I am having a clunking problem with my car. I had asked Jonathan about this at LS MANIA II but he had no idea. Basically whenever I would go over speed bumps in the morning (First Drive) the suspension--I think( --Left Drivers side, Dealer says it sounded like right side) would clunk. It had gotten worse to the point when I am leaving a location and hit any bumps,cracks or somewhat serious road imperfections the Clunking noise would occur.
The Dealer has had my car for over a week now, focused on this issue for 4 Days now and no clue. They have had 2 techs look at it and can't find the cause. The town car is nice but, shoot I am missing my car.
as much as I hate to admit it I also have this clunking noise. It appears to happen when you go over a bump of some sort. It sounds like something is bumping the underside of the vehicle. I don't think its a shock. I can't find anything wrong with them. It's almost like a thump that happens when your steam fired boiler heats up. For those of you that live in an 80 year old white elephant like I do... anyway.... I'm ignoring it... I don't need this at this point.
Kevin 2000 V8 20K miles cordovan/lite graphite loaded...
einarvikng - A week in a Town car is torture that no one should have to endure. I've put in my time, once had to spend 2 days driving a Town Car loaner, hope I never have to do it again.
Leaf blowers, ram air why not go all the way and put a shaker hood scoop from a 1969 Mustang or Torino on their LS?
I may dating myself, but in the 1960's we used to attach a hose from the air cleaner housing to a hole in the firewall. The cavity below the windshield is a high pressure area and a great source of cool air. I just wonder if there is room to run a 4" diameter hose from the firewall to the LS airbox? This would also be a good intake source for the leaf blower/spa blower.
I'm going to run 3" tubing from my airbox down through a hole thats already there down towards the floor and around to the bottom air-dam out through a 4" inch opening creating a venturi effect like carburaters do to mix fuel and air better.Remember the old fire saftey trick; crawl to the exit hense heat rises. That is why I'm routing the hose downwards instead of upwards.
How could that possibley happen? i could under stand if I'm running one of those cone-filters down there but, I'm using the stock airbox. It's only going to suck up air and maybe a little debree but that's why we all have air filters. There will be a small drain hole at the bottom of the scoop so if it does rain; water will be able to drain out.
You WILL suck up water. The bottom grill is low enough that it will be under water and if you are moving it will create enough of a pressure wave to inundate the airbox causing you to ingest a large amount of water and hydro-lock the engine.
If you don't believe me, I have a picture of a LS undergoing water testing in AZ that shows how much of a bow wave the car can push.
Have the above message over the last two days. Goes on when car is started and goes off again for about 10 minutes after hitting reset before reappearing. Have re-tightened gas cap numerous times, filled tank with gas and tightened again to no avail. Talked to dealer today and he wants to drain gas tank and replace tank pressure sensor. This problem arose only after dealer rotated tires. Coincidence? Could they have knocked a vacumn or overflow/return fuel hose loose from the filler neck? Anyone else had this problem or a solution?
Maybe so but, it does not rain that much here in the central-western part of Florida. Ever here about how this state keeps on having droughts? When it does rain it doesn't flood or if it does flood when it does rain, count about an inch too two inches. This is going to be an inginius setup; trust-me Mike
Isn't Florida the state that gets drowned out by hurricanes several times a year? I also seem to remember a ton of rain & thunderstorms due to these hurricanes when I lived in Macon GA (which is pretty close to FL)
Oh, you lived in Macon Ga; I guess thats not Florida now is it? When we do have hurricane season; it usually misses us all together(knock on wood.) And while on the subject, we haven't seen rain for over a month already(hoping it will rain.)Well, I thought this was a message board on LS's not the weather but, I do have a nice bridge for you. Mike
I grew up in Tarpon Springs (that's central western FL badazz) and, hurricanes aside, it rained every day around 4:00PM in the summer. I moved to Cincinnati 12 years ago to complete my second Master's degree but the Florida I knew was very wet. Did you create your own ozone hole there and completely change the weather? Also, would that bridge you have for sale be the remnants of the Sunshine Skyway bridge that collapsed when the ship hit it?
I have a similar noise and have posted questions about it here previously. My '00 V8 makes the noise any time the vehicle shifts weight from front to back. The noise is under the center of the car, just barely behind the front seats. In fact, just climb out of the car and the minor shift in weight will generate the noise every time.
If you get a solution, please post it for the rest of us.
Consider yourself warned - you run a high probability of hydro-locking your engine with the intake that low. Just ask some 97 explorer owners. Ford moved the air intake (and it wasn't anywhere near the bottom of the vehicle) and there were numerous hydrolocks from driving through puddles. They had to move it back mid-model year. It does happen, even with stock filter setups.
Is the very small gain in HP due to the position of the intake worth the very real risk of destroying your engine?
Well guys, sorry first of all to hear you guys did not have a solution. But most of all sorry you guys are experiencing the clunking too. I love my LS but I just hate the fact that somethings are complicated. The Dealer could not explain how they got the noise to go away. I believe I will pick it up today. Now to DBossman. I think you and I have a different clunking. Brian I would hope that two technicians would check the shocks. It would be a simple fix at that point. We will see...Klarsons description sounds more like my sound. Now when I go over a broken up road all the clunks are successive with each bump I hit. When the car is acting up of course... I will keep you guys posted on this issue if a solution is reached
Now Regarding the Manifold issue since I have a 2000 V8 Sport. How do you know you have a bad Manifold?
Don't forget that you do NOT have to be running in deep water to experience hydrolocking. If there is standing water and someone passes you fast enough to kick up a rooster tail, a misplaced air intake can ingest a big enough gulp of water to lock the engine...only takes a couple of ounces to make it past the filter to ruin an engine...
Clunk: I noticed the clunking at 10-20mph over speed bumps when I picked up my 2001 V6 Getrag last Feb. I posted it here, and was advised to slow down over speed bumps. Dealer said they checked everything and all was well, despite the fact that I drove a dealer V8 over same bump and no clunk. Mine still clunks today.
Manifold: Motor Trend just wrapped up their long term test of an LS-V8 and an LS-V6 Getrag. They had one problem with the V8 - a cracked manifold. They said one of their drivers could just barely hear the 'spitting' sound (my word) of the exhaust leak under the hood. They also said their LS was in the shop for a long time waiting on the part. Interestingly they didn't say *how* long, but they did say that the shop down time was responsible for the V8 having so few miles on it during the test (15000 vs 20000+ for the V6). The V6 also had but one problem: a broken cooling system hose clamp. It happened in Death Valley on a 115 degree day.
Thank You all for your wonderful concerns. I do quite honestly know well what hydrolocking is and does to an engine. You haven't seen the setup I'm going with and when you do; you will be asking me, "Where can I get this for my car?" And with this setup, I'll be LS-8 sport and LS-6 Manual hunting. And speaking about The Weather Channel(keyrow), I do know were Tarpon Springs is located at and it does rain up there alot. Needless to say if you lived in Florida; you should be fimiler with rain storms meaning if it rains in one city, there's probualy a drought the next city over. Alot probualy has changed in 12 years since you lived here; Big time Water Restrictions, Water prices went up, are reclaimed water is even diminishing. Plus you NOT living here must mean you don't frankly know; now do you. Does any one watch The Weather Channel? It hardly rains! And when you think you see rain on the weather overcasting Florida; we have a sight sprinkle to water are DRIED UP LAWNS!!! Now haven said that; I can't speak entirely for Orlando Fl; that place rains every other day; or anytime I happen too travel over there.
Best regards all of you; and watch The Weather Channel more closely, Mike
things that you should be concerned with *are* a car with 30,000K.
That turns out to be 30 million miles or KM. You should look for something with less miles than that. If the car has 30K on it, that's a different story. Based on comments here, there is nothing to be wary of, outside of worn tires. The car should be well broken in, getting the maximum mpgs and maxmimum performance. The only thing that some have criticized is the mating of a V6 to an automatic, which people tend to be happy with for the most part. I have that car with a manual, and it seems a bit under-powered at times (going from off the line to 50 mph) but for passing from 55 and up, we don't even have to downshift to grab decent passing acceleration. I am not sure how that works, considering that the low speed to high speed is done with lower gears and should seem faster while using the higher rpms than a 55 mph pass in 5th gear. I do notice a huge difference when using the wife's grand marquis with its 210 hp V8, for standing start acceleration, much like that of an LS8. Plus, when I do that with the Mercury, I close my eyes and imagine that I am the driver of a sheriff's Crown Vic on Fox Tv's COPS show, based on the air cleaner noise. You don't really get that sound with the V6 LS. The other negative thing about the V6 LS is the lack of the integrated message center. In all, if I had to buy an LS with 30K and an automatic, I would undoubtedly go for the V8. The price difference between the two engines for a same-year automatic would surely be negligible.
On another note: do 16 wheels fit on a sport model LS? The front brake calipers look to be pretty close to filling up the 17" wheels' space, but I am looking to put snow tires (Winterfires) on my car and do not like the idea of either purchasing 17" snow tires, OR dismounting my 17" all season tires every 6 months. Please say that they fit, as I already bought the wheels and tires! I cannot imagine a 3600-lb. car floating through snow or slush on 235mm wide tires and getting a decent bite of traction, whether for accelerating or steering.
Do not open any emails that have Hi as the subject line with an attachment of GONE.SCR. This is a virus and will propagate to everyone in your address book and destroy your Norton Anti-virus files. Affects PCs not Macs.
Tried the heat and it came off okay. I was wondering if your kit covered the entire area for the wood trim pieces on the dash. The one I have does not and it seems they should. I got mine from Joshua Tree and contacted them regarding other problems with the kit. Two other pieces for the radio and air-conditioning area do not fit. the hole for the buttons do not match up properly. If I put it on to match the left side of the radio the right side cutouts fall over the buttons on that side. Same thing is true with the a/c. Can you tell me how accurate yours is?
The tires that my 2000 LS-8, non sport came with are P215-60VR16.
mtnh.....does Firestone make the Winterfires in a 60 series, 16 inch tire ?? I've had them on my S-10 4x4 for three winters, and am satisfied with their performance. They're fairly quiet for a snow tire, but IMHO, they might prove a bit noisy for a car. In fact, I sprayed the inside of the floorpan of my truck with Dnyashield, a sound deadener, to help the situation.
A fellow LLSOC member and I swaped wheels successfully. Like you, mtnh, he was looking for 16" wheels for snows. As it NEVER snows (is that the proper word for that opaque rain?) in San Diego and I was looking to upgrade to 17 inchers, we both made out. Me a LOT better, but that is a different story! After we did the swap, it looked to me that the rotor was closer to the wheel on the 16. It was wierd. Had to be an illusion. Anyway, the stock wheels are interchangable.
Can you believe it? It actually rained AGAIN last night! Twice in 10 days. We're getting flooded here! :~)
I don't exactly know what you mean on the entire dash but, what stereo do you have eg:what model yr. & model;how many speakers? The A/C piece should go right on. Test fit it all. I too got mine from Mike over at Joshua Tree and all my pieces fit fine.
(mtnh)The sport wheels and non-sport wheels have the same exact bolt pattern. You can buy a set of stock(brushed five-star alum) 16" for cheap and use them soley for winter tires; and keep the super sports 17" for the other seasons.
The two main complaints that seem to be common with the 2000-model LS are delayed shifts in the automatic transmission and failure of the rear window mechanism. The shifting complaint is not hardware-related; there is a software upgrade that can be done by a Lincoln or Ford dealer that eliminates this concern. The window-lift failure is much more common in hot climates, but is possible on any LS, and is covered by an upgraded part (and technical service bulletin) should a failure occur.
Are you buying the car from a Lincoln/Ford dealer? If so, you should be able to get a service history on the car from the dealer's service department by having them look up the Oasis history on the car. This will tell you whether any recalls apply to this particular car, and whether they've been taken care of. The Oasis service history will also tell you whether the transmission software upgrade has been done. This history is, in effect, a record of everything that has been done to the car (repairs and maintenance) by a Ford or Lincoln dealer.
If you're not buying from a Lincoln dealer, you can still get the service history by taking the car's VIN (vehicle ID) to a Lincoln/Ford dealer and asking them to call it up for you. They'd probably be willing to do this if you plan to have your service done there.
I believe that the warranty in Canada is 48 months and 80,000 kilometers. You might want to find out what the in-service date is so you'll know exactly how many months of warranty you have remaining and whether any paperwork needs to be done to insure that the warranty transfers. Also, I think that standard maintenance was included with all new LSs in Canada; check with a Ford/Lincoln dealer to see if this "free" maintenance deal applies, and if it transfers to you. This could save you money on oil changes, tire rotations, etc. In the U.S., Ford warranties automatically transfer to subsequent buyers, but I don't know if it's the same in Canada.
Hope this helps.
Note to mtnh: Guess you didn't notice that twomor sports a Canadian flag. In Canada, they use kilometers, not miles, so 30,000K(ilometers) is exactly what he meant. K?
I have the 2001 V8 with standard auto transmission. I have the in dash CD changer. I don't intend using all the wood piece either as it is too much. What I meant by the "dash" fit, I meant the area that is recessed in the dash for the various parts. The outline for instance, for the a/c vents, on the center console. The trim piece does not cover the entire area, but leaves about an 1/8" of more showing of the black background. The two parts for the radio/CD changer and the a/c controls do not match at all. The other two pieces the openings for the buttons are not close, as half of them are covered by the trim kit. I know they have to be replaced but was just trying to find outwhen the kit is installed is the entire area filled with the trim or is there black background left exposed
As for the pieces that go around the a/c vents; they do show abit of the black or in my case dark grey. I took them off because I thought it didn't look right IMHO but, that is funny that the trim wont go around the a/c controls?! The stereo might have to be reordered; Mike Smith over at Joshua Tree will probualy replace it at no charge. As for the shifter; there should be a slit to go around the shifter; I just warmed it up where it was mendable enough to twist and slip around and on. Laid down pretty good as I have the same shifter pattern that you do,(non-sport,wood-grain shifter- nob.)
Hope this answered you ques. but, if you have any more I'll try my best. Best regards, Mike
If you think about it, will be a disadvantage to have a low air intake. The air temperature at ground level can be higher during the day (& the first half of the night) due to solar heating of the ground. This can be especially true if the pavement is dark colored asphalt which can easily reach temperatures >130 degrees F during the summer. In addition, having a low air intake will cause it to ingest more dirt dust and debris which will clog the filter quicker, plus there is the previously discussed water ingestion problem. Even if you get rain once a year it is too great of a risk to take!
If performance is your goal one would think that race cars would put the air intake in the best place allowed by the rule book. I know of no race car that uses a low intake. As stanny noted stock cars (& some other production based race cars) use the area between the hood and windshield. Most sports & open wheel race cars have their air intakes up high to get them into clean air and use whatever ram effect that can be obtained. Also since many race cars use minimal (if any) air intake filtering to put them low would be to invite disaster.
My friend has a quite a similer set-up with his Ford Taurus SHO and has never sucked up water but debree yes. That is why cars have air filters and I have a K&N so it works better clogged up plus I can clean it out when nesessary. You must have a friend with a Honda with one of those setups where they use a cone type filter hanging down at the road. This sep-up is ingenious and you plus alot of others will want the same exact thing. My friends and I did alot of research of air-flow design. By the way, do you drive a LS or Taurus? If you would see the design what comes with the factory air-box with the snorkle you would know that it is VERY restrictive and sound absorbing just what a old Lincoln buyer is looking for; real quite. People on this board are buying full exhaust systems, K&N replacement air cleaners, bigger Mass air flow sensors, cutting holes in thier air boxes to draw in more air, but not relizing the thing thats restricts the air is the design of the snorkle and the little amount of cold air coming from outside the car. Opening such a hole in the air box creates turbulance and brings in hot engine air which we all know robs horsepower and torque. Just what I'm saying is if we what a car that performs; we have to try stuff out, and who knows; I might be marketing all these ram-induction systems to all the LS owners that want some more horsepower in thier car, not talking always about a manual V8 or adding a 6-speed to the LS. It's like beating a dead horse. Wait a couple of years when LM have sold alot of LS's and sell more than 2% of manual's. I say; if you cry about wanting a manual LS; you should of bought one or ordered one in the first place. If you want a Manual V8; why did you buy a Lincoln instead of a new/used Camero, Firebird, Corvette, Mustang, BMW, Trucks, Ford Lighting,for that money that you would of saved; you could be driving a fire breathing dragon with the possability for alot of diverse upgrade mods for some of the cars I had mentioned. I could go on and on. Do me a favor a quit whining. I'm very happy with my purchase and so should everyone else. I'm always hearing comlaints about your LS's; why don't you sell it then. Get a high performance car with Luxury. Spend the extra cash in a lease and go with a MB E55 or better yet a BMW //M5 or how about real performance and spring for a Porsche Turbo, or a Dodge Viper. Oh, cost too much for you likings! I guess for $32K to $41K you only get a smooth ride,great handiling, nice interior cosmetics, and a quiet ride. I love having and owning my LS and I don't complain about it either. Sorry for my outburst and I know that I will be hearing it also. I will be wearing my football helmat and shoulder pads.
Mike, your rant was unnecessary. Had you bothered to read back a few hundred posts you would know that all of your "concerns" have been discussed to no end. YES, we are quite aware of the restrictive snorkel, hot engine air, where not to place the intake, etc. Those of us who are most vocal about wanting a six speed manual V8 HAVE purchased the V6M. And we also have compared the LS to all those other available vehicles and found them wanting. The most cited reason to purchase the LS is VALUE. We do realize the performance and luxury we get for the $$$. So please do get some sleep, and be sure to go back and read some more posts before you get a reputation like GIOWA, if you even know who that is. We all love our LSs and wouldn't think of getting anything else. We only want a great car to improve and become as close to perfect as is humanly possible. Peace brother. Jim
Is that while it is a less restrictive filter (good for performance), it doesn't do as good of a job filtering out the small stuff as an old fashioned paper filter. For this reason alone, I don't use them. If you're going to put an air intake down low where it can vacuum-cleaner up every piece of dirt on the road, loose the K&N for a filter that's better at actually filtering. Your engine will thank you for it.
I did read through earlier posts with the infamous GIOWA was rambling on always argumentivly; But, I'm just making a point about the whole manual thing I did read about in earlier posts by the majority and I got so sick of every other post about a manuel trans. I just had to type my .02 cents worth even though it's been quite awile since the discussion has been brought up. But, one thing I certainly have to comment on when you stated quote on quote,"Those of us who are most vocal about wanting a six speed manual V8 HAVE purchased the V6M." I contest to that from earlier posts; I mostley heard, I want a manuel V-8, I want a 6 speed manuel, whinning and whinning and than saying, "Oh, I ended up purchasing a auto-matic V-8 sport, V-6 sport but, I want a manuel, Whinning and more whinning." Thats all I got to say. But, one things for sure I hope the Manuel trans. discussion don't come up again.
You are right and I agree but, do you know how small of particles doesn't get filtered out between a stock paper and a K&N? Too small to do any harm. Plus, when the paper filter gets clogged it filters out 100% of the small micron particles yet, it doesn't flow air through it at all; like sucking a Slurpee with a coffee stirier. On the other hand, when a K&N gets dirty it filters out more but, at the same time flows -air still better than a brand new stock paper filter. I don't even have to buy any more filters for the rest of my cars life. Warrentiee on the K&N is 10yr or one million miles which I plan niether.
I believe most of us have (reluctantly) accepted the fact that a six speed manual V8 will never appear for the LS and that is why so many of us are eagerly awaiting the introduction of the Infiniti G35. While it will not initially offer a manual there are expectations that after the the Nissan Z is available its transmission will easily migrate over to the G35.
BTW, the easy way to not get sick of reading endless discussions which do not interest you is to skip right over them.
SO you want to be an engineer huh...then you will need a trip back to High School chem, followed by some thermodynamics followed by non-linear fluids (yuck!) which involves more calculus that I prefer doing.
Basically the relationship between Tourque/Horse Power and air is one of the number of molecules, say moles, introduced over some period of time, say per second, and at what temperature they enter. All this needs to measured around the process, ie combustion in the cylinder.
Now for some high school chem>>>> PV=mRT where P= pressure Ram air, turbo V= volume Cyl size m= mass of gas, moles of air R is a constant T = temperature
Why cold air > it's denser Why higher pressure, ie ram or turbo etc. because you can squish more air into the chamber.
Actually, if you could keep the number of molecules entering the cylendar the same, hotter air would actually produce more power as each molecule would carry more energy. The probelm is that as you heat the air it expands thereby providing fewer molecules of air to the chamber.
As far as race car intakes go, the key parameters for loaction are distance. as close as possible to the engine cylinder intake and as unrestricted as possible. If the engine intake manifold were at the bottom of the engine, I would consider a bottom intake.
The point is that as with all aspects of life, this issue is a trade-off. Just a non-intercooled turbo gets more mass into an engine because the pressure override the heating effect of air. The effect of Ram air COULD easily overcome the temperature effect of being near the street. In general you will find that at low speeds, temperature will dominate and at higher/highway and greater, speeds, RAM effect will dominate.
In a nut shell, One must properly maximise PV=mRT for m in the engine for the conditions at which you are operating.
Sorry don't know too much about non-linear aerodynamics, but I do know that they will significantly affect the RAM pressure developed.
Just thought this might help you decide how to modify your intakes.
Please ignore my poor typing and spelling, I refuse to use this horrible spell checker.
badazzls6 and many of us who post here have K&N filters in our LS's. I also have used K&N filters in my other cars and motorcycles for more years then I wish to think about. I have always kept my vehicles for at least 10yrs and never had an engine problem. As you stated we have been down this path of challenging the K&N's filtering abilities, and the people who choose not to use the K&N have every right to thier opinion. The only thing that bugs me is that these same people who ask for independent proof that the K&N filter is a better filter, can't offer any proof independent or otherwise that its harmful in any way to use the K&N. There are independent test results on K&N's website but I'm sure that the info provided is not enough to change your opinion. My experience and the collective experience of others is good enough for me.
The LLSOC project car has had a redesigned air system in place for the last couple of months. Redesigned meaning from the snorkel, air box, air filter, mass air sensor, air tube to the throttle body, so I think I've got a bit of practical experience with this one on the V-8 model.
1. If you go this route you will need to recalibrate the sensor as the engine will go to lean-run condition.
2. The stock system is restrictive. Replacing the entire thing with a cold-air ram intake, open cone filter, heat baffle, 3 inch pipe and 75mm mass air flow sensor will net you more power. How much hasn't been determined yet, but it is definitely felt. The ram intake works in this case because it's open and while you're moving the cold air comes in but there isn't any vacuum to suck up water like you would have with a closed box system.
3. If you haven't done the exhaust system modifications yet, you're wasting your time with the air modifications. Do the exhaust first otherwise you won't see the increase you'd expect.
4. There is no room on the passenger side to utilize the windshield bleed air for the system since it would need to go through a filter first.
TireRack.com has 215 60VR 16 CV95 on special for $59 plus shipping. They list an identical CV95 for $114. I called to see what the difference was. Mr. TireRack said the $114 are Original Equipment tires, while the $59 CV 95 have slightly different internal construction, but identical tread pattern. My lease is up in 15,000 miles so I ordered the $59 set, but I could find no reviews or other info/reviews of this tire.
It's real simple. Carnot's Formula. T1-T2/T1. The higher the difference between the incoming air temperature and the combustion temp, the bigger the bang (the larger the PSI increase in combustion). Sir Harry Ricardo's classic book "The High Speed Internal Combustion Engine", written in 1922, covers the subject in detail. His aluminum OHC hemi engine was very advanced, especially when compared with the look of the body of the car it was fitted in. He not only advocated cool air intake but keeping the engine block, head and cooling system temps as low as possible to KEEP the intake charge cool. Of course, emissions was not a concern in 1922.
With all due respect, and I AM NOT trying to be argumentative here, but the data provided by K&N is far from conclusive. While I understand that you have had positive experience with this filter, and respect your advocacy for it, I am nontheless reluctant to use it in my car without independent test results that clearly indicate that K&N filters do their primary job of filtering air as well as the paper OE filters. The only "proof" or support that I offer in support of the paper filter is that it is OE specified by Ford for the LS (although, IIRC, the Mustang Cobra may specify a K&N filter). As I was an Aerospace Engineer for more than 13 years, including the design, development and test of gas turbine engines (I claim no particular expertise with regard to internal combustion engines), I will not accept claims by a vendor without conclusive, independent analysis in support. The tests put forth by K&N, simply aren't conclusive or definitive.
Also, given the fact that I live in the very dry, dusty Sonoran Desert environment of Arizona, I am particularly sensitive to the air filtration capabilities of competing engine air filters. I typically change air filters at the same interval as oil filters due to my local conditions (typically 2-3 months or 3K miles). I have heard K&N advocates use the argument that off-road race teams use K&N filters, but my response to this argument is, what is their objective? Achieve maximum performance over the duration of a race. But, I haven't heard of an off-road race yet that covers 100K+ miles. Off-road race teams have different priorities and objectives than me when it comes to striking a balance between performance and engine longevity. Until someone can show me conclusive and definitive data in support of K&Ns filtration capability, I will remain a (hopeful) skeptic.
Respectfully, Chris - LLSOC Charter Member attendee of LS Mania I & II
Comments
The Dealer has had my car for over a week now, focused on this issue for 4 Days now and no clue. They have had 2 techs look at it and can't find the cause. The town car is nice but, shoot I am missing my car.
Any clues?
Regards,
Airwolf1000
It appears to happen when you go over a bump of some sort.
It sounds like something is bumping the underside of the vehicle.
I don't think its a shock. I can't find anything wrong with them.
It's almost like a thump that happens when your steam fired boiler heats up.
For those of you that live in an 80 year old white elephant like I do...
anyway.... I'm ignoring it... I don't need this at this point.
Kevin
2000 V8 20K miles cordovan/lite graphite loaded...
Leaf blowers, ram air why not go all the way and put a shaker hood scoop from a 1969 Mustang or Torino on their LS?
If you don't believe me, I have a picture of a LS undergoing water testing in AZ that shows how much of a bow wave the car can push.
Brian
LLSOC Member
Mike
Mike
If you get a solution, please post it for the rest of us.
Is the very small gain in HP due to the position of the intake worth the very real risk of destroying your engine?
sorry first of all to hear you guys did not have a solution. But most of all sorry you guys are experiencing the clunking too. I love my LS but I just hate the fact that somethings are complicated. The Dealer could not explain how they got the noise to go away. I believe I will pick it up today. Now to DBossman. I think you and I have a different clunking. Brian I would hope that two technicians would check the shocks. It would be a simple fix at that point. We will see...Klarsons description sounds more like my sound. Now when I go over a broken up road all the clunks are successive with each bump I hit. When the car is acting up of course...
I will keep you guys posted on this issue if a solution is reached
Now Regarding the Manifold issue since I have a 2000 V8 Sport. How do you know you have a bad Manifold?
Regards,
Airwolf
Manifold: Motor Trend just wrapped up their long term test of an LS-V8 and an LS-V6 Getrag. They had one problem with the V8 - a cracked manifold. They said one of their drivers could just barely hear the 'spitting' sound (my word) of the exhaust leak under the hood. They also said their LS was in the shop for a long time waiting on the part. Interestingly they didn't say *how* long, but they did say that the shop down time was responsible for the V8 having so few miles on it during the test (15000 vs 20000+ for the V6). The V6 also had but one problem: a broken cooling system hose clamp. It happened in Death Valley on a 115 degree day.
Best regards all of you; and watch The Weather Channel more closely,
Mike
things that you should be concerned with *are* a car with 30,000K.
That turns out to be 30 million miles or KM. You should look for something with less
miles than that. If the car has 30K on it, that's a different story. Based on comments here, there is nothing to be wary of, outside of worn tires. The car should be well broken in, getting the maximum mpgs and maxmimum performance. The only thing that some have criticized is the mating of a V6 to an automatic, which people tend to be happy with for the most part. I have that car with a manual, and it seems a bit under-powered at times (going from off the line to 50 mph) but for passing from 55 and up, we don't even have to downshift to grab decent passing acceleration. I am not sure how that works, considering that the low speed to high speed is done with lower gears and should seem faster while using the higher rpms than a 55 mph pass in 5th gear. I do notice a huge difference when using the wife's grand marquis with its 210 hp V8, for standing start acceleration, much like that of an LS8. Plus, when I do that with the Mercury, I close my eyes and imagine that I am the driver of a sheriff's Crown Vic on Fox Tv's COPS show, based on the air cleaner noise. You don't really get that sound with the V6 LS.
The other negative thing about the V6 LS is the lack of the integrated message center. In all, if I had to buy an LS with 30K and an automatic, I would undoubtedly go for the V8. The price difference between the two engines for a same-year automatic would surely be negligible.
On another note: do 16 wheels fit on a sport model LS? The front brake calipers look to be
pretty close to filling up the 17" wheels' space, but I am looking to put snow tires (Winterfires)
on my car and do not like the idea of either purchasing 17" snow tires, OR dismounting my
17" all season tires every 6 months. Please say that they fit, as I already bought the wheels
and tires! I cannot imagine a 3600-lb. car floating through snow or slush on 235mm wide tires and getting a decent bite of traction, whether for accelerating or steering.
Brian
mtnh.....does Firestone make the Winterfires in a 60 series, 16 inch tire ?? I've had them on my S-10 4x4 for three winters, and am satisfied with their performance. They're fairly quiet for a snow tire, but IMHO, they might prove a bit noisy for a car. In fact, I sprayed the inside of the floorpan of my truck with Dnyashield, a sound deadener, to help the situation.
Can you believe it? It actually rained AGAIN last night! Twice in 10 days. We're getting flooded here! :~)
Mike
LLSOC member
(mtnh)The sport wheels and non-sport wheels have the same exact bolt pattern. You can buy a set of stock(brushed five-star alum) 16" for cheap and use them soley for winter tires; and keep the super sports 17" for the other seasons.
Mike
Are you buying the car from a Lincoln/Ford dealer? If so, you should be able to get a service history on the car from the dealer's service department by having them look up the Oasis history on the car. This will tell you whether any recalls apply to this particular car, and whether they've been taken care of. The Oasis service history will also tell you whether the transmission software upgrade has been done. This history is, in effect, a record of everything that has been done to the car (repairs and maintenance) by a Ford or Lincoln dealer.
If you're not buying from a Lincoln dealer, you can still get the service history by taking the car's VIN (vehicle ID) to a Lincoln/Ford dealer and asking them to call it up for you. They'd probably be willing to do this if you plan to have your service done there.
I believe that the warranty in Canada is 48 months and 80,000 kilometers. You might want to find out what the in-service date is so you'll know exactly how many months of warranty you have remaining and whether any paperwork needs to be done to insure that the warranty transfers. Also, I think that standard maintenance was included with all new LSs in Canada; check with a Ford/Lincoln dealer to see if this "free" maintenance deal applies, and if it transfers to you. This could save you money on oil changes, tire rotations, etc. In the U.S., Ford warranties automatically transfer to subsequent buyers, but I don't know if it's the same in Canada.
Hope this helps.
Note to mtnh: Guess you didn't notice that twomor sports a Canadian flag. In Canada, they use kilometers, not miles, so 30,000K(ilometers) is exactly what he meant. K?
Hope this answered you ques. but, if you have any more I'll try my best.
Best regards,
Mike
If performance is your goal one would think that race cars would put the air intake in the best place allowed by the rule book. I know of no race car that uses a low intake. As stanny noted stock cars (& some other production based race cars) use the area between the hood and windshield. Most sports & open wheel race cars have their air intakes up high to get them into clean air and use whatever ram effect that can be obtained. Also since many race cars use minimal (if any) air intake filtering to put them low would be to invite disaster.
Mike(Had a long night!)
Jim
Hope the sky is clear,
Mike
Best regards,
Mike
BTW, the easy way to not get sick of reading endless discussions which do not interest you is to skip right over them.
Basically the relationship between Tourque/Horse Power and air is one of the number of molecules, say moles, introduced over some period of time, say per second, and at what temperature they enter. All this needs to measured around the process, ie combustion in the cylinder.
Now for some high school chem>>>> PV=mRT
where P= pressure Ram air, turbo
V= volume Cyl size
m= mass of gas, moles of air
R is a constant
T = temperature
Why cold air > it's denser
Why higher pressure, ie ram or turbo etc. because you can squish more air into the chamber.
Actually, if you could keep the number of molecules entering the cylendar the same, hotter air would actually produce more power as each molecule would carry more energy. The probelm is that as you heat the air it expands thereby providing fewer molecules of air to the chamber.
As far as race car intakes go, the key parameters for loaction are distance. as close as possible to the engine cylinder intake and as unrestricted as possible. If the engine intake manifold were at the bottom of the engine, I would consider a bottom intake.
The point is that as with all aspects of life, this issue is a trade-off. Just a non-intercooled turbo gets more mass into an engine because the pressure override the heating effect of air. The effect of Ram air COULD easily overcome the temperature effect of being near the street. In general you will find that at low speeds, temperature will dominate and at higher/highway and greater, speeds, RAM effect will dominate.
In a nut shell, One must properly maximise PV=mRT for m in the engine for the conditions at which you are operating.
Sorry don't know too much about non-linear aerodynamics, but I do know that they will significantly affect the RAM pressure developed.
Just thought this might help you decide how to modify your intakes.
Please ignore my poor typing and spelling, I refuse to use this horrible spell checker.
Have fun folks
Tom
Charter Member LLSOC
1. If you go this route you will need to recalibrate the sensor as the engine will go to lean-run condition.
2. The stock system is restrictive. Replacing the entire thing with a cold-air ram intake, open cone filter, heat baffle, 3 inch pipe and 75mm mass air flow sensor will net you more power. How much hasn't been determined yet, but it is definitely felt. The ram intake works in this case because it's open and while you're moving the cold air comes in but there isn't any vacuum to suck up water like you would have with a closed box system.
3. If you haven't done the exhaust system modifications yet, you're wasting your time with the air modifications. Do the exhaust first otherwise you won't see the increase you'd expect.
4. There is no room on the passenger side to utilize the windshield bleed air for the system since it would need to go through a filter first.
Any info appreciated.
Also, given the fact that I live in the very dry, dusty Sonoran Desert environment of Arizona, I am particularly sensitive to the air filtration capabilities of competing engine air filters. I typically change air filters at the same interval as oil filters due to my local conditions (typically 2-3 months or 3K miles). I have heard K&N advocates use the argument that off-road race teams use K&N filters, but my response to this argument is, what is their objective? Achieve maximum performance over the duration of a race. But, I haven't heard of an off-road race yet that covers 100K+ miles. Off-road race teams have different priorities and objectives than me when it comes to striking a balance between performance and engine longevity. Until someone can show me conclusive and definitive data in support of K&Ns filtration capability, I will remain a (hopeful) skeptic.
Respectfully,
Chris - LLSOC Charter Member
attendee of LS Mania I & II