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Audi S4 vs BMW M3
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The BMW would be OK with 4 winter tires, the Audi could probably be OK with 4 all season high performance tires.
But, I'd take the S4 with all-seasons over an M3 with winter tires any day... in inclement weather..
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Have Pirelli snows on S4, which I do not like as much as the Blizzaks I had on the G---very hard rubber for a snow. Has anyone found anything else in the 18 inch wheel size?
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Yep, I've got summer tires and I made it jus' fine through the 15" snowfall we had the day or two before Christmas (once I had my driveway cleared).
Oh, I am NOT suggesting that anyone go with Summer tires in the Winter -- I am not buying more tires on a car that will be gone at most in 6 months, that's all.
And, the good news is I haven't felt the need for them thus far.
Just a thought. . . .
As far as the winter Goodyears that I have.. They don't even show them anymore on their website.. So, maybe they have been discontinued.. I've only had them just over a year, though..
Anyone looking for winter tires of any type at this late date... are probably out of luck.. most sizes are sold out by now...
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Both should wear a little better and be a little quieter than your ContiExtremeContacts.... Plus, handle marginally better..
At a price premium, of course... what else is new?
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thanks.
Here we are specifically comparing the S4 to the M3 so it's not really the best resource for what you are asking.
Good luck.
I just got quoted a money factor of .00255 for a 3yr/15k lease on a 05 M3, the money factor seems kinda high as I believe that works out to about 6%. Thoughts?
The dealer is permitted to mark it up to .0024, and I would guess they are waiving the security deposit for an additional .00015, totaling your quoted MF of .00255
In addition, the residual should be 59%, which the dealer has no control over.
I would insist on the base rate, and make the security deposit.. you come out ahead over the life of the lease.
regards,
kyfdx
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I looked @ quality issues for A4's from
'99-'03 and I'm not encouraged.
2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD
4mort@bellsouth.net
Could anyone recommend a place in Northern New Jersey to have a chip installed?
Also, what are the top suppliers of the chip?
Thanks in advance for your input.
Gregor
I have a sprint blue S4 Cabriolet, and the quality is phoenominal, as in all Audis. There's even a well-made drawer under each of the front seats, only on the cabriolet, but a cool and useful feature. Every material fits perfectly into place in its silver Nappa leather interior, with no huge panel gaps. I really have no complaints in this car, except the rear seat armrests are a little intruding. No biggie.
In reliability, you should check the latest J.D.Power ratings. Audi is easily the most-reliable German manufacturer, in fourth place overall, behind Lexus, Toyota, and Honda/Acura (tied), in that order. What makes me laugh is that BMW and MB are in like the twenties or something. Just be glad when you dust an M3 that's getting jump-started on the side of the highway!
In almost any sense, the Audi S4 is flawless. Although anyone would agree that the Cabriolet is beautiful, a slight few may not agree on the sedan and Avant, but I think they look almost as good.
In other respects Audi get's high marks for it's interior and fit and finish.
M
A link to this survey please! Oh and please don't tell us about Germany because we all know that Audi is seen in a much better light over there, but we don't live in Germany and here Audis are no better than any other German brand and in most cases they're much worse than BMW, and usually in the same place with Mercedes in any survey I've seen.
M
That's the first line of the autospies.com page referenced; not exactly gushing. It’s also interesting to note that on the same page Audi is advertised three times, as is the case for all the features pages.
M
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**RELIABILITY**
The BMW has been more reliable than the Audi and less expensive to maintain. Known reliability issues with the E36 3-series include the cooling system and rear shock mounts. My second thermostat was installed at ~60k miles (the car now has 72k). I will be replacing the plastic-impeller water pump and possibly the radiator as preventative measures at my next service (soon). Rear shock mounts also have been changed twice. I don't know if these issue had been addressed for the E46 generation. There have been a few other non-routine repairs, but overall I have had good reliability over the 10 years. The Audi has had a bit more of the non-routine stuff happening, including radio, antenna and speaker problems that were never completely fixed after at least 4 tries, power window glitches, water pump, thermostat, intermittent instrument fritz (water temp, fuel guage, odometer display), un-turnable rotors at 50k, temp sender, a couple of leaks (gasket replacements), CV boots twice, random alarms, windshield washer system and probably a few other items I am not remembering. Despite all this, I still think the A4 has been one of the best cars of the past decade. But I did trade it in this month fearing future repair and maintenance costs. Although individual experiences vary, I would not believe any surveys that rank Audi or BMW as having near the reliability of Toyota and Honda.
**SERVICE**
There are quite a few independent service shops that specialize in BMWs here in the SF Bay Area. Although they must exist, I do not know of any independent Audi-only shops in my area. New Dimensions is the closest thing, advertising themselves as a VW/Audi shop. However, I am sure that 90% or more of their business is VW; I had a mediocre service experience there. So, there are more service options for BMW along with somewhat lower service costs vs. Audi.
Thats incorrect. No automaker posts anything there. Autospies gets the press releases from the same sites that you and I would go to read them, like the autochannel.com or any other respectable media outlet. Autospies just posts them on their site with a catch headline and then calls it news. Every wonder why they wait until Thursday to post new info? They gather the press releases from thecarconnect.com, autochannel.com and others all week long and just rehash it on Thursday night. Problem is they often try to act like they got the "scoop" first and then they run with it.
There probably isn't a more seedy or tacky site on the net, as far as automotive things go.
Do you really think Mercedes, Audi or any other carmaker would have anything to do with such a low-rent, off-base site? I think not. Are there car dealers associated with them? Yes of course. They are what keeps the site going. Big difference from the corporate offices of MB, Audi, BMW, Porsche, Lexus or any other make. None of them "post" anything on their site. A press release is just that a press release and once its out anyone can post it anywhere.
M
Please do not put Lexus in the same sentance as MB, Audi, BMW, Porsche it degrades your point about these car manufactures!
I do need to ask you to keep your posts totally in English, please ...
I instruct at track events for a number of clubs, and have done quite a few BMW club events. I've driven and ridden in a bunch of M3's on the track, but never on the street.
My daily driver is an '01.5 S4, and I've driven a friend's '05 S4 (both 6-speed), but I've never tracked an Audi.
They're both great cars, but are at their best doing different things.
IMO the M3 is almost certainly the better track car, comparing unmodified cars. (That's assuming a dry track - different story in the wet). Great balance, feedback, high-rpm performance, brakes, it's all there. I prefer the slightly older M3's because the new ones feel - and are - heavier, but they're all a real pleasure on the track. I think the S4 would feel quite heavy on the track, particularly front-heavy, and the front tires and brakes would take a beating. I saw a very fast S4 (V6TT) on the track recently, mostly stock but with stiffer suspension and chip,exhaust, etc., and I'd sure like to drive it some time, but this thread is really about stock cars.
On the road the S4 is really amazing, it's hard to imagine anything better. Fast, smooth, responsive, comfortable, superb interior, and all in a car you can drive all day and night through a snowstorm. I've had no problems in New England winters with just all-season tires.
So, my verdict, which means absolutely zero by the way, is the S4 for a street car, even in non-snow country, and also the S4 for someone who does an occasional track event. For a real track junkie though I'd have to recommend the M3, provided there's something else to drive when it's slippery out.
http://www.jdpower.com/pdf/2005069.pdf
This is the 2005 JD Powers Initial Quality Survey.
BMW is clearly above Audi. Also making a mental note never to buy a Suzuki.
And uh, what exactly does that mean? I suspect that you are implying that the V8 S4 easily trumps the B5S4....which isn't exactly accurate . The 2.7 Biturbo easily lends itself to performance upgrades that enable it to leave the larger behemoth in its wake. I traded my '01 for an '05 and, while the newer version has many wonderful attributes, I miss the performance of my 2.7T. "i could keep going but i think every1 see's my side"(sic). You do more baseball than college, don't you.
Lexus is also becoming far more competitive- the IS350 is a 315 hp car, and it's not even the M3-fighter. It could probably wipe the G35 across the floor.
The only thing that BMW is actually better at is performance- and that's not saying Audis have bad performance. They have great performance and accelaration off the line, with luxury, style, and value to back them up. And, quality is different than reliability. In a test I read today, the magazine said that "the A6 has the highest quality of the bunch". They didn't mean reliability.
And, I love the attention. I got a beautiful Sprint Blue color, and that way almost every luxury car owner knows that it's an S4. A man in a Porsche Cayenne Turbo gave me a thumbs up, a person in an A8L nodded at me, and someone who drove an S4 sedan just smiled at me. And, most people who drive competing companies just look at it. For a while. I can see a tad of jealousy. But, my favorite part so far was when a dark blue M3 Convertible and I were at a stoplight, and I just dusted him. Twice.
I'll never get tired of the car, and now I'm hooked on convertibles. After this, I could never go into another A6.
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