I got a chance to play around with one yesterday. Ford had a display at our State Fair, and had many models that you could hop in and check out.
The Freestyle was right next to the 500, so making comparisons between the two was easy.
I really like the 500, but the Freestyle just wasn't quite as nice. It feels cramped inside compared to the 500, noticeably losing interior space so that they could cram in the third row seats. My wife was with and she mentioned the cramped feeling in the Freestyle's second row.
Also the 500 interior feels a step up in quality. The dash layout was different too. The Freestyle had an all black interior, and showed all the dirt from people getting in and out of it, while the 500's tan interior looked nice under the same conditions.
Also next to these two was an Explorer and a Freestar. The Freestyle feels like a 7 to 8 tenths scale Explorer. The Freestar (minivan) is considerably bigger than the Freestyle. With the third row in use in the Freestyle, there is very little room behind the rear seat.
Also, with the third row up, and the second row DVD player in use, you have very little view out the back window. The DVD screen blocks about 80% of the view out the back, and the rear seat headrests cover most of the rest.
Just some random observations. I do like the 500 quite a bit, but the Freestyle was a disappointment to me. My wife didn't like it.
(the worst part was that the Ford reps they had on hand were clueless! One was supposed to be some regional marketing rep, and I don't think knew a Duratec from a Hemi! A few of us were asking questions and these guys had no clue. They did say the Freestyle on hand was a pre-production model, and the final one may be different. I hope so, since this one felt half-baked.)
Note: in fairness we were comparing the Freestyle against some bigger vehicles (Durango, Sienna, etc), as we were hoping the Freestyle could be a minivan replacement. But it is just too small for that.
According to the ford line, you can fit 6' people in either row. With No Problema. * How cramped did you feel on the 2nd row? * Did you check the 3rd row? * How did the 2nd & 3rd rows compare to Freestar & Explorer?
Yes, you do. However, I hoped to see a review. Do you have word on the Edmunds verdict?
For everyone: Tidbits on the Edmunds 500's review. You can spot it on the new cars section too. The 500 & Freebie share a lot in common. * "Bland" styling * Low HP count, perhaps redeemed by the transmissions (CVT/6-spd, Freebie only has CVT)
Most people posting here know that. What I'm eager to see is the "first drive". That's the make or break IMO.
Yes, 6' people will fit in the 2nd and 3rd rows. I think the 'cramped' feeling will vary by person... The Freestar has a lot more room so that isn't a fair comparison (though the 2nd row seats in the Freestar are not very comfortable. They seem cheap and thin comparatively).
The Explorer 2nd row has more room and was more comfortable (according to my wife and daughter). We didn't attempt the third row in the Explorer so I can't comment on that. The Explorer 3rd row looks like an afterthought, but not nearly the joke of a 3rd row the Highlander has!
The Durango 3rd row has lots of room, and is comfy, thought that is a much bigger vehicle and gets awful gas milage. So many trade-offs with cars!
Hey guys, help! Is my dealer blowing smoke? We ordered a Limited about a month ago, when the dealer didn't have all the information about the vehicle. I specifically asked about getting a garage door opener, and he told me it wasn't available. Now I see that it is an option. My hubby called and asked to have it added to the order, as our Freestyle is scheduled to be built in three weeks from now. The salesman's reply was "no can do". I had my hubby call back today and talk to the sales manager. He said no, too. We asked if he'd even tried and he said it wouldn't do any good. I find that hard to believe. Finally Joe suggested that he at least try, which he agreed to do. Jury's out on that. Is Ford truly that inflexible and unable to respond to a customer's request with a three week window? Or do we just have a lazy dealership? My husband is ready to just back out and keep his Chevy. I want a Freestyle, and I'm hoping everything will work out!
A few options I would try first... Did you leave a deposit to place the order?
Then I would try another Ford dealership, and ask them if they are able to place an order, and change it, etc.etc. And see what they have to say over it.
Ideally if your dealership really wanted to go out of it's way...It would order another vehicle you want with your options, and keep the one that will be built in 3 weeks to sell it off as any regular vehicle... Although the downside will be having to wait a bit longer... Instead of 3 weeks, maybe 4-5 weeks.
Ask if a build date/number has been issued to you yet. Then it's almost impossible to pull back and change anything on it. If you do not have a build date/number issued to you, then your able to alter your order a bit.
And if your able to change it then, just be nice/polite and kind. You phrases such as, "could you give me the contact information for your reginal Ford manager.... Maybe if I give him a call, he might make it possible in helping you alter the order for me", and/or "If I give the local manager a call, I'm sure he could kindly facilitate this issue for you and we can come to a resolution".... etc. See what I'm doing ? Shifting the words to make it seem as if the regional will HELP them do something, instead of saying "HEY, I'm gonna give him a call so I can get you in trouble for not giving me what I want".... Just throw in some honey and it might work.
No, I usually don't see new editorial content any faster than anyone else (nor do I get a schedule of what's being tested when). Probably one of those press embargo things.
Have been looking into sport wagons and small SUVs for my next car. Am interested in the Freestyle, although I won't know until I see it whether it's the right amt. of size or two much.
But even before that point ... I wonder whether the Freestyle (which, like the 500 is a new design debuting this fall) is safe to consider at its debut?
I have heard that a new car needs a year or two to work out some kinks. But the Freestyle does seem to be the first re-lean toward a "more regular-sized" wagon vs. a compact wagon like the Matrix or Mazda 6 wagon. So I'm wondering what other people's thoughts are ... worth considering? Or give it some time (either a few months or 1-2 years) to see how its reliability goes?
(I'm running into the same mental dilemma with the upcoming Highlander Hybrid. Great idea, but not sure if I want to jump and consider one of the first batch arriving around Jan. 2005).
Auto123.com published a comparison test drive today and the Freestyle beats the competition in AWD capability, seating space, and even acceleration to 60!
Interesting article though I am bummed to learn that they launched the car in Milwaukee as that is my town and the Calatrava is only a short hop from where I live. If I new, I would have popped down and had a look.
I was shocked at first at the price they mentioned - then I remembered that this is a Canadian web site. Thew...
"Ant", thanks for the advice on changing our order. Joe called the manager back and asked (nicely as you suggested) that he simply make the effort to see if something could be done. He did put in a request to add the garage opener, even though the order is already in. No promises. Thanks, Nancy
Okay you got me started on the price again... It's interesting in the press release the Five Hundred said it included delivery, but they didn't specifically mention it for the Freestyle. The pricing on edmunds shows the MSRP minus delivery at the front for the Five Hundred and doesn't for the Freestyle. But when you go deeper into the pricing of the Freestyle they give a lower price for the MSRP and then give the delivery charge, bringing the price back to the press release value. Up in Canada.... they add $1085 dollars delivery to the MSRP in the press release. hmmm.....
They talk about how 150 journalists where invited to the launch, so expect to see a lot more reviews soon.
Incidentally, the drive from Milwaukee to Chicago on I-94 involves only a few corners in its 80 miles route so it would not give a lot of opportunity to test the cars handling
Kerry.
PS. - Sorry to the Moderators for my earlier post (now deleted) where I quoted the article directly.
All vehicles are an unknown when introduced. I recall the original Contour's "neutral steering shake". When you put it in neutral, guess what. It took a couple of years to eliminate it, unfortunately after I bought mine.
That happens now with Freestyle (with Duratec) 30, Highlander or Escape Hybrid. Freestyle 35 in 2006+ or a -possible- Freestyle hybrid in 2007+ will also have such issues. There are always unknowns.
The first key to assess how bad is the "unknown" is how the company managed those unknowns. In the case of Freebie/500/Monty Ford: * refined an existing engine (Duratec 30) * employed a transmission developed and used on other cars like Audi (see earlier Canadian review link) * employed an existing auto frame (Volvo's) * used the proven Volvo AWD systems In short, they reduced the unknowns by using known tech. The integration of all of the above in one car is always a mystery, so here comes the next step.
Another source of information is the reviews. * The Canadian post noted no problems. Only praises. * Edmunds is about to release their first impression of Freebie. However, they already did for cousin 500. Their review indicated no construction or performance flaws. Only "wished a better" interior material/engine, based on competitors' offerings. Compare the minivan comparison of the Freestar (a derivative of the existing Windstar) with the 500 (new). You'll see the former had some flaws. The latter, zero. In short, they improved quite a bit.
--NOTE: We had some time ago in this room a discussion on Duratec 30 vs. 35. We all agreed 35 is better, but it's a year away at best.--
Finally, nothing will insure you of a perfect buy. Even Camrys fail. However, certain website that lets us post Freebie-messages for free allows you to get extended warranties...
I hope all this yadda-yadda help you measure the unknowns. Now it's up to your personal risk threshold to determine whether to take a new car or not. Ford or Toyota or whatever.
For the record, I stated my plan much earlier. I'll say good-bye to my faithful Contour, and replace it with a Freebie 30.
I would like your opinion. I always bought cars through loans, and never leased. However, the Freestyle 35 is one year away & the hybrid is two (maybe). Thus, I thought leasing is an option.
* I recall an earlier conversation on this subject. Another Poster said the lease cost equals buy and sell yourself. Granted, rough ballpark. * No matter which financing road you do, follow Edmunds.com advise.
I'm not the "sell yourself" type. I also wouldn't mind an option to get a Freebie 35 or Hybrid. Therefore my interest on leasing for a change.
First, lower the buying price. Don't buy a vehicle where a large percentage of the price pays for the brand and model label (e.g. Lincoln Town car vs Ford Crown Victoria, Lexus 330 vs Toyota Camry SE). Determine what you need, then what you want, remembering that cars are an expense, not an investment. Obtain bids from a good number of dealers to obtain the best price.
Second, pay cash for the vehicle and drive it until it reaches the point where resale value starts to drop off rapidly and expensive repairs become likely. A zero percent interest loan may be helpful, but remember that any consumer debt may impair your ability to obtain debt for investments in a business or real estate. Rather than waste money on an extended warranty, invest the cost of the extended warrantly so that you have the money to pay for the repair(s) if needed, but still have the cash if expensive repairs are not needed. If it is mainly for business use, buy it through the company.
Third, consider the entire costs - fuel, maintenance, and insurance. Don't focus excessively on fuel usage, since big differences in mileage translate into just pennies per mile differences in actual operating costs.
The dimensions are a bit smaller than the Explorer's but I can't subjectively compare it to the Explorer because I've never ridden in an Explorer's 3rd row seat. I can say that the comfor and visibilty in the Freestyle's 3rd row are good, as good as the back seat in some midsized wagon, e.g. the Passat, and bettr than the 3rd row in the Freestar, the 3rd row is still a relative pain to get in and out of.
I would think that the Freestyle would be roomier than the Explorer, since it has a transverse engine, and is about 10 inches longer. That's why it seems odd that people refer to it as a baby Exploder. Maybe it's because it's lower?
It's narrower than the Explorer, but there's alot more 2nd row legroom, the seats are higher off the floor of the vehicle, though closer to the ground because the whole vehicle sits lower. There is also quite q bit more cargo room behind the 3rd row when that seat is being used. As I said, I'm not really thet familiar with the 3rd row on the current model Explorer but in the Freestyle the seating back there feels like regular seating, not a jump seat like in some minivans, you sit high, with a rather chairlike seat height, and the seating position is slightly raised so you can see forward quite easily. I'm over 6' 2" and I woudn't mind sitting there for an hour or more. The look of the vehicle is much lighter and leaner than the Explorer, I refer to it as Explorer Lite, but then I'd prefer something more along the lines of a traditional station wagon version of the Five Hundred. Maybe Mercury will do that with their version.
I called my nearby dealer, and they finally got the Free Freestyle brochures, pardon the pun. They'll also bring a Limited Merlot (NANCYB style!) within the week. A Norsea SEL and a few others will follow. They invited me to test drive the first. (How courteous of them...
I visited the gentleman whom I spoke over the phone. Then I got surprised as another salesperson (whom I dealt earlier) came back to work there. When I recognized him and said hi, he sat right beside me at the gentleman's desk. The poor guy seemed to explain why he was talking to me, and gave the salesperson the survey form for follow-up. We talked about my desire list, etc., which went right into the form. He gave me the dealer order sheets for both vehicles. As he identified them, he started hinting "nice car", you get the drift.
IMO, he pretty much failed the "test drive the salesperson" test recommended by Edmunds right there.
The salesperson will give me numbers for both Freebies. Let's see what all comes to dollar wise. Whether he gets the business is T.B. Determined.
I was out of state and stopped at a Wisconsin Ford dealer last weekend -- and got a Freestyle brochure. Loved the looks of the F.S. -- I prefer not to think of it as "boring", but rather as "understated and classy." Sam -- can't wait to hear about your test drive when your dealer gets the first one. Ours is supposed to be made around the 18th but not at the dealership until a month later. Can't understand why so long, but I did post Joe's Chevy on the board at work today. Does anyone know if the Freestyle will be included in the Fleet Plan (X-Plan) that is offered to employees of companies that have the Fleet Plan with Ford? I just found out that I have this plan available to me -- which might mean an even better deal. thanks, Nancy
All plans are Freebie-compatible, according to my local dealer. For a NANCYB Special (Limited), below is the ballpark. * A, Z, & D could get you 1K to 1.5K below invoice. * X is invoice.
Hope the Impala will speedily bring you a good down payment.
For the record, I'll bring our digicam to the test drive. This time, I won't leave a seat, oops , rock unturned.
Sam, you are truly a wealth of information. I don't know what we'd do without you. You have really contributed some great information to this board. I hope our dealer isn't upset when I hit him with the X-Plan thing, as we were talking about $1000 over invoice when we started -- but no contract in writing. I assume that the dealer still makes a decent profit?
Thanks for the kudos, yet I'm just one of the many in this "Band of Buyers" (pardon the WW2 TV series pun willing to help with what we know. That's what will make the group successful at getting their Freebies.
On the dealer, He/She will miss the profit, for sure. Yet if I were him/her, I rather sell you a X plan than losing the business. There are more Ford dealers if they don't oblige.
Happy customers come back.
Regardless of earlier discussions, follow edmunds.com advise to the letter. Read "confessions of a car salesman" too. (There you'll find 4 profit lines within a car deal. The Impala is one.)
I'll doing the same with my local dealer. My unwritten rule on sales, "if there's a wallet (or purse), there's a way" .
Don't worry about their dealer profits. * Freestyle has ZERO incentives as far as I know. (Focus 2005 had a "token" $500 one.) * If they sell the vehicle minutes after arrival, they get maximize their profit. (The longer the car stays, the more they pay Ford in interest, etc. I think it's called "holdback". Correct me guys/gals if I used the wrong term.) * Some Companies offer dealer-only incentives for getting more Model Y cars to the lot. You won't see those! * If you buy it with their arranged financing outfits (Ford Financing, bank X offered there), they get a commission. I doubt they offer those banks for free... * If you buy an extended warranty, they get a commission. * Any hyper-over-priced gizmo or paint job or whatever, your buy will translate into a killing for them. My local dealer offered me a Nav system for $2.2K. Circuit City (not known for cheapness) has a highly-recommended & far better one for $1,200. AND you can bet there's plenty of profit in it for C.C.
It (and the Five Hundred) now show up on the X-plan web site. The example for the Freestyle says- MSRP: $25,595 X-Plan Price: $23,777 and states this is an example only. Actual prices will vary based on option content and can only be obtained through your local dealer. Go to FordDirect.com to view a dealer's Freestyle inventory and pricing on vehicles in stock.
The only trouble is- very few dealers have one in stock.
RE the brochure: I live in NE Wisc (Fox Cities) and Stumpf Ford on E. College Ave in Appleton sent me a Freestyle brochure. So, Nancyb, I think you're on track with your answer. Freestyle, according to Stumpf, is due at their showroom on/about 9/15.
Carry on & hope I like the Freestyle and can sell my wife on it. Currently we own an Econoline 350. Huge inside and legroom is no problem.
picked up a brochure today. If it drives as nice as it looks in the pictures, Ford could have a hit on it's hands (assuming, of course, it's nice a quality nightmare).
There is a page where the describe how "203 HP can feel better than 250 HP", dedicated to the wonders of the CVT. THey also give 0-60 results for the Free (8.6) and the 250HP Pacifica (9.5ish) to prove the point. Of course, they don't mention that the porker pacifica probably weighs 5-600 pounds more.
Actually, the more I look at the CVT, it just seems like a good idea. It is really a simple system, and even if the chain or internals wore out, it must be cheaper to rebuild than a modern AT. Ever see how many parts are in a 5 speed EC AT?
I have family in Neenah and Appleton. Always nice to go home! Stickguy, glad you got a brochure. Looks nice, eh! I've been back and forth on the CVT, but as others have pointed out on these boards, Audi and others have used this successfully. My son (a SeaDoo rep) says that snowmobiles have also used this technology. He just cautioned me that the towing weight would be low (Ford says 2000 pounds) -- enough for a personal watercraft, or a 4-wheeler or small boat -- but don't expect to pull anything substantial like you could with an Explorer. This article came out today, saying that shipments were being delayed a bit, also tells us how many Freestyles have already been built: http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=100768
Hey NancyB! I live in the Town of Harrison, just south of Appleton & east of Menasha. Have lived in Appleton & Oshkosh. Anyways, we're trying to downsize our present E350 and I think Freestyle will be the way to go. The 350 is way too big, sucks gas, and my wife left the road twice last year slipping on snow (I want the AWD Freebie). We even downsized our 2800# pop-up camper for a 1500# pop-up to meet the 2000# Freebie tow rating. I gotta sell my wife on it though. We have a tall family, I'm 6'2", she's 6'1", son is 5'6" & he's only 11. So, it'll be interesting to see/feel how the 2nd & 3rd rows will be.
You may recall earlier postings of mine saying the 2005 Focus had a $500 "token" rebate. Well, I stand corrected. It's now $2,000.
I suspect that Ford may introduce Freebie rebates later on. Note the 2005 Focus is only 3-4 months in the market. Of course, rebates and conditions vary from place to place. Also, Freebie seems to be a hot item, so they may delay such rebates.
(On the other side, Chrysler offers $1,000 to new buyers of Pain-cifica. You may recall my nightmarish experience with the vehicle, and thus the Fraudian Slide.
It's just a hunch. Please do not construe any other way.
I read the same article when it was released in Autonews (for paid subscribers) days ago. The vehicles aren't being purposely delayed because of any bad reason.... They are slowly being released, but Autonews is spinning the story as if there's some major issue or concern with the vehicle, which there isn't.
If there WERE a problem with the vehicles, or some quality concern, I promise you, you would see it on every major publication since it would considered a free-for-all story. Autonews is trying to magnify or create a situation/concern, when there really isn't. More about acting on hunches than anything else.
Just like Me saying, "well I'm going to die one day"... Well yeah we all will, it's the time we don't know of heh... :-)
Ant14, I wasn't worried when I read the article. I knew they hadn't started shipping yet, but it sounds like it will be any day now. I was more interested to see an actual production number! Ranger, I know where Harrison is. I bought maple syrup a few years back from the "Sugar Bush" label which lists a Harrison address -- even though the Harrisons lived in Neenah close to my Uncle's place. I grew up in Neenah, left in 1966 for college and haven't lived in the state since... but I've always felt a "pull" to return one day. Too bad your taxes are so damn high. Much cheaper to live in Arkansas! You should be quite happy with legroom in the Freestyle, from all the reports I've seen. They have really maximized the interior space with a lot of good engineering and planning. I can't wait to sit in one! I put flyers up at work for Joe's 2000 Impala. When we get back from Branson in 2 weeks, we'll start running ads in the paper. I'd rather sell it than have to deal with having the dealer try to steal it from us! (Sam, was it you who recommended reading "confessions of a car salesman" on the Edmunds main page? VERY enlightening!!!)
Comments
Otherwise, it's empty. Seems Ford forgot to send Edmunds an info file. While people already can get brochures (post #825).
Sam
The Freestyle was right next to the 500, so making comparisons between the two was easy.
I really like the 500, but the Freestyle just wasn't quite as nice. It feels cramped inside compared to the 500, noticeably losing interior space so that they could cram in the third row seats. My wife was with and she mentioned the cramped feeling in the Freestyle's second row.
Also the 500 interior feels a step up in quality. The dash layout was different too. The Freestyle had an all black interior, and showed all the dirt from people getting in and out of it, while the 500's tan interior looked nice under the same conditions.
Also next to these two was an Explorer and a Freestar. The Freestyle feels like a 7 to 8 tenths scale Explorer. The Freestar (minivan) is considerably bigger than the Freestyle. With the third row in use in the Freestyle, there is very little room behind the rear seat.
Also, with the third row up, and the second row DVD player in use, you have very little view out the back window. The DVD screen blocks about 80% of the view out the back, and the rear seat headrests cover most of the rest.
Just some random observations. I do like the 500 quite a bit, but the Freestyle was a disappointment to me. My wife didn't like it.
(the worst part was that the Ford reps they had on hand were clueless! One was supposed to be some regional marketing rep, and I don't think knew a Duratec from a Hemi! A few of us were asking questions and these guys had no clue. They did say the Freestyle on hand was a pre-production model, and the final one may be different. I hope so, since this one felt half-baked.)
Note: in fairness we were comparing the Freestyle against some bigger vehicles (Durango, Sienna, etc), as we were hoping the Freestyle could be a minivan replacement. But it is just too small for that.
link
Steve, Host
According to the ford line, you can fit 6' people in either row. With No Problema.
* How cramped did you feel on the 2nd row?
* Did you check the 3rd row?
* How did the 2nd & 3rd rows compare to Freestar & Explorer?
Sam
For everyone:
Tidbits on the Edmunds 500's review. You can spot it on the new cars section too. The 500 & Freebie share a lot in common.
* "Bland" styling
* Low HP count, perhaps redeemed by the transmissions (CVT/6-spd, Freebie only has CVT)
Most people posting here know that. What I'm eager to see is the "first drive". That's the make or break IMO.
Sam
The Explorer 2nd row has more room and was more comfortable (according to my wife and daughter). We didn't attempt the third row in the Explorer so I can't comment on that. The Explorer 3rd row looks like an afterthought, but not nearly the joke of a 3rd row the Highlander has!
The Durango 3rd row has lots of room, and is comfy, thought that is a much bigger vehicle and gets awful gas milage. So many trade-offs with cars!
Is Ford truly that inflexible and unable to respond to a customer's request with a three week window? Or do we just have a lazy dealership?
My husband is ready to just back out and keep his Chevy. I want a Freestyle, and I'm hoping everything will work out!
Then I would try another Ford dealership, and ask them if they are able to place an order, and change it, etc.etc. And see what they have to say over it.
Ideally if your dealership really wanted to go out of it's way...It would order another vehicle you want with your options, and keep the one that will be built in 3 weeks to sell it off as any regular vehicle... Although the downside will be having to wait a bit longer... Instead of 3 weeks, maybe 4-5 weeks.
Ask if a build date/number has been issued to you yet. Then it's almost impossible to pull back and change anything on it. If you do not have a build date/number issued to you, then your able to alter your order a bit.
And if your able to change it then, just be nice/polite and kind. You phrases such as, "could you give me the contact information for your reginal Ford manager.... Maybe if I give him a call, he might make it possible in helping you alter the order for me", and/or "If I give the local manager a call, I'm sure he could kindly facilitate this issue for you and we can come to a resolution".... etc. See what I'm doing ? Shifting the words to make it seem as if the regional will HELP them do something, instead of saying "HEY, I'm gonna give him a call so I can get you in trouble for not giving me what I want".... Just throw in some honey and it might work.
No, I usually don't see new editorial content any faster than anyone else (nor do I get a schedule of what's being tested when). Probably one of those press embargo things.
Steve, Host
link
Steve, Host
But even before that point ... I wonder whether the Freestyle (which, like the 500 is a new design debuting this fall) is safe to consider at its debut?
I have heard that a new car needs a year or two to work out some kinks. But the Freestyle does seem to be the first re-lean toward a "more regular-sized" wagon vs. a compact wagon like the Matrix or Mazda 6 wagon. So I'm wondering what other people's thoughts are ... worth considering? Or give it some time (either a few months or 1-2 years) to see how its reliability goes?
(I'm running into the same mental dilemma with the upcoming Highlander Hybrid. Great idea, but not sure if I want to jump and consider one of the first batch arriving around Jan. 2005).
-sb
I was shocked at first at the price they mentioned - then I remembered that this is a Canadian web site. Thew...
I love the AWD on our A4, so for the Freestyle to have a similar system is certainly a plus in my book.
The link FSMMCSI talks about is below. I'm equally impressed, reaching WOW, YIPEE, THAT"S MY (soon) CAR.
http://www.auto123.com/en/info/news/roadtest,view,Ford.spy?artid=- 28233&pg=1
And our friendly neighborhood moderator-man hints Freebie will soon be in their reviews.
Sam
It's interesting in the press release the Five Hundred said it included delivery, but they didn't specifically mention it for the Freestyle. The pricing on edmunds shows the MSRP minus delivery at the front for the Five Hundred and doesn't for the Freestyle. But when you go deeper into the pricing of the Freestyle they give a lower price for the MSRP and then give the delivery charge, bringing the price back to the press release value.
Up in Canada.... they add $1085 dollars delivery to the MSRP in the press release. hmmm.....
http://www.bizjournals.com/Milwaukee/stories/2004/08/23/tidbits1.- - html
They talk about how 150 journalists where invited to the launch, so expect to see a lot more reviews soon.
Incidentally, the drive from Milwaukee to Chicago on I-94 involves only a few corners in its 80 miles route so it would not give a lot of opportunity to test the cars handling
Kerry.
PS. - Sorry to the Moderators for my earlier post (now deleted) where I quoted the article directly.
Freestyle Page 5 (enlarge screen to see)
this is from the PREVIEW GUIDE and it clearly states on the left hand side that the HOMELINK Universal Garage Door Opener is one of the options
Hope this helps
Odie
P.S. - if you need any of the other preview guide pages you just need to go back a few posts to get them.
Also our Pueblo Gold Freestyle Limited has been built and is awaiting shipment from Chicago to Canada.
That happens now with Freestyle (with Duratec) 30, Highlander or Escape Hybrid. Freestyle 35 in 2006+ or a -possible- Freestyle hybrid in 2007+ will also have such issues. There are always unknowns.
The first key to assess how bad is the "unknown" is how the company managed those unknowns. In the case of Freebie/500/Monty Ford:
* refined an existing engine (Duratec 30)
* employed a transmission developed and used on other cars like Audi (see earlier Canadian review link)
* employed an existing auto frame (Volvo's)
* used the proven Volvo AWD systems
In short, they reduced the unknowns by using known tech. The integration of all of the above in one car is always a mystery, so here comes the next step.
Another source of information is the reviews.
* The Canadian post noted no problems. Only praises.
* Edmunds is about to release their first impression of Freebie. However, they already did for cousin 500. Their review indicated no construction or performance flaws. Only "wished a better" interior material/engine, based on competitors' offerings.
Compare the minivan comparison of the Freestar (a derivative of the existing Windstar) with the 500 (new). You'll see the former had some flaws. The latter, zero. In short, they improved quite a bit.
--NOTE: We had some time ago in this room a discussion on Duratec 30 vs. 35. We all agreed 35 is better, but it's a year away at best.--
Freestar link
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/comparison/articles/101676/page014- .html
500 link
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2005/ford/fivehundred/100396835/roadte- starticle.html?articleId=102924&tid=edmunds.e.roadtests.conte- nt...Ford*
Finally, nothing will insure you of a perfect buy. Even Camrys fail. However, certain website that lets us post Freebie-messages for free allows you to get extended warranties...
I hope all this yadda-yadda help you measure the unknowns. Now it's up to your personal risk threshold to determine whether to take a new car or not. Ford or Toyota or whatever.
For the record, I stated my plan much earlier. I'll say good-bye to my faithful Contour, and replace it with a Freebie 30.
Sam
I would like your opinion. I always bought cars through loans, and never leased. However, the Freestyle 35 is one year away & the hybrid is two (maybe). Thus, I thought leasing is an option.
* I recall an earlier conversation on this subject. Another Poster said the lease cost equals buy and sell yourself. Granted, rough ballpark.
* No matter which financing road you do, follow Edmunds.com advise.
I'm not the "sell yourself" type. I also wouldn't mind an option to get a Freebie 35 or Hybrid. Therefore my interest on leasing for a change.
Your two cents and larger denominations welcome.
Sam
First, lower the buying price. Don't buy a vehicle where a large percentage of the price pays for the brand and model label (e.g. Lincoln Town car vs Ford Crown Victoria, Lexus 330 vs Toyota Camry SE). Determine what you need, then what you want, remembering that cars are an expense, not an investment. Obtain bids from a good number of dealers to obtain the best price.
Second, pay cash for the vehicle and drive it until it reaches the point where resale value starts to drop off rapidly and expensive repairs become likely. A zero percent interest loan may be helpful, but remember that any consumer debt may impair your ability to obtain debt for investments in a business or real estate. Rather than waste money on an extended warranty, invest the cost of the extended warrantly so that you have the money to pay for the repair(s) if needed, but still have the cash if expensive repairs are not needed. If it is mainly for business use, buy it through the company.
Third, consider the entire costs - fuel, maintenance, and insurance. Don't focus excessively on fuel usage, since big differences in mileage translate into just pennies per mile differences in actual operating costs.
Headroom 38.6"
Legroom 33.3"
Hip room 45.9"
Shoulder room 50.8"
The dimensions are a bit smaller than the Explorer's but I can't subjectively compare it to the Explorer because I've never ridden in an Explorer's 3rd row seat. I can say that the comfor and visibilty in the Freestyle's 3rd row are good, as good as the back seat in some midsized wagon, e.g. the Passat, and bettr than the 3rd row in the Freestar, the 3rd row is still a relative pain to get in and out of.
Headroom 39
Legroom: 34.8
Hip room: 54.2
Shoulder:52.4
third row access will get easier when they release the 6 door version
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=7480&sid=18- 1&n=157
Freebie came out good!
Some minus points on the engine (hint to Ford: Duratec 35!), and the interior materials.
Sam
I don't have enough line of credit + savings for "paying cash". However, a mix with an auto loan might work almost as good.
I'll keep you posted. And again, thank you.
Sam
I visited the gentleman whom I spoke over the phone. Then I got surprised as another salesperson (whom I dealt earlier) came back to work there. When I recognized him and said hi, he sat right beside me at the gentleman's desk. The poor guy seemed to explain why he was talking to me, and gave the salesperson the survey form for follow-up. We talked about my desire list, etc., which went right into the form. He gave me the dealer order sheets for both vehicles. As he identified them, he started hinting "nice car", you get the drift.
IMO, he pretty much failed the "test drive the salesperson" test recommended by Edmunds right there.
The salesperson will give me numbers for both Freebies. Let's see what all comes to dollar wise. Whether he gets the business is T.B. Determined.
Sam
Sam -- can't wait to hear about your test drive when your dealer gets the first one. Ours is supposed to be made around the 18th but not at the dealership until a month later. Can't understand why so long, but I did post Joe's Chevy on the board at work today.
Does anyone know if the Freestyle will be included in the Fleet Plan (X-Plan) that is offered to employees of companies that have the Fleet Plan with Ford? I just found out that I have this plan available to me -- which might mean an even better deal.
thanks, Nancy
* A, Z, & D could get you 1K to 1.5K below invoice.
* X is invoice.
Hope the Impala will speedily bring you a good down payment.
For the record, I'll bring our digicam to the test drive. This time, I won't leave a seat, oops
Sam
Thanks for the kudos, yet I'm just one of the many in this "Band of Buyers" (pardon the WW2 TV series pun
On the dealer, He/She will miss the profit, for sure. Yet if I were him/her, I rather sell you a X plan than losing the business. There are more Ford dealers if they don't oblige.
Happy customers come back.
Regardless of earlier discussions, follow edmunds.com advise to the letter. Read "confessions of a car salesman" too. (There you'll find 4 profit lines within a car deal. The Impala is one.)
I'll doing the same with my local dealer. My unwritten rule on sales, "if there's a wallet (or purse), there's a way"
Don't worry about their dealer profits.
* Freestyle has ZERO incentives as far as I know. (Focus 2005 had a "token" $500 one.)
* If they sell the vehicle minutes after arrival, they get maximize their profit. (The longer the car stays, the more they pay Ford in interest, etc. I think it's called "holdback". Correct me guys/gals if I used the wrong term.)
* Some Companies offer dealer-only incentives for getting more Model Y cars to the lot. You won't see those!
* If you buy it with their arranged financing outfits (Ford Financing, bank X offered there), they get a commission. I doubt they offer those banks for free...
* If you buy an extended warranty, they get a commission.
* Any hyper-over-priced gizmo or paint job or whatever, your buy will translate into a killing for them. My local dealer offered me a Nav system for $2.2K. Circuit City (not known for cheapness) has a highly-recommended & far better one for $1,200. AND you can bet there's plenty of profit in it for C.C.
I hope all this helps.
Sam
I am happy to learn that this should indeed be the case.
Incidentally, as I live a work in SE Wisconsin, which dealer in Wisconsin had the brochures?
Kerry
X-Plan Price: $23,777
and states this is an example only.
Actual prices will vary based on option content and can only be obtained through your local dealer. Go to FordDirect.com to view a dealer's Freestyle inventory and pricing on vehicles in stock.
The only trouble is- very few dealers have one in stock.
Carry on & hope I like the Freestyle and can sell my wife on it. Currently we own an Econoline 350. Huge inside and legroom is no problem.
There is a page where the describe how "203 HP can feel better than 250 HP", dedicated to the wonders of the CVT. THey also give 0-60 results for the Free (8.6) and the 250HP Pacifica (9.5ish) to prove the point. Of course, they don't mention that the porker pacifica probably weighs 5-600 pounds more.
Actually, the more I look at the CVT, it just seems like a good idea. It is really a simple system, and even if the chain or internals wore out, it must be cheaper to rebuild than a modern AT. Ever see how many parts are in a 5 speed EC AT?
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
This article came out today, saying that shipments were being delayed a bit, also tells us how many Freestyles have already been built:
http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=100768
You may recall earlier postings of mine saying the 2005 Focus had a $500 "token" rebate. Well, I stand corrected. It's now $2,000.
I suspect that Ford may introduce Freebie rebates later on. Note the 2005 Focus is only 3-4 months in the market. Of course, rebates and conditions vary from place to place. Also, Freebie seems to be a hot item, so they may delay such rebates.
(On the other side, Chrysler offers $1,000 to new buyers of Pain-cifica. You may recall my nightmarish experience with the vehicle, and thus the Fraudian Slide.
It's just a hunch. Please do not construe any other way.
Sam
I read the same article when it was released in Autonews (for paid subscribers) days ago. The vehicles aren't being purposely delayed because of any bad reason.... They are slowly being released, but Autonews is spinning the story as if there's some major issue or concern with the vehicle, which there isn't.
If there WERE a problem with the vehicles, or some quality concern, I promise you, you would see it on every major publication since it would considered a free-for-all story. Autonews is trying to magnify or create a situation/concern, when there really isn't. More about acting on hunches than anything else.
Just like Me saying, "well I'm going to die one day"... Well yeah we all will, it's the time we don't know of heh... :-)
Ranger, I know where Harrison is. I bought maple syrup a few years back from the "Sugar Bush" label which lists a Harrison address -- even though the Harrisons lived in Neenah close to my Uncle's place. I grew up in Neenah, left in 1966 for college and haven't lived in the state since... but I've always felt a "pull" to return one day. Too bad your taxes are so damn high. Much cheaper to live in Arkansas!
You should be quite happy with legroom in the Freestyle, from all the reports I've seen. They have really maximized the interior space with a lot of good engineering and planning. I can't wait to sit in one!
I put flyers up at work for Joe's 2000 Impala. When we get back from Branson in 2 weeks, we'll start running ads in the paper. I'd rather sell it than have to deal with having the dealer try to steal it from us! (Sam, was it you who recommended reading "confessions of a car salesman" on the Edmunds main page? VERY enlightening!!!)