. . .as I indicated, I had made my appointment to test drive the 300C AWD Saturday. The big blizzard passed Cincinnati by, and I felt the dealer would NOT have any issue with my wife and me taking an AWD 300C out on two day old snow covered streets.
Long story short: dealer had two AWD 300C's in; only one was dealer prepped. While we were awaiting the passing of the keys to test the car, apparently a long time loyal customer phoned the dealer to buy the car sight unseen. Dealer said, "you may get in the car, but not drive it -- if the person buys the car as of 6PM, we'll prep the other car on Monday and you can drive that one." I understand.
My non-driving impressions:
Note -- prior to this, my wife and I had come to the conclusion that the most impressive American car we had ever tested was a 2005 Cadillac SRX V6 with the sport lux package (MSRP $54,000+)!
The interior of this 300C AWD (dark grey leather) was as nice as, or perhaps better, than the Cadillac. The power actuated steering column and sound system were excellent, the seats were firm -- the view over the hood is HUGE, bigger than the SRX's. The switchgear glided and snicked and thunked with the requisite verisimilitude of "premium quality."
The SRX was a V6, the 300C a V8; the SRX was $14,000 MORE than the 300C. The warranty on both was close enough for Jazz. The Chrysler's wheels, despite other's protestations are the nicest wheels on any 300 at any price (which may be not much of a compliment, I'll agree, but I was more impressed with them than with the chrome wheels I have seen previously on 300C's.)
One difference: the wheel fender gap on the AWD 300C is noticable when compared side-by-side with the RWD version.
Price MSRP: over $40,000 -- but not by much (car had nav+sound+sirius+protection group; crystal black pearl (or something like that).
One dealer in Cincinnati is selling the car for sticker plus $4995. This dealership, since I was NOT at that moment buying only said "we do NOT mark the cars up over MSRP." Perhaps that just means "the sticker is the sticker."
This salesperson, not at all slimy, suggested that there were some major changes coming in 2006, "more colors and interior choices, more options like rear seat entertainment, more wheel choices, etc." Salesman also said another manufacturing facility was coming on line and that supply during the second half of the year wouldn't be so tight. Quoted 14 weeks for an order (although he said all dealers are on allocation -- he said they have been selling 100% of their monthly allocation which means every month their allocation grows in quantity by model. He said they were allocated 6 300C's per month last month and that is has grown this month.)
Can I see myself, after over 27 Audis, driving this car? I think so.
Can I see myself starting all over at the bottom of the customer pecking order, knowing that my wife and I are in the top quartile at the Audi dealer (in terms of "treatment and customer service?") This is a much tougher question; MAYBE a test drive and $11,000 (lower than an A6 3.2) will "weigh more" than I can currently imagine.
Never in my life would I have dreamed it would be THIS difficult to arrange a simple test drive; perhaps next week.
Sir...I am going to go out and test drive a 300C in my city (Which is smaller than yours I believe) just to find out what I may have missed out on. (Nevermind the money I could have saved!) I will report back to you! ;-)
Mark: Wow....customer service at its finest. I wonder what the service department is like? I think you aree a confirmed Audi driver. You should 12 step it and admit it. Cicero
I am an american soldier living in Germany (Stuttgart...home of DC) I have driven BOTH the 300C and 300C AWD here (that means no speed limits in some areas!). I just ordered my fully loaded 2006 300C AWD (delivery May 2005). After serving my country for 18 years I finally get a break...price break. The discount I was given more than made up for the extra cost of the AWD. After driving both cars on dry pavement and in the snow (the A8 Stuttgart to Munich) I had to go with the AWD! Unbelievable handling combined with the stares of the other drivers I was blowing by convinced me. Both cars are fantastic, I just prefer the handling of the AWD. I drive VIPs and have been to DC's school as well as a few offensive/defensive driving schools in the US so I think the AWD vs. RWD thing is a matter of driving style and preference. Once I test drove my first 300 (in the states in September) I was hooked, but I had to try the HEMI. I can't wait till May...
Mark, just read your post and had to tell you that I just converted from an Audi A6 2.7T Quattro to the new 300C AWD. I was lucky enough to stop by a dealer in December (on a whim) to see when the AWD's were going to be arriving. They had one on order in "D" status that was not yet sold. I bought it that night, for sticker, and it arrived 30 days later. I can tell you that this car is every bit as nice as my A6, less expensive, more powerful, has more equipment, and looks much better. I had it out in a Minnesota snowstorm last Friday and it handled as well or better than my Audi. It was awesome! Dry pavement handling it just as impressive. Let me know your thoughts after your test drive, and good luck!
I've only seen photos, but the wheel fender gap on the 300C AWD is very noticeable and doesn't look good. Does anyone know what was the design consideration for raising the body on the AWD version? Does it really look as bad as the photos show?
The Chrysler dealer where I had hoped to drive the 300C AWD is in an auto mall. So, when, once again, we couldn't test drive the 300C AWD, we drove over to the Infiniti dealer next door.
Took a long drive of an Infiniti G35x (2005).
This car would probably end up being for my wife -- if we were to go with a Japanese car (my wife has some difficulty abandoning "European" cars (notably German brands). But this car was impressive -- I can see why it made C&D's top ten list for two years.
Thanks for the review of the 300C AWD from the persepctive of a former Audi driver.
There is wheel gap on all of the models especially the 300. The wheel gap on the 300C RWD (with 18s) is the same as the wheel gap on the AWD (with 18s). 20s will fill the gap a liitle more and that is what most of the pictures on the web seem to have now. 20s will also be stardard equipment on the SRT-8.
I have driven my 300C now for 1400 miles. Where did they get their gas mileage figures? I get about 15 mpg around town and maybe 18mpg on the highway. Does that sound right or am I just driving like a maniac?
You may be driving like a maniac (who wouldn't with a new 300C!), but your main problem is the car will likely take 3 - 4,000 miles to break in. You should start to see better gas mileage after you reach 2,000 miles.
At least, that has been my experience with 2 300M's. However, they didn't have the hemi engine....
I have put 13,500 highway miles on my 300C in about 5 months. A friend pointed out that my front tires were cupped. Coincidentally, my service engine light came on. While dropping it off at a dealer to check on the light, I asked about the tire wear. The technician contributes the wear to not rotating, and also told me the rear tires need replaced because the center of them is bald. I know I should have rotated sooner but is this a little ridiculous? I have never layed a patch of rubber since a bought the car. The car still handles like the day I bright it home.
The service light was on for 7 different codes, including one for the CD player. They asked me if the car was involved in a flood because they have never seen so many codes. They reset it and told me to just wait to see if it came back on. I think a new computer may be in my future.
Let me first say that I'm not a tire expert, but I've been around enough to know the folklore about tires. In my experience, cupping is not going to be corrected by rotating. You'll just get more cupped tires. I believe cupping is caused by worn/broken shock absorbers. It certainly is not a normal ware pattern. The bald center on the rear tires is probably caused by over-inflation. Could be caused by an over-zealous J-Team when you get an oil change. I've had that happen to me: if 30 pounds is good; 40 pounds is better. Check your pressure and try to check your front shocks.
Back when the car was first being prepped for IronWorks, a worker in the shop (and not the sharpest knife in this particular drawer I might add) responsible for the 300C in question, let the extra "Transit Air" out of the front tires, and then forgot which set he'd done. Thinking to himself, "Hmmm, did I do the front or the rear, well, I think I did the rear tires first and since I can't find my gauge, I'll just do the fronts this time." The result; 16 lbs. in the front tires and 45 lbs. in the rears.
Yup, that should just about explain cupped front tires and bald in the middle of the tread rear tires. I think that Mr. IronWorks should lean on the dealership for a little compensation regarding those tires.
What ever happened to checking your tire pressure every week and visually inspecting the tires every month or so? Shouldn't the cupping and extra wear in the middle have been noticed earlier before so much damage was done to the tires? I find it disturbing for someone to expect compensation for something as simple as over inflation. The cupping issue may be compensable if there is an alignment or shock problem with the car. Even then, if someone is paying even a little attention to their vehicle that should have been noticed before it got so bad. I guess a lot of people just get in the car and drive, doing nothing more than putting in gas. I checked my tire pressure the morning after I bought the car and have every week since. I have looked for unususal tire wear each week as well. It only takes 5 minutes a week.
Sorry Shipo, it had been a long day already when I read your post. Of course, considering my occupation, I see people every day who are trying to blame others for everything. It seems to have become a national pastime! Please accept my sincere apologies!
A national newspaper hopes to talk with a consumer who traded in a Mercedes for a Chrysler 300C. Please respond to jfallon@edmunds.com no later than Tuesday, February 8, 2005 with your daytime contact info and a few words about your decision.
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maybe i'm not sure what cupping is. i thought that was the term for when the shoulders of the tires are wearing faster than the center, which is due to underinflation.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
"Cupping can be caused by an unbalanced tire condition, faulty wheel bearings, loose parts, fatigued springs or weak shock absorbers. Check the condition of the shock by forcefully bouncing the front end of the car several times and releasing it on the down stroke. Failure of the vehicle to settle after two strokes suggests worn shocks or struts."
I leased a BMW 530 with sports suspension. It had performance tires. BMW tuned the suspension so that the front had a camber setting that pulled the tires away from the car. So that when you cornered hard the tire on the outside as it lifted kept more tread on the ground. With wide soft tires this helped to give more traction and the car held nicely. But I noticed that the front cupped quickly. the tires lasted about 18000 and I got another set. Even when I rotated them every 3000 miles they still cupped as fast as the first set. BMW also recommend more pressure in the rears that caused them to wear in the center. So maybe DC is trying to give you better performance and is tuning the suspension a little.
thanks for the link, but that still doesn't tell me what cupping IS. That link also talks about wear on the shoulders and how that is related to underinflation, as I stated. So, apparently, cupping is a different type of wear, but what type? what does it look like?
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
As you run your hand along the outside or inside edge of the tire you will feel ridges along the tread edges sort of a concave effect thats like a cup. The tires will also start to whine as the ridges get deeper.
I would describe cupping as uneven wear on the outside edges of the tire. Unlike underinflation which would cause a uniform "balding" along the edges, cupping would result in many bald spots spaced several inches apart along the edge. Bald spots would be the extreme manifestation. Earlier indications would be uneven wear of the tire pattern (cleats?) at the edge of the tire. It is an unusual condition. Main causes (probably not all) are out of balance tires or faulty shocks followed by worn suspension components.
If you were able to keep these tires (on the BMW) for 18,000 miles you did just fine. 15,000 to 20,000 is about the best anyone can do with these Max Performance Summer tires.
They are designed for performance at the expense of wear. BMW, Audi, Porshce and some Mercedes use Max performance (which is the final step above Ultra High performance) "summer tires" -- my wife's second TT tires were basically "gone" at 13,000 miles and the car was maintained "by the book" at the dealer.
The Acura NSX and some of the Porsche's needed new rubber sometimes as soon as 6,000 miles. I had a set of Pirelli tires ONE TIME, that sacrificed themselves for my "driving pleasure" by about 8,000 miles. I have since switched to UHP tires and can now exceed 20,000 miles without concern about the tire's efficacy.
Now, I find it difficult to believe that the 300C would have such Max performance tires (the SRT-8 MAYBE) -- this cupping is caused as noted above. I would hope that the 300C's OEM tires would go over 25,000 miles with relative ease.
I have a 300C w Continental Self Sealing tires. On the tires it says: Maximum tire pressure 51 Lbs. It doesn't say what the optimum pressure is. The sticker on the car does not name that tire specifically but the size and suggests somewhere around 34 if I remember correctly. 2300 miles on my car in winter driving. Only problem is broken knob on the Nav system wh they w fix.
Very solid car. Fun to drive. Quiet if the Boston stereo isn't going full blast. Acceleration is outstanding. It even sounds as "bad" as it looks. It's too bad that some people get a lemon. Mine is no lemon. If mine were, I can understand how my thoughts and feelings would be jaded. I hope Chrysler "makes good" for people. They have called me three times to ask how things were, plus one mail in survey and two phone surveys. What can I say???
Oh yea, I drove on salt covered roads and didn't wash it for a week. Today after the car wash I looked / touched the rims and their edges etc and saw no pitting that someone else complained about. Maybe they drove through an acid spill. A damp then dry cloth got rid of water spots.
Mark, I was shocked to see you on this forum. Interestingly enough, I am very interested in the 300C AWD, only one of which I can locate on Chrysler's web page for a 50 mile radius! I've driven the 2wd C, and liked it. Missed the ease of manually directing the shifting similar to Audi's version, and felt the caster was different, as the wheel didn't return to straight after turning a corner. In all fairness, the car had almost NO fuel, a dirty windshield, and I didn't get far enough from the dealer to really be sure it was warm.
I will likely get out of my TT 3.2 DSG Roadster early, as the fun is overshadowed by the inconvenience of lack of storage, comfort for my spouses's tush, etc. I am actually disappointed I turned in my A6 early. I've put the car up on lease trader, but no action for a month. Probably because the payments for the next 14 months are about $770. Anyway, if the A6 has gone up that much, I'll probably go with the 300C, as the CTS seems small, and dated, and the STS seems too large, and way too expensive. Unfortunately, both the STS and 300C AWD are quite scarce now.
It's good to see your name again, as I haven't browsed the forums for over a year. I lost your email address when I had a crash a month or so ago. HA! Hell of a note!!
Audi is still on my short list. But the 300C and the Acura RL and even the Infiniti M's cannot be overlooked. Even the upcoming Bimmer 3 and 5 AWD's merit consideration. Audi is no longer alone, that is.
The 300C AWD is quite the value -- and from reading, it is also quite the performer.
It's funny how I got all excited when pricing out the A6 this morning. I've owned 5 911s, and don't remember that much excitement, considering luxury, appointments, performance, i.e., whole package!! Guess my old age is showing. I could keep the Audi on my short list, but may very well go with the 300C AWD.
I have been reading through this complete forum after having purchased my 300 in Nov/2004. Excellent discussion about this terrific vehicle. Even though I purchased the 300 with most of the available options I wondered whether it might be possible to upgrade the headlight system from standard to the H.I.D system that is available on the 300C. Has anyone considered this option or know if this is something practical to consider.
. . .it would be cheaper to trade your current car in on another one with Xenons rather than try to retrofit them to your current car.
I do not know if this is LITERALLY true. However, I have been participating in these forms for years and years and whenever this question comes up, someone who knows the technical hurdles usually explains why this, although possible, is generally thought to be too expensive. Perhaps Chrysler has somehow managed to build this car in such a way that this is both possible and affordable.
Good luck.
I don't know if this feature was available or not, so this question is not meant to be impertinent: why would anyone get a brand new car without HID lights (if they were available)? If you have ever driven or ridden in a car with these lights, you certainly can attest to their efficacy -- heck, I'll go so far as to say, these lights could save your life.
But, while I'm on my soapbox, why would anyone get a car without ESP (or stability control) if such technology was available on the car one was considering buying? The cost of these two technological marvels is relatively low and the very fact that it is NOT an overstatement to claim these features could save your life would seem to compel new car buyers to demand these features.
I love the Black loaded 300C AWD I have a deposit on. I hate the fact that I couldn't get the dealer to move AT ALL off of the $40800 list price. Except for tossing in a remote starter I can't get any concessions. This is the only one I could find in a 50mile radius of Danbury, CT where I live.
So... can owners reply w/reliability, concerns, issues, experience and recommendation? thanks!
PS: lastly my 2nd choice right now is the Infiniti G35x
Have had HID lights--very good except for sharp cutoff. Do not have them now but have installed Sylvania BrightStar bulbs. Best way you can spend $40 to improve your lighting. Also you can adjust them for more distance lighting without problems for oncoming cars. Go from yellow lights to white.Not as bright as HID but great improvement.
After several years of not posting at Edmunds, I’m surprised and delighted to see Mark here, as well as other folks from the ranks of Audi drivers. Though I’m not in the market for a new car right now, I find the 300C occupying my automotive fantasies as an eventual replacement for my former non-sport ‘01 A6 2.7T.
I was fascinated by the aesthetic of the new 300, and excited by the many glowing reviews of the driving experience. The pleasure an auto offers while driving it is probably paramount among my criteria. I prefer a roomy, fast, good-handling touring sedan to sports cars. If I like it’s looks, so much the better.
The new Durante grill on the A6 and other new Audi’s isn’t as great a turn off for me as it seems to be for many. Other aspects are more disappointing. The original new ’98 A6 was a WOW of design departure with creativity and brilliance evident in almost every detail. Its replacement is not. The exterior goes from “huh?” to yawn. While its interior is less attractive, and amazingly, perhaps a tad snugger even though the car is bigger. The quality of materials and fit and finish are still excellent, though not to quite as high a standard as my old ’01. I haven’t driven one yet.
I began to satisfy my curiosity by visiting the nearest Chrysler dealership where there were originally plenty of 300’s sitting around the lot. My reaction echoed what I’d read in automotive magazines; “This is a Chrysler?” They were well put together with an excellent (Though not quite Audi) level of fit and finish. The interior was very roomy and comfortable, and the materials were better than reviews had led me to believe. And the 300C’s stickered for about $10K-$12K less than my A6 had.
Over several months I watched 300’s arrive and depart the dealership. I saw a few that had botched paint jobs with plenty of orange peel and poorer fit. Though in fairness, I’ve seen new Mercedes with plenty of orange peel too, and have even seen it on some body panels on some new Audi’s. I noticed when looking at the construction and welds in the door jam, engine compartment, etc., that this is obviously a simpler and ruder technique of body construction than that used to produce an A6. That doesn’t bother me very much, as the overall result in appearance and solidity is impressive. However, I wouldn’t accept delivery of some the cars that had really screwed up paint.
The dealer salesman with whom I dealt was charming, but the process was a little comical. He likes trucks, the dealer likes trucks, and they like to sell trucks! He really didn’t seem to know what to make of the 300C, or $30K+ sedans in general. Chrysler seems to have lightning in a bottle. Let’s see what they do with it. The initial dealer response to low inventories has been predictable; I’ve seen dealers trying to add $3K to $5K to the sticker!
My first impression on the RWD 300C test drive was that this was the best American car I’d ever driven by a huge margin. It didn’t feel as big as I thought it would. It was both much quieter and smoother than my ’01 A6. The interior is delightful. It is attractive, roomy and very comfortable to drive. I would sum up the driving experience as stately. I treat new, unbroken-in cars pretty gently. Given that, I thought the engine powerful, though not in the ripping, kick-in-the-pants nature of the 2.7T.
I found myself exceeding the speed limit by 10 to 20mph in 40 and 50mph zones with no sensation of the extra speed. The handling is very good, though not quite as nimble as the A6’s, though the excessive body roll of the older non-sport A6’s is absent. The brakes were adequate, though much less powerful than those on my A6. Break-in may alter this comparison, as it will almost certainly affect engine performance as well.
Much of the brilliance of an A6 and other Audi’s is found at the extremes. As I’m not willing to bring any new, unpurchased car to that point, I found myself wondering how the 300 would compare in those situations to the A6. My initial test drive suggests the A6 would be substantially superior. But I don’t spend much time driving a car at its limits, so I don’t think these extra margins would necessarily affect a buying decision for me.
I too am most interested in the AWD version. Those of us familiar with Audi’s quattro know that there’s a trade-off. The extra weight and friction result in a slightly slower car, and reduced gas mileage. I doubt the effect will be too great on the 300. The few posts I’ve read here about the 300C with AWD are very promising since the drivers seemed to love the result of AWD on the driving experience.
I do wonder about the difference between the center differential system used on the AWD 300 compared to the Torsen center differential of Audi’s. That’s one thing that has worked very well, and has been bulletproof on Audi’s. I also wonder about the overall level of problems the 300 is likely to experience. Audi’s aren’t nearly as bad as many think, but they are sometimes not flawless. I would be surprised if the overall number of trouble a 300 driver will experience will be either much greater, or much less than has been the experience among A6’s.
I just picked up my 300c AWD and it is awesome. The AWD was put to the test already and worked flawlessly in a heavy snow storm. Glad I made the decision to go with AWD.
The wheel fender gap bothered me when I first saw the car (ordered it sight unseen) but with the 18's it isn't that bad. Probably about 1/2 inch more fender gap than the RWD 300C though. The news I'm receiving on changing the wheels isn't good however. An addendum to the manual states that all wheels must have the same size and type tires. Unequal tire sizes must not be used because it may cause failure of the front differential and/or transfer case.
Looking into lowering springs. Will keep you posted.
You can get them at just about any autoparts store. I've not looked, but I hear they even sell them at the discount stores. Be sure to get The Silverstars and not a cheap imitation. These are pretty white, not the boy racer blue.
does anyone know when orders stop for the Chrysler 300 2005 models and when 2006 production starts. I'm asking because it was just about a year ago that the 2005 went into production - so will 2006 start soon, or not until the traditional August time frame? Also, if anyone knows how the '06's will be structured content-wise; apparently i'ts a Detroit mode of operation to decontent cars as they age, model-wise.
Comments
Long story short: dealer had two AWD 300C's in; only one was dealer prepped. While we were awaiting the passing of the keys to test the car, apparently a long time loyal customer phoned the dealer to buy the car sight unseen. Dealer said, "you may get in the car, but not drive it -- if the person buys the car as of 6PM, we'll prep the other car on Monday and you can drive that one." I understand.
My non-driving impressions:
Note -- prior to this, my wife and I had come to the conclusion that the most impressive American car we had ever tested was a 2005 Cadillac SRX V6 with the sport lux package (MSRP $54,000+)!
The interior of this 300C AWD (dark grey leather) was as nice as, or perhaps better, than the Cadillac. The power actuated steering column and sound system were excellent, the seats were firm -- the view over the hood is HUGE, bigger than the SRX's. The switchgear glided and snicked and thunked with the requisite verisimilitude of "premium quality."
The SRX was a V6, the 300C a V8; the SRX was $14,000 MORE than the 300C. The warranty on both was close enough for Jazz. The Chrysler's wheels, despite other's protestations are the nicest wheels on any 300 at any price (which may be not much of a compliment, I'll agree, but I was more impressed with them than with the chrome wheels I have seen previously on 300C's.)
One difference: the wheel fender gap on the AWD 300C is noticable when compared side-by-side with the RWD version.
Price MSRP: over $40,000 -- but not by much (car had nav+sound+sirius+protection group; crystal black pearl (or something like that).
One dealer in Cincinnati is selling the car for sticker plus $4995. This dealership, since I was NOT at that moment buying only said "we do NOT mark the cars up over MSRP." Perhaps that just means "the sticker is the sticker."
This salesperson, not at all slimy, suggested that there were some major changes coming in 2006, "more colors and interior choices, more options like rear seat entertainment, more wheel choices, etc." Salesman also said another manufacturing facility was coming on line and that supply during the second half of the year wouldn't be so tight. Quoted 14 weeks for an order (although he said all dealers are on allocation -- he said they have been selling 100% of their monthly allocation which means every month their allocation grows in quantity by model. He said they were allocated 6 300C's per month last month and that is has grown this month.)
Can I see myself, after over 27 Audis, driving this car? I think so.
Can I see myself starting all over at the bottom of the customer pecking order, knowing that my wife and I are in the top quartile at the Audi dealer (in terms of "treatment and customer service?") This is a much tougher question; MAYBE a test drive and $11,000 (lower than an A6 3.2) will "weigh more" than I can currently imagine.
Never in my life would I have dreamed it would be THIS difficult to arrange a simple test drive; perhaps next week.
Let me know, thanks!
Took a long drive of an Infiniti G35x (2005).
This car would probably end up being for my wife -- if we were to go with a Japanese car (my wife has some difficulty abandoning "European" cars (notably German brands). But this car was impressive -- I can see why it made C&D's top ten list for two years.
Thanks for the review of the 300C AWD from the persepctive of a former Audi driver.
Maybe next week.
At least, that has been my experience with 2 300M's. However, they didn't have the hemi engine....
The service light was on for 7 different codes, including one for the CD player. They asked me if the car was involved in a flood because they have never seen so many codes. They reset it and told me to just wait to see if it came back on. I think a new computer may be in my future.
Let me first say that I'm not a tire expert, but I've been around enough to know the folklore about tires. In my experience, cupping is not going to be corrected by rotating. You'll just get more cupped tires. I believe cupping is caused by worn/broken shock absorbers. It certainly is not a normal ware pattern. The bald center on the rear tires is probably caused by over-inflation. Could be caused by an over-zealous J-Team when you get an oil change. I've had that happen to me: if 30 pounds is good; 40 pounds is better. Check your pressure and try to check your front shocks.
My .02
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
Back when the car was first being prepped for IronWorks, a worker in the shop (and not the sharpest knife in this particular drawer I might add) responsible for the 300C in question, let the extra "Transit Air" out of the front tires, and then forgot which set he'd done. Thinking to himself, "Hmmm, did I do the front or the rear, well, I think I did the rear tires first and since I can't find my gauge, I'll just do the fronts this time." The result; 16 lbs. in the front tires and 45 lbs. in the rears.
Yup, that should just about explain cupped front tires and bald in the middle of the tread rear tires. I think that Mr. IronWorks should lean on the dealership for a little compensation regarding those tires.
Best Regards,
Shipo
Best Regards,
Shipo
I hereby instruct the gods of reason to go easy on hardhawk for the rest of the week. ;-)
Best Regards,
Shipo
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'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
"Cupping can be caused by an unbalanced tire condition, faulty wheel bearings, loose parts, fatigued springs or weak shock absorbers. Check the condition of the shock by forcefully bouncing the front end of the car several times and releasing it on the down stroke. Failure of the vehicle to settle after two strokes suggests worn shocks or struts."
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
try this one...scroll down and find the pic and description.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
They are designed for performance at the expense of wear. BMW, Audi, Porshce and some Mercedes use Max performance (which is the final step above Ultra High performance) "summer tires" -- my wife's second TT tires were basically "gone" at 13,000 miles and the car was maintained "by the book" at the dealer.
The Acura NSX and some of the Porsche's needed new rubber sometimes as soon as 6,000 miles. I had a set of Pirelli tires ONE TIME, that sacrificed themselves for my "driving pleasure" by about 8,000 miles. I have since switched to UHP tires and can now exceed 20,000 miles without concern about the tire's efficacy.
Now, I find it difficult to believe that the 300C would have such Max performance tires (the SRT-8 MAYBE) -- this cupping is caused as noted above. I would hope that the 300C's OEM tires would go over 25,000 miles with relative ease.
Very solid car. Fun to drive. Quiet if the Boston stereo isn't going full blast. Acceleration is outstanding. It even sounds as "bad" as it looks. It's too bad that some people get a lemon. Mine is no lemon. If mine were, I can understand how my thoughts and feelings would be jaded. I hope Chrysler "makes good" for people. They have called me three times to ask how things were, plus one mail in survey and two phone surveys. What can I say???
Oh yea, I drove on salt covered roads and didn't wash it for a week. Today after the car wash I looked / touched the rims and their edges etc and saw no pitting that someone else complained about. Maybe they drove through an acid spill. A damp then dry cloth got rid of water spots.
Does anyone have the 3.5 v6 ?? Is it adequate?
really dont need another hemi (Durango).
I know the hemi is nice, but this could be more of a commuter car - so i am going for gas mileage.
there seem to be plenty of V6's at the dealers, so I was hoping to get a little less than MRSP.
Thanks
Dan
I just got my 300C AWD via the Costco program and got it on that pricing basis, which was much better than any other dealer was willing to do for me.
I got the $1,000 rebate by borrowing the minimum required ($10K), but you can pay off the loan after 3 payments, so it's a pretty sweet deal.
I will likely get out of my TT 3.2 DSG Roadster early, as the fun is overshadowed by the inconvenience of lack of storage, comfort for my spouses's tush, etc. I am actually disappointed I turned in my A6 early. I've put the car up on lease trader, but no action for a month. Probably because the payments for the next 14 months are about $770. Anyway, if the A6 has gone up that much, I'll probably go with the 300C, as the CTS seems small, and dated, and the STS seems too large, and way too expensive. Unfortunately, both the STS and 300C AWD are quite scarce now.
It's good to see your name again, as I haven't browsed the forums for over a year. I lost your email address when I had a crash a month or so ago. HA! Hell of a note!!
jk
The 300C AWD is quite the value -- and from reading, it is also quite the performer.
jk
I have been reading through this complete forum after having purchased my 300 in Nov/2004. Excellent discussion about this terrific vehicle. Even though I purchased the 300 with most of the available options I wondered whether it might be possible to upgrade the headlight system from standard to the H.I.D system that is available on the 300C. Has anyone considered this option or know if this is something practical to consider.
Thanks to everyone for a terrific forum!
kroache
I do not know if this is LITERALLY true. However, I have been participating in these forms for years and years and whenever this question comes up, someone who knows the technical hurdles usually explains why this, although possible, is generally thought to be too expensive. Perhaps Chrysler has somehow managed to build this car in such a way that this is both possible and affordable.
Good luck.
I don't know if this feature was available or not, so this question is not meant to be impertinent: why would anyone get a brand new car without HID lights (if they were available)? If you have ever driven or ridden in a car with these lights, you certainly can attest to their efficacy -- heck, I'll go so far as to say, these lights could save your life.
But, while I'm on my soapbox, why would anyone get a car without ESP (or stability control) if such technology was available on the car one was considering buying? The cost of these two technological marvels is relatively low and the very fact that it is NOT an overstatement to claim these features could save your life would seem to compel new car buyers to demand these features.
Still couldn't drive a 300C AWD -- could've driven a non C AWD, decided to pass.
So... can owners reply w/reliability, concerns, issues, experience and recommendation? thanks!
PS: lastly my 2nd choice right now is the Infiniti G35x
I was fascinated by the aesthetic of the new 300, and excited by the many glowing reviews of the driving experience. The pleasure an auto offers while driving it is probably paramount among my criteria. I prefer a roomy, fast, good-handling touring sedan to sports cars. If I like it’s looks, so much the better.
The new Durante grill on the A6 and other new Audi’s isn’t as great a turn off for me as it seems to be for many. Other aspects are more disappointing. The original new ’98 A6 was a WOW of design departure with creativity and brilliance evident in almost every detail. Its replacement is not. The exterior goes from “huh?” to yawn. While its interior is less attractive, and amazingly, perhaps a tad snugger even though the car is bigger. The quality of materials and fit and finish are still excellent, though not to quite as high a standard as my old ’01. I haven’t driven one yet.
I began to satisfy my curiosity by visiting the nearest Chrysler dealership where there were originally plenty of 300’s sitting around the lot. My reaction echoed what I’d read in automotive magazines; “This is a Chrysler?” They were well put together with an excellent (Though not quite Audi) level of fit and finish. The interior was very roomy and comfortable, and the materials were better than reviews had led me to believe. And the 300C’s stickered for about $10K-$12K less than my A6 had.
Over several months I watched 300’s arrive and depart the dealership. I saw a few that had botched paint jobs with plenty of orange peel and poorer fit. Though in fairness, I’ve seen new Mercedes with plenty of orange peel too, and have even seen it on some body panels on some new Audi’s. I noticed when looking at the construction and welds in the door jam, engine compartment, etc., that this is obviously a simpler and ruder technique of body construction than that used to produce an A6. That doesn’t bother me very much, as the overall result in appearance and solidity is impressive. However, I wouldn’t accept delivery of some the cars that had really screwed up paint.
The dealer salesman with whom I dealt was charming, but the process was a little comical. He likes trucks, the dealer likes trucks, and they like to sell trucks! He really didn’t seem to know what to make of the 300C, or $30K+ sedans in general. Chrysler seems to have lightning in a bottle. Let’s see what they do with it. The initial dealer response to low inventories has been predictable; I’ve seen dealers trying to add $3K to $5K to the sticker!
My first impression on the RWD 300C test drive was that this was the best American car I’d ever driven by a huge margin. It didn’t feel as big as I thought it would. It was both much quieter and smoother than my ’01 A6. The interior is delightful. It is attractive, roomy and very comfortable to drive. I would sum up the driving experience as stately. I treat new, unbroken-in cars pretty gently. Given that, I thought the engine powerful, though not in the ripping, kick-in-the-pants nature of the 2.7T.
I found myself exceeding the speed limit by 10 to 20mph in 40 and 50mph zones with no sensation of the extra speed. The handling is very good, though not quite as nimble as the A6’s, though the excessive body roll of the older non-sport A6’s is absent. The brakes were adequate, though much less powerful than those on my A6. Break-in may alter this comparison, as it will almost certainly affect engine performance as well.
Much of the brilliance of an A6 and other Audi’s is found at the extremes. As I’m not willing to bring any new, unpurchased car to that point, I found myself wondering how the 300 would compare in those situations to the A6. My initial test drive suggests the A6 would be substantially superior. But I don’t spend much time driving a car at its limits, so I don’t think these extra margins would necessarily affect a buying decision for me.
I too am most interested in the AWD version. Those of us familiar with Audi’s quattro know that there’s a trade-off. The extra weight and friction result in a slightly slower car, and reduced gas mileage. I doubt the effect will be too great on the 300. The few posts I’ve read here about the 300C with AWD are very promising since the drivers seemed to love the result of AWD on the driving experience.
I do wonder about the difference between the center differential system used on the AWD 300 compared to the Torsen center differential of Audi’s. That’s one thing that has worked very well, and has been bulletproof on Audi’s. I also wonder about the overall level of problems the 300 is likely to experience. Audi’s aren’t nearly as bad as many think, but they are sometimes not flawless. I would be surprised if the overall number of trouble a 300 driver will experience will be either much greater, or much less than has been the experience among A6’s.
The wheel fender gap bothered me when I first saw the car (ordered it sight unseen) but with the 18's it isn't that bad. Probably about 1/2 inch more fender gap than the RWD 300C though. The news I'm receiving on changing the wheels isn't good however. An addendum to the manual states that all wheels must have the same size and type tires. Unequal tire sizes must not be used because it may cause failure of the front differential and/or transfer case.
Looking into lowering springs. Will keep you posted.
http://www.us.leaseplan.com/fleet_resources/fr_pnews.htm
- Ray
Not leasing right now . .