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I would recommend talking to Mobil or Valvoline for further informationn on this issue.
Don't even consider anything less than SL grade. I might even consider adding Molly if I had one.
I am confused. Are you saying the SL standards are different for a 5W-20 oil, than for an 5W-30 ??
(excepting viscosity range of course!)
So if the only change is adding Supersyn, then the pout point should be LOWER, not HIGHER.
Supersyn has a lower pour than regular PAO. OK. Since the pour point increased with the (super low pour) Supersyn, what is the conclusion that can be drawn? Is that clear enough?
Read it all at
http://www.exxonmobilchemical.com/chemical/customer/products/families/synthetics/basefluids/paos.html
Bo
The friction proofing should be a major consideration because it is a major reason for using the thinner oils....GAS MILEAGE, but I can't find those numbers. Seems like it would be a major comparative value.
Is Chevron SL a synthetic?If Chevron SL is a synth,then what about the question:"If the price were the same,would you use dino or syn?"Does it become: at 1/4 the price,would you use "syn" over syn?
In today's SL world,what oils ARE synths?Chevron says in their FAQ,that their SL oil is synthetic!How close is it to other synths in real-world use?
Seems we have MORE questions than before SL.....
1976 -- 1990 Conventional multigrades v. PAO or esther synthetics.
1990-- 2001 Conventional Multigrades vs. PAO vs "hydrocracked synthetics"
2002 conventional multigrades with hydrocracked synthetics vs pure hydrocracked "high mileage" oils vs. Conventional/syn blends of any variety vs syn base with lots of conventional vs syn base with lots of hydrocracked, vs higher quality hydrocracked oils vs Esther synthetics vs PAO synthetics.
the picture muddies.
Question to Mobil
I have used Mobil 1 for 10 years now in my vehicles and four extended family vehicles. Many people now think that the higher pour point of Mobil 1 indicates that Mobil is addopting the tactics of Castrol and using some "Severely Hydroprocessed" stocks in with the Base stocks of Mobil 1?
What say you??
Answer:
Mobil 1 Supersyn is still a PAO based oil just like the Tri-Synthetic Formula so it is a fully synthetic motor oil.
"In order to satisfy both viscosity and volatility requirements(SL) for SAE 5W-30, a new Group II+ base oil was used to formulate this product."
Easy! It's because they can't get a word in edge wise! >;oÞ
I'm no engineer, but I think he meant clearances, not tolerances. I'm pretty sure tolerances refer to design specifications. Clearances to actual part measurements. Nonetheless, I was struck by how easily he backed off using 5W20 oil. He acknowledged it is only "recommended" in the owners manual, not required. I realize his is only one dealer rep's opinion, and he does not speak for Ford, but I'm really warming up to using a good full synthetic oil at the next oil change instead of Ford's blended 5W20. I'll track actual mileage until then and see if it really does change with a slightly heavier syn oil. My only reservation...Ford's 5W20 oil is high in moly.
Mrdetailer...in #3802, did you mean to say that SL specs for 5w20 oil carry higher sludge requirements than SL specs for other weights? Thats how I took it. I assumed all SL oils met the same specs, but don't really know for sure. Thanks.
I'm not sure about the reason for this jab,but I'm a Chevron SL user and I'm still here.I doubt that you have convinced everyone(anyone for that matter) that they must agree with you and use a synthetic,ANY synthetic.
If you read this FAQ carefully,maybe you will understand why this SL oil has so many proponents on this board: http://www.chevron.com/prodserv/baseoils/faq_answers.shtml
The owner's manual says it is ok to use 5W-30, but 5W-20 should be used at the next oil change. No reason why, it just says it should be used. Well, I have been using Amsoil 0W-30. I don't really need the 0W here in Kansas but I have been convinced that the Amsoil series 2000 is good stuff so I don't really mind paying the extra money. I also feel much better about leaving the oil in past 3000 miles (I have been changing it at about 6000, owners manual says 3750/7500 for severe/normal use), although I will never use Amsoil's 25000 mile interval.
I am definately not worried about not using the 5W-20, since my dealer didn't even have it when I went in for my first oil change (before I switched to Amsoil). They were the first to tell me about Honda's reasons for the switch, and then I have read it numerous times on this board and others. I am worried about Amsoil not being API certified, but that is a different story!
My 2000 Regal manual recommends changing oil as requred by oil monitor, between 3,000 and 7,500 miles depending on driving pattern. With our car, every time around 6,000 miles. I heard that in the mileage between oil changes increased substantially for 2001-2002 models. The same car, the same engine. Different software?
As to the regal, I use the Amsoil 10W30 in my 2000 GSE SC and change filter at 6000 miles and oil at 12,000 miles. I simply reset the indicator at 6000 when I change the filter. Light has yet to come on indicting a change should be sooner for me. Oil analysis has been fine so far. Changed to synthetic at 4300 now have about 25,000 miles. However, a good portion of highway miles.
I'd like to see someone use an extended interval with this oil and do an analysis!
Thanks
Arm - I have been thinking about doing an oil analysis when I am about to change this next time. Everyone on here seems to be talking about Blackstone? Is that the way to go? Of course, I would probably be relying on some of you here to help me interperate the results!
I am inclined to buy this explanation for now. The Trisyn Formula was, according to some, to be a downgrade, but I posted awhile back that the results of wear testing showed the Trisyn Formula to be better than the previous generation. No reason to suspect different here.
The formula was changed because the old SJ Mobil One formula could not meet or surpass the new stricter SL standard.
The only thing that is cloudy in my mind is the issue of whether the Zinc formula or % is lower, higher, same or reformulated. The verbiage seems to hint that long life is a primary concern.
(the zinc in the formulas is the issue with longer/shorter cat life)
My overall take is that at worst it is no better than the SJ rating, which is very good and incidently the specs for my vehicles call for SJ. At best the new SL will let me extend the drain interval to 15k and beyond!!
The answer is NO the SL standard for oils is still 80 hours with no more than 50% thickening. It is a Ford or Honda Standard that requires 120 hours with the 50% thickening. Thickening is indicative of oxydation as well as sludge.
This is not unusual. Look at a bottle of valvoline 10W-40 SL, It will list Volkswagon, BMW, Corvette and Mercedes oil specifications in addition to a european one that is in excess of the SL standard.
I see, it is like the same as the GM standard for oil that I have on one car.
Like for example, Mobil One synthetic meets that standard and others do not necessarily even though they are synthetic?
If you are so confident that it is as good as some of the synthetic users on the board why don't you become the guinea pig?
Oh GEE! 7500 miles is the normal recommended range between oil changes for your vehicle, in the owners manual!!? (it is for mine and that interval was recommended with that old junk SJ standard!) Now 6000 miles on the SL rated conventional oil is really living on the wild side!
(Being as how the new interval for SL rated conventional oil is actually 12,000 miles and you guys think me a wild child for a 15,000 miles oil change interval with synthetic, SJ rated!
I'm sorry that it offends you "true synthetic" users that I could even compare Chevron SL to Mobil-1 or Walmart "synthetic".I (and many others) think that the gap has closed so much,that it is nuts to waste the money on the above oils.(remember,I have never said that "synthetics are obviously superior to dinos as bottgers has done -OR vice versa).No blanket statements like that from me.Nor will I admit that Chevron SL is inferior to Mobil-1---I don't know and I dare say that you don't either.
AFA oil testing,I think of it as a waste of $$,even though I'm curious as to the results.If I were paying $4.45 a qt for oil,I might consider analysis(but only trend analysis makes good sense to me ).And my opinion is still that Chevron SL,changed at reasonable intervals(4,000 odd miles) is probably overkill.
To me, 6000 miles IS an extended drain interval for conventional oil.
Granted, many people are going that long, or longer. Those people think they are fine but they probably don't realize that their oil might be wearing out with that many miles on it.
You might consider a filter change at 3000 miles (maybe you already are).
Perhaps someone has some good information here. I'm sure armtdm probaboy can answer this.
Or then again it may not!! Look I am not the one who has the doubt! So while you may agree that oil analysis is a waste of money, it is the very thing that could possibly keep you from continually wasting it! But it will always be a "doubt" unless you "test" it. The bottom line is I have no problem at all with you using Chevron SL conventional oil. In fact, thank you very much!! The stock is doing wonderfully for me! Shoot I should stand here and tell you to change it every 1500 miles!
What grade will you be using?
I do want to say that although some posts seem to be pretty contentious, we live in a great country where choice and right-of-opinion are so highly coveted that these boards are able to exist and thrive. Without that, we would only have one or two brands with which to debate
Who are you kidding? You won't believe it under any circumstance! >:o[ LOL
Yes synthetic is app 3x longer lasting than conventional oil, so yes 22,500 to be exact. But ultimately it is easy to get a true picture by getting a cost per mile for lubrication.
Or let me approach it another way. If the useful life of SL conventional is 12,000 miles and you change it at 3000,4000,5000,6000 miles what is the range of % waste on the useful life remaining? And the conventional oil advocates say this is cheap? or cheap insurance?
Decisions...decisions. Thanks
The question that keeps going through my mind when people state that 3K oil changes is the STANDARD and to go beyond that is blasphemy is this: Where did they learn about that "standard". Most likely it was based on advice passed down by their parents, etc., which was based on the auto and oil industry's recommendations. But guess what? Both the auto and oil industries are now recommending oil changes beyond the traditional 3K. Only the oil changing shops are still advocating 3K changes.
Question is, do you trust the motives of the auto and oil industries? Well, you trusted it before when they said 3K changes...why not now?
Because we want evidence beyond a doubt, and then some, that it won't harm our engines! Well, there will never be any studies to satisfy that criteria for everyone.
Me, I use Mobil 1, and change at 6 months with my severe driving cuz that's a "reasonable" balance between following the manual's recommendations and having a little faith in the expensive oil I paid for. Is it overkill? Probably, but that's all right cuz I'd rather spend a little more than have to deal with the hassle of a sludged engine later down the road.
For those interested in protecting the environment and/or getting the most for their money/time, I think the only way to determine the safest interval for extended drains is to do serial oil analysis. No two engines are the same, and no two drivers drive under the same conditions, so no matter the published studies, your engine and your driving habits may be different - for better or worse.
Very good point. This board is pretty civil, but we could lessen the argumentative aspect significantly if all of us acknowledged the validity of your theory.
For me, the "evidence" shows it is quite likely that Mobil 1 is safe to be used well beyond 6,000 miles. However, that is the top end of my comfort zone and I'm not willing to leave the oil in my vehicles any longer than that.