They could dig big caves facing the prevailing wind.
Personally I find them attractive. We have a wind farm that is growing just East of us on an Indian Reservation. They are silently saving us money on electricity here in San Diego county. They are more practical than solar as they run day and night in the windy areas they are built in. I don't think they take up near as much room per MW of power as solar.
Tax means fewer travellers at main Dutch airport: report Jun 28 02:46 PM US/Eastern Some 50,000 fewer passengers are expected to use Amsterdam Schiphol airport, one of Europe's busiest, this summer on account of a Dutch environmental tax on flights, it was reported Saturday.
"We're expected zero growth in 2008, and in fact a decrease (in passenger numbers) in July and August," an airport spokesman was quoted as saying by the domestic ANP news agency.
The Netherlands is the only country that levies an environmental tax on flights departing the country -- 11.25 euros per passenger (17.75 dollars) for European destinations and 45 euros for intercontential points.
With higher fuel prices pushing up air fares worldwide, travel industry experts say the tax will hurt business at Schiphol and see many Dutch travellers go to nearby German airports instead.
Another good reason to vacation in the good ole USA....
Oh you must be mistaken. I saw nothing about this reported on CNN. I did see a story that they think the north pole will be ice free this summer. They hinted that this was because of global warming and by inference it was all your fault for reving your car at stop lights.
If it had been some natural force I'm sure they would have reported it and said they were sorry for misleading us in the past. That's what they would do, right? Right? :sick:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Thank you very much!! It humbles me to know my 300 gals of yearly diesel fuel consumption @ 50 mpg was enough to melt the artic ice caps! That is enough to given anybody a Napoleon complex!
For my next trick, I will solve the hidden pyramid mystery (on the history channel as I write this.) :shades: I wonder how much C02 was expended putting together these piles of rocks, monuments to the one ups man ship over each of the the last KING/s to have died.
"...If Mother Nature gives us lemons we make lemon meringue pie..."
That will go good for dessert when Ted Turner and all the other GW cannibals have you for dinner.
(For all you folks who don't get my reference, Ted Turner said that in 10 years GW would destroy all the crops starve everybody and the few who survive would be cannibals.)
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Can I sing? I'm an old Karaoke Krooner from a way back. No leisure suit, I prefer shorts and Hawaiian Shirts. Did they say anything about the Arctic Ice covering the Hawaiian Islands?
You know Gary, there are residential wind turbines available also. You could buy one for your home and put electricity back into the grid, as little as you use.
To put this into perspective, the current after market price for one portion of energy self sufficiency
(house and POSSIBLY PLUG in electric car with 250 mile range switch able between electrical, and/or a diesel/gasser engines)
are 20,000 per 20 years away. On one level ,which is really off topic but relevant is we are only a capacity (of 250 miles away) from a no brainer solution STILL using electrical, D2 or Rug as a secondary or even switchable fuel sources. Pardon the clich'e but it really hits home: "killing two birds with one stone". In any case there are NO real crisis'. Artificial!?? ABSOLUTELY!!!!
Perhaps those that have put in passive solar water/pool heaters can outline whether those companies that installed them (years ago) are still in business....etc., etc. They do not get ANY BILLING as to their role in energy conservation!! :lemon:
Last I checked on small wind generators, they require a nominal 9 MPH wind. We are rarely subjected to 9 MPH winds. Most of the time we sit with about a 3 MPH westerly breeze. When the winds come it is out of the East and upwards of 35 MPH. Gladly that is only a few times a year. Our roof would be a much better choice for solar. My wife does not want to spend the money as the payback is way past our likely lifespan. Tax incentives are very poor for residential. Only commercial solar get the big bucks. So what's new with our Government? Then you have to deal with the county building people. I spent 3 years trying to get a permit to build a 20X25 foot garage on my 5 acres. Finally gave up and just built it. Here is what it would require to put in wind generation on my place.
Skystream 3.7™ is designed to make wind power accessible to more people than ever before. If your site fits the following criteria, chances are Skystream 3.7 will work for you:
* At least 10 MPH average wind speed (best results at 12 MPH or more) * Your property is greater than .5 acre and is unobstructed * The local zoning allows a structure that is at least 42′ tall * Your local utility has an existing interconnection agreement (Your Skystream dealer can help determine this).
The first two would eliminate me. My acre is covered with trees. Big oak and 100' eucalyptus. Not sure about zoning. It would take a minimum of 2-3 years to get any kind of permit here. Several $1000s in environmental impact studies are the starting point. I think I will stick with SDG&E. They had plenty of reserve in the last heat wave. The rest of CA has restricted the utilities to the point they are facing rolling blackouts this summer. We are fortunate to have a tribe of Indians that are located in a perfect place for a HUGE wind farm. And they are happy to sell the power to us.
The Kumeyaay Wind farm annually produces power sufficient for about 30,000 homes and saves approximately 110,000 tons a year in greenhouse gas emissions, compared with equivalent fossil fuel generation. It helps San Diego Gas & Electric meet its target of supplying at least 20 percent of its customers' electricity from renewable sources by 2010.
I am not sure a lot of folks see this, but your post really highlights the fact that the very same environmentalists are squarely in the way of the environmental ism they advocate. Indeed the environmental rules make it onerous for you to implement the very softer impact they advocate.
3 years to get a PERMIT to build a 20 x 25 ft garage, which would take an old style American "barn raising" 1 day of a crew of neighbors with BBQ, social interaction and bonding, etc to raise???!!! PREPOSTEROUS !!!
What do folks think they will put in the way when they are now taking MONEY from them!!?? This is disingenuous beyond being disingenuous. Or perhaps more real than REAL. FOLLOW THE $.!!??
I am convinced that on the whole environmentalist groups have tunnel vision. They all talk like they want to protect the environment as a whole entity. When the truth comes out they have a very narrow agenda. Be it protecting the snail darter or the air we breath or the rain forest. Everything man does has some impact. The very act of getting out of bed and making a cup of coffee impacts a dozen different eco systems. We have to decide is man more important or the snail darter.
The bottom line I see with most environmentalists. Whatever they are protecting is more important than you or I as humans. I wonder if they would be willing to give there lives or even their lifestyle to protect their little pet project. So far I have not seen any of the high profile environmentalist doing that. Driving a Prius to the airport to board your Gulfstream is not giving up anything worth talking about.
Seeing environmentalists as the enemy is the wrong way to go about it.
Gary asked, "We have to decide is man more important or the snail darter."
Problem: They are both important.
About 25% of the prescription drugs we use in this country were derived from research using Rain Forest plants or organisms.
So destroying the rain forests and losing plant and animal species which live there has a direct relationship to survival of mankind.
We'd better take care of our planet so it can in turn help us take care of ourselves.
If GW is causing species to go extinct, we might inadvertently kill off the plant or animal which might someday help us cure cancer or aids or heart disease.
I think the snail darter was one of the straws that convinced me to move away from Tennessee. At least I got to canoe the Little T a few more times before the God Committee decided to let the dam go ahead and be built (a little dam at that, with no power generation on it, but it was enough to kill off an nice stretch of trout fishing stream). TVA has pretty much dammed up every bit of flowing water in that region, from little streams (Raccoon Mountain) to the namesake river itself.
But you're right - everything is all connected. Maybe driving cars has warmed California enough to let the beetles move their habitat north, resulting in huge tracts of dead trees, all of which seem to be burning up this week in N. Calif.
Well no, the natural conditon of (significant portions of the so called state of ) CA is once every 5 years a significant portion of the state BURNS!! aka WILD FIRES. Indeed, NOT burning is UNNATURAL !!!!! How's that for an oxymoron!?
I watched Boxer being interviewed by a friendly host on some channel this weekend. She kept trying to say her bill to control the evil cause of all evils, carbon dioxide wouldn't cost anything and there was no "tax" involved, just charges on the companies.
Who pays those costs for the companies, e.g.
I'm surprised Boxer can balance her own household budget since she understands money so poorly. But she's another example of big stick pie-in-the-sky fixes for imaginary problems. :sick:
But I think the idea of the green movement, which in my eyes is to "take care of the planet so it can take care of us LONGER" is a fabulous idea.
And which green movement would that be? The one that is blocking the expansion of solar in the desert SW? The green organization that does not want us to use wind generation? Maybe it is the green organization that blocked the clearing of dead trees in So Cal that was the cause of losing 3000 homes last fall. Or the green folks that are burning buildings and SUVs.At least some of the groups that opposed Nuclear Power are now rethinking their stand. I am looking for Balance and do not see it in most environmental groups.
While I do question the use of hydro electric. What would be the alternative in the SE? They have plenty of coal for power generation. I still recall the Sierra Club trying to block the Glen Canyon dam. Their argument was there is enough coal in that area to supply our power for 1000s of years. Now they don't like coal for power.
Balance is the key. I do not see much balance in these green organizations.
Well I think world PEAS is a great ideal too!! I have long ago gotten over that!!! :lemon: :mad: I was part of the forgotten boomer generation that actually WAS subject to the DRAFT !!?? The draft was actually not the worst of it (unless you were part of the 58,000 troops who were killed and hundreds of thousands of others who were wounded, crippled, or mentally affected by the Vietnam "conflict". Parole was from ages 18-44 years old. I did get my (no more parole notice, aka AGE related") honorable discharge at AGE 44.
Regardless of how you personally feel about various environmental "ORGANIZATIONS" Gary, remember: I never brought up ORGANIZATIONS - you did.
I said "green movement" which, again I repeat myself here, to ME means "to take care of the planet so it can take care of US longer."
Of course anyone with common sense knows that some green ORGANIZATIONS have various and sundry agendas which in many cases do not make sense to those outside the ORGANIZATION.
The kind of green living I personally endorse does not need balance, because I am not wanting anyone to give up anything important other than to avoid excessive consumption.
I endorse common sense items such as personal recycling, reducing your own family's carbon footprint, driving more efficient vehicles, stop WASTING in ALL AREAS of life, buying solar and wind power if you can afford it, shop and trade at Goodwill so clothes get "recycled", etc etc.
Nothing with an agenda other than just the basic "take care of the Earf and don't be a waster." I think the one of the worse things people can say about someone is that they are wasteful.
All MAJOR environmental actions involve trade-offs, some more major than others. Some ORGANIZATIONS pick and choose HOW they want to protect the environment and in some cases they make stupid choices. Such is life.
"...the very same environmentalists are squarely in the way of the enviromentalism they advocate..."
Truer words were never spoken. So much of the regulations now in effect were put there to stop "those rich capitalist" from messing up the planet. Now they just serve to slow down progress of ANY kind.
I was reminded of my own encounter with the regulatory demon several years ago. I wanted to set up a little folding table in front of my farm to sell some tomatoes to the neighbors.
Well, let me tell you, it took 6 months of paperwork and $2000 to set up that table. I had to fill out "environmental impact" forms and go to a public hearing right along with the big developers. When I pointed out that this was all a bit silly I was told: "Hey, Wal-Mart has to do it too." I supose that they thought that was actually an answer.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I endorse common sense items such as personal recycling, reducing your own family's carbon footprint, driving more efficient vehicles, stop WASTING in ALL AREAS of life, buying solar and wind power if you can afford it, shop and trade at Goodwill so clothes get "recycled", etc etc.
I can endorse doing all those things also. Except maybe the Goodwill. I prefer the Salvation Army and other thrift stores. The Goodwill is generally over priced in my experience. That is the main thing we do on vacation is hit all the thrift shops. We buy cloths look for coffee cups, books etc etc. One of the victims of the fuel increase may be recycling. They do very little recycling in the Hawaiian Islands because it costs too much to ship the scrap to the mainland. It may become the case here also.
The problem I see with the Green Movement is it has been hijacked by unscrupulous people. What may start out as good cause soon gets taken over by people with a political agenda. Two such organizations that I have belonged to over the years have met that fate. The Sierra Club and the Audubon Society. So far the San Diego Zoological Society has been pretty good. Though they get attacked by wacko groups like PETA.
I just want to beat Al to the punch and blame the current mess in China on GW. :sick:
BEIJING: With less than six weeks before it plays host to the Olympic sailing regatta, the city of Qingdao has mobilized thousands of people and an armada of small boats to clean up an algae bloom that is choking large stretches of the coastline and threatening to impede the Olympic competition.
Local officials have initiated an all-out effort to clean up the algae by mid-July. Media reports estimate that as many as 20,000 people have either volunteered or been ordered to participate in the operation, while 1,000 boats are scooping algae out of the Yellow Sea. The official news agency, Xinhua, reported that algae currently covered a third of the coastal waters designated for the Olympic races.
Water quality has been a concern for the sailing events, given that many coastal Chinese cities dump untreated sewage into the sea. At the same time, rivers and tributaries emptying into coastal waters are often contaminated with high levels of nitrates from agricultural and industrial runoff. These nitrates contribute to the red tides of algae that often bloom along sections of China's coastline.
But officials in Qingdao said pollution and poor water quality did not have a "substantial link" to the current outbreak, according to Xinhua. Instead, scientists blamed the bloom on increased rainfall and warmer waters in the Yellow Sea. Algae are now blooming over more than 12,900 square kilometers, or 5,000 square miles, of the sea, according to Xinhua.
ummm...I gotta say that if anyone puts a windturbine up anywhere in southern Arizona(except in Tucson city proper anywhere)they couldn't possibly block anyone's view! I do mean outside of towns...in the open desert where the winds really pick up some serious speed. I mean, we have so many mountains over here that all anyone objecting to a tall turbine would have to do is look to another direction...divert their eyes a bit, and they'd see another chunk of mountains.
You don't mean to tell me that the green groups are objecting to wind turbines to help to generate solar energy in sunny Arizona, do ya?
It has to be the kangaroo rat habitat that would be endangered. The Wind generators pose a slight danger to blind hawks, Owls and bats.
Builders of solar power plants fear that a government decision to halt applications to use federal lands as it weighs environmental consequences could harm an industry still in its infancy.
"It's simply not sending the right message to the American public that they (the U.S. government) are committed to getting solar off the ground," Holly Gordon, vice president of legislative and regulatory affairs at Palo Alto's Ausra, said of the government's 22-month moratorium on new land claims. That company has filed claims to build plants on federal land in Arizona and Nevada, and is developing a solar power plant on private land in San Luis Obispo County.
The U.S. Bureau of Land Management last month declared the moratorium on its lands throughout the West as it studies the environmental impact of the new projects. The moratorium will last at least through spring 2010.
Coal makes me sick. So I quit eating it. Even with ketchup it is not that tasty....
What a loser Reid is. Stands there telling us to use Solar while the US Government that He is now in charge of is blocking Solar projects in the Desert of AZ & NV his state. Think he even knows what is going on?
You ever take the tour? They burn the wood outside to make the charcoal, or did - been years since I was there last. Not many neighbors in that small county to complain (plus most of them probably work for Jack).
Then they mellow it drop by drop - when you see the vats they drip it through, well, if your home shower worked like that, you'd drown in all the drops. :shades: Slick advertising though.
I may have lived in TN for 6 years or so, but Jim Beam's stuff next door tastes better to me.
Not that I remember..., but my car knows the way. Ops, it probably would be more pc to say I took public transportation or walked there! :lemon: Well , my car is publically registered?
"Norway, which already has some of the highest fuel prices in the world, on Tuesday introduced a new tax on petrol and diesel aimed at curbing climate change. On Tuesday, the petrol price at Statoil stations across Norway inched up to 13.73 kroner (1,72 euro, 2.71 dollars) per litre (quarter gallon)."
One year I did do a tasting road trip. Napa Valley at that time more smaller wineries, Olympia Beer, Coors Beer, etc etc. Back then tasting was no charge! :shades:
The King of Norway will use any excuse to stick it to the peasants.
Party leader Siv Jensen told VG on Tuesday she was not surprised that most Norwegians opposed the new tax.
"Most people in Norway are dependant on their car. I think a lot of people have trouble understanding why the government is blaming (the hike) on the climate agreement," she said, insisting the government was under no obligation to spend the extra tax money to help halt climate change.
Where did they think the CC money was coming from? Did they think the King was going to dip into his pocket to support the GW Scam?
"The average U.S. citizen completely ignores the regularity with which the automobile kills him, maims him, embroils him with the law ... He woos it with Simoniz, Prestone, Ethyl and rich lubricants—and goes broke trading it in on something flashier an hour after he has made the last payment on the old one.By last week, this peculiar state of mind (has) sucked thousands of American oil wells dry.
The traffic light, the yellow line, the parking lot, the parking meter, the underground garage, the one-way street, the motorcycle cop and the traffic ticket had all blossomed amid the monoxide fumes—and traffic had gone right on getting thicker and noisier year by year."
Ah the lure of globalization. Actually there is a very easy answer which we have LONG disavowed...... make everything accessible/intergrated within a 1.5 mile radius. There are very few places that have this. Those that do are impossibly expensive and expensive to maintain. NYC would be an example.
It'd be fun to have a plugin for MapQuest or Google Maps so that you could overlay a mile circle and see which of us has the most amenities within a short walk/bike/drive.
Anyone know of such a tool?
I'm on the edge of a small town (in the county in fact) and I'm within 4 miles of just about everything from an ER to Thai and Indian food.
This is not to overlook the so called "new urbanism" movement that has been at work for at least 1.5 generations. However those usually only work oxymoronically with HUGE developments. They structurally only call for 10-20% less area/spaces for private transportation. There are of course HUGE HUGE HUGE assumptions that rest on already built infrastructure.
The bottom line is again oxymoronically/disingenuously the very Nirvana's touted and proported (aka NYC, etc etc) could not be build to its present conditions under any and all current rules.
What I am saying is for example when you have smaller "in fill" projects you have to conform to the broader requirements and NOT the new urbanism requirements (off of a HUGE development). AKA you are not densing it (that infill project) up as you would hope. Indeed the new urbanism model does NOT allow for the densing anybody would really hope!!! This of course can be a good/bad thing. I hope I am not being vague. I can give a for real example if you would like.
I'm less than 4 miles from a bunch of great Mexican food, Italian, 3 Pizza places, BBQ, mixed Oriental, Steak house, Albertson's, Library, two book stores etc, etc. I have to drive 22 miles to the 2nd best Thai food on the planet. First best Thai is in Hilo Hawaii. And I have a view that extends from sunrise to sunset. The loudest noise is the crickets and ravens. NO ROAD NOISE can be heard. No fast food places allowed except the Carl's that snuck in somehow. We have blocked McD's and the rest, hopefully FOREVER. Clsest Wally World is about 9 miles. Close enough.
I think I hear you. Part of the problem is that city planners love buzz words and the 80's New Urbanism led to the more recent Smart Growth movement and who knows what else. What used to be diverse or mixed use is now sustainable or neotraditional planning.
Maybe I missed my calling - always liked vernacular architecture and stuff like the Palms over in Dubai and Seaside FL make for interesting reading.
Comments
Personally I find them attractive. We have a wind farm that is growing just East of us on an Indian Reservation. They are silently saving us money on electricity here in San Diego county. They are more practical than solar as they run day and night in the windy areas they are built in. I don't think they take up near as much room per MW of power as solar.
Jun 28 02:46 PM US/Eastern
Some 50,000 fewer passengers are expected to use Amsterdam Schiphol airport, one of Europe's busiest, this summer on account of a Dutch environmental tax on flights, it was reported Saturday.
"We're expected zero growth in 2008, and in fact a decrease (in passenger numbers) in July and August," an airport spokesman was quoted as saying by the domestic ANP news agency.
The Netherlands is the only country that levies an environmental tax on flights departing the country -- 11.25 euros per passenger (17.75 dollars) for European destinations and 45 euros for intercontential points.
With higher fuel prices pushing up air fares worldwide, travel industry experts say the tax will hurt business at Schiphol and see many Dutch travellers go to nearby German airports instead.
Another good reason to vacation in the good ole USA....
Oh you must be mistaken. I saw nothing about this reported on CNN. I did see a story that they think the north pole will be ice free this summer. They hinted that this was because of global warming and by inference it was all your fault for reving your car at stop lights.
If it had been some natural force I'm sure they would have reported it and said they were sorry for misleading us in the past. That's what they would do, right? Right? :sick:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
For my next trick, I will solve the hidden pyramid mystery (on the history channel as I write this.) :shades: I wonder how much C02 was expended putting together these piles of rocks, monuments to the one ups man ship over each of the the last KING/s to have died.
All that and carbon dioxide still is proved to be the greenhouse gas problem they want to claim. Water vapor appears to play a larger role.
Now they're going to upset the geology and cause carbonated water by putting carbon dioxide into the ground rock under pressure to store it!!!
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
That will go good for dessert when Ted Turner and all the other GW cannibals have you for dinner.
(For all you folks who don't get my reference, Ted Turner said that in 10 years GW would destroy all the crops starve everybody and the few who survive would be cannibals.)
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
But can you sing? :shades:
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Can I sing? I'm an old Karaoke Krooner from a way back. No leisure suit, I prefer shorts and Hawaiian Shirts. Did they say anything about the Arctic Ice covering the Hawaiian Islands?
Go fer it dude !!!
(house and POSSIBLY PLUG in electric car with 250 mile range switch able between electrical, and/or a diesel/gasser engines)
are 20,000 per 20 years away. On one level ,which is really off topic but relevant is we are only a capacity (of 250 miles away) from a no brainer solution STILL using electrical, D2 or Rug as a secondary or even switchable fuel sources. Pardon the clich'e but it really hits home: "killing two birds with one stone". In any case there are NO real crisis'. Artificial!?? ABSOLUTELY!!!!
Perhaps those that have put in passive solar water/pool heaters can outline whether those companies that installed them (years ago) are still in business....etc., etc. They do not get ANY BILLING as to their role in energy conservation!! :lemon:
Skystream 3.7™ is designed to make wind power accessible to more people than ever before. If your site fits the following criteria, chances are Skystream 3.7 will work for you:
* At least 10 MPH average wind speed (best results at 12 MPH or more)
* Your property is greater than .5 acre and is unobstructed
* The local zoning allows a structure that is at least 42′ tall
* Your local utility has an existing interconnection agreement (Your Skystream dealer can help determine this).
The first two would eliminate me. My acre is covered with trees. Big oak and 100' eucalyptus. Not sure about zoning. It would take a minimum of 2-3 years to get any kind of permit here. Several $1000s in environmental impact studies are the starting point. I think I will stick with SDG&E. They had plenty of reserve in the last heat wave. The rest of CA has restricted the utilities to the point they are facing rolling blackouts this summer. We are fortunate to have a tribe of Indians that are located in a perfect place for a HUGE wind farm. And they are happy to sell the power to us.
The Kumeyaay Wind farm annually produces power sufficient for about 30,000 homes and saves approximately 110,000 tons a year in greenhouse gas emissions, compared with equivalent fossil fuel generation. It helps San Diego Gas & Electric meet its target of supplying at least 20 percent of its customers' electricity from renewable sources by 2010.
3 years to get a PERMIT to build a 20 x 25 ft garage, which would take an old style American "barn raising" 1 day of a crew of neighbors with BBQ, social interaction and bonding, etc to raise???!!! PREPOSTEROUS !!!
What do folks think they will put in the way when they are now taking MONEY from them!!?? This is disingenuous beyond being disingenuous. Or perhaps more real than REAL. FOLLOW THE $.!!??
The bottom line I see with most environmentalists. Whatever they are protecting is more important than you or I as humans. I wonder if they would be willing to give there lives or even their lifestyle to protect their little pet project. So far I have not seen any of the high profile environmentalist doing that. Driving a Prius to the airport to board your Gulfstream is not giving up anything worth talking about.
Gary asked, "We have to decide is man more important or the snail darter."
Problem: They are both important.
About 25% of the prescription drugs we use in this country were derived from research using Rain Forest plants or organisms.
So destroying the rain forests and losing plant and animal species which live there has a direct relationship to survival of mankind.
We'd better take care of our planet so it can in turn help us take care of ourselves.
If GW is causing species to go extinct, we might inadvertently kill off the plant or animal which might someday help us cure cancer or aids or heart disease.
Tread lightly on this Earf mis amigos.
But you're right - everything is all connected. Maybe driving cars has warmed California enough to let the beetles move their habitat north, resulting in huge tracts of dead trees, all of which seem to be burning up this week in N. Calif.
Who said they were the enemy? YOU!?
However you really missed the point about E's getting in E's way.
You know good and well it was not me - why even waste time typing that?
Not to put blame on anyone in particular, but SOME posters in here and their posts in other areas make clear their feelings toward the Green movement.
So much stuff we don't know....
I don't personally like AlGore for his heavy-handedness and his hypocrisy.
But I think the idea of the green movement, which in my eyes is to "take care of the planet so it can take care of us LONGER" is a fabulous idea.
Who pays those costs for the companies, e.g.
I'm surprised Boxer can balance her own household budget since she understands money so poorly. But she's another example of big stick pie-in-the-sky fixes for imaginary problems. :sick:
Now if she can control water vapour....
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
And which green movement would that be? The one that is blocking the expansion of solar in the desert SW? The green organization that does not want us to use wind generation? Maybe it is the green organization that blocked the clearing of dead trees in So Cal that was the cause of losing 3000 homes last fall. Or the green folks that are burning buildings and SUVs.At least some of the groups that opposed Nuclear Power are now rethinking their stand. I am looking for Balance and do not see it in most environmental groups.
While I do question the use of hydro electric. What would be the alternative in the SE? They have plenty of coal for power generation. I still recall the Sierra Club trying to block the Glen Canyon dam. Their argument was there is enough coal in that area to supply our power for 1000s of years. Now they don't like coal for power.
Balance is the key. I do not see much balance in these green organizations.
I said "green movement" which, again I repeat myself here, to ME means "to take care of the planet so it can take care of US longer."
Of course anyone with common sense knows that some green ORGANIZATIONS have various and sundry agendas which in many cases do not make sense to those outside the ORGANIZATION.
The kind of green living I personally endorse does not need balance, because I am not wanting anyone to give up anything important other than to avoid excessive consumption.
I endorse common sense items such as personal recycling, reducing your own family's carbon footprint, driving more efficient vehicles, stop WASTING in ALL AREAS of life, buying solar and wind power if you can afford it, shop and trade at Goodwill so clothes get "recycled", etc etc.
Nothing with an agenda other than just the basic "take care of the Earf and don't be a waster." I think the one of the worse things people can say about someone is that they are wasteful.
All MAJOR environmental actions involve trade-offs, some more major than others. Some ORGANIZATIONS pick and choose HOW they want to protect the environment and in some cases they make stupid choices. Such is life.
Truer words were never spoken. So much of the regulations now in effect were put there to stop "those rich capitalist" from messing up the planet. Now they just serve to slow down progress of ANY kind.
I was reminded of my own encounter with the regulatory demon several years ago. I wanted to set up a little folding table in front of my farm to sell some tomatoes to the neighbors.
Well, let me tell you, it took 6 months of paperwork and $2000 to set up that table.
I had to fill out "environmental impact" forms and go to a public hearing right along with the big developers. When I pointed out that this was all a bit silly I was told: "Hey, Wal-Mart has to do it too." I supose that they thought that was actually an answer.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I can endorse doing all those things also. Except maybe the Goodwill. I prefer the Salvation Army and other thrift stores. The Goodwill is generally over priced in my experience. That is the main thing we do on vacation is hit all the thrift shops. We buy cloths look for coffee cups, books etc etc. One of the victims of the fuel increase may be recycling. They do very little recycling in the Hawaiian Islands because it costs too much to ship the scrap to the mainland. It may become the case here also.
The problem I see with the Green Movement is it has been hijacked by unscrupulous people. What may start out as good cause soon gets taken over by people with a political agenda. Two such organizations that I have belonged to over the years have met that fate. The Sierra Club and the Audubon Society. So far the San Diego Zoological Society has been pretty good. Though they get attacked by wacko groups like PETA.
BEIJING: With less than six weeks before it plays host to the Olympic sailing regatta, the city of Qingdao has mobilized thousands of people and an armada of small boats to clean up an algae bloom that is choking large stretches of the coastline and threatening to impede the Olympic competition.
Local officials have initiated an all-out effort to clean up the algae by mid-July. Media reports estimate that as many as 20,000 people have either volunteered or been ordered to participate in the operation, while 1,000 boats are scooping algae out of the Yellow Sea. The official news agency, Xinhua, reported that algae currently covered a third of the coastal waters designated for the Olympic races.
Water quality has been a concern for the sailing events, given that many coastal Chinese cities dump untreated sewage into the sea. At the same time, rivers and tributaries emptying into coastal waters are often contaminated with high levels of nitrates from agricultural and industrial runoff. These nitrates contribute to the red tides of algae that often bloom along sections of China's coastline.
But officials in Qingdao said pollution and poor water quality did not have a "substantial link" to the current outbreak, according to Xinhua. Instead, scientists blamed the bloom on increased rainfall and warmer waters in the Yellow Sea. Algae are now blooming over more than 12,900 square kilometers, or 5,000 square miles, of the sea, according to Xinhua.
http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/06/30/asia/china.php
If they are smart they will make biodiesel from all that luscious green algae... :shades:
You don't mean to tell me that the green groups are objecting to wind turbines to help to generate solar energy in sunny Arizona, do ya?
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
Builders of solar power plants fear that a government decision to halt applications to use federal lands as it weighs environmental consequences could harm an industry still in its infancy.
"It's simply not sending the right message to the American public that they (the U.S. government) are committed to getting solar off the ground," Holly Gordon, vice president of legislative and regulatory affairs at Palo Alto's Ausra, said of the government's 22-month moratorium on new land claims. That company has filed claims to build plants on federal land in Arizona and Nevada, and is developing a solar power plant on private land in San Luis Obispo County.
The U.S. Bureau of Land Management last month declared the moratorium on its lands throughout the West as it studies the environmental impact of the new projects. The moratorium will last at least through spring 2010.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqR0Ui0g3wI
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
What a loser Reid is. Stands there telling us to use Solar while the US Government that He is now in charge of is blocking Solar projects in the Desert of AZ & NV his state. Think he even knows what is going on?
Then they mellow it drop by drop - when you see the vats they drip it through, well, if your home shower worked like that, you'd drown in all the drops. :shades: Slick advertising though.
I may have lived in TN for 6 years or so, but Jim Beam's stuff next door tastes better to me.
In GW news, Norwegians fume as new 'climate tax' on fuel takes effect (AFP)
"Norway, which already has some of the highest fuel prices in the world, on Tuesday introduced a new tax on petrol and diesel aimed at curbing climate change. On Tuesday, the petrol price at Statoil stations across Norway inched up to 13.73 kroner (1,72 euro, 2.71 dollars) per litre (quarter gallon)."
Party leader Siv Jensen told VG on Tuesday she was not surprised that most Norwegians opposed the new tax.
"Most people in Norway are dependant on their car. I think a lot of people have trouble understanding why the government is blaming (the hike) on the climate agreement," she said, insisting the government was under no obligation to spend the extra tax money to help halt climate change.
Where did they think the CC money was coming from? Did they think the King was going to dip into his pocket to support the GW Scam?
"Its good to be the KING! "
The traffic light, the yellow line, the parking lot, the parking meter, the underground garage, the one-way street, the motorcycle cop and the traffic ticket had all blossomed amid the monoxide fumes—and traffic had gone right on getting thicker and noisier year by year."
Time Magazine
(check the date of the article - 1947. The more things change...)
Anyone know of such a tool?
I'm on the edge of a small town (in the county in fact) and I'm within 4 miles of just about everything from an ER to Thai and Indian food.
The bottom line is again oxymoronically/disingenuously the very Nirvana's touted and proported (aka NYC, etc etc) could not be build to its present conditions under any and all current rules.
Sunrise
Sunset
Maybe I missed my calling - always liked vernacular architecture and stuff like the Palms over in Dubai and Seaside FL make for interesting reading.