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Toyota TACOMA vs Ford RANGER - X
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Comments
The Ranger continues to outsell the Tacoma about 3 to 1, if you include Mazda B Series it goes up to about 4 to 1. The Ranger is the best all around compact pick-up on the market today. As for resale, go to Kelly Blue Book, punch in a 1998 Ranger XLT 4x4 4.0 5spd to being with, load it up the same as a Tacoma, you will be very surprised believe me..
The Ranger has more package options, more truck configurations, more, more, more for less money. Toyota survives on guys like spoog and allknowing.
As for the NHSTA numbers, spoog wants you to see the total numbers. If you take a quick peak you will see at least half are for lables, some are duplicates, another good amount are for only certain lots of Rangers.
The new 2001 Ranger will chew up and spit out a Tacoma. The SOHC 4.0 is long over due. As was said look at the Torque/HP curve, the Ranger pounds the Tacoma into the ground. www.crashtest.com, Edmunds, carpoint all rate the Ranger better in crashtests also. You can't pick what is going to hit you, but I guess if you own a Tacoma you can.. LOL!@.
In all fairness though, the Tacoma is a good truck, the Ranger is ever bit as good just for less money. The pedestal that Toyota seems to sit on with some of these guys cracks me up!
Standard
Tacoma 2.7 4 cyl vs Ranger 2.5 4 cyl
(Toyota has 150 hp vs Ranger 119)
Upgrade Option 1
Tacoma 3.4 V6 vs Ranger 3.0 v6
(Toyota has 190 hp vs Ranger 150)
Upgrade Option 2
Tacoma TRD Supercharged V6 vs Ranger 4.0 v6
(Toyota has 265 hp vs Ranger 207)
Does this mean the locker is faulty on all vehicles? No, I cannot say that, however, I would think this would qualify for one of the TSB's that spoog is fond of posting.
A TSB is meerly an notification that a certain problem existed on a vehicle or that a certain maintenance practice is required. They should NOT be taken as a serious problem based on just the TSB's face value.
I pointed out numerious times that, when you LOOK beyond just the NUMBER of TSB's that the seriousness of the Tacoma TSB's is higher. Examples from Tacoma TSB's:
- Transfer case locked up throwing vehicle out of control. Injury accident.
Examples from Ranger TSB's:
- Recommended glazing compound for glass repair.
You are incorrect regarding the 3.4 headgasket. I will do some searching on the Tacoma sites to show you that that head gasket was a non-documented recall of the vehicle. The data I had before even listed the mileage failure rate as to when Toyota would repair the head gasket.
They seemed, as I recall, to fail somewhere around 80-110K miles.
-
Standard passive theft system on the XLT. Due to a code chip in the key, it cannot be hotwired. Does make replacement keys cost about 30 bucks, and you can only get them at the dealer, and you NEED to keep the key information. But, you have to tow the vehicle to steal it.
Also that feature has lowered my insurance by maybe $80 a year. It is a premium reduction item for Farmers Ins.
So, on Monday, it's back to the dealers for another look at Ford.
CPounsr - Just curious as to where in NJ you grew up, I work in Warren County.
Thanks to everyone for their advice. Pretty sure my mind's made up. I'll be sure to check back with you when I get my new truck.
I'm guessing that it was silent because a company that banks on a reputation for quality and charges a premium for it doesn't want to advertise a major engine defect that could cause thousands in damage.
One more thing. The standard engine on 4wd Rangers is the 3L V6. And, the TRD Supercharger is an aftermarket option. This leaves us with:
Standard
Tacoma 2.7 4 cyl vs Ranger 3.0 6 cyl
(Toyota has 150hp/177tq vs Ranger 150hp/192tq)
Upgrade Option
Tacoma 3.4 V6 vs Ranger 4.0 v6
(Toyota has 190hp/220tq vs Ranger 207hp/238tq)
http://www.lieblweb.com/tacoma/VA052700B/MVC-047B.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513A/MVC-002.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513A/MVC-005.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513B/MVC-023B.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513C/MVC-010C.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513C/MVC-014C.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513C/MVC-015C.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513C/MVC-025C.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513E/MVC-008E.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/P000513E/MVC-009E.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/tacoma/S000930A/MVC-859F.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/tacoma/GWNF000902A/027.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/tacoma/GWNF000902A/028.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/tacoma/GWNF000902A/021.JPG
http://www.lieblweb.com/tacoma/GWNF000902B/035.JPG
I grew up in Hunterdon county, a little town called High Bridge.
Cost can be a factor on a decision such as a vehicle.
I can tell you now the answer will be silence.
Spoog won't show pics, he doesn't own a Tacoma, just dreams about it..
By the way, my friend with the Tacoma headgasket issue tried to hide if from me. He and I always exchange jabs back and forth. (All in fun). It made me wonder though how many people who own Toyota's or even Honda's don't tell people when their car or trucks have problems..
One might as well just post nothing as opposed to self-serving half-truths or omit material facts because of some psychological inadequacy. It just gets tiresome and reduces what could be meaningful discussion and debate to namecalling and mudflinging.
Oh, Al Gore and George W... What a couple of terrible choices for president. I'm throwing my vote away to a 3rd party candidate.
-Colin
and went to the 3.4 four cam.
This is the major reason that the 3.4L is a very reliable and refined engine (notwithstanding the obvious head gasket issue). There were many years of R&D and put into the original 3L design.
It seems I can't get the 4.0 L engine on the 2001 with a manual trans, so I may be stuck with a 3.0 and want to make sure it isn't going to be a mistake.
Allknowing, You claim Ranger owners bash the Tacoma and try to assure themselves with their purchase of a Ranger. Your telling me you have never bashed the Ranger? or no other Tacoma owner has come onto this board and bashed the Ranger?
The Toyota crowd keeps claiming the Toyota is better "quality". So why hasn't Toyota claimed the number one spot in 14years for the compact truck?
The 3.0 sometimes pings, from what I have been able to hear and it means you have to run a higher octane than the 4.0. There have been some complaints of the 4.0 having a dieseling noise. My 4.0 does not. Either engine is noisy as compared to the toyota. Just the way they sound.
The 3.0 as I recall is a flex fuel vehicle. Can run on two different types of fuel. Do not know much about that feature.
Both the 3.0 and the 4.0 Ford engines are the 60 degree design V6 vs the, I think, 45 degree of the majority of the engines.
The power difference between the 4.0 and 3.0 is 207 hp vs 150 hp. The 4.0 should get worse gas mileage as it is a higher compression engine.
I don't know, can you wait a couple of months and check and see if the manual is coming with the 4.0?
Now in FAIRNESS, this appears to be something on the order of a TSB that Ford seems to use.
SOME but NOT ALL vehicles are effected.
Just curious why Toyota or someone did not issue a TSB if they got the wrong or a bad design of gaskets in the engine.
Heck, Ford issues TSB's for incorrectly listing a 16 inch tire in the owners manual when it is in reality a 15 inch tire. Kinda obvious I would think, don't try to put a 16 inch tire on a 15 inch rim. . .Duh.
They are derived from the old Ford 2.9 which has been around since the mid 80's. I know one guy with an 87 2.9 that has 189,000 miles. It leaks, runs a bit rough but it is running ok.
The 4.0 was introduced in the early 90's and the OHC version in the 2001 is what has been in the Explorer's since that timeframe.
Seriously, put synthetic in at 10,000 mile. You will not be making a mistake doing that. It costs more but the engine runs so much better.
And use the manufacturer oil filters.
The SOHC 4L would be my choice if you're not too concerned with gas milage. There were a couple of bugs in early 4L SOHC Explorers (97-98), but they seem to have been remedied. It is a very fun engine to drive. I'd really wait to test drive a manual Cammer before you jump at something else.
If you get a '00 4L Ranger, it will be the older OHV 4L. It is a bored/stroked version of the 2.9L Cologne V6 introduced in the Ranger around 1987. The OHV 4L is a strong running reliable engine. It has tons of torque and tows like a champ. But, it is unrefined and noisy when compared to the imports. It is also not the best when gas in auto/4wd/low-gearing configuration. It is actually pretty good with manual/2wd/3.55 LSD, though.
About the only "bad" choice IMO would be the 3L with an auto tranny or anything taller than 3.73s.
-Colin
If you want a rattl-e , drivetrain warbling vehicle in 3-4 years, grab the Ranger.
I suggest you read the Edmunds.com long term ranger road tests before you jump in.
Also be sure to check out this 1999 JD powers LONG TERM 5 year reliability study on all vehicles:
http://www.jdpa.com/studies/pressrelease.asp?StudyID=292&CatID=1
Notice the Ranger or F150 is nowhere on the radar..... notice all the TSB's and recalls I posted earlier...
Here is that Edmunds.com long term test link:
http://edmunds.com/vehicles/1998/ford/ranger/roadtests/wrap.html
OHV 4L - 160hp, 225ft/lbs of torque
2001 and later Rangers:
SOHC 4L - 207hp, 238ft/lbs of torque
Simple terms:
OHV = overhead valves (pushrod engine)
SOHC = single overhead cam (cam placement above valves)
They're two different schools of engine design, OHV being the less technologically advanced.
"In May 1999, drivers observed the first "clinks" from the transmission during deceleration and when backing up an incline. Our executive editor suggested that there might be a problem with the transfer case, given that no other symptoms, such as driveline shudder or shifting difficulty, were present. Two months later, the "clinks" had become definite "clunks," and we decided that a trip to a dealer was necessary.
"take a nice long test drive before you buy a used Ranger."
Edmunds.com
The problem was not resolved during the 15,000-mile service, so we took the truck back to the dealer in November 1999. The Ranger now had two distinct drivetrain issues: First, we observed that it clunked into gear when we moved the shift lever from "Park" to "Drive," "Park" to "Reverse" and so on. Second, shifts were hard and unrefined during acceleration. Hollywood Ford decided to lubricate the driveshaft yoke (a warranty repair), and drivers reported the transmission issues resolved.
But just before the end of the lease, our editor-in-chief experienced the harsh shifting again - and on one occasion, the transmission freewheeled when he turned off overdrive while coasting down a steep freeway descent. Wardlaw was a bit put off, since the Ranger was never asked to carry heavy loads or do any towing. Santa Monica Ford was unable to duplicate the Ranger's symptoms, so they did not pull out the transmission"
"We suspect that a Technical Service Bulletin (TSB) may even cover our disagreeable transmission, as we found several bulletins at the NHTSA Web site that specified buzzing, grinding, pings or thumps during acceleration."
"We did notice rattles coming from the dash and the intersection of the front and rear doors during the Ranger's first winter, but they seemed to be caused by cold temperatures."
"There was a brief period when we could not persuade the Ranger to shift into 4WD Low. Somehow this problem went away on its own, though we found several more TSBs that covered this problem and its annoying inverse — it seems that some Rangers get stuck in 4WD Low."
--Edmunds.com
"I currently have 35,000 miles on my 1998 extended cab, four door with the 4.0-liter engine and five-speed auto transmission. I have made several trips cross country and have been routinely driving to Oklahoma City. First, overall I really like the Ranger and hope to keep it for a long time, barring no major mechanical problems. I, too, have been very disappointed with both my Ford dealerships and Ford. I have also heard many complaints from other Ford owners, including the use of poor fitting non-Ford parts, poor service and lack of warranty support. Personally, I had front-end problems that dragged on for several months and, before my first oil change, the material on the driver's seat had severely wrinkled up. The seat foam and cover were replaced with no improvement. I personally inspected several dealerships over the past few years and found this to be a common problem. The upholstery shop the dealership sent me to said this was a flaw and that horizontal stitching was needed to fix. Note: The new Ford Rangers and those that were made before 1998 have this stitching. I contacted Ford through the Internet over a year ago; my warranty is about to expire and I have been ignored. I have also noted a rattle when I brake that sounds like a clock ticking, I hope to get it into the dealer here in Oklahoma. Bottom line, at 41 years of age and making enough money to buy just about anything on the market, and being a faithful Ford customer, I no longer plan to purchase a Ford product in my lifetime. As a customer I do not expect or demand perfection, I just expect a company to stand behind their products." — P. Shaffer, Wichita Falls, Texas
"But there was more to our relationship with the Ranger than our delight with the four-door convenience. Although the truck was a reliable servant (except for the flaky transmission) for two years, most of our editors would not want the Ranger for daily commutes, long trips or family excursions. But all of them would like to have one available for a spontaneous trip to the hardware store on a wintry day."
or:
"Ford revised the front suspension in 1998 Rangers to improve the ride and handling and added rack-and-pinion steering for better response. Most of our editors noted in the logbook that the Ranger handled quite deftly — some went so far as to call it almost car-like — while maintaining a strong truck identity. Even our "non-truck" staffers liked the Ranger, because it was easy to maneuver in city traffic and easy to coax into U-turns and parking spaces"
or:
"One driver wrote, "I pumped up the air in the tires before leaving Denver, since I knew how twisty [Highway] 285 is. When I pulled up into Montrose for the night, a green Plymouth minivan that was driving next to me on the highway showed up. The driver was also checking into the Best Western and commented, 'That thing sticks to the road like glue.' I think he was surprised at how quickly the Ranger handled the turns. I told him the tires were at 35 psi and that the stiff suspension kept it from leaning too far around corners."
or:
"Editors found many things to like about the truck's interior layout. We almost always found kind words in the logbook about the friendly design and simple placement of all controls — though nearly everyone found fault with the overdrive button on the end of the column shifter, that is, we all hit it inadvertently. And our editor-in-chief was disappointed that the power window and door buttons were not illuminated. Some made a case for larger stereo controls, but most were thrilled by the sound theater in the cab. One driver raved in the logbook, "Climbing into the [long-term] BMW today, with its upmarket Harmon Kardon speakers, proved disappointing; its much more expensive setup didn't match the Ford in sound quality." Another driver, who was also quite taken with the stereo performance as well as with the quality of the interior materials, said, "These standards are not matched by any other small pickup I've driven."
or:
"Our Ranger attempted to ply us with tidy handling, last-minute hauling ability, winter weather agility and durable red paint, and, in most respects, it did. Further, Ford created an off-road warrior that seduces onlookers even when covered in clods of dirt. Drivers continually remarked on the thoughtful and substantial interior design. And when we totaled up repair costs for the two-year period, . . .
NOW READ THIS REAL CLOSE SPOOG:
we were amazed to discover just how inexpensive it was to care for this Ranger. Nor did it spend any days out of service,
except when a dealer let it sit for a week without bothering to call us. Even when you include these seven days,
AND READ THIS TOO SPOOG:
our Ranger tied with our dependable long-term Toyota Camry for the fewest days spent out of service (among all vehicles that have taken part in our long-term program).
We hesitate slightly in lavishing praise on the truck by admitting that we wouldn't vouch for the continued health of its transmission - since we never did find a cure for its clunks. Owners may want to consider an extended warranty."
You forgot the pros and cons spoog:
What Edmunds.com says about the Ranger:
Pros: Excellent handling, four-door cab access, competent in winter weather and off-road, stunning exterior beckons voyeurs, user-friendly interior layout, favorable reliability record.
Cons: Needs more horsepower for authoritative passing, uncomfortable seats without height adjustment, clunky transmission may lack desired longevity, flareside design reduces bed capacity."
You forgot to say that I was quoted in the piece on Edmunds.
I bought a new '99 Tacoma and completely agree with you that the ride was just AWFUL! In addition, I felt the seats were very uncomfortable. Rather than spend MORE money attempting to fix things I didn't like, I sold the truck. I don't miss it. BTW- the new grille on the 2001 Tacoma is just plain UGLY!
From your posts, it sure seems to me that a Ranger may suit your personal needs/uses than a Tacoma, because you can buy a Ranger equipped exactly the way you want it and don't have to pay for things you don't want.