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DODGE DAKOTA QUAD CAB
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Comments
http://www.weathertech.com/
Any rumors on what will happen with the $2k rebate on the QCs, after 4/30?
Another dealer in the area thinks they'll continue, but I wonder about that, as all factory orders for the 2001 DAKs have to be in by the 1st week of May, why offer a rebate on a truck you can't order anymore, yet, with DC wanting to move any leftovers, I could possibly see the rebate being extended.
Thanks for looking into your crystal ball...
check, going on 7 weeks for me.
In Ga. it cost me $25.00 to join, sounds like
the best investment I've made. Also got the
$2000.00 rebate:)
mick
My fee was $40 and was handled by the salesman at time of purchase. He had my membership #, and then had the FB fax the appropriate form (he had run out) which he then filled out. The $500 was then deducted from the truck.
Sounds to me your dealer short changed you on this service. I would call the dealer and/or the Farm Bureau and follow up - if you haven't already, 7 weeks is way too long for this to get done IMHO. Good luck.
Rich
Apparently, dealers have the choice of passing the rebate along to the customer. I would guess that the first dealer I went to was hoping the rebate would expire so they could pocket the money and tell me that I was too late.
I hope this helps you, and I hope your dealer is treating you fairly.
Thanks, and I'll be careful......
With the T&H package and AWD, I didn't want to loose too much low end torque or that smile from taking off when the light turns green...the 3.92 in my opinion, is a must if you want some good acceleration from a stop or at low speeds, giving up some MPG, but then again, aftermarket mods could even that up again (yah right, those will just make ya want to hit the go-pedal harder and longer!)
All 4 wheels are ABLE to recieve torque, I believe the system is 50% to the front and 50% to the rear at all times, not in 2WD until slippage happens.
Torque is given to the front and rear at all times, regardless of road conditions, with the capability to send all the torque to one wheel, if needed (to the experts, is this right?)
I would have to think some power is lost due to AWD and the extra weight of the additional component(s) for the system...hence why I went with the 3.92 for those stop light launches!
I live in a hilly area with a steep driveway, Northeast, snow and all, I wanted the safety and comfort of full time 4WD.
I have a Jeep Wrangler Sahara, 4WD, short wheel base, and when the road conditions are just short of mandating 4WD, when that sucker is in 2WD (aka RWD), it can get a bit tricky on slick roads, even just with rain.
I had a 1996 Outback, to date, probably my favorite car ever...looking for this new DAK QC (everything but leather and tow package) to be numebr 1!!!
(it had been 8 weeks), dealer said they had it
and sent me a $500.00 check. So I received the
rebate, 8 weeks. Thought Farm Bureau would send
it to me, but at least I got it. I wonder how long
the dealer would have held on to the money until
I called?
Bookitty
I have an appointment with the dealer for my first oil change. I am not really sure want kind of oil I should put in it. I talk to the guy in the service department and he said that synthetics like mobil 1 are not really good. I am not really good with cars or trucks, but I definitely want the best for my Dakota. can you guys give me some good advice on the matter? what kind of oil should I put in the truck?
thanks for your help
As to Mobile 1, the users manual considers synthetic oils acceptable. In reality synthetic oils were developed for hi temperature and hard use. They lubricate very well and do not break down at high temperatures.
I for one am a cheapskate. For many years I used Quaker State 10 W 30 and Fram filters without any problems. I have given the subject a lot of thought and I will be trying Mobile 1 in my 01 Dakota when it is ready for its first change and switching to Mobile 1 in my 97 at the next oil change. I also now use Puralator Pure One filters. I feel the synthetic is worth spending a few dollars more. It is still cheap insurance in my book.
Caveat is: Rings need to seat fully by running petro oil for a few thousand miles before the switch to synthetic, or you could develop blow-by and oil leakage. my switch will occur at about 8000mi, but 3000 might be alright. That figure is where the opinions get mixed sometimes.
Anyway, that guy is wrong.
change. It should help gas mileage a little, but
the main reason is protection. I'll also be using
a better oil filter than Fram,...
My truck is 2wd, but for you 4x4 guys, if you go
synthetic in your engine, trans, and diffs. I bet
you'll have improved gas mileage. I'm not pushing
AmsOil, any synthetic is better than petro-oil!
dward4
You are mis informed. The "full time 4WD" system on the Dakota is simply an open differential in the xfer case. There is no "power split" or other fancy-dancy stuff. It is essentially ONE WHEEL DRIVE... if any one of the wheels looses traction, all of the torque will go to that wheel and you are stuck.
Informed people will NOT pay extra for this "full time 4WD" system that offers LESS traction and faster tire wear than the "shift on the fly" system.
Having said all of this, the AWD system can be shifted into the same 4WD mode as the part-time system ie. center differential locked. So I'm not sure how this system would yield less traction than the part-time system would in this mode. AWD does wear your tires out faster, but under wet conditions (rain or snow), I like the added traction the AWD provides without having to worry about whether conditions are slippery enough to keep the drivetrain from binding when I'm going around a sharp corner or parking.
Lastly, having said all of this, I still struggle with whether I should have gone with part-time 4WD or AWD. When the weather conditions are poor, I'm glad I have AWD. When they are bright, hot and sunny, I wish I had the part-time system so that more torque would be directed to the rear wheels in 2wd mode when I'm hammering the gas pedal. I'd also be getting a little better gas mileage as well (but for hammering the gas pedal, of course).
Actually, isn't 2WD a misnomer, isn't part time 4WD and 2WD DAKs really single RWD (without limited slip)? If so, you can't tell me this is better than AWD!
I still have the capability of going into 4HI or 4LO (I'm assuming you are informed that the AWD system has this capability). Plus with limited slip, IMHO, AWD is a win win situation over part time 4WD and 2WD.
Open differential or not, doesn't this AWD system still have the ability to give torque to all 4 wheels? And if just one wheel has no traction, how do I loose out by giving that wheel all the torque?
My driving is gonna be limited off-roading, not mud bogging (it it was, I would have kept my '98 JEEP Sahara).
I don't mind increased tire wear for the sense of safety, traction, and handling in AWD -vs- 2WD in
all road/weather conditions, and do feel more secure on the road in rain and slick conditions that would ruin your drivetrain if those condtions don't warrant going into part time 4WD.
Since I'm on a rant on why I prefer AWD over the part time 4WD system and 2WD, thoughts on which hooks up better doing the 1/4 mile at the track?
Also, I in no way say AWD is superior over 4WD HI and when I'm off-roading, I will always use 4WD HI. (as we all know it is better to be in 4WD than get stuck in 2WD and go into 4WD to get un-stuck)
However, I am saying IMHO that AWD is far superior over 2WD in any road condition, and with still having the capability of using part time 4WD, the AWD system was my choice of drivetrain, regardless of increased tire wear and less MPG. I feel comfortable paying out on this for the feeling of extra safety and driveability...especially when hauling the family.
Sorry for the rant again, I must still be detoxing from the two 'full time AWD' Subarus we recently owned...note to self: don't take a AWD vehicle onto the beach, yikes!
I am not a salesman trying to market some gizmo that is less capable than the competetion like the suberu or Jeep quadratrack.
The NV242 xfer case available in the Dakota / Durango (Euphemistically called AWD) is ONE WHEEL DRIVE. The torque goes to the one wheel that is spinning the fastest.
In the snow, going around a corner, this will be the outside-front tire. This also happens to be the tire that is grasping for traction because it is doing the most work during a turn. An easy tap on the throttle and this tire will begin to throw snow up higher than the hood. The other tires are getting very little torque to speak of under this condition. Your vehicle is sliding sideways twards the gaurdrail at this point. Adding LSD to the rear axle actually makes this situation WORSE because one FRONT tire will ALWAYS have less traction than BOTH rear tires.
This AWD system may be great for soccer-moms that do not want to be shifting in to 4WD.(And perhaps would forget to take it out of 4wd) But My wife prefers the viscus-coupling systems that are TRULY AWD.
Now... lets discuss what REAL 4WD offers us.
There is ALWAYS torque to the front and the rear axles making this actually 2 wheel drive. Adding LSD to the rear axle makes this essentially 3 wheel drive.... MUCH BETTER THAN the NV242 xfer case in the full-time setting.
What other drawbacks does an open diff in the xfer case provide for our extra $$?
The tire-wear is FAR greater than with 2WD. Those big tires are expensive too.
Overall drivetrain wear is exaggerated because ALL of those axles, bearings, gears...etc are churning EVERY SINGLE MILE YOU DRIVE. (Have you ever had to replace 4WD drivetrain parts? I hope you have some extra $$$)
All of this churning steel reduces MPG and makes more noise too. (Who likes to pump gas?)
of AWD -vs- 4WD HI...not the case for me, I'm ranting on about the benefits of AWD -vs- 2WD....read on:
Would you still prefer 2WD (really 1 wheel RWD with out limited slip) over AWD on slick road conditions where it is not sloppy enough to use 4WD HI without damaging your drivetrain?
Soccer mom...geez, that's funny, how about ballet dad?
I've been drving the 10 past years with various AWD and 4WD systems and from my JEEP Sahara experience, that vehicle was scary as hell in certain road conditions that still mandated not using 4WD HI less I screw up the drivetrain...I still prefer the DAKs AWD over 2WD in those kind of road conditions! When it gets nasty enough, I know to use 4WD HI or just stay home (I'm confident in my driving abilites, not too sure about others on the road).
Thoughts on wear and tear above and beyond normal 2WD wear and tear on the drivetrain, within 3 years (about the average on how long I keep my vehicles, fits in nice with the standard warranty)
Thanks.
understand its limitations. It gave me much better handling
and traction on wet roads and intermittently snow-covered
roads. However, if you use it in deep snow/very-low traction
conditions you will get stuck just like bpeeples says. You've
got to know enough about it to know when to switch to the
Par-Time (locked diff) 4WD. Unfortunately, the drivers' manual
never explains this.
How much different is this -vs- the NV242 TC?
FWIW, I know the limitations of AWD and 4WD HI and LO based on 10 years of various driving experiences...I'm still a firm believer of AWD over 2WD and 4WD HI over AWD, and knowing when and where to use each mode. I do admit I'm learning more about our AWD system -vs- others I've owned in the past.
I do (now) indeed feel informed enough to have purchased this
system and pay extra for it as I know the differences between 2WD, AWD, and 4WD...all of us 4WD DAK owners have the same "shift on the fly" system, except when some are in 2WD, others are in the superior AWD mode for those not slick enough road condtions to shift to 4WD HI. (and shame on me if I get stuck and should have been in 4WD HI)
bpeebles, I still need you to explain to me how the NV244HD offers LESS traction than the NV233HD "shift on the fly" system...you're not saying when in 4WD HI with this system, it is inferior to 4WD HI of the NV233HD system?
Thanks...
dward4
I cannot tell anyone what is "better" for them. My technical nature (see my profile) compells me to explain this in real-world terms. I apologise if I ruffle anyones feathers.
You are correct that 4wd HI is the same on both xfer cases. The discussion here seems to be preference of the NON-4WD setting. On one xfer case this is simply Rear Wheel Drive (RWD).... on the other it is an OPEN differential in the xfer case or Full Time 4WD (FT4WD).
The other option in the mix is Limited Slip Differential(LSD).
Lets look at the combonations
WITHOUT LSD;
RWD
Either Rear tire can slip to be "stuck"
FT4WD
ANY tire can slip to be stuck
It is far more likely that one of 4 tires may have less traction than one of 2 tires... Thus the RWD seems "BETTER" from a purley traction standpoint.
WITH LSD;
RWD
Both Rear tires MUST slip to be "stuck"
FT4WD
One front tire will ALWAYS have less traction than BOTH rear tires together thus one front tire will ALWAYS loose traction first.
Again, the RWD seems to be better for traction because there are 2 tires providing torque to the ground.
I cannot stress strong enough that a FT4WD system is indeed inferior to the standard RWD. As my original append says FT4WD is only ONE WHEEL DRIVE.
I even know people with the FT4WD system that routenly REMOVE THE FRONT DRIVESHAFT and lock the xfer case into 4WD during the summer. This provides them with RWD, saves on tire wear, eliminates all of the churning, increases MPG...etc.
My WIFE even removed the front driveshaft on one of my FT4WD systems so she could go grocerey shopping. (The front driveshaft had become so warn that it broke one time and was in danger of breaking again)
I agree that some are louder than others.
Is the NV244HD the same as the NV242 you mentioned, and work exactly the same?
Assuming it is, I look at it different than you do, where you talk about being stuck or loss of traction, I look at it as having the ability to give torque to all 4 wheels or the one wheel that is stuck (this is correct, right, as you don't even hint that traction can be re-gained)
If indeed all 4 wheels or 1 wheel could loose traction, you do admit that all 4 or that one wheel still can regain traction as more (if not all) torque is applied to it, yes? I mean only in the worst of condtions would more torque or all torque not free you up (thats what 4WD is for)
You say stuck/loose traction, I say give it more torque to regain traction...and I'll be real, I'm talking in conditions that don't warrant 4WD HI
Thanks for your input.
Paul (still a happy AWD owner)!
case, and liked having a "Full-Time" position. However, the
Jeeps had 4 Total xfer case positions: 4-High Full-Time,
4-High Part-Time, 4-Lo Part-Time, PLUS a RWD position.
Therefore, one COULD be in RWD most of the time. I can't
imagine why the Dakota/Durango NV242/NV244HD leaves
the RWD position OUT! I'm just guessing, but possibly the
"NV244HD" nomenclature is the electronic-switch-on-the-
instrument-panel version of the lever-actuated NV242.
In general, the JEEP 4WD systems are superiouer to virtually all others. (this is what JEEP is known for)
For this discussion, it may not be fair to compare JEEP to the Dakota.
If we apply some high school physics, we can see that the wheel would only spin faster. The sum of the torque would remain almost constant. The faster a wheel spins... the LESS traction is has. (again... high school physics.... static -vs- dynamic friction)
The bottom line is... One can only provide torque to a wheel that has HIGH traction.
The reason I "don't even hint that traction can be re-gained" is because I am doing simple calculations with as many constats as possible. Assume (for these discussions) that one wheel is off of the ground (zero traction). The question is then... Can the other wheels that are still touching the ground be provided enough torque to move the vehicle. With the FT4WD system that has an open differential in the xfer case... the answer is a resounding NO!
This is why I keep saying that an OPEN DIFFERENTIAL in the xfer case is very poor design for a 4WD system. An open differential always sends the torque to the point of LEAST resistance.
(LEAST resistance means lowest possible traction)
For maximum traction, one wants to send torque to the point of MOST resistance because this is where the traction is.
Is this starting to make sense yet?
Once one understands the physics behind this stuff, can can truly appreceate the suberu (sp?) system that sends power (torque) to the the wheel that grips (has traction).
Did you know that the JEEP quadratrac system is the ONLY one that can move the vehicle with one front AND one rear wheel off of the ground? (think 2 tires on ICE!!)
Thanks for the engineering aspect of the NV244HD.
Do you have real world experience with the NV244HD?
Does anyone here with the AWD NV244HD TC swear at it or swear by it? Have you gotten stuck where you think you wouldn't with 2WD?
I find it hard to believe DC will market a AWD system where if one tires slips on a rain soaked road, all the torque in the world will not have it regain traction...I mean this is what you are saying, right?
Also I agree with you, the Subaru system rocks!
Thanks
With respect to locking the transfer case during the summer, I'm considering doing that as well -- not so much for gas mileage as for performance during the dry months.
Now, I have a completely different question for bpeebles -- how did you get some of your words to highlight in red? That was pretty neat. Also, my thanks for livening up this particular board which always seems to get neglected as compared with the QC owners board.
Have a good holiday everyone.