Jeep Wrangler

chasingerica

The seven speakers look like the factory 4 except there is a sub in the center console. They get 7 by counting the sub, the 2 in the sound bar, and 4 in the dash. The 4 in the dash are actually 2 speakers and then 2 tweeters on top of them. It really doesn't show any different. As for the Dana44 in the rear and the D30 in the front I know there is a difference but I can't think of what it is right now.

Tony

tsjay

The Dana 44 is a much stronger axle, and you should be very glad that you have it.

The front diffs on all Jeeps, except for the Rubicons, are Dana 30s. Rubicons have the Dana 44s front and back. The front axle usually takes much less of the load compared to the back, so they put the lighter-duty Dana 30s up front.

The standard rear diff is the Dana 35, but the Dana 44 is an option on the Sport and on the Sahara models. The 44 is not available on the SE, nor on the X models.

Having the Dana 44 allows you to run bigger tires and to run a locker without as much of a chance of breaking the axle.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

mtngal

Definitely check out Paul's photos on webshots - they are excellent! I love the 3-some picture - Tom, Ross Allen and Thelma Jane. Though I do admit that I'm having second thoughts about wanting to go 'wheeling with Tom - don't think my stock Noble Black Steed could handle some of that stuff. Sure looked like fun, though!

tsjay

Hey, those pics of Stan in the red XJ were taken in Buttpucker Gulch. I have been in there three times with Thelma Jane, and I had to winch out twice and back out once. That place is more than we can handle right now. We had fun watching Stan, attempt it, though.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

erickpl

Better him than you in those shots, eh Tom?

I imagine BP Gulch will be a bit 'easier' once it dries out. That stuff was slippery even with my hiking boots!

-Paul

mullins87

NOT RELIABLE?!?!?!?!?! Have your father read the nearly 13k posts in this forum alone and he will find very few real problems. I must admit that I haven't had my Jeep very long, but my little 4-banger, stripped down, no carpet, no radio, softop has such a good heater on it that it will run you out on the coldest days. And finally, safe is relative. Are you talking safe as compared to a Volvo, or safe compared to a Yugo. I believe the TJ actually ranks better in frontal crash testing than the Grand Cherokee, or so I've read.

tsjay

Like Jim (mullins87) said, have Pop spend some time in here reading old posts. Then pick any other type of vehicle and go the discussion board for that vehicle. Bet you will find FAR fewer posts about problems in here than you will in the other one!

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

mtngal

I have a '98 with over 117,000 miles on it, and the only expensive repair was the exhaust manifold (I think there was a recall for this with the '97 model year Wranglers). I think that's pretty reliable.

I have a hard top, not a soft top, but it doesn't have any insulation - just a fiberglass shell. They are just as safe as the soft top, just provide more security. The heater works quite well in winter (and it does snow here).

I love my Wrangler and don't plan on replacing it any time soon. It has been such a fun, tough vehicle that we've thought about replacing our 2000 Tacoma, which is very uncomfortable, with either another Wrangler or one of the upcoming Wrangler Unlimiteds.

div2

Have your Dad read post #12221. My 1999 has been very reliable. As I noted in my post, All I've had to do is replace the radiator, steering stabilizer, and-just last month-the original battery. Not bad for a five year old vehicle with nearly 70K on the odometer. The soft top and HVAC keep the interior warm in the winter and cool in the summer. I'd rather have my son driving the Wrangler than most subcompacts.

chasingerica

I'll kick in my vote for ya. Two weeks after I got my Wrangler this winter we had 8 inches of snow and ice fall. I have a soft top but when I posted pics Tom said it looked more like a hard top. It was a hard top at the time it had 1/2 an inch of ice covering it. No damage at all to the soft top, it's perfectly fine. The heater never makes it to max, even when it was 0 degrees outside I was sweating inside in a t'shirt. I was up at the dealer the other day, getting the oil changed and asking about mods, and there was a guy up there with a '97. He had 145,000 miles on it and had no problems. (well he had one prob, he was running 35" tires and still had the original gears so it was a little slow, installing new gears would fix that, and he was doing that anyway) Keep the oil changed and bolts tight and it will treat you great.

Tony

mtngal

Urr! I can't believe some people! It's like they go out into the "wilderness" and their good sense goes out the window.

This morning I was up on a forest service ridge not far from homes and ranches (a mile or 2 away). I found a large log and a campfire smoldering along with a bag of trash left out in the open. The campsite (which was not in a campground) had been abandoned. How dumb can you get - the snow melted a couple of weeks ago and it has been warm and very dry since (like 20% humidity much of the time). The sage brush etc. has really dried out. And someone left a smoldering log and a hot campfire with trash all around.

Please, everyone, be careful out there. I want the areas that are still open to off-roading to remain open. But if thoughtless people keep doing DUMB things like that, everything will get closed. I know - I'm preaching to the choir, but it just makes me so mad that I need to blow off steam a bit. Thanks for being so understanding.

tsjay

What can I say? There is NO EXCUSE for this stuff, whether it is campers, offroaders, or whomever.

RESPECT THE RESOURCE!

I always pick up other people's trash at Turkey Bay. WHY SHOULD THIS BE NECESSARY????

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

jptj

RELIABLE? I have over 160K on my TJ, and I do not have to add oil between changes. Only Two repairs:
At 78K replace the Radiator, 141K A/C (leaking freon)

erickpl

I can vouch for Tom's offroading habits. Great habits to follow.

Tread lightly and pack in, trash out!

As for reliability, some may think replacing a radiator is a major thing, as div2 mentioned he did. I replaced mine too, and I'm NOT a mechanic. 4 or 5 bolts hold it on. Pull out, drop in, reattach. It is THAT easy.

My exhaust manifold went too, as did mtngal's. This was addressed by 1999, so is now a non-issue for new TJ's. My catalytic went out, but that has happened on my Mazda and my Pontiac so I won't include that as being a TJ only problem.

As for safety, yes, TJ's can roll over. But don't drive stupid and you'll be okay. This is NOT a sports car. It is a high CG, narrow wheelbase vehicle and as long as you drive with consideration to WHAT you are driving, you're fine. If you DO roll it over, the roll cage will support the vehicle's weight. I've seen photos of rolled jeeps, and the roll cage, while bent a bit in a few photos, supported the passenger cabin and did not leave them trapped. Not many cars can say that.

-Paul

chasingerica

Well 2 weeks ago it was 70 and I had the top down for 2 days. Today I wake up there is snow on the grownd, it's sleeting and in the low 30's. It's been raining all day. I just can't believe it. I love the snow and all but man if it's going to get warm it better stay warm.

Oh well just as fun driving the jeep in bad weather as it is sunny

Tony

ponm

Hello everyone,
    Just wondering if anyone has a half top on their TJ. I have a 2003 and bestop has yet to make a half top for the 03 but makes one for the 97-02 model year. I have heard that the 97-02 top will not fit on the 03 model because the roll bars on the 03 model are larger. I have taken off the padding and there seems to be no difference in rollbars sizes. Then I heard the header could be different but all I could tell is that jeep just put a bunch of plastic at the top that really dosen't effect the header at all. I don't know, what do you guys think? By the way, I have the half doors also. -scott

gman1259

Before you make a decision, like buying a half top for a different year Wrangler, go to Bestop web site. I could not find a “Safari” style top for my 04. In fact I contacted a supplier who said he could not find a listing for the top. I then e-mailed Bestop directly and they responded to with the part number I needed. And I do believe the header for the 03 and 04 is different from earlier models.

Glen

tsjay

Scott:

I think the header would just about have to be of a different design for the 03s and 04s, because of the plastic above the windshield.

I have the BesTop safari top for my Thelma Jane, and I use the no-drill header. I can see where the plastic cladding on the 03s and 04s might make my header unuseable for them.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

chasingerica

I know that they make a bikini/ safari top for the 03/04 model so I'm sure that by now they are also making a half top. Personally I was looking at the Mopar Sunbonnet/ Windjammer/ tonneau cover. It's not a complete enclosure but the top covers the sound pods too which I like. There are tons of options and most are made for 03/04 now so just look around. You could also check out the GatorTop which looks pretty cool but a little expensive.

Tony

bamatazz

Hey... jeepers.. Hope you guys havent forgot about ole BAMA here.. Everything going well here Tazz is ALL clean & shiny. I have the "No Drill" bikini top for TAZZ. That 1st time installing it was a major PAIN!. But after a few times its no problem. Its Definatly getting JEEP weather here in the south, time to take hard top off & get my soft top on. KEEP JEEPIN! BAMA

gman1259

I put my soft top in yesterday. Now I hear the weather is going to change again, dropping the temp from the 90s to the 60s.

Still haven't ordered the "Safari" top yet. Plan to do that sometime in June. I probably will not need until the June gloom is gone.

Glen

tsjay

Hey, Terry!

Ready to come up here and let Tazz have some fun at Turkey Bay with me and Thelma Jane (and Ross Allen, of course)?

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

mtngal

We never forget about you - I think about you every so often when you don't post much. We need someone to clean up our image! After all, not everyone who wants a Wrangler is going to off-road, and having a long time person around who loves their show-room condition Wrangler is great!

Glad to hear that Tazz is still in mint condition.

erickpl

I have the Safari top with the no drill header. With it in the 80's and 90's here, I think I'll be installing it this weekend before we go to Hungry Valley (if we go this weekend).

I still have the original bikini top that came with our TJ, but the Safari will cover the backs of our necks and the rear passengers.

-Paul

mac24

Link one........a comparison of apples and oranges. Discovery, Wrangler, H1, and a Toyota pickup. Each has their own merits but picking a 'winner' has no real meaning.

Link two........a staged exercise to pretend to destroy a Toyota pickup. Jeremy Clarkson was the ideal immature frontman for this (50 going on 15). British 'Tonka Toy' Toyota owners must have been cheering as they watched the program before their parents sent them to bed.

Believe me, if I'd run it into the wall, or swung the wrecking ball, or set the fire, there's no way it would have started afterwards!

chasingerica

Didn't read the second link, it didn't talk jeep so I was concerned. As far as the first link their only complaint of the TJ not having a Locker is easy to fix. All you have to do is get a Rubicon instead of a Sport. They were comparing a mid range TJ to a top package Taco, they need to compare top to top. My Rubi has both front and rear lockers. I haven't gotten out and tested them, haven't needed to, it does everything I want without them. I'm sure that if I got stuck they would get me out of anything that I was brave enough to try at this point.

Tony

dchristo1

I am trying to get a feel if the Sailcloth tops are really as quiet as the marketing hype. I am thinking of upgrading my top and would like to know if I spend the extra bucks I'll actually hear the difference from my standard 1999 vintage soft top.

Thanks in advance for all of your help!

David

twylie

I read the links you provided and here are my thoughts...

For the most part, I agree with the comments in the fourwheeler.com article. Too bad they didn't do a fair comparison (top line vehicle against top line) , i.e. pick a Rubicon to participate. It looked like the big criticism was the lack of a rear locker in the TJ. While the engineering and build quality on the Toyo products I've driver or owned (Supra and Lexus coupe) is generally excellent, there is NO, ZERO, NONE, ZIP, NADA way the Tacoma/Hilux beats the Wrangler for fun and driving pleasure.

I've driven both, and for mild offroading and general use the TRD Taco is a decent vehicle IMO. On the Taco, IFS and its breakover angle (especially on extra cab) will keep it from doing serious rocks or any offroading requiring lots of articulation. If you've got a Taco and like it, great, but unless you're ready to trade it, don't ever drive a Wrangler with the top down in the mountains or on the beach!

If you're here to try and suck us into long discussion on "my truck is better than your truck", you'll probably have better luck on the other boards you posted these links on. This is a pretty laid back group that loves their Jeeps. A few on here own or have owned Tacos and if they had to choose, I'd wager no one would give up their Jeep for the Taco.

-twylie

tsjay

David:

I wish I had some personal experience with the sailcloth vs older type soft tops, but I don't.

I can tell you, though, that by ALL ACCOUNTS, the sailcloth is night and day different and MUCH better than the old type of soft top for noise.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

chasingerica

I've been in plenty of Jeeps over the years from CJ5's on up. My top is much more quiet then my bosses YJ's top or even the top off a 2000 that a guy I work with has. If I was going to get a new top I would definately make sure it was sailcloth just for my mind.

Tony

gman1259

I do not know about the sail top either. However, the new soft top they are putting on the Wrangler now is a great product. I put the soft top on Ellie’Mae and can tell you I cannot tell ant difference in the noise level from the hard top.

Glen

chasingerica

The new factory soft tops are sailcloth. They are a 3ply design instead of the 4 ply that Bestop uses but they are still sailcloth. If I'm not mistaken Bestop actually makes the material for the factory. Good to know it's no louder then the hardtop now days.

Tony

gman1259

I did not know that...Then I would recommend buying the sailcloth top without reservation.

Glen

twylie

When we were buying our Jeep, we almost bought a 2000 modem off a dealer lot. When we could not reach agreement on price, we started looking at 2001s and were very pleased with the reduction in noise with the sailcloth. Since we have the soft top only, this was a great improvement to us. I dont' think you'll be sorry if you go with the sailcloth.

-twylie

mtngal

I have both a 2000 Taco and a 1998 TJ. I hate the Taco because the seats are uncomfortable, where the TJ has very comfortable seats. I'm in the process of refinancing my home so I can pay off the Taco - I still owe more than it is worth - and I'll sell it as soon as I decide what I really want that will fit all my needs (I know, I'm dreaming). My Wrangler will be 6 years old next month, is paid off and I love it dearly. That's my opinion (and I did read the article - they said that if the Wrangler had had a locker the results would have been different).

That's my 2 cents on the topic.

drosketer

Howdy folks! How's everyone doing? Tom, you still off the smokes?

Haven't posted in a while, been out driving Buffy. I can't believe how much I love driving... still way too cold to take the top down (flurries expected over the next few days) but hopefully within a month or so I can try to get the softtop on!

Have been off-roading about once a week, fairly mild stuff (managed to get some mud inside Buffy when I left the windows open while on a muddy climb) but tremendous amounts of fun. Also picked up a Warn/Mopar engine skid (yet to be put on), as well as taillight guards and (soon) the steering box skid. No plans for lifts as I won't be able to get her into my parkade but eventually...

Must have missed something (like the message with the links), but comparisons tend to be useless. It's like the one that seems to crop up all the time comparing H1s and Wranglers. They both have their strengths and weaknesses... but what's the point of comparing them?

Lastly, not sure if anyone noticed, but the vehicle that the president of Taiwan was in during that assassination attempt was a TJ (guessing pre '03 model based on the soundbar). You can see a couple of pics over on the BBC news site. Cool that he chose a Wrangler... although probably not the best thing to be in when people are taking potshots at you!

Andrew

erickpl

YES, GET THE SAILCLOTH.

We had the original 97 top on our TJ and we could see the sun through it. The sailcloth top (Bestop) was VERY easy to install and it is MUCH quieter. The multilayer design makes for a quiet and sealed design.

Just keep the fan going to bow out the windows so they don't flap.

-Paul

dwrestle

I was wanting to know what kind of gas mileage Wranglers get. What kind of gas mileage does the 4 cylinder get, and what kind of mileage does the 6 cylinder get?

Another question I have, is it worth it to get the 4 cylinder for better gas mileage, or is it not even a big enough difference to even consider losing so much power for the 2.4 or 2.5 depending on what year I get?

tsjay

I can see you are "dwrestling" with the decision between the four banger and the six.

Wrestle no more. Get the six! The 4.0 will get within about one mile per gallon the same gas mileage, and it will have MUCH better power.

Now, I have to admit that I have not yet driven a Jeep with the 2.4, which replaced the 2.5. The 2.4 is supposed to have better power than the 2.5, but it would need a LOT more to even get close to the 190 HP and great torque of the 4.0.

If you would only be around town and/or on the trails with the Jeep, then the four banger would be fine. However, any highway driving, and especially any highway driving in hilly country, would be a PAIN with the four banger.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

tsjay

Eleven weeks and counting.

I STILL have entire days that are ROUGH! I thought it would just be the occasional strong urge by this stage of the game. Not so.

Thanks for asking.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

mtngal

I get a pretty consistent 20 mpg on the road with hilly driving, almost all highway. BUT - and that's a big but - I get that by driving around 65 and never going over 70 without wind. Add wind or go over 70 and your mileage will drop significantly.

By the way, when I say hilly, I mean mountainous, really, though it is at freeway speeds. I live at about 6,000 feet and work at sea level - 75 mile one way commute. The extra gas I use going uphill is more than made up by what I save going downhill.

My best gas mileage was in the mountains going through Sequoia National Park and I don't think we got over 55 mph. We made about 22 mpg that trip.

tabbeanboo

I have been reading all the posts for sometime now and thought it was about time to enter. I am also considering purchasing a 2004 Wrangler. I owned a 91 jeep years ago and since selling it I have realized that there is nothing out there that is as much fun as the wrangler. I don't do any off-roading, I just enjoy the wind in your hair, the open country, time by myself and my maker, hunting, fishing, and most important other than my maker....my grandson. He is only 9 months old but my guess is that he would love to own a well taken care of 15 year old jeep! I know I would have. So that's my plan...buy the jeep and give it to him 15 years from now....I just have to make it till then to give it to him!...anyway, thanks for listening....I appreciate all the info you all have provided!...oh, one more thing...I noticed a few guys/gals from Central Pa...that's my home also......take care and God Bless.
Big Lou

tabbeanboo

One more thing before I leave on vacation for a few weeks. I use to smoke way back when....yea it's tough to quit.....but I had someone put it to me this way....
Do you enjoy smoked ham, smoked porkchops, smoked salmon ....I think you get the picture...THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT YOUR DOING TO YOUR THROAT, VOICE BOX, LUNGS AND THE REST!! your cooking your body...I don't mean to be gross...but that's what cancer is...GROSS...trust me I know!
God Bless.......Big Lou

oprystar

Hello all. I love this group. I have been reading for some time now. Today, I decided to join in....My wife and I have decided to buy another Jeep, this time a 6 cylinder Wrangler. This will be number four. The other three (Golden Eagle, Scrambler, and a Limited) have been bought and sold over the years. I have been test driving a few late model used Wranglers, and today I went and drove a new Wrangler X with a soft top. Oh my gosh! No noise at all from the top! Bear in mind, I was reminiscing an old 1978 Golden Eagle, whose top was louder than a KISS concert. This new Wrangler very much impressed me. The new soft top impressed me even more, both in the lack of noise and in the ease of removing and installing.

mtngal

to both Lou and oprystar! Don't hesitate to post - we love having new people around to share the fun.

Hmmm, 15 years on a Wrangler? I'm only a year away from being half way there. Except for my last pickup, I've never owned a car more than 3 years, so perhaps I'll have this Wrangler for that long.

Last summer I test drove an X with a soft top because I was curious about the newer tops. Like you I was amazed at how quiet they were. Getting the windows and side curtains started in their slides took a bit of care, but it wasn't something I would hate doing. Even my "ONLY HARDTOP" other half remarked how it wasn't any noisier than our hardtop.

gman1259

I own a 2004 Wrangler Sport, with a 6 cly and auto trans. I drive a little over 30 miles one-way to work on the 91 FWY (in So Cal) in bumper-to-bumper traffic I average just under 18 mpg (17.7 to 17.9), might as well call it 18mpgs. The best I got was my trip to Modesto, driving over the grapevine towing a small trailer with a piano. On that trip I go 20 mpgs (had about 1000 miles on it at that time). If I had better driving conditions going to and from work I believe I would get 1 to 2 mpg better economy.

tsjay

Hey, welcome to the family dwrestle, tabbeanboo, and oprystar!

Jeeps are undoubtedly THE coolest vehicles in the world!!! They are enjoyed by people who never take them off the pavement, and they are enjoyed by those who love to go wheelin'.

I have been in both categories. For the fourteen months that I owned Thelma Jane and kept her spotless, never even THINKING about taking her out in the woods, she was the most fun vehicle that I had ever owned. Then, once I started offroading her, WOW! She became even MORE fun.

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeehawwwwwwwwwww!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I LOVE MY JEEP!

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

dwrestle

I don't have a Wrangler but my uncle has an 88 with a hardtop, if I got a newer Wrangler with a softop, would the weather really effect the top?(tear holes in and just mess it up) Is there such a thing as glass roll up and down windows with a soft top?

I don't like the idea of zipper windows, but i would still get a Wrangler.

By the way anybody ever drive with the glass down and get hit with bugs, man I bet that hurts.

mtngal

You can get the full doors with a soft top, which would give you the roll up windows. There are also after-market slider windows you can get to fit the half doors.

Thinking about getting hit with bugs brings back memories - the only time that happened to me was when I was driving a motorcycle. Jeep's manual says you shouldn't drive over 20 mph with the windshield down, and California doesn't allow you to drive on a state road without a windshield, so I've never tried it (except years ago in an OD Green Jeep in a maneuver area when you weren't driving very fast. As soon as you hit pavement you had to put up the windshield). With the windshield up, you don't have problems with bugs.

dchristo1

Thanks for the inputs. I was out on the road today in high winds for a 200 mile trip in Sara. Gas mileage was about 15 with the wind and 10 against.(100miles each way) Sure could have used a sailcloth top. The wind noise was incredible against the wind.

Guess I'll order a new top.

Thanks again.

David