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btw tag, is the 135i really a sharp handler? I've heard some people starting to compare it with the old M3. Sounds great.
Louiswei, I'm surprised the IS turned into a chick car over there in Cali. They definitely dont sell that well around here...
The wife agreed to the game plan going into this new situation: she would learn to drive; the Rabbit would eventually become hers; I would get a BMW 3 Series Coupe, which would be exclusively mine.
In addition to the points you state, the steering wheel is quite BMW-like-perfect thickness and feel.
As I stated, there are significant signs that VW has finally turned the corner on reliability. CR gave the 2008 Rabbit "better than average" recently.
I won't be discussing this vehicle here anymore. Not the place for it.
As I mentioned, the XLR thing is irrational. The biggest problem, imo, with the car is/was the price. Had they priced it more in line with the Lexus SC 430, it might have fared better. But there is certainly an arrogance about Cadillac pricing, the first time I saw 1G CTS with a sticker of $40k and then sat in and took in that most wretched of interiors, I knew that I would never consider one. The exterior was nothing I wanted to look at continually, either. But, hey, Caddy sold 'em and hopefully began the resurrection of a Marque that at least for a time stood for something (vs. we sell rebagded Chevys!).
I've never driven an XLR, but from what I've read, it's not that bad a ride. But for $78+k, it's that bad a value. Interior is typical GM, not so good. I believe that it was intended to be a softer, more luxurious Corvette. If the Car Fairy was to say you may choose either an SC430 or XLR, I'd take the cash... But, if that wasn't an option, probably the XLR (as long as the Fairy allowed me to drive 'em first.). Of course, I'd most likely then go trade either one for a Jag...!
Ah, your Jag. Poised outside you Country Club (or gated community) under the old Red, White and Blue. Way to dangle a bone at this starving dog...
Actually, prior to the irrational XLR desire (and I always try to enjoy at least one irrational desire), was the lust for the prior-gen XK8. A beautiful, timeless design. Probably even more British, especially the mondo-wood dash, than the current Callum beauty. Maybe in '09 I'll find a great deal on an '08. Currently, there is very, very little inventory of XKs, esp. the Coupe, in my neighborhood. Tata transition? Cranking out XFs?
Luckily, my '05 TL still looks rather new. Thanks to my TLC (TL Care?) and, of course, wait for it... Zaino!
'21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)
I love VWs and will consider an upcoming VW UP! for downtown mobility assuming it does get very frugal mileage .
But I will still be keeping my BMW 335i for many many years until such cars like my 335i become as nostalgic as those 1960s muscle cars (with the way things are going at the gas pump that may be a year or two away). BMW engineers are like alchemists who are able to magically combine all the following ingredients to make a close to perfect car: grip, fun, handling, speed, precision and agilitiy There is no way whatsoever that a hybrid or Electrical Vehicle can combine all those attributes in one vehicle.
After 3 days, I have to say the vehicle is flawless-no squeaks or rattles. Everything works as planned.
Wow! Seventy two hours of flawless no squeaks or rattles. I hope the next 24 hours goes just as well and last but not least thousands of more reliability hours in the future when your wife learns driving.
Only one way to find out!
And after you drive it, let me know what you think.
TM
My experience driving a French car in Europe was a Citroen Xsara about 10 years ago and I was impressed with this economy car. Despite being a gasser the mileage of its 1.6l engine was quite impressive.
At least I stayed German! Yup, as you say, "Seventy two hours of flawless squeaks and rattles." Does this qualify as a VW record?
BMW and I aren't quite finished yet. I will return!
Seriously-drive a Golf (Rabbit) or even better, a GTI. They have to be considered among the best driving FWD vehicles on the road.
I can't believe I am actually enjoying the VW, but it's true! Actually it's not a surprise. I extensively test drove the vehicle twice before deciding to purchase it.
I totally agree with you. Put a hybrid or electric vehicle into the equation and take driving fun and world class performance out of the equation.
There is nothing in the world that would get me to drive a Prius. I don't care if gasoline goes to $12 a gallon.
I don't blame you for wanting to keep the 335i for as long as possible. The 335i is terrific either as a sedan or coupe. One of the world's truly great vehicles.
Then again there is TM having a hard time keeping the Vogue-model types away from his 135i convertible! :surprise:
You guys really have the life!
Thanks again for the good wishes!
I have been missing your with and Rum Cake stories..Now I know what you have been up to....I have always loved vw, although haven`t driven one in years....I have actually been thinking of a Prius--just thinking-- but lately have had to drive down to the plantation for the dike work--..There I need the old s10 truck, which I migh add I had for twelve or more years, and is still going strong up in N C mountains under my friends ownership...No question that was the most amazing truck--never broke--drove (like a truck) great and had the best radio ever--due to the cab and reflection of the sound....I am sure the Rabbit will be alot of fun, and I would imagine it to be nimble and light.. To answer your question about the audi, it is problem free other than I hit another tire, and knocked the little lower grill out...That didn`t do nearly the damage the other tire did, and just yeaterday some mean person cracked the back door glass...I think I`l wait til I get down to Miami and have it fixed there as audi just doesn`t have a good dealership here....Just for the heck of it I wlll take the car there and just see what happens, but I bet there is no support...We`l see, and I`l report..If it were the Lexus dealer here, they would fix all for free and give me a loaner--altough they would be under no obligation....For me the dealership is very important, and when I really get down to buying a new car I`l put that at the top.....Your Friend Tony
Well the Prius is what it is-a basic fuel efficient hybrid vehicle that will get you where you want to go in serious fashion. I myself prefer vehicles that provide a bit of fun.
Yes. The VW is nimble and light.
So, it seems you will keep the Audi for a bit.
Speaking of dealer experiences, Tony-my VW dealer was top notch! My acid test is when I get a new vehicle home, I wait until the following morning and measure the cold tire pressures for all the tires. If they are what they should be, I know I can be confident in bringing the vehicle back for service. The tire pressures were spot on.
First fill-up: 24 mpg, regular fuel which is exactly what I should be getting.
Gorgeous day here in Tampa after 3 days of nothing but rain.
Take care, my friend!
Are there others besides you and I that have actually owned VWs? I mean it wasn't that long ago that many here were bashing VW for inferior quality & workmanship, cheap ugly materials, and poor reliability.
Heck, I've owned an original '71 Beetle back in the old days, as well as a Karmann Ghia convertible, and I also bought one of the "new" Beetles for my wife several years ago, although it didn't last long because she ruined it driving it through the garage door!... Yes, she is a blonde.
And, of course, there was the recent GTI. Now, I know that qualifies me as a genuine VW fan, but what about the rest here?
And since you mentioned that you wouldn't be caught dead in the Prius, as I understand it, Dewey is actually waiting for the next generation Prius or the Lexus version of the Prius. Suddenly, he's considering an "UP" from VW? :confuse:
And, Dewey isn't the only one who is waiting to purchase a hybrid or electric vehicle... I'm waiting to scope out the upcoming CR-Z from Honda.
All I can say is, Powders, the moment you got yourself that Cwazy Wabbit, a lot of folks here seem to have jumped on the VW love-bus... Well, it's about time!
Anyway, I do honestly have to wonder if others besides you and I have put their money where their mouth is and actually ever owned a VW.
TM
Regards,
Jose
I feel that VW is poised for a nice growth spurt in NA. Making fine, vehicles never was their problem. The fact that they would fall apart in 48 hours was the big deal. I still have 18 hours to go and man am I sweating! If I can get through those first 48 hours unscathed, then the next 4-5 years should be a piece of rum cake.
Well Dewey is considering an "UP" VW as a second vehicle. There is no way in his right mind that he would trade his 335i sedan for one of those.
Most folks here seem to lean toward Japanese vehicles. I doubt if any more than one or two of the other posters have ever driven a VW. LG has already posted that he doesn't care for them.
I have seen several "studies" that indicate VW is on track with reliability improvement. If they are the number one volume leader in Europe, they must be doing something right. People won't continue to buy crap. However, if it comes down to buying a VW from Tennessee or Germany, I'll take the latter.
As for me, I want nothing to do with electric cars or hybrids. The Rabbit has that damn electronically assisted steering that makes it easier to turn the wheel at low speeds. It should be an option. Don't need it. Don't want it. Shame on them!
It is indeed cheaper to use energy off the grid to recharge an electric car's batteries than to use a gas engine to charge them. That's why the auto manufacturers are scrambling to go to the next step and produce a good plug-in hybrid. The obstacle isn't the electricity cost to recharge the batteries... it's the battery technology itself... it's about the driving range/distance that a single charge can provide, as well as the amount of time it takes to complete a recharge cycle. Obviously, it would be ideal to have a very short recharge cycle time, and for the vehicle to travel many hundreds of miles on a single charge.
In the top-of-the-line version of the next Prius, there will be solar collectors built into the roof of the car. This will further help to keep the batteries charged, and thus increase their driving range.
An advantage of electric vehicles is that electric power can be generated from many different sources... such as natural gas, coal, wind, hydro, nuclear, and solar. In other words, the vehicle isn't petro dependent exclusively.
Electric motors convert 75% of the chemical energy from the batteries to power the wheels—internal combustion engines (ICEs) only convert 20% of the energy stored in gasoline.
Electric vehicles use, on average, less than half a kilowatt-hour per mile as they drive. Most recharging is done at night, when the public's electrical demand is minimum.
Here's some information from the U.S Department of Energy:
Electric vehicles with direct current (DC) electric systems get about 0.4 kilowatt-hours (kWh) per mile, while those with more efficient alternating current (AC) systems get about 0.174 to 0.288 kWh per mile. If your home electricity rate is $0.13 per kWh, it would cost about $0.05 per mile for DC operation and $0.03 cents per mile for AC operation. You would pay $0.12 per mile for gasoline in a vehicle that gets 25 miles per gallon when gasoline sells for $3 per gallon.
When considering total operating costs, weigh battery replacement at four-year intervals or about 20,000 miles ($1,000 or $2,000) against four years of tune-ups, oil changes, mufflers, starters, water pumps, etc.
Hope that all helps answer your questions! Seems pretty damned obvious, doesn't it?
TM
Same here, though I don't consider an Audi to be "settling" for anything
Thanks TM. It helped.
Electric vehicles with direct current (DC) electric systems get about 0.4 kilowatt-hours (kWh) per mile, while those with more efficient alternating current (AC) systems get about 0.174 to 0.288 kWh per mile. If your home electricity rate is $0.13 per kWh, it would cost about $0.05 per mile for DC operation and $0.03 cents per mile for AC operation. You would pay $0.12 per mile for gasoline in a vehicle that gets 25 miles per gallon when gasoline sells for $3 per gallon.
Correct me if I am wrong. Out from the U.S. Department of Energy example, I should increase by about 50%-25% (DC/AC) the (gas) cost per mile to get the final cost per mile.
Or, out of the same example but if the hybrid car gave 50 miles per gallon, I should add about 10%-5% (DC/AC) to the gas cost to get the final cost per mile.
All other considerations, even not fun-driving when hypermiling, not taken into account.
Regards,
Jose
I suppose that's possible, but I have to wonder, just how price sensitive is that market? Would 911 or SL buyers really consider an XLR at $68K but not at $78K? I don't know, but I kind of doubt it. As for SC430 vs. XLR, frankly I'd rather drive a Miata than either of them.
Ah, your Jag. Poised outside you Country Club (or gated community) under the old Red, White and Blue. Way to dangle a bone at this starving dog...
Hahaha. That one's not mine, and we certainly don't have any places (or trees) like that in this town. I was just looking for some pictures of the XK, and stumbled across those on an eBay auction. Whoever the guy is he's good, the auction looks like an XK brochure. Here's a link if you'd like to see the rest:
Jag XK auction
Maybe in '09 I'll find a great deal on an '08. Currently, there is very, very little inventory of XKs, esp. the Coupe, in my neighborhood. Tata transition? Cranking out XFs?
'07s are going for $55-65K now. The one big reason to get an '08 is they finally got rid of the archaic Jag radio antenna. XK coupes have always been hard to find, same goes for the XJ-S before that. The cars are fast, but it really isn't about that. If you're looking for performance, buy a 911. In a Jag you want a deserted back road, the sun out, and the top down. That's why so many choose the drop top.
Depends on what type of vehicle, but you're right, I'm not much of a VW fan. In your case I would've gone for the Mazda3 hatch, but that's me. If you're happy with the Rabbit, that's what is important. It will be interesting to see what VW does with the next Passat. Supposedly it's going to be a special Americanized version to try and compete more directly with Camry and Accord, rather than be stuck in the sort of note-quite-this, not-quite-that, Subaru/Volvo no-mans land that it's in now. If sales are going to grow for the brand in NA it will be there, and not with poorly conceived (and named) minivans and pick up trucks.
4 cylinder vs. 5 cylinder
156 HP vs. 170 HP
3 year warranty vs. 4 year warranty
no security system vs. standard security system
no brake pad indicator vs. brake pad indicator
no MP3 vs. standard MP3
6 CD changer optional vs. 6 CD changer standard
no 8-way adjustable seats vs. standard 8-way adjustable
seats
6 speakers vs. 10 speakers
no signal mirrors vs. signal mirrors standard
no heatable side mirrors vs. standard heatable mirrors
no heated washer nozzles vs. heated washer nozzles
no valet key vs. valet key
no fold flat front passenger seat vs. fold flat front passenger seat
5 speed AT vs. 6 speed Tiptronic trans.
Some of the reasons I chose the Rabbit. Especially important was the fold flat front passenger seat, so I could fit my road bike inside. Can't do that with the Mazda 3.
The question is, if you knew that oil price will go back to $80 a barrel for the next 5 years, which cars/SUVs would represent a smashing deal right now (only from the brands that we like to discuss in this forum please) ?
Cadillac Escalade $3000 cash.
Acura MDX $2500 cash.
Excellent deals can be had on BMW lease turn-ins. One can find low mileage 2005 CPO 545i's for only $28,000 that were selling for almost $60,000 three years ago. I know, since I turned one in last week.
The luxury names are not "dealing".
Cadillac Escalade $3000 cash.
Acura MDX $2500 cash.
I would not touch the Hummer even if oil were at $80. I do like the other two, so I will take one of each, where can I find these deals ?
Don't blame you on the Hummer. One of my neighbors has a big Hummer with a "Life is Good!" on the back. Who's he kidding? More like "Life is Hell"! :surprise:
TM
I wouldn't gamble on gasoline ever re-visiting attractive prices for any extended period. If so, it would only be strategy for getting folks back on the oil hook... as before, again and again and again.
I remember arguing that gas would reach $4/gallon, and many of the guys on the forum wouldn't believe me. And, I'm talking previous posters like ljflx, who is a very smart businessman and investor. At the time, it seemed impossible.
I realize the question about which SUV someone would buy IF gas was cheap for 5 years is hypothetical. And I sure hope no one here actually thinks gas will ever be a long-term bargain again.
So my answer is NONE. I will never buy a thirsty SUV again, at any price. Any SUV I buy in the future will be a more fuel-efficient next-generation SUV.
edit: I have relatives that just purchased two Ford trucks... each discounted over $6,000 off of the MSRP. Each truck was a modest model, originally listing for about $25K. So, we're talking about a 25% discount for a brand new vehicle. Considering the depreciation and market conditions for vehicles like that, I think the discount makes sense, and the deal was definately a good one... but only if you need a truck or two... cause now each of those trucks will need to visit the gas station to "fill 'er up".
TM
VW makes one feel that you are driving a much more expensive vehicle. The steering wheel is BMW perfect in thickness and texture. So glad they decided not to add the "phony wood."
I'd estimate that it feels like 65-70% of a 3 Series. Not bad.
There are certainly smashing deals to be had, but the question should be "is the deal on this car good enough to offset $5 gas?", instead of what if cheap gas returns? The days of cheap gas are over. Why not get a great deal on something that's also fuel efficient? In terms of luxury cars, a used Jag XJ8 is the best buy on the market. It creams the big heavy Germans in terms of mpg, and gives up very little. You can get an '05 example for $25K.
I was about to write them a check for the entire amount, but found out they have 0 % financing over 36 months, so I went with that. I see interest rates going up after the election, so I thought it better to leave most of it in the money market fund and pay each month with no interest. This way I get the absolutely lowest price on the vehicle, due to the interest earned that would have otherwise been lost in a lump sum payment for the vehicle.
Tony, this is why I am known throughout the mosquito-infested Florida swamps as the:
Terminator-Negotiator :shades:
I have thought to sell our '05 Jag, but every time I get close to pulling the trigger, I think about where I can get a luxury car like that that still delivers that kind of mileage. She's got only around 10K miles on her, has a 7-year warranty, gets awesome mpg, and has tons of extras, such as the DVD entertainment with rear-seat headrest monitors, Bluetooth, dual-climate, Premium Factory wheels w/ performance tires, Jaguar Voice command, wire mesh XJR-style front grill, Navigation, and nice little touches that only come with the Vanden Plas. Not one scratch on her, and she's had no mechanical issues whatsoever.
Of course, an '05 Vanden Plas is worth considerably more than the $25 - $30K of a base model, but it's still an amazing value. A standard-equipped '05 Vanden Plas can be purchased for around $30 - $35K, and one equipped like mine with almost no miles, for around $37 - $39K, although it honestly would be hard to find one quite as cherry.
LG, curious... in your opinion, what are some other comparable screaming deals that are actually smart purchases?
TM
This relocation surprises me. There is minimal Bentley population in New England, our financial services people (one third of all Bentley US sales--which itself is 45% of the total Bentley world wide sales-- are to financial service types) aren't hedgies but rather poorly paid back office people, we have net out-migration of talented young people, there is only one dealer in the entire six state area until you get down to Greenwich, CT which is really a NYC suburb, we don't have a lot of flashy people who have to have the latest or the best car (e.g., the Bentley GTC), our weather is lousy for six months a year, the ethos of our pro teams such as the Partriots and the Bruins is anti-flash, etc. Yet Bentley locates in Boston!
I guess your business judgement gets cloudy when you finally sell 10,000 cars in a year.
Speaking of Bentley, it puzzles me that in the Northeast that more S Class 4 Matic buyers (most of the are indeed 4 Matic) don't consider a used AWD Bentley Continental.
Mazda's worst nightmare would be seeing those very same reasons advertised in a VW Ad.
For the sake of Mazda why dont we keep that post of yours a secret.
Unlike Tagman my BMW 335i tends to attract former Soviet female weight lifters
Back when I was a teenager and drove a 78 Ford Granada every girl turned their head when I passed them by. Though if I am not mistaken I think they all turned their heads because of the massive amount of rust on my Granada.
Even Obama ranked my Ford Granada as the worst car ever made in USA. Quite miraculously I still got dates while owning a Granada. I can just imagine what a popular Casanova I would have been if I drove something that was not as bad as a Granada--- like a Chevy Vega or something.
Most likely a Prius. A Lexus Prius assuming it's got a revolutionary new hybrid lithium ion drivetrain which is not shared by any other Toyota. A VW UP! is a possibility if it gets mileage that beats the competition. Right now I am not definite about my decsion since the specs of these cars when introduced in North America are unknown as of now.
I am looking for a frugal appliance which I can use to drive and park in downtown. Unlike a BMW my choice of this frugal appliance will be based primarily on its fuel efficiency specs and not on a test drive.
I never bought a car because of its styling. I buy a car for its grip, fun, handling, precision and agility. If styling ranked high among my list I would buy a vintage Benz. IMO any Benz that is over 40 years old is one of the most beautiful metallic forms on this planet earth.
As long as you continue to retain the BMW, you will survive such an experience. That way you can get your "fix" now and then.
Unlike Tagman my BMW 335i tends to attract former Soviet female weight lifters.
LOL... You guys have been having way too much fun with this.
The BMW 3 series coupe IMO is not only the best looking BMW but also the best looking coupe period.
I don't know if it's the very best looking coupe, because the Maserati GranTurismo, for example, is incredibly beautiful, and so is the Jaguar XKR for that matter. But, certainly the 3-Series coupe is near the top. IOW, I tend to agree, but with an asterik.
TM
One funny thing-the other day I was stopped for a light in the right lane and this redneck pickup truck comes almost behind me, checks out my car and sharply maneuvers into the left lane behind someone else. What did he think-I'm driving a bicycle? What a revolting development!
TM's attracts the Allure, Cosmo, Glamour, In Style, Marie Claire, W, Women's Health and Vogue models because the 135i is err...."petite."
At this point my vehicle has attracted absolutely no one. I kind of expected that.
I just hope some angry, verging on suicidal SUV person doesn't key my vehicle out of total frustration and jealousy. :surprise:
Recently, I got my wife an almost 2 carat diamond solitaire ring for our anniversary. Two days later she tells me she wants to go back to the store and get a second diamond ring.
Whatever happened to the sweet, unspoiled rum-cake producing girl I used to know? :sick:
One word... menopause. :sick: Us guys can endure no bigger challenge in life than to stay with a woman during menopause and maintain our sanity.
One funny thing-the other day I was stopped for a light in the right lane and this redneck pickup truck comes almost behind me, checks out my car and sharply maneuvers into the left lane behind someone else. What did he think-I'm driving a bicycle? What a revolting development!
LOL. Depends upon what he chose to get behind instead of you... Most likely it was a car that was obviously a faster car. But, if he chose to get behind a Yaris, instead of your Rabbit, then that's a different story.
Besides, consider the source... I mean what does a redneck in a Pickup truck know about cars anyway? He was just in a hurry to get to the local gun shop anyway.
TM
I'll get used to the different "treatment" now that I'm not in the 545i. Once past the break-in period, I will become competitive. The only thing I won't be able to do in the VW that I could in the 545i is the 0-60 mph in 5.3 seconds.
I'll get used to the different "treatment" now that I'm not in the 545i. Once past the break-in period, I will become competitive. The only thing I won't be able to do in the VW that I could in the 545i is the 0-60 mph in 5.3 seconds.
You're not in the major leagues anymore... and it's an adjustment. While the Rabbit is indeed a very willing and capable car, let's face it... it's no 545i.
So, instead of your car representing style, luxury, power, performance, and aggressiveness... you now have a car that represents intelligence, efficiency, maneuverability, functionality, and a little more passiveness than you've probably been used to.
Who knows?... the change of gear might actually be good for you.
TM
Yes. It will be an adjustment coming from the 545i. As you say, from extreme aggressiveness to being a bit more humble; "passiveness", as you say, will be entering the equation for the first time.
One thing I notice- the 545i had blind spots to the sides due to the thicker pillars, that the VW doesn't have.
"The change of gear might actually be good for you." This will take time. I am still within the break-in period, so my right foot has been kind of light. Once I really rev it and see what the car is capable of, I will evaluate.
Thank goodness I'm not the only one liking the current post-refresh 7 series. I agree w/ you the next design is bland at best. The 1-convertible seems like a serious chick magnet, but I like the A5 better. I wonder if Audi will make a convertible version...
I didnt know that a Prius is a sign of "hot" or "rich" anywhere in the states. There are very few here, and all I can tell you is noone seem to care much for it. Well, Wranglers may be kinda hot in the highschool-college days, but I dont see a lot of respect for Wranglers and pickup trucks around here, maybe because of the urban environment. I believe trucks are more like a statement of "tough" and "practical". I'm not sure urban societies will get it like I do.
Btw, Lexusguy, the '06 FX35 still ride like a gokart when I tested one. I'm really expecting progress with the new FX, especially since they raise the price significantly. That said, I agree with you that the face looks kinda funny from some angles, particularly up front and center.
That's a very good question. There aren't a lot of cars out there that offer space, luxury, power, comfort, and great mileage on the cheap like the XJ. That said, I think a CPO '05 Audi A6 4.2 is a pretty good buy right now at $27K or so, same goes for the '06 Infiniti M45 for similar money. Depreciation has hit the V8 versions of those cars hard, so on the used market the V8 upgrade is basically free.
A certified '05 A8 is in the low $30s now, and that's a hell of a lot of car for that kind of money. It's also better looking than a brand new S-class, 7, or LS.
I understand how you feel. I wouldn't buy a pretty car that's terrible to drive, but styling does play a large role. The 5 series is a good example. It's a great car to drive, but I just can't stand to look at it, so I wouldn't buy one. The 335i coupe on the other hand looks great, so I would probably be willing to overlook the other things I don't like about it, at least until the supercharged A5 hits the market.
If styling was my absolute top priority, I would sell everything I own to buy one of those Alfa 8C Superleggera Spyders from the '30s. No other car deserves the title "rolling sculpture" more than that one. The new Alfa 8C Competizione Spyder is gorgeous, but the original is a work of art.
Good news is I can afford the fuel, so an Audi A8 may not be such a bad idea afterall....