At a certain point, manufactures need to realize that their's only so much power you can pump to the front wheels. The torque steer on this car is just to annoying to me, and I noticed it on the test drive I took. My brother bought one about 5 months ago, and he loves it. The Maxima could really be the top of the crop in it's clas if Nissan would make it RWD or AWD drive. I'll wait for the the newly designed Infiniti M series. That car looks great, and I'm sure it'll RWD. Nissan will have another hit on their hands with that car.
I don't see the Maxima being the top of its class, RWD or not, with its disjointed interior.
I just test drove a G35 sedaan 6-speed today and even though it's a better interior than the Maxima, it's still 1-2 notches down from the 2004 TL, IMO. For whatever reason, Nissan/Infiniti just have some ticky tacky design elements, like the little aluminum steering wheel buttons, dash / center console look, power seat buttons to the right of the seat, etc. I sincerely wish Nissan would take a styling cue from Acura on the inerior - the TL just plain looks good, like it was desinged by one person with good taste, not a committee without.
As for the Maxima's torque steer, the TL 6-speed didn't have as much, in spite of being quicker. I think it's because the TL has a lower torque higher revving engine than the Maxima.
As for the G35 AWD, the G35 6-speed I test drove had a sticker of about $33.5k, including premium without navigation. I suspect that even with discounting, the G35 AWD would be $5k+ more than a Maxima and the same or higher than a TL.
According to the TL prices board, the non-navi models seem to be moving at a pretty good discount. The navis are another story, pretty much close to sticker.
I test drove the new 2004 Altima with the 3.5 V6, and I wouldn't call it torque steer, but rather, "steering wheel yank", it yanked the steering wheel to the left whenever starting from a dead stop with a bit of throttle, not full throttle, just above average, which I thought was unacceptable. I just picked up a 2001 Maxima (with the 3.0 of course) and it doesn't have this torque steer, I like it better than the new 3.5!
The 3.0 doesn't have as much torque as the 3.5 which is why the torque steer isn't nearly as bad. Like y'all didn't know that already ;-). When you get up into 260+ ft/lbs of torque, not many front drive cars have no torque steer. Even the sweet new 2004 TL has an abundance of torque steer. In reality, unless you're a teenager, who really stomps on it off a dead stop anyway. As long as you're aware it can happen if you hammer it, it ain't a big deal.
Good luck quantifying "a bit of throttle, not full throttle, just above average.." Not to sound harsh but those terms are a little too subjective to use in assessing the torque steer.
When I drive my 02 Max I accelerate quicker than most anyways. Even if I accelerate "just above average" the torque steer still isnt as bad as you imply. Now if I hammer the pedal to the floor that's a different story, but I know its coming so I take a firm hold of that wheel!
I'm planning on buying a SE this fall. All I want is the 6spd. and the sunroof. However, Nissan now reqiuires you to get the Bose stereo to get the sunroof. Adds a $1,000 to the sticker price. Disappointed enough to consider a Mazda6.
The 6 is considerably smaller than a Max, and probably a better bang per buck. But, the Max has more power and more panache. The Max is a better highway cruiser and the 6 would be better in the twisties. Why not up the ante and get a better vehicle than both for close price to what a Max would cost.........a G35! Then again from your post of $1,000 making a diff to you a G35 might be stretching it a bit. Just my .02, but if I was doing it again I'd probably go G35X to get all wheel drive since I'm in MN. Or else on the cheaper route I probably would get a 6. Don't think I'd buy an 04 Max, they just don't do it for me like they did when I bought my new 2000.
But, if you compare the specs, the 6 isn't really all that smaller. However, sitting in both, the 6 feels more like my '97 Accord and the Max is much bigger.
An additional $1,000 is more of a mental barrier, because I don't really think the stereo is worth it. But, the G35 is out of my league this time around, especially since I'm in MN too and would need the G35x
Never mind the packaging woes - read the complaint in the "chronic problems" forum (there are only two messages). I did not have so many problems with a used Yugo which I bought in 1990. It appears that the service is just as bad as the initial quality in this case. How can one try to balance tires sixteen times and do it wrong over and over again? No doubt the warped rotors (and maybe even bent rims) are the result of using an impact wrench on the lugnuts and applying uneven torque over and over again. And replacing the same strut three times?
We must remember these boards usually attract two types of people, enthusiasts and those unlucky few wo got lemons. Obviously the guy who posted about chronic problems got a lemon. It happens. Out of the 50,000, you are gonna get a few bad apples, be it Nissan, Honda, Mazda or anyone.
I have driven 2 Nissans, never a single problem besides the normal maintenance.
The internet can make the rarest case seem common.......
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Kiplinger's magazine had an interesting article and rated its top 24 midsize sedans according to value in the May issue. I was a little surprised to see the 04 Maxima at the top of the list. The car was rated No. 1 primarily because of its power, interior space, safety features and cost, which according to Kiplinger's, should be around $300 under invoice. The SL version it featured had a best price of about$27K (suggested retail of $29.8K).
The rest of the top five was the Camry XLE, Chevy Malibu LT, Altima SE and Accord EX.
for them to put the 04 maxima on top of the list, it's a joke... one of the things they're equating to value is the amount of power the maxima has... how does that translate to value for the buck? are they calculating by #HP/$$? I think overall, the Mazda 6 is a much better value especially since you could get one for $20K. The maxima is at least $7K more.. i'm not completely sure, but doesn't the 6 have good safety features too? and I own a maxima.. i just think the new maximas aren't as good "bang for the buck" as previous generations and since 04, other vehicles have taken that distinction away from the max..(it should be in top 10, just not #1)
you guys are assuming that the maxima is the same size/features as the 6. you are WAAAAY off on that. the 6 is smaller than the accord. it is less powerful than the camry. the ONLY thing it has on the maxima, IMO is the looks.
I'll wager the 6 handles much better than the Max. Although I've never driven one. Have driven an 04 6-sp Max though. Was ahh-ite, but would much rather have a new TL.
In a move sure to further diminish the Maxima's claim to the title of 4DSC, Nissan has formally announced the 2005 Altima SE-R. Really makes the 4DSC title a toss-up between that and the G35.
You can find the specs at www.nissannews.com under vehicle news. The SE-R has the same V-6 as the SE but with lowered suspension, larger sway bars, 6spd. manual, 18 inch forged aluminum wheels, all options standard. Also has a three gauge cluster from the 350Z in the center of the dash. Interesting. No details on pricing or availability.
I don't have the magazine in front of me right now, but I believe the Mazda 6s was eighth, behind the Passat GLX and a version of the Grand Prix.
Actually, the more I think about it, the Max should rate pretty high. It's got as much room and power as any midsize, the styling is hit or miss, depending upon your taste, but most safety equipment, including stability control, is standard or available. In addition, as the magazine points out, you can now get a loaded Maxima for close to what you pay for a Honda Accord EX V6 with navigation.
I like the Mazda 6s too, but by the time you put the safety equipment on it, you are close to the Maxima in cost, and to me, the Maxima is a more substantial car. Of course, the MZ6 does have a rebate which widens the price difference.
The Mazda is more fun to drive, but Nissan has targeted the Altima SE against the 6s in the affordable performance sedans market. The Maxima is aimed more at the Acura TL, which is a problem because the TL , like the Accord, is an outstanding value. By the way, the TL wasn't included in the Kiplinger's comparison because the upper price limit was $30 K.
The Maxima has changed a lot since I bought my SE 5-speed in 1995. So has the Mazda 6 from the former 626. However, I would still be inclined to think that the Maxima would be a much more likely car to make it 10 years and 150k miles, and still look good, than the Mazda 6. I've seen a few (very few) 1995 vintage 626s around and they look extremely dated and appear as though the finish was far cheaper than my Maxima.
BTW, I'm seriously considering getting a new TL as a replacement for my Maxima. The primary holdback is that the Maxima still looks and drives far younger than 9.5 years and 152k miles would imply. I wish I had a family member in need of a great hand me down, it would make my decision much less guilt ridden.
Habitat: If you have the space, hang onto your 95. Wife and I had 5 vehicles licensed and insured at one time because we liked the old ones so much and could not part with them when we bought the new. We kept the extra 2 in the barn. We are now down to 3 vehicles and the barn has more usable space. I probably face the same decision on our 97 Max (keep and use occasionaly and put in barn) when my wife turns over the 04 TL to me in a couple of years.
I understand your point. It is hard to let go of a great car.
But, if the money isn't a problem, I would move on. I see by your posts on the TL buyers board that you have negotiated a pretty good deal on a TL 6-speed with navi. Think of the improved safety features you will enjoy, and that sound system must be unreal. Plus, you will be doing a favor for someone who can use a great used car, right? Good luck.
I love my '01 Max but just for the record, my son drove a '90 626 for nearly 200,000 miles, and it's still going strong. It was the sedan hatchback in silver, which I thought was a very attractive car and never looked dated. I do think the later vintage -- '94-'00 -- 626's were not as handsome, and the recent version -- the 6 -- is very nice-looking and drives well too. For the money it's a great buy. However, I don't think it's in the same category as the TL; more like the Camry or maybe the Galant.
My 1993 626 had 170,000 miles on it before I donated it to children's hospital. Was still running with 1 new clutch at about 150,000 and no transmission problems. It was a very good v6 but I decided to get a better v6 in my 02 SE.
Was wondering if anyone knows of any major and or minor issues with the last gen Max. My dad's looking at low mileage 03 SE's, automatic. Apart from the acclaimed VQ engine, I thought some have experienced brake rotor issues. How is the tire life with the 17" wheels? Any info. on this is very welcome.
there is definitely rotor problems... if you get a max between 2000 and 2003, you should expect to cut your rotors about every 20k miles... if you want to avoid all this trouble, get some new aftermarket rotors, which i will be doing very soon on my 2k max
I average 10-15K miles before having to turn or replace my rotors. I replaced my rotors with after-market ones - that seems to have had no effect. Then I switched to ceramic after-market pads, still the same problem. My rotors were last cut about 5K miles ago and I am staring to feel a slight vibration developing. Will definitely need to cut the rotors (or replace them again) in another 5K miles.
I don't blame my Nissan dealer - I had my rotors cut by an independent mechanics once, and the result was the same – rotors warped within 10-15K miles.
I am starting to suspect there is something wrong with some other part of system - the calipers, maybe. Anyway, the car has been nearly perfect otherwise (65K miles currently), so I am resigned to doing the rotors every other oil change.
By the way my car is a 2001 GLE and it sees a lot of long trips at highway speeds with very little breaking.
Our other car – an Acura RSX-S – is driven a lot more aggressively, and at 50K miles the break pads and rotors have not been touched. May need to change the pads soon, but the rotors are totally true.
I have 23K miles on my '02 Max. Only problem I've had was I needed to get my stereo replaced under warranty when the CD player failed. No brake problems at all so far.
My dad has an '03 with over 20K miles and has had no problems at all.
I have a 1995 SE w/ 152,000 miles. Replaced the front pads twice (90,000 miles and 145,000 miles) and the rear pads once (120,000 miles). The rotors have never been touched.
A friend with a 2000 Maxima had a much worse experience. Rotors turned 1-2 times and then replaced in less than 3 years and 36,000 miles. She managed to get this covered by Nissan under warranty, and then traded the car last year.
Oddly, my 1995 Maxima has been by far the best car I have ever owned with respect to brakes (and everything else for that matter). My old 1978 Datsun B210 was the worst. And the 2-3 friends who have 2000+ Maximas have not been happy with their brake experience, and have other issues as well. Partly as a result, the only "Nissan" product that is remotely on my shopping list for a replacement sedan or SUV is the G35 6-speed, and it's near the bottom of a list that includes the TL, 330i, 530i, E320 CDI and a few others. Nothing by Nissan/Infiniti is on my SUV shopping list. But I still love my 1995 Maxima.
Rotors. On my 2k with 65,000 mi. I've replaced O2 sensors, coils, Mass Airflow sensor, LR Caliper and a fried headlight P-L-U-G.
On my wifes '02 Max. there was a safety recall for the Cam and crank angle sensors and a TSB for the rear wind noise. Depending on your VIN # , your '02 could be involved in 4 or 5 safety recalls. I feel like I live at my freakin dealer.
I would not recommend 5th . gens to ANYONE !!!
Let's hear from all you guys about how the " Made in Japan " cars are BETTER than the Smyrna Cars. Bullcrap !!!!!!
I have a 2K SE - 47K miles. I had rotors warp once, and the power mirror mechanism failed and was replaced under warranty. Also replaced the transmisson control module under warranty via a service bulletin. That's all the problems I've had.
On my y2k GLE, I only had to resurface the rotors after 3 years (about 33K miles), still under warranty/TSB. Then the Engine Control Module had to be reprogrammed after it started showing the Check Engine light. But the engine is starting to knock after about 40K miles. I have tried 91 octane gas, because I thought that maybe the 87-octane gas was causing it. It makes no difference. Maybe the ECM was not redone right?
I have a 97 (40k miles) and 03 Max (7k miles), both are GLEs and both have been reliable and problem free. As to the 97, I have replaced two sets of brake pads and one set of tires, and that that's been it. I have yet to give the 97 a tune up, as the engine has been running flawlessly.
I don't mean to pick on norbert44, he may have his reasons for using 87 octane gas in a $25k car. Whether that has contributed to his consistent knocking problem, I'm not qualified to say.
HOWEVER, I still think this is generally the most penny-wise pound-foolish decision anyone could make. A post audit of my Maxima economics is as follows:
9.5+ years 152,200 miles 6,355 gallons of 93 octane premium gas 23.95 miles per gallon $9,220.83 total gas expenditures
At an average savings of $0.10 per gallon, I would have saved $635 over the past 9.5 years (average of $67 per year). That's IF my gas mileage didn't suffer. If it dropped by 1 mile per gallon to 22.95, I would have burned an extra 277 gallons over 9.5 years at an average price of $1.35 (1.45 -0.10). As such, $374 of my savings would have been wiped out, leaving me with a whopping $261 in savings (about $27.50 per year). And I drive an above average 16,000 miles per year.
I can't honestly claim that the reason my engine runs as good as the day I bought the car is because I only burn 93 octane gas and change my oil every 4,000 miles. But I sure as hell wouldn't be "pound foolish" enough to burn 87 octane (or even 89-91) in the hopes of saving $27.50 or even $67 per year on a $25,000 car. Whatever remote chance that it could cause engine damage or lowered performance isn't worth it. Hell, you can buy a Chevy over a Maxima and save $10,000 if long term relaibility and performance isn't important to you.
I do make an effort to fill up with premium on Thursdays (6 cents off at Exxon). Proving that I'm not against getting a good deal, just against being imprudent about it.
Not that it's a big deal or anything, but the dealer told me straight out they don't put premium in ANY of their Nissans, new or used. That being for test drives or whatever reason they have to put gas in them. Probably too much additional expense. Wonder if this is true for all dealers or just mine??? Hmmmm.
It was a sales guy that I've gotten to know because we chat whenever I'm in for service that told me that. I asked about Murano's requiring premium, and he said "we just put normal pump gas in all the vehicles....."
Your calculations are little off. The savings between premium and regular would be a minimum of 15 cents a gallon and more like 20 cents in my neck of the woods.
Granted, it doesn't change your point that the savings are relatively small over a 10-year period, but to those, like me, who have never seen much of a difference either in gas mileage or performance in their cars no matter what octane we use, it is a savings.
I have primarily used 89 octane (sometimes 93 during the hottest summer months here in Florida, and sometimes 87 during the cool winter months) and the engine in my 92 SE is still strong. Unfortunately, a lot of stuff (water pump, oil something or other) is leaking and I'm holding off the repairs as long as I can while I try to come up with a replacement.
You calculations are little off. The savings between premium and regular would be a minimum of 15 cents a gallon an more like 20 cents in my neck of the woods.
Granted, it doesn't change your point that the savings are relatively small over a 10-year period, but to those, like me, who have never seen much of a difference either in gas mileage or performance in their cars no matter what octane we use, it is a savings.
I have primarily used 89 octane in my car and the engine in my 92 SE is as strong today as it was 10 years ago. Unfortunately, a lot of stuff is starting to leak and I've got to decide whether to pony up for repairs or move on.
Let me quote the y2k Max manual, page 10-4: "In most parts of North America, you should use unleaded gas with at least 87 or 91 octane.... now and then you may notice light spark knock for a short time while accelerating or driving up hills. This is no cause for concern, because ou get the greatest fuel benefit when there is light spark knock for a short time under heavy engine load."
As I said, my engine knocks no matter what gas I use. It only does that uphill and on heavy acceleration. My beef is that it did not used to do that ON ANY gas until the engine was reprogrammed by "factory trained technicians" at the Nissan garage.
From my years doing engineering for petroleum business, I have learned that the best octane is the cheapest gas that will not knock in your engine. And again, an occasional light knock will not do any damage to your engine. All other theories such as the one related to the cost of the car in your post 8076 have not been proven by any research, to my knowledge.
Comments
I just test drove a G35 sedaan 6-speed today and even though it's a better interior than the Maxima, it's still 1-2 notches down from the 2004 TL, IMO. For whatever reason, Nissan/Infiniti just have some ticky tacky design elements, like the little aluminum steering wheel buttons, dash / center console look, power seat buttons to the right of the seat, etc. I sincerely wish Nissan would take a styling cue from Acura on the inerior - the TL just plain looks good, like it was desinged by one person with good taste, not a committee without.
As for the Maxima's torque steer, the TL 6-speed didn't have as much, in spite of being quicker. I think it's because the TL has a lower torque higher revving engine than the Maxima.
As for the G35 AWD, the G35 6-speed I test drove had a sticker of about $33.5k, including premium without navigation. I suspect that even with discounting, the G35 AWD would be $5k+ more than a Maxima and the same or higher than a TL.
When I drive my 02 Max I accelerate quicker than most anyways. Even if I accelerate "just above average" the torque steer still isnt as bad as you imply. Now if I hammer the pedal to the floor that's a different story, but I know its coming so I take a firm hold of that wheel!
An additional $1,000 is more of a mental barrier, because I don't really think the stereo is worth it. But, the G35 is out of my league this time around, especially since I'm in MN too and would need the G35x
It appears that the service is just as bad as the initial quality in this case. How can one try to balance tires sixteen times and do it wrong over and over again? No doubt the warped rotors (and maybe even bent rims) are the result of using an impact wrench on the lugnuts and applying uneven torque over and over again. And replacing the same strut three times?
We must remember these boards usually attract two types of people, enthusiasts and those unlucky few wo got lemons. Obviously the guy who posted about chronic problems got a lemon. It happens. Out of the 50,000, you are gonna get a few bad apples, be it Nissan, Honda, Mazda or anyone.
I have driven 2 Nissans, never a single problem besides the normal maintenance.
The internet can make the rarest case seem common.......
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Review your vehicle
The rest of the top five was the Camry XLE, Chevy Malibu LT, Altima SE and Accord EX.
You can find the specs at www.nissannews.com under vehicle news. The SE-R has the same V-6 as the SE but with lowered suspension, larger sway bars, 6spd. manual, 18 inch forged aluminum wheels, all options standard. Also has a three gauge cluster from the 350Z in the center of the dash. Interesting. No details on pricing or availability.
Actually, the more I think about it, the Max should rate pretty high. It's got as much room and power as any midsize, the styling is hit or miss, depending upon your taste, but most safety equipment, including stability control, is standard or available. In addition, as the magazine points out, you can now get a loaded Maxima for close to what you pay for a Honda Accord EX V6 with navigation.
I like the Mazda 6s too, but by the time you put the safety equipment on it, you are close to the Maxima in cost, and to me, the Maxima is a more substantial car. Of course, the MZ6 does have a rebate which widens the price difference.
The Mazda is more fun to drive, but Nissan has targeted the Altima SE against the 6s in the affordable performance sedans market. The Maxima is aimed more at the Acura TL, which is a problem because the TL , like the Accord, is an outstanding value. By the way, the TL wasn't included in the Kiplinger's comparison because the upper price limit was $30 K.
BTW, I'm seriously considering getting a new TL as a replacement for my Maxima. The primary holdback is that the Maxima still looks and drives far younger than 9.5 years and 152k miles would imply. I wish I had a family member in need of a great hand me down, it would make my decision much less guilt ridden.
But, if the money isn't a problem, I would move on. I see by your posts on the TL buyers board that you have negotiated a pretty good deal on a TL 6-speed with navi. Think of the improved safety features you will enjoy, and that sound system must be unreal. Plus, you will be doing a favor for someone who can use a great used car, right? Good luck.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
I have 139k on a 00 Maxima SE.
I had the rotors turned with new pads at 50k and replaced the rotors at 90k.
About due to have the rotors turned again with new pads.
That works out to about every 40-45k.
Far better than my last two Hondas (one civic, one accord)which seemed to need new pads every 20k and pads and rotors every 40k.
I don't blame my Nissan dealer - I had my rotors cut by an independent mechanics once, and the result was the same – rotors warped within 10-15K miles.
I am starting to suspect there is something wrong with some other part of system - the calipers, maybe. Anyway, the car has been nearly perfect otherwise (65K miles currently), so I am resigned to doing the rotors every other oil change.
By the way my car is a 2001 GLE and it sees a lot of long trips at highway speeds with very little breaking.
Our other car – an Acura RSX-S – is driven a lot more aggressively, and at 50K miles the break pads and rotors have not been touched. May need to change the pads soon, but the rotors are totally true.
My dad has an '03 with over 20K miles and has had no problems at all.
YMMV.
'24 Chevy Blazer EV 2LT
A friend with a 2000 Maxima had a much worse experience. Rotors turned 1-2 times and then replaced in less than 3 years and 36,000 miles. She managed to get this covered by Nissan under warranty, and then traded the car last year.
Oddly, my 1995 Maxima has been by far the best car I have ever owned with respect to brakes (and everything else for that matter). My old 1978 Datsun B210 was the worst. And the 2-3 friends who have 2000+ Maximas have not been happy with their brake experience, and have other issues as well. Partly as a result, the only "Nissan" product that is remotely on my shopping list for a replacement sedan or SUV is the G35 6-speed, and it's near the bottom of a list that includes the TL, 330i, 530i, E320 CDI and a few others. Nothing by Nissan/Infiniti is on my SUV shopping list. But I still love my 1995 Maxima.
On my wifes '02 Max. there was a safety recall for the Cam and crank angle sensors and a TSB for the rear wind noise. Depending on your VIN # , your '02 could be involved in 4 or 5 safety recalls. I feel like I live at my freakin dealer.
I would not recommend 5th . gens to ANYONE !!!
Let's hear from all you guys about how the " Made in Japan " cars are BETTER than the Smyrna Cars.
Bullcrap !!!!!!
Nissan's Quality control needs serious attention.
I believe there's a lesson in there somewhere!
HOWEVER, I still think this is generally the most penny-wise pound-foolish decision anyone could make. A post audit of my Maxima economics is as follows:
9.5+ years
152,200 miles
6,355 gallons of 93 octane premium gas
23.95 miles per gallon
$9,220.83 total gas expenditures
At an average savings of $0.10 per gallon, I would have saved $635 over the past 9.5 years (average of $67 per year). That's IF my gas mileage didn't suffer. If it dropped by 1 mile per gallon to 22.95, I would have burned an extra 277 gallons over 9.5 years at an average price of $1.35 (1.45 -0.10). As such, $374 of my savings would have been wiped out, leaving me with a whopping $261 in savings (about $27.50 per year). And I drive an above average 16,000 miles per year.
I can't honestly claim that the reason my engine runs as good as the day I bought the car is because I only burn 93 octane gas and change my oil every 4,000 miles. But I sure as hell wouldn't be "pound foolish" enough to burn 87 octane (or even 89-91) in the hopes of saving $27.50 or even $67 per year on a $25,000 car. Whatever remote chance that it could cause engine damage or lowered performance isn't worth it. Hell, you can buy a Chevy over a Maxima and save $10,000 if long term relaibility and performance isn't important to you.
I do make an effort to fill up with premium on Thursdays (6 cents off at Exxon). Proving that I'm not against getting a good deal, just against being imprudent about it.
Granted, it doesn't change your point that the savings are relatively small over a 10-year period, but to those, like me, who have never seen much of a difference either in gas mileage or performance in their cars no matter what octane we use, it is a savings.
I have primarily used 89 octane (sometimes 93 during the hottest summer months here in Florida, and sometimes 87 during the cool winter months) and the engine in my 92 SE is still strong. Unfortunately, a lot of stuff (water pump, oil something or other) is leaking and I'm holding off the repairs as long as I can while I try to come up with a replacement.
Granted, it doesn't change your point that the savings are relatively small over a 10-year period, but to those, like me, who have never seen much of a difference either in gas mileage or performance in their cars no matter what octane we use, it is a savings.
I have primarily used 89 octane in my car and the engine in my 92 SE is as strong today as it was 10 years ago. Unfortunately, a lot of stuff is starting to leak and I've got to decide whether to pony up for repairs or move on.
Let me quote the y2k Max manual, page 10-4: "In most parts of North America, you should use unleaded gas with at least 87 or 91 octane.... now and then you may notice light spark knock for a short time while accelerating or driving up hills. This is no cause for concern, because ou get the greatest fuel benefit when there is light spark knock for a short time under heavy engine load."
As I said, my engine knocks no matter what gas I use. It only does that uphill and on heavy acceleration. My beef is that it did not used to do that ON ANY gas until the engine was reprogrammed by "factory trained technicians" at the Nissan garage.
From my years doing engineering for petroleum business, I have learned that the best octane is the cheapest gas that will not knock in your engine. And again, an occasional light knock will not do any damage to your engine. All other theories such as the one related to the cost of the car in your post 8076 have not been proven by any research, to my knowledge.