Subaru Legacy/Outback 2005+

dieselram · March 2005

I will be taking in my wife's car next week and told the "service" person of the stumble. We have mentioned it the last time it was in for an oil change, but their excuse was that the car was "learning" the driver's driving habbits ... yeah right. Since my wife brought in the car she did not question them ... I WILL. I am asking for a computer diag. and a list of any software updates that are needed for the car.
I will ask about disconnecting the battery (who know what that will do to all the other electrical components).
Thanks for the info, I'm sure it will come in handy.

xwesx · March 2005

Disconnecting the battery should not adversely affect any of the electrical components. The only inconvenience your wife should experience is needing to reset any customized controls, like the ACC and stereo.

kens · March 2005

Actually, I believe the radio will retain it's presets even after disconnecting the battery. My previous 98 Forester did and I don't see why it wouldn't with the current head unit.

But yes, there aren't any adverse electrical effects of disconnecting the battery. If there were, it would be detailed in the owner's manual under battery replacement.

The only thing I can think of that you need to be prepared for is the alarm going off when you reconnect the battery. Keep that keyfob handy!

Ken

ssminton · March 2005

I have an appointment with Sean on Saturday. Thanks!

twrx · March 2005

I've had my Legacy 2.5i LTD auto wagon since Oct. I had not thought to check the tire pressure. It was about 25 lbs in the tires. So i aired up to 35. City mileage is now at 23. I recently went to Louisville one weekend and Nashville another. Mileage was 30 for each round trip but on the way down there I was averaging 32. Zipping around in traffic in downtown Nashvill reduced it to 30. I have only 8000 on the car and my previous experiences showed big increases in mileage at 20,000!

ateixeira · March 2005

Cool, Bruce, I bet it was a combination of tire pressure plus the engine being less green.

-juice

hat · March 2005

It's a pretty reasonable assumption that the 2.5NA engine for the '06 Leg/OB will get the same AVLS enhancement (and 8-hp bump) as Forester.

I noticed that the base (X) Forester now has a fold-down rear-seat armrest, and am hoping that the base OB gets the same upgrade. That's about the only feature of the higher OB trim levels that I'd like to see flowed down to the base model.

I hope they DON'T re-align OB trim levels like they've done with Forester. I don't want a sunroof (for headroom reasons), and don't like that you'd have to get a sunroof on the '06 Forester in order to get useful goodies like alloys, limited-slip, all-weather package, etc. I fear they'll decide to "de-content" the base OB to encourage customers to step up to the OBL.

piperboy72 · March 2005

I just bought a 2.5i OBW a few weeks ago. This is a great forum. I searched here and found out how to disable the incredibly annoying seat belt chime. I am so thankful to have that information. Now for my next quest. Does anyone here knows how to modify the perimeter alarm sensitivity settings? I had the alarm upgrade added as a dealer installed option when I bought the car. However it does not appear to do anything other than to flash the "security" light on the dash, even when jumping on the hood of the car. Does that sound right?

locke2c · March 2005

it's a motion sensor, and it should start honking the horn when the alarm goes off.

you figured out how to buckle your seatbelt? good for you!

robr2 · March 2005

New Toys

xwesx · March 2005

Hehe... I tried to play with them earlier, but the server crashed on me. :lemon:

occking · March 2005

Someone tell me again how to disable the front seatbelt chime please! Don't worry--seatbelts are always used by all passengers all the time. There are just some instances in which the car is parked, or for some other reason & seatbelts not required.

sduford · March 2005

Turn ignition to ON, lock an unlock seatbelt 20 times within 30 seconds, turn ignition to OFF.

That's it!

piperboy72 · April 2005

The problem is that the alarm does not go off when the car is in motion (ie..jumping on the hood, tipping the car onto two wheels, etc). The alarm will go off if I open the door through the window so I know the alarm is armed. I assume that the problem is the motion sensor (perimeter alarm) sensitivity settings are too low. Can these settings be adjusted by me, or does it need to be performed by a dealer as it states in the manual? (P2-29 "You can have the sensitivity of the shock sensors adjusted to your preference by your SUBARU dealer")

luck11 · April 2005

Sorry...a bit late in the discussion. But my OBXTL 5MT is still hesitating upon acceleration after 2,500 miles on odometer. I did report it to the dealer and they confirmed that they have noticed it with other XTs, but no official fix from Subaru Canada. Presume the same in US. :mad:

locke2c · April 2005

the shock sensor can be adjusted by any competent dealer, or even an aftermarket security installer --if you have an ovoid remote, it's Alpine.

of course, a Subaru dealer should do this for free.

~c

fj60 · April 2005

I know the mileage issue has already been discussed to the nth degree, but I had a question for manual transmission owners.

According to the owner's manual, the shift points for the GT (balanced for performance vs.mileage) are 20 mph, 30 mph and 40 mph for 2nd, 3rd and 4th respectively. This is unnecessarily high for me even for casual driving because that translate to shifting gears when the engine is running close to 3000 rpm. How low, RPM-wise, can I short shift to gain some improvement in mileage?

FJ60
2005 GT Lmt Wgn 5MT

ateixeira · April 2005

I'd say that's about right. You don't want to lug the engine, i.e. overload it at low rpms.

-juice

locke2c · April 2005

under very light throttle -- like manuevering in a parking lot-- you can get away with 2,000 rpm or below.

in normal driving you'll be best served to shift between 2,500 and 3,000 rpm. light throttle, say 20-25%, will get you the best gas mileage and revving to 3,000 honestly is pretty irrelevant compared to 2,500 assuming the same throttle input.

~Colin

saintviper · April 2005

Picked up my new Legacy GT Limited wagon on Wednesday. Kinda difficult to tell what exactly I paid for the car because the dealers seem to like charging full price for the car and applying any discounts to the value of the trade. If I look at how much more they gave me for my trade over the blue book value, it seems like I got the car for pretty close to invoice price. Some calculations put me a couple hundred over, others a couple hundred under.

So far I'm very happy with the car. I traded in a 3 year old WRX wagon with 96K miles. The Legacy is much more refined. The interior is a huge step up. Some other likes are the huge sunroof, the smaller steering wheel, and heated leather seats. Noise from the tires is a bit louder than I'd like, though better than the WRX was. Wind and engine noise are controlled extremely well. Even at 70 mph on a windy day, there's very little wind noise. Very impressive.

I haven't been able to push the car yet because of the break in, but I can feel the potential in there. Cornering seems pretty good too from what I've tried. I do notice that it feels significantly longer than the WRX was. I've been driving it around corners like it's a semi. Something I'll have to get used so. The size is one of the reasons I moved up to the Legacy, so this is just an observation, not a complaint.

This is the first auto transmission car I've owned (at 36 years old). So far I don't miss the clutch except when trying to start the car. Time will tell if this remains the case...

ateixeira · April 2005

That's a pace without rest, 32k miles per year? Wow.

I think your left foot deserves a break. :sick:

Congrats.

-juice

yatesjo · April 2005

DO NOT shift below manufacturer recommended points on ANY car. Any gas savings will be tiny and blown away by the repair costs incurred by lugging the engine. Always look at manufacture recommended shift points as being the ABSOLUTE MINIMUM shift points. If you want to accelerate at anything much above a crawl, you go higher; never ever ever lower or you WILL DAMAGE YOUR ENGINE. I've seen vehicles ruined by trying to save a few pennies by shifting lower and it is not worth it. :sick:

yatesjo · April 2005

While we are very happy with our new 2.5i Legacy Ltd, we've noticed the engine is very easy to kill in first gear. One day last week I stalled the Legacy 3 times pulling away from lights, compared to my two commuter cars (Mazda Miata and Ford ZX2) which I might kill 3 times in an entire month driving. If I jackrabbit it, it goes like a champ, but when I've trying to drive smoothly it will stall a little too often for my tastes. Any one else with 2.5i/manual setups notice this or is it a quirk limited to my car?

kens · April 2005

I think in general, AWD Subarus require a little more clutch finesse than 2WD vehicles. For very smooth starts you'll need to know your clutch take up point very well and get used to applying just enough throttle.

Ken

samiam_68 · April 2005

Stalling three times a month is actually a lot. I stall my car maybe once every couple of years. Have owned many stickshifts - Toyotas, Subarus, Chrysler.

Maybe a different technique will help - try slipping the clutch a bit on takeup and build the RPMS to 1500 or above while still slipping.

yatesjo · April 2005

I said maybe three times in a month, probably a lot less (I don't exactly keep count and was grasping for a frequency comparison) but it does happen every so often. I have been told time and time again from multiple sources from the time I learned to drive, when driving stick the occasional stall is just a fact of life. Getting down to such a low frequency, how long do your cluches last? I expect 100K miles minimum from a clutch; my Miata is around 120K on its original, still going strong and I have always been able to get nice smooth takeoffs when I wanted.

frog · April 2005

Yes, stalling the manual subie trans is a subaru trait, or flaw if you will. I have a new 04 legacy and it has basically the same engine setup as the 05 though I believe the 05 is tweaked for 3 more hp or something, and the 04 stalls in first every chance I give it. I dont like to rev it up at a stoplight to launch it, but if my throttle is slightly off my clutch release, BOINK, she dies. No mercy. I am guessing as it breaks in it will mellow a bit. Truly it does not bother me now at 11k miles though I have stalled it just this week, and thats not good as there are only about 2 stops on my whole commute,

. My brother did take it out for a run this summer and came back unimpressed by his three embarrasing stalls at all the major intersections. So, you are not alone. Your car is just fine and you will learn its unique needs in time.

samiam_68 · April 2005

Out of all my cars, I only had to replace a clutch once. That was on my Supra Turbo at 125K miles. But I beat the living daylights out of that car, so I would consider that a very durable clutch.

michael2 · April 2005

question, at my last fill up, the gas station attendent pumped i gallon of regular into my tank before i caught him. i've used nothing but premium since getting the turbo, and filled up the rest of the tank with premium. will this screw up hurt my engine

krzyss · April 2005

will not hurt you.

Krzys

ateixeira · April 2005

The ECU is leaning out the gas mix as much as it can to get the best mileage. That might be affecting the stalling.

You'll get used to it and just apply more throttle.

-juice

tsy · April 2005

I'm not sure about the 2.5i, but I know the GT has a Clutch Delay Valve, which makes starting a little tricky at times. The problem is when you think you are engaged, you're not, and when the clutch finally engages, your revs are too slow and you stall (very embarrasing!). It took me a few weeks to get used to it, and I still occasionally stall when I'm not paying attention.

Subaru's have lots of quirks. Just get used to them and enjoy your new car.

tom

saintviper · April 2005

I've been noticing when getting into my new Legacy Wagon at night that there isn't much light up front. The dome light is nearly behind the rear seats because of the big sunroof. Is there some way to get the map lights to act as a dome light? I looked in the manual but it doesn't look like it.

I also noticed that a lot of the switchgear isn't lit at night. Some of the window and lock controls, the vents and their controls, the gear selector and indicators, shift buttons on the steering wheel, etc... I also noticed that the radio and hvac displays are green, but all of the other switchgear is red. They contrast nicely, but it seems like they should match. I imagine these are cost cutting measures, but when you are trying to move upscale, people begin to notice these things.

Disclaimer: I'm still super happy with my new Legacy. I'm just starting to notice some of the shortcomings as well as all the important stuff that I really like.

kens · April 2005

Craig here did a modification on his OBXT wagon so the map lights turn on with the dome light. I haven't gotten around to doing it myself, but it's fairly straightforward if you have some basic soldering skills.

Which model Legacy wagon do you have? On my GT wagon, the HVAC and radio control display is white so it matches the instrument panel layout. I wonder if the manual HVAC system has different colors.

Ken

rwoods · April 2005

Great question! I too wonder about the map lights not lighting up upon entry to the car. There are many knowledgeable people on this board and I think an answer will be furthcoming.

Another question: The "security" icon light always flashes when I turn off the car. Is that normal?

Bob

kens · April 2005

If you do a search over at legacygt.com, you'll see Craig's modification detailed in one of the topics.

I believe that's normal behavior for the security icon. I believe it was mentioned somewhere in the manual.

Ken

cantinflas · April 2005

I have had several go-arounds with dealers and installers for my XM radio which I have a paid up 4 year contract for. Here is my letter which is circulating I think from bottom (dealer) up and the president of Subaru down. Maybe some middle manger will get the same letter on his desk from two directions and DO SOMETHING

Dear Sir:
I have would like to bring to your attention a technologic anomaly in my Subaru that has severely compromised my appreciation of my otherwise excellent new 2005 Legacy Sedan GT. This anomaly has colored my purchase decision to the point I would not recommend this car or buy a new one until this problem is fixed, which is ridiculously easy.... in the production stage.
My concern? I discovered after I bought the car there is NO GOOD WAY to get an "auxiliary signal" in my case XM radio, to others -iPods and the like, into the Stock (and hard to replace) stereo system in this car. I have a portable XM unit and a 4 year contract with XM paid for.
I asked the local dealer to install "direct in" jacks as part of the deal to buy this car, because I otherwise liked the sound system, and part of my financial calculation was not needing to spend more on the audio. He agreed, in good faith. This is not a complaint about the dealer or sales staff.
When I bought the car in, I was told neither his service dept NOR the local electronic dealer, Crutchfield, could do this! He was right; there is NO aux signal route in, even "round the back". Previously I was using the XM via a cassette adapter in my 95 Legacy, but of course in new one, no cassette. I was then told my best option was a "hard wired FM modulator" which injects the signal directly into the antenna input, heard through the FM radio, and lowers the interference from outside stations. This is a "just barely acceptable" solution to audio buffs. I was not crazy about this but thought I could live with this. Then, guess what, I learn that this can be adapted to EVERY CAR in the WORLD except new Subaru's because of an "atypical" antenna jack!! I was then suggested a totally unacceptable alternative, a "wireless FM modulator". These are famous for and confirmed by me for rotten fidelity and much interference. Not useful in this day of digital audio!
So I am totally frustrated, to the point of having to recommend against an otherwise great car to those millions of us who depend on good music for our sanity. I have no idea how to solve my dilemma, but I would greatly appreciate a solution from Subaru.
This would be so easily accommodated, by an OEM radio with a tiny "auxiliary" stereo mini-jack on the face plate!
Then I could enjoy my daily commute on an otherwise fun and practical car.
Thanks for your attention to this matter.
.
Sincerely,

kens · April 2005

Lots of folks share your frustration of not having an easy way to get alternative music sources into our headunits. Over at legacygt.com, there have been several brave souls that have actually tapped into the electronics to create a true aux-input. My hope is that Subaru does change the headunit in future models. I would be willing to pay the price to swap out my headunit with one that has an aux-input.

FYI, Subaru isn't the only car manufacturer that uses non-standard FM antenna connectors. Metra is reported to be releasing an adapter in the near future. Others have simply gone out and soldered on their own standard connector to make it work.

Ken

breld · April 2005

As far as iPods go, take a look over at DensionUSA.com. I recently installed this interface in my TSX, and absolutely love it. It's basically an iPod dock for your car, and it allows you, to a limited extent, to use the stereo controls to control the iPod. Most importantly, it allows for a hard-wired connection of the iPod to your stock stereo.

Last I checked, Subarus were on their list for "future interfaces."

Monster also has a product "iCruze" that is similar. I'm not sure if has an application for Subarus yet.

hypov · April 2005

I've not checked it out myself, but I read a thread in one of the other forum that mentioned scoobymod having the DIY via the external CD changer input terminal. Workable only with the newer OEM in-dash 6 CD HUs with the circular terminal.

-Dave

rwoods · April 2005

Thanks Ken. You are the best.

Bob

hypov · April 2005

OK found the DIY in the Forester Mods at scoobymods under " Mod: Aux input/iPod solution for FXT".

-Dave

ssminton · April 2005

I have been an XM listener for four years. I have had XM both through direct line and also through antenna direct FM modulation and unfortunately most recently through what I would call "AM" modulation... at least that what it has sounded like. To be honest, there is not a "huge" difference in sound between the direct input and good FM direct antenna, at least with a "factory" radio. The biggest difference is in audio gain. I have had a 2005 Outback since last July. I just got my system "upgraded" a few days ago from the proximal FM connection, which acted like an AM radio, to the direct antenna connect. My audio pro was able to splice the XM antenna connect into the factory antenna thus bypassing the plug issue.

This issue is not Subaru's fault. Most factory radios have proprietary antenna plugs. The difference is that there are not enough 2005 Subarus on the road with after market audio accessories to motivate the standard after market outfits to design and mold an adapter. The Subaru antenna variance across models and trim levels further exacerbates the problem.

Good Luck!

c_hunter · April 2005

I understand your frustration, but you are making a mountain out of a molehill. I wired a direct connect FM-modulator into my Outback radio (same as your GT) over 7 months ago, which I use for my iPod but this would also work fine for XM (in fact, the modulator I used had instructions geared towards XM). This was done simply by splicing into the antenna wire behind the radio. Any minimally competant stereo installer can do this, and at least 5-6 people on this forum have had it done. So the problem lies with your installers, not with Subaru. If you let this ruin your experience with the Legacy GT, then I'd be really disappointed. Find a good stereo installer. Heck, I could do it for you with about $10 in parts (I'm in tidewater Virginia).

Craig

catmandu · April 2005

Just purchased a new 05 Outback wagon . Was a Trooper owner for last 4 years. Always change my own oil. Got the filters from an internet outlet in Missouri, Anyone know where to buy oil filters on the net for a shade-tree mechanic. Many thanks, Mel

locke2c · April 2005

the subaru brand filter is a rebadged Purolator. use a regular purolator from your favorite autoparts store, or a pureOne if you're feeling saucy.

btw, congrats on the new OBW

~Colin

c_hunter · April 2005

I believe they switched filter makers for 05.

I normally buy filters from an online dealer. Try and find one nearest to you in order to save on shipping time/costs. I'm in Virginia and buy parts from Liberty Subaru in NJ, I believe they discount 15-20%.

CRaig

squirtdad · April 2005

Any new about new features in Legacy GT/outback?

Nav is not of interest, but mechanical goodies, like 6 speed are of great interest.

thanks
jim

saintviper · April 2005

Well, I've had my new Legacy for a week now. The minor annoyances I had when I got it have faded away, drown out all the things I'm liking. I've completed my 1000 mile break in and and gradually starting to have more fun with it. I'm still amazed at how quiet it is at freeway speeds. My WRX was quite loud, but the Legacy handles wind noise even better than my wife's Audi.

To further the general Legacy community's knowledge about this car, I decided to test the actual cruising range of the vehicle... Ok, actually, I was trying to make it to my favorite gas station and I knew it would be close. I was able to go 387 miles on a tank of gas before I ran out on the freeway and had to pull over. :sick: I was about a quarter mile from the exit I was trying to make and could actually see the gas station I had been going for. Unfortunately it was a steep uphill offramp, so there was no chance of coasting to it.

My house was only 10 minutes away, so rather than test the Subaru roadside assistance, and be laughed at by the tow truck driver, I called my wife. She brought me gas and laughed at me instead. :P FWIW, I was only able to put 15.5 gallons in total. Either it stops running 1.5 gallons before it's empty, or the gas pump will not fill it all the way. I usually do not top the tank off after the pump stops.

After starting the car again, I had a CEL, :lemon: and of course the cruise light was blinking. When I got home, I did a little research, then went out and started the car and shut it off again. After 4 tries, the CEL went away. :shades: It would seem that if the cause of the CEL isn't present after you restart the car 5 times, it goes away.

It's been 3 weeks since any serious snow here, so I think it's safe to put my summer wheels from the WRX on. I'll get try them out this weekend and post a pic when I get them on.

kens · April 2005

To further the general Legacy community's knowledge about this car, I decided to test the actual cruising range of the vehicle...

That's too funny. I'm glad to hear that you were close enough to home to get some help. I agree that it would have been embarrasing to call for Roadside Assistance for something like that.

If it's not a serious error (like yours), CELs do go out after several on/off cycles.

Thanks for checking the 15.5 gallons!

Ken

Subaru Legacy/Outback 2005+

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles