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Toyota Echo

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Comments

  • mdaffronmdaffron Member Posts: 4,421
    I had a set of RE-92 Poortenzas (as they've come to be known on the Protege discussion) on my '92 Protege when I bought it new in December 1991. Eight months later, in August 1992, I had just come off an off-ramp from the interstate onto a four-lane divided secondary road here in Richmond, VA -- speed limit 45, I was going 35 because of the rain. Saw a Volvo 245 DL at the bottom of the slight hill I was coming down -- he was at least a tenth of a mile away. Started braking -- nothing. I tried everything -- I could even spin the steering wheel from lock to lock like it was the tuning knob on a stereo. No friction whatsoever. The guy I hit even told the judge he saw me coming with my wheels turned all the way to the left, yet I was going in a straight line. I kept those tires rotated and everything, yet in 28,000 miles, they were slick enough to do that.

    The car was totaled (and there was $6,000 damage to the Volvo) -- but I did walk away from it. I replaced the car with another '92 Protege, but swapped the Poortenzas for a set of Toyos at about 22,000 miles. The Toyos were still doing fairly well when I traded the car at 83,000 miles, for comparison!

    If you'd like to see a pic of what the RE92s caused, go here (and I apologize for the b+w pic, but I was a newspaper reporter at the time):

    http://www.geocities.com/negatize/media/specialty/meade92_totaled.jpg

    My present car, a 2000 Protege ES, also came with these horrible tires. I kept putting off replacing them but finally did at 33,000 miles -- but by then the tires were spinning from every takeoff in the rain, and were downright terrifying on the highway in the rain. I replaced them with a set of Dunlop SP Sport A2s -- excellent, excellent tire. The car goes like it's on rails in the rain even after 14,500 miles with these tires. They're H-rated but feel more like V-rated tires. And they didn't do too badly in yesterday's snow either!

    I highly recommend the Dunlops (they're only about $80 apiece at tirerack.com where I bought them), and I highly DO NOT recommend the Bridgestone Potenza RE92. (There are other versions of the Potenza and I've heard that some of them are good tires -- just stay away from the RE92.)

    If you need further owners' opinions, please go to the tirerack site and read the customer reviews for both tires. You'll see a whole lot of commentary about the Potenzas being terrifying in the rain.

    BTW, the Dunlop has a treadwear rating of 420 if memory serves me correctly -- and by how mine are doing, I fully expect to get at least 60,000 miles out of these tires. I barely got that much mileage out of the THREE sets of OEM Potenzas I experienced over the last 10 years.

    Meade

    P.S. Pat, I know this is not the tire discussion. But since the subject was being discussed here, I thought I'd answer here. Now, as Forrest Gump said, "That's all I have to say about that."
  • babyboomerbabyboomer Member Posts: 205
    The name of the "ship" in the 1960 movie "The Whackiest Ship In The Army" with Jack Lemmon and Ricky Nelson was?

    Yep, the ECHO.
  • rajmoranrajmoran Member Posts: 46
    It's been a while since I've posted. It's coming up on three years now and I still own my ECHO (a 2000 model) and still love it. Happy Holidays, everyone.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    How many miles now?
  • rajmoranrajmoran Member Posts: 46
    I've got 42,000 now, which works out to around 14,000 per year. I tend to ride my motorcycle to work in the good weather, so the car doesn't get the workout it might otherwise. I can report that I was on the road to Pennsylvania around Thanksgiving and that the ECHO performed flawlessly in some pretty dicey road conditions.
  • cruxakiracruxakira Member Posts: 4
    Hi,
       I am interesting in buying a 2003 ECHO.
    It will be a 4DR with 4-C Automatic. With all the option I want, the total of the invoice price from web site will be $14,000(w/o Tax). I will pay in cash. Could it be cheaper? How could I talk the dealer to it?It is my first time of buying a new car. I have no experience of buying a car. Please give me some suggestion. Thanks a lot!!!

    Rex
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Try to go at the end of the month. Ive heard thats when theyre trying to get a sales figure or goal and your car might get them over. Ask to see the invoice. Show them the money. (that you have the cash or the loan already) Make an offer, like maybe $300 under invoice. Make sure they have your phone number and WALK OUT if they dont meet it. Some times they play the "let me go ask the boss" and come back and brightly smiling say "Its approved!" then they go back later and say "I cant do it" If that happens walk out and hope they call. Go to a less well known dealer. Also, call around the state (or even country) and try to get a price.
    I know how to fix car, but really I doubt I am able to manipulate others to get the best deal. (I suspect few others are either) Being in the right place at the right time is worth its weight in interest payments. ECHO is a GREAT car however, so I think you cant go far wrong buying one in any case.
    I just screwed myself the other day bigtime. I wanted my family to have a digital camera for xmas. (OK I wanted me to have it but my wife WILL use it too) I decided on a Canon Powershot 40 and looked on the net for the cheapest price ($217-350) I went to the $217 place but got talked into extras I really didnt need and the price came to $403! Its dog eat dog out there! (but I like the camera and will be happy with it)
  • cruxakiracruxakira Member Posts: 4
    Thanks dude! I will try to do this...It is a really valuable suggestion for me!!! Thanks again!
  • rjgeerjgee Member Posts: 27
    Start reading all you can about car negotiating:


    Here's a good start:

    (Confessions of a car salesman is a great article to see some of the tricks they try)

    http://www.edmunds.com/advice/?id=lin9033

  • biggie4852biggie4852 Member Posts: 34
    Looking at a 4 door automatic dealer will not go pass $13,185 fully load . I would like other owner to reply with comparable equip car as to price they paid. This would help greatly in our purchase we plan to buy in the next 3-4 days.
    Thanks all
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I saw an 03 Echo in person for the first time last night, parked in a mall called Arundel Mills in Hanover, MD. I was pleasantly surprised by the styling upgrades. It makes the car look neater, I think. This one had the 15" wheel package, and it definitely fills out the wheelwells, and it's only $90 so that's not a bad upgrade.

    Maybe with the styling changes, the Echo will become a better seller. It's too bad some don't like the looks of the Echo and don't look past that, there's alot of fun, reliability, and value to be had here.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    What do you mean by "loaded"? Do you mean power windows and locks, keyless entry, CD player, etc.? If so, then that's a good price. But I wouldn't go more than $500 over invoice in today's market for an Echo.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    I saw my first 2003 ECHO on the street last night. (Ive seen them in dealers lots, but covered with protective plastic stuff) Cant understand why they went to the expence of restyling it as there isnt much difference. The thing that stands out is the Toyota emblem on the front of the car. I like the origional style better IMHO. Im couldnt be more pleased with the changes as now my ECHO will look current to the uneducated eye at least until the next change.
  • coolguyky7coolguyky7 Member Posts: 932
    I believe I saw another new silver 2003 the other day turning into Best Buy. The black ECHO with those reflective tail lights looks really good.
  • wrgrahamwrgraham Member Posts: 112
    I just got my 60,000 service at the Toyota dealers for my 2000 Echo 5 speed. This is the first time I have had the car taken anywhere for service. I change my oil and filter every 6K and I did replace the air filter at about 35K. Once I added some coolant, as it had gotten below the mark. Anyway, the Echo runs as great as ever. The service report said I still had 70% left on the front brakes and 75% left on the rear. Overall I would say the car is not as quiet as when new, but still a fairly quiet vehicle. And I can sense more bump in the suspension when I go over poor road surfaces than before. Power is just as good as new, as best I can tell. I changed tires at about 40K, replacing the original 175/65 Potenza's with 185/60 Potenza model RE930i. These are really first rate tires, much better quality than the original Potenza's which I did not like. The sidewall of the tire says Traction A, Temperature A, and Treadwear 300. The big improvement for me is the terrific traction on wet roads which I did not have with the original tires. Sometime soon I should run another miles per gallon test, since I havent done that since my original testing when the car had less than 15K miles. I had gotten 42mpg over many fills at that time.
    I really like and appreciate this car. We do have strong winds over here, and it does take some getting adjusted to deal with that, but it becomes a non-issue for us after that. We do not have any freeways or highways of 4 or more lanes to drive here. If I had to do a lot of high speed freeway driving I can see how I might look to a heavier car. But I love the agility and economy of this Echo. I would buy another without a doubt. And since my daughter now drives it, she has her learner's permit, maybe I will have to buy another in the future.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Thnakyou for your post about your ECHOs milestone and congradulations. That was an interesting article to read. My 2001 ECHO has 13,964 miles on it because I just drive it 6 miles to work mostly and probably wont get anywhere near 60k for a while. (which isnt good because short trips wear out a car mechanically much faster.)
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Now that your ECHO has 60k miles on it, every time you change your oil remember to check the four flexible boots on the drive axles that go from the transmission to the front wheels. Most likely you still have three or four years before they go, but when they do if you dont catch it right away youll need new axle shafts installed $500+?) as opposed to just replacing the boots themselves ($200?) I think their demise is most likely tied to age as opposed to miles, but keep an eye on them.
  • wrgrahamwrgraham Member Posts: 112
    That is a good thought about the boots. I will be sure to keep an eye on them. One other minor thing that came to mind is the tire rotation, switching front and back tires on the same side. About half way through the life of my original tires I did that, but havent done so on the replacement tires yet. Seems like I often hear about tire rotation, but I have seldom done that in the years I have driven various vehicles. And I have no memory of any problem from not rotating. Since more weight and hence more wear would occur on the front I can suppose that a well timed rotation will allow all 4 tires to wear out at about the same time. But that is about all.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I thought you only switched tires like that anyway? Of course, I have to as mine are directional...
  • vadpvadp Member Posts: 1,025
    Did you get your new tires at Costco?
    Yes, Potenza RE930i's are very good tires for the price, especially with the Costco deal ($50 off with a purchase of 4).
  • wrgrahamwrgraham Member Posts: 112
    Yes, I did get my tires at Costco, Kona, about a year ago I would guess. And the $50 off pricing was in effect at the time.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    About all rotating your tires will do is make them wear out evenly. If you dont rotate the fronts will wear out before the rears. I dont know of any reason to rotate other than this. Maybe someone has heard of another benefit?
  • tominvatominva Member Posts: 7
    Warren Brown, the car critic for The Washington Post, has a very positive review of the 2003 Echo. His daughter just bought one, and he drove it from the DC area to upstate New York for her. In addition to the print edition, his review is posted online here. Very good publicity for the Echo!
  • modernmmodernm Member Posts: 5
    Did you get $50 off 4 Potenza tires from Costco tire center?, I need to replace my 4 tires as well, and I just call Costco they told me there is no such promotion. I am in So. California.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    Nope, but I don't have an Echo. I have a Jetta. I checked prices for my tires (Michelin Pilots) at Sam's Club, and they were $200 each! I will be getting Sumitomos next.
  • rsangesrsanges Member Posts: 4
    I'm considering a '03 ECHO, but I have one pet peeve that I need satisfied. I have not seen any 2003s yet, and I don't want to contact a dealer just now.

    Does the tail light assembly have a separate bulb for the turn signal, separate from the brake light? IE, when you apply the brakes and the turn signal simultaneously, does the brake light (on that side) flash?

    I can't stand cars that do that, and I swore to never buy a car with that design. It just seems cheap and unsafe IMHO. Thanks for your help.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I saw one in a shopping mall not too long ago. I could have sworn that there is a separate bulb, but don't hold me to it.
  • coolguyky7coolguyky7 Member Posts: 932
    I hate tail lights that have red turn signals! It is more difficult to notice someone is turning with those kind, especially in the day light. My favorite tail lights are those that are amber but you don't see the yellow/orange color without the light because its hidden behind a clear/white color. My 96 Corolla has that.
  • vadpvadp Member Posts: 1,025
    A couple of times a year Costco sends out those little booklets with a bunch of coupons.

    They usually include that $50 or $30 coupon in there - last time it was $50 off with a purchase of any 4 Bridgestone or Michelin tires at the Costco tire center.

    And yes, they're right. There's no such promotion at the moment.
  • babyboomerbabyboomer Member Posts: 205
    Somewhere I read that the very best time to buy a car off the lot is the Monday after Christmas, and the more miserable the weather the better deal you can get.
  • coolguyky7coolguyky7 Member Posts: 932
    That belief makes a lot of sense. First of all, who even likes Mondays? Secondly, most people have spent a lot of money for Christmas and need to save up again. Thirdly, aren't car sales worse in the winter anyway?
  • smoothresultsmoothresult Member Posts: 1
    Hi All ~

    About 2 1/2 years ago, I had a choice between a Kia Sportage and a Toyota Echo. Had a gut feeling about the Echo, but went with the Sportage. Well, 2 1/2 years later, I'm not sure of the problem, but either the tires or the 4 wheel drive (not sure which) on this particular Kia (even if not on any other one) is horrible. I can't see 2 1/2 more winters with this thing. Tonight, Dec 23rd, 2002, I am unable to finish my Christmas shopping, because I am sliding on barely 1/4" slush on a straight surface. Go figure..(yes, the 4WD is set correctly.)

    Anyway, would I be thinking off another planet to attempt trading this 2000 Kia in for an Echo? I know how to research, etc., but not too familiar with the 'trading up', 'trading down' theory, just where I am on that line, & if it's even a possibility. I owe about $7000 on the Kia, and according to the Edmunds site research, it is worth $8030 on trade in (maybe more).

    Also, it seems from this site that the older model Echos are getting a higher rating than the 2003. Any comments on this?

    Thanks for any help you may have to offer!
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    The"new" amd "old" ECHOs are virtually identical so I dont see how one could be better than the other.
    Have you driven another Sportage to see how it handles on snow? Maybe discussed this with other owners in the Town Hall? Or the dealer? I think you are right in your feeling that its the tires. Is it time for new ones yet? As long as the vehicle is OK mechanically I would keep it unless you want to take a major hit on tradeing it in. Good luck and tell us what you find out/decide.
  • rwgreenbergrwgreenberg Member Posts: 154
    Hi all. I've been following your group for some time now and decided to buy today. While I've always driven sticks, I decided to buy my Echo with automatic because my daughter will be learning to drive on it, and I felt it would be a bit safer to go with the automatic (at least at first).

    I ended up with the aqua-green color, AC and a few other options.

    Will pick up tomorrow and report back soon.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Nice color aqua-green. I got silver because many of my past cars were silver. We here at the ECHO forum are ready to answer your questions, if you have any! Good luck with your new car, your daughter must be very excited about it.
  • aeroterremeraeroterremer Member Posts: 79
    I wanted to share with you all my favorite gift this year. It's from my twin sister and it's the Hallmark Keepsake Item 'A Year To Remember 2002'.

    Since this is our first Christmas with Echo, she filled it with 4 photos she took of our Echo and recorded her own captions. I just love it all - my twin, my Echo, and my Echo keepsake!
  • rwgreenbergrwgreenberg Member Posts: 154
    Hi. I love my (our) new Echo so far (1 day). Peppy enough for us, good visibility, lots of cool storage nooks (the best part I think). The only option I couldn't get (unless I paid a lot more for a more loaded car) that would be nice are the remote side mirrors (I believe the option gives one a couple of convenient thingos on the inside to move the mirrors). Does anyone have any idea whether this feature can be added, and what it would entail and/or cost?
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Get on Google and look up Toyota Guys. Its a toyota dealer somewhere that has lots of stuff for ECHO and at discounted prices. I didnt get power mirrors or locks or windows on my ECHO and Im used to it now. AND my wifes Honda that does have them is costing us a fortune to get them fixed (car is 12 years old)
  • kaz6kaz6 Member Posts: 331
    On my way back to LA from Vegas tonight, I passed a new '03 ECHO. I didn't recognize it at first because of the light pattern in the back-tag light and tail are different. I'm partial to the old style as I felt it was cleaner.
    Funny thing: I was walking to my car and a man asked me if mine was the new version. I have 15" wheels and rear spoiler so I get that a lot.
  • biggie4852biggie4852 Member Posts: 34
    We purchase an 03 Echo on 12/23/2002 need a gas saver for the wife's 110 mile commute we live in Los Angeles. I must say I'm very please with it so far. We had Nissan Altima and it was not bad on gas but in this car we are getting almost a 50% increase in mpg. Plus it's very surprising that this little car is as comfortable even for a large man like myself. We purchase the automatic, power steering,15" wheels. But no power lock or window, but we don't even miss this option. We also own a 02 Trailblazer and have had problem with all the computer operate device. So it's good to go back to basic engine and transmission. It mean less maintances worried to me. The Monday idea is a good one. We talk to the dealer three day before purchase but my wife want to check out the Ford Focus over the weekend before she made up her mind.(NO GO IT HAD MORE POWER BUT MORE MONEY) We came back on Monday he drop the asking price by $500 so paid 12,745 for 2 door model. Edmund price on it TMV scale say we should pay 12,475 but we shop around and that was not happening.
  • rwgreenbergrwgreenberg Member Posts: 154
    Any advice on an easy and safe (as in no scratches) way to remove the wheel covers on my Echo. I've never had a car with wheel covers (past cars have had no covers, and I recently bought a 2001 Focus ZX3 that has alloy wheels. It turns out that the wheel covers on my Echo make it hard (almost impossible) to get my portable air device mated to the valve. I'm contemplating getting rid of the covers, but thought I would see how much of a hassle they are to get off and on.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I have almost always had cars with alloy wheels. The way I get the wheel covers off is to pry them off with the end of the jack handle that the owner's manual recommends using. Checking the manual might help in this situation.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    You can buy extensions for the valves in Pep Boys, AutoZone et. When you have new tires installed, get them to install longer valves and thata way you wont have to remove the covers.
  • rwgreenbergrwgreenberg Member Posts: 154
    Thanks. Extensions for valves...the answer to my problem.
  • rwgreenbergrwgreenberg Member Posts: 154
    Well, now that I have one of each I can't help but compare my experiences.

    So far:
    ZX3:
    More solid feeling and grippier (bigger tires too)
    Echo:
    Much more in the way of storage nooks.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    January First is Oil Change Day for my ECHO, but since I returned from a 240 mile nonstop trip on Sunday I changed my oil then thinking it would be best what with the oil well warmed up from the trip. The car sat for five minutes after I got home while I got my drain pan. Removing the plug I was careful not to get burned by the hot oil as it drained. But I got some on me anyway and it was...COLD! I guess the outside temperature was about 40 degrees F, but I was doing 75-80 for four hours before that. Well, I guess it isnt fair to say it was COLD, but it was less than lukewarm. I wonder does anyone else have any similiar experiences?
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    Dont forget to mention that if you are driving the ZX3 and you see another ZX3 being driven by a beautiful woman, if you wave to her she will NOT wave back BUT if you are both driving ECHOs youll definately get a wave in return. Sometimes the wave is just the beginning...
  • aeroterremeraeroterremer Member Posts: 79
    I received my recall notice in the mail this afternoon from Toyota Motor Sales, U.S.A, Inc. re 2001 & 2002 model year Toyota Echo rear brake tube safety. According to the notice, the problem concerns snow accumulating in the rear wheel and freezing, which may contact the rear wheel tube and cause the brake fluid to leak. I was rather surprised to receive the notice because I live in snowless Honolulu. Anyway, I'll call our dealer tom'r to schedule an inspection.
  • vocusvocus Member Posts: 7,777
    I know someone in here asked if the rear signal lights on the 03 Echo were amber or integrated with the taillamps and red. Well, I went to the mall where they have Toyotas last night, and thought about you (whomever you are). I made it a point to walk past the Echo and check its taillamps, and the signal lights are still yellow in the back. They are also round shaped. The Echo looks a little like a shrunken Matrix from the front now. All Toyotas are starting to look alike, it seems... :)
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Member Posts: 1,694
    The NY Times is reporting that the new toyota (I forget its name) is announced recently and will be out in 2004. It reportedly has a 108 hp engine....hmmmm where have we seen that before. No pictures though. There are marketing this like the ECHO toward young buyers. They werent worried about the 108 hp engine because they say youngsters can spend another $2-3k to hop it up if they want to. Its amazing how an outfit like Toyota can target its sales and be so completely WRONG. (ie ECHO was meant for the 20 set and most buyers are at least 40 and many retired) I wish they would pay me $$$,$$$ a year to make those calls because I can screw it up as good as anybody...maybe even better!
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