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Comments
Honda volutarily recalled the all V6 transmissions in the fleet. That shows that they take a proactive approach when they find they have a problem.
They have voluntarily recalled parts things not even this important when they find design defects.
http://www.accidentreconstruction.com/news/may02/052302b.asp
http://www.accidentreconstruction.com/news/may99/051299b.html
I own a 2003 SI and an 04 Odyssey. I also own a 04 Accord EX-L but I'm dumping it due to the tranny issues, even though we aren't having any. That was the final straw since we wanted to get rid of it for a 5 speed anyway.
As a person who test driven both the Rav4 and CR-V and done extensive research, there's no clear winner. But as a CR-V owner, if I knew then what I know now...I'd go with the Rav4.
I own a '99 CRV and if I were in the market again for a compact SUV, I'd pick a low mileage 2001 CRV. Simply beacuse it's the last year of that model design, which I'm happy with. Mine has been rock solid, just a couple annoyances. It's easy to do the maintenance myself. I've got 96K miles and all I've done is scheduled maintenance, one set of tires, a battery, and two brake jobs.
Also, in examining the A02 I noticed that the gasket free turns in the channel of the filter body and can be easily pulled out.
Investigation continues!
Steve, Host
After removing the old oil filter, simply look at it to make sure the old gasket didn't stick on the mounting plate as they sometimes do on ALL cars. Take a shop rag and wipe off the mounting plate.
Apply a thin film of oil on the new gasket and install the filter making sure it's tightened properly.
Nothing to it unless someone gets careless or in too much of a hurry!
Oil filter relocator - yes, these exist. In fact they're sold for the Miata for a different reason - access. The filter is on the side of the block, under the intake (not the hot exhaust side), and it's kind of hard to reach. The kit moves the oil filter to a more accessible position, closer to the bottom of the engine I believe.
extech: 12 minutes for an oil change? That's kind of squeezing the techs, and *that* may be the real problem - if you have to rush, and Honda is the one that determined it should take just 12 minutes, well, mistakes are more likely when you're in a hurry.
I mean, you have to drive the car in, put it on a lift, raise it carefully, drain, remove the oil filter, clean the area thoroughly, pre-fill the oil filter, oil the new gasket, double-check that the old gasket is on the old filter, recycle the oil drained and the stuff in the old filter, replace the oil filter, torque the drain plug to specifications, refill, check the oil level, top off if necessary, lower the car, start it up to test it, and fill in the paper work. In 12 minutes.
I can change my oil quickly, but I don't think I can do it in 12 minutes, even with rhino ramps. And I'm not doing any paper work, plus I recycle the oil later, and I'm not including that amount of time.
Is Honda's pressure on the techs to finish in 12 minutes the real problem here? Just throwing that out there for thought.
-juice
Namely, the oil filter itself, since not all Hondas use the same one, and the drain plug gasket, which should be replaced at each oil change.
-juice
Norne - With the percentages we are talking about here, it is very possible that the 2002 models escaped problems because of dumb luck.
That's a nice perfect world you live in.
-juice
If I were Honda I'd think I would have:
1) Immediately send a TSB for my techs to be especially carefull when changing the oil.
2) Designed a new filer or gasket or design to allow for the occasional human error that may occur when changing oil so it does not result in a fire; allbeit one car or one thousand. Quietly implement such a change as well.
3) Cover the expense under warranty and give those very 'few' affected a new vehicle thus keeping the whole situation quiet.
4) Thank the lord no one was hurt.
Instead they just stick with the finicky design, and blame the techs. Which costs more in th end?
Oh yea, does this mean the independent shops will now have to be so overly carefull when they change the oil that they will have to charge more for CRVs? Will the independents soon refuse to service them? How will this affect the reputation. I wonder how it affects insurance?
I think this is a really simple issue. Technically Honda may be correct that it is the tech's fault. But only because of some design issue that makes changing the oil on the CRV more particular than the norm. Hopefully that issue can be corected in a manner that gives the tech a margin of error that every other make and model appears to allow.
The second issue is reputation. It does not take much to besmerch your reputation when you are on the top. Whether desreved or not. You should always be on the look out to protect it.
Again I have no doubt the CRV is a great vehicle. ( I must check out these tranny issues though) My issue here is how these large corps appear arrogant when there is such an issue as the one being discussed.
Give them 18 minutes so they can do it right, even if you have to charge a tad more.
-juice
http://www.freep.com/money/autonews/recall24_20040224.htm
1. Don't run red lights
2. Make sure you remove the old gasket material.
I don't think it's a "finicky design". I just think Honda figured the people changing the oil were smart enough to do it right. These are no different than any other car. This is NOT Honda's fault!
You are right about reputation. People tend to fix on and amplify what is bad. Human nature.
And CRV's have no "transmission issues". The cars that do have issues are very limited in actual problems.
varmint Apr 29, 2004 10:25am
I did 5 o/c and ready for 6th. (I do o/c every 5K). After Sabrina's fire I always double check for leaks after changing filter. I did not have any problems - I am very happy with my CR-V EX 03.
elissa
Thank you,
JN
( sorry to change the subject)
Yeah, that's what I would do. But why did you buy that Dakota among all those fine dependable automobiles ? I gave up American since 1980s, never looked back.
HAVING JUST HAD THE FIRST OIL CHANGE PERFORMED ON MY 2004 HONDA CR-V, I WAS ONLY A FEW BLOCKS AWAY FROM THE DEALERSHIP WHICH PERFORMED THE OIL CHANGE (HANOVER HONDA IN HANOVER, PA) WHEN SMOKE STARTED POURING OUT FROM UNDER THE HOOD AND THROUGH THE AIR CONDITIONING VENTS. I MANAGED TO GET THE VEHICLE OFF THE STREET AND THE IGNITION SWITCHED OFF WITHIN SECONDS OF THE LOW OIL WARNING LIGHT COMING ON. I WAS TOLD BY THE ASSISTANT SERVICE MANAGER THAT IT APPEARED THE OIL FILTER WAS DEFECTIVE. AFTER HEARING REPORTS IN THE NEWS (ON JULY 9, 2004) OF OTHER CR-V OWNER WHO EXPERIENCED FIRES IN THEIR VEHICLES THAT SEEMED TO ORIGINATE WITH THE OIL FILTER, I WANTED TO FILE THIS REPORT WITH NHTSA.
Thanks for the info regarding Door Edge Guards...
much appreciated.
JN
Steve, Host
Clueless? Because I'm not hysterical over 35 botched oil changes? LOL
icvci: I understand that the odds of having a defective filter is very low but, as you see, that happens also. I heard horror stories about bad filters on other autos which resulted in oil loss but no fires (again Honda fault).
Edunnet: I am not "brave", actually people are brave who trust Beaves/Buttheads "grease-monkeys", who must finish there job in 12 minutes.
Quick o/c job is an oxymoron. - you suppose to leave oil drip as long as you can afford (in time) - I leave it drip overnight. If you did your own o/c and have the skills for it - continue to do it! All in your own hands. In case o/filter is bad (which is unlikely) double check for leaks after test drive.
As far as the trannys go I was reffereing to Odessey van problems that appear to be occurring. I can not say for sure what the deal is with the trannys but if you look in some of the other minivan forums they are being mentioned.
Again, its all perception.
Yes something DID change, THE ENTIRE VEHICLE!!!!!!!!!! Geesh! Haven't you seen an older CR-V on the road? It's different. Different exterior. Different interior. And a different engine. Of course something changed!!!
And I do subscribe to the fact that this is an issue that only affects vehicles worked on by buffoons. I have never had an oil filter leak in 15 years of doing my own oil changes. Never. Zip. Zilch. Nada.
Ya know you can blow up your car if you don't jump the battery correctly. Who's fault would that be? Yours for not knowing how to do it or the manufacturers for making sure you couldn't do it?
If you overload a circuit in your home and catch it on fire, who is to blame? You or the manufacturer of the appliance? Or maybe the home builder?
How about dryer ducting? Lots of people burn their houses down every year by using flexible ducting. Yet it is still available and people still use it. Even though consumer groups and fire departments preach the hazards. Should the dryer manufacturer be held accountable for making a dryer that fits the flexible duct?