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Trading a New Car for Another New Car: Am I a Moron or No?

Angst_RiddenAngst_Ridden GAPosts: 11
edited November 2018 in General
Purchased a brand new 4Runner back in early May of this year (2018 TRD-Offroad Premium), 11 days after taking delivery of it a deer decided to end itself on the vehicle... thus began a huge, seemingly endless, fiasco of waiting on insurance/no title existing/insurance ready to settle/still no title/title then appears/we get our check (they deemed it a total loss because of a full airbag deployment and we came out on top -- making $2600.00 over what we paid). However, in all this, 45 days worth of no car, as a single car family, we were walking everywhere (occasionally using Lyft for longer errands, and we had just relocated to a new area of the States, and summer was bearing down with big heat & humidity) and I was feeling the duel pressure of not only getting us back into a vehicle but also that dad/husband thing of "save some money too" ~ give a man too much time to think and well... I started thinking about other options.
And why not... I actually made some money (got paid so to speak) to drive the 4Runner for 11 days, the potential bad mojo of buying another 4Runner with what had happened (our first 4Runner ever, and then 11 days later Bambi kills herself on it, not that I am particularly superstitious but), other vehicles began making sense to my heat-soaked brain (like I said... give a man on foot, in the growing heat & humidity of the South, no car, and too much time to think on all those foot errands, and... ).
So in the end, I made the wife very happy on June 29th with a 2018 Subaru Outback 2.5i Limited purchase (she didn't dislike the 4Runner but in her words, "The Outback seems less intimidating and easier to park") while I just felt like I did the good husband/dad thing for all of us, me-wife-daughter, by getting us back into something with a great reputation and for way less money (out the door, the Outback saved us $7,850.00 and when I factored in the insurance settlement of $2600.00 over my 4Runner OTD price well, the Outback purchase ended up netting me a total savings of $10,450.00 ~ winner/winner chicken dinner)... except now,
after four months of ownership the Outback is not to my liking at all. It feels "fine" -- bland, underwhelming and like I 'settled' for something instead of what I truly wanted (I have wanted a 4Runner for seven years but always told myself "no" but decided last year that 2018 would be the year I said "yes"). Yes, it has an outstanding reputation for longevity and safety and resale but it's not a 4Runner... and when I want to [non-permissible content removed] & moan, I can truly say it feels a little shoddy with regard to workmanship and technology (there are well-documented head unit issues, and yes, we have them in ours; we only have 5400 miles on ours and I am noticing the beginnings of rattles and squeaks which honestly are pissing me off; Android Auto, which we use, is horrid with disconnections and glitches again-another well-documented issue that Outback & Forester owners bemoan on Subaru forums)... and it seems like, maybe an omen, that everywhere I drive in our Outback all I notice around me are 4Runners (and the bittersweet memory of what once was); even my smartass daughter will say "Look dad," while smirking when we are out on errands together and she spots a 4Runner in Nautical Blue (the color I selected for ours).

So finally my question...

I have never 'flipped' a car so quickly so I truly don't know what to expect if I move forward on this... so here are my details and I could use some advice:

I paid $31k OTD (all inclusive) on the Outback, I put 11K down and financed at 20K, it's still basically new-- 2018 2.5i Limited w/5400 miles. We have made five payments of $321.00/per month on the Outback and KBB puts it at $27.5 to $29.2 for private sale (as far as I've seen, they don't show trade-in because it's too new). Factoring in the immediate depreciation of a new vehicle, how badly would I get taken on trading in the Outback on exactly what I had before Bambi took it away from me... any ideas on what to expect or how this even works?

Any and all advice gladly welcomed!
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  • Thank you, will do!
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  • Well first thing I'd do is re-post your situation in our REAL WORLD TRADE-IN VALUES topic. That way, you will get a very realistic idea of what a dealer will give you for the car on trade.

    For that topic, just post the year, make, trim level, color and your zip code. You can keep telling your "story" here (which is quite interesting) but don't post all that in the Real Values topic. Just the bare facts. "What's the trade-in value on a .....etc etc."


    Once you have that trade-in number, we can discuss your options. It may be that the hit on trade-in is too painful and you may have to attempt a private party sale--which means you will compete with discounted new models of the same car.

    Since you say that your wife didn't have strong objections to the 4Runner, perhaps the feeling of bad "mojo" wasn't all that rational, and perhaps the purchase of the Subaru TOO rational! (can't win, can we?).

    Anyway, short answer is forget the past or the guilt or even the desire---and just crunch the numbers and see how much pain you can stand to get back into a 4Runner. Who knows, maybe you can even find an off-lease, low miles 4Runner to make all this do-able.

    Just posted over there, thank you again.
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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,473
    OK. Good. So now we know you could expect about $28K on a trade-in. How does that number work for you? Looks like you're out $3K + whatever you buy over $28K + sales tax, license, etc.

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  • Angst_RiddenAngst_Ridden GAPosts: 11
    edited November 2018

    OK. Good. So now we know you could expect about $28K on a trade-in. How does that number work for you? Looks like you're out $3K + whatever you buy over $28K + sales tax, license, etc.

    3k seems about right on a loss... so now onto some other questions:

    1. Am I correct or incorrect in assuming if I found a used 4Runner at a dealership that was listed at 28K (which ironically I have ~ strange world), there is no way they are going to either,
    A) Let me negotiate down on the 4Runner -- or they will actually try to under-price my Outback
    B ) Let me walk out the door with basically an even swap on vehicles (excluding tax, etc)
    ...opinions on that?

    2. Going a different direction for a minute... what would happen in the event I found something at 20k for instance. The bank will want their $18,xxx paid off obviously and with the 3k hit on my original down payment evaporated due to depreciation, I can't imagine a or any dealership having me drive away in a 20k car and handing me, metaphorically, a check for 8k while doing so... having never done this previously, am I to assume the 8k gets rolled into the original price of 20k ~ now taking it down to 12K, is that right?

    A 3k loss is definitely not as bad as expected and I am possibly willing to suck that up and drink it down but what worries me is the gain/loss of getting the 4Runner -be it used or new (well, especially new... don't think that's going to happen and truthfully I probably shouldn't have ever gone the "new" route on either our short-lived 4Runner or current Outback) - because I want to accomplish basically three objectives here with getting a 4Runner:
    1. Keep the down payment as small as possible (I paid out 17,850.00 for the dead Bambi 4Runner down payment -- to get financing at 20K... and I paid 11k on the Outback to get that financed at 20K).
    2. Have a smaller than current monthly payment (now at appx $331'ish/month if memory serves)... which seems very doable given an OTD price of something 28K and down (and more realistically 20K and under~given the value of the Outback along with the $18,xxx still owed to the bank + my Outback down payment).
    3. Get it paid off as soon as possible.

    Sorry for the length of this, hah, I just realized typing all this out is helping me think and see things more clearly.

    Another question for now... any surprises to expect when securing financing on a used car (I believe there is but can't recall -- I did turn 55 years old recently so the memory is not what it once was). How about this for an example: 2014 4Runner, 28k asking price (minus tax, tags, etc), 34k miles... say I get 28k for the Outback and the OTD (hypothetical price) is 20k on the aforementioned 4Runner... what kind of down payment would make my banker smile while saying "yep" and also make me not feel like I am the world's biggest idiot for chasing a 4Runner? If it helps in your guesswork, my credit rating is Prime.

    Thanks for reading all this... I owe you a beer someday!
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  • It's hard to predict the dealer might handle this, since all used cars are different and we don't know how much he has into his 4runner. If he's asking $28K for the 4Runner, he might only have $24K in it, so he might very well pay off your Subaru and do a swap. I doubt he'd offer you money as well--but like I said, it's up to you to demand what YOU want---so you dictate the terms. If the dealer doesn't like it, then he will let you walk out the door.

    You can't negotiate if you can't leave the table and walk out.

    The dealer might also offer you financing on the used 4Runner, but you should shop for money just like you shop for a car--you might find a better interest rate at your credit union or bank. I don't see why any lending institution wouldn't lend you on a clean, low miles 2104 car--the question is at what rate.

    The point is, in a two car deal with a trade, you have to keep a close eye on the numbers.

    I can't really say more until I see the "deal" that's being offered you.

    I'll keep you updated as this moves forward, thanks again.
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  • @Mr_Shiftright ...

    Slight, well not really, big change-up. So I contacted an old friend who is a salesman at the Toyota dealership where we purchased our short-lived and ill-fated 4Runner. I explained everything that was going on. He asked me to run down all the details on our Outback and send him the VIN via text. A bit later he emailed me this (while saying he definitely couldn't and wouldn't be able to locate me an '18 with the same add-ons as last time (he can't find any stock nation-wide)... those add-ons being specifically, just the moonroof)
    So here it is with an attached sales sheet for you to take a look at...
    2019 4Runner
    TRD Offroad Premium
    Nautical Blue w/black SofTex interior
    Moonroof




    Many Questions, Few Answers
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 117,319

    @Mr_Shiftright ...

    Slight, well not really, big change-up. So I contacted an old friend who is a salesman at the Toyota dealership where we purchased our short-lived and ill-fated 4Runner. I explained everything that was going on. He asked me to run down all the details on our Outback and send him the VIN via text. A bit later he emailed me this (while saying he definitely couldn't and wouldn't be able to locate me an '18 with the same add-ons as last time (he can't find any stock nation-wide)... those add-ons being specifically, just the moonroof)
    So here it is with an attached sales sheet for you to take a look at...
    2019 4Runner
    TRD Offroad Premium
    Nautical Blue w/black SofTex interior
    Moonroof




    That's a nice discount, but are you really going to eat $9300?

    I'd learn to love that Outback.

    Take the $9300 and send your smarta-- daughter off to boarding school. ;)

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

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  • thebeanthebean Parts UnknownPosts: 970
    @kyfdx, how do you figure he's eating $9,300? That's just the difference between his "owe" on the Outback versus what's he getting in trade, and it's in his favor. He said he got the Outback for $31K OTD, so he eating around $3K on the deal, which is to be expected. The 4 Runner is around $9K more than the Outback, so maybe that's what you are referring to, but he netted some cash from the total of his first 4 Runner.
    2015 Honda Accord EX, 2017 Honda Civic EX-T
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 117,319
    thebean said:

    @kyfdx, how do you figure he's eating $9,300? That's just the difference between his "owe" on the Outback versus what's he getting in trade, and it's in his favor. He said he got the Outback for $31K OTD, so he eating around $3K on the deal, which is to be expected. The 4 Runner is around $9K more than the Outback, so maybe that's what you are referring to, but he netted some cash from the total of his first 4 Runner.

    Ah.. you are correct.

    I stand by the boarding school advice. ;)

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • thebeanthebean Parts UnknownPosts: 970
    @kyfdx, I apologize for my tone. I think I had too much caffeine that morning. I can be a bit too much when it comes to numbers. ;)
    2015 Honda Accord EX, 2017 Honda Civic EX-T
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 117,319
    thebean said:

    @kyfdx, I apologize for my tone. I think I had too much caffeine that morning. I can be a bit too much when it comes to numbers. ;)

    No tone inferred.. I get the number thing. ;)

    Did you get a good deal? Be sure to come back and share!

    Edmunds Moderator

  • All good here... thanks for everyone replies! Just heard back from the dealership a minute ago -- they secured it and it is en route for tomorrow evening or Sunday pickup, YOOHOO!! Of course this should get VERY interesting when I pack the wife and daughter up into the Outback for a "lets go on a little fall foliage drive" that results in a two hour drive north into South Carolina and straight to the Toyota dealership we went to back in May of this year for the first 4Runner that Bambi killed... and we drive home, sans Outback, in a brand spankin' new 2019 4Runner!!
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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,473
    Glad the planets re-aligned for you. B)

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  • I found this discussion very interesting. I have wondered the same thing. I bought a new 2018 Honda Cr-V EX-L December 2017. Trust me, I did not get a great deal. But I felt the dealership right out lied to me about their HondaLink and it's compatibility with my Apple 6S Plus phone. I spent the last year + being angry with them. I first wondered if I could sue them for fraud, but turned my head toward how much more would I be 'out' by trading it in for a Hyundai Santa Fe. @Angst_Ridden , I applaud your tenacity and your gut feelings. Before this Honda I had a 2003 Tacoma TRD Off road with 165,000 miles of mostly love for my truck. The only problems with the truck was, as I aged, so did my truck. And we both could use a little touching up. But, I had saved $30K back from my husband's life insurance specifically to buy a new vehicle. I just want to say, you are commended by me (not that it means much) for going with your heart! I just bet if your wife would get used to driving a jacked up truck that everyone turns to look at, she would start making you drive her car!
  • Angst_RiddenAngst_Ridden GAPosts: 11

    I found this discussion very interesting. I have wondered the same thing. I bought a new 2018 Honda Cr-V EX-L December 2017. Trust me, I did not get a great deal. But I felt the dealership right out lied to me about their HondaLink and it's compatibility with my Apple 6S Plus phone. I spent the last year + being angry with them. I first wondered if I could sue them for fraud, but turned my head toward how much more would I be 'out' by trading it in for a Hyundai Santa Fe. @Angst_Ridden , I applaud your tenacity and your gut feelings. Before this Honda I had a 2003 Tacoma TRD Off road with 165,000 miles of mostly love for my truck. The only problems with the truck was, as I aged, so did my truck. And we both could use a little touching up. But, I had saved $30K back from my husband's life insurance specifically to buy a new vehicle. I just want to say, you are commended by me (not that it means much) for going with your heart! I just bet if your wife would get used to driving a jacked up truck that everyone turns to look at, she would start making you drive her car!

    Thank you! Update... my wife and daughter LOVE the 4Runner --- and (so far) we have encountered no more deer!! B)
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