Did you recently take on (or consider) a loan of 84 months or longer on a car purchase?
A reporter would like to speak with you about your experience; please reach out to PR@Edmunds.com by 7/25 for details.
Options

Subaru Legacy/Outback 2005+

1142143145147148214

Comments

  • occkingoccking Member Posts: 346
    Five months, almost 16k miles. Here are my comments

    1) You are correct on cruise control surging on downhill. Does it all the time
    2) You are right about glove box not shutting if anything touching door
    3) No room under front seats for storing anything
    4) Center armrest way too low, although I am starting to get used to it (accumulating Subaru bucks at a rapid pace & may get extension for armrest for
    $150 from dealer)
    5) Mostly highway mileage & gas mileage improving as weather improves. Last trip averaged a little over 29. Mileage as indicated on trip computer consistently about 1 to 1.5 miles over actual
    6) Acceleration about what I expected. Had I drive the H6 or Turbo would probably have gotten one but I don't really need it, have to pay for own gas for work & like getting decent gas mileage plus not having to put in premium which seems to be required for turbo & at least recommended for the H6,
    7) The configuration of dome lights could be improved. Not enough in front area
    8) ACC & heat both work very well but difficult to control heat in extremely cold weather plus windows on this vehicle have tendency to fog up much more frequently than any other vehicle I have had.

    While I have everyone's attention, how necessary is the 15k checkup the dealer wants me to perform, suggesting I need that to maintain extended warranty. I religiously change oil every 3000 miles (part of deal with dealer (Capitol in Pawtucket, RI) is free oil changes for one year) Even if I had to pay that is something I have always done. Rotating tires on my own so don't need that. Dealer wants $100 for this service. but other than changing oil, rotating tires, not sure what else they do that warrants this charge. I figured I would be ok just changing oil & rotating tires until 30,000 miles. I see that plugs are recommended at 30,000 miles. Why so often? Any feedback on services others are doing would be appreciated.
  • kat95kat95 Member Posts: 49
    I do not follow what the dealer recommends, it's often more costly. Refer to your Subaru owners manual, that is the manufactuers bible so to speak. I'm on my second Subaru and they are
    great cars. Regarding the spark plugs, they just happen to be ones Subaru uses.
    I would ask the service department if you could put platinum tip or another longer lasting type, though that may affect the tune up schedule.
  • docthrockdocthrock Member Posts: 2
    I know most people don't listen to AM radio anymore. I like to listen to NPR, and that's the only way I can get it in my '05 XT. The reception just plain sucks. Yes, the stereo overall is much better than my previous Outback, but the AM reception is much worse.

    Anyone have a fix for this? Is the radio reception/antenna adjustable at all? I was hoping to do this myself to save a minimum half day trip to the dealership just to find out that I can't do anything about it. Seems in the old days there was a bit of tuning one could do at either end of the system to improve reception. Man, I hope so because the AM sucks.
  • saintvipersaintviper Member Posts: 177
    I find that the AM reception in my Legacy is as good as any other car I've ever owned including my previous WRX. I haven't tried it with the rear window defroster on though. If yours is that bad, you may want to have it looked at.
  • sweet_subiesweet_subie Member Posts: 1,394
    where is the antenna by the way ?
  • batman702batman702 Member Posts: 12
    I went into my local subaru dealer about two weeks ago. It is the only dealer in the Las Vegas metro area. I sat, and sat, and sat, while the salesperson, and the manager came up with some numbers on a 2005 subie legacy gt limited. I have great credit was willing to put about 5k down and had a good trade that they were willing to even out. I sat for about an hour as they came back a few times with some monthly payment scenarios, starting at aroung 600/month. Way too high, am I buying a friggin lexus, beemer, or mercedes? I told them no, and after about an hour or so they finally came down to 515/month or so. I gave them another number lower and they said that was their final offer? What the hell? I was appalled and left. anyone else have this problem? r people really paying this much for a legacy? I got the bmw dealer dowm to 515 on a 330 2006? what gives? I thought subaru wanted to sell some cars, there is never anyone at the dealer when I pass it going to work. Any ideas? Thanks
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Without knowing the specific terms it's hard to compare purchases like that.

    Shop for a price for the car. Then negotiate an interest rate. After that, you can calculate a fair price by yourself. Use Excel, it has PMT() functions for that.

    -juice
  • rob_mrob_m Member Posts: 820
    On the wagons I believe that it is in the driver's side rear window. In the sedan, it is in the rear window. The grid looks like the defroster wiring. Rob M.
  • rob_mrob_m Member Posts: 820
    Unfortunately, an uneducated person may pay this amount. You did the right thing by walking.

    A Legacy GT can be had for around $1000 under invoice. Invoice (no options) is around $28.5k. Sticker is around $30.5. There is a $1500 rebate - but it might be regional and not apply in your area.

    My local dealer wanted me to pay sticker. The same dealer who I have purchased 3 other Subarus, and blessed them with all my maintenance and repairs. I walked away, and found another dealer under an hour from my home, located outside of metro Boston. Within 2 hours, we negotiated a deal, on a car with the color and options I wanted, AND the price I wanted.

    I did my research, knew the numbers for the car, trade, rebate, downpayment and interest rate. I stuck to the numbers I wanted.

    The best part of the story? My local dealer called a week later, wanting to know how my car search was going. Good Luck! Rob M.
  • saintvipersaintviper Member Posts: 177
    Never negotiate based on monthly payments. Too many variables there to understand what kind of deal you are getting. Negotiate the price for the new car, then the trade, then make sure you get a reasonable interest rate. From there the monthly payment is a simple calculation. You should have an idea of what interest rates are, and how big a loan you are expecting to get so that you can negotiate the price of the vehicle and trade with some numbers in mind.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Make sure you let them know they lost a loyal customer. Tell them they were fools, plain and simple.

    -juice
  • rob_mrob_m Member Posts: 820
    I certainly wouldn't raise hell. If you buy there, and it's the closest dealer - you'll be remembered. Besides sales, there is service, and if there are any problems ....

    Dealers operate independent of SOA. SOA has limited control of the dealer. If you are not at the least comfortable with the dealer, maybe a BMW is in your future.

    My approach was simple. I went in armed with numbers, but never disclosed anything until the negotiation got serious. Talk to the sales manager or financial person directly. The sales person is limited in authorizing sales.

    I asked for their best price on first the car, and second the trade. Then politely said no to thier numbers. On the second counter offer, said no. I then took their paper and wrote in my own numbers. They were shocked, and said it couldn't be done. I thanked them for their time, and after some consideration, they said yes.

    Again, timing was the factor. It was Sunday. It was raining. I was trading a Subaru. Nearing the end of the month.

    As for options, I found the 05 Legacy GT LTD to be well accessorized to start with. I optioned for the upgraded security system and subwoofer. I will be getting the auto dimming mirror this weekend. General consensus is that the factory spoiler is ugly. I have a JDM STI trunk lip spoiler on order. Good Luck! Rob M.
  • sweet_subiesweet_subie Member Posts: 1,394
    best thing to do is to buy a car & arrange a loan through e-loan lendingtree or something.
  • rob_mrob_m Member Posts: 820
    Not impressed with Lending Tree.

    My local credit union beat anything they could offer by a full point. Capital One was 5.75, Credit Union was 4.75, Subaru Dealer would match lowest with Chase Automotive if I opted with the $1500 rebate back in May. I ended up with the $500 rebate and 2.9 financing through Chase. Rob M.
  • doug1doug1 Member Posts: 37
    30,924 is ridiculous. I'd say a reasonable price for a GT Ltd sedan with an automatic is about $26,500, assuming a rebate of $1500. That should put it at right about invoice price before taking the rebate into account. If it's a stick, take off another $1100. I paid invoice last summer, a few months after the 2005s came out. Now that the 2006s are soon arriving, invoice price (or below) should be even more readily obtainable.

    I'd likely buy it from the other dealer, in Utah. I bought my XT Ltd in Seattle, even though I live in Portland. The local dealers are still happy to take my money for service.

    Good luck.

    Doug
  • jholtanjholtan Member Posts: 8
    Does the Dealer get money back from Subaru when you purchase through the VIP program (Amer. Canoe Assoc.)?

    Disregarding customer rebates, what kind of pricing can you expect to get on a 2005 Subaru Limited with Auto? Is $1500 less than invoice reasonsable considering the imminent changeover to 2006 models?

    Right now I'm only being offered invoice and I am tempted to wait and just get a 2006.

    Jack
  • sweet_subiesweet_subie Member Posts: 1,394
    3-4k below MSRP is what you should pay for OB LTD
  • rob_mrob_m Member Posts: 820
    I believe that the dealer gets cut a check for $300-400 through VIP. VIP pricing gets you invoice minus applicable rebates, incentives, etc.

    I qualified for IMBA VIP, but chose to negotiate straight out on my GT LTD instead. All said and done, I came in over $1000 under invoice and qualified for 2.9% financing.

    The deals are out there - depends on how motivated the dealer is to move the vehicle. Rob M.
  • mvc_jonesmvc_jones Member Posts: 88
    Can anyone provide me their experiences in maintenance costs/items for their Legacy 2.5GT? I am not concerned about factory-scheduled maintenance, but more like items such as brake pads, rotors, tires, etc… and when replacement occurred. Trying to get a sense of the cost of operating beyond time specific maintenance. Thanks.
  • rob_mrob_m Member Posts: 820
    I believe that it's sort of early to predict timing and replacement costs for these things. Driving habits would certainly be a factor, especially if you push the car as it is designed.

    Based on past experience with my 99 GT sedan at 125k, I replaced one set of tires @40k and one full set of brakes (rotors, pads, etc) at 80k. Tires were around $600 and brakes $700. I wasn't hard on the car, but didn't exactly baby it all the time either. I also do a lot of highway driving.

    That's all I did to the car besides normal maintenance. I expect the same with the 05 GT.

    First thing to go on the new LGT will be the tires. I hated the RE92's on the 99 GT. The gave me all kinds of grief in wet weather. The potenza's on my 03 Outback are starting to act up at 18k. Rob M.
  • moorejwmmoorejwm Member Posts: 9
    Hello,

    We went looking and driving a 2005 Legacy 2.5i today. Dealer offered invoice plus $1500 rebate.

    Can we do better?

    Are there any Subaru to dealer cash incentives that might lower our price?

    Thanks!
  • sweet_subiesweet_subie Member Posts: 1,394
    good deal, you mean Invoice minus 1500 ?
    bring it down another 500$, if you can.
  • dsattlerdsattler Member Posts: 135
    At 15,000 miles I've had to replace nothing, except a tire (picked up a nail).
  • babe915babe915 Member Posts: 34
    I have a few more complaints that the OB should have basic features like the windows don;t work when you shut off the ignition, cannot open all doors with
    the key. most cars even my wife's hyundai does these basic things for thousands
    less.
  • mvc_jonesmvc_jones Member Posts: 88
    Did you have to replace more than one due to the AWD and tolerances of tire tread depth?
  • sdufordsduford Member Posts: 577
    What do you mean by cannot open all doors with the key? Just hit the button ont he remote twice and they all unlock.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    What do you mean by cannot open all doors with the key? Just hit the button ont he remote twice and they all unlock.

    He probably means being able to unlock all the doors using the key in the lock as opposed to the remote.
  • dsattlerdsattler Member Posts: 135
    Only had a few thousand miles on it at the time, and replaced only that one. Haven't noticed anything different since (well, except that I don't have to put air in that tire every couple of days any more).
  • liv4todayliv4today Member Posts: 6
    I have an 05 Legacy Wagon. I am looking to replace the wiper blades up front and in the back. Does anyone know how to remove the blades from the arms. I seem to have hit a stumbling block. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
  • mph42mph42 Member Posts: 4
    Does anyone have a suggestion for a new set of first rate, all season tires for this car? I live in NE Ohio, all weather conditions possuble. The car came with Bridgestone Potenza RE92 tires which receive terrible reviews from hundreds of people who have used them, sort of disappointing that they are original equipment.........most other tires also do not get particularly good reviews either on the customer review pages. Any suggestions would be welcome. I have used Michelins in the past on my 92 Toyota Camry and easily gotten over 60,000 miles: most tires reviewed for my current car seem to wear out much more rapidly. Good wear is also of interest to me.
  • sweet_subiesweet_subie Member Posts: 1,394
    have heard bridgestone turanza is very good.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I believe they use a U-hook design. Mine I had to push in a release pin and then push the whole assembly towards it base to get it out.

    Found a decent site with instructions:

    http://www.ehow.com/how_107_replace-windshield-wiper.html

    -juice
  • mikejlmikejl Member Posts: 78
    I put Bridgestone Turanzas on a 2003 L. L. Bean last Spring and ran through the winter with them. DO NOT PUT THESE TIRES ON YOUR CAR!

    They were so bad in the snow that I thought I was driving a rear-wheel car instead of a Subaru. I live north of Pittsburgh, so our winters are probably similar. I assume it's the tread design, but whatever the reason, these tires were terrible. I almost slid off the road on several occasions and in conditions that I wouldn't have thought twice about with the OE tires.

    I put Michelin Pilots on a 2000 OB LTD a few years ago. I was very pleased with them and would buy them again.
  • sweet_subiesweet_subie Member Posts: 1,394
    thanks. I have good experience with my Michellin on my MPV as well. I had heard Yokohoma is good as well, anyone ? I know foresters have these on them
  • jaguar62jaguar62 Member Posts: 2
    I can't believe it! I have a 1996 OB and it opens the doors using the key.
    Since the Key-fob only lasts about 2 years before breaking, how can they be so stupid not to let the key open the door.

    I also don't like the lack of storage space, the Integrated Radio, the gawd-awful faux wood trim or the silvery-plastic dash panels (I believe this was started by Nissan/Infinity and is now seen on all Japanese cars).

    You'd think that Subaru would learn that the demographic they appeal to may appreciate a well thought-out car, with some room for customization. Instead they keep trying to build a one-size fits all car - and loosing useful features in the process.

    I think I'll get a 2006 XT and take it to the Pimp my Ride guys for a work-over :)
  • phalephale Member Posts: 2
    I have the same model with the exact same symptoms. Just finished a 1400 mile road trip and the first two hours on cruise was just fine. Then it started disengaging at different intervals. We narrowed it down to when the OB was going uphill (sometimes). Speed ranges from 75-80 on cruise.

    Also seemed to work better when the outside temp was lower. We were driving through New Mexico and morning temps were around 70-75. When temp got above 95 the symptoms seemed to be a lot worse.

    I also experience the downhill chugging just as you start down a hill. Pretty unnerving.

    I think both of these have to do with the new electronic throttle that the dealer was "so" proud of. No more mechanical linkage with the gas pedal.
  • phalephale Member Posts: 2
    I just spoke with the service dept. at a local dealer (Flatirons Import, Boulder, CO) and Subaru is aware of the cruise control problem and indicated that it is caused by a software "bug" in the cruise control controller. Subaru is working on a patch and should be ready in a month or so. Subaru will notify owners when the ECU can be upgraded to correct this problem.
  • saedavesaedave Member Posts: 694
    The integrated radio is essential for eliminating radio theft. As a past owner of a dozen German cars with single DIN radios, I can attest to how often they are stolen. Our insurance premiums would be higher if Subarus had such radios. A jack for external audio devices would be nice, however.

    The single key eliminates additional places for easy break-in. Note how many trunks with keys have an armored plate added!

    With Subaru's low production volumes, one size must fit all.
  • locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    wow what a different world it is 12 hours from Wichita, KS there in Chicago.

    1) I have never had a radio stolen of any kind and I have had many aftermarket stereos. I do detach the faceplates or use other similar built-in security features.

    2) I have never seen an armored plate for a trunk nor has my trunk ever been broken into.

    therefore to me it's easy to agree with the original notion that the climate-control integrated radio is evil. it is one of the reasons, a smaller one though for sure, that I don't own 2005 Legacy GT.

    ~Colin
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    Does anybody really have radios stolen anymore? I remember the VW's with the Blaupunkts back in the 80's were a problem but that was back in the days of factory AM and maybe FM with 2 front speakers. Nobody was stealing the DIN Delco out of my Cavalier!!

    The intergrated radio is done because it's part of the design element. Could you imagine a DIN sized plate breaking up the flow of the dashboard?
  • dougb10dougb10 Member Posts: 185
    I switched the stock Bridgestone Potenza's (lousy ride and handling) on our '05 Outback Limited....replaced them with Bridgestone Turanza LS-H.
    Incredible difference in ride comfort..great handing in rain. No problem in snow so far last winter...but did not drive in anything more than 6'' deep.
    These tires work just fine for me....good luck.

    Doug

    P.S. see any tire reviews on Tirerack.com
  • mph42mph42 Member Posts: 4
    Thanks for your reply. The tire getting by far the best reviews from buyers on Tirerack.com is a Goodyear called Triple Tred, a tire which came out a year ago: it's the only one which has almost no negative comments in 3-400 reviews.
  • fendertweedfendertweed Member Posts: 98
    Someone wrote that the owner's manual is "the Bible" of service recommendations.....

    Not necessarily so.

    Service intervals are now part of marketing, everyone wants to sell you a car you don't have to do a thing to for 100,000 miles. And if you follow their advice, that's what you'll get, a car that may last 100k and that's all.

    OTOH, if you do proper maintenance it'll likely run twice that.

    I'm talking about items like replacing ATF (for ex., VW/Audi says it's "Lifetime", in reality change every 40k if you want the car to last), same with power steering fluid ("lifetime"? No, change at 60k), coolant, etc.

    There is no free lunch, manufacturers want to be sure the car will live through the warranty period, and 100k is nice but they want you back to buy another car, not to drive the one you have for 150-250k miles.
  • sweet_subiesweet_subie Member Posts: 1,394
    I am starting to get very impressed with the build quality in my 2005 OB XT vs my 2001 OB. The way this 2005 is built looks like it would last forever. I can just feel the 5-star crash test rating.

    i am surprised how they managed to do this & yet reduced 200lbs in curb wieght. also, we can feel the alumn. alloy wheels being lighter.

    anyone else felt this way ?
  • kat95kat95 Member Posts: 49
    I was replying to someone asking if they should follow the dealer recommended service and I told them that it's a ploy to make more money for the dealer. The owners manual from Subaru is put in your vehicle for a reason and not a ploy to make extra money but to follow so your car does last you 150-200k miles. :)
  • rob_mrob_m Member Posts: 820
    There are 2 maintenance schedules.

    One is found in the owner's manual. This is the manufacturer's recommended basic maintenance schedule.

    The other is used by the dealer. It is the manufacturer's extreme condition maintenance schedule. Basically, all the intervals are halved. Your 30k service becomes your 15k service, etc ....

    The bigger questions. Do any of our vehicles truely fall under the 'extreme condition' guideline? Is there any added value to overmaintaining a vehicle? Will a dealer be more inclined to help someone out when there is an issue outside the warrantee period? Does overmaintenance give you points here?

    Remember, service = profit for the dealer, and the consumer bears the cost. Rob M.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    I service our Odyssey under severe conditions and did my Accord under normal. The Odyssey typically gets driven 2.5 miles to and from the train station and then around town taking the kids to their activities by my wife - that's severe service per the Honda manual. The Accord was driven about 40 miles per day on the highway and into Boston - the dealer feels the Accord should be serviced under the severe schedule because some of my driving is stop and go.

    But I have found that by doing all my service at the dealer gets me plenty of leeway. They've gone to bat for me with Honda regional or just taken care of little things without charging me - even out of warranty items. I ensure the service writer gets an "excellent" when the surveys come and talk to them if I have a problem instead of "getting even" on the survey. I write an occassional letter to the owner praising them and they take care of me. My experience has shown that overmaintaining and being nice works.

    Now YMMV.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    How 'bout it, a good relationship with your dealer will make you both happy.

    I send mine references, he takes good care of me.

    -juice
  • kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    The dealer recommended services, IMO, are designed to be very conservative and for people who absolutely don't want to think about vehicle maintenance.

    Most dealers I've been to allow you to pick and choose the items you want. You can save quite a bit of money by doing some of the basics yourself and knowing your driving conditions.

    There are many basic service items that can easily performed by the owner such as checking headlight and wiper operation, basic fluid checks and tire pressure. These really should be done on a regular basis by the owner.

    Other items like oil/filter changes, belts, spark plugs and other more invovled service require a little more judgement. For example, the maintenance schedule calls for a timing belt replacement at 120K miles. Many dealers will schedule this at 80K miles or less. Since a broken belt can be catastrophic, one could chose to have it replaced at 105K miles instead to still have a margin of safety.

    So, while post-sales services are a good source of revenue for dealers, I don't think it's a rip-off unless the dealer demands that you do everything they ask for.

    Ken
  • rob_mrob_m Member Posts: 820
    Can't disagree with any of you.

    With 2 Subarus in my house, and driving 30k a year, I spend a few $$ on maintenance. I typically send all my business to my local dealer. Yes juice, that relationship thing has definitely worked in my favor in the past.

    As a side note, I typically adhere to the severe maintenance schedule. I consider it cheap insurance.

    But, based on past experience, I am a bit wary of what is 'required' vs what the dealer wants to do. Case in point: a dealer wanted to change the transmission fluid at the15k service on my 2 yo Outback. Stated that if I didn't want warrantee issues down the road, it would be in my 'best interest' to do this. I said I'd take my chances, and wait until the 30k service.

    However, because I live on these boards, and consider myself to be educated in the subject of Subaru, I know what is/is not appropriate for maintenance service. Your typical person on the street probably would not, and is paying for services that may not be really necessary. Rob M.
Sign In or Register to comment.