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Chevy Silverado and GMC Sierra Undercarriage Rust

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Comments

  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    Has GM done anything for you?
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    Christina,

    Stop pretending that GM is interested in resolving this problem.

    GM has stated in court that it does not cover ANY corrosion caused by the environment. GM will do nothing to help any of these people.

    Only the NHTSA has the power to make GM stand behind its crappy, unsafe products.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    GM has stated in court depos that their undercoating is designed to last only one year, and even then only to provide cosmetic protection. Meanwhile, they tell you in the warranty that if you add an after market undercoating, your warranty is voided.

    File your complaint with the NHTSA. That is the only organization with the clout to force GM to address the problem.

    Government Motors!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
  • Toyota had a similar issue and replaced the frames on the trucks in question. The only way to tell GM to address the problem is to not buy from them. Then they will finally realize that customers do care about what they buy and will not return like I will be doing. I work in stealerships and know some of the owners / managers and GM will not do anything after your warranty is up. My suggestion to anyone with this issue is to get on the dealership service dept and keep bringing it in for this rust issue and demand it be resolved by GM. Your truck will become unsafe. Mine is now becoming a plow truck scheduled to be killed instead of the immaculate family truck it was.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    Toyota only fixed the problem after NHTSA got involved.

    GM won't fix the problem until enough people file complaints with the NHTSA and there is some press coverage of the catastrophic brake line and other failures.

    GM does not care if you buy their trucks. They are too big and bureaucratic. That's why they went bankrupt the first time and why they will go bankrupt again.
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    I have the same problem, Rust on a 1 year old truck. Junk made to fall apart apparently?! I am not happy, and GM customer service is Bulls#@t!! You get the runaround and then told nothing can be done! I want my Dodge back!!!
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    GM doesn't cover corrosion. That includes the undercarriage and sheet metal.

    Their warranty is a sham.

    Government Motors!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • gmcustsvcgmcustsvc Posts: 4,252
    casilla,

    Do you currently have a case with GM Customer Assistance? If so, could you please email me the case number? I would like to look further into your situation.

    Thank you,
    Caron, GM Customer Service
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    Caron,

    Don't waste Casilla's time. GM does not cover corrosion under its warranty, and will do nothing to help Casilla.

    There is nothing you can do as a GM customer service rep except give Casilla the run around. You have no authority to do anything, and GM has already stated that it does not cover ANY corrosion due to the environment, which is ALL corrosion. This is company policy and you can do nothing to change it.

    Government Motors!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    I had a case # but I got frustrated playing phone tag with Racheal from customer service in Durham NC. It took 3 weeks of calling and when we finally connected, I was told that nothing could be done. Why should I have to spend money to fix a new truck? If I do undercoat it myself, the warranty by the book says it will be void!!?? I do believe that your policy is to make a truck that is built to fall apart quickly. This was my first brand new GM truck and probably my last.
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    I also wanted to state that the 2000 Chevy Silverado that is used at the place I work still runs like a top and shifts great< however it cannot be driven on the road because the frame is rusted through in 3 different places and the body has cancer so bad that if falls off in chunks when you shut the doors, I had a used 1987 GMC Sierra that was the same scenario ran great, but rusted out up to the windows!!! I have a 2010 that will probably not last the five years I have to pay on it unless I spend thousands of dollars every spring to keep it rust free, that's just plain a sham!! I sure would love to have my money Back! I did contact the NHSTA about my problem. I also wax and wash on a regular basis, and am starting to notice that the lower half of the truck is starting to pit up and will not take a shine!!! I will post this on every forum I can find!!!
  • gmcustsvcgmcustsvc Posts: 4,252
    kendonhank,
    I'm sorry you feel this way and have had a bad experience; however, the department and I are proof that GM cares and they are trying to reach customers they were unable to reach before. We handle everything on a case by case basis and at the very least I like to look into customer situations to try to provide some assistance.
    Christina
    GM Customer Service
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    Well if you care I would have a resolution! Yet I was told nothing can be done! Why are you still employed? My tax dollars bailed GM out and I bought a GM product!
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    You might care Christina, but GM does not. GM refuses to cover ANY corrosion under it's warranty, so your efforts are moot. You have no authority to do anything to help any of the people on this forum. You simply take notes and relay them GM area managers, who then do nothing to address the problem, per GM policy.

    If GM cared, they would stand behind their warranty instead of giving customers the runaround and forcing them to sue in order to get satisfaction.

    GM is a sham, a failed company bailed out by the taxpayers, with no clue about how to produce a quality product or satisfy its customers.

    Government Motors!!!!!
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    Christina,

    I'll bet you do not even understand the GM warranty as it pertains to corrosion. Tell me Christina, what corrosion is covered under the warranty?

    I challenge to you to respond.

    You cannot, because you are just a note taker with no understanding of the GM warranty, much less how to help someone.
  • KCRamKCRam Mt. Arlington NJPosts: 3,516
    You're certainly allowed to discuss your issues and express (some) frustration, but as with any other member conversation, do not make things personal.

    kcram - Pickups/Wagons Host
  • id1386id1386 Posts: 1
    Think BIG TOBACCO...delay...deny...frustrate...plead ignorance...ignore...reposition as "THE, NEW-CARING...WE LISTEN AND WE CARE COMPANY" ...TRY DEFIANCE ! TRY ANY GOTDAM THING THAT WILL KEEP US FROM LIABILITY AND ADMISSION THAT WE KNEW WE WERE SELLING JUNK FRAMES...SUBSTANDARD STEEL. Hire a slew of professional metallurgists that can be bought, to swear under oath that the junk we pushed on customers were of the highest automotive quality, after all, TOBACCO had MEDICAL DOCTORS !!!

    Imagine one of these disasters someday being a...CLASSIC? A CLASSIC WORTH RESTORING? THERE WON"T BE ANY.

    STILL THE SAME FAILED LOSERS IN CHARGE WHO BUILT JUNK LONG ENOUGH TO KILL THE INDUSTRY...TODAY, UNION GOONS OWN THE COMPANY.

    A GIGANTIC CLASS-ACTION SUIT IS INEVITABLE AND THE SETTLEMENT WILL NOT BE COUPONS FOR A CAR WASH !

    SEE YOU IN COURT !
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    They would rather fight you in court and deny that they cover corrosion under the warranty. I have already gone that route and it is very expensive.

    They don't care if they lose because it's not their money. If they lose, the execs still get paid, and if the company goes broke again, the taxpayers will bail them out.

    It's like suing the government.
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    CLASS ACTION!!! CLASS ACTION!!! CLASS ACTION!!!
  • I am also so tired of watching my truck Rot away Had to replace all the shock mounts and the cross member under the bed and countless brake lines rocker panels are all but gone and now the bottoms of the doors are rotting it seems like its never gonna end I wish I had a spare 30 grand around to get a new truck not A Chevy but unfortunately I don't. I definitely want in on a class action if one is made.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    You need a critical mass of plaintiffs. I see hundreds, but maybe no thousands.

    And a finding by the NHTSA that GM has a corrosion problem would give the suit a much higher probability of succeeding.

    That's why it's so important for everyone to report their corrosion issues to the NHTSA.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    An NHTSA recall is your best bet to force GM to take care of the problem and compensate people for their losses.

    File your complaint with the NHTSA and write your Congressman a letter insisting that NHTSA escalate its investigation.
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    That is exactly what I have done. It is easy and painless, and they call you for a little info to confirm, and start a log for casefiles. You can see mine at safecar.gov #10402609.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    I have done the same, and also written to my Congressmen, who has contacted NHTSA and asked them to expedite the matter. Google your Congressman and send him a brief letter with a copy of your complaint.

    Ask him what the status of the investigation is and why it's taking so long.

    Email a copy of your letter to the Associated Press news desk.

    Pressure!!!!

    Once NHTSA issues a finding, GM will have to do a recall.
  • KCRamKCRam Mt. Arlington NJPosts: 3,516
    You will get absolutely nothing from a class-action lawsuit. First of all, no one makes money in these things except the attorneys. Second, the most you'll get is a coupon... worth a few thousand dollars, assuming you actually redeem it. And the defendant corporation in such suits knows full well that many people won't bother, which saves them even more money. I'm sure some of you have received letters or emails from attorneys who sued computer manufacturers, utility and communication companies, and the like for class action settlements that amount to a $10-25 coupon or credit to your account.

    Auto manufacturers only warrant the sheetmetal against rust perforation, as the painting procedure is intended to prevent this. For those that want to do some research, note that the Toyota Tacoma frame rust issue was not remedied by a recall or lawsuit. Toyota instituted a "Customer Satisfaction" program to buy back 1995-2000 trucks, and replace the frames on 2001-2004 models. Note that Toyota recognizes some of these trucks will never be brought in for inspection, there are conditions involved for specific situations, and the model years being bought back are old enough that the settlement amount is tolerable to their bottom line.

    Ranting and raving does nothing. I'm sure the majority of you would think the same if one of your business customers came in screaming like a lunatic about something that your company clearly put in writing. When they're done yelling, you would point out what they agreed to and send them on their way. GM is no different.

    The way to get a solution is to work with them, not against them. Instead of threats (whether of lawsuits, media coverage, or lost future sales), a far more successful method is to say something to the effect of "I like my truck, but I noticed this problem. What can be done so I'm confident in buying another one in a couple of years?" I've actually done this a number of times, and my concerns have always been addressed.

    kcram - Pickups/Wagons/Vans+Minivans Host
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    kcram,

    I have first hand knowledge that you do not have. I have also seen more than a hundred emails from other owners of late model GM trucks with the same problem. GM is doing nothing to address it.

    First, the undercarriage is protected against corrosion with a coating, in addition to the use of corrosion resistant steel. The vital structural and safety components are supposed to last the life of the vehicle, not a couple of years.

    Second, you do not understand GM's position on its warranty. GM does not warranty any corrosion on the vehicle caused by the environment, despite the misleading language they provide on rust through. That includes sheet metal and the undercarriage. They may fix a minor problem as part of what they call "Good Will", but they will tell you that they are not obligated under the warranty.

    Third, there is no "working with" GM on this problem. I took it to the top of the company. They will not fix an undercarriage corrosion problem, regardless of how the vehicle was used, where it was purchased, how it was maintained, etc. They have stated this in court testimony.

    Toyota initiated its buy back program after NHTSA did its investigation and found the vehicles lacking, and after the widespread negative publicity. Toyota stonewalled its customers for years before the adverse publicity finally forced them to act.

    GM is doing the same thing now, and making nice with them will not get you a resolution, just months of runaround. Like any big bureaucracy, they would rather litigate and take their chances than admit the problem and fix it.

    That's one of the reasons they went out of business the first time and why they will go out of business again.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    kcram,

    You are probably correct about the class action suit not providing any remedy to individual owners. About all that can be achieved at this point is the satisfaction of holding GM's fee to the fire.

    However, you are wrong about everything else, including the warranty and GM's willingness to address the problem.

    GM has stated in court documents that its warranty covers NO corrosion due to the environment, anywhere on the vehicle, and that includes the sheet metal.

    The so-called five-year rust-through protection for sheet metal is a sham.

    GM has a problem with premature corrosion of certain of its trucks, and they are stonewalling attempts to get justice.
  • KCRamKCRam Mt. Arlington NJPosts: 3,516
    No one was entitled to a 100% stainless steel alloy truck. Where did GM promise in writing that their vehicles were rust-free? The coatings applied to the frames are not a guarantee of rust prevention.

    The reason they state rust due to environment is not covered is because they have no control over the environment. No manufacturer is going to cover rust on a truck sold to a DOT or public works department that is used as a salt-spreader in winter, or beach patrol by the ocean. So they're not going to cover a truck owned by anyone else for similar corrosion.

    Toyota Tacomas are still not under recall for frame rust. The buyback and frame replacement programs are not open to every truck in the affected model years. There are trucks in those model years that have no sign of frame perforation that has put other Tacomas out of service.

    I live in the northeast and I deal with road salt every winter. Having owned full-size pickups exclusively for over 20 years, I recognize that rust is a possibility. So I pay extra to have my trucks treated before delivery. Does that prevent rust? Of course not. Does it slow rust formation way down? Yes, it does. I don't expect the manufacturer to cover it; I address it myself before it happens.

    Writing to the manufacturer CEO is a waste of time. It will be read by a staff member and forwarded back down the chain. Again, the key is not to be combative - the manufacturers have legal teams that do nothing but handle the ranters... and they're very good at what they do. With all the correspondence you say you have made, you have likely been labeled as such a customer. And for every one of you, there are 1000 people who will still buy a Silverado or Sierra.

    I'm not saying your concerns are not legit; but your methods of addressing those concerns could be the reason you aren't getting a positive reaction.

    kcram - Pickups/Wagons/Vans+Minivans Host
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    Never said that anyone was entitled to a stainless steel truck.

    They are however entitled to a truck that will be essentially rust free over the period of the warranty provided it is not abused or operated in a way that the truck was not intended to be operated. They are certainly entitled to a truck that will maintain structural integrity and be safe to operate within the warranty period, and really, for the intended life of the truck.

    I have lived all over the country, including the Northeast, and have plowed in the winter. I had a Ford truck for ten years not garaged on the ocean in the Northeast with zero rust. My brother has a 20 year old Chevy that was used as a plow truck, never washed or maintained, with virtually zero undercarriage rust. I have seen thousands of vehicles is all sorts of uses and never have I seen anything near this type of corrosion in such a short time.

    The GM trucks we are talking about are rusting prematurely, sometimes within months of delivery. And not just in rust belt areas. all over the country. One rusted within a year in a semi-desert area.

    I agree that writing to GM is a waste of time, because they have no interest in standing behind their products. That's why they went bankrupt and headed that way again. However, you are required to put your complaints in writing prior to taking legal action, which I did.

    I am not recommending that anyone take legal action, because it is expensive, and as you say, GM has very good attorneys. What I have suggested is that they report their safety issues to NHTSA and let their Congressman know. I suspect an NHTSA recall or adverse finding and some bad publicity might just get GM's attention.

    I have dealt with hundreds of companies on many different issues and I have never seen a company stonewall and obfuscate like GM, and that includes the federal government. They are in a class by themselves.
  • gmcustsvcgmcustsvc Posts: 4,252
    casilla,
    If you would like for us to look into this please just email your case number or your contact information and we can take a look into your case.
    Christina
    GM Customer Service
  • Anything GM could do to help people out of this rot situation the better! I just put almost 2 thousand into wheel bearings brakes shocks and tires, before i noticed the front frame section had a small rot hole that grew quite large very quickly. This is in a 1999 suburban 2500, with only 110,000 miles on it! I babied this truck, washed it every weekend and went to the extent of inserting the hose into the frame to rinse out debris sand etc. And now she sits, unable to be driven, not worth a dime except in parts. I keep saying if this was a toyota i would be taken care of. Thats why when we needed a new family car we bought a hyundai!! I cant wait till a foreign company produces a full size 3/4 ton truck! Thats what I will be buying if Gm doesnt man up and help us out with this problem.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    GM will do nothing for you except give you the runaround.

    They don't even cover corrosion DURING THE TERM OF THE WARRANTY. My brand new Chevy truck rusted out in two years and they would do nothing.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    Report your corrosion to NHTSA. You can do it over the phone. They are investigating GM right now for premature corrosion right now.

    NHTSA can force a recall. GM will do nothing for you otherwise.
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    We too were considering a Chevrolet for a family car, but considering the way things are going with my first new GM purchase, we too bought a Hyundai!!If they build a fullsize work capable truck, I am on board!It may be taht a new truck from GM is only a $28000 deal, not much to them, but about what the average person makes per year in my area!
  • greg128greg128 Posts: 451
    An NHTSA recall is your best bet to force GM to take care of the problem and compensate people for their losses.

    I did a quick search on link title

    I found about 3 complaints of rust specifically on 2000-2006 Silverados.
    There were many complaints about the tailgate cables breaking. These are complaints made directly to NHTSA. According to these statistics and considering the number of vehicles sold this seems to be a non-issue.

    I have a 2006 and live in New York and I see NO rust on frame or body.
    I find it suspect that about half of the posts on this thread are made by
    about 2 posters.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    I have received over a 100 emails from GM truck owners all over the country complaining of brake failures and other premature corrosion issues. NHTSA has a couple hundred complaints on file and is conducting an investigation.

    If it was a minor issue, GM would just take care of the handful of cases and replace the vehicles at very little cost. I suspect the problem is more widespread and they are covering up.
  • greg128greg128 Posts: 451
    edited June 2011
    I have no doubt that you and many others are having rust problems with
    your trucks. I think living near the ocean as is your case can have a very real effect on the frame and body. I recently worked on a mid 2000 Ford
    F-250 Police vehicle that does duty on Fire Island here on Long Island. The paint was pitted in spots. I never see that on that year Ford on anything driven inland.

    Also many pick up trucks around here are used to haul boats in and out of the salt water bays via boat ramps resulting in the total immersion of the frame and lower body in salt water.

    That could be the case in many (not all of course) of the complaints. If you go to link title and search "rust" in complaints the first complaint for a Chevy truck is page 8 of the search. Most of them are for Toyota, with quite a few for Hyundai, Nissan, Honda and a smattering of Fords. I conclude that the rust problem for the GM pickups are no worse and might be and probably is better than the competition.

    I try to research this objectively but of course I could be wrong
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    I have received emails from GM truck owners who live nowhere near the beach whose trucks have rusted prematurely, one owner who lives in a semi-desert area.

    I had a Ford truck here for three years parked in the same spot as my Chevy. It didn't have a spot of rust on it. The Chevy rusted out in two years. The rear drive shaft snapped in half.

    That cannot be explained by living close to the beach.
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    What part of NY do you live in? I am in the Adirondack MTs. and there is more rust on my 1 year old GMC than there was on my 9 year old Dodge! I can show you about 100 trucks in backyards from roughly 1998-2005, sitting in back yards, rusted so bad that they cannot be driven. They claim that they are "the longest lasting trucks on the road", which may be true, they are on the road, just not moving!
  • greg128greg128 Posts: 451
    I live on Long Island. While we don't have the amount of snow that people get upstate we have been averaging 3 or 4 major snowstorms and 4 or 5 minor storms per winter and they use alot of salt on the roads..

    I have a 2006 Silverado. I looked underneath it today and saw almost no rust. There was some in the front end parts, but only a little. The guy next to me at work has a 2005 Silverado and a 2006 Colorado and I examined both and saw again very little rust.

    Can you take a picture of the one year old GMC? If you would like I'll take a picture of mine and we can compare.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    It's not all GMCs. It's a small subset. I don't know why, but some GMCs are fine, others used in the same way and the same location rust out. It's odd.

    GMC should just fix the ones that have obviously rusted prematurely, but they won't That's why they're Government Motors and will go bankrupt again. They do not stand behind their products, they stand behind their attorneys, funded by taxpayers.
  • gmcustsvcgmcustsvc Posts: 4,252
    chrisb01440,
    I apologize for your frustrations. Have you spoke with your dealer or GM Customer Assistance? I look forward to your response.
    Christina
    GM Customer Service
  • I have not yet, I just figured it would be futile since this problem has existed for a while and I have not seen or heard anything from GM about this issue. I do occasionally look online to find out if any recalls have happened but no info can be found about them even discussing the issue. I do understand these trucks with the issues are older but I also believe a 3/4 ton with low miles that was taken care of shouldnt be sitting in my driveway unregistered. I am a ford guy, but purchased this suburban due to the excellent luck my father had with his chevy 1500. Me and my father run a retail tire store with a large clientele and see issues arise that seem to be consistent. With the rust issues I see on the ford rangers (rear frames, wheels leaking etc) and the chevys with the frame problems, it makes me wonder if the american car companies seem to think they dont need to take care of there customers the way toyota did on there tacomas. Every customer I have that had the toyota tacoma swears that will be the only truck they drive, for one reason, LOYALTY. They know if there is a major issue toyota will step in and do something about it. I hope ford and GM will follow there lead.
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    They will NOT do anything for you. Their customer service rep, who has ZERO authority to resolve disputes, will take your complaint over the phone. Then a couple weeks later you will get a quasi form letter telling you there is nothing they can do because they do not cover corrosion due to the environment. Then if you question their decision, they will assign the case to a so-called supervisor, who is just another low level customer service rep. And a couple of weeks later you will get the same form letter. And so on and so forth forever.

    GM will not cover any corrosion due to the environment (all corrosion), regardless of where you live or how you garage and care for your vehicle, or how fast it rusts out. If you live in the desert and keep your vehicle in a climate controlled garage, and only drive it on Sundays on paved roads, they will not cover you if the vehicle corrodes head to toe.

    That's why they are GOVERNMENT MOTORS!!!!!
  • I just replaced another brake line on my 2000 silverado and I can't believe the ammount of metal flaking off the frame and upper control arms on the front end. I will replace the others tomarrow and see what i can do about stopping the corrosion. I don't think there are only two people with this issue. I have a 87 one ton that I put through the mill a few times on the beach and the frame is perfect. I just don't understand. Brake lines I understand are an expendable item. The frame and undercarriage parts are not. Tailgate straps come on. Lets get this frame issue resolved.
  • I replaced my entire break system on a 02 TWICE. Do yourself a favor and eliminate that from your corrosion problems. Use Cunifer tubing to replace lines. My still look like the day I put them in. The frame unfortunately is rotting away around them. Do those lines, it's really scary when you lose breaks while towing at 65 MPH.
  • casillacasilla Posts: 20
    I must say I thought I was doing the right thing by buying a GM Truck, but I am truly disappointed by the lack of caring by the corporate stucture of GM. I am severely disappointed in the poor quality of construction of the 2010 GMC Sierra I purchased as I have had 2 seat cushions replaced and still have fuzz all over, my undercoating is coming off my driveshaft clunks and my transmission is whining so loud that I can hear it over my Dynomax exhaust and my radio. I noticed tonight when I was waxing that my door bottoms are all pock marked,. These are all normal operating conditions I am told every time I have to take time from work to drive a 100 mile round trip. I sure would like my money back!!!
  • kendonhankkendonhank Posts: 61
    Government Motors!!!!!!!!!!!!!
  • rogerperryrogerperry Posts: 1
    edited June 2011
    I purchased a new 2000 Model 2500 4X4 in October of 1999. This truck currently has 25,500 miles and appears in almost new condition inside and out. There is absolutely no body panel rust and the truck has always been garaged. I recently took it back to the dealership for service and was called to come back after they put it on the lift. They were astonished at the undercarriage rust and advised me to contact Chevy customer service, as they stated it would not be practical to repair the truck. I would note here that the truck was garaged next to a 1961 Jaguar, which has none of the problem of rust from the same storage conditions. I have since learned that General Motors purchased defective steel from Mexico around the period this truck was manufactured; and this truck was made in their Texas truck plant, which makes me suspect some of that steel was used on my truck. This is not just a case of a defective truck being sold by Chevy, but it is also a grave safety issue. Chevy customer service offered a $1,000.00 credit toward the purchase of a new truck.
    I would like to make other truck owners aware of this dangerous condition as Chevy obviously does not care to support their customers as Toyota has on a similar problem.
  • Well like I said in an earlier post, me and my father run a retail tire store. Which I am purchasing from him the end of this month. My rotted chevy with 110,000 miles on it sits in the parking lot next to the building. And I warn every customer that even mentions getting a new truck to avoid chevy and point them in the direction of my truck to take a look at how well the "longest lasting truck on the road" actually holds up. I know I have saved numerous people from making the same mistake I did. And I will leave that truck right there and continue to "advise" my customers until GM steps up and takes care of this. My truck still books for about 6500, I would be happy it they even offered to buy it back for half that. At least that would be something!
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