Your knowledge of the salvage business is severly lacking.
Vehicles aren't picked up curbside twice a week and dumped in landfills. Please be realistic. When they finally do give out the salvers tear them apart for every last scrap of value. Then the frame and bodies are crushed and remelted for use in electric-arc furnaces here and all over the world. This was my business for 20+ years. Automotive scrap is among the most highly priced there is.
Now if you are talking about the batteries that's been solved and discussed to death. Toyota will take them back. I assume Honda and Ford and GM will also. So what do these NiMH batteries consist of? Plastic, galvanized steel and nickel. That's it. You can take one apart in your garage without having the EPA swoop down on you. Don't let hate blind you.
Pulse and Glide. It saves fuel. It was probably intentional.
The gasoline engine is running all the time at highway speeds. However sometimes the electric assist can put the gasoline engine into 'super-overdrive' and give it a rest while on the fly. The gasoline engine life may be extended by as much as 30-50% as a result.
Fact: diesel is much cheaper per gallon in Canada than in the US compared to regular unleaded gasoline and has been for many years now,don't you find that odd ? Why is it more expensive in the US ? Because they don't want you to use diesel engine cars?? When they offered the TDI engine option in Canada people actually bought them and benefited from the better mileage per gallon. Emissions is another argument, but I believe with the new catalytical converters and technology emissions are very close now to regular unleaded cars. But I believe the real reason is not apparent. It could be the US automakers have a stake in gasoline sales versus diesel sales. But since diesel technology has existed for many many years, and these engines have been proven in Europe and Canada, why not bring it here and give people the choice as in Canada's case ? I believe the US can greatly benefit from this, don't knock ''til you've tried it. All they have to do is find out why Canada has such low diesel prices, if they have it so should the US.
Also, there is a possibility diesel prices will become cheaper as more people buy cars with the TDI engine option once they allow it-VW will be allowed to sell the 2008 Jetta with this option in the US for the first time this year now that superdiesel is being sold at the pumps. And I really like the other benefit of diesel engines, they have better torque with less displacement of engine size, ie. they are extremely efficient engines compared to gasoline engines, and yes diesel engine cars practically never die-I imagine 400K+ miles for the average diesel engine is typical from what I have heard versus your 250K+ gasoline engine seems better to me. So the real question is ''what will you do when diesel is cheaper by $1/gallon compared to unleaded ?" Wouldn't you want a Chrysler with more torque and less fuel usage per mile ? I sure would! That new Dodge Caliber SRT4 in a diesel or the new Sebring would be nice don't you think ?
"Fact: diesel is much cheaper per gallon in Canada than in the US compared to regular unleaded gasoline and has been for many years now,don't you find that odd ?"
Yes and no. I would chalk that up to refineries in Canada having greater diesel capacity than US refineries. Maybe Canada has a higher percentage of diesel vehicles. It also may have something to do with the US ULSD.
I would never buy a car with 101K miles on it, but if I already had one I'd never sell it. I'd just keep it until I ran it into the ground. Shoot, I've had this curiosity about getting an Insight after reading an article about it in "Collectible Automobile." It would be nice to give a big upright middle finger to the oil companies everyday during my morning commute.
Soory, your fact isn't quite correct, at the moment regular is about $1.09/litre, and deiesl is $1.19/litre (generally about 10 cents more a litre) now if you come up in the late spring, summer or early fall, then deisel is going to be less than regular gas. So for about half the year your statement is true. Once heating season kicks in (and they have to add more additives to the deisel???) then the price goes up. Scott
>Your knowledge of the salvage business is severly lacking.
Please spare us all your constant putdowns of myself as a poster. Just scroll over my posts rather than the repeated use of ridicule. Others are allowed their opinions just as you are.
I have been driving around Florida here now for about 2.5 months and see that type of driving behavior every day. Its the FLORIDIOTS!.. Yesterday one pulled out infront of me in a 55mph zone and immediately sped up to 40 mph and drove that way for 3-4 miles with a double yellow line to keep me behind the little toyota... When the chance came to pass the toyota immediately sped up to 55-60 until the next curve and then slowed back to 40-45.
I try to be optimistic to think that some folks just feel more comfortable driving fast on the straight sections of road, so they naturally speed up as compared with curvy roads. Unfortunately for those trying to pass, when you get to a passing location they speed up back to the legal speed, so the only alternative is to exceed the speed limit on the straight parts. This happens all the time to me when I'm driving on 2 lane roads.
I think we're focusing on the wrong thing here! Gas prices are like a runny nose, compared to the bone-cancer that is going through the global financial system lately. You won't have to worry about $4/gal gas when many of your investments or house value may get miniscule, and people start losing jobs!
That is very true. Bear Stearns went from a market value of $3.5 billion to $233 million over the weekend. The Fed is going to cover the loss by printing more worthless paper.
Yikes. I saw some diesel prices near me (zip 20854) and they were pretty frightening. $4.25 at the Shell on Shady Grove Rd. in Rockbille, MD. That's not even a very expensive area. Gas was $3.29.
Ouch.
Cheapest prices according to gasbuddy.com near me is $3.26 for gas and $3.99 for diesel.
If house prices average increase goes back to the 5% average that it's been historically then that's a good thing. It may take time to adjust though.
Think about the stock market. For decades it's been slowly rising, averaging 12% per year, but then for a few years it really shot up way too high. People loved it, but then the party was over for the next 5 years and now it's to a point of it's slow and steady rise (if you look at long-term averages).
So for a few years, some house prices went up 20% or more a year and now they're down, and at some point they'll level off and go back to their slow climb. It's nice for them to climb up at a constant rate, but if they go up 20-50% for a couple of years and then drop 20-40% the next couple of years then they're still up over the long term.
Like the the stock market, the long-term investor has nothing to worry about with their home investment. Just keep your stocks and keep your house. This cycle will pass.
Gas on the other hand will probably not cycle back to $2/gal, so we need to get more efficient.
>You won't have to worry about $4/gal gas when many of your investments or house value may get miniscule, and people start losing jobs!
The media hasn't cared much about people's losing jobs through the last decade in the midwest. But today they're concerned about the folks who work at Bear Sterns. Maybe it's because they're in New York with the talking heads and they can see they're actually real people unlike the auto workers and auto-related workers in the Midwest.
With the ethanol fiasco and grain prices being affected by the government paying to build ethanol plants and suck up acreage for crops other than corn, I suspect the inflation is going to make $4 gas seem like it's $5 for some of us due to discrecionary money being spent on inflation costs for necessities.
BTW Nancy Pelosi said the democrats had the answer for rising gas prices back in April 2006 when she wanted everyone to vote in a democrat congress. Where is that plan? Has anyone heard any more from them?
Yes, agree completely. It's all about balance. You can't spend your way blindly until oblivion. The pendulum swings the other way....every time.
If you don't sell your house or your investments, there is no real loss. Gas prices, OTOH, takes more out of your current spending power and the upward spiral will continue until a change in demand swings the pendulum back.
I don't know about Sterns, but they sure lived down to the "bear" part!
I guess it's more of a tragedy to the media when some pampered yuppie dweeb loses his overpaid position and can no longer live a glamourous lifestyle of overindulgence versus Joe Factory Worker just trying to eke out a living to take care of his family.
It was the newer style Prius with the glitzy taillights rather than the early ones that looked like Corollas, but it looked like one of the first of that era. It had come from Florida (plates) so it surely had miles on it and some age. I seriously wondered if there was some quirk with the hybrid about the way she was driving. It was repeated speed up for 10-15 miles and slower for 10-15 miles. She'd pass me; I'd pass her. Most drivers who lag for a time, take off and go like heck once they take care of whatever slowed them down, coffee, cellphone, cigarette.
If you are planning to buy a new vehicle soon, but are holding off for the time being, a reporter wants to talk with you. Please respond to ctalati@edmunds.com with your daytime contact information and a few words about your experience no later than Wednesday, March 19, 2008.
imidazol97: The media hasn't cared much about people's losing jobs through the last decade in the midwest. But today they're concerned about the folks who work at Bear Sterns. Maybe it's because they're in New York with the talking heads and they can see they're actually real people unlike the auto workers and auto-related workers in the Midwest.
The stories I've seen have centered on the effect that a Bear Sterns collapse could have on American (and world) financial markets. Not too much on how this will affect Bear Sterns employees.
Bear Stearns, if not for the intervention of JP Morgan, would have collapsed completely. GM, Ford and Chrysler are still in better shape, although Chrysler's situation gets more perilous by the month. Up until this point, all three have reduced their blue-collar workforce through early retirement offers and buyouts that workers in other industries would be glad to receive. So it's a little hard to shed any tears for them.
If one of the Big Three files for bankruptcy, then, yes, we will see stories on how this action has affected communties and their workforces (blue- and white-collar).
The media hasn't cared much about people's losing jobs through the last decade in the midwest. But today they're concerned about the folks who work at Bear Sterns.
No I'm talking about the Secretary of the Treasury and the financial analysts who are talking about the possibility of avoiding a total financial collapse. When the Fed. Chairman, Sec. of the Treasury and the president are working together on Sun. night, like last night, it's the financial equivalent of the Cuban Missile Crisis.
So far in the last few years a few patches have worked when the global financial system appeared ready to burst. If we're not so lucky and competent, we might find out as other economies have in the past, just how fast a currency can become of little value.
We've just witnessed a fairly quick loss of the value of a $, and a runup in the price of the $ in an orderly market; who knows what would happen if some banks fail. $20/gal? $50/gal?
Do we really want to criticize the brain trust at the Fed? What better solution to easy credit -- print more money and make credit easier to get. :sick:
I thought all paper money was worth at least 1/20 of a cent just like coupons
8,000 coupons will get you one gallon of diesel, start saving now...
I don't find the number for the total employed by Bear Stearns but on Good Morning America or another of the early shows had a talking head and they commented on the loss of jobs for employees.
As I said there are many people unemployed as plants have closed or reduced employment for GM and GM spinoffs/suppliers. I agree with your point many received nice payouts after years/decades of nice salaries. But many in this region were not so lucky. They receive small severance packages and had hired in after the pay reductions took effect. Those people are having rough times and it shows in the economy in the region.
I sympathize with the Bear Stearns employees but I _assume_ that many will be employed by the JP Morgan folks. Plus the New York economy is probably much heathier than the car-oriented Midwest.
"Bear Stearns went from a market value of $3.5 billion to $233 million over the weekend. The Fed is going to cover the loss by printing more worthless paper."
Precisely! The Federal Reserve has thrown out any pretense of legitimacy during the past year. They're not conducting monetary policy. They're juicing the stock market and giving a back-door bailout to the real estate racket .... oops, I mean "industry."
Cutting the overnight rate by 100+ basis points at a time, lately cutting the "discount rate" exclusively for their cocktail party pals in the financial industry, and printing more money just to cook the books -- all this amounts to a massive theft from you and me.
Allowing the Wall Street crooks to "borrow" money from the U.S. central bank, and use the WORTHLESS mortgage securities as "collateral" is just plain fraud.
It's the same as a bank offering you a second mortgage on your house, but only requiring you to put up last week's garbage as collateral, and forcing everyone else in your neighborhood to pay back the loan if you default.
All these actions de-value our money (and it's already at historic lows), and force us to pay more for everything ..... INCLUDING GASOLINE.
BTW, lest you mistake this for a left-wing rant from some Gen-Y underachiever:
I'm a 40-year-old, hard core conservative college graduate with a solid job, a house, a car (paid for) and a healthy five-figures in my checking account.
I'm definitely no class warrior ..... but I know a scam when I see one.
Forget OPEC and Exxon/Mobil -- the Federal Reserve Bank has GUARANTEED us $4 gas by this summer. .
Sorry, your fact isn't quite correct, at the moment regular is about $1.09/litre, and diesel is $1.19/litre (generally about 10 cents more a litre) now if you come up in the late spring, summer or early fall, then diesel is going to be less than regular gas.
Gotta chime in here and add that while driving past the various gas stations today I noticed that diesel is now $1.10 more expensive than Regular gas. No way can I afford to buy a diesel car if it's already over $4 a gallon. Regardless how much i'd like one it's just not worth the extra price per gallon and with so few cars available even in the upcoming year except VW (Virtually Worthless) VW needs to concentrate of reliability instead of competing with Audi.
No way can I afford to buy a diesel car if it's already over $4 a gallon.
I think that is exactly what the powers that be are hoping for. Congress both sides of the aisle DO NOT want you to get better mileage. They gave incentives on hybrids to appease the wacko enviro types. They of course limited them to a very small percentage of the 250 million vehicles in America. If too many people jump on the high mileage band wagon you will see other states going for the tax by mile that Oregon is testing and CA is considering. Face it, if you are getting 50 MPG you are not paying your fair share of the taxes. The Feds and the states do not like that. Ethanol may be the biggest scam ever concocted next to Global Warming. It takes as much fossil fuel to make a gallon of ethanol as you get. So it is a double whammy for Congress. They look good in the Midwest and on the tax ledger. There is no reason other than maybe a colder winter that diesel is still more than regular.
PS You may never see a diesel sold to Joe Average again. They keep raising the bar for emissions. Making only the very expensive vehicles able to absorb the cost.
I personally am sick and tired of the goverment not doing anything about opecs oil control. Sitting back and watching them raise prices every summer..and every holiday that comes along. Just because some so-called expert says gas will hit $4.00 a gallon. interesting that gas isnt 6.50 right now considering oil is $100.00 a barrel and when it was $50.00 ..gas went up to 3.25. Its obvious, that the opec nations are trying to sabotage (actually an act of terrorism) the u.s. by running the prices up, trying to break us. And we sit back and let it happen. Where are all the elctric cars that take 10 mins to charge and can go 500mi. per charge?. Why since they've been complaining that new refineries havn't been built in 30 yrs. ...aren't they building refinerys??? So when will the u.s. do something about it??....WAIT... we already are. the small 1 to 2 % which is government and congress hold so many oil stocks, that they are doing something about it. Letting prices run up because it lines thier pockets. They could care less about the other 250 million u.s. citizens. As long as they're in power and thier stock is rising, and they can still maintain policing control over us, they're completely satisfied and wont do a thing. We the people of the u.s need to complain...5 times louder than we are. If we make it a sore spot that wont go away, they'll eventually listen to us and either make changes....or be impeached... We vote for them....hire them...they work for us, and yet since they have a little power they seek unrightcheous dominion. We need to kick thier butts and cause a little disturbance. Maybe if they thought we would fire them (impeachment) and they had no income, they'd get thier butts in gear and do something. We have the technolgy to make electric cars...and cars that get 60 mpg. But until we complain ( non-stop) they wont implement said technology. So lets start making them feel the pain we feel. Start writing e-mail...the heck out of your Senators and congressman... And make them work for us since we pay them....or fire them for doing a lousy job.
Later
Caaz P.S I HOPE YOU ALL HAVE A 1 YEAR EMERGENCY FOOD SUPPLY. Like the members of the Church of jesus christ of Latter day saints has been telling thier members to do for years. WHEN GAS HITS $4.00 to $5.00 dollars there wont be a food shortage...BUT... the Truckers Will STRIKE...and it will take just 3 days for every grocery store in the country to have empty shelves. And it if takes several weeks to resolve the strike?.... what will you do?.....And i'm all for the strike. because the combination of the strike and angry americans is what it will take to wake the government up and get thier butts in gear...and do something about gas prices.
If too many people jump on the high mileage band wagon you will see other states going for the tax by mile that Oregon is testing and CA is considering. Face it, if you are getting 50 MPG you are not paying your fair share of the taxes.
That's a load of BS and you know it. :P Gas is taxed and some people use a lot more than others since the usage itself is taxed the more you use the more tax you pay. Hence the incentives to buy SUV's and big gas guzzlers. Kinda like the Sequoia you own. Fact is I have 1500 miles on my 2008 Civic that I bought 2 months ago. Last year my job was at least 30,000 miles of driving per year. I want a diesel but prices need to be realistic per gallon. Sadly the Prius delivers and I could buy one tomorrow. I can't buy a new diesel tomorrow or even next month.
You may never see a diesel sold to Joe Average again. They keep raising the bar for emissions. Making only the very expensive vehicles able to absorb the cost.
Even the Truckers are suffering, so it has to give somewhere, it's just a fact. you want to affect Congress and gas prices just don't deliver any food to the stores. A week long strike would get some attention about diesel prices. Before Bush was in things were ok, but his second term has made the oil companies so rich my calculator doesn't have enough digits to show the profits. :sick: What worries me more is shortages and waiting in long lines like back in the 70's. That could happen again. :sick:
I think Americans should spend a few weeks in Europe if we think gas prices are too high here.
When I was in France in August we rented a car for several days. Diesel prices were lower than regular gas but I paid $1.30 to over $1.50 per liter for the cheapest diesel - that's in euros. I don't have any liters to gallons and euros to dollars conversion tables handy but it's easily over $5/gal in US dollars.
I am not saying it is right. I am saying IT WILL happen. How do you suppose they will tax people with EVs? If the guy with a Civic Hybrid gets 50 MPG and your Civic only gets 30 MPG who is paying their fair share of the road tax? My gas guzzler is paying a lot of road tax. If it was diesel getting nearly twice the mileage I would be paying half as much. My choice was a diesel SUV. I test drove the GL320 CDI and did not like it. No other diesel and the Sequoia was highly discounted.
I am not complaining about the high price of gas. I hope my 401K has lots of oil stocks to stay ahead of the falling dollar. I think you are ranting at the wrong people. The oil companies are just benefactors of the inflated oil prices. Remember the guy in Bangladesh is also paying $110 a barrel for oil. We are not the only ones buying oil these days. The few miles a year I drive will not make any difference in my lifestyle. I have my garden planted. and have been eating fresh peas and citrus all winter long. I do think something has to give with the trucking business. Everything will have to go up in price because of high fuel prices.
Don't expect this Congress or any of the Presidential candidates to do ANYTHING about the price of gas. They are not going to cut off the feed to their trough.
"... now is the time to pick up some agressive growth stock. Prices will never be better."
Oh, they're going to be a lot better; i.e., lower. Think about it:
The Fed has cut the overnight rate down to 3%, they've cut the discount rate, they've "injected liquidity" by the billions ..... yet the stock market's not buying any of it. It just keeps going down.
Pretty soon, the Fed's bag of tricks is going to come up empty, and the market will be forced to adjust to the reality of 7% inflation, 6% unemployment, a housing market implosion, plummeting consumer spending, and, of course, $4 gas.
Along with those economic factors, consider the political situation shaping up this year. The democrats stand a fair chance of winning the presidency. Either candidate, Clinton or Obama, will raise capital gains taxes (to the delight of the democratic Congress). That means that many folks will cash out their stocks THIS year under the current "Bush tax cut" rates. More downward pressure.
Lots of reasons to sell, no reason to buy. So I'm staying liquid. I'll get back into the market when the time's right. .
"Face it, if you are getting 50 MPG you are not paying your fair share of the taxes."
I always ask anyone who uses the term "fair share" to define it. Invariably, it comes down to "anyone paying less than me is not paying his fair share." .
Diesel prices were lower than regular gas but I paid $1.30 to over $1.50 per liter for the cheapest diesel - that's in euros.
Okay, I found a liters to gallons conversion chart. One US gallon = 3.785412 L
Let's see...last August I believe I was paying around $1.45 US per euro. If diesel in France was $1.50 euros per liter that comes out to $8.23 US dollars per gallon.
And people complain about $4/gal for gas here? Oh, brother. :sick:
“I personally am sick and tired of the goverment not doing anything about opecs oil control.”
First, it is not our oil. Second, oil is a commodity traded freely worldwide. Third, demand worldwide has increased faster than supply. The products we buy from China fuel the demand for oil, hence higher prices. And speculators are adding a bit of premium to the price.
“Its obvious, that the opec nations are trying to sabotage (actually an act of terrorism) the u.s. by running the prices up, trying to break us. And we sit back and let it happen. “
Do you really think OPEC is making us buy all the over sized vehicles? The US uses 25% of the energy with only 3% of the population. That is our bad...
“Why since they've been complaining that new refineries havn't been built in 30 yrs. ...aren't they building refinerys??? So when will the u.s. do something about it??....”
Read the book “Oil on the Brain”. Refineries have expanded. Refineries closed in the past because they did not make enough money.
“Letting prices run up because it lines thier pockets.”
Yes, business is about making money – maximizing shareholder wealth.
“We have the technolgy to make electric cars...and cars that get 60 mpg.”
Yes, but People are not buying them. Its not congress, the oil companies or OPEC – We are all to blame. :shades:
Not just truckers. Try hailing a cab in the near future if this trend keeps up. I used to drive a taxi, but couldn't see doing it in today's environment. I'd hate to be a guy delivering pizzas today. The fuel prices would kill you and people aren't going to be so generous with tips these days.
I can see a lot of city transit systems in trouble. You can only raise fares so much.
...blame the consumers. It's the consumers that are using so much fuel that the market lives right on the edge and so every world hicup or dropping dollar increase the price of gas. We Americans like a free market and minimal regulations when it suits us, but when gas (for example) goes up then there are cries for the government to do something.
If consumers would simply reduce their driving through increased carpooling, using public transportation when available, combining trips, and buying more efficient vehicles, we wouldn't be in this mess.
For example: Drive a Civic-sized vehicle instead of an Accord-sized vehicle. Find someone at your work who lives close to you and carpool back and forth. If you live in a big city with good public transporation, use it. Plan your shopping better, so you only need to go to the stores twice a week instead of every day.
Of course some of these things may be a little inconvenient, but they would reduce gas consumption by a huge amount and only consumers can do this. I'm not saying everyone needs to do all of these things, but for those that are complaining about the price of gas, if you're not willing to do any of these things then stop complaining.
"I always ask anyone who uses the term "fair share" to define it"
Absolutely. I've worked several negotiations, and as soon as somebody trots out the 'fair' word, I know we're in trouble. To me, "fair" is a four-letter word, beginning with an "F"!
I always ask anyone who uses the term "fair share" to define it.
No problem. Two people driving down the interstate in Honda Civics. Both going 65 MPH. One is getting 30 MPG the other is getting 50 MPG. The one driving the non hybrid is paying 40% more gas tax to maintain the highway they are both using.
DIsclaimer: This is not my idea. It started in the CA state legislature around 2000. There was concern as to how they would tax people driving electric cars with the advent of the EV-1 and a few others. The state of Oregon is testing a tax by mile system that uses GPS to determine how many miles you drove on the last tank of gas. It also determines how many of those miles were in the State of Oregon. It sends a data stream to the gas station you are using to fill your tank. It then adds the per mile tax to your bill.
And my point on the whole subject is the Federal and State governments DO NOT want us to get better mileage, with hybrids or diesel cars. It cuts into their fuel tax. If we all got 30-40% better mileage that is possible with hybrids and diesels that would be a 30-40% cut in their fuel tax revenue.
Puleeze.. there are no 'powers' that are driving up the price of diesel just to screw Joe Lunchpail. That's silly. The market has priced it because the supply is lower relatively to the demand.
Add a bunch of new VW and Honda cars in the fall and several Big 3 diesel pickups/SUVs and the demand may drive diesel prices to a 50% premium over gas until the refineries can realign themselves to get more diesel out of a barrel than they do now. If you are looking for some culprits it may be the refiners who are currently geared to get 51% of barrel as gasoline 15% as distillate fuel ( diesel ) 12% as jet fuel link
Until biodiesel is readily available I'd expect diesel to stay sginificantly higher than gas as the demand for diesel vehicles increases.
If we all got 30-40% better mileage that is possible with hybrids and diesels that would be a 30-40% cut in their fuel tax revenue.
But then the government could raise taxes elsewhere to cover the difference.
Plus the government is the biggest consumer of fuel, so if everyone got 30-40% better MPG and the price of fuel went down, then the government would also save money there, thus reducing the impact of the reduced gas tax revenue.
"But then the government could raise taxes elsewhere to cover the difference."
That's what they should do, but they've met a lot of resistance. That's one reason the Oregon folks give for going to an intrusive and expensive GPS-based system. Would make much more sense to ramp up per-gallon taxes to cover the shortfall, would also increase gas conservation (a good thing, both for imports and for GW, if you're into that). Too logical, I guess....
It's Tuesday so that means it's Mazda chat time again! Stop in tonight and meet and greet some of your fellow CarSpace members. We'll talk anything and everything Mazda, automotive, and just plain have a good time. Anything is fair game, even gas prices
Comments
Regards,
OW
Vehicles aren't picked up curbside twice a week and dumped in landfills. Please be realistic. When they finally do give out the salvers tear them apart for every last scrap of value. Then the frame and bodies are crushed and remelted for use in electric-arc furnaces here and all over the world. This was my business for 20+ years. Automotive scrap is among the most highly priced there is.
Now if you are talking about the batteries that's been solved and discussed to death. Toyota will take them back. I assume Honda and Ford and GM will also. So what do these NiMH batteries consist of? Plastic, galvanized steel and nickel. That's it. You can take one apart in your garage without having the EPA swoop down on you. Don't let hate blind you.
The gasoline engine is running all the time at highway speeds. However sometimes the electric assist can put the gasoline engine into 'super-overdrive' and give it a rest while on the fly. The gasoline engine life may be extended by as much as 30-50% as a result.
Also, there is a possibility diesel prices will become cheaper as more people buy cars with the TDI engine option once they allow it-VW will be allowed to sell the 2008 Jetta with this option in the US for the first time this year now that superdiesel is being sold at the pumps. And I really like the other benefit of diesel engines, they have better torque with less displacement of engine size, ie. they are extremely efficient engines compared to gasoline engines, and yes diesel engine cars practically never die-I imagine 400K+ miles for the average diesel engine is typical from what I have heard versus your 250K+ gasoline engine seems better to me. So the real question is ''what will you do when diesel is cheaper by $1/gallon compared to unleaded ?" Wouldn't you want a Chrysler with more torque and less fuel usage per mile ? I sure would! That new Dodge Caliber SRT4 in a diesel or the new Sebring would be nice don't you think ?
Yes and no. I would chalk that up to refineries in Canada having greater diesel capacity than US refineries. Maybe Canada has a higher percentage of diesel vehicles. It also may have something to do with the US ULSD.
Scott
Please spare us all your constant putdowns of myself as a poster. Just scroll over my posts rather than the repeated use of ridicule. Others are allowed their opinions just as you are.
Have a good day.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
NOPE ... just OLDER Florida folks driving..
You won't have to worry about $4/gal gas when many of your investments or house value may get miniscule, and people start losing jobs!
Ouch.
Cheapest prices according to gasbuddy.com near me is $3.26 for gas and $3.99 for diesel.
Think about the stock market. For decades it's been slowly rising, averaging 12% per year, but then for a few years it really shot up way too high. People loved it, but then the party was over for the next 5 years and now it's to a point of it's slow and steady rise (if you look at long-term averages).
So for a few years, some house prices went up 20% or more a year and now they're down, and at some point they'll level off and go back to their slow climb. It's nice for them to climb up at a constant rate, but if they go up 20-50% for a couple of years and then drop 20-40% the next couple of years then they're still up over the long term.
Like the the stock market, the long-term investor has nothing to worry about with their home investment. Just keep your stocks and keep your house. This cycle will pass.
Gas on the other hand will probably not cycle back to $2/gal, so we need to get more efficient.
The media hasn't cared much about people's losing jobs through the last decade in the midwest. But today they're concerned about the folks who work at Bear Sterns. Maybe it's because they're in New York with the talking heads and they can see they're actually real people unlike the auto workers and auto-related workers in the Midwest.
With the ethanol fiasco and grain prices being affected by the government paying to build ethanol plants and suck up acreage for crops other than corn, I suspect the inflation is going to make $4 gas seem like it's $5 for some of us due to discrecionary money being spent on inflation costs for necessities.
BTW Nancy Pelosi said the democrats had the answer for rising gas prices back in April 2006 when she wanted everyone to vote in a democrat congress. Where is that plan? Has anyone heard any more from them?
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
If you don't sell your house or your investments, there is no real loss. Gas prices, OTOH, takes more out of your current spending power and the upward spiral will continue until a change in demand swings the pendulum back.
For now, it's up and away.
Regards,
OW
Dollars to donuts it was a huge tax increase for us and incentives for alternative fuel for the industry.
Regards,
OW
I guess it's more of a tragedy to the media when some pampered yuppie dweeb loses his overpaid position and can no longer live a glamourous lifestyle of overindulgence versus Joe Factory Worker just trying to eke out a living to take care of his family.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
If that's what increases mileage from 44 mpg to 48 mpg, no thanks. Drivers that repeatedly pass me and then slow down REALLY bug me.
The stories I've seen have centered on the effect that a Bear Sterns collapse could have on American (and world) financial markets. Not too much on how this will affect Bear Sterns employees.
Bear Stearns, if not for the intervention of JP Morgan, would have collapsed completely. GM, Ford and Chrysler are still in better shape, although Chrysler's situation gets more perilous by the month. Up until this point, all three have reduced their blue-collar workforce through early retirement offers and buyouts that workers in other industries would be glad to receive. So it's a little hard to shed any tears for them.
If one of the Big Three files for bankruptcy, then, yes, we will see stories on how this action has affected communties and their workforces (blue- and white-collar).
No I'm talking about the Secretary of the Treasury and the financial analysts who are talking about the possibility of avoiding a total financial collapse. When the Fed. Chairman, Sec. of the Treasury and the president are working together on Sun. night, like last night, it's the financial equivalent of the Cuban Missile Crisis.
So far in the last few years a few patches have worked when the global financial system appeared ready to burst. If we're not so lucky and competent, we might find out as other economies have in the past, just how fast a currency can become of little value.
We've just witnessed a fairly quick loss of the value of a $, and a runup in the price of the $ in an orderly market; who knows what would happen if some banks fail. $20/gal? $50/gal?
Have you a corrected or revised address?
I thought all paper money was worth at least 1/20 of a cent just like coupons
8,000 coupons will get you one gallon of diesel, start saving now...
As I said there are many people unemployed as plants have closed or reduced employment for GM and GM spinoffs/suppliers. I agree with your point many received nice payouts after years/decades of nice salaries. But many in this region were not so lucky. They receive small severance packages and had hired in after the pay reductions took effect. Those people are having rough times and it shows in the economy in the region.
I sympathize with the Bear Stearns employees but I _assume_ that many will be employed by the JP Morgan folks. Plus the New York economy is probably much heathier than the car-oriented Midwest.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Precisely! The Federal Reserve has thrown out any pretense of legitimacy during the past year. They're not conducting monetary policy. They're juicing the stock market and giving a back-door bailout to the real estate racket .... oops, I mean "industry."
Cutting the overnight rate by 100+ basis points at a time, lately cutting the "discount rate" exclusively for their cocktail party pals in the financial industry, and printing more money just to cook the books -- all this amounts to a massive theft from you and me.
Allowing the Wall Street crooks to "borrow" money from the U.S. central bank, and use the WORTHLESS mortgage securities as "collateral" is just plain fraud.
It's the same as a bank offering you a second mortgage on your house, but only requiring you to put up last week's garbage as collateral, and forcing everyone else in your neighborhood to pay back the loan if you default.
All these actions de-value our money (and it's already at historic lows), and force us to pay more for everything ..... INCLUDING GASOLINE.
BTW, lest you mistake this for a left-wing rant from some Gen-Y underachiever:
I'm a 40-year-old, hard core conservative college graduate with a solid job, a house, a car (paid for) and a healthy five-figures in my checking account.
I'm definitely no class warrior ..... but I know a scam when I see one.
Forget OPEC and Exxon/Mobil -- the Federal Reserve Bank has GUARANTEED us $4 gas by this summer.
.
Gotta chime in here and add that while driving past the various gas stations today I noticed that diesel is now $1.10 more expensive than Regular gas. No way can I afford to buy a diesel car if it's already over $4 a gallon.
Regardless how much i'd like one it's just not worth the extra price per gallon and with so few cars available even in the upcoming year except VW (Virtually Worthless) VW needs to concentrate of reliability instead of competing with Audi.
At age 40, now is the time to pick up some agressive growth stock. Prices will never be better.
I think that is exactly what the powers that be are hoping for. Congress both sides of the aisle DO NOT want you to get better mileage. They gave incentives on hybrids to appease the wacko enviro types. They of course limited them to a very small percentage of the 250 million vehicles in America. If too many people jump on the high mileage band wagon you will see other states going for the tax by mile that Oregon is testing and CA is considering. Face it, if you are getting 50 MPG you are not paying your fair share of the taxes. The Feds and the states do not like that. Ethanol may be the biggest scam ever concocted next to Global Warming. It takes as much fossil fuel to make a gallon of ethanol as you get. So it is a double whammy for Congress. They look good in the Midwest and on the tax ledger. There is no reason other than maybe a colder winter that diesel is still more than regular.
PS
You may never see a diesel sold to Joe Average again. They keep raising the bar for emissions. Making only the very expensive vehicles able to absorb the cost.
Later
Caaz
P.S I HOPE YOU ALL HAVE A 1 YEAR EMERGENCY FOOD SUPPLY. Like the members of the Church of jesus christ of Latter day saints has been telling thier members to do for years. WHEN GAS HITS $4.00 to $5.00 dollars there wont be a food shortage...BUT... the Truckers Will STRIKE...and it will take just 3 days for every grocery store in the country to have empty shelves. And it if takes several weeks to resolve the strike?.... what will you do?.....And i'm all for the strike. because the combination of the strike and angry americans is what it will take to wake the government up and get thier butts in gear...and do something about gas prices.
That's a load of BS and you know it. :P
Gas is taxed and some people use a lot more than others since the usage itself is taxed the more you use the more tax you pay. Hence the incentives to buy SUV's and big gas guzzlers. Kinda like the Sequoia you own.
Fact is I have 1500 miles on my 2008 Civic that I bought 2 months ago. Last year my job was at least 30,000 miles of driving per year. I want a diesel but prices need to be realistic per gallon. Sadly the Prius delivers and I could buy one tomorrow. I can't buy a new diesel tomorrow or even next month.
You may never see a diesel sold to Joe Average again. They keep raising the bar for emissions. Making only the very expensive vehicles able to absorb the cost.
Even the Truckers are suffering, so it has to give somewhere, it's just a fact. you want to affect Congress and gas prices just don't deliver any food to the stores. A week long strike would get some attention about diesel prices.
Before Bush was in things were ok, but his second term has made the oil companies so rich my calculator doesn't have enough digits to show the profits. :sick:
What worries me more is shortages and waiting in long lines like back in the 70's. That could happen again. :sick:
I think Americans should spend a few weeks in Europe if we think gas prices are too high here.
When I was in France in August we rented a car for several days. Diesel prices were lower than regular gas but I paid $1.30 to over $1.50 per liter for the cheapest diesel - that's in euros. I don't have any liters to gallons and euros to dollars conversion tables handy but it's easily over $5/gal in US dollars.
I am not saying it is right. I am saying IT WILL happen. How do you suppose they will tax people with EVs? If the guy with a Civic Hybrid gets 50 MPG and your Civic only gets 30 MPG who is paying their fair share of the road tax? My gas guzzler is paying a lot of road tax. If it was diesel getting nearly twice the mileage I would be paying half as much. My choice was a diesel SUV. I test drove the GL320 CDI and did not like it. No other diesel and the Sequoia was highly discounted.
I am not complaining about the high price of gas. I hope my 401K has lots of oil stocks to stay ahead of the falling dollar. I think you are ranting at the wrong people. The oil companies are just benefactors of the inflated oil prices. Remember the guy in Bangladesh is also paying $110 a barrel for oil. We are not the only ones buying oil these days. The few miles a year I drive will not make any difference in my lifestyle. I have my garden planted. and have been eating fresh peas and citrus all winter long. I do think something has to give with the trucking business. Everything will have to go up in price because of high fuel prices.
Don't expect this Congress or any of the Presidential candidates to do ANYTHING about the price of gas. They are not going to cut off the feed to their trough.
Oh, they're going to be a lot better; i.e., lower. Think about it:
The Fed has cut the overnight rate down to 3%, they've cut the discount rate, they've "injected liquidity" by the billions ..... yet the stock market's not buying any of it. It just keeps going down.
Pretty soon, the Fed's bag of tricks is going to come up empty, and the market will be forced to adjust to the reality of 7% inflation, 6% unemployment, a housing market implosion, plummeting consumer spending, and, of course, $4 gas.
Along with those economic factors, consider the political situation shaping up this year. The democrats stand a fair chance of winning the presidency. Either candidate, Clinton or Obama, will raise capital gains taxes (to the delight of the democratic Congress). That means that many folks will cash out their stocks THIS year under the current "Bush tax cut" rates. More downward pressure.
Lots of reasons to sell, no reason to buy. So I'm staying liquid. I'll get back into the market when the time's right.
.
I always ask anyone who uses the term "fair share" to define it. Invariably, it comes down to "anyone paying less than me is not paying his fair share."
.
Okay, I found a liters to gallons conversion chart. One US gallon = 3.785412 L
Let's see...last August I believe I was paying around $1.45 US per euro. If diesel in France was $1.50 euros per liter that comes out to $8.23 US dollars per gallon.
And people complain about $4/gal for gas here? Oh, brother. :sick:
First, it is not our oil. Second, oil is a commodity traded freely worldwide. Third, demand worldwide has increased faster than supply. The products we buy from China fuel the demand for oil, hence higher prices. And speculators are adding a bit of premium to the price.
“Its obvious, that the opec nations are trying to sabotage (actually an act of terrorism) the u.s. by running the prices up, trying to break us. And we sit back and let it happen. “
Do you really think OPEC is making us buy all the over sized vehicles? The US uses 25% of the energy with only 3% of the population. That is our bad...
“Why since they've been complaining that new refineries havn't been built in 30 yrs. ...aren't they building refinerys??? So when will the u.s. do something about it??....”
Read the book “Oil on the Brain”. Refineries have expanded. Refineries closed in the past because they did not make enough money.
“Letting prices run up because it lines thier pockets.”
Yes, business is about making money – maximizing shareholder wealth.
“We have the technolgy to make electric cars...and cars that get 60 mpg.”
Yes, but People are not buying them. Its not congress, the oil companies or OPEC – We are all to blame. :shades:
I can see a lot of city transit systems in trouble. You can only raise fares so much.
If consumers would simply reduce their driving through increased carpooling, using public transportation when available, combining trips, and buying more efficient vehicles, we wouldn't be in this mess.
For example:
Drive a Civic-sized vehicle instead of an Accord-sized vehicle.
Find someone at your work who lives close to you and carpool back and forth.
If you live in a big city with good public transporation, use it.
Plan your shopping better, so you only need to go to the stores twice a week instead of every day.
Of course some of these things may be a little inconvenient, but they would reduce gas consumption by a huge amount and only consumers can do this. I'm not saying everyone needs to do all of these things, but for those that are complaining about the price of gas, if you're not willing to do any of these things then stop complaining.
Absolutely. I've worked several negotiations, and as soon as somebody trots out the 'fair' word, I know we're in trouble. To me, "fair" is a four-letter word, beginning with an "F"!
yeah, somebody always tends to get faired over, don't they. :sick: Especially in this faired-up economy! :P
No problem. Two people driving down the interstate in Honda Civics. Both going 65 MPH. One is getting 30 MPG the other is getting 50 MPG. The one driving the non hybrid is paying 40% more gas tax to maintain the highway they are both using.
DIsclaimer: This is not my idea. It started in the CA state legislature around 2000. There was concern as to how they would tax people driving electric cars with the advent of the EV-1 and a few others. The state of Oregon is testing a tax by mile system that uses GPS to determine how many miles you drove on the last tank of gas. It also determines how many of those miles were in the State of Oregon. It sends a data stream to the gas station you are using to fill your tank. It then adds the per mile tax to your bill.
And my point on the whole subject is the Federal and State governments DO NOT want us to get better mileage, with hybrids or diesel cars. It cuts into their fuel tax. If we all got 30-40% better mileage that is possible with hybrids and diesels that would be a 30-40% cut in their fuel tax revenue.
Add a bunch of new VW and Honda cars in the fall and several Big 3 diesel pickups/SUVs and the demand may drive diesel prices to a 50% premium over gas until the refineries can realign themselves to get more diesel out of a barrel than they do now. If you are looking for some culprits it may be the refiners who are currently geared to get
51% of barrel as gasoline
15% as distillate fuel ( diesel )
12% as jet fuel
link
Until biodiesel is readily available I'd expect diesel to stay sginificantly higher than gas as the demand for diesel vehicles increases.
But then the government could raise taxes elsewhere to cover the difference.
Plus the government is the biggest consumer of fuel, so if everyone got 30-40% better MPG and the price of fuel went down, then the government would also save money there, thus reducing the impact of the reduced gas tax revenue.
That's what they should do, but they've met a lot of resistance. That's one reason the Oregon folks give for going to an intrusive and expensive GPS-based system. Would make much more sense to ramp up per-gallon taxes to cover the shortfall, would also increase gas conservation (a good thing, both for imports and for GW, if you're into that). Too logical, I guess....
The Mazda Club Chat is on tonight. The chat room opens at 8:45PM ET Hope to see YOU there! Check out the schedule