I've been watching this thread for a little while since my wife's Murano lease is up next month. Since we have both an additional kid and dog since we started the lease on the Murano, it may be time for a minivan. We're going back and forth between this and the AWD Sienna. If we can get away with FWD, I'd prefer the Odyssey but we have an uphill 400 ft-long driveway in PA. I do a good job of keeping it clear with the quad but... one friend unable to make it up in a T&C with all-seasons has my wife worried.
I worked for Honda dealer while in high school and college. At the time, I worked as a service writer and parts guy, later assisting in the F&I backoffice. It wasn't wasn't what I wanted to do the rest of my life but I love cars and the owner went to my church. The dealership has since been sold but I keep in contact with one of the sales staff who's been there quite a long time.
Anyhoo... My point about about the too-good-to-be-true advertised specials is that I have indeed purchased, or arranged the purchase, of three of these "specials" over the last ten years. All three had one common feature that the Odyssey does not: a manual transmission. The one dealer was quite amazed that my parents actually wanted to buy the 1998 Isuzu Trooper 5-speed. They didn't even know where they'd stored the car on the lot, expecting nobody would want it. Of probably 20 Troopers on the lot at the time, it was the only manual-equipped unit.
It's at best only an OK deal - should be able to do better (shoot for something of that vintage with less than 40K). It's hard to rack up that kind of mileage without spending a lot of time on highways. That said, miles don't really hurt Hondas (except as to price) and you should be fine IF you plan to keep it a long time.
For comparison, I'm getting ready to sell my '05 Touring R&N with less than 44K. It will most likely go to Carmax for between 20 and 21 (and they will mark it up to 26).
These are the offers I'm considering sending out to dealers in my area. Just wanted some opinions from others. Whether or not these offers are do-able or out of the ball bark. thanks
I posted this in the Lease section and did not get any response so thought I would try here. Local dealers are telling me that the lease deal has continued and in fact actually got a little better. In fact, the current advertised lease at honda.com is significantly better than last month.
I was wondering if someone in the know could tell us how much dealer cash Honda is now allowing to be used toward a lease as well as the current residual and money factors.
I just purchased an 08 EXL for 29,250 OTD. The sticker was 26,750(including dest) + taxes tags and fees. Several dealers came within $500 but in the time I had this was the best deal. (Garden State Honda) Not sure about the EX but I think you could do better.
Folks- I am buying for the first time in US. Could someone clarify this?
Some dealers provide a quote including new plates. In this case, do I have not to go to the DMV. Does this also mean that if I get Ody from an out of the state dealer who includes Title and Tag, then I have to get to the DMV for registration?
I am new to this site and it was quite a surprise to me that it is possible to buy so much below the invoice price. Anyway, the current best deal is something like invoice price minus $2,500 or minus $1,500 combined with special financing. Somebody indicated that this deal will continue through 9/2/2008.
1. I wonder whether this is likely to be the best deal?
2. What about August? Will the cash back be the same through 9/2/08 or it may increase as the manufacturer is likely become more desperate to sell 2008 models?
3. NOW, what is going to happen with the 2009 model??? Do you expect based on the experience that the incentive will go to zero, be half or else?
Is Honda likely to keep it that high for the new model???
my quotes are coming at 32,700 OTD for EX-L w/ DVD. Nothing under 31k like I hoped.
My understanding is that 6 CD changer is a standard item in EX-L with DVD. Some are wanting to charge me for it and others are not?? Also are headphones for the DVD player included or is this up to the dealer even if this is a manufacturere feature.
I ended up buying my silver EX from Freeman Honda. It was a very painless experience, in and out under an hour. Got it for 24,000 + TTL (25,732 out the door) without using Honda financing, which was the initial quote I received from this dealer. Other dealers wanted to play games, and their out the door prices started much higher. Could have probably shaved couple of hundred bucks more if I had been more aggressive and played the dealers against one another. I am sure the folks in Atlanta/Boston can shave $1000 - $2000 from this, but it didn't look like that was currently possible in DFW.
FYI, this week I received OTD quotes in the Boston area from $28,850 (Honda Cars-Everett, Herb Chambers - Boston) to $30,500 (Boch, Honda Gallery) for an EXL-RES.
Since most of here are dealing with salesman over the phone or internet, are you finding that you end up giving in to pay for items such floor mats when its all said and done.I could see this being one of those items that "they get you on" when your signing the deal. Also this may fall into my earlier post of DVD headphones etc.???
Just got the following in quotes from Colonial Honda in GA...their previous internet price for an EXL R&N had been 31,193...so this is about a thousand buck drop...
"Just checking in with you to see if you are still in the market for a new Odyssey. The pricing has slightly changed.
EX-L R&N MSRP: $ 36,480.00 Internet Sale Price: $ 30,290.00
TOURING MSRP: $ 40,680.00 Internet Sale Price: $ 36,527.00
That was one of the more thoughtful explanations I have seen on this board in a while. While I understand your viewpoint, I wish everyone to understand, that it is not a common practice to mislead consumers into the door.
During the interview and in my own explanations, I have repeated the need to do thorough, reliable research when it comes to purchasing any vehicle. Unless you were directly involved in any neogitation, it is difficult to accurately describe events that transpired.
Concerning the interview, the gentlemen who purchased the vehicle responded to a survey from American Honda and rated his purchasing experience a 100%. Completely satisfied and willing to refer customers.
Thank you for all who read these posts and give real feedback to our sales processes, I assure you we take the feedback and strive to improve the experience for all involved!
Thanks in advance for your feedback. ------------------------------------------------------ As of yesterday, the lowest quote I have received on a 08 Odyssey EXL RES is $30215 (Out-the-door). Waiting to hear back if the dealer is still offering 0.9% APR for 36 months. Btw, invoice price is $30,711.00 excluding the freight charge.
Also, today one dealer has announced $500 off extra for first five buyers everyday till 7/13/08. Any thoughts? Here is their ad:
"EARLY DELIVERY COUPON $500"
"FIRST 5 PURCHASERS EVERYDAY WILL BE GIVEN AN ADDITIONAL $500 OFF THE ALREADY LOW INTERNET PRICING. EXCLUDING FIT AND ALL CIVIC MODELS.
MUST PRESENT COUPON PRIOR TO PURCHASE. OFFER CAN NOT BE COMBINED WITH ANY OFFER OTHER THAN ORIGINAL INTERNET PRICE QUOTE. EXPIRES 7/13/08 C O B."
"2008 ODYSSEY (Offers do not include tax, tags, $385 processing fee, $495 appearance package/prep and $635 or 670 freight) LX $21527 EX $23839 EXL $26266 EXL-DVD $27711 EXL-DVD/NAV $30519 TOURING $35314 TOURING PAX $35856" --------------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---------------------------
I also live in GA and looking for a deal on a EX-L R&N. The best price I've gotten from on dealer is 30,200 + fees or 31,200 + fees and special financing. However carsdirect price is 29,719. Hope this helps. I still haven't pulled the trigger waiting on 29K + fees. We'll see what happens next month I guess.
I haven't found any extras to be tacked on at Boston area dealers, although they always try to upsell you with extended warranty, fabric protection and clear coat finish, etc. I have been told that one pair of wireless headphones is included with the RES and that a second pair is extra...
Although you say this is not common practice in your dealership (wink, wink), I suspect "lies" and "misunderstandings", such as took place with the Podcast interviewer and, potentially, Rohitk, happen far more often than you would be willing to admit, for obvious reasons.
I listened again to that portion of the Podcast and I am even more convinced now than in my previous post that this technique is a regular part of your everyday business model. I don't believe the average listener would come away from the interview convinced of anything less. Once again, I recommend to any potential Ourisman customer to take a listen and judge for themselves. (link title starting at about 0:50) It still really surprises me that Ourisman would not be distancing themselves or retracting the statements that were made starting around minute 50 of the interview.
Continuing with your other comments, it also does not take too much to read between the lines when you speak of the customer doing thorough and reliable research. If a customer comes into your dealership that is otherwise, uninformed, short on backbone, or not particularly sharp, your dealership will take every opportunity to extract the maximum profit from the transaction.
In the case of the Podcast interviewer, it was likely only because the he presented himself as an intelligent male with some backbone that his complaint was taken seriously. I am fairly certain that your simple goal is to make as much as you can off each sale while simultaneously making the customer reasonable content with the purchase.
If that means getting $1000 or more on the sale than was promised over the phone, great. For another customer that might mean $500 extra profit. Or, if someone really pushes back, like the interviewer, they may even get close to the original deal offered over the phone, but only after they fight for it. Unfortunately for the customer, that means you start at the basest of levels, testing each potential customer's intelligence, knowledge and fortitude.
During the interview, you seem to rationalize your dealership's behavior by claiming that the customer ultimately got a good buy. I am confident that no one in your dealership loses any sleep when a deceived customer ultimately spends $500 to $1500 more than was promised them over the phone, because they did not have the backbone, knowledge or intelligence to stand up to such tactics.
The bottom line appears to be that it is not important for your dealership to treat the customer honorably or fairly, but, ultimately, to bring them to the point where they are convinced that they have been.
One regularly reads on these boards about dealers attempting to double charge for destination, adding unwarranted last minute fees, or last minute changes to interest rates that might go unnoticed. I am sure I am just scratching the surface of the "gray area games" that are employed by car dealers. Let me be clear, I am in no way accusing you or your dealership of these tactics.
However, if lying to a customer to get them through the door to begin negotiations hoping to charge them much more for a vehicle is not considered abhorrent, intolerable behavior by your dealership, why would I be surprised to learn that any of the other tactics listed above might also be employed by your dealership? If the customer gives you a good rating and thinks they got a good deal, are these tactics acceptable?
Certainly, all dealerships fall on a continuum regarding their ethics and treatment of customers. I could not begin to venture a guess as to where your dealership falls on that continuum. Each dealership must determine if the business model they are employing is working. I am guessing that dealerships employing deceptive practices believe it helps there bottom line. I am sure you are convinced that the profits gained by getting people into the dealership far outweigh the negative customer reactions that happen on occasion or you would not be doing it. If it turns out profits start to fall because of public perception that your dealership is not honorable, maybe management would even think about sailing a different course.
Finally, how should the customer react after the sale when considering other services the dealer has to offer. If my purchase is premised on a lie to get me through the door (even if I leave satisfied, as apparently the interviewer did), how could you expect me to ever trust that what the service department is recommending is actually needed? How would I know if you were telling the truth about a repair being outside the scope of warranty service? Or, as in the sales process, do I need to bring a full compliment of knowledge, intelligence and backbone to be treated fairly at the service counter?
This will be the last post in reference to benfs' prose.
Although you continue to express your sentiments in a way that is clearly aggressive, sarcastic and demeaning, I respect your right to voice concerns and opinions on a dealership you have had no contact or interaction with.
Customer satisfaction is a top priority at our dealership. Short term profits do not reflect a plan for long term steady growth. Every customer that has an issue with a price or interaction with the dealership is immediately addressed and hopefully rectified to the customers complete satisfaction.
The interview was given to be an inside look at the buying process from both the seller and buyers perspective. It is not a reflection on how the dealeship does business, but a look at one mans foray into the car buying process, and how others may learn from his experience. If you have reviewed the posts that were left by listeners, you will find most individuals enjoyed the podcast and the inside look that they were given. To suggest this interview is a business model of how the company operates is not accurate.
I have always welcomed the opportunity to discuss with any individual the purchase experience and how it can be made more enjoyable. I am an ardent supporter of using the internet to assist consumers in the purchase of a vehicle. Your attempts to portray the experience as less than truthful does not reflect accurately the emphasis that this dealership places on customer satisfaction.
Your insights into what you portray as the truth is being presented as factual without any first hand knowledge.
Customer satisfaction has been and always will be an inherent part of the culture that the dealership instills in its employees. I welcome anyone that has any questions regarding any issue pertaining to the purchase of a new vehicle to contact me. You will be treated with respect, valued as a customer and appreciated for the opportunity you have given us to be your choice for a new Honda.
Thank you to all who have patronized our dealership, and to those who may we weclome you.
Thank you to everyone for posting thoughts on experiences and pricing for new Odysseys. We just made our decision on a new Honda Odyssey EXL and we love it! After doing plenty of research, I emailed 3 of my local dealers. The winning bid came from Ourismans Honda in Laurel Maryland. Pricing was about the same as the others but the quote had a break down of "on the road pricing" which helped us get our financing together. The process took a couple hours (as expected) and we were on our way home in our new Odyssey! Although the financing manager offered warranties and other services we declined and went with our own credit union for financing. We love our new Odyssey and Ourisman will have our business again when my sister is ready for her new Accord! Thanks again for all of your input! Good Luck to every one!
It would seem that such an omission (in what appears to be a fake testimonial) was not unintentional and suggests that previous critical comments about this store do have a basis in fact.
Since Ourisman Honda has committed to having made his final post on this matter, I will make the same commitment.
In my opinion, lying to a customer is wrong. Deceiving a customer is wrong.
During the the interview (starting at minute 50), a sales manager with Ourisman Honda makes it very clear that lying is an acceptable business practice, necessary to get the customer into the dealership.
At no time in response to any of my writings, does this sales manager with Ourisman Honda state that lying and deceptive practices are wrong. He simply states, in a previous post, that lying was not a "common practice". Much more important than its rate of occurance would be his insistence that it is wrong and will not tolerated at his dealership.
Ourisman Honda, at its highest management levels, clearly admits to lying to get customers through the door (listen to the interview). If lying or deception is an acceptable means to initiate a sale, it is not clear to me, the potential customer, at what point (during or after the sale) Ourisman Honda would consider lying or deception to be unacceptable business practices.
Easy to spot that & understand this post is trying to save the dealership's name. This membership was setup 7/11 same day and right after his post. He praises himself like B investigates B.
Thank you for the link to the podcast. It reinforced all my knowledge that says car dealers are the bottom rung. The sales manager in the podcast said lying to get a warm body in his door is a "gray area.' I don't think so.
I am down to two dealers...$130 apart. I negotiated price on an LX via email. If I am naive, i will believe i just walk in and they have the numbers filled into their sales sheet from my email, and they don't try to change anything or say I have to pay for wheel locks or floor mats. I assume they will try to sell me an extended warranty..... and do they still do "undercoating" like in the move Fargo? Has anyone gotten an email price and then had them play the same old games when you show up in person to sign the paper?
I bought a 2008 Honda Odyssey with 8 miles on.. It was not considered Brand new but was Honda Certified Used and had been titled by Honda USA.
The trick is to find one of these. It took me a while and to find a dealer that will sell you one at good price and not at a premium as it has the extended warranty included ($1500), not that the warranty is valid for Canadians anyways.
I bought it for the 2008 EXL-RES model for $28,700(list $34,445) including documentation fee and Temporary Tag(30 days) used to drive back over to the Canadian border. I did not have to pay sales tax as it is being exported.
I bought the car from Martin Mainline Honda, in Philadelphia. I dealt with a great salesman(Steve Sacks Ext 113) who has Toronto links and was extremely helpful and professional.. I trusted him from all our emails and phonecalls and he was genuine. He even paid for my taxi from my hotel to his dealership.
I found the car through Honda USA certified used website. This deal was about a month ago.
This website was really helpfull. Thank you to everyone.
If you have further questions email me at dd19999 at gmail dot com.
When I purchased my last Honda, a CRV, I purchased it from a dealer that was about 4-hours away. Obviously, I did not want to drive that distance without a clear understanding of the agreement.
The dealer was more than willing to fax me the sales agreement with all of terms, once I had given them a $500 deposit for a particular VIN. The deal was not completed until I arrived, but, IIRC, the contract was signed by the dealer.
I see no reason that a dealer would not be willing to do this for you even if the sale is "more local". If I were a dealer, I would expect to get some type of deposit before I would begin preparing the docs. Using a credit card should provide some level of protection, if for any reason, the contract would not be honored once you arrive.
My experience played out much like you describe. We negotiated to the penny via email. Did not pay or provide a CC to hold the vehicle, but he did fax me a financing form to complete and fax back (I assume to run credit)... even though I told him we we were paying cash.
When we arrived, all paperwork was complete, and waiting our signature. The salesguy did point out the mats, wheel locks, pinstripe, rr cargo mat.... but said he would include it all... (plus 3 extra wireless headphones!)
When signing the papers, the finance guy did try to sell both the extended warranty & tried to talk me into financing. Just said I was buying Bernardi Warranty and told them what the price was. My dealer wanted nothing to do with it. So we finished signing the papers, was given a brief demo of the Ody's features, and left.
After getting a ton of great information from this site, I wanted to pass on our buying experience. In St. Louis, MO we paid $32K inlcluding destination for EX-L with RES/NAV. This was by far the best price we could get and we negotiated for quite some time for this. We slightly preferred a Toyota XLE (with no nav) but the dealer would not come down from $35,500 ($33,500 after $2000 incentive) so we went with the Honda. I only wish it had an automatic lift gate; otherwise, I love it.
We did have one experience with the salesman that I'm debating how to handle. He was very nice but only with Honda for 6 weeks. When he didn't know something, he admitted it and got the answer. We originally didn't want navi, but they didn't have an EX-L RES on the lot in any color other than white, which we didn't want. When he introduced the model with navi, he said multiple times that it had bluetooth. We didn't really care about getting that at the time, which he knew. It was quite late when we were actually finished (2+ hours past dealer closing time), so we arranged to meet with the salesman this Tuesday to go over the car. In the meantime we spend a couple of minutes watching the DVD and fall in love with the bluetood feature, but then I figure out we don't have bluetooth. I did mention it to the saleman today when he called to check up on us. He consulted with another salesperson who also that the EX-L with RES and NAV came with bluetooth. I pointed out that one look at the steering wheel tells us we don't have it.
How much of an issue would you make of this? My husband is inclined to ask them to install it for free ($700+ for parts and labor). I want to make some issue of it but don't want this guy to lose his job. We've always had great luck with this dealership and particulary love their service department.
Also, any experiences installing the XM to Sirius converter in the Odyssey? We have researched it and it looks like a pain. Not sure if any installers will do this though.
I'm interested in learning about the XM -> Sirius conversion as well. I'm waiting to see what happens with the merger (maybe it'll happen in another 16 months! ). Besides Howard Stern, I prefer Sirius' music channels over XM's. I want my Alt Nation over "Fred," etc.
Hi. I have been reading your site for a while and am hopefully about 5 days from pulling the trigger on a deal in NJ. I did some donkeypunching and have received 5 quotes ranging from 32,000 to 32,200 out the door for an Odyssey EX-L w/ RES (based on the $1500 for the special financing). I am wondering if anyone in the NJ area is doing better or if this is about the best I can do from what you are all finding. The price includes everything (NJ tax of 7%, tire tax, destiantion, tags, etc)
That podcast was awesome! I applaud the sales manager's candor, but I can't believe that he essentially admits that dealers take advantage of uninformed buyers and give low-ball quotes to potential customers to get them in the door.
The hosts should post the link for this podcast on every "prices paid" forum.
Yes, the Touring does, but unfortunately we don't have the Touring. We are just deciding how much of an issue to make of it because the sales guy said more than once that the EX-L w/RES&NAV had bluetooth.
There is an XM to Sirius converter, but installing it requires removing a lot of the interior panels. We are going to try to find a professional to do it. There is a ton of information online if you are interested.
Just my opinion, but I wouldn't spend any money to convert to Sirius. The merger deal isn't 100% dead yet. If it goes through, you can bet that programming will be shared...
Comments
I worked for Honda dealer while in high school and college. At the time, I worked as a service writer and parts guy, later assisting in the F&I backoffice. It wasn't wasn't what I wanted to do the rest of my life but I love cars and the owner went to my church. The dealership has since been sold but I keep in contact with one of the sales staff who's been there quite a long time.
Anyhoo... My point about about the too-good-to-be-true advertised specials is that I have indeed purchased, or arranged the purchase, of three of these "specials" over the last ten years. All three had one common feature that the Odyssey does not: a manual transmission. The one dealer was quite amazed that my parents actually wanted to buy the 1998 Isuzu Trooper 5-speed. They didn't even know where they'd stored the car on the lot, expecting nobody would want it. Of probably 20 Troopers on the lot at the time, it was the only manual-equipped unit.
Thanks~!
For comparison, I'm getting ready to sell my '05 Touring R&N with less than 44K. It will most likely go to Carmax for between 20 and 21 (and they will mark it up to 26).
08 Honda Odyssey EX-L RES+NAV
29,000 + tax, tag and Dealer fee (499)
or
30,300 + same fees and the 2.9 for 60
I live the Atlanta area.
I posted this in the Lease section and did not get any response so thought I would try here. Local dealers are telling me that the lease deal has continued and in fact actually got a little better. In fact, the current advertised lease at honda.com is significantly better than last month.
I was wondering if someone in the know could tell us how much dealer cash Honda is now allowing to be used toward a lease as well as the current residual and money factors.
Thanks
Trumpy
Some dealers provide a quote including new plates. In this case, do I have not to go to the DMV. Does this also mean that if I get Ody from an out of the state dealer who includes Title and Tag, then I have to get to the DMV for registration?
1. I wonder whether this is likely to be the best deal?
2. What about August? Will the cash back be the same through 9/2/08 or it may increase as the manufacturer is likely become more desperate to sell 2008 models?
3. NOW, what is going to happen with the 2009 model??? Do you expect based on the experience that the incentive will go to zero, be half or else?
Is Honda likely to keep it that high for the new model???
Thanks!!!
Nothing under 31k like I hoped.
My understanding is that 6 CD changer is a standard item in EX-L with DVD. Some are wanting to charge me for it and others are not??
Also are headphones for the DVD player included or is this up to the dealer even if this is a manufacturere feature.
thanks
I am sure the folks in Atlanta/Boston can shave $1000 - $2000 from this, but it didn't look like that was currently possible in DFW.
Also this may fall into my earlier post of DVD headphones etc.???
"Just checking in with you to see if you are still in the market for a new Odyssey. The pricing has slightly changed.
EX-L R&N
MSRP: $ 36,480.00
Internet Sale Price: $ 30,290.00
TOURING
MSRP: $ 40,680.00
Internet Sale Price: $ 36,527.00
Please let me know if I can help you!"
During the interview and in my own explanations, I have repeated the need to do thorough, reliable research when it comes to purchasing any vehicle. Unless you were directly involved in any neogitation, it is difficult to accurately describe events that transpired.
Concerning the interview, the gentlemen who purchased the vehicle responded to a survey from American Honda and rated his purchasing experience a 100%. Completely satisfied and willing to refer customers.
Thank you for all who read these posts and give real feedback to our sales processes, I assure you we take the feedback and strive to improve the experience for all involved!
------------------------------------------------------
As of yesterday, the lowest quote I have received on a 08 Odyssey EXL RES is $30215 (Out-the-door). Waiting to hear back if the dealer is still offering 0.9% APR for 36 months. Btw, invoice price is $30,711.00 excluding the freight charge.
Also, today one dealer has announced $500 off extra for first five buyers everyday till 7/13/08. Any thoughts? Here is their ad:
"EARLY DELIVERY COUPON $500"
"FIRST 5 PURCHASERS EVERYDAY WILL BE GIVEN AN ADDITIONAL $500 OFF THE ALREADY LOW INTERNET PRICING. EXCLUDING FIT AND ALL CIVIC MODELS.
MUST PRESENT COUPON PRIOR TO PURCHASE. OFFER CAN NOT BE COMBINED WITH ANY OFFER OTHER THAN ORIGINAL INTERNET PRICE QUOTE. EXPIRES 7/13/08 C O B."
"2008 ODYSSEY (Offers do not include tax, tags, $385 processing fee, $495 appearance package/prep and $635 or 670 freight)
LX $21527
EX $23839
EXL $26266
EXL-DVD $27711
EXL-DVD/NAV $30519
TOURING $35314
TOURING PAX $35856"
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------- - ---------------------------
If so, those prices are not very good at all.
Here are your latest Interent prices for the Odyssey vehicle:
EX
$24,827.00 and choose rates as low as 0.9% for qualified customers
$23,827.00 and use conventional rates or pay cash
EX-L
$27,801.00 and choose rates as low as 0.9% for qualified customers
$26,801.00 and use conventional rates or pay cash
All prices INCLUDE the destination charge.
What do you think? Would you try to go lower?
This is in the Cincinnati area.
Thanks for any input!
I listened again to that portion of the Podcast and I am even more convinced now than in my previous post that this technique is a regular part of your everyday business model. I don't believe the average listener would come away from the interview convinced of anything less. Once again, I recommend to any potential Ourisman customer to take a listen and judge for themselves. (link title starting at about 0:50) It still really surprises me that Ourisman would not be distancing themselves or retracting the statements that were made starting around minute 50 of the interview.
Continuing with your other comments, it also does not take too much to read between the lines when you speak of the customer doing thorough and reliable research. If a customer comes into your dealership that is otherwise, uninformed, short on backbone, or not particularly sharp, your dealership will take every opportunity to extract the maximum profit from the transaction.
In the case of the Podcast interviewer, it was likely only because the he presented himself as an intelligent male with some backbone that his complaint was taken seriously. I am fairly certain that your simple goal is to make as much as you can off each sale while simultaneously making the customer reasonable content with the purchase.
If that means getting $1000 or more on the sale than was promised over the phone, great. For another customer that might mean $500 extra profit. Or, if someone really pushes back, like the interviewer, they may even get close to the original deal offered over the phone, but only after they fight for it. Unfortunately for the customer, that means you start at the basest of levels, testing each potential customer's intelligence, knowledge and fortitude.
During the interview, you seem to rationalize your dealership's behavior by claiming that the customer ultimately got a good buy. I am confident that no one in your dealership loses any sleep when a deceived customer ultimately spends $500 to $1500 more than was promised them over the phone, because they did not have the backbone, knowledge or intelligence to stand up to such tactics.
The bottom line appears to be that it is not important for your dealership to treat the customer honorably or fairly, but, ultimately, to bring them to the point where they are convinced that they have been.
One regularly reads on these boards about dealers attempting to double charge for destination, adding unwarranted last minute fees, or last minute changes to interest rates that might go unnoticed. I am sure I am just scratching the surface of the "gray area games" that are employed by car dealers. Let me be clear, I am in no way accusing you or your dealership of these tactics.
However, if lying to a customer to get them through the door to begin negotiations hoping to charge them much more for a vehicle is not considered abhorrent, intolerable behavior by your dealership, why would I be surprised to learn that any of the other tactics listed above might also be employed by your dealership? If the customer gives you a good rating and thinks they got a good deal, are these tactics acceptable?
Certainly, all dealerships fall on a continuum regarding their ethics and treatment of customers. I could not begin to venture a guess as to where your dealership falls on that continuum. Each dealership must determine if the business model they are employing is working. I am guessing that dealerships employing deceptive practices believe it helps there bottom line. I am sure you are convinced that the profits gained by getting people into the dealership far outweigh the negative customer reactions that happen on occasion or you would not be doing it. If it turns out profits start to fall because of public perception that your dealership is not honorable, maybe management would even think about sailing a different course.
Finally, how should the customer react after the sale when considering other services the dealer has to offer. If my purchase is premised on a lie to get me through the door (even if I leave satisfied, as apparently the interviewer did), how could you expect me to ever trust that what the service department is recommending is actually needed? How would I know if you were telling the truth about a repair being outside the scope of warranty service? Or, as in the sales process, do I need to bring a full compliment of knowledge, intelligence and backbone to be treated fairly at the service counter?
Although you continue to express your sentiments in a way that is clearly aggressive, sarcastic and demeaning, I respect your right to voice concerns and opinions on a dealership you have had no contact or interaction with.
Customer satisfaction is a top priority at our dealership. Short term profits do not reflect a plan for long term steady growth. Every customer that has an issue with a price or interaction with the dealership is immediately addressed and hopefully rectified to the customers complete satisfaction.
The interview was given to be an inside look at the buying process from both the seller and buyers perspective. It is not a reflection on how the dealeship does business, but a look at one mans foray into the car buying process, and how others may learn from his experience. If you have reviewed the posts that were left by listeners, you will find most individuals enjoyed the podcast and the inside look that they were given. To suggest this interview is a business model of how the company operates is not accurate.
I have always welcomed the opportunity to discuss with any individual the purchase experience and how it can be made more enjoyable. I am an ardent supporter of using the internet to assist consumers in the purchase of a vehicle. Your attempts to portray the experience as less than truthful does not reflect accurately the emphasis that this dealership places on customer satisfaction.
Your insights into what you portray as the truth is being presented as factual without any first hand knowledge.
Customer satisfaction has been and always will be an inherent part of the culture that the dealership instills in its employees. I welcome anyone that has any questions regarding any issue pertaining to the purchase of a new vehicle to contact me. You will be treated with respect, valued as a customer and appreciated for the opportunity you have given us to be your choice for a new Honda.
Thank you to all who have patronized our dealership, and to those who may we weclome you.
In my opinion, lying to a customer is wrong. Deceiving a customer is wrong.
During the the interview (starting at minute 50), a sales manager with Ourisman Honda makes it very clear that lying is an acceptable business practice, necessary to get the customer into the dealership.
At no time in response to any of my writings, does this sales manager with Ourisman Honda state that lying and deceptive practices are wrong. He simply states, in a previous post, that lying was not a "common practice". Much more important than its rate of occurance would be his insistence that it is wrong and will not tolerated at his dealership.
Ourisman Honda, at its highest management levels, clearly admits to lying to get customers through the door (listen to the interview). If lying or deception is an acceptable means to initiate a sale, it is not clear to me, the potential customer, at what point (during or after the sale) Ourisman Honda would consider lying or deception to be unacceptable business practices.
LX $21,598 including dest. and doc. fees plus 6% tax, $120 TT+L...$23014
EX $24,399 w/ same payments as above...$25983.
Should I expect much better? No dealer options on either vehicle, havn't gotten into financing....
I was offered $21,717 for an LX from another dealer but $22,717 if I wanted the special financing options.
Thank you for the link to the podcast. It reinforced all my knowledge that says car dealers are the bottom rung. The sales manager in the podcast said lying to get a warm body in his door is a "gray area.' I don't think so.
If I am naive, i will believe i just walk in and they have the numbers filled into their sales sheet from my email, and they don't try to change anything or say I have to pay for wheel locks or floor mats. I assume they will try to sell me an extended warranty..... and do they still do "undercoating" like in the move Fargo? Has anyone gotten an email price and then had them play the same old games when you show up in person to sign the paper?
The trick is to find one of these. It took me a while and to find a dealer that will sell you one at good price and not at a premium as it has the extended warranty included ($1500), not that the warranty is valid for Canadians anyways.
I bought it for the 2008 EXL-RES model for $28,700(list $34,445) including documentation fee and Temporary Tag(30 days) used to drive back over to the Canadian border. I did not have to pay sales tax as it is being exported.
I bought the car from Martin Mainline Honda, in Philadelphia. I dealt with a great salesman(Steve Sacks Ext 113) who has Toronto links and was extremely helpful and professional.. I trusted him from all our emails and phonecalls and he was genuine. He even paid for my taxi from my hotel to his dealership.
I found the car through Honda USA certified used website.
This deal was about a month ago.
This website was really helpfull. Thank you to everyone.
If you have further questions email me at dd19999 at gmail dot com.
DD
2008 Pilot 4WD SE Silver $25,920 ... MSRP 31,145
196-miles Automatic
The dealer was more than willing to fax me the sales agreement with all of terms, once I had given them a $500 deposit for a particular VIN. The deal was not completed until I arrived, but, IIRC, the contract was signed by the dealer.
I see no reason that a dealer would not be willing to do this for you even if the sale is "more local". If I were a dealer, I would expect to get some type of deposit before I would begin preparing the docs. Using a credit card should provide some level of protection, if for any reason, the contract would not be honored once you arrive.
Good luck.
When we arrived, all paperwork was complete, and waiting our signature. The salesguy did point out the mats, wheel locks, pinstripe, rr cargo mat.... but said he would include it all... (plus 3 extra wireless headphones!)
When signing the papers, the finance guy did try to sell both the extended warranty & tried to talk me into financing. Just said I was buying Bernardi Warranty and told them what the price was. My dealer wanted nothing to do with it. So we finished signing the papers, was given a brief demo of the Ody's features, and left.
So it is possible to have it go as planned!
We did have one experience with the salesman that I'm debating how to handle. He was very nice but only with Honda for 6 weeks. When he didn't know something, he admitted it and got the answer. We originally didn't want navi, but they didn't have an EX-L RES on the lot in any color other than white, which we didn't want. When he introduced the model with navi, he said multiple times that it had bluetooth. We didn't really care about getting that at the time, which he knew. It was quite late when we were actually finished (2+ hours past dealer closing time), so we arranged to meet with the salesman this Tuesday to go over the car. In the meantime we spend a couple of minutes watching the DVD and fall in love with the bluetood feature, but then I figure out we don't have bluetooth. I did mention it to the saleman today when he called to check up on us. He consulted with another salesperson who also that the EX-L with RES and NAV came with bluetooth. I pointed out that one look at the steering wheel tells us we don't have it.
How much of an issue would you make of this? My husband is inclined to ask them to install it for free ($700+ for parts and labor). I want to make some issue of it but don't want this guy to lose his job. We've always had great luck with this dealership and particulary love their service department.
Also, any experiences installing the XM to Sirius converter in the Odyssey? We have researched it and it looks like a pain. Not sure if any installers will do this though.
Thanks for any thoughts/feedback.
I'm interested in learning about the XM -> Sirius conversion as well. I'm waiting to see what happens with the merger (maybe it'll happen in another 16 months!
I did some donkeypunching and have received 5 quotes ranging from 32,000 to 32,200 out the door for an Odyssey EX-L w/ RES (based on the $1500 for the special financing). I am wondering if anyone in the NJ area is doing better or if this is about the best I can do from what you are all finding.
The price includes everything (NJ tax of 7%, tire tax, destiantion, tags, etc)
Thanks
The hosts should post the link for this podcast on every "prices paid" forum.
There is an XM to Sirius converter, but installing it requires removing a lot of the interior panels. We are going to try to find a professional to do it. There is a ton of information online if you are interested.
I am picking up my new car tomorrow. What will happen?
What do I sign?
I alraedy signed a sales sheet when I left my deposit.
Thanks