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Toyota Highlander

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  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Haven't seen the make-up ad. Sounds like a good thread for I don't like SUVs, why do you? :-)

    For some real fun, put some hi-test in a Briggs & Stratton mower engine that wants regular.

    Steve, Host
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    So, if the rate of flamefront travel isn't the issue then how is it that simply delaying the ignition spark for low octane stops pinging?

    Premium fuel can be ignited earlier in the cycle because it doesn't detonate as explosively, slower flamefront travel, as a lower octane would.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    gets the same fuel as whatever vehicle I happen to be fueling up at the same time, it never seems to care.
  • e825e825 Member Posts: 1
    I have owned a 03 HL V6 FWD non-limited with currently 12700 or so miles on it since April 03. I have read all of the comments good and bad on this site, and I waited too make a statement after reading as much as I could. I would like to offer my opinion/experience on the 03 HL. In an attempt to keep it short I will curb my enthusiasm. Since owning I have noticed that the response of this HUV seems to be to think with you, especially during emergency situations, inclement weather and when turning off your vehicle. I experienced recently what ABS feels like when you hit brakes on ice and how the vehicle responded, I was pleased that it stopped before impact and zero fish tailing which allowed for a controlled panic stop, not to say that it will not slide on ice because it certainly will but if you are in control as you should be at all times and drive intelligently, you can avoid most accidents. I hate to bring this up again, but those who drive with just the two back windows down, well get over it, thats all I dare say about that. I have so far "knock on wood" had no problems from this vehicle, with proper maintenance I anticipate a long life with this 03 model. Good luck to all other owners.
  • ohmygoshohmygosh Member Posts: 66
    Thinking about buyin' the Highlander. Don't really need that 3rd seat but I like the car.
    Does the 3rd seat on fold completely flat ???
  • 2003tls2003tls Member Posts: 100
    The 3rd seat on the 2004 Limited model I tested at the dealer folded completely flat. Of course, it also was extremely small and tight back there. I can't imagine anyone younger than 8 (can't fit the booster seat), or older than 14 using it.
  • ohmygoshohmygosh Member Posts: 66
    Does anyone know if Toyota will be offering a rebate or financing incentive in the near future. It seems they are the only auto maker not enticing the buyers at this time.
  • roadrunner70roadrunner70 Member Posts: 241
    on the v6, i am planning on draining and refilling the cooling system. there is a little drain tube hanging down on the driver's side of the radiator, how do you open it. besides iit is almost impossible to reach.

    did any one remove the bottom plastic cover to reach it. thank.s
  • vicvvicv Member Posts: 41
    So, if the rate of flamefront travel isn't the The issue then how is it that simply delaying the ignition spark for low octane stops pinging?
    _____________________________________________
    I'd love to know that myself. I have a friend who owns an engine dynamometer business on the side. He's also a physicist. I'm a logistics engineer in missiles. We've both toyed with cars and engines for decades. I have my theories and he has his about detonation, but we both agree that flamefront travels at speeds independent of octane rating. When a fuel/air mixure reaches the ignition point caused by the increasing temp/pressure, it will detonate. Introducing a spark really close to that ignition point may cause it to denonate rather than conflagrate. That would explain the detonation while the piston is still on the compression stroke. But retarding the spark a few degrees would have no significant affect on that - it would seen that you'd still get detonation. Gotta go have a cup of coffee with my old buddy and hash this out. Also, maybe there's more on this since the last time we discussed it.

    Thanks
  • bigdadbigdad Member Posts: 55
    the occurence of detonation and pre-ignition. They are not the same, although one hears the pinging or knock from both. Pre-ignition is caused by localized excess heat (carbon buildup, sharp edges in cyl or piston, or any other condition that causes the fuel to ignite before the spark plug fires. You hear the flame front collide with the piston before the desired time and a light ping or knock is the result. Preignition is similar to regular ignition in the single kernel of flame being produced, but at too early a point. Detonation is the collision of several flame fronts within the cylinder and when two or more collide produce a heavy shock wave or knock. Similar conditions can cause detonation as pre-ignition. Higher octane fuel reduces the explosive and self igniting capacity of the fuel and make it a more stable single flame front burning mixture.
  • sirfilesirfile Member Posts: 42
    Message to the Host . . .

    Perhaps a new thread entitled 'Flamefront Up Your Tailpipe' should be started for those that want to engage in esoteric discussions regarding detonation and pre-ignition.

    Toyota recommends 91 octane for the HL but its ok to experiment with other grades of fuel and make a decision based on price, performance, and fuel economy.

    Thanks
  • alaicoalaico Member Posts: 5
    I went to a Toyota dealer today and told him that I was interested in a Highlander, WITHOUT the 3rd row, a V-6 (Not the LIMITED EDITION) with Fwd. He told me it is not available. All V-6 models must have the 3rd row. Edmunds website clearly shows a Fwd model with the V-6 and no mention of the 3rd row seat. What is the truth??
  • lmacmillmacmil Member Posts: 1,758
    Local dealer has a 2002 HL Limited AWD, leather, sunroof, CD changer, etc. 29K miles (lease turn-in) and is Toyota certified. Oddly he's got it listed on Ebay. Current bid is $22K (reserve not met) with a buy-it-now price of $27.3K. It appears to be in excellent condition, clean title, etc. I will be checking it out tomorrow.

    What's a good price? Got almost a $4K spread between Edmunds TMV ($28.3k) and Kelly Blue Book retail ($24.6k).
  • lmacmillmacmil Member Posts: 1,758
    Depends on where you are located. If I put in my zip in the Toyota website I got to the Chicago region and all V6s come with 3rd row seat. If I punch in a Silicon Valley zip (94041), a 4x2 V6 Limited w/o 3rd row is available.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    What is the "Kelley Blue Book" Price?

    and

    Real-World Trade-In Values

    are two recommended links.

    Steve, Host
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    In many regions, the distributors are not ordering all configurations of the HL. That is likely the reason you are not finding them. Dealers are being honest when they say Toyota is not making them. They just need to add the term, "for us" at the end of their sentence.
  • 2003tls2003tls Member Posts: 100
    Just signed the papers on a brand new 2004 Highlander yesterday. I passed on the dealer's extended warranty (7 year / 100,000) miles for $2,000. Anyone know of a better deal?
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    $2000 for a warranty that is on Toyota's web site for $1425? That's a bit steep. Only Toyota dealers can sell the genuine Toyota Platinum plan warranties and many will sell them below the MSRP. Send an e-mail to other dealers to see if they can help.
  • 2003tls2003tls Member Posts: 100
    I checked out the Toyota website today and it made me angry that the dealer was trying to sell a 3rd party service contract for $2,000 when the official Toyota one is $1,425. Good thing I turned it down. Anyone have any experience with the official Toyota Service Contract (called Toyota Extra Care)?
  • bigdadbigdad Member Posts: 55
    that 91 octane fuel is recommended by Toyota for the HL. Toyota requires 87 octane fuel for the V6 (pump octane, which is similar to a 91 research octane rating). This (87)is the octane rating labeled at the pump. For improved performance they indicate that 91 octane (pump octane, or 96 research octane) can be used. Pump octane and research octane are determined differently. By the way, mixing regular 87 octane and 93 octane (pump octane) does NOT provide a 90 octane mixture....the mixing does not provide a linear response equivalent to the "average" of the blend. You will be perfectly safe using the regular grade of 87 octane gas (as labeled on the pump) in your HL per Toyota recommendations.
  • kwang9kwang9 Member Posts: 2
    I am thinking to buy a HL. I have a concern. Since it does not have rear AC, is front AC strong enough for a whole SUV?
  • priscprisc Member Posts: 16
    Hi there!

    I'm seriously considering the highlander as my next vehicle, although, I'll probably wait for the hybrid version. Anyway, I can't decide if the AWD is worth the extra $ and decrease in mpg. I was thinking this is probably one more thing that could go wrong and/or require regular maintenance. Is this true.

    I live in the Washington DC area so I don't do any off-road driving.

    I plan to own this vehicle for 8+ years or so.

    Thanks in advance!

    Jack
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    I think there is a topic in the "Warranties" section about this. I think it was specific to the Camry but the same ideas apply. IIRC the topic was "Extended warranties for a Camry" or something to that effect.

    I'm a fan of the Toyota Extra Care. Keep in mind, that is what I do for a living so take that opinion for what its worth, but I actually believe in these things. I don't think I could work in a dealership that sold aftermarket plans. I've just never seen one that comes close to the ease and clarity of the Toyota plan.
  • fvpfvp Member Posts: 147
    I have an '03 V6 4WD HL and in Western PA, it was well worth the few bucks for 4WD. I'm not only referring to snow - rain traction is excellent with all four wheels providing grip. It's tough to even find one around here without 4WD. It's a great system - you don't do anything except drive. No pulling handles, pushing buttons or wondering if the surface is slick enough to warrant engaging 4WD [like in our Jeep]. As far as I know, there is no regular maintenance required for the 4WD system.
    Gas mileage is around 20-22 MPG in mixed driving so I am giving up 1 or 2 MPG's for the 4WD. A small price to pay for me.
    One caveat: Our HL came with Bridgestone tires that were the absolute worst for snow traction. I just spent $550 for four Michelin Cross Terrain tires - problem solved.
  • snakehairsnakehair Member Posts: 120
    I live outside of DC (Gaithersburg) and have an '01 HL AWD Limited. Even with the limited snow we get, the AWD is great (in comparison to the Dodge Caravan and Honda Accord we also have). well worth the $$ and virtually transparent in driving feel.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    If it's like the RX you can put a shut-off valve in the engine compartment in the water jacket line and shut the flow off during the summer.
  • cliffy1cliffy1 Member Posts: 3,581
    Its worth it. True, we don't get a lot of snow around here, but we do get a fair number of days with freezing rain and sleet. Even on those nights were the temp is just above freezing, its reassuring to know you've got a better shot at traction with the AWD.
  • roadrunner70roadrunner70 Member Posts: 241
    on the v6, i am planning on draining and refilling the cooling system. there is a little drain tube hanging down on the driver's side of the radiator, how do you open it. besides iit is almost impossible to reach.

    did any one remove the bottom plastic cover to reach it. thank.s
  • phrosutphrosut Member Posts: 122
    I haven't drained the coolant, but I have removed/reinstalled the plastic shield in order to more easily change the oil filter. It was a quick and easy operation.
  • bigred54bigred54 Member Posts: 6
    A few weeks ago awchan13 wrote about putting new tires on his Highlander 235/70/16 dulers.
    While he's correct in describing the poor life of the OEM tires, upsizing from 225 to 235 is risky. As I found out, there is very little space between the wheels and the wheel well. A wider tire may rub or trap objects as small as pebbles, a very risky possibility!
  • roadrunner70roadrunner70 Member Posts: 241
    thanks phrosut,

    does the panel come down with only the visible screws or are there plastic plugs which are re-usable?? by the way, i do the oil changes from the top and once you get the hang of it, it is very quick and easy. avoids the removal time and trouble. thanks. rr70
  • bigdadbigdad Member Posts: 55
    upgrade from 225 to 235....I had the same concerns before I did mine, but measured and couldn't find the difference. The Integrity also has such weak sidewalls that they bulge more, especially in turns under load, than a good 235 profile. I bought Yokohama Outlandars in the 235x70x16 in the HT/S G051 configuration...very, very pleased with them.
  • gunturguntur Member Posts: 19
    I am in a big dilemma as to which of these three versions of HL (FW drive with 4 cyl or 4 wheel drive with 4cyl or 6 cyl) to get. Yesterday I test drove Corolla, Rav4, Matrix, HL 4x2 4cyl, HL 4x4 6 cyl, Honda Pilot and CRV. Both Hondas fell out of consideration because CRV doesn't have enough leg room and Pilot driver seat is like sitting in a tight box because of the rear AC/Heat module that sits in between the two front seats. I am a Honda fan and I own an Ody and both these Hondas drove and felt like Ody, so no complaint there.

    With Toyotas Corolla is descent and great for in-town use and short distance trips. Matrix engine was too loud and sounded like my old Camry when it developed a small hole in exhaust system. Didn't like Rav for its bumpy ride primarily and instrument panel design. That left me with the option of getting a Highlander. I liked the ride, handling, almost everything about it. Obviously the V6 is more powerful than the 2.4L 4 cyl engine which was not bad at all. I felt the 4 cyl HL performed more like my old Camry which also has 4 cyl eng. Even the base model of HL comes with ABS, Vehicle stabilizer and traction control systems which is what I am mainly looking for.

    If I don't care for the power of the V6 engine, is it OK to go with 4 cyl model with 4x4 drive. Or should I go with the FW drive only with 4 cyl engine. Is the 4 cyl engine too small for 4x4 drive ? I don't need 4x4 for towing or any such thing. It is for added safety! I plan on using this for long distance driving.

    Also, what should I expect to pay for these models of HL. Appreciate you feedback. Thanks in advance.
  • fvpfvp Member Posts: 147
    The 4 vs. 6 topic has been discussed at length here in the past, but in general, folks have been happy with either motor. It really depends on your personal situation.
    For me, I have an 03 V6 4WD. I live in Western PA where 4WD [and the V6] comes in very handy - and not only for snowy conditions. The grip that 4WD provides in the wet is comforting as well. Plus, it's hilly around here and the 4 cylinder seemed to struggle when pulling uphill - especially with the A/C on and 2 or 3 passengers. That's a lot for a 4 to lug around.
    My suggestion would be to drive them both until you feel comfortable in making a decision. After owning ours for 6 months I can tell you it has exceeded our expectations in every way.
    As for pricing, check out the Highlander topic "Prices Paid and Buying Experience". That should help you to get a feel for what kind of prices are out there.
  • phrosutphrosut Member Posts: 122
    It's just the screws you see, nothing hidden. Might take 5 minutes to remove and another 5 to replace. I do it while up on ramps and then get to do a pretty good visual inspection of lower engine, mounts, CV shafts, etc.
  • 2003tls2003tls Member Posts: 100
    I know it is personal preference, but I can't imagine getting a four cylinder engine, and then adding the extra weight of the All Wheel Drive system to it. Furthermore, the AWD drivetrain will have greater friction and inertia to overcome, which will make the 4 cylinder engine struggle even more. If you want the AWD, I would go for the V6. I did.
  • junepugjunepug Member Posts: 161
    We have a 2003 v6 fwd and the power of the v6 seems to handle the hills of eastern Kentucky quite well. I have also noticed it handled I77 through WV much better than the v6 that was in our old Jeep Cherokee. Basically it is a personal decision, but if you are facing a lot of hills, I would recommend the v6. My own personal opinion.
  • akat2000akat2000 Member Posts: 4
    A Mercury News column today talked about this. http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/business/industries/au- tomotive/7778094.htm
  • lmacmillmacmil Member Posts: 1,758
    The Mercury News article mentions trade-in which I hadn't thought of. There are very few 4 cylinder Highlanders (my local dealer typically has only 1 out of 10) which says retail demand is low. I suspect that would translate into lower trade-in value.
  • gunturguntur Member Posts: 19
    Thanks to all those that helped me decide in favor of V6 AWD HL version. Are there any option packages I must consider to get or to avoid getting based on your experience. Thanks again and I look forward to your feedback.
  • banner1banner1 Member Posts: 14
    Since this winter has been so cold-how many other Highlander owners have had the air bag warning light flashing a code after start up on a near zero morning? The light stops flashing later in the day as the temp. goes up. Has anyone gone to the dealer with this condition & what did they say? I find it hard to believe that the air bag will not work when it is below zero, here on Long Island that is about as cold as it gets but what about other areas such as upstate N.Y. -20 this morning in some areas, it will not get warm enough for the light to go off! Will the air bag work when the light is flashing? Thanks...
  • twosmgstwosmgs Member Posts: 11
    At the Detroit Auto Show, Toyota displayed the upcoming 2005 hybrid. It has a new chrome grill which IMO is much classier than the current style. The hybrid will be out in early 2005, but the regular 2005 model should arrive in late summer or early fall. Does anyone know if the new grill will be incorporated on the regular Highlanders as well as the hybrids?
  • QuazimotoQuazimoto Member Posts: 15
    Has anyone compared the RX with the HL? I have a 99 RX with 100k on it. It is a great vehicle, and I want to trade my Acura TL-s in for a new RX or HL. I Drove an HL last weekend. It was a FWD with Integra tires. Way too noisy. I am assuming the tires are the problem, as the noise sounded like tire noise.

    I realize I will be giving up some toys with the HL vs the RX, but the noise was unacceptable. What have HL owners noted about different tires and noise?

    Also, the FWD HL had a lot of torque steer. I have never had that in my 4wd RX. Is that a FWD issue?

    Thanks!
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    The Lexus will have a great deal more isolation and insulation to lower the noise level. Torque steer is a function of FWD but the HL and the RX should have about the same with FWD or AWD, same drivetrain and same initial (no slippage) torque biasing, 95/5 F/R.

    Torque steer is most noticeable when accelerating and turning, hard acceleration and tightly turning would make it most pronounced. Since the left halfshaft is shortest they will always torque steer, "pull", to the right.

    Some have said that the newer models, 04, do not exhibit (as much??) torque steer.
  • 2003tls2003tls Member Posts: 100
    I looked at the RX330 before I went with the Highlander. Yes the RX is a lot nicer and has more goodies, but it would have cost $7K more. I couldn't justify the price difference.
  • grapevinetxgrapevinetx Member Posts: 89
    Of course, the first statement is that they are much more alike than different. HL has a little more cargo room towards the back and roof due to more squared-off rear body lines. As 2003tls says, RX has more high-end goodies available, for a price, if that's what you're looking for. In my area, all RX have a mirror tint on the rear windows, unlike HL which has a more flat black / dark gray. Not sure if the mirror is factory or region-added, but it's on all RX around here.

    I'm a little surprised that you found the HL noisy, as many consider it quiet compared to alternatives such as Pilot and Murano. I'm not so sure that the GY Integrities are the source of the noise as their strengths are soft ride, low noise, high mpg. Many would say that they also have weaknesses around rain traction and treadwear. They are something like a value version of the Michelin Cross-Terrain, with emphasis on value, heavy emphasis.

    Did you drive a 4-cyl. or 6-cyl. HL? There are pros/cons to both, but the 4-cyl. certainly generates more engine noise than V6.
  • zorglubzorglub Member Posts: 79
    Hello,

    I would like to get the feedback from some fellow board members. I'm planning on trading in my Accord for an SUV. I am looking for an SUV with full independent suspensions, 3rd row seats for the kids in a pinch (1 and 5 year old), a V6, AWD to go skiing and a tow hitch to haul my stuff to the dump once in a great while. Based on the above, I narrowed it down the HL and the Pilot. I am interested in hearing about what others think the main differences are between the HL and Pilot, to help out in my decision.
  • mckeownmckeown Member Posts: 165
    My wife narrowed her choice to the same 2. After a 2nd and 3rd test drive, she chose the Highlander. The Pilot, while as smooth running as you are aware Honda's are, Is built on a truck frame. By the 3rd test drive, she definately felt the difference. Being our use is back and forth thru the Pocono's to take care of aging parents (not off roading), the AWD, 3rd row seat, better MPG and as I stated repeated test drives made her decision.
    I personally felt bad for the Honda Rep. He put a lot of time and a decent deal on the table. But the choice was hers and 4 months later she is still pleased. We also got a Great deal on the Highlander thru buycar.com .
    My $.02
  • QuazimotoQuazimoto Member Posts: 15
    I was driving the 6 cyl HL.

    Based on the feedback you all are providing me, I need to drive the HL again.

    I agree with the feedback. The RX is nice, but that nice will cost ~$6-8k. So, if the HL is quiet enough (I am somewhat deaf, so quiet means I can hear peole talk) then the HL is the deal.
  • lite112lite112 Member Posts: 5
    Looking at getting HL FWD v6 with tow package. We need to be able to launch and pull up a 20ft party barge. The boat launch is right next to our camp so we will not have to travel much distance. Just need to be sure we can get our boat in and out of the water when other family members with trucks are not there. Any comments?
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