DODGE DAKOTA QUAD CAB

gregp5

Thanks for the replies,will call the Bureau again today.

mopar67

.......and that's a crying shame!

silverquad

www.oemparts.com is a great sight for finding all those things dodge continues to leave off your truck, they are way under the dealer price. I ordered the v8 magnum badges for $10.27 a the dealer quote was $16.06.if anyone else knows some great part places please post them sharing this info we won't be forced to go and give dodge any more of our hard earned money. how about weathertech air defectors, these are great no tape they just slide up into your window channel, made in germany.whats the best bug shield out there? still looking for the right look.

bobs5

http://www.macneilauto.com/store/

http://www.weathertech.com/

bobs5

http://jcwhitney.com/productnoitem.jhtml?CATID=58185

macey

Well, my truck is due any day where I must take delivery within 5 days of it being dropped off at the dealer (suspect that to be 5 business days)

Any rumors on what will happen with the $2k rebate on the QCs, after 4/30?

Another dealer in the area thinks they'll continue, but I wonder about that, as all factory orders for the 2001 DAKs have to be in by the 1st week of May, why offer a rebate on a truck you can't order anymore, yet, with DC wanting to move any leftovers, I could possibly see the rebate being extended.

Thanks for looking into your crystal ball...

txqc2000

EGR makes a good bug shield. It fits between the grill and the hood and doesn't require any tape.

mtrialsm

How long does it take to get the Farm rebate
check, going on 7 weeks for me.
In Ga. it cost me $25.00 to join, sounds like
the best investment I've made. Also got the
$2000.00 rebate:)
mick

wantone2

I'm slowly getting my missing parts for my Quad Cab I took delivery on about three weeks ago. My salesman called today and said they had my hood insulation now and I could come and get it installed. I never knew I was buying one of those kits that you have to put together. So far I have no complaints at all on my new Quad except that is really likes gas, or maybe I just notice it more since the prices are going up on gas.

rockymtn4x4

Mick,
My fee was $40 and was handled by the salesman at time of purchase. He had my membership #, and then had the FB fax the appropriate form (he had run out) which he then filled out. The $500 was then deducted from the truck.
Sounds to me your dealer short changed you on this service. I would call the dealer and/or the Farm Bureau and follow up - if you haven't already, 7 weeks is way too long for this to get done IMHO. Good luck.
Rich

stnick

Like Mattel, all parts sold seperatly, some assembly required. Marshall, your gas milage will probably improve with time ,and come on now, admit it, if you have the 4.7 or higher engine, you may be pressing a little harder on that gas pedal to feel that feel and to hear that sound. RIGHT? Stnick

ksatbjh

I was concerned about getting the $2000 rebate also. At the first dealer, I was told that if it expired before the arrival of my truck, I lost it. The second dealer got a funny look on his face and said that Dodge, unlike most manufacturers, will give rebates based upon the date a vin. number is created (short after placing your order). They put it in writing for me.
Apparently, dealers have the choice of passing the rebate along to the customer. I would guess that the first dealer I went to was hoping the rebate would expire so they could pocket the money and tell me that I was too late.
I hope this helps you, and I hope your dealer is treating you fairly.

hogchows

Can any of you tell me where I can go on the web to find a database to search for performance specs for different vehicles? I have a new Quad cab coming, already challenged to a little duel, but I want to know what to expect before I make any bets. Someplace where I can look up quarter mile times, zero to sixty times, etc.
Thanks, and I'll be careful......

zonk

You might try MSN CarPoint home page and click on the review section. I believe it is Robert Heraud (sp)that provides that type of info, if he or his team has tested the vehicle. The info for the '01 Quad cabs are there.

zonk

The address is carpoint.msn.com. And it's Daniel Heraud, not Robert. I am not sure if Edmund's has anything like it. (By the way, the other reviewer choices you will be offered don't usually have that kind of technical data in their reviews.) Sorry for the misinformation. It's Friday, what can I say?

saskquad

The 2001 Quad 4.7 auto is listed at 10+secs. 0-60 but the 2000 Quad 4.7 is listed at 7.7 secs 0-60 . Maybe the 2001 was pulling a trailer at the time ??? %)

apollo3

I am still trying to decide if I should get the 3.92 rear end or the 3.55 . I plan on getting the automatic transmission with the 4.7 liter. Will the rear end affect 0-60 performance? Is it worth getting worse gas mileage? Does anyone have the full time 4WD. I am thinking about getting that also. Any suggestions?

txqc2000

The 3.92 will help you if you plan to tow. Should also reduce the off-the-line times and mpg somewhat, though I'm not sure if it will be that significant. I have a 5.9L with full time 4wd. It has been very good thus far.

macey

Tomorrow at 1pm, I'm picking up my 2001 QC with AWD or full time 4-wheel drive, auto, 3.92, Tire & Handling Sport +, Limited Slip with 4w-ABS (and a bunch of other stuff)

With the T&H package and AWD, I didn't want to loose too much low end torque or that smile from taking off when the light turns green...the 3.92 in my opinion, is a must if you want some good acceleration from a stop or at low speeds, giving up some MPG, but then again, aftermarket mods could even that up again (yah right, those will just make ya want to hit the go-pedal harder and longer!)

apollo3

Macey--Do you know if the AWD transfer case robs power from the engine (if it is not correcting for slippage) or if it is just like having it in 2 wheel drive? By the way your truck sounds great. It is basically what I am thinking about ordering.

macey

DC calls the AWD a Full-time Four-Wheel Drive, they even have a unique brochure on the system.

All 4 wheels are ABLE to recieve torque, I believe the system is 50% to the front and 50% to the rear at all times, not in 2WD until slippage happens.

Torque is given to the front and rear at all times, regardless of road conditions, with the capability to send all the torque to one wheel, if needed (to the experts, is this right?)

I would have to think some power is lost due to AWD and the extra weight of the additional component(s) for the system...hence why I went with the 3.92 for those stop light launches!

I live in a hilly area with a steep driveway, Northeast, snow and all, I wanted the safety and comfort of full time 4WD.

I have a Jeep Wrangler Sahara, 4WD, short wheel base, and when the road conditions are just short of mandating 4WD, when that sucker is in 2WD (aka RWD), it can get a bit tricky on slick roads, even just with rain.

I had a 1996 Outback, to date, probably my favorite car ever...looking for this new DAK QC (everything but leather and tow package) to be numebr 1!!!

danoh

rebates extended until july !!!!!!

mtrialsm

I called my dealer to check on Farm Bureau rebate,
(it had been 8 weeks), dealer said they had it
and sent me a $500.00 check. So I received the
rebate, 8 weeks. Thought Farm Bureau would send
it to me, but at least I got it. I wonder how long
the dealer would have held on to the money until
I called?

bookitty

Forever and ever.

Bookitty

bobs5

http://www.speedtweaks.net/bedrug_group_buy.htm

crawly16

Well, I finally reached 3000 miles on my Dakota
I have an appointment with the dealer for my first oil change. I am not really sure want kind of oil I should put in it. I talk to the guy in the service department and he said that synthetics like mobil 1 are not really good. I am not really good with cars or trucks, but I definitely want the best for my Dakota. can you guys give me some good advice on the matter? what kind of oil should I put in the truck?
thanks for your help

namfflow

Any good quality oil that meets the requirements as stated in your owners manual is good.

As to Mobile 1, the users manual considers synthetic oils acceptable. In reality synthetic oils were developed for hi temperature and hard use. They lubricate very well and do not break down at high temperatures.

I for one am a cheapskate. For many years I used Quaker State 10 W 30 and Fram filters without any problems. I have given the subject a lot of thought and I will be trying Mobile 1 in my 01 Dakota when it is ready for its first change and switching to Mobile 1 in my 97 at the next oil change. I also now use Puralator Pure One filters. I feel the synthetic is worth spending a few dollars more. It is still cheap insurance in my book.

txqc2000

I use Mobil 1 synthetic. I love it. The engine felt immediately smoother after I made the switch. In fact, the sales manager is the one that recommended I make the change ASAP and to add synthetic oil to the differential etc. whenever they are due for a change. Just my $0.02.

ethuresson

Fully synthetic oil is definately superior to dino oil. Drain intervals can also be safely extended. The lubrication and flow properties of synthetic are better by far. If the guy in your service department actually said synthetics are not good, run screaming from there now 'cause he's a fool and he might touch your truck. This is only my opinion, but I've read ALOT about synthetic vs petro based and not once have I seen anyone state synthetics aren't superior. Not once.
Caveat is: Rings need to seat fully by running petro oil for a few thousand miles before the switch to synthetic, or you could develop blow-by and oil leakage. my switch will occur at about 8000mi, but 3000 might be alright. That figure is where the opinions get mixed sometimes.

Anyway, that guy is wrong.

mtrialsm

I'll be putting AmsOil in my '01 Quad first oil
change. It should help gas mileage a little, but
the main reason is protection. I'll also be using
a better oil filter than Fram,...
My truck is 2wd, but for you 4x4 guys, if you go
synthetic in your engine, trans, and diffs. I bet
you'll have improved gas mileage. I'm not pushing
AmsOil, any synthetic is better than petro-oil!

dward4

I have a 2000 QC SLT 4x4, 5.9 Auto with 20,000 miles on it. I love this truck. Has anyone out there had any experience with an annoying "click" sound coming from within the dash when the air-conditioning or defrost is being used? The "click" is emitted approximately every 10 seconds.

dward4

txqc2000

I've got the same type of QC ('00 4x4 SLT+ with 5.9L engine). I haven't noticed this condition, though I only have around 7k miles. Does the sound occur in both a/c settings (ie. recirculating and regular)?

kramerkrause

I went to the Dodge dealership today looking to upgrade the wheels on my yet to be delivered QC SLT with RT wheels (4x2, 4.7, 5spd, LSD, T&H, HD service, yada, yada, yada). Anywhay, the parts man asked me if I wanted the 'factory' RT wheels or the ones in the accessary catalog? The 'factory' ones cost about 500 ea while the catalog ones run 640/set. He had no clue why there where two different wheels at two rather different prices. Anyway, I'm looking to swap out at least the tires if not both for something a little more performance oriented. Anyone with some insight on a good set of tires and/or wheels to replace the Goodyear Eagle LS's that come with the tire and handling pkg.

bpeebles

You are mis informed. The "full time 4WD" system on the Dakota is simply an open differential in the xfer case. There is no "power split" or other fancy-dancy stuff. It is essentially ONE WHEEL DRIVE... if any one of the wheels looses traction, all of the torque will go to that wheel and you are stuck.

Informed people will NOT pay extra for this "full time 4WD" system that offers LESS traction and faster tire wear than the "shift on the fly" system.

txqc2000

According to a Car & Driver article I read, the Durango AWD system, which is the same as in our vehicles, does constantly split torque between the front and rear -- something like a fixed 40%F/60%R. It certainly isn't the fancier type you find on some Japanese or German vehicles that can apportion the torque between the front, rear, left and right wheels, depending on traction conditions and requirements, or even the QuadraTrac system on the Grand Cherokee which can lock all 3 differentials (front, center, rear). So bpeebles is correct that if the front driving tire on the Quad AWD system loses traction, the torque will not shift to the other front wheel with the traction (no locking front diff, etc.). The system will also not shift more torque to the rear if both front tires are off the ground. However, the "anti-spin" differential should help if the driving rear wheel loses traction and begins to spin.

Having said all of this, the AWD system can be shifted into the same 4WD mode as the part-time system ie. center differential locked. So I'm not sure how this system would yield less traction than the part-time system would in this mode. AWD does wear your tires out faster, but under wet conditions (rain or snow), I like the added traction the AWD provides without having to worry about whether conditions are slippery enough to keep the drivetrain from binding when I'm going around a sharp corner or parking.

Lastly, having said all of this, I still struggle with whether I should have gone with part-time 4WD or AWD. When the weather conditions are poor, I'm glad I have AWD. When they are bright, hot and sunny, I wish I had the part-time system so that more torque would be directed to the rear wheels in 2wd mode when I'm hammering the gas pedal. I'd also be getting a little better gas mileage as well (but for hammering the gas pedal, of course).

macey

Your gonna have to explain to me how AWD offers less traction then being in 2WD?

Actually, isn't 2WD a misnomer, isn't part time 4WD and 2WD DAKs really single RWD (without limited slip)? If so, you can't tell me this is better than AWD!

I still have the capability of going into 4HI or 4LO (I'm assuming you are informed that the AWD system has this capability). Plus with limited slip, IMHO, AWD is a win win situation over part time 4WD and 2WD.

Open differential or not, doesn't this AWD system still have the ability to give torque to all 4 wheels? And if just one wheel has no traction, how do I loose out by giving that wheel all the torque?

My driving is gonna be limited off-roading, not mud bogging (it it was, I would have kept my '98 JEEP Sahara).

I don't mind increased tire wear for the sense of safety, traction, and handling in AWD -vs- 2WD in
all road/weather conditions, and do feel more secure on the road in rain and slick conditions that would ruin your drivetrain if those condtions don't warrant going into part time 4WD.

Since I'm on a rant on why I prefer AWD over the part time 4WD system and 2WD, thoughts on which hooks up better doing the 1/4 mile at the track?

macey

Just so we're on the same page here, I'm under the impression that with the AWD system, torque is split between the Front and Rear at all times, if I'm wrong, please point me to some reading matterial to debunk my thinking and enlighten me!

Also, I in no way say AWD is superior over 4WD HI and when I'm off-roading, I will always use 4WD HI. (as we all know it is better to be in 4WD than get stuck in 2WD and go into 4WD to get un-stuck)

However, I am saying IMHO that AWD is far superior over 2WD in any road condition, and with still having the capability of using part time 4WD, the AWD system was my choice of drivetrain, regardless of increased tire wear and less MPG. I feel comfortable paying out on this for the feeling of extra safety and driveability...especially when hauling the family.

Sorry for the rant again, I must still be detoxing from the two 'full time AWD' Subarus we recently owned...note to self: don't take a AWD vehicle onto the beach, yikes!

bpeebles

Let me be specific. This is NOT my humble opinion... this is FACT! I am not surmising or guessing... I have driven in snow since I learned to drive. I have ALWAYS owned a 4wd vehicle and KNOW the differences between the various designs.
I am not a salesman trying to market some gizmo that is less capable than the competetion like the suberu or Jeep quadratrack.

The NV242 xfer case available in the Dakota / Durango (Euphemistically called AWD) is ONE WHEEL DRIVE. The torque goes to the one wheel that is spinning the fastest.

In the snow, going around a corner, this will be the outside-front tire. This also happens to be the tire that is grasping for traction because it is doing the most work during a turn. An easy tap on the throttle and this tire will begin to throw snow up higher than the hood. The other tires are getting very little torque to speak of under this condition. Your vehicle is sliding sideways twards the gaurdrail at this point. Adding LSD to the rear axle actually makes this situation WORSE because one FRONT tire will ALWAYS have less traction than BOTH rear tires.

This AWD system may be great for soccer-moms that do not want to be shifting in to 4WD.(And perhaps would forget to take it out of 4wd) But My wife prefers the viscus-coupling systems that are TRULY AWD.

Now... lets discuss what REAL 4WD offers us.
There is ALWAYS torque to the front and the rear axles making this actually 2 wheel drive. Adding LSD to the rear axle makes this essentially 3 wheel drive.... MUCH BETTER THAN the NV242 xfer case in the full-time setting.

What other drawbacks does an open diff in the xfer case provide for our extra $$?

The tire-wear is FAR greater than with 2WD. Those big tires are expensive too.

Overall drivetrain wear is exaggerated because ALL of those axles, bearings, gears...etc are churning EVERY SINGLE MILE YOU DRIVE. (Have you ever had to replace 4WD drivetrain parts? I hope you have some extra $$$)

All of this churning steel reduces MPG and makes more noise too. (Who likes to pump gas?)

macey

Interesting reading on the TC. Me thinks we're getting into a debate
of AWD -vs- 4WD HI...not the case for me, I'm ranting on about the benefits of AWD -vs- 2WD....read on:

Would you still prefer 2WD (really 1 wheel RWD with out limited slip) over AWD on slick road conditions where it is not sloppy enough to use 4WD HI without damaging your drivetrain?

Soccer mom...geez, that's funny, how about ballet dad?

I've been drving the 10 past years with various AWD and 4WD systems and from my JEEP Sahara experience, that vehicle was scary as hell in certain road conditions that still mandated not using 4WD HI less I screw up the drivetrain...I still prefer the DAKs AWD over 2WD in those kind of road conditions! When it gets nasty enough, I know to use 4WD HI or just stay home (I'm confident in my driving abilites, not too sure about others on the road).

Thoughts on wear and tear above and beyond normal 2WD wear and tear on the drivetrain, within 3 years (about the average on how long I keep my vehicles, fits in nice with the standard warranty)

Thanks.

antony

I've had 3 Jeeps with the NV242 xfer case and I find the Full-Time 4WD position to be quite useful as long as you
understand its limitations. It gave me much better handling
and traction on wet roads and intermittently snow-covered
roads. However, if you use it in deep snow/very-low traction
conditions you will get stuck just like bpeeples says. You've
got to know enough about it to know when to switch to the
Par-Time (locked diff) 4WD. Unfortunately, the drivers' manual
never explains this.

macey

Actually, my documents for my 2001 DAK QC say I have the NV244HD Electronic Full Time Transfer Case.

How much different is this -vs- the NV242 TC?

FWIW, I know the limitations of AWD and 4WD HI and LO based on 10 years of various driving experiences...I'm still a firm believer of AWD over 2WD and 4WD HI over AWD, and knowing when and where to use each mode. I do admit I'm learning more about our AWD system -vs- others I've owned in the past.

I do (now) indeed feel informed enough to have purchased this
system and pay extra for it as I know the differences between 2WD, AWD, and 4WD...all of us 4WD DAK owners have the same "shift on the fly" system, except when some are in 2WD, others are in the superior AWD mode for those not slick enough road condtions to shift to 4WD HI. (and shame on me if I get stuck and should have been in 4WD HI)

bpeebles, I still need you to explain to me how the NV244HD offers LESS traction than the NV233HD "shift on the fly" system...you're not saying when in 4WD HI with this system, it is inferior to 4WD HI of the NV233HD system?

Thanks...

dward4

TXQC2000 -- The "click" is present anytime the air conditioning or defrost is on (re-circulating or not). The system seems to work fine, the sound is quite annoying.

dward4

bpeebles

(macey) I refuse to call the open diff in the xfer case AWD.

I cannot tell anyone what is "better" for them. My technical nature (see my profile) compells me to explain this in real-world terms. I apologise if I ruffle anyones feathers.

You are correct that 4wd HI is the same on both xfer cases. The discussion here seems to be preference of the NON-4WD setting. On one xfer case this is simply Rear Wheel Drive (RWD).... on the other it is an OPEN differential in the xfer case or Full Time 4WD (FT4WD).

The other option in the mix is Limited Slip Differential(LSD).

Lets look at the combonations

WITHOUT LSD;
RWD
Either Rear tire can slip to be "stuck"
FT4WD
ANY tire can slip to be stuck

It is far more likely that one of 4 tires may have less traction than one of 2 tires... Thus the RWD seems "BETTER" from a purley traction standpoint.

WITH LSD;
RWD
Both Rear tires MUST slip to be "stuck"
FT4WD
One front tire will ALWAYS have less traction than BOTH rear tires together thus one front tire will ALWAYS loose traction first.

Again, the RWD seems to be better for traction because there are 2 tires providing torque to the ground.

I cannot stress strong enough that a FT4WD system is indeed inferior to the standard RWD. As my original append says FT4WD is only ONE WHEEL DRIVE.

I even know people with the FT4WD system that routenly REMOVE THE FRONT DRIVESHAFT and lock the xfer case into 4WD during the summer. This provides them with RWD, saves on tire wear, eliminates all of the churning, increases MPG...etc.

My WIFE even removed the front driveshaft on one of my FT4WD systems so she could go grocerey shopping. (The front driveshaft had become so warn that it broke one time and was in danger of breaking again)

bpeebles

Are you saying that this "click" is occasional... perhaps every few minutes. If so, this is just the AC compressor clutch kicking on and off. ALL cars with AC have one of these clutches that kicks in and out.

I agree that some are louder than others.

macey

Hey bpeebles, how ya doing?

Is the NV244HD the same as the NV242 you mentioned, and work exactly the same?

Assuming it is, I look at it different than you do, where you talk about being stuck or loss of traction, I look at it as having the ability to give torque to all 4 wheels or the one wheel that is stuck (this is correct, right, as you don't even hint that traction can be re-gained)

If indeed all 4 wheels or 1 wheel could loose traction, you do admit that all 4 or that one wheel still can regain traction as more (if not all) torque is applied to it, yes? I mean only in the worst of condtions would more torque or all torque not free you up (thats what 4WD is for)

You say stuck/loose traction, I say give it more torque to regain traction...and I'll be real, I'm talking in conditions that don't warrant 4WD HI

Thanks for your input.

Paul (still a happy AWD owner)!

antony

As I said before, I have owned 3 Jeeps with the NV242 xfer
case, and liked having a "Full-Time" position. However, the
Jeeps had 4 Total xfer case positions: 4-High Full-Time,
4-High Part-Time, 4-Lo Part-Time, PLUS a RWD position.
Therefore, one COULD be in RWD most of the time. I can't
imagine why the Dakota/Durango NV242/NV244HD leaves
the RWD position OUT! I'm just guessing, but possibly the
"NV244HD" nomenclature is the electronic-switch-on-the-
instrument-panel version of the lever-actuated NV242.

bpeebles

(antony) This has been discussed previously in other Dakota forums... the consensus is that the JEEP xfer case that includes a RWD setting IS NOT THE SAME XFER CASE as the one offered in the Dakota. (how can it possibly be the same one if it has different lever settings?)

In general, the JEEP 4WD systems are superiouer to virtually all others. (this is what JEEP is known for)

For this discussion, it may not be fair to compare JEEP to the Dakota.

bpeebles

Lets think about this.... How is it possible to send more torque to a wheel that has no tracton?

If we apply some high school physics, we can see that the wheel would only spin faster. The sum of the torque would remain almost constant. The faster a wheel spins... the LESS traction is has. (again... high school physics.... static -vs- dynamic friction)

The bottom line is... One can only provide torque to a wheel that has HIGH traction.

The reason I "don't even hint that traction can be re-gained" is because I am doing simple calculations with as many constats as possible. Assume (for these discussions) that one wheel is off of the ground (zero traction). The question is then... Can the other wheels that are still touching the ground be provided enough torque to move the vehicle. With the FT4WD system that has an open differential in the xfer case... the answer is a resounding NO!

This is why I keep saying that an OPEN DIFFERENTIAL in the xfer case is very poor design for a 4WD system. An open differential always sends the torque to the point of LEAST resistance.
(LEAST resistance means lowest possible traction)

For maximum traction, one wants to send torque to the point of MOST resistance because this is where the traction is.

Is this starting to make sense yet?

Once one understands the physics behind this stuff, can can truly appreceate the suberu (sp?) system that sends power (torque) to the the wheel that grips (has traction).

Did you know that the JEEP quadratrac system is the ONLY one that can move the vehicle with one front AND one rear wheel off of the ground? (think 2 tires on ICE!!)

macey

Never touched the stuff...got out of taking physics, chemistry, geometry, etc, by filling up on business and computer courses (over 1000 hours alone in Data Processing)

Thanks for the engineering aspect of the NV244HD.

Do you have real world experience with the NV244HD?

Does anyone here with the AWD NV244HD TC swear at it or swear by it? Have you gotten stuck where you think you wouldn't with 2WD?

I find it hard to believe DC will market a AWD system where if one tires slips on a rain soaked road, all the torque in the world will not have it regain traction...I mean this is what you are saying, right?

Also I agree with you, the Subaru system rocks!

Thanks

txqc2000

As I'm on the road right now, I don't have too much time to jump into this debate. But like bpeebles, I've driven 4wd systems in the snow since I was 15 (driving with permit and licensed "adult"). Suffice it to say, that's been two decades. This is my 1st experience with 4wd/AWD in a Dodge. Previously, I've had Subaru's, GMC's, Mitsubishi Montero, Ford Explorer's, and possibly a few other vehicles with 4wd that I'm forgetting. All I will say about the AWD system in the QC is this -- torque is applied to both the front and rear wheels at the same time -- which is obvious when one drives in the snow and rain -- as you can feel the front wheel pulling AND the rear wheel driving the vehicle. Try going around a corner in the snow and gunning the engine -- you'll feel the front pulling and the rear end will come around quickly like you'd expect a RWD to do (actually, you can always feel the front tires pulling when you floor it around the corner -- and the rear wheels will "chirp" as well). How this comports with the different drivetrain denominations is for ya'll to sort out. Also, I noticed the "anti-spin" differential works very well in the snow.

With respect to locking the transfer case during the summer, I'm considering doing that as well -- not so much for gas mileage as for performance during the dry months.

Now, I have a completely different question for bpeebles -- how did you get some of your words to highlight in red? That was pretty neat. Also, my thanks for livening up this particular board which always seems to get neglected as compared with the QC owners board.

Have a good holiday everyone.