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Chronic Car Buyers Anonymous



  • stickguystickguy Posts: 26,347
    The Sunday paper (I know, old school) also works just fine. Whenever a maker is running heavily subsidized leases (or specials like 0/0/0) every dealer seems to feature them in their ads. Not to mention the endless TV commercials!

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • stickguystickguy Posts: 26,347
    how quaint. But not gonna hurt you.

    even if they don't have brand new stock, see if they have any on the used side. I don't think that it has changed enough since released that it would not give you a good feel as to if it would work.

    2018 Hyundai Elantra Sport (mine), 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's) and 2015 Jetta Sport (daughter's)

  • michaellnomichaellno Posts: 4,300
    Update - I went to the specific dealer website rather than the "Go Dealers" (Auto Nation brand name here in Denver) website and found our number one choice in stock.

    Checked on insurance ... about $45 cheaper per year than the CX-7, so that's a wash.

    Need to determine if premium is "required" or "recommended" for the Juke. With a small, direct-injected turbo, I suspect it will be required.
  • steverstever Posts: 52,683
    We say "Premium unleaded (recommended)".
  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 10,637
    Try to steer your bride into this Juke:


    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport / 2014 M235i / 1999 Wrangler / 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2016 i3 REX/2009 Cooper Clubman Son's: 2009 328i

  • michaellnomichaellno Posts: 4,300
    edited March 2013
    Yeah, the NISMO version. She's not really the "Fast 'n' Furious" type, if you know what I mean.

    Only 9 more HP?

    And, the summer only rubber would be a killer when the snow falls here in Colorado.

    From a features point of view, about the only thing she's giving up with the Juke are the HID headlights, the telescoping steering wheel, and power seats.

    Oh, and a fair bit of interior space. 4" less rear legroom, 1/3 luggage capacity (30 cu ft in the Mazda, 10 in the Juke).

    Everything else she's got on the CX-7 - Bluetooth, sunroof, heated seats, nav, backup camera - are now available on the Juke.

    In fact, the Juke has Sirius/XM traffic available - she might be able to use that for the driving that she'll be doing.

    Hopefully, she'll get a chance to look it over and drive it today. I'm concerned that she won't like the CVT. Or the rear spoiler.

    Related note - the co-worker who got rid of the Land Rover bought a Forrester.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 22,661
    That is really really disappointing.
    I hoped they'd get somewhere in the same ballpark as this one. But 197hp? That's not even the same planet.

    '17 F150 Crew 2.7; '67 Coronet R/T; '14 Town&Country Limited; '09 LR2 HSE. 44-car history and counting!

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    If it is a long drive in the convertible bring not just a hat but also ear plugs, that reduces fatigue.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Dealers are getting 2014 Foresters now. The 2 closest dealers have 2 each.

    Was it you who was waiting to see those?
  • gouldngouldn Posts: 223
    Ah that was me (looking for them). I'll check the local stock! Thanks! If I go the Forester route I'll want to go full boat loaded, although I could do without the turbo.
  • gouldngouldn Posts: 223
    I've been looking at the Juke too, and I like it ... it's a tad too small for me, but one thing I'd be concerned about is the mileage ... if you look at fuelly the average was about 30, but then I noticed that includes the diesel version which we cannot get. I wonder if real world mpg would be more like 25 ... fine, but not a whole lot more the 19, especially if you have to use PUG.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    2013 or 2014?

    One member ordered one but I haven't heard of anyone taking delivery yet.

    Good luck with the wheeling and dealing.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Wifey loves her 09 Limited, as loaded as the non turbos came at the time.

    They offer a LOT more options now. You can go hog crazy.
  • michaellnomichaellno Posts: 4,300
    2013 or 2014?

    My guess is that it's a '13.

    We will see how it goes tonight .. it's possible the daughter will be with us to evaluate the back seat. The Juke would still fill the "family car" role for when the 3 of us travel together.

    I, too, am concerned about the MPG, and, more importantly, the fact that the AWD version has an 11.8 gallon fuel tank (FWD has 13.2 gallon tank). At 30 MPG you're looking at around 300 miles per tank.

    The CX-7 has a 16 gallon tank, so if you fill up once a week @ $4/gal (PUG), you're saving about $16.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    edited March 2013
    Hmm, your daughter may complain about the tight space.

    My advice? Stay out of it if they argue about that. ;)

    The small gas tank in the Miata is an annoyance.
  • gouldngouldn Posts: 223
    Thanks guys!

    that "ridewithg" website is neat, thanks! The lease swapper sites are neat, but I wonder how you ensure yourself that the previous owners didn't damage the car that you end up being on the hook for at least end? Has anybody here ever tried it?
  • tjc78tjc78 JerseyPosts: 6,663
    edited March 2013
    If I was using that site I would certainly try and stay pretty local so I could check the car out. Before I leased the LaCrosse I was looking on there pretty often and was ready to contact a seller about an MKS with a really low payment for the MSRP and when I went back it was gone.

    I guess you could also email the seller asking for hi-res pictures. There isn't really any gamble mechanically as it will be under warranty.

    2017 Buick Enclave / 2017 Hyundai Elantra

  • breldbreld Posts: 3,446
    At least from the pictures, I'm really liking the new 2014 Forester. I'll be checking them out when they become more available.

    I did end up listing the 530i - I did so at a really high asking price, figuring that if I found the buyer who really wants that specific car, it'd be a good deal. And if not, then I just hang onto it.

    Good luck with the Juke shopping this evening Michael - I assume it's Go Nissan down on Arapahoe? That's just down the road from my work - I could come down and cheer you on to making the purchase :D .

    2017 Durango R/T - 2017 Civic Type R - 2016 V60 Polestar - 2012 Mini Hardtop

  • xwesxxwesx Fairbanks, AlaskaPosts: 11,152
    Hey, at least the NISMO comes with a manual transmission option! I didn't look close enough to see whether that is with or without AWD, but the basic Juke only offers MT on the FWD. No thanks. But then, I don't really care too much since they are so terribly ugly that I would never seriously consider owning one.
    2014 Audi Q7 TDI, 2008 and 2013 Subaru Forester(s), 1969 Chevrolet C20 Pickup, 1969 Ford Econoline 100, 1976 Ford F250 Pickup
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 11,586
    W is for Why would I ever even consider driving a vehicle built by another manufacturer?

    Everyone here knows how much I simply LOVE my 2011 E90 328xi. One of the many benefits to owning (leasing in my case) a BMW is the excellent service & great pool of loaner cars available. Hey, you're getting a new BMW as a loaner, how bad could it be? For my 1st service I had the distinct pleasure of driving an E90 335d which I gushed about.

    This past Tuesday I brought it back to the dealer (2nd time in a year, damn those unreliable German cars), for a few nagging issues. The trunk latch needed to be replaced (this part was ordered form my previous service) and my right headlight was looking a little droopy. The loaner I was given this time was a 2013 BMW X1 X-Drive 28i.

    For those of you unfamiliar (although I'm pretty sure most of you are), X1 X-Drive 28i is BMW speak for X1 with the N20 2.0L Turbo 4cyl engine & AWD. My tester loaner was equipped (from what I could tell) with Premium Package (leather, home link, power seats, panorama roof), heated front seats, and keyless go. I was excited to drive the X1 for it's power train, the 1st BMW I drove with the Turbo 4cyl engine & 8 speed automatic transmission.

    First Impressions:

    Exterior: The X1 definitely has the whole "tall wagon" look going for it. My loaner was Black with 17" wheels and standard halogen headlights. The European Pedestrian Crash Safety nose combined with BMWs traditional short overhangs make the car look stubby.

    Interior: The seating position is definitely "down & in" the car as opposed to my E90 which is more level. The cabin seems wider than my E90. I immediately grab the perfectly thick, 3 spoke steering wheel & start thinking of ways to switch it with mine ;) Soft touch plastics are all over the place. The top of the instrument cluster feels hard. Outward visibility is not good. Thick A Pillar almost forces you to stick your head out the window like Ace Ventura. Look over your left shoulder (like when moving from right lane to center lane) and there's a sight blocking B Pillar. Rear visibility is also dismal. A backup camera and blind zone alert sensors should be standard.

    Driving Impressions:

    Foot on the brake, insert key (I didn't realize it had keyless go yet), press start button. The N20 growls to life, but never settles down. Idle is almost coarse. In its defense, my Prelude's engine is impressively smooth (with counter rotating balance shafts), my Pilot's 3.5 L V6 is damn close to silent, & my BMW's Inline 6's smoothness is legendary.

    Snaking my way around the parking lot, I notice the steering is a touch lighter than my E90, but very communicative. A right turn out of the dealership, a couple of traffic lights and its time to jump on the highway. Left blinker and put the throttle half way down while merging & I'm going 75 without breaking a sweat. I settle down and set the cruise at 70 because its late and I'm tired.

    The X1 holds the road well as a BMW should. The ride is not as compliant as my 3 series. The engine note is audible, but not offensively. Its a 4cyl after all.

    Time to pay a toll. Slow down to 5mph in the EZPass lane, slide the shifter into DS and drop the hammer. The car actually forced me back into my seat. This car has an incredible power band. The 8 speed auto trans shifted crisply. I look down and see the speedo needle sweeping past the 110 mph mark. Whoa. Slow down. Ease on the brakes and set the cruise at 70 for the remainder of the ride home.

    Once I got off the highway, I was able to test the X1s handling as we have some brilliant back roads here in CT. The X1 drives as if it smaller than my 328xi. I really noticed this while taking corners. The steering is quick and you can feel less mass over the rear wheels.

    My average gas mileage over the 100 miles I drove was 23.5

    The verdict:

    I wouldn't hesitate to buy a BMW with this N20 4Cyl turbo engine. It is not as smooth, but much faster than my Inline 6. I also couldn't justify the extra scratch for the N55 Turbo Inline 6 powered X1 X-Drive 35i. I really liked the way it drove.

    The X1 just doesn't look right to me. The loaner's 17" wheels didn't fill out the wheel wells enough, the standard halogen lights were horrible and made the X1 look cheap.

    Gas mileage was a little better than in my 328xi, but with the 4cyl engine, auto start/stop, and 8 speed automatic, I expected much better.

    I wouldn't run out and buy an X1 when my lease is up. But if there was a fire sale on service loaners or executive demos, I'd consider it if other BMWs are too pricey for me.

    Thanks for reading. Sorry to steal some of your thunder today Sandy.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2015 Infiniti Q40 AWD, 2017 Honda Pilot Touring AWD

  • sandman_6472sandman_6472 Coral Springs, FLPosts: 4,282
    edited March 2013
    Don't be silly guy, I really think you and Backy do a much better job than I at this stuff so please, be my guest. Now let me give it a shot. The March 7th edition of The Sandman Chronicles is set to begin below.

    For my 1st Ft. Myers run today, i had a top of the line Chrysler 200 in charcoal with 18" alloys, a very sedate looking vehicle and all I can say is..."wow"! hat a sleeper car this is! Smooth as glass and I got it up to 102 to pass someone and the car didn't even flinch just did what my right foot asked of it. Soft touch dash and nice hardware with every control right where it needs to be...wonderful ergonomics and the leather wrapped wheel was just meaty enough where it felt like one with my arms. Great steering and minimal road noise made for a fun and energetic run across the alley. This car really is a sleeper and surprised they don't sell more than they do. I know it's the fleet queen but it's a really good family sedan and although not the looker that the new Accord or Fusion is, anyone in this market should give this vehicle a good tryout as I'll bet it's priced aggressively and I had a smile on my face the whole way over. This is the 4th 200 I've driven this week with two being the lux model and the other two the regular one with 17" bolt on wheel covers and they both drive superbly though if I had to purchase one, I'd go for the top model to get that great steering wheel and the Sirius/XM.

    Trip two almost got me into a brand new with the plastic Nissan Sentra but my buddy saw it first and he took it. Was a bit envious but I'll just get the next one. At this Dollar out lot, we're in the process of swapping out the fleet so there are new vehicles waiting including Altimas and Sonatas. But I got a beautiful ref 2013 Ford Focus with just 435 on the clock. No sat radio but my flash drive synched perfectly with the standard radio though the speakers are on the cheap side. If I were to own one of these puppies, I'd have to swap out the speakers and put in a small amp to get more sound bang for the buck, as to me it's an investment in happiness and the cost isn't much when a car is kept as long as I do with mine.

    These Foci have nicely bolstered seats which really hold you in place but they really need some more padding where it counts...I got back fatigue by the midpoint of the trip which caused a considerable amount of pain and problems with my bad left leg on the return trip to Lauderdale. For the seat alone, I could never purchase this vehicle. This is it's major faux pas for me because in the hatch version, it's a nice looking ride. The other major problem was the irritating wind noise the driver side mirror resonates which just gets louder at higher speeds...very annoying and unacceptable inn this segment. The 2013 Sentra I tested last week was so much quieter and even the little Kia Rio was stellar in this regard. No matter how high I put the music, I could still hear that annoying wind noise and it took away some of the enjoyment of the drive. the seat fabric was acceptable, not class leading but it did it's job and didn't itch my legs. I usually wear shorts on these trips so comfy fabric is important.

    Mileage is impressive though and I had the a/c on most of the time as it has warmed up by the afternoon. in this car, the dash surrounds one like a cockpit which is a bit claustraphobic at first but after awhile, it's not even noticeable. All the controls fall to place and are within easy reach. Not a fan of the awkward cruise buttons but they are better than some of the GM products of late. Still, for simplicity sake nothing beats my '06 Civic's cruise control push operation and it always works without fail. Why the other guys don't copy it's form and function is a mystery to me but it works...period! Ford and GM I hope you are listening here folks!!!

    In the compact segment, this Focus is just mid pack and really, nothing to write home about. The Elantra is still the benchmark hands down with the Sentra moving up the ranks nicely with it's new 2013 model but I will have to wait till I get some extended seat time to really evaluate it properly. But just from my little test drive last week I'm gonna say that Nissan did a very commendable job here, much better than the comfortable one of the last generation. This new one looks so much better and I think is very comfortable especially in SL version which has the nicer seat fabric and extra options. But I'm very excited to see what Toyota has up it's sleeve with the new Corolla coming soon. These last two generations have shown this to really be a "blahmobile" no matter what version one chooses...but that's not to say that blah is a bad thing. It gets the job done with stellar mileage and though not a looker in any trim, it quietly goes about it's business and still seems to sell in record number so they must be doing something right here. I guess many folks are happy with an appliance that's still "cheap to keep" with minimal input. I had a couple years ago when Toyota and Honda were the major players in this segment and could do no wrong and they were great vehicles then. These past two generations have just been very dull looking but are still appealing to many. Toyota knows that it needs to beat the Elantra in this segment because the Koreans have seemed to duplicated the Toyota playbook and tweaked it in such a way that they are now the class leading benchmarks of the compact segment. How and why Toyota and Honda got left in the dust is an interesting question but they both know that they have a lot of catch up to do. Hopefully Toyota is up for the task and will hit a homer with the next Corolla. Saw a brand new Civic today on the road, my only comment was "meh", still a bit on the bland side and if I had to purchase today, I'd skip the Honda store completely. As we shop for the next Mrs. Sandmanmobile, no Honda or Toyota is even on the short list as there's nothing that she's remotely interested in. My how things have changed in the import vehicle segment!

    Until next time reader, I am,

    The Sandman :) :sick: :shades:

    2015 Audi A3 (wife) / 2015 Golf TSI (me) / 2009 Nissan Versa SL Hatch (daughter #1) / 2008 Hyundai Accent GLS (daughter #2)

  • sandman_6472sandman_6472 Coral Springs, FLPosts: 4,282
    edited March 2013
    Still suffering from insomnia so I thought it would be a good time to write the latest version of "The Sandman Chronicles" but please forgive me if some of the sentences aren't the best as I'm really tired now so please bear with me. I did correct as many spelling and punctuation errors as I could find. I'll be back with the next installment once I get to drive some different vehicles. There are a few that I've got my eye on and depending on how fast I can get to them will determine what I drive. Also we tend to look for vehicles which are already gassed up and ready to go as waiting in line for petrol is a major time waster and we always leave the lot in a group as each vehicle and each driver are checked against the master list for logistics purposes. Once we hit the open road though, we're free to go as we please. Some go in groups but I prefer to be the lone wolf and go at my own speed. Many eat in the car after they go through a fast food line. I'd rather go inside and get out of the car if I do end up buying my meal. But I also pack a lunch and maybe eat once we get to our destination while I wait for the chase vehicle and the others. I'm not one for eating while I drive as I don't want to spill or leave crumbs in any vehicle...I treat all my rides as if they were my own vehicle and never do anything stupid on purpose. I just wish others would do the same as some people are really pigs folks, absolute swine in that they trash these things and leave paper products and charge slips all over. I've seen some very low mileage vehicles with marks and stains on the seats and headliners which is just plain so low class and it really pisses me off. I bet these folks treat their personal vehicles so much better so why do they feel they can muck up these rentals...just leaves me speechless!

    The Sleepy Sandman :surprise: :sick: :shades:

    2015 Audi A3 (wife) / 2015 Golf TSI (me) / 2009 Nissan Versa SL Hatch (daughter #1) / 2008 Hyundai Accent GLS (daughter #2)

  • michaellnomichaellno Posts: 4,300
    Good luck with the Juke shopping this evening Michael - I assume it's Go Nissan down on Arapahoe?

    Hmm, your daughter may complain about the tight space.

    My advice? Stay out of it if they argue about that.

    breld - yep, it was Go Nissan on Arapahoe. Wife's new office is just north of Arapahoe on Peoria, so quite close.

    Headed up to meet the wife after our daughter got home from work. Didn't go directly to the dealer; the girls needed to get a bit of retail therapy first so we went to the local Vera Bradley store. Then a bite of dinner at California Pizza Kitchen before heading to the dealer around 7-ish.

    Took a few minutes to find the specific car we were wanting to look at ... 2013 Nissan Juke SL AWD in Metallic Bronze. Since it was dark out, you couldn't really appreciate the color. I took a look at the window sticker - OMG! Over $30K - this particular car had the "sport" package - rear wing, gunmetal alloys. Also equipped with the front armrest and carpeted floor mats. Dealer sticker wanted to charge for pinstrips, nitrogen in the tires, and other fluff.

    Nobody approaches us so I head into the showroom to grab a salesman. Managers greet me and introduce me to "Marv" (not his real name). I tell Marv that we want to see that specific Juke and give him the stock number so he can get the keys. I also give him my license to copy so we can do the test drive without any other delays.

    The girls are standing by the Juke and I introduce them to Marv. I explain to him that I know about the car but the wife does not so he needs to explain it all to her. I'm trying not to influence the wife's opinion one way or the other.

    Marv does a decent job of explaining the major features of the Juke (torque vectoring, small turbo engine, etc.), but he's doing so in a somewhat condescending manner .. as if my wife had never driven such a feature laden car.

    He pulls it out of of the line and under a large light so we can see it better. He opens up the hatch to put in his dealer plate and the wife comments how small the rear storage area is (yep, 1/3 the size - 29 cu ft. in the Mazda vs. 10.5 in the Juke). Marv flips the seat down - it folds flat, which is nice.

    Wife hops into the drivers seat and Marv starts explaining all the features - auto headlights, buttons on the steering wheel for cruise and Bluetooth, etc. Tells us he can't demonstrate the Nav system as all the SD cards are locked up in the showroom. Bummer - that's a feature my wife will use a lot in her new job.

    So, off we go on the test drive - Marv explains how you can "configure" the Juke to operate normally, in Sport mode or in Eco mode. Each affects the way the engine responds to throttle inputs and handling. Wifes' eyes glaze over - like she's gonna change modes while driving. Not!

    Test drive route is a mix of business parks roads and a short blast on the highway. Takes us to a parking lot to demonstrate the turning radius (for some reason, this is a big deal for my wife) and the backup camera. Turning radius is really small - as it should be, since the car has a WB of under 100". The backup camera includes lane markers shaded in green, yellow and red - a nice feature the Mazda doesn't have.

    I ask her how she likes the ride. The Mazda is pretty firm, but since it's a larger car, you don't notice it as much. The Juke, OTOH, is about a half step up from the daughter's MINI. Not sure how that would play on a long road trip.

    Decent power, easy to drive, very responsive, according to the wife.

    Daughter said she was OK in the back seat, her biggest issue was that the windows were smaller than in the Mazda. Yep, quite true.

    The test drive ends and we tell Marv that we need to give it some serious thought. He doesn't try to pressure us at all .. no questions about a trade, though it was pretty obvious that we'd be swapping the Mazda. No "trial closes". Very professional. We tell him it's not a matter of choosing the Juke over something else, it's a matter of keeping the Mazda or not.

    So, what did we decide to do? We had a long talk afterwards and a decision has been made .. will share that with you here in a bit.

    In the words of our departed friend Mack, to be continued...
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Idle is almost coarse

    Fairly typical of DI engines nowadays.

    I think we give up linearity and smoothness, but the power and economy balance are impressive.

    I predict we'll see more and more "fake" engine sounds piped in to cabins.
  • tjc78tjc78 JerseyPosts: 6,663
    Fairly typical of DI engines nowadays.

    Guess it depends how it is tuned. The 3.6 in my LaCrosse is very smooth at idle (can't feel it) and outside the car (as long as the cooling fan is off) there is barely a whisper coming from under the hood except for the electronic "clicking" of the injectors.

    2017 Buick Enclave / 2017 Hyundai Elantra

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    no Honda or Toyota is even on the short list as there's nothing that she's remotely interested in

    The segment is competitive, you just can't rest on your laurels nowadays. Others will simply outgun you, and then you'll have to lower prices and say bye bye to profits.

    Fitzmall has a brand new Corolla for $15,306, how much of a loss is there for a price like that?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    windows were smaller than in the Mazda

    The rear doors do seem small. Did she have to duck to get in and out?

    $30k seems a bit steep for such a small vehicle, but it does sound loaded up. I've priced Altimas for a lot less than that, though.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I sampled the 3.6l in the very first year Saturn Outlook, but I don't think they had DI back then. IIRC they made it an upgrade option a year or two later.

    I bet your Buick has excellent insulation, too.
  • michaellnomichaellno Posts: 4,300
    The rear doors do seem small. Did she have to duck to get in and out?

    I don't know, but wouldn't be surprised if she had to. Quite a bit of slope on the rear doors.

    $30k seems a bit steep for such a small vehicle, but it does sound loaded up.

    Yeah, I don't think there was an option or accessory it didn't have.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I get why you're letting her choose (happy wife, happy life) but if it were me, I'd get the Altima instead. More car for less money, really. The 4 banger is both quick and efficient, and loaded up they were mid 20s.

    While at the dealer, you should say "why don't you try one of these" and just see what she says.
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