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Battery issue is fixed.
Cobasys is not a Fiat sized company.
Wagoner said the GM board has approved production of a new small Chevrolet car at a plant in Lordstown, Ohio, in mid-2010 and production of the Chevrolet Volt electric vehicle in Detroit.
Amazing how people make things up here. Anybody can say anything. Obviously the design has been ongoing. The B of D just approved the financials to changeover a plant. In 2 years the vehicles will be going out the door. Currently the vehicle is built overseas.
Yeah, I posted a pretty long diatribe in response to that post when it showed up in another forum, but I can't find it now. Anyway, I think the best the '78 Civic did (1978 was actually the first year they started publishing EPA tests) was 44 on the highway, with the CVCC model and a stickshift. The non-CVCC model, with the 2-speed semi-automatic was only rated at 23/30.
By 1996, GM was getting 27/40 out of the 4-cyl Century, with just a 3-speed, non-overdrive automatic. Again, this is using those raw test numbers, which are much more liberal than what was showing up on the window stickers. Heck, even the '96 Impala SS, with its LT-1 350, was rated something like 19/33!
Today, the 4-cyl versions of the Malibu post raw highway figures of something like 42 or 46, depending on transmission. And the XFE version of the Cobalt (or whatever acronym they use) is rated something like 36/50!
I think the Cobalt's pretty impressive, considering it most likely has power steering, brakes, and a/c standard. I doubt if the late 70's Civics the EPA was testing didn't have any of that stuff.
Building ethanol plants takes time (years, not days). Even if GM plugin Volt works, which is quite likely and Toyota is now saying they will have one too for 2010, production capcity to build 20 million units annually will take time, but perhaps can be done in 2-3 years.
If we know that oil will be gone in a few years from this very minute, and we start now, perhaps alternatives could be ready when it is gone.
The real problem is that oil production will decline, and is already declining. There is less production this year than last year. This means that we need to use less oil this year than last year.
graph
Current production is around 86.5 million barrels per day. The graph shows that by 2020 the production will probably decline to about 60 to 70 million per day
29/37 (76 CID, manual)
23/30 (76 CID, semi-automatic)
36/44 (91 CID CVCC, manual)
29/35 (91 CID CVCC, semi-automatic)
I guess if you adjusted those downward by around 10-15%, that might have been more indicative of what the "typical" driver got?
graph
Current production is around 86.5 million barrels per day. The graph shows that by 2020 the production will probably decline to about 60 to 70 million per day
I thought I read recently (within the past 2 weeks) that oil production is finally above 2005 levels and most of the production issues pertain to a few countries that are having internal management problems with their oil reserves (Russia and Venezuela). I could be wrong.
Either way the issue with oil is not that we are running out. Investors found out how delicate the oil/gas production was after Katrina and are now speculating on the future price of oil similar to stocks. Oil went up $11 last Friday not because of any disruption to oil production but on news of the US unemployment rate and value of the US dollar. If the idiots in Congress would stop arguing and come up with a REAL energy plan that invests in US energy independence, i guarantee that you will see the price of oil drop. This oil craze smells and looks like the recent housing market.
Back to GM, I'm also skeptical that the Volt will accomplish what GM hopes. Every time I think GM is out of danger something else pops up to remind me how delicate their situation is. I think it's great they are moving forward with the Volt but you have to ask where is their answer to the Prius, Civic Hybrid, Altima CVT, Insight NOW! I can't buy a GM vehicle to match these cars today for fuel efficiency. Their version of green and fuel efficiency is to promote a 5500 #, $40k+ Tahoe that gets 20 mpg. Yay! Put that technology to work in a regular car and achieve 40 mpg. Why is this so hard for them to grasp this concept??? All I keep reading is excuses and it's coming. I'm in the corner with the "wait and see" group.
I thought they solved their issues with the labor union last fall. Why all the talk of labor issues and possible strikes?
Ethanol in two years will be made from old tires, switch grass, human manure and just about anything. It is almost like the stuff that ran the Delorean in Back to the future.
For those who think that ethanol production has not affected corn prices, and consequently food prices, think again or read more than one source on the subject. Wheat prices are way up from where they used to be too, and flour that was priced at $4 per bag (premium flour, what can I say
Also the alcohol is subisidized at 46 cents per gallon, I heard recently, by the taxpayer. I understood building the plant also was subsidized. The ethanol requires 3 gallons of energy to end up with 2 gallons of ethanol. It also produces a large amount of CO2 to the point that one project has been run on "storing" the CO2 underground. And a new grant has been give to Battelle (Columbus) to study and test storing CO2 underground a different way. Apparently a large amount of that awful global warming causing CO2 is being produced to get the ethanol. I'll post a llink if I can find it from our newspaper in the last week or so.
CO2 study
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
As far as where the energy for recharging is coming from, they should be recharged in the off peak hours when there is excess power capacity. This is not to say that 100 million rechargable cars will not require more power plants (like wind and solar or nuclear).
again, corn is not the future of ethanol. In two years this will be a non issue.
Given that foods using corn as an ingredient make up less than a third of retail food spending, overall retail food prices would rise less than 1 percentage point per year above the normal rate of food price inflation when corn prices increase by 50 percent.
http://www.americanfuels.info/2008/05/study-examines-ethanols-effect-on-corn.htm- l
In fact according to the study, if ethanol production were the only thing driving corn prices, the price would have increased 41 cents from the first quarter of the 2006/2007 marketing year to the first quarter of the 2007/2008 marketing year. This would have resulted in a price of $2.95 per bushel. The actual price was $3.34 per bushel, so 39 cents of the increase came from other factors.
again, corn is not the future of ethanol. In two years this will be a non issue.
Given that foods using corn as an ingredient make up less than a third of retail food spending, overall retail food prices would rise less than 1 percentage point per year above the normal rate of food price inflation when corn prices increase by 50 percent.
http://www.americanfuels.info/2008/05/study-examines-ethanols-effect-on-corn.htm- - l
In fact according to the study, if ethanol production were the only thing driving corn prices, the price would have increased 41 cents from the first quarter of the 2006/2007 marketing year to the first quarter of the 2007/2008 marketing year. This would have resulted in a price of $2.95 per bushel. The actual price was $3.34 per bushel, so 39 cents of the increase came from other factors.
So corn pricing is up about 30% with less than half due to ethanol. And since corn price is not directly related to the price of other food products(i.e. price of meat does not go up proportionally to corn) the increase due to corn is much less than 5% (1% according to one study).
I haven't read the link..., but
the beef are fed corn. When corn goes up, the relative cost of beef goes up. Same for pork. That pork chop and bacon costs more. And other grains are ground into the meal mix used to feed various poultry and livestock, so they all are affected.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
The two hybrids – one badged a Toyota, the other a Lexus – will debut at the Detroit auto show and come on top of the third-generation Prius car, also due in 2009.
Toyota didn't give further details about the upcoming vehicles. But Masatami Takimoto, executive vice president in charge of R&D, said the Toyota will be larger than the Prius. "It's a totally new car," Takimoto told Automotive News.
For the redesigned Prius, Toyota will stick with the current generation's nickel-metal hydride batteries.
The long-awaited lithium ion batteries, light in weight and high in power, will debut in Toyota's first plug-in hybrid, due in 2010, he said. Toyota also discussed its long-term battery plans.
Toyota President Katsuaki Watanabe said he already is thinking beyond lithium. To that end, the automaker is setting up a battery research department this month to develop a post-lithium ion battery with even better performance, he said.
The yet-to-be-named compact would ride on the Delta platform and is expected to begin production at General Motors’ Lordstown, Ohio, plant in mid-2010. It’s likely to be revealed it at an auto show this fall.
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080612/FREE/993098544/1065
Still, ethonal is joke. 25% less fuel efficiency than gas and it takes alot of resources to produce. Then there are subsidies to the tune of .51 cents per gallon!
I refuse to put ethonal in my car on an ethical and fiscal basis.
Unless you're driving a diesel you're probably using gasoline with ethanol added to it. It was my understand a few years back the legislation mandated a certain quantity of ethanol be used. Of course that coincided with granting assistance to large companies to build ethanol plants and to subsidize their out put at $0.46 per gallon...
Our state used to have a requirement on the pump to notify consumers if the gasoline could have up to 10% ethanol in it -- anything beyond the nominal amount for condensation control, but that has disappeared now. So you don't know what you're buying. I do know in Tennessee last week I bought fuel an the pump was marked that it did contain 10%. I didn't put in much. That explains why it was 3-5 cents cheaper at those stations.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Our mid-grade fuel here is 10% ethanol and is labeled as such. Its price tag is also the lowest. Premium is now 425 cents per gallon.
ethonal, according to Consumer Reports will decrease your MPG by 25%.
All this talk about ethonal using alternatives to corn makes me wonder if the lobby for ethonal is just buying time to continue the ethonal infrastructure going.
The state of California purchased many flex fuel cars which have never seen a drop of ethonal. It was a black eye to Scwartzenager who was accused of making a deal with GM where only GM flex fuel cars qualified for a state contract. They purchased all these cars with no competition with no infrastructure in place. The cars run less efficient on gas as well! :surprise:
http://www.autobloggreen.com/2007/09/23/schwarzeneggers-role-in-gm-getting-flex-- fuel-contract-questione/
http://www.bizjournals.com/eastbay/stories/2003/01/06/daily51.html
WASHINGTON, DC, March 29, 2006 (ENS) – The oil industry's decision to abruptly abandon the controversial fuel additive MTBE could tighten gasoline supplies and cause further price spikes, the head of the U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) told a Senate panel Wednesday.
Fear of litigation has prompted refiners to replace MTBE, which has contaminated groundwater across the nation, with ethanol, but concerns remain about the logistics of the switch and supply of the plant-based fuel.
An estimated 130,000 barrels of ethanol per day are needed to fill the void left by MTBE, or methyl tertiary-butyl ether, a figure that is nearly half the current domestic production.
"Nearly all companies have been planning to blend ethanol," said EIA Administrator Guy Caruso, "and it involves major changes in operation and supply sources to the east coast and Texas."
http://www.ens-newswire.com/ens/mar2006/2006-03-29-10.asp
I could not find the article but I did find one that said 4%.
In fact, it says that only 4 percent of the change in food prices is a result of fluctuations in corn future prices.
It identifies the "marketing bill", which is the final food costs excluding grains or other raw materials, as a key driver of the consumer price index (CPI) for food, largely due to rising energy and transportation costs.
Another significant factor is surging global demand for commodities.
"The statistical analysis plainly details that energy-intensive activities such as processing, packaging and transporting, as well as the cost of labor, have a far greater impact on consumer food bills than the price of grain," said Informa chairman and CEO Bruce Scherr.
"It may be politically convenient to blame ethanol for rising food prices, but it doesn't make it factually accurate."
http://www.foodqualitynews.com/news/ng.asp?id=81987
http://www.foodnavigator-usa.com/news/ng.asp?n=80295-ethanol-food-prices-corn
http://nqr.farmonline.com.au/news/nationalrural/agribusiness-and-general/general- /ethanol-has-minor-impact-on-food-prices-in-us/85258.aspx
Lets hope someday you get the joke.
CHICAGO – Coskata Inc., a biology-based renewable-energy company
supported with an investment from General Motors Corp., calls its
cellulosic-ethanol production process bulletproof and says the next step
is to increase the efficiency of the microscopic organisms used in
making the fuel.
The organisms can make cellulosic ethanol for less than $1 per gallon
(3.8 L), a threshold Coskata passed in January, at roughly the same time
GM announced its undisclosed stake in the firm.
“We flew by our minimum economic threshold, and now we’re about a year
ahead of schedule,” Coskata President and CEO William Roe tells
journalists at a recent media event here. “It gives us great confidence
moving forward.”
GM prefers Coskata’s simple 3-step process because the feedstock used to
make synthesis gas, which the microorganisms eat and then excrete
ethanol, comes from non-food sources such as garbage, manure, wood, old
tires and factory waste.
The process also is highly scalable, so it’s capable of supporting the
large fleet of flex-fuel vehicles GM would like to see the U.S. auto
industry bring to market over the next several years.
June 11, 2008
It seems the folks over at GM are as experienced at emergency surgery as the cast of “ER.” Across GM’s entire lineup of cars, trucks and SUVs, the company has tried to enhance fuel economy above all else, often with significant results.
We can only report with certainty on the models whose EPA estimates have been reported so far, and the ones that stick out most are GM’s midsize sedans and full-size trucks.
The Chevy Malibu, Pontiac G6 and Saturn Aura now feature a six-speed automatic transmission in their four-cylinder models. The six-speed is offered only on certain trim levels of the Malibu and G6, but is standard, along with stability control, on the Saturn Aura. Prices haven’t been announced for the 2009 models, but prices for the same trims/packages for 2008 were $21,185, $21,775 and $20,405, respectively. That makes the Aura by far the value leader of the trio.
What does the new transmission mean at the pump? It means the trio — rated at 22/33 mpg city/highway, up from 22/30 mpg for 2008 — is now more efficient than four-cylinder versions of the Toyota Camry and Honda Accord, which are rated at 21/31 mpg and 22/31 mpg respectively. They even best the manual-transmission Accord at 22/31 mpg.
Earlier, we reported on both the 2009 Chevy Aveo and the 2008 Cobalt base models getting mileage bumps.
What other GM models get better mileage this year? The Chevy Silverado.
The 2009 Chevy Silverado pickup only saw an increase in mileage on its biggest 6.0-liter V-8, going from 13/19 mpg city/highway to 14/19 mpg for 2009. And while GM's Chevy Tahoe, Suburban and GMC Yukon also get six-speed transmissions in models equipped with larger V-8s, estimated mileage remains the same as it was in 2008.
Go to: http://blogs.cars.com/kickingtires/2008/06/gm-cars-suvs-ge.html
Earlier this week, J.D. Power & Associates released its annual Initial Quality Study (IQS). In this study, GM attained its best PPH (Problems Per 100) performance ever. The Chevrolet Malibu led the way with a first-place finish (80 PPH) in the mid-size car segment, beating out the Toyota Camry and Honda Accord. The Chevrolet Silverado Light Duty and Pontiac Grand Prix also were segment winners.
Here are some more GM highlights:
Four brands (Cadillac, Chevrolet, Pontiac and Buick), representing 82% of our volume, rank above the industry average – up from zero last year
GM has a total of 11 vehicles in the top three positions of award-eligible segments, an increase of one over 2007
– Chevrolet Malibu
– Chevrolet Silverado Light Duty
– Chevrolet Corvette
– Chevrolet Tahoe
– Chevrolet Express
– Chevrolet Avalanche
– Pontiac Grand Prix sedan
– Pontiac Solstice
– Cadillac DTS
– Cadillac Escalade
– GMC Yukon
Hummer, Cadillac, Pontiac, and Chevrolet show double-digit PPH improvements year-to-year
Ethanol has a lower energy content than gasoline. That means that about one-third more ethanol is required to travel the same distance as on gasoline.
The facts are, however, that the production and use of ethanol will actually worsen air pollution and may increase the release of greenhouse gases. In addition, it will not result in meaningful independence from foreign or domestic oil. Its production will require large amounts of water, often in areas that are subject to chronic and sporadic plagues of drought. And, it will have severe effects on agriculture, food prices and starvation relief, along with the potential for serious water pollution.
They're making Ethanol in Brazil today from Sugar Cane - it's much cheaper, but can't compete with what's made here due to the corn lobby getting a .51 cent subsidy from the US government.
It's not just about producing alternate forms of energy to burn in your combustable engine, but more about efficient uses of energy and using more clean energy to power our cars.
True, but at 85% ethanol, it STILL uses less gasoline than 100% gasoline.
Its production will require large amounts of water,
WRONG!!!! The costkata model uses less than 1 gallon of water to produce 1 gal of ethanol, and uses all kinds of waste to peoduce it.
This is from a different blog:
During the North American International Auto Show (NAIAS) or the Detroit Auto Show, one of the most exciting developments I heard was made by GM Chairman Rick Wagoner, announcing a partnership with Coskata, a Warrenville, IL, biology-based ethanol producer. The company uses proprietary microorganisms and patented bioreactor designs to turn biomass, municipal solid waste and other carbonaceous material into ethanol for under $1.00 per gallon.
To me, this is a game changer, easily altering the way we all recycle, for one thing. Imagine, instead of creating more landfills, we convert our plastics, tires, cardboard, and solid food waste into a clean energy! Plus, it doesn’t feed into the controversy about using grain-based products for energy use and the supposed increase in global food prices that are a result.
and how many years off is that "exciting GM development"?
I'm talking corn - it does take alot of water to grow corn. There's nothing "wrong" with that statement.
you're talking about something in the future that sounds great, but for now we are putting our efforts into the wrong solution.
Yes it does use water. It is not efficient but then again most people in this country want to get the hell out of the east and that is not gonna happen as long as we need their gas.
The Coskata process is in usage today. GM has been burning it with no problems. The plant being built now and soon to be completed will supply fuel for GM to test in their entire fleet by the end of this year. Full scale plants should be in production in two years. Now do we have any other solutions to reduce the oil imports in that time frame?
http://www.greentechmedia.com/articles/coskata-begins-building-demonstration-pla- nt-778.html
Coskata has begun producing small amounts of ethanol at a pilot plant at its offices in Warrenville, Ill., and has started building its 40,000-gallon-per-year demonstration plant, Chief Marketing Officer Wes Bolsen told Greentech Media this week.
The next step is the demonstration plant, which Coskata expects to open at the end of this year or the beginning of next year (see Coskata Bucks Tradition).
The company expects to break ground on its first plant, which will have the capacity to make between 50 million and 100 million gallons of ethanol annually, this year and to have the plant up and running in late 2010.
GM, Ford will export more cars to China (mlive.com)
here is a link that shows corn production is up and soybean production is down - due to biofuel shifts. It stands to reason that grain prices are going up if farmers are shifting production out of other grains into corn.
Given that foods using corn as an ingredient make up less than a third of retail food spending, overall retail food prices would rise less than 1 percentage point per year above the normal rate of food price inflation when corn prices increase by 50 percent.
Did see:
In fact, it says that only 4 percent of the change in food prices is a result of fluctuations in corn future prices.
http://www.foodqualitynews.com/news/ng.asp?id=81987
http://www.foodnavigator-usa.com/news/ng.asp?n=80295-ethanol-food-prices-corn
http://nqr.farmonline.com.au/news/nationalrural/agribusiness-and-general/general- /ethanol-has-minor-impact-on-food-prices-in-us/85258.aspx
The Gremlin didn't use much gas, but that's because a car isn't using much gas when it's on a repair lift or being towed...
be able to deliver the all-electric Chevrolet Volt as planned and is
close to naming a supplier for the vehicle's crucial battery, GM Vice
Chairman Bob Lutz said on Monday.
"I would say there's almost no reasonable doubt in our minds anymore
that this is going to work," said Lutz, who heads vehicle development
for GM.
tell me what link you want and I'll provide it.
I thought it was amaizing you needed a link to belive that GM would have anything to do with a tax write off for people who purchased a Hummer. Do you want the names, dates, photgraphs and bank transfer reciepts when the money was handed off from GM to the lobby who went to Washington to greese the wheels of Congress? :confuse:
Actually anything at all that shows GM was behind the revision in the law would be just fine.
1) 4% is 4 times the number you were claiming, so you were wrong.
2) those links are all basically using the same source as the basis for saying no problem - and it looks more like a lot of hand waving than actual data.
The problem is that food prices have many feed backs and to say that something has no effect is difficult. Ethanol production does take a lot of corn, and this has raised the price of corn. Farmers are shifting production of other grains into corn - meaning that there is less production of other food grains like wheat and soybeans.
One thing I will agree with is that ethanol production is not the only reason that food prices are up, but it is ONE reason that they are up. The ethanol plants designed to use corn will continue to do so until this is not profitable. With corn at $8 some ethanol plants are not profitable now, or at least I have heard on the news that they were suspending operations.
I could not find the site on the 1% so I may still be right. Read it somewhere and it came from a government source. But I will take the hit and be wrong on 1%. 4% is still a reasonable number to me for getting rid of some oil usage.
It is a lot of hand waving. The permutations and complications are huge with the food and fuel markets. However it is one thing to run off and say that ethanol is the cause of the food run up and another to actually have groups look into it and find that it is a source of food cost increases but nowhere near the amount spouted on the internet and the airwaves.