Toyota Tacoma vs. Ford Ranger, Part XII

saddaddy · April 2002

Just to keep the peace, lets keep our heads on straight.

midnight_stang · April 2002

Well that info comes from a coworker who drives a Tacoma 4x4 extended cab. I also found a link that states "The owners manual warns the user that when using the locker, speed should not exceed 5 mph" Maybe he misquoted the book as well.

http://www.mtdemocrat.com/archives/auto/prerunner032599.shtml

saddaddy · April 2002

what you said, Stang, may well be true. I haven't read the sticker on my door lately. But if it does say that, its just an insurance policy for Toyota. It is conceivable that some idiot engages the locker while on the pavement and tries to drive down the road with it. When they try to swerve or something very quickly, they lose control. Toyota then gets sued for not having a warning when its the idiots fault. Thats why it might say that.

eagle63 · April 2002

I guess I don't really understand why anyone would WANT to have any locker engaged at much more than 5 or 10 MPH.

midnight_stang · April 2002

Didn't someone say here on a previous chapter of Tacoma vs Ranger that the locker would automatically disengage itself after a certain speed was reached anyways?

I do remember doing a little off roading in my old college roomate's wrangler, and we were rarely under 5 MPH(at least the tires weren't at that speed). Sure on some tricky stuff it did get down to 5 MPH just to make sure we didn't break something, but it just seems kinda like a hassle to have to engage it 5-10 times every hour or so, and only use it at a certain speed.

But I'm not really an off-road guy anyways, so... except maybe on a mountain bike.

saddaddy · April 2002

Hehe, j/k. First off, the locker will NOT disengage itself at any speed. If you are going too fast it will refuse to engage to begin with, but once locked, it stays that way.

The way I do it, when im approaching something sticky, I push the button. The light on the dash blinks meaning that it isn't locked yet (if im going too fast). When I get in the mud hole and a wheel slips the least bit, it locks and the light stays on = more "gription." Usually the mud slows me down enough so that i don't have to worry about decellerating to under about 8mph (thats about where mine engages, not all the way to 5). That is just in mud, though. Guys who do alot of crawling are usually going really slow as it is. They push the button and they're locked - simple as that. There is no hassle in pushing a button that you don't even have to look for. Push the button, and IF it doesn't engage right away, it will engage as soon as any slippage occurs. The speed limitations NEVER interfere with the usage and handiness of the locker, in all honesty.

tbunder · April 2002

the goodyears coming on rangers will last a lot longer than any bfg coming on a tacoma. my dad had an f150 that got 80K on wrangler rt/s.

and the fx4's bfg lt rated tires aren't cheap. however, your $50 a tire bfg rugged trails are.

a locker doesn't work for everyone, however, a lsd works for anyone at anytime, automatically too. nice try.

saddaddy · April 2002

Especially not people that buy a truck that says "off road" on the side for the purpose it is supposedly made for. I know a guy that comes on the Tacoma boards alot and owns a FX4. Nice truck. He bragged about the lsd just like you for exactly the same reasons. But guess what his next $500 is going towards -- you guessed, it a real locker. That is because he actually uses his truck for what Ford claims it is capable of, off roading. Don't get me wrong, if I had a 2x that stayed on the road on the hiway all the time, I would be singing the same tune as you. But who can justify manufacturing an off road package with anything but a locker these days. Oh wait, Ford doesn't care about being better, just as long as they can sell more trucks, right. I forgot.

Just so I don't come across wrong, Im not saying that all tacomas are better or that lockers are always better. But on a truck that says "off road" on the quarter panel, how can you say that off road performance should be compromised so that you can beat someone off the line at a red light or go 10 miles an hour faster on a wet twisty road. Not happening. Just for the record, do you understand where I am coming from?

sc0rpi0 · April 2002

You said it yourself: you needed better tires than the crap Ford supplied and a locker in order for Ranger to get top honors. If 265s BFGs that Toyota puts on are so bad, why doesn't Ranger rule offroad?
As for FX4: so what? You are buying a truck thats specifically made with offroaders in mind. And it's not the cheapest truck in Fords collection, but rather the most expensive Ranger that comes close to Tacoma prices (and maybe costing more). Tires are easy to get. Rear axle with a locker is not.

plutonious · April 2002

Tacoma TRD is renowned for its killer suspension. A lot of hard science goes into making a good suspension, and I doubt simply upgrading the shock absorbers on the Ranger is going to making it perform as well as the Tacoma TRD.

midnight_stang · April 2002

That would be assuming there is no "hard science" put into the Ranger suspension. Alot of praise go towards the Rangers (and Tacomas) on-road handling, control, and suspension. Off-road probably depends on your style or skill more than anything. Like I ride a fully rigid mountain bike where others have a front and rear suspension (shock absorbers). I can't jump and land as drastically, but I sure can transfer all my power to the wheels easier.

I wonder why the TRD offroad package only adds Bilstein shocks, tires, rims, and a locker to the mix then? Maybe a base Tacoma has the same suspension?

saddaddy · April 2002

base Tacomas do have pretty much the same suspension design. They are praised for it too. I know nothing about Ranger suspension really, aside from the presence of the god forsaken torsion bars. Toyotas usage of coilovers is just an example of some of the ways they like to use better performing setups despite added cost.

eagle63 · April 2002

doesn't the TRD package also add progressive springs?

saddaddy · April 2002

forgot about that eagle, thanx for the addition.

issisteelman · May 2002

I don't agree that the TRD suspension is the same as the base Tacoma suspension. My friend has a TRD and he can put a larger payload in his pick up than I can. When I really load up my pick up, the rear end really sags quite a bit. But when he puts a similar load in his pick up, you don't even see a sag in the rear end. As such, I believe that the TRD upgrade includes both a locking rear differential and a much stronger suspension system.

Just my thoughts. In any case, a Tacoma is a better truck than a Ranger, regardless of the package you purchase.........Steelman.

midnight_stang · May 2002

I'm not saying that is bad or anything... Just trying to keep the conversation going, in an sensible, non-biased way.

tbunder · May 2002

if the tacoma is so much better of a truck, just one question for you. and this is the one i just can't figure out. why don't they come close to rangers in sales? i mean, if they're THAT much better, you'd think the public would realize such, and put them ahead of the ranger in sales. and dont give me that mc donalds crap or other hamburger spiel that scorpio and pluto always resort to. its just a simple question. can you answer it? i mean, we're a free society and people can buy what they want. can you explain why people prefer a ford truck over a toyota truck more often? i mean, after all, if toyota is so much better, you'd think that the buyers would see this and buy tacomas. dont get all pissed or anything, i just want a solid answer. and also maybe some proof that backs up that the tacoma is actually better. and i dont mean some magazine quote either. the real world is what matters. if toyota is such a superior truck to the fords, why aren't there as many toyota trucks on the road still as there are fords?

leomort · May 2002

I think it's mainly do to with price.

Leo

sc0rpi0 · May 2002

Several reasons that I can think of:
1. There's a portion of population that still believes in "Made in U.S. of A", disregarding the fact that many parts come from Mexico.
2. There's a portion of population that prefers to buy the cheapest things. You decide whether or not it's a good thing.
3. Just because you disregard the McDonalds analogy, does not mean it is not true. McDs food is bad for you, it's crap. But it's cheap, and it's right around the corner. Why? Beats me, but I prefer to eat at Subway when I'm grabbing a lunch on the go, or oriental fast food (despite the name, it's basically rice with meat and veggies). It's a lot better for you, while maybe being $1-$3 more expensive.
5. There's more Ford dealerships than Toyota: 5 to 3 in Austin.
6. Toyota does not produce that many vehicles. You don't see Toyota dealers sitting around thinking "How in a hell am I going to get rid of all these Tacomas". Toyota sells the trucks they make. I agree that it's artificial demand, but it seems to work.
7. And finally (which pretty much encorporates #2 and #3): large portion of population is stupid enough to buy things without doing research first. Just because your grandpa swore by his 1950 Ford does not mean that 2002 Ford is as good. Just because that ruben guy (who wrote hickbonics) swore by "them Chevys that been hauling tobacco for 20 years" does not mean that 2002 Silverado will go on for 20 years. Times have changed and vehicles have changed too.

issisteelman · May 2002

Just read the post above this one. Scorpio has hit the nail on the head.

I prefer quality when I purchase items, particularly vehicles because I keep them for a long time (4 years minimum). I could have bought the Ranger and saved 1 or 2K, but I wanted a reliable, long lasting truck. Hence, I bought the Tacoma. Simple, isn't it?

Take care, and thanks for saving me a lot of time Scorpio..........Steelman.

saddaddy · May 2002

(this is addressed to everyone), all of those points scorpio listed are linked to one another is some way or another. I feel like it all goes back to the fact that Toyota is young in the US and can't sell to the hardheads.

Ummm, I will say this: most of the time in vehicles, when there is so much price difference between two competing models, there often is much more of a difference in quality and performance than there is between the taco and ranger. Ranger is definitely a good value and not a bad vehicle by any stretch of the imagination. For those who want to pinch the life out of pennies, it is the BEST value, quite possibly. I happen be one of the ones that believes that the extra money is more than worth it. Of course, Im sure that is obvious by now.

midnight_stang · May 2002

On Edmunds.com, the True Market Value of both vehicles.

Ranger: 12,839 - $23,508
Tacoma: 11,753 - $20,931

For a vehicle that offers so much quality and off-road prowress, and is cheaper, why again?

But this doesn't really count for all the options Toyota wants to sell you at a HIGH premium. But still the price difference has been argued many times here before, and what's the biggest difference? 0-2000 bucks I believe, in either direction.

When purchasing a vehicle, that is only a small portion of the final price.

So if the Tacoma is so much better in quality, about the same in price(little better or a little worse), then why can't it move more vehicles? Brand loyalty doesn't mean much. How many people are loyal to McDonalds? More likely it's just convienent, cheap, or something to get the kids to be quiet.

Scorpio's post does make a great attempt at making an argument, albeit one backed by no cold hard facts. However it is still one man's opinion, and not backed by any facts.

Would it be prudent to say that educated people are more likely to make educated choices? Would it also be prudent to say that educated people are more likely to have the money (or salary) to afford new vehicles? If so, then it is also prudent to say that most new vehicle buyers are more likely to purchase vehicles and making an educated choice.

The fact is more consumers choose Ranger. The opinion of some is that this is because they are so cheap (as if 15-20 grand is cheap).

So my point is that if the Tacoma was the obsolute best compact truck (As issteelman keeps on insisting), then what is another 1 or 2 grand (or less) for the best that you can get?

Apparantly the general public doesn't think so, and I weight their opinion over any (Tacoma) truck drivers on this site.

Let me conclude by saying the Tacoma is a recommended truck. The Ranger is the best value in a compact truck. Just don't downplay the other because you don't drive one.

sc0rpi0 · May 2002

An existance of links between each and every other one of those points was my intent. It was up to everyone else to see it.

saddaddy · May 2002

You gave the question, why can't Yota move more trucks?
Im not sure that they couldn't. They just refuse not to. It takes an act of Congress to get a dealer to order a truck or even look for one at another lot. Kinda like tbunder says with Ford. Yota would rather just sell their quota (lower than the competition though it may be). If you don't want what they have on the lot, someone else will come by soon that does. Thats just my take, it might not be totally accurate.

sc0rpi0 · May 2002

Depends on who you ask. Compact trucks are affordable, anyone can buy them, but 1-2K will mean a lot to Smiths who have a 30K/year budget (right around average, for example) than to Joneses who have a 90K budget. I was carefully selecting everything I wanted, playing around with options and numbers, until I got down to a reasonable price for my truck, because, even though I do make a lot more than TX/nation average, I don't want to spend any more than I have to. And I could not bring myself to buy a Ranger for several reasons:
1. Made by Ford, USA. I don't trust American-made vehicles (recall record is one indication).
2. I can't stand the looks, they've only just now started making Rangers look reasonable, IMHO.
3. This is a matter of "social status" for me, more or less. Call me superficial, so what. I don't want riding around in a vehicle that every Mexican drives in TX. I didn't get 2 university degrees for that (and no, tbunder, it was not some community college, but a state university).

saddaddy · May 2002

its posers like you driving around in TRDs that give the truck a bad name. Shame on you. Haha!

midnight_stang · May 2002

saddaddy--->So you are saying Toyota only makes as much as they want to sell, right? If any consumer product is produced to make a profit, why would a company not want to sell more product?

Let me propose a scenario. Consumer demand for vehicle A = X. Would the manufacturer produce 2X? No, the manufacturer would do their best to produce exactly X, thus keeping unpurchased quantities on hand from over supplying the demand. If vehicle A sits around for a year, it must be discounted because there is a brand new vehicle A available. Why pay the same for something older?

If product supply exceeds product demand, product cost( and profit) can not go up. If demand meets or exceeds supply, the price can go up. Up to a point where supply is still greater than demand, but profit margins are much higher.

All this is besides the point. Ford sells more vehicles. Demand is high. Making vehicles is all supply side. If Ford makes more vehicles than demand wants, then they aren't making as much profit as they could. They are flooding the market. You can't judge a vehicle because of it's amount of supply, but you can just what the consumer wants based upon it's demand (sales figures).

You can say that Toyota produces just enough Tacomas as they want (or can) sell. That is good business practice. I honestly haven't compared any Ranger sales vs production figures, so I can't comment on that. I will bet that the figures are closer with the Tacoma.

Scorpio--->Jonses and Smiths huh? Well you list some perfectly valid reasons why you choose a Tacoma. Your reasons are yours, and I'd bet some or all of them are shared by others. However, for each one like you, there are 3 or 4 others (I forget the actual figure off hand) who think in favor of the Ranger. Poor smiths will have to buy used, but looks like the Jonses (or equivalents) are more likely to buy a Ranger. I wonder why? If the people more likely to buy new vehicles, and more new vehicles called Rangers are sold, I guess the dumb, confused, and brand loyalty biased make more money. That sounds like a silly comment to make.

plutonious · May 2002

why are none of their models best-sellers worldwide? Seems like the only demand for them is in America.

Scorpio, lol, I liked your comments about Texas and who drives what. I don't understand the Mexicans in Texas either. It amazes me how many people in Mexico City speak English, but in South Texas, in AMERICA, they can't! These are usually the same folks with a Mexican flag on their Ford. I've always said that if you took the worst of Mexico and the worst of America and mixed it all in one spot, you'd get South Texas.

lariat1 · May 2002

Isnt the F-150 the best selling vehicle in the world?

sc0rpi0 · May 2002

is a bad idea. Sure, it works in good economy times...but when economical situation goes bad, companies will end up with extra inventory (and a lot of it) on their hands. This is potentially what happened to Ford: it got into this war with 0% late last year, and sales kept dropping. Where does all that surplus go? Nowhere.

daddy: Yeah, I'm a pooser

I need to get myself a Ford Excursion so I can take frequent trips to the mall.

stang: There'll always be people who believe that buying the best is a better way to avoid headaches later. Ranger itself may look like a nice truck on paper, but when I see at the whole company picture, I see cars being released before they are finished. Escape: 5-7 recalls first year. FX4: mall-warriors blowing lockers and having to take it in for rear axle replacement. List goes on and on. I don't like that....maybe Ford got "lucky" with Ranger in that it does not have as many recalls, but the whole track record looks bad.

pluto: I don't like to go into the whole "foreigher" thing. I don't get people who refuse to speak the language of the country they are living in. They ought to be put on a bus and taken across the border back to their country.

sc0rpi0 · May 2002

F150 is the best-selling vehicle in the world because its only sold in America in large numbers. It's not sold in Europe or Middle East, I think. I could be wrong though.

saddaddy · May 2002

stang-----> "saddaddy--->So you are saying Toyota only makes as much as they want to sell, right? If any consumer product is produced to make a profit, why would a company not want to sell more product?"

Well, for the same reason that Ford only wants to outsell the competition and care nothing about outperforming them in areas where trucks are meant to perform, like offroad. That is a page right out of your and tbunder's books. You don't understand why Toyota doesn't want to sell more, and I don't understand why Ford doesn't have a locker and a true off road package in the Ranger.

Scorp: Yeah, you're not the one with a wimpy prerunner

Lariat: Would the F-150 still be the best selling if GMC Sierra and Chevy Silverado sales numbers were added? They are the same truck, and only separated so that every GM dealership can carry a pickup truck. See if you can dig up some numbers that say that F-150 outsells GM fullsize trucks. Im not sure if they exist or not???

scape2 · May 2002

The TRD package is a joke.. You guys fell for it..
A locker is only good for straight away traction.. Try making a hard turn and see what happens to the locker. A locker is only good in severe terrain.. How many people will use the locker for the terrain it was actually intended for? How much percentage of driving will you use the locker? Maybe 2%? A locker is very limited and cannot be used for everyday use. The TRD axle is normally an OPEN axle...
Limited slips are more useful to the everyday user. They help pull, tow, haul.. Lockers can't..
Steelman.. I have over 60,000 miles on my unreliable Ford Ranger that has NEVER broken down! I paid 3K less than a Tacoma.. gee whos ahead??

plutonious · May 2002

Just wait till you sell and you get a hands-on lesson in DEPRECIATION!!!

BTW, let me know when the automotive community discovers the Ranger outperforms the Tacoma TRD on the trails (or roads, for that matter)...I'll be waiting...YAWN.

One other thing - your LSD's clutches will wear out in time and will perform just like an open diff - but without the locker. Sounds like a winning off-road combination, huh?

The locker isn't the only reason people buy the TRD, either.

midnight_stang · May 2002

" trucks are meant to perform, like offroad. That is a page right out of your and tbunder's books."

You forget an exchange you and I had (I think it was you) in which I stated I don't offroad, and prefer to see the outdoors as they were meant to be. On my own two feet. I'll take a backpack and walk for a week, camp out under the stars, and hopefully make it back to the truck in one piece. (GPS is the way to go). Offroading trucks for sport? or is it just a testosterone hobby? Or maybe I can pull a scorpio/pluto and make a redneck comparison.

I really don't care too much about off-roading. If you do, that's cool, have fun. If I catch someone tearing up any of my property, you will be shot at. If you take trails and other 4x4 designated areas, even better! I hope you tread lightly, take nothing but pictures, and leave nothing but foot/tireprints.

Also you can't force people to buy products. If I sit on a corner, with 1,000 widgits can I force people to buy them? No. People only buy enough widgits as they want. If I produce more, the same amount of widgits are sold, more or less, according to the demand now. Maybe people no longer like widgits? Maybe friends have told friends, and more widgits are wanted. That is supply and demand.

Every company is out for profit. For itself, for self investment, and for the stock holders dividend. Toyota is doing well for a business, because they can pace themselves. They don't make more vehicles because they can't, they don't make more vehicles because they know there isn't enough demand for them. Toyota does a good job of matching their supply with demand, and that is it. More money for them too, because with a better matched supply, they can set their prices higher, and give themselves a nice profit.

Scorpio--->Yeah maybe Ford got lucky with the Ranger for 15 years straight. Maybe Ford got lucky with it's trucks for the past 25 years. Maybe Ford got lucky with it's complete line of best selling SUV's. Guess what you see more and more of on the road nowadays?

Sure Ford has had it's share of recalls and problems. However, you don't see anything much on the subject, lately. It is sad about the Ranger FX4, but according to the TSB, the replacement parts will be available in April, and therefor back on the street very soon. There's your answer to on-road safety, and off-road prowress.

I also don't look at everything a company makes to see the quality of it. I don't look at Kawasaki's Railroad company, or industrial division when shopping for a motorcycle. I go off the exact models specifications, what it is know for, and of course a good test drive.

4 out of 5 dentists still choose Ranger over Tacoma.

I leave you with a quote from Jeffrey Bleustein of Harley Davidson... "There have been times in our history where, in increasing production in response to a rapidly growing demand, we let quality drop." Everybody knows brands have their up and downs. Was the mid 1980'S good for H&D? No, they almost went bankrupt. Would most motorcyclers love to have a new H&D? Yes. Get your shots in now while you still can, because in a 5 or 10 years from now, you may well be wanting a Ford of your own. (Make mine a Mach 1 Mustang)

plut--->LSD Clutches may wear, but so will a Locker that it's manufacturer says you shouldn't run faster that 5mph. Of course you only use it 0.005% of the time. Does an Locker help you keep traction on a icy road while towing a small bass boat (or nothing at all)?

Everyone makes off-roading the big issue, but how many off-roading individuals (who only off-road in brand new stock trucks) are there compared to people who just commute to work, with the occasional need to carry a load. Or maybe they just want something easier on the wallet or insurance, and still be able to carry or tow their work materials, or just stuff from home depot?

You want a locker? Go buy one and have it installed. The only problem there is that you will be paying out of pocket (of course probably with the money you saved buying the Ranger in the first place) and your warranty will no longer cover the rear differential. Besides once you start modifing your truck, it's off-road ability grows in leaps and bounds above any stock truck from any brand.

allknowing · May 2002

OK, we've heard tbunder's repetitive question on sales and, in turn, the obvious answers to why the Ranger has higher sales. What about the larger issue in that no major consumer publication seems to rates the Ranger as a better and more reliable truck than the Tacoma. I've seen it rated as a "better value" but never as a better truck. Are all of the magazines in America paid off by Toyota tbunder?

tbunder · May 2002

as pluto said, "yawn".
i like them both. but $27K for just an SR5 taco double cab? get out. try getting much off that. sure a loaded FX4 ranger is close to $26K, but everyone knows one could be had for probably $20,000. and the FX4 is extremely rare and has exclusive off-road components that no other small truck can even match. (pluto, the FX4 LSD doesn't use clutches, just fyi. its a special LSD that is specifically engineered for one wheel in the air locking- via torsen engineer) the point is ford will work with you, toyota just basically says to take a hike if you want to deal. and this is why i probably will never buy a toyota. dont get me wrong, they have some awesome looking products. but they're just too proud of them. personally, id love to have a new civic Si. hehe.

nonetheless, very good discussion going here.

sc0rpi0 · May 2002

Ford does not have anything like Taco DC (although some of you have tried to claim that SportTrac is DoubleCabs' competitor, you have admitted that it blows anywhere but on pavement). Tacoma DC can be had for 27K? Great. How does FX4 fit in? How about comparing an FX4 to Xtracab instead? A reasonably loaded Xtracab (SR5, TRD, power) can be had for 21.5K: essential things with some bells and whistles.

stang: So....lets see, April? Basically all the people who bought the "offroader" FX4 had to wait 2 month to get parts replaced? What are they driving now? Same axles, or did Ford put an axle without locker on the back? As for looking at the whole company: I'm not talking about the railroad division when buying a bike. I'm talking about looking at other cars in the companys' production line to see how they make out. Again, when I read that Escape was recalled for leaking gas gaskets....it makes me think. You don't have to take my words and twist them so out of context. As for bestselling: the millions of people who make Ford Explorer the bestselling SUV and McDs the biggest fastfood chain can kiss my butt, I'm not falling for the "millions of people can't be wrong" idiocy. If everyone jumped off a cliff because it was the latest craze, would you follow?

plutonious · May 2002

that when you buy a Ford, you unknowingly become part of their testing division?

Oh, and stang, don't worry about me being on your property "tearing" it up. I doubt you have anything I'd want to see anyway.

issisteelman · May 2002

I'm surprised that my Tacoma friends did not think of the obvious reason as to why (perhaps) Toyota does not pump out a lot of Tacomas. Consider the following:

I work in the manufacturing sector. We try to maintain a careful balance between maximizing production while maintaining quality. You see, what typically happens when you focus only on production (which, in my opinion, is what Ford does with Rangers) is that you tend to have quality problems. This happens usually because you limit the amount of quality control during the manufacturing process because quality checks take too much time and slow things down.

Now, when you focus too much on quality, then your production slips because (again) quality control slows down the manufacturing process.

As has been said before, Tacomas always sell on dealer lots and they can sometimes be hard to find. Therefore, it seems to me that Toyota has found a nice balance between maximizing production while maintain good quality. And, since they sell all the vehicles they produce, they've also kept their inventory at the optimal amount (namely 0).

Take care...........Steelman.

saddaddy · May 2002

I guess it wasn't you that made that quote. It was something I had heard some of the Ford guys say in regards to the Ranger's absence in the off road comparos that I love so much

That quote seemed like a lame excuse so I was just trying to show how dumb it sounds. I understand you don't offroad much, and thats great. Im looking into getting a GPS real soon (Garmin Legend). Any advice. Thanks for keeping this civil, everyone.

saddaddy · May 2002

No one hear ever said that a locker was the best all around axle setup. IT IS NOT. That is why it comes with a package labeled "TRD OFF ROAD package." THE LOCKER IS THE BEST AXLE SETUP FOR OFF ROAD. There is not way to refute that. I will agree, an LSD is the best for running to the mall and the occasional trip to the beach and will HELP off road. The torsen even has a bigger usage band (there I said it). However, you can't tell me that an LSD is a more appropriate setup on a truck that has "OFF ROAD" written on the side. Someone please tell me why this idea of mine is so hard to understand. I would love any questions so I can explain my point further.

issisteelman · May 2002

There is absolutely no question that the Tacoma TRD off road package is the BEST (and I do mean best) off road package currently offered for pick up trucks. All dealers will tell you this (Ford dealers included, if they are being honest) and all magazines I've read thus far say it as well. For anyone to say otherwise is ludicrous. This is simply a fact that (I believe) no intelligent person would refute. TRD is a GREAT off road package, period, end of story. In fact, I do a lot of offroading here in God's country and I now wish that I had paid a little more to get the TRD package (although my truck has performed very well without it).

Take care..........Steelman.

eagle63 · May 2002

I know this question has been posed before with a variety of responses, but does anyone know if it's possible to order a Tacoma with a limited slip? I mean, I know you could always get one aftermarket, but I thought I read somewhere that it was available from the factory if you "special order" it.

scape2 · May 2002

I have picked apart this TRD package over and over again in past posts months back.
I would be foolish to say a locker is not best for offroading. But, most owners, I can easily say at least 95 percent of them would not even know when or how to use a locker in what terrain.
Facts show over 90 percent of 4x4's barely touch even a gravel road. This package is expensive for some Bilstein shocks/springs and a locker.. For aftermarket you can do better, much better.
Try comparing the cost of changing the clutches in my LSD to replacing your locker, whew! what a difference.
Sad, you don't know my background obviously. I live in the Northwest, visit the Cascades, MT Hood, MT St Helens, Tillamook Natl Forest, to the deserts around Bend, Three Sisters area. I own a 1998 Ranger S/C stepside with a 4.0 (offroad pkg) I put on some LT265 all terrains. My Ranger has never let me down, and I have been into some pretty tough spots. I have a friend who owns a TRD and have been able to go anywhere he can. My Ranger has been reliable and dependable. I can now consider myself a long term owner. I am thousands ahead of the typical Toyota owner, I paid less, thousands less upon initial purchase. I will be in the market again in about 2 years. I want that new 4.0 the RAnger has to offer!

plutonious · May 2002

1998 Ranger? My 1998 Tacoma TRD SR5 (V6, Ex-cab, 4x4, 3.4 V6, PW, PL, tow package, manual transmission) was $22,500 out the door. Sticker was $24,890. Did you really pay "less, thousands less?" At the time of sale, there was a $1000 rebate.

Are you really thousands ahead of me at this point? Look at your local auto-trader or wheel-deals and compare our trucks. The Toyotas have really held their value.

sc0rpi0 · May 2002

TRD package includes the alloy wheels with BFG 265s, the most expensive wheel option on Tacoma. That is where the most cost is. If you don't go with TRD, you need to pick the wheels: steel, chrome or alloys.

rickc5 · May 2002

Heck, I just paid $19,400 for a FULLY loaded 2002 Ranger XLT, which has several features not even available on a Tacoma (unless you wish to spend even MORE on a Limited). Sticker was about $26K, before all the discounts & rebates.

So even if I could have bought a new 2002 Tacoma for what you paid for your '98, I'm at least $3000 ahead.

I paid $22K for my '99 Tacoma (just like yours, except with an auto trans). According to the ads in the Denver Post, its worth about $17-18K now. '99 Rangers are selling for about $15-16K, about a $2K difference. Using only my simple math, it still looks like the Ranger is a better deal, at least for those of us who live in the Denver area.

eagle63 · May 2002

Scorpio took the words right out of my mouth. try buying alloy wheels aftermarket and see what they cost. I would guess at at least $200 each. and those tires would be around $100 each as well. (and don't forget about the spare) all of a sudden the price of the TRD package doesn't look so bad. in fact, if anything it's a bargain.

saddaddy · May 2002

Well first of all you have told a little bit about your background and that you have offroaded quite a bit in an area I would kill to even be able to visit. Lucky you. I knew that you realized that lockers were helpful.

The only problem I have with what you said earlier was that you stated that the TRD package was a waste of money. I HATE it when people say that. I have never put down Ranger reliability. If you did any very tough offroading, i.e. actually lifting a tire, you would see how much better a locker would perform. Other than that, you are exactly right, lockers aren't for everyone. That is why they MOSTLY come in an OFF ROAD package. Don't forget, though, you can get one by itself for $400, very competitive with aftermarket lockers that aren't even selectable.

Toyota Tacoma vs. Ford Ranger, Part XII

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