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weak USD makes it hard for car makers to keep their price point low.
see the price raise of Lexus and Infinity for recent years.
at about 30K, a car wiith 300+ horsepower and plenty of features,... it's a great deal
If it doesn't break, that is. Beware Year 1 model intro's...enter at your own risk!
Regards,
OW
•So, the "speculation or publicity" didn't mention that the base model would pack 264 horsepower in a 3.3L package. So what? The PRE-RELEASE announcement did. Hyundai reports the lineup accurately six months before it hits the showrooms, and you're portraying it as a credibility/integrity failure on their part because the online gossip mill got it wrong?
•Hyundai is guilty of "double-speak" for saying they benchmarked the E-Class, Infiniti M and Lexus GS? They matched the feature list, matched the size, knocked off the styling and clobbered the price. What's the complaint here? That they're down 30 hp with the base engine? That's it?
•"Now we have hp ratings based on grade of fuel? Korean Kurve Ball." In case you haven't noticed, every maker who says "premium fuel only" is doing this. Most of the cars would also run on regular, but their knock sensors would retard the timing, reducing horsepower. It's just that the luxury nameplates need the extra HP more for advertising and exclusivity purposes, and need the selling point of regular gas less. (Example: The Acura TL is rated for premium, while the outgoing Accord V6 is nearly the same engine but is rated for regular, even though dyno tests prove it gains 10 hp with premium.) In addition, the new SAE horsepower ratings knock down the numbers a few percent from the old ones -- a fact that has already been noted in numerous places, including these Hyundai boards.
I'm sorry you're unhappy with your Hyundai. But if you have a legitimate case against Hyundai, it should be sound enough that you can state it with true facts rather than the ones you're using now.
I'm not unhappy, with either of the two Hyundai's in my garage. My "case against Hyundai", as you put it, has never been aimed at the vehicle, but rather their screwed up US marketing and 3rd world dealer network.
Then can "benchmark" any competitive model they want, They have proven so far to be the best financed knock-off artist in the industry. But using Azera as a recent example, Genesis is doomed.
I also agree the 3.3L will be a good base engine, since it will deliver decent performance and better fuel economy than the 3.8L. The .5L difference in displacement between the two V6's should make for a couple MPG difference.
The base Genesis 3.3L weighs 162 pounds more than the Avalon XLS (3,732 vs 3,570), has only 4 HP less than the Avalon (264 vs 268 / both reg unleaded), and they both have 6spd automatics. Considering the Avalon's 0-60 MPH time is around 6.0 to 6.2 seconds, the base Genesis should pull off 0-60 in around 6.8 to 7.0 seconds.
Many sedan drivers consider that performance to be more than adequate. Those used to driving something as quick as an Avalon or a Passat V6 would probably be very satisfied with the performance Genesis 3.8L. I'm anticipating the professional track tests over the next couple months.
Unit Sales 12/06 12/07 C/Y 06 C/Y 07
XG350/AZERA 2,479 1,597 26,833 21,948
A sizable decrease both in December and C/Y. US dealers total approximately 750 meaning each dealer sold an average of 2.43 Azera a month in '07 Great car, great value but horrible performance at the dealer level.
The lack of factory training to upgrade dealer sales personnel? Of course.
Lack of professionialism at the dealer sales level? Of course.
The absence of a US marketing program, budget, agenda? Of course
A lower level dealer network to begin with? Bingo!
How then can Hyundai even think of launching a product above the level of Azera? Probably by dropping Azera? Time will of course tell.
Lumps for those that bought, walk-away for those that leased.
False
"Lack of professionialism at the dealer sales level"
False
"The absence of a US marketing program, budget, agenda?"
False
Don't generalize based on your preconceived notions.
Once again you choose to ignore the basis of my post, which simply was horrible sales results for an otherwise desireable vehicle and the decision now to offer a further upgrade in amenities and platform alternative.
Why do you think Azera isn't selling?
Obviously, our opinions differ. Try to get over it and move on.
Bottom line, you are basing everything on what you know and passing it off as your view for the entire US operation. I am trying to set the records straight - my view/opinions have nothing to do with them.
This one is specifically for those interested in Hyundai Genesis and frankly, if you've already decided you aren't interested, there are probably better threads for you to post in than this one; for example... the other thread in which this conversation is taking place:
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It's one thing to analyze the reasons, whatever they might be, but saying Hyundai hasn't tried (i.e. no marketing, no training, dealer professionalism) and implying as if they have no idea what they are doing for the entire US operation is absurd.
You'd have to remember, this is a two-way street. If consumers don't respond, no matter how great the car is, or how much $$$ the automaker allocate marketing the car, it doesn't mean a thing until delivery takes place. We might be seeing a bit of that with the Azera.
Back to Genesis...
What gives? Pricing. Last I checked Hyundai is still in the business to make money. By the way, do you know how much a S. Korean-spec sells for? You'd be happy the NA-spec then to hear it starts under 30K and only rise to sub 40K.
FWIW, the US-spec will come with all of the features and toys "standard" in the luxury market.
For that, I respectfully, 100% disagree the NA-spec got short-changed. Go check out the press release what's going to be there. For one, I am absolutely thrilled the Lexicon speaker system will be used in the Genesis, I've tested out a version of it in the Rolls-Royce Phantom. Those 17 speakers are sure to wow most people, if not all.
The fact that, as a car-buying public, we're unwilling to pay TOP dollar for those cars. That Chinese Park Avenue runs about $50k US for the top-line V6 (there is no V8), and the Genesis is about $15-20k more in Korea for equivalent models. We won't pay for the good stuff, so we get the stripped-down versions.
Here are the specs for NA:
http://www.hyundainews.com/Media_Kits/2009_Models/Genesis/Press_Release.asp
GM product chief Bob Lutz - once dismissive of Industrial Korea's penchant for inexpensive knock-offs - was the latest executive to check out the Genesis today. Lutz, who's pushing Cadillac even more upscale, especially around the world, walked away impressed with the Genesis.
Just 10 years ago, after another wave of quality woes, sales slump and dealer defections, the Korean automaker considered abandoning the U.S. market altogether. Today, it's on the verge of a new frontier - selling luxury to the masses at an affordable price.
Why can stupid American makers can't make what Koreans can make?? Build a car w/ V8 with 375hp, xm realtime traffic, rear wheel drive, 5 linked suspension, 8" lcd navigation, 30gig harddrive, 53/47 weight distribution that cost less than $40,000?? Find me a car that give that much value?? anyone??
P.S. To get a lousy sunroof costing $500 in korea, one must buy a higher trim level, plus puchase an additional option package, costing nearly $10K in total. I would like see Hyundai try that in the States. :mad:
There's nothing magic about any one person's spoutings just because he made them in front of a lens. Consumers will make their own judgments. And when they do so, most will do it with an eye to getting what they view as the best use of their hard-earned money over several years, not to make a momentary splash to drum up attention for an obscure car website.
Hyundai Genesis, it all starts here."
Phase 1 internet marketing concurrent with the Detroit auto show (debut site). The ads are on Emdunds, for example.
"Don't have kittens; Genesis is going to work." - Dr. David Marcus
"According to myth, the Earth was created in six days. Now, watch out. Here comes Genesis. We'll do it for you in 6 minutes!" - Dr. Leonard McCoy
I think it would be hilariously funny if Hyundai grabbed William Shatner to do ads for Genesis. Probably not the image they want, though.
Regards,
OW
The comments were very interesting and demonstrated what Hyundai is up against. Many were saying Hyundais were junk. Others pointed out that what was the case is no longer the case and Hyundais have dramatically improved these last few years.
Anyone else think the aspect ratio was weird on the commercial? On my computer screen, the Genesis looked much more bulbous and squatty than from the photographs I've seen or, for that matter, on my regular TV today when they were doing a show on Detroit's auto show.
Yes, the sound system is one of my primary draws to the Genesis. I listen to a lot of music, primarily classical, and have yet to find a sound system anywhere near what I hear at home. It's a joy for me to put on something like Mahler and just cruise through the mountains or along the coast for hour after hour. If the sound system pans out and the overall reviews of the newest Hyundai are positive, I have a strong inclination toward buying one this summer.
My main hesitations, at that point, would be the quality of nearby dealerships and getting a first year release.
But I may have no choice. I pretty much will be in the position of having to get a new car this summer as my current car is being given over to my youngest daughter.
However, when I look at the Azera, it did pretty well during its initial release, at least according to owners and Consumer Report.
I am sure that Hyundai will make sure the quality will be spot on from the start. It can not afford otherwise. I first drove an XG350 from San Francisco to Napa Valley and on to Yosemite.with Gershwin on the system. I look forward to the same journey in the Genesis. Hey guys keep me posted as and when the first company to offer this as a rental.
I WANT ONE NOW PLEASE TOTALLY LOADED!!
I live in Northern California, so that's exactly the type driving I'm talking about. :shades:
Looking again at the pictures I think they should just keep the H badge on the back as its a complete pisstake on the Lexus LS. I think I would be proud to say I own a HYUNDAI GENESIS. Lets hope it performs well in all areas when its road tested. :shades:
Have fun out there. :shades:
Hyundais are still pretty good value but still as much as three times more than what you pay. THere is no way i would buy a Ford for more.
I cant import from the USA as we are still right hand drive and it wouldnt save much after legislation etc.
Still I want a Genesis so lets hope. :shades:
And..as a general note, I've never even driven a Hyundai before, but I have been a fan of Hyundai since they came out with the 07 Santa Fe..and the Genesis has certainly sparked my interest..can't wait to take this one for a test drive
Thanks!
-A.