Does anyone know if you can fit a California king mattress and box springs in the back of a 2004 EX? I have to go pick one up and am not sure if I'll need to borrow a vehicle to go get it.
I have a 00 EX with 79k and the previous owner went through 3 sets of Michelin Symmetry tires, which are now bald! She also and complained of tire pressure problems.
I live in the Northeast USA. I need a tire that is safe, handles well, and has a good tread life. Do all 3 exist in a tire? I tend to be an agressive driver, but do not typically speed.
I've been told by various sources, including TireRack: Toyo Spectrum BF Goodrich Traction TA Brisgestone Turanza LST Goodyaer Eagle LS Yoko AVID Michelin Hydoedge
You can see why I'm confused. I've looked at reviews, but they vary with the type of car the owner has. I want your advice.
Strange. I swapped out my 2002 EX's Michelin Symmetrys for another round of Symmetrys, and have experienced no problems.
I have BF Goodrich Traction TAs on my wife's 99 Civic and it has worked out far better than the previous Good Year Allegras she had. (The BF Goodrich gave a smoother, quieter ride than the Allegras)
Learn how to compare tires not by their brand names but by the ratings. There are something like 11-12 actual "manufacturers" of tires in the world for hundreds of brands (i.e., a lot of these brands come from same line).
All tires have this information on the sidewall. If you're looking for longer lasting tires, you want to pay attention to the treadwear number. I think the Symmetrys I recently got have something like 720 for treadwear (a "400" would last twice as long as a "200"). "Sticker" tires (for higher top speeds) generally have softer ride, but are more expensive and less durable. Unless you plan on taking your Ody on an autobahn, a "T" rated tire should be fine.
No problems w/ my Michelin Symmetries - got 60K out of my first set (Calif. driving 80% Hwy 20% city). Keep in mind all tires lose air gradually, so you want to be checking the presure at least a couple times a month.
...you want to pay attention to the treadwear number. I think the Symmetrys I recently got have something like 720 for treadwear (a "400" would last twice as long as a "200").
Keep in mind though that the number is only good in comparing tires of from the same manufacturer. A 400 rated Michelin is not the same as a 400 Goodyear. Each manufacturer has it's own standard to measure against.
Perhaps you can shed some more light on this: I had heard each company has their "reference" stock of tires to base their wear numbers, but I thought the ratings were still somewhat comparable across brands. My understanding was that the agency that does this used to have a "100" rated reference stock, and that each manufacturer has to provide some justification/data indicating the validity of their own numbers with respect to this official reference stock. Is this not true?
I suppose it might be easier just to go by the warranty on the tires.
I hated the stock Symmetry tires so much I had to swap them within 500 miles of buying the Ody. I now have 16K on BFG Traction TAs they were a big improvement over Symmetry. They have more grip in the dry and wet. I actually turned some laps at the local race track this weekend in my Ody showing my students the lines. Based upon the current tire wear, they should last 40K. The Ody is an under steering pig on the track but better tires help.
I replaced the original Michelin Symmetry tires on my '01 Ody EX in the fall of '04 at 45K with Goodyear Aquatred 3. I've been very happy with them, especially in the wet weather. They're better than the Symmetry in the snow, too, but probably not as good as some others. I believe Goodyear has replaced them with the new Assurance line. I think they would be worth checking out.
The problems with the testing is that the testing is only based on a 7200 mile test and the treadwear is extrapolated - it's not until the tread is exhausted. Also, they are allowed to rotate, align, and check inflation every 800 miles - just like all of us do!! The testing isn't real world and the manufacturers are all
Lastly, the manufacturers conduct the tests - not NHTSA. Most tire dealers seem to take the number with a grain of salt.
I have BF Goodrich Traction T/As on my Chev Lumina and had not thought about putting them on my wife's Odyssey. The BFGs may be the best tires I've owned (quiet & good traction/handling) as well as wear. My only real complaint with the Michelins is the wear. I don't think I can blame Michelin for the understeering of the Odyssey.
It seems like from the feedback that I'm leaning toward the GoodYear Assurance Triple(something?) and the BF Goodrich Traction TA's. However, I heard that the Toyo have an amazing treadlife, but no one has commented on them.
Also, no one has mentioned handling on snow and ice--We get a lot of that here. Also, I'm a quick braker. So, braking handling is extremely important.
Any ideas on the treadwear life on the Goodyear?
That's pretty gutsy driving a mini on a race track. How fast did you get her up too? :surprise:
I have an older Previa that I don't drive that much so I went with the BF Goodrich from Costco mainly due to price. Very smooth and quiet ride and no problems in rain. A friend has the same van with the Michelin X's and his ride is not quite as smooth but has better handling and steering feel. Overall, the BF Goodrichs were good deal for the price, but if you want best tire, go for the Michelins. They recently won a magazine tire test. Don't know much about Cooper tires. Tire Rack has a lot of good tire info.
Actually turning laps in an Ody is pretty boring. It under steers so much and the steering is so numb that the harder you go the less fun you have with it. I had 2 other people in the van and I was supposed to be taking it easy so I didn't get over 80. I have a C6 to drive for fun.
BTW, if you want better handling get the V rated TAs; that is what I have. They have stiffer sidewalls.
When backing out of garage MIL came on simultaneously with TCS light. No previous history. Scanner says knock sensor circuit malfunction, Hoping it was a fluke I reset MIL and drove. Within 15 miles on highway the MIL light and TCS light again came on. After returning home scanned again with the same fault code -- knock sensor malfunction. The TCS light can be turned off by just cycling TCS switch. I've seen similar threads but none seem to indicate the final conclusion/fix. Thanks in advance!
I had this conversation with a neighbor. He didn't like my roof rails because they are not perfectly straight, which might cause problems with a Thule or Yakima hard carrier (availabe at most sporting goods stores & are not cheap). My local TV weatherman bought a soft carrier, which can be attached to any roof rack, and drove to Yellowstone, Banff & back with no problems. I just wouldn't trust it in the rain. Personally, I don't like the roof carrier for long trips--kills gas mpg. Let us know what you do.
I have a soft carrier but learned a lession about driving in the rain with it! Water finds its way thru seams at highway speeds. Since then, I put the luggage in black trash bags first, then into the soft pack.
Other item that is an issue is the lack of actual rooftop molding on the Ody. I used the softpack over the years on a Camry wagon, Grand Caravan, and Windstar, but never yet on the Ody. All had metal strips that protected the paint and gave some structural rigidity to the sheetmetal panel.
To use this type of carrier, you spread the rack crossbars to the extreme, and place the bag between them on the roof panel itself, strapping the bag to the siderails and crossbars. Without the panel strips, the roof might "oilcan" despite the stamped ribs, and would probably get scuffed even though the softpack has a felt underside.
I guess if I was planning a trip, I would consider buying some adheasive backed molding.
My Mich Symt tires have lasted as long as I can push them and I'm looking at replacements. However, I'm having some difficulty finding a 98T tire in the 225/60/16 size. I see a lot of people going for the Turanza (97T) and the Hydroedge (97T) and other tires. My question though, if you want to maintain a 98x, in many of these tires you have to go to a 235. Has anyone done that? I'm looking for a tire with good traction, good ride, quiet with a decent treadlife.
I tried the TTreads on my accord and ended up swapping them for the comforttreads..not the greatest tire but adequate. Anyway, I'm looking for input as I need to replace these pretty quickly and I'm sorta stuck.
Does anyone know how to remove the coin tray/drink holder? (2003 Ody but probably all the same) A important small document was sitting on mine and the tray was pushed in. Consequence.....important document either in back of or under coin tray.... Appreciate any input ....thanks george
I have had excellent luck using a soft carrier made by Kanga. It was the Typhoon model (I don't think it's still available). http://www.kangaco.com
Had a rubber mesh non-slip pad, and an unfolding cushioning mat that went in the bag. It is designed in such a way that properly zipped, no water can enter the bag. I used it on a couple of trips from ATL to Destin FLA (in the rain), and everything uptop was dry dry dry.
You have raised an interesting question. Until you asked this, I had never noticed the slight weight capacity difference possible within a given size. I went to the TireRack site and reviewed some of their tech documents to see if I could work some figures and make some extrapolations. BTW, they recommend not going below either the speed rating (sidewall stiffness - handling), or load rating when choosing replacement tires. At first I dismissed this as overly conservative, but after looking at numbers, I am beginning to see that the rather portly Odyssey presents a challenge to tires of this size.
I own two vehicles that use size 225/60R16. The Honda Ody came with Michelin Symmetry with a rating of 98T, while my Subaru Outback has Bridgestone Potenza RE92 with a rating of 97H. The speed rating implies greater sidewall stiffness on the H vs. the T. The weight rating of 98 (1653 lbs @ 44 psi) gives a 44 lb per tire load advantage over the 97 (1609 lbs @ 44psi).
I bought snows for both vehicles a few years ago (Dunlop WinterSports), all 8 have 98H rating, so I am OK there.
So is the 97 vs 98 an issue? Maybe....
If you look at the drivers door jam (B pillar), you will see that the GAWR (max per axle weight) is Front = 2833, Rear = 2845 lbs. That is your full van vacation load, or about 1250 lbs over the empty van weight. So 2 tires x 1609 = 3218 lbs, or 2 tires x 1653 = 3306 lbs, at first glance everything is OK. Problem is that Honda's recommendation is for inflation of 36 psi, not 44 psi where the weight limits are posted. From another chart that shows relationships between high speed driving, load ratings, & inflation pressure, it looks like that 8 lbs difference could easily account for a 20% reduction in weight limit. Again, back of the envelop math says that the 98T's max rating of 3306 could be reduced to 200 lbs below the recommended axle rating. A 97T ends up nearly 300 lbs below! Even if the reduction was only 15%, you are underrated. I guess maybe you could close the gap by upping the inflation pressure a lb or two, watching the weight, or slowing down?
Bottom line is that while small, it could become an issue if you carry a heavy load, tow, do high speed driving, or get even sloppy in maintaining the inflation pressure. The Odyssey looks to be really close to the safe limit for the tires it has. If you did the same math on my Subaru, starting out with the same size tires on a more svelt 3500 lb body & 1000 lb load limit, you have nearly 1000 lbs excess tire load capacity to play with. You could do almost anything and in theory get away with it.
Going up to a 235 mm cross-sectional tire would throw your speedo off and reduce acceleration very slightly, as circumference also rises about 4.25%. There would also be a question about clearance to the strut tower and inner fender to consider.
I have not really looked, but it sounds like you have. Could you post the tire models and the weight ratings you know of?
The tire I'm landing on is the Goodyear Comfortred 225/60/16 98H. They have a 97T but I opt'd for the H since it had a higher load rating. Of course I don't plan to use the "speed" portion of this.
The tires that I saw issues with due to the 97T were: Mich HydroEdge - 97T (does not come in a 98 unless you go to 235) Bridg Turanza - 97T (they do have a 98H but you drop to 50k on the mileage warranty) Goodyear Triple Tred - same thing on the 97T. Couldn't find a 98 load tire on their site anyway.
The problem I had mostly noticed was either you had to go up to an H and then lose miles on the warranty or there was no other option than the 97. That's why I think I'm pretty solid on the ComfortTred in a 98H.
I did ask about going to a 235 and I've heard it both ways - no problem or it raises the height of the van slightly which raises the center of gravity...throw in the math and you are slightly more tippy. It's probably negligable though.
Ok, I really appreciate these posts, and I as I am a tax man and no where close to being an engineer. Let me see if I get this straight.
According to my manual my 2003 Honda Ody EX requires 225-60R-16 -98T.
Based on reviews in Consumer reports and the Tire rack i was going to replace those tires with the GY assurance triple tred.
But if I understand this correctly, those tires only come in a 97. Since I have 4 kids and we often "load" the vehicle for family camping trips and road vacations is it right that I should not consider this tire and look for something that has either a 98T or 98H rating?
Such as the Yohohama Avid TRZ. Which they are substantialy cheaper than the GY. Should that scare me?
And now the plot thickens...twice yesterday I had someone tell me they had a 98H in the ComforTred and then when I checked back I found that wasn't the case. The Goodyear TripleTred and ComforTred both are 97T tires. And both places told me that a 97 would be ok. Not sure what to do now.
If they have them, I do not see any problem with going up to an H tire over the OEM T's. My Dunlop M2 winter tires are H, and frankly, I think they outperform the Symmetry's under most conditions. You get a slightly stiffer sidewall that stands up to friction/flex related heating better, along with a mild increase in handling response. The downside might be slightly decreased ride comfort, and shorter life.
A few years ago Consumer Reports predicted that if proposed tire quality standards were implemented, most tires below H would dissappear from the marketplace. They wouldn't pass the heat resistance (ply delamination, tread separation) tests.
BTW, I sent a note to TireRack asking for their thoughts on this question.
I emailed Connor and asked what he thought of the GY triple tread, the Yokohama's, and the bridgestones. I asked him about the bridgestones, since in the past he has recommended this tire for the Ody. He says:
Greetings and thank you for the opportunity to assist you, I would still recommend the Bridgestone Turanza LS-T as the best tire with the Yokohama TRZ second. Personally i would not recommend the Goodyear Tripletred for any type of van, SUV, or truck. The Bridgestone would offer the best overall ride quality as well as the best traction levels in dry, wet, and snow condition out of the three tire listed.
I went to Costco last night, to get a quote on the Michelin X Radial DT and as we were chatting he felt that the Bridgestone or even the Michelin HydroEdge was a better choice.
I am struggling with the fact that the Bridgestones "overall" score on CRs latest rankings falls on the bottom rung of "good". I appreciate any elses thoughts.
Has anyone had a problem with the spring breaking on their Odyssey? BOTH my springs broke and Honda replaced struts, springs, etc for a total of $2,100. Honda would only pay for $1,700 of the bill. They told me this is not common but its happening to the Acura MDX. I purchased van new in March of 2001. Van has 78,000 on it. If you live in a "Salt state" Michigan..etc. Get the springs checked. The rubber seal at the top of the strut comes off and the salt gets in and rusts....spring will fail! Spring could come apart and go thru your tire causing an accident!
HydroEdge P235/60R16 is a 99T (vs 98T) tire that has a diameter of 26.9" (vs 26.8" for 215/65), an insignificant difference as to speedometer readings. Wheel requirements 6.5-8.5 (vs 6.0-7.5), Max. load 1709@44psi (vs 1653). Eyeballing clearence - probably ok - but has anyone installed 235 section tire on the 99-04 Odyssey? Interesting - 2006 Odysssey has 235/65R16 tires.
Does anyone know how to remove the coin tray/drink holder? (2003 Ody but probably all the same) A important small document was sitting on mine and the tray was pushed in. Consequence.....important document either in back of or under coin tray.... Appreciate any input ....thanks george
I have talked with the tire rack, costco tire center, JustTires, read CR, and EVERYONE has different opinions on what is the best tire for the car *sigh*
CR and Tire rack survey rank the GY Triple assurance tred as top tire. But Connor at TireRAck says don't put this on a minivan.
Tire rack says the Bridgestones Turanza LS-H. However, these have a very low overall score on CR.
CR's #2 was the Michelin X Radial DT, Costco says the HydroEdge is a better tire I should do that one instead.
Then of course there is the Yokohamas Avid TRZ, which very high ranked but every tire shop says don't use.
I am at the point I will just put the four choices in a hat and whatever I pull out is what I go with for my 2003 Honda Odyssey. *rattle*
Am I just making too much of this *ranting and kicking*
I can relate. In fact, I made the same comment yesterday to someone. It was much easier to make the decision of which van and what trim level than which tires to use.
I talked to my honda dealership and they were pretty wishy washy but ended up saying that as a honda dealership, they couldn't recommend going with anything other than the OEM specs.
So what do the tire shops say about the Yokahama's? I was starting to look in that direction.
The Honda service tech gave me this 10 minute dissertation on how the Michelin Symmetry were made specificaly for the Odyssey, and I should look no other way.
My response: I showed him my tires, and said they should fire either Michelin or Honda's engineers and told him to look me in the face and see if he can recommend this tire based on the wear I have at 45,000 miles.
Suprisingly, he told me that they can order ANY tire I want and will price match.
I think the Yoko's are a very good and considerable less expensive, but am told they are a very soft tire and will wear rather quickly.
Would this problem affect those of us who lived briefly in a salt state (Ohio for the first 50,000 miles of the car's life) and the rest in a not-so-salty state? (Tennessee from 50K-87K)
I received a very nice call at home earlier this evening from Alex Mouroulis, a Performance Consultant at TireRack, along with an e-mail with details. He agreed that the van is on the heavy side for this class of tire, and that in some respects, an LT (truck) tire might have been a better OEM choice. He explained how the ratings are derived in more detail. I had never paid much attention to the presence or absence of the "P", and didn't realize that we were being thrown off by the results of two different grading organizations, or that the max load rates were measured at different pressures (and not at the max pressure). I have responded to his note looking for further clarification, but I think the bottom line is that the 97T is acceptable if you are careful. It has a slightly reduced margin, but as long as you keep the inflation pressure at 36 psi (or maybe slightly above if you are going to carry a heavy load), you should be OK.
I even went to TR's web site and punched in Honda / 2002 / Odyssey / T-U-H speed rating / all-season, touring & all-season performance and came up with a long list of 97T, 98T, 97H, 98H tires.
I'll post any follow-up response, but I think the load rating issue is resolved. So you have plenty of choice...
Steve
=====================
Steve,
I think the idiosyncrasies of tire rating systems may explain some of the discrepancies you've noticed. Euro-metric tires, like your original Symmetry are governed by ETRTO -European Tire and Rim Technical Organization. They state maximum load bearing capacity is achieved @ 36 PSI. Conversely P metric tires (P225..... Ect) are governed by TRA - Tire & Rim association achieve maximum load bearing capacity at 35 PSI. One could theorize that up to 35 PSI that both tire real load bearing capacity would be equal. However they are based on different graduation scales - so the rules say that is not true. The GVAW would be exceeded by 97T's in this case but if your intentions are to use the same specs Honda offered yielding the same load bearing requirement as your original tires- Euro metric would be the only equivalent. Now that I have explained the load achievement - its also should be noted that addional inflation pressure can be used to enhance stability, facilitate handling characteristics or reduce rolling resistance.
I hope this helps. Feel free to call me with further questions
Not sure if anyone out there is contemplating doing this, but I figured I would take up some bandwidth by relating how I spent most of a day off mid week. Call it 'quality time with my 2002 Honda Ody'!
I wanted to install the Honda Trailer Hitch Kit so that I could get a larger bike rack than I am currently using on my Subaru. I like the way the Honda hitch unit is built, and the negotiated price from my Dealer was in line with (what appear to be) lesser units from the aftermarket. I passed on the tranny & PS cooler, as I only want it for bikes. In fact, I wasn't even going to install the lighting module for this reason, but after having everything apart, I decided to go ahead and do it.
I discovered a few snags that cost me hours, so figured that I would document them for the next poor SOB that attempts this. I did this job solo. While do'able, it sure would have been great to have had an extra pair of hands for working the bumper cover, and the hitch (50+ lbs) into place. What I thought would be 2 hours took more like 5 or 6.
1) If you live in the rust belt, and your van is a few years old, anticipate a LOT of rust, in places that will matter. Don't even begin until you have check your tap & die kit, and in my case, find that it doesn't have the requisite 12x1.25mm tap. With everything in place, I found that the 6 main threaded holes were so corroded, that I couldn't even get the lead threads on the bolts to catch. After a trip out, it took me close to 2 hours of painstaking work to clean them up. Not much working room when lying on your back. The set under the exhaust required dropping the hangers and moving the pipe to allow access. Getting them started straight was the challenge. Lots of oil, quarter turn in, eight turn back out to clear the debris. Every three complete threads, back it out to wire brush and re-oil as the tap slots became throughly clogged. There was so much thread damage that I really doubted the bolts would have enough fresh steel to grab onto, yet they held torque. If I had to do it again, I might just drill them out and tap fresh with a larger diameter.
2) If the plastic is cold, use care removing the lights. The clip in the back does not give easily, and when it finally did, I lost some skin and a few drops of blood.... Oh, and watch those wires when you remove the weatherproof grommet and the connector. The one on the passengers side was under tension and pulled back thru the hole and into the body cavity. Took me a few minutes to fish it out again, and tape it securely.
3) Removal of the mud flaps requires either a right angle philips #1 (which I had), or jacking and removal of the wheels.
4) Under those mud flaps is a flat, black clip on the wheel lip (bumper to body) that does not give easily. One broke up and had to be drilled out.
5) I used jack stands to position the hitch in anticipation of bolting it into place. Getting the passengers side positioned takes some effort because of the exhaust. With two people it might have been easier. I had to drop an exhaust hanger in order to slide it up and in above the pipe. Again, check those bold holes first!!! Torque spec is 58 lbs. Easy to do accurately with a click wrench on the drivers side. Needed a universal on the 18mm socket (sheet says 19mm, but mine had 18mm heads), which makes it cumbersome to do right.
6) The plastic bumper cover cutout 'scribe lines' are near impossible to see, and are not the same as drawn in the instructions. Close, but I had to do a little extra fine trimming. Right & Left handed sheet metal tin snips work great. Much easier than a utility knife. And yes, both left and right sides need to be cut.
7) I was not going to do the wiring, but realized that if I ever decided to get the coolers and tow, it would be a lot of work that I would have to repeat dealing with the bumper. I cheated and did not remove the lower interior panel as shown. I found that the side panel gave enough free play to get my hands in, snake the wire thru, place the module, and make the connection. The only thing I could not do this way was to make the ground connection where they show. I found an alternate spot that worked just fine. Again, some scrapped skin and a few bruises, but less dissassembly.
8) The instructions are not terribly clear in how to route the wire thru the hole in the cover while simultaneously trying to get the cover back on. One of those times when a helper would be handy.
My Honda Odyssey is in the dealer getting the 3rd transmission replacement right now. the first one failed at 73k, second one at 133k, and the third at 165k. Honda is replacing this at no cost to me because I had to pay $1900 for the last one, so I had a 36k or 3 years warranty. That is a transmission for almost ever year that I own the van. UNBELIEVABLE!!!
How much did the new tranny cost you? i have an '02 with 57k miles...
as for the tires, i purchased michelin hydroedge tires last year for our odyssey and accord. tires are great all around performers - especially in snow. they have a 90k tread life warranty - their only drawback is that the create more road noise than the stock tires. for me, this is not a big deal
We have about same time....we got it Nov '01 and have about 55,000 miles. What signs of trouble did you first see? We have none so far but I'd like to keep a heads up...
I have 2000 Odyssey. I cannot open the tailgate, it unlocks electrically but from the back when I pull the handle it does not open. It appears that the rod inside the handle is either broken or detached.
Does anyone know how to open the lock manually from inside. I can see the lock mechanism from inside . I cannot figure out how to open it. Also how to open the inside panel.
None. The transmission just quit on the freeway. If there were warning signs, I missed them.
I was able to limp home and when I checked my transmission fluid, there was very little fluid in there even though I had the car serviced a few weeks earlier at a Honda dealer in Bowling Green, KY. So I'm not sure if the problem was caused by the KY Honda dealer's incompetence (I had the transmission put in by a different Honda dealer, one in Tennessee) or by the design of the transmission.
Whenever they recalled the transmission, I had the recall work done at a Honda dealer (different one from either the Bowling Green or Tennessee dealer) and the van worked flawlessly until it failed in November 2004.
As for opening the plastic panel, it should be no different than popping any other interior panel -- look for round plastic caps that hide screws (if any) and once all the screws are removed, you should be able to pop off the panel by wedging a screwdriver in a seam between the panel and the metal part of the door.
Many online Honda part stores have an exploded view of the components (tailgate panel) so maybe it would help you locate all the screws and clips. (or if you go to the dealer, the parts guy can show it to you on his screen) Let me know if you need help locating one of these drawings.
Hopefully once you pull back the panel, you'd see a broken/loose piece from the door handle...
I had to pull the interior panel off of mine when the entire latch mechanism literally fell apart on my '02. I posted about it back right around Christmas. Fortunately for me, I could open the door in this state. You are going to have a real problem with it being closed. On the underside on either side of the latch are two plastic pop screws that you may have to snap off. Remove the grab handle (two screws), and start by opening the two light access panels, work your hands in and begin pulling to pop the plastic fasteners. Best to do this after the sun has heated the plastic, otherwise you might crack something. I supplemented with a hair dryer.
When you get it fixed, be extra careful to route the lock rod into the clip as you reinstall the panel. Not difficult, but requires a little dexterity.
That's weird - looks like the site 'ate' my reply to you from yesterday. Short answer - wished I did take pics, but I was too mad at the situation to take the time to do so. Day before leaving for a 400 mile road trip.
Comments
Are you getting the mattress from Sam's or Costco?
I live in the Northeast USA. I need a tire that is safe, handles well, and has a good tread life. Do all 3 exist in a tire? I tend to be an agressive driver, but do not typically speed.
I've been told by various sources, including TireRack:
Toyo Spectrum
BF Goodrich Traction TA
Brisgestone Turanza LST
Goodyaer Eagle LS
Yoko AVID
Michelin Hydoedge
You can see why I'm confused. I've looked at reviews, but they vary with the type of car the owner has. I want your advice.
I have BF Goodrich Traction TAs on my wife's 99 Civic and it has worked out far better than the previous Good Year Allegras she had. (The BF Goodrich gave a smoother, quieter ride than the Allegras)
http://www.ehow.com/how_107557_choose-tires.html
All tires have this information on the sidewall. If you're looking for longer lasting tires, you want to pay attention to the treadwear number. I think the Symmetrys I recently got have something like 720 for treadwear (a "400" would last twice as long as a "200"). "Sticker" tires (for higher top speeds) generally have softer ride, but are more expensive and less durable. Unless you plan on taking your Ody on an autobahn, a "T" rated tire should be fine.
No problems w/ my Michelin Symmetries - got 60K out of my first set (Calif. driving 80% Hwy 20% city). Keep in mind all tires lose air gradually, so you want to be checking the presure at least a couple times a month.
'03 Ody EX
Keep in mind though that the number is only good in comparing tires of from the same manufacturer. A 400 rated Michelin is not the same as a 400 Goodyear. Each manufacturer has it's own standard to measure against.
Perhaps you can shed some more light on this:
I had heard each company has their "reference" stock of tires to base their wear numbers, but I thought the ratings were still somewhat comparable across brands. My understanding was that the agency that does this used to have a "100" rated reference stock, and that each manufacturer has to provide some justification/data indicating the validity of their own numbers with respect to this official reference stock. Is this not true?
I suppose it might be easier just to go by the warranty on the tires.
'03 Ody EX
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiretech/techpage.jsp?techid=48¤tpage=40
The problems with the testing is that the testing is only based on a 7200 mile test and the treadwear is extrapolated - it's not until the tread is exhausted. Also, they are allowed to rotate, align, and check inflation every 800 miles - just like all of us do!!
Lastly, the manufacturers conduct the tests - not NHTSA. Most tire dealers seem to take the number with a grain of salt.
However, I heard that the Toyo have an amazing treadlife, but no one has commented on them.
Also, no one has mentioned handling on snow and ice--We get a lot of that here. Also, I'm a quick braker. So, braking handling is extremely important.
Any ideas on the treadwear life on the Goodyear?
That's pretty gutsy driving a mini on a race track. How fast did you get her up too? :surprise:
BTW, if you want better handling get the V rated TAs; that is what I have. They have stiffer sidewalls.
Here's a sample pic of the OBD cable, Left connector:
http://www.obd2cables.com/products/images/OBDII-TypeB_quality-30.jpg
Here's a sample pic of an OBDII connector in a car:
http://www.kovo314.szm.sk/index_soubory/autoelektro/OBDII.jpg
I tried to find an Ody pic but they are all pretty much the same.
Hope that helps.
I've seen similar threads but none seem to indicate the final conclusion/fix.
Thanks in advance!
Other item that is an issue is the lack of actual rooftop molding on the Ody. I used the softpack over the years on a Camry wagon, Grand Caravan, and Windstar, but never yet on the Ody. All had metal strips that protected the paint and gave some structural rigidity to the sheetmetal panel.
To use this type of carrier, you spread the rack crossbars to the extreme, and place the bag between them on the roof panel itself, strapping the bag to the siderails and crossbars. Without the panel strips, the roof might "oilcan" despite the stamped ribs, and would probably get scuffed even though the softpack has a felt underside.
I guess if I was planning a trip, I would consider buying some adheasive backed molding.
Steve
I tried the TTreads on my accord and ended up swapping them for the comforttreads..not the greatest tire but adequate. Anyway, I'm looking for input as I need to replace these pretty quickly and I'm sorta stuck.
Thanks
(2003 Ody but probably all the same)
A important small document was sitting on mine and the tray was pushed in. Consequence.....important document either in back of or under coin tray.... Appreciate any input ....thanks george
http://www.kangaco.com
Had a rubber mesh non-slip pad, and an unfolding cushioning mat that went in the bag. It is designed in such a way that properly zipped, no water can enter the bag. I used it on a couple of trips from ATL to Destin FLA (in the rain), and everything uptop was dry dry dry.
Apparently Thule makes some models as well.
The local Honda dealer, on their Odyssey shuttle, has Good Year Assurance tires I think, but I'm not sure.
You have raised an interesting question. Until you asked this, I had never noticed the slight weight capacity difference possible within a given size. I went to the TireRack site and reviewed some of their tech documents to see if I could work some figures and make some extrapolations. BTW, they recommend not going below either the speed rating (sidewall stiffness - handling), or load rating when choosing replacement tires. At first I dismissed this as overly conservative, but after looking at numbers, I am beginning to see that the rather portly Odyssey presents a challenge to tires of this size.
I own two vehicles that use size 225/60R16. The Honda Ody came with Michelin Symmetry with a rating of 98T, while my Subaru Outback has Bridgestone Potenza RE92 with a rating of 97H. The speed rating implies greater sidewall stiffness on the H vs. the T. The weight rating of 98 (1653 lbs @ 44 psi) gives a 44 lb per tire load advantage over the 97 (1609 lbs @ 44psi).
I bought snows for both vehicles a few years ago (Dunlop WinterSports), all 8 have 98H rating, so I am OK there.
So is the 97 vs 98 an issue? Maybe....
If you look at the drivers door jam (B pillar), you will see that the GAWR (max per axle weight) is Front = 2833, Rear = 2845 lbs. That is your full van vacation load, or about 1250 lbs over the empty van weight. So 2 tires x 1609 = 3218 lbs, or 2 tires x 1653 = 3306 lbs, at first glance everything is OK. Problem is that Honda's recommendation is for inflation of 36 psi, not 44 psi where the weight limits are posted. From another chart that shows relationships between high speed driving, load ratings, & inflation pressure, it looks like that 8 lbs difference could easily account for a 20% reduction in weight limit. Again, back of the envelop math says that the 98T's max rating of 3306 could be reduced to 200 lbs below the recommended axle rating. A 97T ends up nearly 300 lbs below! Even if the reduction was only 15%, you are underrated. I guess maybe you could close the gap by upping the inflation pressure a lb or two, watching the weight, or slowing down?
Bottom line is that while small, it could become an issue if you carry a heavy load, tow, do high speed driving, or get even sloppy in maintaining the inflation pressure. The Odyssey looks to be really close to the safe limit for the tires it has. If you did the same math on my Subaru, starting out with the same size tires on a more svelt 3500 lb body & 1000 lb load limit, you have nearly 1000 lbs excess tire load capacity to play with. You could do almost anything and in theory get away with it.
Going up to a 235 mm cross-sectional tire would throw your speedo off and reduce acceleration very slightly, as circumference also rises about 4.25%. There would also be a question about clearance to the strut tower and inner fender to consider.
I have not really looked, but it sounds like you have. Could you post the tire models and the weight ratings you know of?
Steve
The tires that I saw issues with due to the 97T were:
Mich HydroEdge - 97T (does not come in a 98 unless you go to 235)
Bridg Turanza - 97T (they do have a 98H but you drop to 50k on the mileage warranty)
Goodyear Triple Tred - same thing on the 97T. Couldn't find a 98 load tire on their site anyway.
The problem I had mostly noticed was either you had to go up to an H and then lose miles on the warranty or there was no other option than the 97. That's why I think I'm pretty solid on the ComfortTred in a 98H.
I did ask about going to a 235 and I've heard it both ways - no problem or it raises the height of the van slightly which raises the center of gravity...throw in the math and you are slightly more tippy. It's probably negligable though.
According to my manual my 2003 Honda Ody EX requires 225-60R-16 -98T.
Based on reviews in Consumer reports and the Tire rack i was going to replace those tires with the GY assurance triple tred.
But if I understand this correctly, those tires only come in a 97. Since I have 4 kids and we often "load" the vehicle for family camping trips and road vacations is it right that I should not consider this tire and look for something that has either a 98T or 98H rating?
Such as the Yohohama Avid TRZ. Which they are substantialy cheaper than the GY. Should that scare me?
A few years ago Consumer Reports predicted that if proposed tire quality standards were implemented, most tires below H would dissappear from the marketplace. They wouldn't pass the heat resistance (ply delamination, tread separation) tests.
BTW, I sent a note to TireRack asking for their thoughts on this question.
Steve
Greetings and thank you for the opportunity to assist you,
I would still recommend the Bridgestone Turanza LS-T as the best tire with the Yokohama TRZ second. Personally i would not recommend the Goodyear Tripletred for any type of van, SUV, or truck. The Bridgestone would offer the best overall ride quality as well as the best traction levels in dry, wet, and snow condition out of the three tire listed.
I went to Costco last night, to get a quote on the Michelin X Radial DT and as we were chatting he felt that the Bridgestone or even the Michelin HydroEdge was a better choice.
I am struggling with the fact that the Bridgestones "overall" score on CRs latest rankings falls on the bottom rung of "good". I appreciate any elses thoughts.
(2003 Ody but probably all the same)
A important small document was sitting on mine and the tray was pushed in. Consequence.....important document either in back of or under coin tray.... Appreciate any input ....thanks george
CR and Tire rack survey rank the GY Triple assurance tred as top tire. But Connor at TireRAck says don't put this on a minivan.
Tire rack says the Bridgestones Turanza LS-H. However, these have a very low overall score on CR.
CR's #2 was the Michelin X Radial DT, Costco says the HydroEdge is a better tire I should do that one instead.
Then of course there is the Yokohamas Avid TRZ, which very high ranked but every tire shop says don't use.
I am at the point I will just put the four choices in a hat and whatever I pull out is what I go with for my 2003 Honda Odyssey. *rattle*
Am I just making too much of this *ranting and kicking*
I talked to my honda dealership and they were pretty wishy washy but ended up saying that as a honda dealership, they couldn't recommend going with anything other than the OEM specs.
So what do the tire shops say about the Yokahama's? I was starting to look in that direction.
My response: I showed him my tires, and said they should fire either Michelin or Honda's engineers and told him to look me in the face and see if he can recommend this tire based on the wear I have at 45,000 miles.
Suprisingly, he told me that they can order ANY tire I want and will price match.
I think the Yoko's are a very good and considerable less expensive, but am told they are a very soft tire and will wear rather quickly.
I even went to TR's web site and punched in Honda / 2002 / Odyssey / T-U-H speed rating / all-season, touring & all-season performance and came up with a long list of 97T, 98T, 97H, 98H tires.
I'll post any follow-up response, but I think the load rating issue is resolved. So you have plenty of choice...
Steve
=====================
Steve,
I think the idiosyncrasies of tire rating systems may explain some of the discrepancies you've noticed. Euro-metric tires, like your original Symmetry are governed by ETRTO -European Tire and Rim Technical Organization. They state maximum load bearing capacity is achieved @ 36 PSI. Conversely P metric tires (P225..... Ect) are governed by TRA - Tire & Rim association achieve maximum load bearing capacity at 35 PSI. One could theorize that up to 35 PSI that both tire real load bearing capacity would be equal. However they are based on different graduation scales - so the rules say that is not true. The GVAW would be exceeded by 97T's in this case but if your intentions are to use the same specs Honda offered yielding the same load bearing requirement as your original tires- Euro metric would be the only equivalent. Now that I have explained the load achievement - its also should be noted that addional inflation pressure can be used to enhance stability, facilitate handling characteristics or reduce rolling resistance.
I hope this helps. Feel free to call me with further questions
Alex Mouroulis | Performance Consultant
Not sure if anyone out there is contemplating doing this, but I figured I would take up some bandwidth by relating how I spent most of a day off mid week. Call it 'quality time with my 2002 Honda Ody'!
I wanted to install the Honda Trailer Hitch Kit so that I could get a larger bike rack than I am currently using on my Subaru. I like the way the Honda hitch unit is built, and the negotiated price from my Dealer was in line with (what appear to be) lesser units from the aftermarket. I passed on the tranny & PS cooler, as I only want it for bikes. In fact, I wasn't even going to install the lighting module for this reason, but after having everything apart, I decided to go ahead and do it.
I discovered a few snags that cost me hours, so figured that I would document them for the next poor SOB that attempts this. I did this job solo. While do'able, it sure would have been great to have had an extra pair of hands for working the bumper cover, and the hitch (50+ lbs) into place. What I thought would be 2 hours took more like 5 or 6.
1) If you live in the rust belt, and your van is a few years old, anticipate a LOT of rust, in places that will matter. Don't even begin until you have check your tap & die kit, and in my case, find that it doesn't have the requisite 12x1.25mm tap. With everything in place, I found that the 6 main threaded holes were so corroded, that I couldn't even get the lead threads on the bolts to catch. After a trip out, it took me close to 2 hours of painstaking work to clean them up. Not much working room when lying on your back. The set under the exhaust required dropping the hangers and moving the pipe to allow access. Getting them started straight was the challenge. Lots of oil, quarter turn in, eight turn back out to clear the debris. Every three complete threads, back it out to wire brush and re-oil as the tap slots became throughly clogged. There was so much thread damage that I really doubted the bolts would have enough fresh steel to grab onto, yet they held torque. If I had to do it again, I might just drill them out and tap fresh with a larger diameter.
2) If the plastic is cold, use care removing the lights. The clip in the back does not give easily, and when it finally did, I lost some skin and a few drops of blood.... Oh, and watch those wires when you remove the weatherproof grommet and the connector. The one on the passengers side was under tension and pulled back thru the hole and into the body cavity. Took me a few minutes to fish it out again, and tape it securely.
3) Removal of the mud flaps requires either a right angle philips #1 (which I had), or jacking and removal of the wheels.
4) Under those mud flaps is a flat, black clip on the wheel lip (bumper to body) that does not give easily. One broke up and had to be drilled out.
5) I used jack stands to position the hitch in anticipation of bolting it into place. Getting the passengers side positioned takes some effort because of the exhaust. With two people it might have been easier. I had to drop an exhaust hanger in order to slide it up and in above the pipe. Again, check those bold holes first!!! Torque spec is 58 lbs. Easy to do accurately with a click wrench on the drivers side. Needed a universal on the 18mm socket (sheet says 19mm, but mine had 18mm heads), which makes it cumbersome to do right.
6) The plastic bumper cover cutout 'scribe lines' are near impossible to see, and are not the same as drawn in the instructions. Close, but I had to do a little extra fine trimming. Right & Left handed sheet metal tin snips work great. Much easier than a utility knife. And yes, both left and right sides need to be cut.
7) I was not going to do the wiring, but realized that if I ever decided to get the coolers and tow, it would be a lot of work that I would have to repeat dealing with the bumper. I cheated and did not remove the lower interior panel as shown. I found that the side panel gave enough free play to get my hands in, snake the wire thru, place the module, and make the connection. The only thing I could not do this way was to make the ground connection where they show. I found an alternate spot that worked just fine. Again, some scrapped skin and a few bruises, but less dissassembly.
8) The instructions are not terribly clear in how to route the wire thru the hole in the cover while simultaneously trying to get the cover back on. One of those times when a helper would be handy.
Hope these tips help someone!
Steve
I had a new tranny at 72K, and it's been fine since then minus some $500 repairs every few thousand miles.
as for the tires, i purchased michelin hydroedge tires last year for our odyssey and accord. tires are great all around performers - especially in snow. they have a 90k tread life warranty - their only drawback is that the create more road noise than the stock tires. for me, this is not a big deal
I have one of the early 02's though (produced Dec 2001). I have a friend with a late production 02 who has had exactly 0 problems.
It appears that the rod inside the handle is either broken or detached.
Does anyone know how to open the lock manually from inside.
I can see the lock mechanism from inside . I cannot figure out how to open it. Also how to open the inside panel.
Thanks
ABP
I was able to limp home and when I checked my transmission fluid, there was very little fluid in there even though I had the car serviced a few weeks earlier at a Honda dealer in Bowling Green, KY. So I'm not sure if the problem was caused by the KY Honda dealer's incompetence (I had the transmission put in by a different Honda dealer, one in Tennessee) or by the design of the transmission.
Whenever they recalled the transmission, I had the recall work done at a Honda dealer (different one from either the Bowling Green or Tennessee dealer) and the van worked flawlessly until it failed in November 2004.
Many online Honda part stores have an exploded view of the components (tailgate panel) so maybe it would help you locate all the screws and clips. (or if you go to the dealer, the parts guy can show it to you on his screen) Let me know if you need help locating one of these drawings.
Hopefully once you pull back the panel, you'd see a broken/loose piece from the door handle...
Good luck
'03 Ody EX
When you get it fixed, be extra careful to route the lock rod into the clip as you reinstall the panel. Not difficult, but requires a little dexterity.
Steve
Steve