Tundra vs the Big 3 Continued V
This topic is a continuation of Topic 2269....
Tundra vs the Big 3 - Continued IV. Please
continue these discussions here. Thanks!
Front Porch Philosopher
SUV, Pickups, & Aftermarket and Accessories Host
Tundra vs the Big 3 - Continued IV. Please
continue these discussions here. Thanks!
Front Porch Philosopher
SUV, Pickups, & Aftermarket and Accessories Host
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Come on! You'd go ape if Toymota had a full size truck with running lights.
Libby can be trained! She didn't use the "y" word once! And she changed subjects to something other than Tundra hitches. I really miss the real rube though. Libby is just a cheap imitation.
I was wondering - If the Silverado is supposedly "full size" - why does it only weigh 2% more than the Tundra? They must be making it out of recycled beer cans.
This means that the Tundra is heavier duty. Those wimpy Silverados will be dropping like flies the first time you try to work them.
If you want a real heavy duty full size truck - get a Tundra.
incidentally, Webster's Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary (c) 1984 DOES list idealogy (yes, with an 'a') as a possible spelling for the word. one of the four definitions listed is "the integrated assertions, theories and aims that constitute a sociopolitical program". now, loosely defining this forum as a "sociopolitical program" (granted, more "socio" than "political"...) and one of my "aims" as proving your logic either false or incorrect, i am altering my ideology by removing that aim. henceforth, i will simply exchange my opinions and facts that i know to be true about my truck. this should save me a great deal of time, as i won't feel the need to correct your illogic.
bco
Answer me this. You say your 4 cam engine is so great, which it may be. But if you can get more power, better gas mileage, and it's cheaper to repair, wouldn't the GM single cam engine be a better choice?? Just more to go wrong if you ask me.
I'm kinda curious how Ford's new V-6 diesel with electronic valves will do...
guess bama hasnt seen the real heavy duty truck (2500HD and 3500)
With
quad -
wow, are you sure all those are TRUE? i mean, i was under the impression that tundras didn't have ANY brake problems. whoa...look out tundra owners.
got the opportunity to use my abs this weekend. was rainy all weekend and the roads were slick. i was doing about 40-45 in a 45 mph zone and some guy pulls out into the road without looking both ways. i planted my foot, felt that minor pulsation of the abs cycling and came to a steady controlled stop while this dude backed sheepishly back onto his side-road.
bco
kevin - you stated:
"I aint seen too many of them chevies or dodges
workin either. Mostly just see young kids and
"yuppies" driving the chevies. You never see any
contractors or state vehicles using them either.
All I see is the Fords, hmmm wonder why that is.
Not really, I know."
i was curious as to where you live? i'm in south carolina, and you see all manner of chevy, ford, and dodge trucks being used for work. as i've stated before, i've only seen about 50 or so tundras since they've been out. out of those 50, i would estimate that 1 or 2 of them were set-up for some sort of work (tool boxes, racks, etc.) but not a one was a commercial vehicle. i've only seen one towing anything (bass boat) and i've seen one with a bed-mounted camper. the big 3 trucks i've seen, on the other hand, are split differently. i'd say upwards of 33% of all new model big three trucks i see are being used for construction and contracting/small business type set-ups. you are right though, i think the state uses predominantly ford trucks. as for me, i don't wear a suit or loafers to work (not a yuppie) and as far as being a kid...well, i bought it myself, insure it myself, fully support myself...
bco
Why?!?
Never mind answering. I will continue to visit to seek out the few sparks of intelligent life herein whenever I find myself sufficiently bored.
Carry on, carrying on....
Sounds to me like you are a fence riding little whore.
I find it hard to believe that someone who tries to come across as the spawn of next-of-kin can have reasonable computer literacy. It makes more sense that we have one or more pseudo hicks acting as a shill for the Big 3. He keeps posting the same unfounded, meaningless tripe and we keep responding to it like it deserves consideration (like right now). Looking back over his subject matter, you see a circle of repetition: the Tundra’s not full size, the Tundra uses the Tacoma’s rear end, the Tundra’s not a working truck, the Tundra’s made out of tin, the Tundra Limited can’t be equipped with a hitch, yadda yadda yadda, and then he starts it over again. I wouldn’t doubt that he gets a dime from GM for every post he makes. “Here’s a list of addle-brained comments. Post a few each day and keep the Tundra crowd stirred up.”
I’ll debunk one topic: the lack of a Limited “factory” hitch. First he said you couldn’t get a hitch on a Limited. But it was pointed out that they were indeed seen on Limiteds. So then he says you can’t get a factory hitch on a Limited. So what? Are Reese or Draw-tite hitches any less reliable than a factory hitch might be? Do you hang a factory air freshener from your mirror? Do you put a factory dashmat on your dash? Do you put factory seat covers on? How about a factory alarm, a factory steering wheel lock, a factory bedliner, etc? Who cares if it’s “factory”?
Sorry for the sermon. I’m done.
hehe
Ryan
I'm confident in saying the only thing you had to learn at your job was, "Would you like fries with that?"
By the way please dont associate me with dodgeram7.
Mod - "Answer me this. You say your 4 cam engine is so great, which it may be. But if you can get more power, better gas mileage, and it's cheaper to repair, wouldn't the GM single cam engine be a
better choice?? Just more to go wrong if you ask
me."
I'm surprised! Someone actually wants to talk trucks. I will list some advantages of DOHC 4 alve per cylinder engines.
1) Smaller lighter valves require less spring tension and will rev higher without floating. They also require less lift. Less wear and tear on the cams and valve gear.
2) The cams act directly on the valves which does not side load the valve guides. This side loading is what causes valve guides to wear out.
3) The sparkplug can be placed in the direct center of the combustion chamber. This is the ideal position. Less valve lift allows for essentially flat top pistons which helps flow. The more efficient combustion chamber which results allows higher compression ratios without knocking. This allows the engine to run on any brand of regular gas.
4) Because of the flat top pistons and less valve lift, the engine can be designed to freewheel in the event of a cam belt failure. The Toyota is a non-interference engine.
5) The engine in the Toyota is in a very mild state of tune. This allows much greater potential performance with headers, cams, superchargers, etc.
6) The Toyota is an oversquare engine which allows for more compact, lighter, stronger engines.
As far as more power is concerned - although the Toyota is 12% less displacement it develops 97% of the torque at lower RPM. The Chevy torque peak is at 4000 rpm! The Toyota develops 3% less torque at 600 less rpm.
Gas mileage is affected by many factors. Of course, the most important factor is weight. The Tundra is essentially the same weight as the Chevy. Chevy geared their truck higher and ran it leaner to obtain 1 mpg more mileage. Many owners are complaining of problems with knocking on the Chevies.
Even though the Toyota engine is probably more expensive to work on - it is less likely to need work. The 4 valve DOHC V8 has been in production for many years and is a proven, bulletproof engine. You can drive a Tundra 180,000 miles with one cam belt change. Will a Chevy timing chain last 180,000 miles?
I agree with the KISS principle (Keep it simple stupid) but the DOHC engine actually has a much simpler valve train - no pushrods, rocker arms, rocker shafts, etc. I would not want to be the guinea pig for a new design, but 4 valve engines have been around many years. It is getting difficult to buy a japanese sedan without a 4 valve engine.
I'm sure the same argument raged when OHV engines replace flathead engines - but time marches on.
Dodgeram7, I'm sorry, you're just goofy. The econoline had a hatch inside the vehicle that made access quite simple when removed. I'll let you know how difficult it is to change my 10 spark plugs in another 90,000 miles. I'm guessing with a 1/4" drive air ratchet it'll be quite easy. As easy as the rear plugs by the exhaust manifolds on your precious dodges. Of course Dodge will be all OHC shortly. What will you say then dodgeram? I know, "Would you like that super-sized?"
We started shopping for the pickup after my wife decided that bigger is better for my safety on my daily commute through Dallas/Fort Worth area, SUV-saturated traffic. This quickly developed into new-car fever. Frankly, I personally liked only the F-150 appearance and only briefly considered the Tundra due to a perception of better reliability. However, after scanning through most of these versus topics and finding no real remaining serious problems (or really any problems!) with the F-150 being reported, I decided that the Toyota was simply more expensive and not necessarily better for me.
Internet research for invoice pricing of my preferred options and then e-mails to all Ford dealers within 100 miles resulted in some solid and decent pricing on a couple suitable 2000s. But then we returned to the dealer closest to us and re-examined the left over 1999 custom trucks they had on their lot (26 of them!). My wife convinced me of the beauty of one Toreador Red of those and we negotiated a decent price for it ($21,500) and bought it.
Our truck: 1999 F-150 XLT Supercab Short Bed, 4.6L V-8, 3.55 non-limited slip (wish it had been LS, but you can't have everything!) with 16" alloy wheels, Goodyear OWL tires, Duraliner (Ford labeled) bed liner, running boards, custom gold two-tone paint, fender flares, fog lights, added tinting for front side windows, Sony CD stereo, keyless entry, electric mirrors & windows, bench seat and we have added a Euro Lid II hard tonneau cover matching the Toreador Red paint. After only 6,000 miles, we still love it and that includes several drives 350 miles each way out to West Texas and back.
Incidentally, regarding the spark plugs: I talked to a (real!) Ford mechanic who said that these newer Ford V-8s are proving very reliable and easy to maintain. He did recommend pulling and/or replacing the plugs before 100,000 miles -- but that was because they can become welded to the engine block by leaving them in place so long and not because the platinum tips will fail.
FWIW (Fort Worth In Winter?) ;-)
Ryan
(Sorry, I just can't resist an opportunity to post a good, bad pun!)
Ryan
Good luck on this one now!
You got anything special planned for Thanksgiving?
Ryan
Ryan
We're going 350 miles one-way to my Dad's place in West Texas. Nice, but long drive. Still, it'll be nice when Dad moves closer -- soon, I hope.
Shim under bucket, shim over bucket, threaded adjuster....been there, done that on them all. (Many motorcycles)
It's exactly what you want to avoid in a truck, motorcycle/small car engine design.
Tundra needs TOO much maintenance, and YOU will pay for it. Replacing the cam belt will set you back at least $700, since they package this service with new water pump and front cover gasket. And you HAVE to have this service. Toy dealers are also fond of selling premature tuneup services, at 30,000 miles, inferring your warranty claim may be witheld if not performed.
For all the theoretical advantages of OHC engines, most don't pan out for truck applications. It may rev higher in theory, but the Tundras I drove shifted at exactly 5200 rpm, same as my pushrod Chevy. No efficiency benefit either, as EPA notes better city and highway MPG for 5.3L GM versus smaller 4.7L Toymota.
And then there is the price of parts....better dig deep inside your pockets when you need something. If that Tacoma pumpkin craps out, or T100 tranny needs clutches or torque converter....
Toyota builds them this way because this is their small truck know how. It can never be cost effective for a work truck, and that's why they won't see fleet service.