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San Diego has been in a state of lock-down all day. We have the majority of the Navy's Pacific Fleet stationed here among eight bases in a twenty mile radius. By eight this morning, all Naval and Marine Corps aircraft were fully armed and airborn. Ships deployed. The nuclear submarines put out to sea. The aircraft carriers were already at sea. All active duty military were called in and the bases locked-down. The majority of San Diego's industry and commercial sectors cater to the Defense Department. In other words, most everyone did not work yet the streets were empty. It was freaky...
My heart goes out to all of the victims, their families, and friends. Everyone, be careful. I hope it is over, but you never know. And I would gladly go back in the Navy and personally program one of the Tomahawk cruise missiles...
I couldn't have said it better myself, although I might not have said "quiet." I've already heard some not-so-quiet remarks from citizens, including us here. It stirs my heart and brings a tear to this big guy's eye to read the posts you all made last night. We may be black, white, Republican or Democrat -- but we're Americans and we face this tragedy unanimously.
I stopped by Wal-Mart on the way home from work yesterday and picked up a brand-new stars & stripes which is now flying proudly from my porch. I left the lights on all night so I wouldn't have to take it down. (We all know our flag etiquette, don't we?) This morning I was proud to see the cab of a tractor-trailer flying a large American flag on the expressway I take to work.
As an American citizen and taxpayer, I'm going to hold Mr. Bush to his remarks and pray for every promise to come to pass:
"Make no mistake. The United States will hunt down and punish those responsible for these cowardly acts. ...
"We will make no distinction between the terrorists who committed these acts and those who harbor them."
God Bless the USA!
Meade
One of many million proud, angry U.S. citizens
Another thing we need to keep in mind -- Town Hall really isn't the appropriate place for extended discussion on who did what yesterday, and what needs to be done in retaliation.
We all have been - and will continue to be - affected by what has transpired in the last 24 hours. I think it is appropriate to express our sadness for the victims and their families and our concern for each other. But please, let's leave the political debate for a more appropriate forum than Town Hall.
Thanks.
Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board
However, YOU are wrong in trying to curb peoples feelings TODAY. People NEED to vent. Pat, you are out of line. Delete the posts if you must, nevertheless, today is far from normal at Edmunds.com Town Hall. If you represent all the hosts and Edmunds.com Management, then I suggest you close Town Hall down, for a couple of days. We can grieve for the victims, however it is understandable that folks here, will also express their outrage and frustrations?
Respectfully,
Larry
There have been a couple of statements here that ARE grouping specific backgrounds to what has happened, rather than recognizing we are all individuals and responsible for our own actions.
My point is that is entirely inappropriate here, as are some other extreme political statements. And because I want people to be able to vent, I am not deleting anything - I just hope folks will help me stick to that by not continuing to post this kind of thing.
Again - let's support and show our caring for each other. Certainly we can talk about being angry. Making broad racist sorts of statements must not continue, however. Town Hall has fine members of all sorts of backgrounds who would never endorse nor engage in any thing resembling what happened yesterday. Those folks have feelings, too.
Larry, I'm really not sure why you are jumping all over me - send me an email if you want to continue to tell me I am out of line; arguing with me here doesn't solve anything either.
Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board
the stock Pro engine has LOW compression (9.1:1 for 1.8L and 2L, and 9:1 for 1.6L). Only from 10:1, it would be considered high compression engine. I don't know about your user manual, but mine said something like:
"Your car will perform best with following fuel:
Unleaded, with antiknock index 87 (R+M)/2 method, 91 RON or above. Oxigenated fuel (gas with alcohol) with less than 10% of ethanol is allowed. Mixture with methanol can damage some parts of the engine."
Bruno
However, killing more innocent people and causing more hatred towards the US doesn't make much sense. Finding the small group of cowards will take time. But once found, it will be time for justice!! However, I do agree with the President: those that harbor the criminals will also be treated as such!
As always with all tragedies, we need to pick-up the pieces and try to get back to normality (it's easy for me to say as I live in the middle of nowhere and don't have any connections to the northeast).
OK, lets start out with something simple: I like raised white letter performance tires (it shows my age). Once it's time for new tires for my '01 Pro, that is what I will look for. What are your thoughts on that?
Gees, what trivial things we discuss in light of so many problems in this world.
Yesterday, the people of this country were attacked violently. Thousands of our brothers, sisters, sons, daughters, husbands, wives and friends were killed. Many thousands more were injured. These people were black, white, hispanic, and of countless other ethnicities. They were Republicans, Democrats and independents. They were middle-aged, retired, and some were too young to know why their lives were being ripped away.
Whoever dealt this horror upon us had no regard for the backgrounds, beliefs or conditions of their victims.
I think it is natural, barely 24 hours following this tragedy, to feel an anger that has no specific target ... as President Bush said last night, "a quiet, unyielding anger." We Americans have been violated as a country. We are angry, and we're not quite sure yet where to direct that anger.
Yes, I agree that Edmunds is not the place to stir racial hatred. In our own country, you are presumed innocent until proven guilty beyond a shadow of a doubt. Let's remember that as we vent our feelings about yesterday in this forum that Edmunds has graciously provided.
Let's use our energies to support our President in any way we can in assisting the victims of this tragedy and the search for the responsible party. We can start by giving our blood. Then, let's support the actions that our country will surely take to rid the world of the perpetrators of this terrorism.
My next posting will be about MAPP II.
Meade
BTW, for the newbies here, MAPP II = "Mid-Atlantic Protege Picnic II." We had our first one last fall, with about 10 people and five Proteges in attendance. I think we just might double that this year. We've reserved a very nice picnic shelter for an ENTIRE DAY this time.
If you would like to attend this sure-to-be-stellar attraction, drop me an e-mail at ...
mdaffron@the-rma.org
... and I'll provide all the details. Warning: You will be expected to bring some food and contribute a few bucks (no more than $10 a head) toward the shelter rental.
24 days to go! ZOOM ZOOM ZOOM!!!
Meade
the interior cover for my sunroof is dirty...i imagine it's from the repaint job they did on my roof. it just looks like white powder...how can i get in that tiny space between the cover and the actual sunroof glass?? if i open my sunroof, it automatically pulls the interior cover open with it. is there any way to bypass this without breaking the interior cover? since my pro is black, the white is quite noticeable and i wanted to get rid of it asap...
thanx
'duh'
Meadeball
Mike
Meade
Edmunds is an international fellowship, and today the kind of fellowship it provides is shining like a beacon. Let our governments say the fighting words ... it's us, the down-home residents of these countries, who are embracing each other now and offering words of support.
I'm sure you've seen this as you've monitored all your topics today, Pat. Everybody else, take five and read some of this. It'll touch your heart!
And to all of you who don't have an American flag flying by your posts ... I am certain I speak for all of my American friends when I say, thank you. Thank you.
Meade
Gas prices here in Calgary have not fluctuated at all (yet!). Hopefully the gas price gouging does not come up here.
PF
Apparently today he found out supply is not a problem, so he has issued a public apology, and is offering refunds to all of his customers.
Wow.
'duh'
But CarsDirect is selling it for $13,790.
So the car has "depreciated" about 12 percent before I've even picked a color."
I think there are special rebates running on the 2001's to get the lower price.
Meade
I thought it was more useful to compare current value to actual selling price. Otherwise, a car has "depreciated" before you drive it off the lot.
Not as absurd a point as I think you perceived it to be.
And, yes, the rebate is part of the reason the car isn't selling at MSRP.
twist
Thanks for any advice or personal experiences!
Depreciation: I got my car under the S-plan. It was $18,500 or so out the door with taxes and tags. That just happens to be the MSRP on the sticker, but that was my total out the door price. I paid $17,500 for the car. It's now worth about $11,500 after 7 months, a couple scratches, and 15,300 miles. I am not happy to say the least.
Not exactly a ringing endorsement of the Civic, Sentra, or Corolla. Wish they would have thrown a Pro into the mix.
twist
I found very little difference between the LX and EX model w/ the Civic's. The civic's do nothing wrong but they don't excite me and adding additional equipement like alloy rims and fog lights cost too much. I do think the civic's had the nicest gear shifting; very solid. The Sentra is a mixed bag with good acceleration and a great stereo. The inside materials seemed cheaper and controls were less intuitive to find, and road noise was a little more pronounced. I wish I could have tested a Sentra w / manual transmission, but I don't think that would change my opinion. I test drove the protege first. I liked the way it looks and feels the best. It was much more fun to drive than the civic's and it looks alot better than the sentra (IMO). Hopefully I'll own a Protege ES soon.
They are definitely more comfortable and quiet. The ride isn't as stiff and is definitely noticeable while going over railroad tracks. Interior road roar has been seriously damped. And they look decent and have a super high treadwear rating. Those are the points I like about the tires...
My Protege no longer feels like a Protege. It feels like the entire suspension has been lifted out and a Corolla suspension put in its place. Initial turn-in response is pitiful. With the OEM Potenza's and the Nitto's, the vehicle responded immediately to steering wheel inputs. Now, there is a definite lag between input and the vehicle actually changing direction. The harder and faster the input, the more lag there is. Freeway transfer ramps that I used to easily take at 75mph on the Potenza's and 80mph on the Nitto's are now scary propositions, even at 60mph which is 5mph below the recommended speeds. These tires suck!!! You can feel the sidewalls just rolling over like butter and the vehicle sways back and forth as the tires attempt to resemble the shape of a tire.
I can't remember who (and I'm not going back to look) kept insisting that the Yokohama AVID T4's would be a great replacement tire. If these YK450's are truly more performance oriented than the AVID T4's, then I certainly cannot imagine how lousy the AVID T4's are. DO NOT BUY THESE TIRES OR THE AVID T4s!! Someone else mentioned the Kumho ECSTA Supra something or other. A lot of the online reviews of those tires resemble my complaints and I certainly would not recommend those either.
Hey Meade... remember my love/hate relationship? Guess where it's going to be now! (But, these tires are certainly not the fault of the car.)
During the "aerial convincing" of Serbs in Kosovo and Yugoslavia, two people came online, one said he was Sebian and the other said he was in Kosovo. The remarks between those two were not kind and, especially about American pilots by the Sebian. I let them vent for a while and eventually kicked the Serb out.The Kosovan was an adult male, the Serb a teenager.
This is the Internet and we have to remember the world can come here just as easily as anywhere else.
For my part on the off-topic remarks, let me just say that when the perpetrators are found out I know the sounds heard in THAT country will be ZOOM ZOOM's I hope we never hear overhead at night.
Maybe one will have this message painted on the side: From America With Love! a balistic greeting card so to speak.
On the Net, you have to be discrete when you greet, you have to be polite when you BITE!
fowler3
I think you can count on the Pro getting into any future comparos, if my neighborhood is any indication. We've gone from none to three in about 2 months. 1 LX, 1 LX 2.0, and one very sharp (glad I don't have to keep it clean) black ES.
I notice you're in Illinois too. Maybe we'll meet at a stoplight somewhere next spring and we'll both be in our new Pros. I'm just trying to hold out long enough to use my tax refund as a downpayment (yes, I know, I know, but I'm in a significantly bigger new house this year and I don't know how much to withhold yet, so I'm being careful to avoid a penalty (can you tell I spent some time at Motley Fool in years past?)).
twist
I purchased my Protege because it's a sporty-feeling, fast, handsome economy sedan. I can get a thrill without feeling like I bought a 1985 Toyota Corolla (and the associated lobotomy).
One thing I really HATE about my Protege -- and it's not Mazda's fault -- is the hard, noisy, short-lived, hydroplane-prone Bridgestone Potenza RE92 tires that came on it. They make the car drone over grooved pavement, they transmit all kinds of noise and vibrations into the car, and they handle like racing slicks in the rain. The exact same tires could have killed me in 1992. Because of those tires, I know what it feels like to have a bruised sternum from hitting your seatbelt at 45 mph. I know what it feels like to slam both hands through your windshield. And I know what it feels like to look over into the front passenger's footwell and see your girlfriend's right leg taking a 90-degree left turn where it shouldn't. Because of those tires, I know what it feels like to ride in an ambulance on a back board, wearing a head brace.
I didn't buy this car so I could drive 100 mph+ on the Interstate. If I'd wanted that kind of car, I don't think a Protege would've been anywhere on my list. Yes, I have driven this car at 100 mph on the Interstate. But I only did it to see if I could; frankly I was scared as hell and would never, ever consider staying at that speed for more than a few seconds.
I WANT -- truly want -- a more comfortable ride than the Potenzas provide. I'm tired of having to raise my voice to talk to my wife on the highway. The AVIDs are still T speed-rated, I believe, and while they're not Vs, they'll still handle any speed I'll ever want to go. Yeah, maybe they don't corner as well as the Bridgestones -- but they'll corner fine for my driving habits. The AVIDs also are all-season tires. I don't want to buy Nittos or Kumho Ecstas and then have to purchase another set of tires for winter. I'm sold on the AVIDs because they appear to offer the kind of ride I'm looking for for not a lot of bucks. I also have other responsibilities in my life right now, like a baby and a wife who's out of work, and I don't have an unlimited supply of cash for tires. I recommended the tires to Larry because I've met him, I know what he uses his car for most of the time, and I thought he might want to consider them too. I'm not saying they're the tire for everyone. I was just elated to find a high-quality, quiet-riding tire that retained some semblance of handling for a good price.
I still think it sounds like you didn't make the right choice when you bought your car. You tend to talk about your Protege as if it's an Acura or a Lexus. It ain't! It's an economy car that has some fun built into it. And we all know you came from an RX-7. You're used to a car that was designed to be tossed around the road.
Keep in mind I'm only speaking for myself here. Your tastes obviously are different. I've played with Proteges for 10 years, and I've had nary a problem with them -- you're wearing out parts on your 1-year-old car that I didn't wear out in 83,000 miles.
You can shod any car with high-performance tires and drive the hell out of it, pushing it past its limits. You can also shod your own feet with $100 Nike basketball shoes, but it won't make you Michael Jordan.
There. That's the end of my editorial.
Meade
Like they say in the Publisher's Clearinghouse commercials:
COME ON! SEND IT IN!
Meade
I still need to hear from:
krotine
mazdafun
black01coupev6
repj
Pat (our beloved host)
... and David, our resident "lurker."
An e-mail from you to me (mdaffron@the-rma.org) will get you all the details.
By the way, I don't wanna hear any whining about any long drives to get to MAPP II -- first of all, Proteges are a blast on the highway, and second, we have one person from MICHIGAN who's planning on coming!!!
Let's hear from YOU!
Meade
That said, I am confident the shop did a good job on the repairs. There are still some items for them to follow up on, but the car looks and drives very well. The accident I had on the surface did not look too severe, as I was only hit on the back 8 inches of the vehicle, but when you add up the parts and labor, the price was pretty staggering. The good news was there was no frame or mechanical damage to speak of. Just body parts. I think if I had been hit a few inches forward, I would be driving a new Protege now. Oh well.
so i got my car back finally! that little zit that once appeared on my roof is gone! and i won't have to worry about cleaning my interior sunroof cover, as the dealership remembered to clean it themselves (hey, they actually did something right!) thanx for all the advice..
pf - did u go with tint or stereo??
'duh'
That said, I am confident the shop did a good job on the repairs. There are still some items for them to follow up on, but the car looks and drives very well. The accident I had on the surface did not look too severe, as I was only hit on the back 8 inches of the vehicle, but when you add up the parts and labor, the price was pretty staggering. The good news was there was no frame or mechanical damage to speak of. Just body parts. I think if I had been hit a few inches forward, I would be driving a new Protege now. Oh well.
I'm glad they got the scratches out ok and even cleaned the sunroof. I hope you're enjoying zoom zooming around Calgary.
Protege_fan
thanx in advance
'duh'