DOES HONDA REALLY LIVE UP TO IT'S NAME?

baker16

I'm still driving my 1985 Toyota pickup. It hasn't given me ANY problems since day one. If my wife's 2000 Accord lasts half as long I'll be happy.

powerman

baker16, isn't it great when you get a vehicle that you never have to worry about that just goes and goes?

It really spoils you and when you have anything that requires more than routine maintenance it feels like the end of the world!

I loved that truck, and I am sure you love your '85 Toyota.

baker16

Yup!

dgrillo

I just gave my 91 Accord to my son with 115'000 miles and it still runs like a new car.A few interior pieces have broken over the years,but overall it's been very reliable.It still has all the original brakes.Rust has set in on the rear fenders but this is very common to this model year.Overall Honda makes a great product at a fair price.

tunabear

I'm living everyone's nightmare. My '88 Accord 4DR LX died on I-95 20 miles s of Richmond, VA last week. I'd blown a hose about 8 weeks ago which apparently corrupted the head gasket, resulting in major failure. Upshot: I need a new engine. The body is in pretty fine shape, interior is excellent. My independent mechanic recommended against a Jasper re-built (for around $3,000) and has instead, ordered a used motor from Japanese Honda which he says has been pulling them from late model engines following a change in emission laws there. They're guaranteed to be under 50K miles and are warranted for 12 mos. Cost is only about $1500.
Anyone have *ANY* experience with this? My mechanic says after two years of installing them he has yet to have any problems.

tunabear

1) I meant to say that Japanese Honda is pulling its engines out of late model *Accords"...

2) My '88 has 125K miles on it.

pat455

Why don't you go over to our Honda Accord Problems topic (#1398) and post there. We are fortunate to have an experienced Honda tech hanging out there (auburn63) who can probably offer you some advice. I'm not sure whether he checks into this topic.

Good luck.

Pat
Community Leader/Maintenance & Repair Conference

canadiancl

I've owned several Honda models over the years from a 1975 Civic to my current 2001 Acura CL-S and my wife's 1997 CR-V. In my opinion, while Honda cars remain fun to drive and mechanical sophistication is second to none, Honda's build quality has taken a turn for the worse in the last few years. In particular I have found that the cars manufactured in the US have markedly poorer fit and finish than cars assembled in Japan. My CL-S has uneven gap clearance between the hood and the fenders, large gaps between one of the headlights and the bumper, etc. I looked around the dealer's lot and 1/2 of the other CL-S there had similar quality problems. My brother's 1998 US-built Accord also has similar body panel & trim problems. My wife's CR-V was delivered with a wheel alignment problem. I had a 2000 Prelude SH that Honda was forced to buy back from me because the ATTS system malfunctioned and the dealer couldn't repair it after repeated attempts!
My sister-in-law's 1997 CR-V needed a new transmission within the 1st year. These types of glitches were unheard of for Honda prior to the mid-90's. I'm particularly disappointed in the fit and finish gaffes on my CL-S. If Honda/Acura wants to compete with Lexus, BMW, and others, I think they have to address this problem.

rfruth

Had a '87 Nissan p/u that went 230,000 miles with routine maintenance & little else, it was a very good vehicle. If my almost 1 year old Civic does anywhere near as well I'll be tickled pink and so far so good !


Rob Fruth - Houston, Tx
http://freeweb.pdq.net/rfruth

1981 Raleigh for commuting, errands & fun
1997 Trek 2300 for real fun !
2000 Civic hatchback 1.6 liter DX 5 speed

kblau

I have a 96 Civic DX Coupe with almost 64,000 miles on it. For the last 5 months, I have noticed when i check the oil between changes, it seems low. I've added 1/2 a quart here and there, but never gave it much thought. I changed the oil on 9/3, put 600 miles on it this week, and now it is 1 1/2 quarts low again. It's not leaking at all and I have had no problems driving it. No warning lights, nothing out of the ordinary. I have been advised to keep checking the oil and get rid of it ASAP before the motor dies on me. I have used only synthetic oil since day 1 and I never expected this car to last only 4 years. Part of the reason I paid more than I really could afford to for the civic was it's reputation. I had hoped it would last an easy 100,000 miles with no sweat. Needless to say, I am extremely disappointed that a 4 year-old car has become so unreliable that I am afraid to drive it. My next car will be a Toyota.

pat455

If you want to run this by a very helpful Honda tech who hangs out here, go to Honda Civic Problems and repost. Auburn63 may be able to help you out, I don't know, but it might be worth asking him.

Pat
Community Leader/Maintenance & Repair Conference

sadiegreen

Can anyone out there advise me how to contact upscalehonda. They are in NY State and they offer a fair price for the Hondacare Warranty. David Winnie is the contact sales rep. I tried them at upscalehonda@aol.com but no luck ! Thanks

pat455

You might want to check our Finance, Warranty and Insurance Conference for a topic which may be discussing something your question would be appropriate for.

Pat
Community Leader/Maintenance & Repair Conference

ggudinkas

my wife has a 1986 honda civic which we bought new. It now has over 200k on it and is still a daily driver. my only complaint is the qualify of the body/paint. i've always keep is clean & waxed, but still has many 'cancer' spots. other that that, it's been very reliable.

protegextwo

There are 2 well-defined levels of Honda reliability and owner satisfaction.

Top Box: The best in the business!
Honda Accord
Honda CR-V
Honda Civic
Honda Prelude

Lacks Consistency: Fit and finish concerns?
Honda Passport
Honda Odyssey
Honda Insight


*Honda S2000, a $35,000 Japanese Porsche, 240 ponies and it redlines at 9000 rpm. S2000 owners buy, for reasons other than dependability!

isellhondas

I guess everyone can be "told" anything...

Just don't believe it all!

markz2k

Well, I don't doubt for a second that the Passport is a notch lower in overall quality than the rest of the Honda products. Because it's actually a re-badged Isuzu. I'm very surprised Honda was willing to risk their quality reputation by selling another manufacturers product. I could see someone buying a Passport and having problems with it, and not wanting to buy Honda again, never knowing they had problems cause it was an Isuzu.

As for the Odyssey and Insight, they are both new/redesigned products this year. A few bugs after a major redesign aren't uncommon.

protegextwo

Isell, are you saying the Civic, Accord, CR-V, and the Prelude are NOT industry leaders in build quality/reliability?

isellhondas

And the world knows that. I just didn't agree with a couple of your other comments.

for example, the Insight is way too new to determine it's reliability although I'm sure it'll be typical Honda.

Odysseys have always been just fine.

I'll agree that the Passports while a fine SUV probably aren't quite up to the rest of the Hondas. Still...nothing wrong with them either.

I guess I have a problem when some column writer or other "expert" gives an opinion and then others, such as yourself pass that information along like it's the ultimate source of reference.

protegextwo

I have respected your honesty and well thought out posts for awhile. I did not mean to disrespect you or Honda in any way. My opinions are based on readings, my familys long loyalty to the Honda brand and a conversation I had with a service tech. My brother races modified stock cars, micro and mini sprints in South Eastern Pa. One of his good friends and a mechanics on the racing team, has been working as a service tech for a local Honda dealership for five plus years. This gent knows his stuff! My post on the two levels of Honda reliability/build quality were basically a summation of a conversation with him. Note: I posted the Accord, Civic, CR-V and Prelude were rated "TOP BOX"! The Odyssey, Passport, and Insight were not recommended at that same "TOP BOX" level. I did not mean to imply that the others were unacceptable or "wrong". My question to you; who is the "ultimate source of reference"? Is a family member who has purchased Honda's for over 12 years, or an auto column writer, or perhaps a quality Honda salesman, or maybe a Honda service tech? Isell, we both know there is no real "expert" with all the answers, nonetheless Edmunds is the place to "give an opinion" and pass, debate and exchange that info.

Respectfully,
Protegextwo

isellhondas

I should have tempered my response a bit.

Lots of opinions out there that we can agree or disagree with.

Ask three different technicians what they think of Jeep Cherokees (I have!) and you may get three different opinion ranging from " They are total junk!" to..." Great cars".

I don't even like to reccommend a restaurant for the same reason.

hkdonhonda

Every single dealer I've talked to has told me that the passport is "embarrassing" to their reputation, and are looking forward to the demise of the Isuzu partnership. Two dealers (whom I tend to have a good one - one relationship with have actually talked me and my wife out of getting one. She on the other hand loves the truck for all the "gadgets" as well as the commanding view. They reminded me of how owners after 1 - 2 years hate their vehicle and actually will do anything to get out of the deal/lease. Another example of the ownership nightmare of an Isuzu product is Edmunds longterm Rodeo. Isell, I have been reading this forum for a year, and I respect and recognize all of your input, so if there are any good points to owning the passport, please post them. I love the Honda/Acura line and would hate to see it marred by one unit.

pat455

I thought I read somewhere that as of one (or two?) MYs ago, Honda was making the Passport itself, no longer rebadging the Isuzu.

Am I wrong? (again! :>) )

Pat
Community Leader/Maintenance & Repair Conference

teo

Interesting Article:

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/issue/001002/japan.htm

Opinions/Comments??

Enjoy!

republican

Honda means rust in Japanese, so yes it lives up to it's name!

hkdonhonda

Just like Ford means "found on road dead" and GM means "Garbage Maker" and Chrysler isn't even worth busting on, so what's your point?

isellhondas

Passposts are still made by Isuzu.

Kind of like my earlier example, people tend to really like them and have great luck with them or they don't.

We have three salespeople who own them. Two of these guys just love them and have had zero problems. One of these has something like 85,000 miles on it, the other has 70,000 miles.

They would buy another in a heartbeat!

The third guy has a 99 with something like 20,000 miles. He says it "has no spirit" and has had some nitpicking problems...nothing serious, stuff like the check engine light coming on.

SUV's in general are higher than normal maintainance vehicles. Want REAL problems? Buy a Jeep!

BUT....There are plenty of happy Jeep owners too!

Go figure!

teo

The Passports have GM parts in them (Correct me if I am wrong) I believe the Automatic transmission is sourced from GM Powertrain. Other engine compartment components are also GM Delco and Delphi.

You say your colleagues drive them with ZERO problems...right?

Great, proof positive that the GM/Isuzu SUV's are not the junk some people claim them to be.

isellhondas

I am unaware of any G.M. parts installed in Passports...I don't think so!

Some early Rodeos had the miserable 2.8 Liter Chevrolet engines in them. A must to avoid!

andre1969

I don't know if this is an embarrassment to the other cars I've owned, but the fastest I've ever driven is in a 1992 Honda Civic with an automatic. It was a rental car, and this was in California, and I was young and stupid. I got it up to 115 mph going downhill. At the time, I had a 1969 Dodge Dart GT with a 225 /6, and was not looking forward to this rental car. My previous experience with a Honda had been a friend's 1980 Accord back in college. That thing was a piece of junk.

I gotta tell ya, though, for what it was, that '92 Civic was a nice little car. And that means a lot coming from a guy who was raised on big rwd cars (the Dart was one of the smallest and lightest cars I've ever owned) The Civic still had a solid feel on the road, and was fairly quiet even at 115 mph. It didn't feel like it was straining.

I have to admit, though, it would only do 115 on a down grade. On level ground I was lucky to get it over 80 or so without a lot of fuss. It never sounded like it was straining...it just would take forever. And uphill? forget it! I guess this story is also a good case against buying rental cars when the companies sell them off...I'm sure what I did to this one was pretty tame compared to what a lot of people do!

Anyway, good luck to those of you who have Honda products. I hope they continue to give you good service!
-Andre

hkdonhonda

Thanks for the info isell. I guess if they're offering 120,000 warranties, they've gotta back them up with some kind of quality. Maybe times are changing for Isuzu?

wonderwall

the honda passport and isuzu rodeo have france listed as the country of origin for their transmissions... could it have renault parts in it? the le passport...

teo

The Isuzu Rodeo Automatic Transmission is made by GM in Strasbourg, France...see it for yourself:

http://www.gmpowertrain.com/transmissions/4l30_main.htm

The Honda Passport uses the same exact GM 4L30 Automotic 4 speed transmission.

Passport/Rodeo Owners....your automatic transmission is the same exact unit found in the Cadillac Catera/Opel Omega/Holden Commodore and BMW Z3 roadster!

starcraft1500

My starter (Nipodenso type) went sour after 75k miles but I could still hear the solenoid clicking when I turned the key. I figured this was too soon for a starting motor to wear out so I removed it and after dismanteling it and checking the brushes, armature and solenoid all was OK but it still wouldn't work. I knoticed that when I pushed the plunger down on the solenoid no connection was made to give juice to the starting motor. The plunger was not making good contact but I found if you take off the other cable nuts to both sides of the solenoid you can take out the internal contacts and bend them up a little it works like new. Wonder how many new or rebuilt starters are bought due to this easy to fix flaw.

carnut30

When I toured the SIA plant in Lafayette, IN, in 1995, the automatic transmissions going into the Passports were clearly marked "General Motors".

isellhondas

Actually, GM builds a pretty good transmissions. They have had their blunders like the Turbo 200's etc but for the most part, they are pretty good.

And, I've heard of no transmission problems in Passports.

As far as the long warranty on Rodeos...Well...Isuzu hasn't been doing too well here in the USA. Personally, I think they could have a lot better job of promoting their dealers and products. They had a pretty slick car too a few years ago that died a slow death.

I think the long warranty is more of a marketing tool than anything else at this point.

mlml14

I have a honda accord , ex 1991, 5speed sedan....currently , i have 192,000 miles on the car...its been a dream car .
I have change the timing belt 2x, breaks , 2x, replace stick shift once, basic stuff....the car is low , low maintence...just change the oil and go. I am sure that I can get another 50, 000 miles out of it , no problem.
I live 7 year in Mass, and had no issues in the snow, either....
I love my honda, but i dont like the styling of the new ones...i hope they make a change for the better soon.
good luck
ml

ribs

I've recently bought a new Accord. Honda seems more aggressive than most manufacturers in insisting that you add their brand of transmission fluid, power steering fluid, etc. I was ready to dismiss this as standard brand-chauvinism, but I've actually seen aftermarket fluid brands (like Gunk) selling "Honda" versions. Are Honda's ATF and other fluids really different than others, or is it like Chrysler telling you to use only Mopar Oil?

butch11

Would strongly suggest using honda atf and PS (power steering) fluid. There may be exact copies out there-but I am not willing to be the pioneer and do the testing on my vehicle. People using non honda PS fluid experience blown seals in their rack and PS pump in a fairly short time-honda ps fluid has some kind of lubricity additive that if missing will cause damage big time. Hear fewer problems with ATF-however I am too much of a chicken to try another ATF-seems to be a lot of people having problems with DC auto trannies after having them serviced-DC trannies are apparently very particular about using the recomended ATF. I would suggest changing ATF on a 30K interval-easier than changing oil.

As for coolant-my honda dealer's service dept uses some generic coolant-I would suggest using a name brand coolant that does not have silicates-apparently the rumor is these things can contribute to the early death of your water pump.

If you do decide to use non honda ATF-let us know how the experiment goes.

lbonistall

I own a 96 Honda Accord and my balancer shaft seal (engine oil seal), which was recently recalled (informally), burst, which also caused my engine to blow. I have had all proper maintenance done on my car and only have 47,000 miles on it. American Honda is reviewing this on a case by case basis, but they did call and ask how much I would be willing to pay for the damages to the engine. I was appalled that they wanted to haggle a price with me. They have been reviewing my case now for over 1 week and I have no resolution. They say they are doing a diagnostic on my car and they will get back to me. Who can I contact to help me with my problem and how long does a diagnostic take?

sinjin_dog

I (my wife) also have 96 Accord. Received a letter, a quasi recall letter about oil seal leak. Had the service done about two weeks ago at 71000 miles.
Talk about hush hush stuff.

Thanks

gasguzz

2k Civic EX 4-DR Auto, 7200 miles
I switched to Mobil-1 Syn ATF at 3k miles, and have had no problems with it nor have heard of anyone having otherwise. The manual states that Dexron-3 is compatible as a temp alternative (Mobil-1 Syn ATF is compatible for use in Mercon/Dexron-3 applications). For a manual tranny, there is a Redline product that satisfies the Honda requirement on “friction modifiers” for the synchros. There is no such thing as a Honda hydraulic/lubricant, a well as with Honda stereos/batteries/tires. Sure, they conform to Honda specs but they are also an automotive standard. Honda simply contracts a major vendor and puts their name on the oil-filter/coffee-mug/alloy-wheel. In short, they are concessions that increase the sales margin.
What is the Honda coolant – the standard spec is green Ethylene Glycol. Honda brake fluid – DOT-3. Honda engine oil – 5w-30 API Service SJ. Now, I’m not saying you may use Loaf-N-Jug products to maintain your car. Just take advantage of quality vendors out there who have some high-tech stuff, at lower cost. Good luck.
Incidentally, what is the Honda PS fluid spec (the manual doesn’t state the name/spec as in the other consumables)???

pat455

Welcome to Town Hall.

You might want to take a look at our active topic on Honda Civic Problems (Topic #912).

Town Hall is fortunate to have an experienced Honda tech hanging out in that topic and he may have an answer to your question.

Pat
Community Leader/Maintenance & Repair Conference

kblau

Any idea if this affects civics as well as accords? My 96 civic (67000) has been using one quart of oil per week. It would be nice if it were recalled and I didn't have to get rid of it.

ashera1

The best place to ask that question is probably the topic linked in post #206. Hope it works out for you.

Pat
Community Leader/Maintenance & Repair Conference

hopper1

I have 95 Civic LX 5 speed just turned 92,000 miles. I drove for lst 3 yrs and college age son
has had it since then. Just had 90,000 mile service, $600. private machanic, highly regarded,
Dealer wanted $950. for same work. Included replacing boots on front ball joints. All these miles, never a repair, only followed service schedule and changed oil every 4,000 miles. Great car. Should go another 90,000. Only slight complaint is that the body metal could be a bit thicker, gets small dents easily. Toyota seems to have better sheet medal. Never known anyone who owned a Honda and maintained it that didn't love it.

mikeg61

On my '94 Accord, I had the timing belt/water pump service and 90,000 mile service done at 87,000 miles. At 92,000, the seal blew dropping most of the oil onto the new timing belt, necessitating all new seals and a new timing belt. Fortunately for me the local mechanic did the repair and replaced all the seals as a precaution. This was about 1 1/2-2 years ago! Car now has 135K on it. Other than routine maintenance, this has been the only issue since the day we bought it.

The silent recall notice came in earlier this week. They're looking for lots of info for reimbursement. Chances are good if Honda didn't do the repairs you're going to have a fight on your hands. Had the same type of issue 6 years ago with Nissan, and they wouldn't pay, which is why I now drive a Honda.

tony106

The oil seal on my 1996 accord went last week, causing the engine to seize. Honda now wants to know what I would consider "fair". Reading through the messages posted I can see that others have had the same problem- how were they settled? Any suggestions welcome!! thanks

chevy57

Took car in to a local Honda dealer because on cold mornings the ign. sw. can't be turned the last quarter turn. They replaced the brake sw., which didn't solve the problem. They then replaced the ign. sw. These "repairs" came to 500.00, this morning, same problem. Should add, the last quarter turn is to the "off" position, after arriving at my destination.