Dodge,Ford,Chevy-----Who Wins? - II

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Comments

  • quadrunner500quadrunner500 Member Posts: 2,721
    I think GM blew whatever chance they had, first with the strike, then with the quality control issues and 3 door mistake. I think Ford, with Super Crew, Sport Trac etc is out front for good. Lastly, with Ford acquiring the right to be sole bidder for assets and factories of Daewoo, they are set to have the Asian market GM covets. Although I still like most of the GM lineup more, Ford may overtake GM as the number #1 automaker in the not too distant future.
  • KCRamKCRam Member Posts: 3,516
    The new GM HD pickups will maintain the torsion bar IFS on 4x4s. If you want to read the banter regarding that, scroll on down to topic 1939 here in Pickups

    kcram
    Co-Host - Smart Shopper & FWI Conferences
    edmunds.com Town Hall
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    Kcram

    i think I remember during a debate about IFS some while back, you told me GM was going back solid axles, because the customer wanted it... ;)
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    swo,

    GM combined doesn't have a chance. And let me add this: If GM was the one crushing all others in truck sales--would GM fans remind Ford owners of it? Hmmmm... All in jest....

    Roc
  • KCRamKCRam Member Posts: 3,516
    cdean,

    well, customers do want it - just witness Ford Super Duty and Dodge/Cummins sales - but GM said they were committed to the IFS. I guess we'll see how people vote with their hard-earned $$ on this one.

    My town's DPW used to be 100% GMC for light and medium trucks and chassis cabs. The mediums are still GMCs, but the majority of the light trucks are now Ford, and they even bought a few Cummins Rams this year with dump bodies.

    kcram
    Co-Host - Smart Shopper & FWI Conferences
    edmunds.com Town Hall
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    some people are above petty things like that. I'd like to think this is one of the few spots here that this could happen. Yeah, I would be happy if GM outdid Ford because I own one, but I really don't care because either way I think I got the best truck out there - really.

    Quad,
    I thought GM was buying Daewoo???
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Member Posts: 1,352
    That was a very mature post but seeing how GM truck owners RIP the Tundra crowd for the lack of sales of the Toyota it sure seems important when it matters to them.
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    It's not the same with Toyota. GM/Ford are both established truck brands that have been going at it for many years. Toyota is new in the game, and while I applaud their effort, I still think they'll come a little short of their 100,000 goal. I see deep discounts on them already when traditionally trucks sold for a little more. And these Toyota guys think their @#$^ don't stink. I think it's a good truck, but have a hard time not slamming them cause all they know is that the Tundra is the best thing ever concieved. There all good trucks, but it will take Toyota many years to get to the level of GM or Ford or even Dodge...
  • arkie6arkie6 Member Posts: 198
    Regarding Tundra sales goal of 100,000: I saw over at TundraSolutions where a guy that recently purchased a Tundra posted his VIN# at ....108###, which indicates he is number 108 thousand and something off the assembly line. And that is about 13 months after the intro of the truck. Looks like Toyota hit their sales goal.

    The Tundra is a fine truck for what it was designed for, but it won't fit everybody's needs.
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    arkie6. My point is that no truck is perfect...
  • KCRamKCRam Member Posts: 3,516
    DaimlerChrysler, already a 21% owner of Detroit Diesel, has just announced with DD a purchase of the remaining 79%. DaimlerChrysler would then be the sole owner of Detroit, offering approximately $23 a share.

    Right now, Detroit does not make an engine competitive with the Cummins ISB5.9 - their smallest engine is a 7.6L Series 40 straight six, which competes with the Cummins ISC8.3, so this would not immediately affect the Ram/Cummins relationship, but the DELTA 4.0L engine would indeed work perfectly in the Dakota/Durango chassis (a Durango was one of the original test mules for that engine).

    For details, check out Detroit Diesel Press Release on DaimlerChrysler Deal

    kcram
    Co-Host - Smart Shopper & FWI Conferences
    edmunds.com Town Hall
  • lariat1lariat1 Member Posts: 461
    I was thumbing through the latest issue of Popular science and read a little blurb in there that the Cummins is out of the new ram and a MB engine is moving in. I guess it will be cost effective for the company but I wonder what it will do to the consumers willingness to buy?
  • quadrunner500quadrunner500 Member Posts: 2,721
    According to Wall St, Journal a few months back, it was stated GM had inside track on Daewoo.

    But last week it was announced that Ford had been awarded sole right by the creditors to bid on the assets of bankrupt Daewoo.

    Win one for Ford.

    Ford= Found On Road Daewoo
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    swobig,

    I use the sales figures only to needle guys like cdean. I hardly trumpet them as holy scripture! LOL! All in jest....


    Roc
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    hey what models do they plan on using that 4.5L? V-6 diesel in? Sounds like a decent little motor...
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    I heard that would be available in their suvs and possibly the F-150 in the future. I think it would be the first half-ton since International to offer a diesel.

    As a fleet owner, my eyes perked up when I heard that rumor! ;) My headaches might actually subside.
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    Quad,

    Hey, will Ford get better sound now from Daewoo??
  • quadrunner500quadrunner500 Member Posts: 2,721
    What? Daewoo makes sound systems or something? Got me. I'm strictly an oem guy on in-car stereo stuff.

    Now my basement, another story. LEDE (live-end, dead-end) audio room, sound absorbent materials, JBL studio monitors, Carver amp, preamp and sonic hologram, dbx subharmonic synthesizer and sub woofer, Kloss Novabeam.

    No time for it now...gotta drive some more fence posts, string some barb wire. Fresh air, no town square..Green Acres we are there. And ride my dirt bike. Bring yours out here sometime?
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    TV's and other electronics - related?? Don't know, but there commercials are pretty lame...
  • KCRamKCRam Member Posts: 3,516
    and you can't bring yourself to the Blue Oval or the General. You're that loyal to DC. What do you move up to? How about a
    Freightliner 4500?

    kcram
    Co-Host - Smart Shopper & FWI Conferences
    edmunds.com Town Hall
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    Ahh....I'm waiting for the Peterbuilt/Kenworth/Paccar version....

    Question: Now that Mercedes Benz Daimler owns Detroit AND DODGE--what'll happen to the Cummins? It wouldn't make financial sense for long. They'll have to make a choice. Heck, they even have Mercedes diesels to choose from as well.
  • lariat1lariat1 Member Posts: 461
    The July issue of popular science had a small blurb about the next Ram having a MB diesel in it so it looks like the Cummins is gone in 2003.
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    magazines and internet sites have reported it...and I reported it 2 years ago when i heard from injection pump shop that was looking at future pump calibration machines and training: Cummins is gone, MB is in.
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    If Cummins is gone, then would Ford or GM pick them up??
  • jaijayjaijay Member Posts: 162
    That Ford owns Cummins and would keep the Navistar Power Stroke (if it aint broke, don't fix it) for the current and future trucks. GM would not likley jump ship since the Duramax looks like a winner.
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    for the umpteenth time--Ford Does NOt own Cummins.

    GM and Ford will have Isuzu and International for at least the next 5 years, so when the Cummins goes, it will have to pitch for ~2005 to make a return to pickups. the Landscape surely will be quite different then...
  • monugenmonugen Member Posts: 2
    I have given up hope on the Montero, so now I am looking into a Extended cab truck. My question is, which has the most room out of the 4? I need a bench seat in the front, but my main concern is room in the back seat. Also, do they all hold their value as long? Which is the cheapest and so on? Also some of the things that I want in it are air, am/fm cd, cruise, tilt wheel, pl, pw, towing package, alarm and a bed liner. I forgot to mention that I want a 99 with no more than about 27,000 miles on it. Am I being unreasonable? Sorry so many questions, but these are things that I would like to know before pounding the pavement and dealing with dealers! Thanks in advance.
  • timothyadavistimothyadavis Member Posts: 322
    If you are in the Dallas/Fort Worth area you can find a brand new, leftover 1999 (actually, about 25 of them!) conversion F-150 Supercabs with most of the stuff you asked for (only a couple have bed liners and I'm not sure if any have alarms or towing package though) for around $22,000 at Village Ford in Lewisville, TX. They also have running boards, tinted windows, driving lights and CD player radios and come in most of the colors -- maybe 10 with bench seats. I bought one and can tell you for sure that the F-150 is as big as any extended cabs inside. You'd need to go to the Crew Cab (full size 4 door models) for more space, but also considerably more dinero.
  • f150rulesf150rules Member Posts: 195
    I would hold off on buying an F150 any year earlier than 2000, unless you don't mind the risk of piston slap.
    I love Ford trucks and will never own anything else, but I waited till the problems with ps were over before I bought a new one. ps occurred from 97-99 5.4l and some 4.6l trucks. PS does not cause performance or longevity problems, but sounds terrible. If you have a choice, why risk it on such a big expense.
    For a few thousand more, you can have a brand new one that is bullet proof. I bought a brand new F150 Lariat 4X4 Ext Cab with every option possible. Purchased at well below invoice at about $26k. With the onset of the Crew Cab F150's, the Supercabs are about $3k cheaper than before.
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    Piston slap is where? I know many guys, including myself, that have never heard this noise. This is the only place it's talked about. Similar rumors at the Chevy camp about "vibrating" sounds from the Silverado.
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    I have many many friends with '97+ Fords, and about 10 friends with new halfton Silverados.

    No vibrations. No shimmy's. No piston slaps. no door cracks. all happy truck owners.

    well, theres that one Dodge guy....

    i gotta let up!
  • davids1davids1 Member Posts: 411
    Make that two!!!
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    enough for me. Had a '99 and traded for a '00. Funny thing, both were/are shakers...
  • lariat1lariat1 Member Posts: 461
    Well you are definitely a die hard chevy fan. If I get a bad truck I am very hesitant to buy the same type again. That is why I still have no desire to buy a chevy. I had a service problem with my old ford so now I have a dodge so far so good 2 years 60000 miles and not even a whimper the only thing that has broken is the passenger cup holder but that was a combination of operator error and the fact that it was 63 below zero air temp.
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    Lariat,
    Problems happen. Would should sway your decision is the fact if you got a bad one, or if the product is entirely bad.

    If my Chevy's fenders fell off going down the road, I still might buy another one, since I know there are millions out there with no probs.

    another big factor is your dealer. My dealer bends over backwards for me, trying to keep my repeat business. that makes as much, if not more, impact than the product itself.
  • lariat1lariat1 Member Posts: 461
    The dealer is definitely a big factor in ownership it sucks when you need an act of god to get work done on your truck when it is needed. That is the reason I traded my Ford in for a Dodge.
  • f150rulesf150rules Member Posts: 195
    Well, I can't claim any problems myself. Never had any Ford problems, but if you take a look at F150online.com, you will see that there is a ps problem that plagued about 2% of the Triton engine sales. Ford replaced the bad ones and the new 2000 and forward do not have it, but the problem was there.

    Chevy, although not much different than Fords initial model change years, has had more than just vibrations to deal with. Lots of folks have or are having pinging, valve problems, loosening steering shafts, launch shutter, clanking when engaging reverse and even drive in some cases, leaking and noisy windshields and/or rear sliders, just to name a few.

    Ford is not perfect and I am not claiming some kind of Ford superiority here. All trucks and cars will have problems eventually, but you can't ignore problems that do occur. Chevy has had their share. It took Ford almost 3 years to get their new models pretty failproof and bugs worked out. I suspect it will take Chevy about the same. Their are still 2000 year Silverado owners that complain about the same issues that were present in 1999 models.
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    Plagued? Not exactly an apt description when relaying that your sources claim only 2% are affected.
    Yes, I've been to that site but I sensed only a few whiners--which I would suspect anyway when it comes to an internet site.
  • f150rulesf150rules Member Posts: 195
    No. Far from just whining. Legitimate complaints.
    Why would Ford widespread replace piston slap engines with brand new ones in the low mileage trucks and remanufactured engines in others, if the problem was not that big of deal? Granted when you sell as many trucks as Ford, 2% is not that many in comparison, but still thousands of engines with the problem existed.

    Deny it or down-play it if you want, but it doesn't make it any less of a real problem that occurred.
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    where did we get 2% from?

    could be .2
    could be 20
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    Where did I deny it? I've heard of this problem but then again, how much of this is a problem? The piston "slap" has no affect whatsoever on performace or reliability. As far as I can figure, it's purely just an annoyance to guys who didn't want their gas engines sounding like diesels.
    I still ask: 2% is a "plague"??
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Member Posts: 1,352
    What do you mean??

    Doesn't the % mean the decimal has already been moved? In other words .02 of the trucks were affected???? I can't believe 1 out of 5 has it. Even 2 out of 100 sounds high to me.
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    that was just my question. How many really is it? Is it 2 out of 100, 2 out of 10, or 2 out of 1000?

    F150 hasn't replied, so I'm guessing that the number was just 'his guess', and not some published number.

    that would be helpful to know the percentages of the probs that are talked about on this board.

    like that will ever get published.
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Member Posts: 1,352
    I thought you were insinuating it was a higher #.
  • f150rulesf150rules Member Posts: 195
    That was the number I got from the Ford Zone Rep I spoke with before buying my truck. I have known him for years. 2%, .02, 2 out of 100, 2 percent.
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    Has anyone noticed?

    The 2001 6.0 truck engine from GM will have aluminum heads now.
  • swobigswobig Member Posts: 634
    and 325 ponies. Wonder if that 6 cylinder (4.2L) will make it in there...
  • dave40dave40 Member Posts: 582
    Any road reports on the 8.1 Allison ?
  • cdeancdean Member Posts: 1,110
    http://www.pickuptruck.com/html/news/handh.html

    looks like the wildly popular SSR from Chevy is going to make it from the showroom to the factory. Apparently they had an enormous amount of positive feedback on the concept.

    I also read an article in Autoweek (i think) where the columnist got to take a few slow spins around the test track in prototype SSR. Has a mix of 'Vette feel with a little of the PT Crusier nostalgia built in.

    I think the engine will be a high-output 6.0, predicting more hp than this year's 'Vette.

    not gonna buy one, but looks like a really cool car/truck.

    Is it a truck?
  • RoclesRocles Member Posts: 982
    A couple of spins, eh?
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