session with an employee at the dealership, and he was having an awful time just using the "voice command" system - when all you have to do is tell the system what you want.

No, I do not consider Mercedes, BMW 7 Series or any car equipped with NAV and voice command, to be a car that is "old person" friendly.

tjc78

Driver, IMO the list is hogwash. There isn't a Panther based vehicle, Buick, Avalon, or a Caddy sedan. I'm not kidding I don't agree with a single model on the list.

abacomike

Driver, IMO the list is hogwash. There isn't a Panther based vehicle, Buick, Avalon, or a Caddy sedan. I'm not kidding I don't agree with a single model on the list.

tjc, I went back to the source *driver listed as a link and it became apparent that the source is questionable. Even if the organization that maintains it represents retired people went and developed that the list, I wouldn't agree with their interpretation of what older people can and cannot handle.

A car with a gear selector, a key hole for the key, radio knobs and a/c and heating controls is more appropriate for older drivers so they can concentrate more on their driving environment and less on a screen that shows them where they are and where they are going.

If you lived here in Florida and had to drive these roads with so many drivers who have no idea what is going on outside their car, you would know what I am trying to convey. :mad:

explorerx4

I went to Tirerack and there are several tires listed as 'Best Sellers' for your car (Genesis 4.6) rated at 50-60k.

explorerx4

Mike,
After your surgery and therapy, maybe you can ask the Marlins to let you throw out the first pitch at a game. :surprise:

jayrider

I have a plan for the eventual demise of the geezer rides. I'm going to buy a small house on the same side of the street of one of those Super Store gas stations. Buy a couple of personal mobility scooters "as seen on tv" and motor over with my wife for coffee, hot dogs, pizza, sodas, chips and of course scratch-off lottery tickets. They have fruit, sandwiches, bread, milk, eggs frozen stuff -- I mean, I can hardly wait !

kyfdx

The way the Marlins are playing, they might put him on the roster.. :surprise:

abacomike

Mike,
After your surgery and therapy, maybe you can ask the Marlins to let you throw out the first pitch at a game.

Heck, explorer, I was almost drafted by them last week, but I was able to catch a fly ball, and that disqualified me!

You should see how the local media is tearing them apart - which they deserve! A brand new stadium that cost $900 million and the owners trade away anyone who costs them more than $500,000 per season.

The Florida Senate just paved the way for the Dolphins to remodel their stadium if voted in by a special election next month with a 1% increase in the hotel tax. The ads state that it's the vacationers and tourists who will end up paying for it.

God bless the South Florida sports teams for their frijoles while delivering absolutely nothing for the fans to cheer about. The Panthers, the Dolphins and the Marlins - to me they're just a bunch of animals! Thank God for the Heat - without them, we would throw in the towel! :sick:

abacomike

The way the Marlins are playing, they might put him on the roster..

Kyfdx, you couldn't be more right!

abacomike

We get Encore as part of our cable channel array. Right now, on Encore Westerns, they are airing, commercial free, High Noon! I was a kid when that film hit the theaters. Lots of Oscars were given out to that movie and cast. I was looking at the actors listed for that film:

Gary Cooper, Grace Kelly, Lloyd Bridges, Lon Chaney Jr.(the original wolf man), Lee Van Cleef (the "bad" in the Good, the Bad and the Ugly, Harry Morgan (Mash), and many others. Tex Ritter also won an Oscar for his performance singing the title song.

Great, classic film.

roadburner

Take note you young whipper snappers, and remember when you join the medicare club,who told you so.

At 56 I'm not exactly a pup- but I can't imagine owning/driving anything bigger and softer than my wife's E90 328i. As a matter of fact, my next car will probably be something ranging from a 500 Abarth to a 135i to a FR-S to a Cayman S. Perhaps in 25-30 years I might want a marshmallow-suspended rolling couch- but don't bet on it... :P

explorerx4

I'm ok with some westerns, but a few of my favorites from a concept point of view are 'The Game', 'Fail Safe' and 'Enemy of the State'.

abacomike

I'm ok with some westerns, but a few of my favorites from a concept point of view are 'The Game', 'Fail Safe' and 'Enemy of the State'.

The only western I ever truly enjoyed was High Noon because of the outstanding concept of telling a story in "real time" as the clock ticks down to noon. The movie was 90 minutes, and the clock ticking down 60 minutes and then the shooting for 30 minutes.

I would add your titles to my list of greats, but would have to include High Noon and The Wizard of Oz.

Sandman6472

I am now 58 and retired, I don't consider my transporter job a real job even though I do get paid...it's more like a fun past time as it doesn't feel like work one bit. I am so happy that the other drivers look at me like I'm some crazy person but hey, when one has been to hell and back, every day is better than the previous one!

I won't go into what I drive or what I'd love to some day as y'all know all that from my posts. Some think I'm a bit over the top in here but it's my true passion in life besides my wife and kids. I hope that my posts don't bore y'all as it did that one guy whose name I truly forgot. Any time this stops being fun, I'll be gone, never to return. But for now, I love being in here whenever I can and enjoy the friendship with people who have the same vehicle passion that I do.

As always, I am,

The Sandman :sick: :shades:

Also, we moved 150 vehicles today so add that to the ones we did on Sunday and I think that puts us at 346...damn, that's a lot of cars!

abacomike

But for now, I love being in here whenever I can and enjoy the friendship with people who have the same vehicle passion that I do.

Whatever turns you on, Sandman. This forum is here for those who desire to post. I read every one of your "sagas" about your job and experiences. And I am sure this venue provides you with a necessary outlet to espouse your driving of various vehicles and your take on the advantages and disadvantages of each. Most of us are limited in the vehicles we drive - you are certainly not!

driver100

I wouldn't agree with their interpretation of what older people can and cannot handle.

Mike and tjc, I have to agree that the list doesn't make much sense, although they say they got a lot of info from some fairly knowledgeable sources;

Catering to older drivers is important. According to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, there will be more than 40 million U.S. drivers age 65 and older by 2020, up from 29 million in 2005.

Accordingly, the AAA, working with the University of Florida's National Older Driver Research and Training Center, has come up with a list of "Smart Features for Mature Drivers."

One thing about a lot of articles is they don't say when they were written. That info would help alot.

Here's a challenge for someone. What cars are good for older people?
I think the Focus and Corolla were made taller than comparable cars so more senior people could get in and out. The instruments and controls are fairly straightforward too. That parallel parking feature in the Focus might help. Chrysler 300 is also pretty much like a car from the 60s so seniors might feel right at home driving one.

Any others?

sb55

My father is 81 years old. He decided to drive from Vero Beach, Florida to my place in Northern Vermont this past February to see Lake Champlain frozen over and drive his BMW 128 convertible on it. Without his wife. In February. And he's 81! When he called and told me about it, he promised that he wouldn't stay at my house more than 2 days. It took him 2 nights on the road to get here, and the crazy guy only spent 1 night in Virginia on the way home. It's almost 1400 miles!
He did this trip and got inspired to drive cross country next fall, so as soon as he got back to Florida, he traded his 128 for a new BMW X-1.
Hell, I'm 58, and I got his genes so I don't think that I will ever have a soft floaty car either!

driver100

motor over with my wife for coffee, hot dogs, pizza, sodas, chips and of course scratch-off lottery tickets. They have fruit, sandwiches, bread, milk, eggs frozen stuff -- I mean, I can hardly wait !

Lots of those roadside markets in Florida. That sounds like the life.

I already told my wife we hardly ever use the stove when we are in Florida - no one feels like cooking there, so i am going to sell the stove and use that space for a computer or entertainment centre.

driver100

to see Lake Champlain frozen over and drive his BMW 128 convertible on it.

That's funny.....I didn't see a BMW 128 listed on the old people's Top 10 list.

He must be quite a guy!

abacomike

Here's a challenge for someone. What cars are good for older people?

I would add to your list the Honda Civic and Acord, Toyota Avalon and Camry, Hyundai Elantra and Sonata, Chevy Malibu, all without NAV and other heavy tech options with the exception of requiring blind spot monitors and lane tracking.

explorerx4

One semester in college, I lived 'in' a house on Lake Champlain, actually I slept in the screened in porch.
I used to see the lights of cars driving on the lake, mostly on the weekends.

tjc78

Maybe we should have 75+ editions. Blind zone alert, parking sensors, front and rear view cameras, collision alert. All with a regular key, radios with knobs and manual HVAC. Oh, and a giant digital speedometer. :shades:

salesguyjay

Your forgot the 8 Track!!!!!! :P

jmonroe

I went to Tirerack and there are several tires listed as 'Best Sellers' for your car (Genesis 4.6) rated at 50-60k.

Don’t take this as an argument but read what I show below.

Are those tread wear warranties for a ‘W’ speed rated tire or a ‘V” speed rated tire? I did a quick check at Tirerack and I didn’t see any tread wear warranties better for a ‘W’ rated tire than what the Serenities had. I’m sure if I looked longer I would have probably found one or two. The OEM Dunlop’s are a ‘V’ tire and not surprisingly, they had NO tread wear warranty at all. I guess Dunlop knows that tire does not wear well. I’m not saying I need more than what the OEMs provide as far as a speed rating is concerned but we have to be comparing like for like speced tires (a ‘W’ tire in my case).

On top of that I got a 23% discount because I did not get the rated wear of the Bridgestone Serenities which had a tread wear warranty of 40K miles. My adjustment was for tires that got 30,800 miles and that was an early adjustment. I could have gotten about another 3000/3500 miles out of them before they were at the wear bars and that would have given me less of a discount. They are only obligated to provide an adjustment when the tires are worn to the wear bars. So, all things considered, I feel the Firestone store was very fair with me.

FWIW, the Tirerack price for 4 Serenities including the road hazard warranty and shipping but adding for the mounting and balancing at this same Firestone store would have only saved me around $15 for all 4 tires. That isn’t enough of a savings for me to deal with an on-line company and if I have a problem I’ll have to wait a few days for the adjustment tire to show up. I know Tirerack is very good in providing adjustments because Son #1 dealt with them on a road hazard warranty adjustment several years ago but like I said, not enough of a savings for me.

There is another good point for the Bridgestone Serenity Plus that I now have. They now have a tread wear rating of 50K miles for a ‘W’ speed rated tire not 40K miles like the ones that were replaced. Maybe that is what the “Plus” means in the description but I’m not sure about that. I am sure that the tread wear warranty is better because that is what the paperwork and warranty booklet says.

jmonroe

mako1a

I was having problems with my back many years ago so I bought a Brougham.

88 Cadillac Brougham De Elegance to be more specific. If ever there was a

good car for seniors, that was it. Even had the gas gauge in the middle of the

dash so your wife could remind you as soon as you got to half way empty.

[Deleted User]

My vote for a mature taller driver is a Forester. It's literally the only thing my father in law could fit into without stressing his neck, back, and knees while entering and exiting. We checked every option on the floor at the auto show for two years, and the Forester was the only one to pass the test. Combine ease of entry with good fuel economy, large cargo and excellent visibility, and Subaru earned a sale on a 2014 a month ago. The CVT took a couple of weeks of adaptation, but now he loves the smooth power delivery, especially in the mountains.

abacomike

My vote for a mature taller driver is a Forester.

Of all the Japanese entries in this market, Subaru continually gets high marks in just about every category used to assess their vehicles. If I was in a different position than I am now and needed a new car, I would purchase the new mid sized Subaru sedan. I think it's called the Legacy. I saw it at the auto show and was very impressed with it.

tjc78

88 Cadillac Brougham De Elegance to be more specific

Great car! One of out member's here (Lemko) still has one of that vintage he bought new.

houdini1

jay, that is hilarious. Man, I love a good sense of humor !!