War of the Compacts:Frontier, Ranger, Tacoma, S10, Dakota, B-Series, & Hombre - II

1…567911

Comments

  • cthompson21cthompson21 Member Posts: 1,102
    Sure, the Dakota is less expensive than Sport Trac's and Supercrew's. The Dakota isn't even in the same class of vehicle.

    If you compare it to the compact truck class, it runs a few thousand more than the Ranger, BSeries, S10, Sonoma, Hombre, and Frontier.

    It does however give you more for your money (bigger size and a V8) unlike the similarly priced Tacoma.


    As for features, the base models are very sparse compared with other base model trucks. And, as you option it up, those features cost more dollar for dollar than its competitors.


    Don't get me wrong. I'm not bagging on the Dakota. I like the truck a lot. It will definately be a top contender when I buy my next truck. I'm in an entirely different financial position than a couple of years ago, and price is not quite so high on the priority list. I'd definately like a V8 before they're replaced with "alternative sources" down the road.
  • xena1axena1a Member Posts: 286
    I've got a '00 Dakota Regular Cab 4X4 5-speed with the 4.7L V8. I'm getting a consistent 17MPG with about 3500mi on the vehicle so far. This is for all-purpose driving. I have not taken a road trip with it yet, so I don't have any hiway MPG numbers for you. One surprising feature of the truck is how smoothly it rides for a 4X4. It definitely has a softer suspension than my previous truck ('99 Mazda B3000 4X4). I'm not sure how this will translate for off-road conditions. But as an every day driver, it is smooth and very comfortable. In fact, I think the truck feels more like a scaled down 2 wheel drive 1/2 ton than an over sized compact. The 4.7L engine is a blast to drive. There is just something about a V8 with a 5-speed! One interesting note concerning fuel costs is that with my old truck, I needed to run 92 Octane in it because of a pinging problem. With the Dakota, it runs fine on 87. Consequently, the V8 only costs me $2.00 more per week in fuel to drive. Shoot, considering how much fun the truck is to drive, I consider that a bargain. Give the Dakota a look. You might be surprised...
  • xena1axena1a Member Posts: 286
    Yes, I agree that compared to the Ranger, the Dakota will probably cost 2-3K more (especially when fitted with a V8). However, compared to the Tacoma, the Dakota suddenly looks like a decent bargain. It is definitely an in-betweener for those who don't want or need a 1/2 ton, but like the idea of more room and power than a compact. It fits my needs just right...
  • superjim2000superjim2000 Member Posts: 314
    Fun to drive is right! To heck with gas prices, DRIVE!
  • xena1axena1a Member Posts: 286
    Yes, I agree. The way I figure, we all work pretty hard at our jobs. Shoot, I don't know anyone who doesn't. If you can afford it, you might as well drive what you want and just enjoy it. For me, it is kind of a nice stress reliever at the end of a long day. I always look forward to the drive home because it is just, well, fun...

    How's that S10 doing? I've always been a fan of the Chevy 4.3L V6. Had one in my '90 1/2 ton. Decent engine...
  • superjim2000superjim2000 Member Posts: 314
    My S10 is awesome, thanx for asking. Michelin tires, Airaid spacer and K&N flter. Its begging for an exhaust upgrade, you should hear it when the rpm's are high. Put in Tim Taylor grunt here, it sounds sooooo good. (sorry, dont have a tach, but it was pick of the litter in '99) Much better than my old S10, (83, carb, 2.8) but, in 83 EFI wasnt avialable for the S10.

    EFI is awesome!!!!!!


    Plus my '83 was a base model, it got the job done with aftermarket stereo and speakers. The S10 is a very good truck, only 2 times did my old S10 let me down........

    Got up at 5am, went to start it, battery exploded. Called my boss, told him what happened, he understood.

    Got up at 2am, truck was outside all day....... wouldnt start. Heck it was -40 in January. My boss picked me up!!!

    I was surprised that new S10's have insulated battery boxes. And with EFI, start it and its running. Worst case, start it, clear the windshield and go. Hopefully I'll have a garage soon.
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    I've got a 2000 ZR2 and I was thinking of doing some mods like airraid and exhaust.How is the airraid? Do you know of any chip for the computer.So far truck is great only 300 miles but the ride is real smooth considering the offroad package it comes with it really holds the toad well and corners very nicely.
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    It holds toads as well as the roads.:)
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    This debate seems to never end with the Dakota. I am a fan of the Dakota, I have to give Dodge a kudos for finding a solid market niche. For those who don't need a full size, yet need the power to tow over 5K the Dakota fits the bill. Dodge is now offering .9 percent financing on ALL Dakota models in the NW region. I personally feel you cannot compare a Dakota to a Ranger, S-10, Tacoma, or Frontier. Pricewise however, when you start to compare a Tacoma 3.4, automatic nicely optioned, a Dakota V8 Tacoma optioned the same can be had for less
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    .9 financing for a .9 sized truck...LOL!!
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    The Dakota is okay,I wouldn't want one because I know to many people with problems with them.
  • steve234steve234 Member Posts: 460
    My gas mileage is averaging 16.5 with a 22.4 on one run. My mileage would be better but I have the 3.92 rear for towing and spend a lot of miles at 70-75. The best mileage is at 60-65 mph. Mine is 2wd and rides very smooth. By no means will it beat a lincoln or even a taurus for ride, but much nicer than my 91 F150. As far as reliability, I would say that the fit and finish is as good as I have seen lately and the feel of the drivetrain is very inspiring. Based on my personal experience, I would rank Ford higher in reliability and Dodge second, above the GMs. I do not bother with the imports because Toyotas are too pricey for the value and the others cannot do the job I need. Plus it is easier for me to find a dealer without a two hour drive.
  • xena1axena1a Member Posts: 286
    It's been pretty quite in here lately...
    Barlitz - How's that new ZR2 doing? I see a few down here in Tucson. Nice looking trucks...
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    The ZR2 is doing great I like it more and more each time I drive it.A little bummed though someone put a nice little door ding in it,any suggestions on getting it fixed?
  • cthompson21cthompson21 Member Posts: 1,102
    Check around for paintless dent removal. It costs about $50, and you'd never know it was dented. My father-in-law had it done to a ding on the door of his truck. You absolutely cannot tell there was ever a ding.
  • xena1axena1a Member Posts: 286
    Those first dents are killers! Especially when it happens so soon after purchase. On my previous truck ('99 Mazda B3000), I got a golf ball dent on the roof 24hrs after I took possession of it. My '00 Dakota already has a couple of minor dings way down low on the passenger's side door...
  • pinettedpinetted Member Posts: 104
    Cthompson21 is right, I had hail damage on one of my cars and when they were done you could not tell it had ever been damaged. As long as the paint is not scratched you shoud be OK. The only problem you will run into is if the dent is located on the bed with no openings close to it. All of todays truck beds are double lined so there is not way to push the dent out.
  • madhatr880madhatr880 Member Posts: 29
    I have owned a ford range an s-15 a mazda b and four toyotas. i am how every more partial to toyota(hence four of them)and ford. my gmc was a great truck, the only problem i every had out of it was the automatic locking hubs( the pins in the hubs kept breaking). my mazda just didnt have the ground clearnce above that no re-sale. I have also had an 81 toyota that had a 4cyl with 44in super swampers that i made stricly as a play toy. never had a problem with it and it went anywhere. my 87 ranger was also a great truck and to this day it is still going. i sold it to a friend and it now has 200,000+ miles on it. i later bought an 89 toyota sr5 exta cab that i customized that was probably the toughest truck i have ever owned. it had a 22re with 38" tires and the factory four elven gears in it and it still performed great. most recently i have purchased a 2000 and a 2001 toyota tacoma both are great( though i do recomend the six cyl over the 4.) before i bought the 2001 i drove every truck i belive could. i drove the ford f-150,ranger, sport trac,the chevy/gmc z71 and regular four wheel drive the mazda b-4000 the s-10, the frontier ( which by the way wound up being one of the final two to chose from.) in the end i bought the 2001 tacoma. I got the truck as loaded as they come with trd package with an impressive 12" ground clearance. the z71 had 8.5 and the f-150 7.8 tundra 10.5. now that i have the truck even devoted friend of chevy and ford and a mazda had to bow down to the ability of my tacoma and are even considering a tacoma as their next purchase.
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    madhater, do you know where Toyota measures its ground clearance from? Did you know that you have an open rearend in that TRD? It can only be engaged in 4-low. This isn't going to help you tow, haul, or pull anything. The locker is not a functional rearend for the everyday truck user. You paid a premium for Bilstein shocks and springs because of the Toyota name bud. Ever heard of a HP/Torque curve? Obviously not otherwise you would have chose a Ford or Chevy. The S-10 Vortec V6 puts out 250ft/lbs of Torque vs the 220 from the 3.4, The Ford SOHC 4.0 puts out 245ft/lbs of Torque with 205HP. Ford is coming out with its own special version of "offroad" vehicle that will cost thousands less than the TRD in about 2 months. I have gone up against a TRD and could go anywhere, climb, crawl whatever my friend could do in his TRD. Enjoy the sticker! LOL!...
  • madhatr880madhatr880 Member Posts: 29
    Im not saying that the other trucks are or arent better i just like the yota. why does everyone say enjoy price sticker i payed 22486 for a completely loaded trd tacoma to me that is very competative
  • madhatr880madhatr880 Member Posts: 29
    the chevy zr2 only has 190hp(same as the trd)and the ford has 207hp you can check that at www.chevrolet.com by going to comparison it will show you that the chevy zr2 has 7.5 and the ford ranger 7.4
  • 2k1trd2k1trd Member Posts: 301
    I think you are beating a dead horse on the open rearend thing! oh and i looked at the sticker on a 01 ranger x-cab 4.0 with off-road package and it
    was almost 25 grand......same as a yota with the
    TRD package.
  • cthompson21cthompson21 Member Posts: 1,102
    Toyota measures ground clearance from the higher of the two axles. Why, I'm not sure. Probably marketing. Seems like blatantly false advertising to me.

    From the lower of the two axles (which would actually constitute ground clearance in my opinion), the Taco's clearance is about 8". So, in reality the Taco has about a .5" advantage in ground clearance over its closest competitors.
  • croy2croy2 Member Posts: 45
    Please don't start comparing the Tacoma to the Ford or Chevy. Take a look at these vehicles 3 or 4 years down the road, and you will truly see which one is superior. That Taco will still be flawless and rattle free.

    Ford just issued the fifth safety recall on the new Ford Escape this week. They have ordered all dealers to stop sales and test drives. At Ford, Quality is truly job #1. LOL.
  • superjim2000superjim2000 Member Posts: 314
    Ranger and Escape are two completely different vehicles. I have a 99 S10 that is flawless. And I'd be happy to look at these vehicles 3-4 years down the road. In fact next year I will be ordering a new S10 so I get all the options I want, when are you going to get out of the honda and buy your tacoma?
  • cthompson21cthompson21 Member Posts: 1,102
    So, we should take a look at the '96 Tacomas as you suggest? The ones with that little problem where they blow the head gaskets? Flawless? Hardly.
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    I have a 00 ZR2ground clearance is 11.4" in front and 9.1" in rear.Your #'s are from a regular 4X4 S-10.Sorry but your tinota is a peice of foreign junk.Support Americans buy American made.
  • madhatr880madhatr880 Member Posts: 29
    i went outside last night when i was told how toyota measured ground clearance. i took a measuring tape and took a measurement from the ground to the rear chunk and it was right at 12 inches. my optional tires and wheels give me this clearance. as far as american made thats great. but before you say that do a little research bud. my truck may have overseas parts but it was made in the usa. do you know where yours was made 85% of american or "domestic" cars are made in canada or mexico. if you dont belive me just do a little digging i already did.
  • goobagooba Member Posts: 391
    If you want to buy American made,then I guess you meant to buy Nissan.The big 3 are mfg vehicles and parts out of this country.
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    madhat, HP, once again a typical Toyota person who doesn't understand HP/Torque curves or even Torque! The Chevy and Ford both out do your pretty Toyota in the HP/Torque curve area. For those of us who use their trucks as trucks and not show toys know that a HP/Torque curve is extremely important on a truck. Torque is also a must in a real truck.
    The rear diff being open on the Toyota does matter. I notice most Toyota owners don't even know they have an open rear diff!! or like tow sweep this under the carpet. It just hammers it home to me that most Toyota owners by their trucks for looks and commuter vehicles. Not so much for looks now though the 2001 is UGLY!
    As far as looking at a Ranger 3 -4 years down the line. My first Ranger was about 5 years old at sale and had 96K miles on it with no rattles or problems? My present Ranger is a 1998 it doesn't rattle and has no problems.
    And your price of an offroad Ranger is a joke. In today's paper they advertise a Tacoma for 18777, this is a 4cyl model (I called the dealership) Same dealer has a Ford lot. For 18999 they advertise a Ford Ranger with the new 4.0 SOHC v6! Air, CD, cruise nicely equipped.. Sorry, your price argument will fail. Its no secret the Tacoma costs more, lots more, option for option.
    Ground clearance, been over this one hundreds of times.. I have P265x75R16 all terrains on my Ranger. My friend has a TRD. We set our truck side by side and he had maybe 1/4" advantage. I have already admitted Toyota puts better tires on their 4x4 vehicles. But you can take your Ford factory tires to any Discount Tires/America's Tires and they will give you a great trade in value for a new set of tires to match what Toyota intalls for very few dollars out of your pocket..
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    Sorry Bud but I only support UAW made vehicles,just as UAW workers would support your business to keep jobs in the US,just my thoughts and opinions.If you feel comfortable sending your money overseas thats your choice.
  • blksn8kblksn8k Member Posts: 36
    As far as Toyota having a reliability edge, I'm not so sure. I have a 94 Ranger 4x4 Splash SC 4.0 5-speed with 102,000 mi. I do a fair amount of off-roading as this is my hunting vehicle. The only parts I have replaced have been normal wear items like belts, hoses, filters and brake linings. I replaced the original Firestones at 6000 mi with B.F.G. All-terrain TA's in 31x10.50-15s. It even has the original exhaust system and battery despite Ohio winters. As soon as Ford offers the Premium Off-road Package I plan to buy a 2001, with absolutely no concerns about reliability and with a very clear conscience.
  • madhatr880madhatr880 Member Posts: 29
    vince i dont know if you read my earlier statement that i like ford. the only reason that nissan was my second choice was the price. the ford i picked out was 25k+ the nissan was 20k+ and the toyota was 23k i happen to like the new body style if you dont the i respect your oppinion im not here to say that one is so much better than the other a truck is only going to last if you take care of it i have a nissan maxima with 175k miles on it and it runs great my friend has one a year newer and it is a piece of crap with much less miles. the ford to me was the best as far a power. i have just had more luck with my toyotas and yes one of the reasons i bought the truck was because of its looks and the ride. as far as towing anything all i pull is a 14ft alluminum boat and a fourwheeler if i need to pull something else i have access to a z71. for me to say that your truck is ugly or a piece of towing junk is irrelevant. we both can study statistics all day long and not know a thing about a trucks ability unless we test them and are not at all biast to one or the other. this is just hard to do. i am sure you love your ford ranger and i like my yota. that to me makes the truck worth owning and the best vehicle that i could have bought(one to fit a persons personality) as for you blitz the only part of my truck that was not made in the usa was the motor and the tranny so what does that mean. the parts of my body and interior were made by hard working americans who got paid for what the did true a great portion of the profit went to japan but what percent of labor cost and manufacturing cost was paid to the americans who assembled the vehicle. many domestic cars are built in mexico or canada providing the citizens of these two nations with jobs instead of ower own. in turn a great profit percentage is then redemed by the usa. comparatively this is the same form of business. in reality i doesnt matter where you by a vehicle from anymore.
  • eddyveddyv Member Posts: 12
    I own a 97 s-10 with a 4.3L, 5 sp, ext cab. Best little truck i ever owned. I have a bunch of friends that own a variety (ranger, tacoma, nissan, etc) and try as they may they can not in any way bark third gear like I can in my truck. I have yet to be beat by these guys in the 1/4. No mods to the truck either.

    Ed
  • madhatr880madhatr880 Member Posts: 29
    eddyv im not much into racing my 4x4. and in the mud i can pretty much spin my tires in any gear i please. but i do agree the vortec 4.3 is a quick little truck.
  • mahimahimahimahi Member Posts: 497
    The S-10 I had was a piece of junk compared to my friend's Nissans, (My '81 yota)and the Frontier I now have. I had to have the auto transmission replaced at 40k!!! Four pitman arms, one throttle-body something rather and five fan shrouds. The funny thing about these problems were that the dealer had all of these items(with the exception of the transmission)in stock, meaning that they were common! My S-10 was a '94 SS...damn right it was quick at the time the only other truck close was the Lightning. That was when it was operating corectly. My 4.3l Vortec was different than the ones they put in them today, however. When I shopped earlier this year, knowing I would be towing I didn't even consider looking at the S-10(fear of the Transmission).
  • allknowingallknowing Member Posts: 866
    You stated "I notice most Toyota owners don't even
    know they have an open rear diff"!!
    How could they not know that Vince since you say the same thing in every one of your posts? Why not get a dictionary, learn a few new words and post something new.

    I also see that Ford not only has the top selling SUV, the Explorer, but the most recalled vehicle probably in history too which is the Explorer as well. Now I see that the suspension breaks in cold weather. Excellent engineering.
  • goobagooba Member Posts: 391
    Sorry Bud but I only support UAW made
    vehicles,just as UAW workers would support your
    business to keep jobs in the US,just my thoughts
    and opinions.If you feel comfortable sending your
    money overseas thats your choice.

    So,how much of the vehicle has to be made in the US,or how much of it has to be union?
  • 2k1trd2k1trd Member Posts: 301
    AMEN!
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    I happen to be an IBEW electrician,I try to support all unions just like I would like them to support me,simple as that.BTW the Tacoma and Corolla are UAW made I just don't like the fact that the profits go back to Japan and get pumped into their economy,and the fact that Toyota does not trade fairly with the US.We go into more debt with Japan everyday because of unequal trading in return means less jobs for us Americans,you should be happy that there are people who think like me it could save your job someday.
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    That should be Japan trading fairly with the US.
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    practices going on, you best take that up with President Clinton cause there can be no "unfair" trading unless one side "allows" it. The US has made threats, talk of increased tariffs, and who knows what else. You can't blame Japan as if you can get away with it....why not?
  • madhatr880madhatr880 Member Posts: 29
    i understand your argument. but let me ask you this where is your computer made. what kind of stereo tv vcr dvd speakers and home appliances do you have. almost anything you buy these days is not made in america i wish it were. even the majority of levis are made in other countries now and imported to the us.
  • goobagooba Member Posts: 391
    Let me see if I understand this correctly.You are against the profits leaving the US.This,in spite of the fact that those forign companies have made an unvestment in the US.UAW members being employed by Toyota building the vehicles is a bad thing,while the big 3 are moving plants and jobs to other countries?It is ok for the big 3 to close plants and put those same UAW workers out of work,impact the local economy,but your beef is over the profits leaving?I think I will take the jobs and investment and who cares where the profits go.
    As far as you and the unions go,it does not affect my job at all.I believe that the unions are starting to become obsolete,and I have seen where they have at times caused more harm then good.
  • barlitzbarlitz Member Posts: 752
    Thats my opinion and I'll do what I like just as you can do what you like,as for Unions I've made close to $85,000 this year I have one of the best health plans in the country,an annuity with more money in it than you make in 3 years,also a pension which allows me to retire at 58 with Dignity I might ad.You may or may not have it better but I'm grateful for what my Union has done for me. Good Luck
  • modvptnlmodvptnl Member Posts: 1,352
    We're all happy for your success. What does that have to do with G.M building trucks in Mexico, taking away jobs from American workers? Oh! Your real name is Smith and your the CEO of G.M. now I understand.

    I've asked this before and all I got was a smart [non-permissible content removed] answer from Rocles. What's more important to the American worker; a foreign company that employs Americans or a American company that employs foreigners?

    Buy the truck/car that you want. This patriotic crap means nothing.
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    Let's put it this way. Toyota is building a plant...and you are to work on that job as an electrician installing lines. Do you refuse the work?
  • goobagooba Member Posts: 391
    I never said anything about your opinions.I just disagree with it.As for what you made,congrats.To which ro you owe it to? The union or the company that you work for? Is the union paying you and securing your pension?If not,thenthe company is doing it for you.Remember,things change at contract negotiation time,unless you are employed by the union.Good luck on your next contract.Hopefully it does not put the company in financial difficulty.

    modvptnl
    Far and away it is best to have a foreign company that employs Americans.At least they believe in the American worker and are willing to back it up with money and jobs instead of bs.

    obyone
    Good question.That puts a "good" union man in a dilema.On the one hand he should own a Toyota because he is working for and getting paid by Toyota.On the other hand he cannot own that Toyota because the profits are going to another country.Which union do you make mad?He cannot refuse the work,because of his union affiliation.
  • scape2scape2 Member Posts: 4,123
    Allknowing, I hit a soft spot huh? Facts are facts man, Toyota's are all open rearends. You Toyota fans can try and try to justify and twist and turn data, but facts are facts. Limited slips (offerred by Ford/Chevy/Nissan) are better than open diffs. I will keep hitting this home over and over again. I always come across someone new who doesn't realize this or what this means. I visit other car/truck rooms around the web and seem to find some Toyota owner who doesn't believe me. After all Toyota is supposed to be the God of 4-Wheel drive(at least some think so anyway).
    Personally, I don't care where my vehicle is built. I buy what ever is the best value for my hard earned dollar. I am presently employed in the industry of the 21st century and what is driving the U.S. now, technology sector. I get paid $34 and hour, non-union, for the skills I learned in school. I keep my skills leading edge because I have to, if I don't I know I will loose in this job segment. I believe in competition, makes the best come out in a person, product or company.
  • allknowingallknowing Member Posts: 866
    No you didn't hit a soft spot, I'm just tired of hearing the same thing over and over and there you go posting it even again. I live in California and the rear end is not an issue for me. I've never even had to use my locker on or off road. If I lived in the Mid-West it might be an issue to me. Here in California, the Ranger doesn't ride or maneuver as well on or off road from my experience. The Tacoma is easily worth the little extra it costs in my opinion.
This discussion has been closed.

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles

Your Privacy

By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our Visitor Agreement.