Acura TL vs Lexus IS 350

danny1878 · March 2006

One thing I noticed that there are still many TL sitting idle in the lot at many dealers that we visited

Maybe because they sell more than others? :P

According to Feb 2006 sales report :
1. TL ___ 5,169 units
2. 325i __ 3,682 units
3. G35 __2,891 units
4. IS 250 2,710 units
5. 330i _ 1,575 units
6. IS 350 1,172 units

Speaking about recent recalls:
LEXUS IS 2006
NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number : 05V565000 Mfg's Report Date : DEC 16, 2005
Component: VEHICLE SPEED CONTROL:ACCELERATOR PEDAL
Potential Number Of Units Affected : 3,567 units

ACURA TL 2006
NHTSA CAMPAIGN ID Number : 05V510000 Mfg's Report Date : NOV 02, 2005
Component: AIR BAGS:FRONTAL
Potential Number Of Units Affected : 316 units

dreyfus · March 2006

My wife and I test drove the IS250, IS350, and the TL. The Lexus is just a beautiful car, inside and out. The styling and luxury beat the TL hands down.

However, the 250 is underpowered and the 350 doesn't have a manual. The nav on the TL beats the nav on 250/350 hands down. My wife thought the 250/350 suspension too stiff and preferred the TL, though I liked it. No contest with the back seats - the 250/350 is a two seater.

The clincher for me was the visibility. I drove the 250 at night and didn't notice it, but when I drove the 350 in the daytime I found my view severely restricted - I was afraid of causing an accident.

So I'm going for the TL, for the legroom, nav controls, and visibility. I hate to pass on the terrific styling and upscale feel of the 350, but for me the TL is just more practical, and a bit cheaper to boot.

laurasdada · March 2006

"The IS is better for him. Doesn't make it so for anyone else."

"If I were you, I would scratch out the 'anyone'. I test drove both the TL and the IS. For me, the TL's interior feels cheaper than the IS's. For me! For me! For ME!!!!"

You're right. I should have typed "....Doesn't make it so for everybody else."

Vote with your wallet, folks! And enjoy your ride!

pentiumburner · March 2006

Well I can comment since I have owned a TL. As well I have some other info everyone may find interesting. The TL had a great voice recogniton and Nav system. Features were nice, all in a car that couldn't decide where it's next interior squeak and rattle were going to come from. Many dealer trips and letters to Acura were unacceptable. My wife's brand new Accord Coupe has a major rattle in the right rear passenger area of the cabin too.

I am tired of paying allot of money for vehicles that are put together by someone that is only thinking about their weekend or paycheck. This kind of quality is not acceptable.

My IS350 is everything I have wanted in a sports/luxury sedan. The comments here about the 3 series getting rated higher are misleading to a fault. If, and I di mean IF your driving is 90 percent down a twisting mountain road then by all means get the 3 series. That is the only thing and then it's even more perception that some reviewers liked better.

Personally I have owned a 3 seriesm, and while a very fun car to drive, I now enjoy more luxury and comfortable features than a 3 series has ever tried to accomplish. All in all I would rate these cars as follows:

IS350: Luxury, quality, fun to drive.
BMW: Quality, fun to drive.
Acura TL: Some nice tech features, hate FWD, hope you like a noisy cabin because you'll get one.

Oh and I can't forget. I now have an ex service writer from an Acura dealer working for me. He confirmed that the TLS are noise makers and that Acura knows about it but refuses to admit any shoddy assy. Big surprise there. I sold mine after a year when the headliner decided to pop of it's cheap double stick tape mounting points. What a piece of sh>>t

digital_b · March 2006

I owned a TL as well. it didnt have the issues that many many owners complain about even on the crappy edmunds review boards but it is in no way a luxury vehicle. the voice recognition and nav system is by far the highlight of that car. regardless of what the numerous complaints about the TL are you can bet that 'laurasdada' will post that HIS car is perfect and that 'lexus has problems too'.

maxidrive · March 2006

If you need to buy a car now and can't decide on the IS 350 or TL, get the IS 350 because the current model of the TL is nearing its end. The next generation of the TL may be better than the current IS 350. But right now, the IS 350 beats the TL hands down! Everytime I run into a TL while driving my IS, I'm smiling from within because I know my IS is a classier and more powerful car with a richer interior. These three things alone are well worth the price difference. Also, Lexus is well known for its top-ranked reliability and first-rate customer service.
It did take me some time to make up my mind on purchasing an IS 350, though. I was going back and forth between the BMW 3-Series and the IS 350. The Bimmer does drive better, but its interior is just too plain and looks cheap. When you add all the options that you want, it just becomes more expensive than the Lexus with the same features. This plus a lesser reliability finally made me opt for the Lexus.

laurasdada · March 2006

"Everytime I run into a TL while driving my IS, I'm smiling from within..."
Are you purposely ramming TLs or does your IS just have a mean streak...?! :P

Enjoy the IS, nice car. I'm waiting for the convertible.

DigiBobby: I own both an Acura TL and a Lexus (evil wife's car). Both are fab, neither has offered more or less problems than the other. But, hey, thanks for thinkin' of me!

Go UConn Huskies! Nice game UAlbany, way to age me a couple more years...!

neko608 · March 2006

PB, it's interesting that you say that, because I had a friend that bought a TSX and within the first week he had a HUGE problem from where the windshield is attached to the dashboard. First came a bunch of noise and rattling and next thing he knew the windshiled was popping out at the corner!!!!

I currently own an IS350...wow what a dream!

starman98 · March 2006

the TL isn't getting redesigned anytime soon according to Acura it will be changed in the 2009 model year(year after the new Accord) as the aging MDX and RSX need a new design first.

starman98 · March 2006

PLus the new ES350 would be better bigger, faster, more features and not a crome camry like in the past. I would personally go with this.

digital_b · April 2006

the new es 350 is to the new camry just as the old combo was. and this is not a place to talk about those cars anyway.

laurasdada · April 2006

While I understand those that have to continually insist that the ES/Camry & TL/Accord are the same cars so why waste your time, I just don't agree with this kind of thinking (yes, I understand platform sharing). Buy the car you want, they are different. In this case, 4 very good cars.

Following this "same car" thinking, don't buy the IS350, it's the same as the IS250. Ditto BMW 325/330, base Corvette/Z06, Porsche Boxter/Boxter S... Why buy the more expensive version, it's the same car with a few extra features? Why? Because you want the more powerful engine, tighter suspension, extra power accessories, different exterior/interior style, brand name, whatever. Because it is the car that you want and it is not the "same" as (insert other here)....

neko608 · April 2006

Laurasdada

Bravo! You hit the nail on the head. Even the new Porsche Cayman is based on Boxter architecture, but I love everything about the new Cayman and am pretty indifferent about the Boxter.

While the new ES/Camry are the same platform, they did make them look a little more different than in the past, but it is obvious they share the same platform (again, so what though)

The IS is based on the Japanese Crown Majestic, I believe.

cathyv · April 2006

Just left the Lexus and Acura dealers test driving the IS 250 and TL with Navigation. Both are great cars and can't decide which one to buy. The IS has those 18 inch wheels that will only last 15,000 miles (replacement would be $1,000). The other thing is that the front tires are different size than the back tires, so no tire rotation. Tires are directional, so they will have to be "flipped".

Lexus would only knock off $800 and the Acura dealer would be invoice plus $1200.

Anybody out there willing to share what they paid for their TL or IS 250?

pat · April 2006

Sounds like you are looking for our Prices Paid & Buying Experience board. There's lots of great information there. Here are a couple of links for you:

Acura TL: Prices Paid & Buying Experience

Lexus IS 250/IS 350: Prices Paid & Buying Experience

Have fun!

habitat1 · April 2006

"The IS has those 18 inch wheels that will only last 15,000 miles (replacement would be $1,000). The other thing is that the front tires are different size than the back tires, so no tire rotation. Tires are directional, so they will have to be "flipped"."

A couple of points:

Directional tires cannot be "flipped" side to side, or they will be going in the wrong direction. There is no rotation whatsoever in a performance vehicle with different sized front and rear tires that are (almost always) directional.

That said, unless you drive like Mario Andretti, you should be able to get well more than 15,000 miles out of a replacement set of "V" or "Z" rated tires, once you burn through the otpional 18" "Y" rated tires. That is a completely idiotic thing for Lexus to specify - "Y" rated tires on a 3,500 lb sedan with 204 hp and 185 ft lb of torque. And I'm sure it's part of their marketing plan to look "cool" to think a Lexus IS has the same tire rating as a M3 or 911S. Stupid is as stupid does.

pg48477 · April 2006

If I remember correctly TL and RL both based on the same platform as Accord, however the chassis size was changed for both TL and RL. ES and Camry on the other hand are identical, plus this time around loaded Camry just as good. Lexus like interior , is a common phrase many auditors used describing Camry. I see many reasons for choosing TL over Accord, better ride, better handling, better engine, better interior quality; dont see one for choosing ES over Camry. Exterior and interior design is purely subjective and can go ether way depending on the taste.

laurasdada · April 2006

Hello, pg:

Basically exactly what I was saying in that you see reasons to distinguish the TL/Accord but not so much the ES/Camry. Fine for you. Someone else who is shopping the ES/Camry may find many reasons to buy the ES over the Camry (simply like the interior/exterior design better, e.g.), their decision.

All I'm pointing out, and more specifically for the TL, is that it is not the same car as the Accord. Whether the differences are germaine to one's buying decision is up to that buyer. I personally believe that those that keep harping on the shared platform issues as a sole determiner as to why you shouldn't buy a car are simply posting an incorrect generalization. However, their opinion is certainly correct for themselves...

digital_b · April 2006

the IS is a brand new car world wide based on nothing. that is unless you want to say the cut down gs platform makes it like the gs. the toyota crown is the top of the line toyota in japan above the old celsior which is the car the ls is in the usa.

digital_b · April 2006

why you cannot handle the FACT that the TL and accord are EXACTLY the same car interior wise with the exception of the fake carbon fiber/ wood in the TL is amazing. the 2 cars are built in the same factory in ohio. the ES and camry share the same chassis and switch gear but the ES is built in canada I believe while the camry is built in georgetown kentucky. the 06 accord is the closest thing to a TL you can buy. the suspension and body work has changed significantly. it is ridiculous that honda is so lazy to do this but honda fans dont seem to mind. you CANNOT buy a toyota equivalent of the IS anywhere.

neko608 · April 2006

The Accord is a great car, and I don't think Honda should be knocked for basing the TL off of it.

laurasdada · April 2006

Yes. You are right. Everything you state is FACT. How can I respectfully disagree with your factual opinion. Yes, other than the differences, the TL and Accord are exactly the same! :shades:

Again, why buy the IS350 over the IS250. By your factual logic, they are the exact same car, besides the differneces! Same body, interior, built in the same factory... Wow, how lazy is Lexus/Toyota. But, I guess their customers don't mind...

And I agree Neko, basing a car off a perennial "10 Best" car is nothing to be ashamed of. If more Chevy's were based on the Accord...!

Again, I bought the car I wanted. The TL. Not the Accord, which while a fab car in and of itself, is no TL!

pg48477 · April 2006

I dont see your point, if TL and Accord both build on the same factory it makes it the same car; and because ES and Camry build on two different factories, its not the same car? I dont see anything wrong that TL is based on Accord, TL however much different from Accord in and out. ES on the other hand is exactly the same as Camry.

Its amazing that Acura created a vehicle that has no real completion, Accord IS the closest thing. Thats why it sells so well. Its the one and only FWD entry level sport sedan that is close in performance to its RWD rivals and its the size of the old 5series.

You said it yourself, you can buy IS equivalent in Japan. Which just like TL makes IS a rebadged TOYOTA. Nothing wrong with that, though.

digital_b · April 2006

you are being ridiculous but thats your 'right'. the is 250 and 350 are of course the same car except for the larger engine. of course you some how cant accept that your analogy is inaccurate to say the least.and no one said that the TL being essentially a super accord is anything to be ashamed of. I bought MY IS because its better than a TL which I also owned. I wont be looking at any toyota badged product that is essentially an IS either. this shouldnt be too hard to grasp but if it is I wont bring it up again.

digital_b · April 2006

you probably should re-read my post. NOWHERE did I say you can buy an IS equivalent. period. its not just that the TL and accord are built in the same factory. [have you ever looked inside both cars? I dont think so.] it really annoyed me that the salesman without literally saying so, implied that it was in fact ordered and coming within 11 days because it was coming from the same place as the accord. the TL once again is not different than the accord inside. its different on the outside.

pat · April 2006

There are many who totally disagree with you but this is the wrong place for that particular debate - we have a separate TL vs Accord discussion. If you need to continue, please do it there. Thanks.

pat · April 2006

Folks, the continuing arguments about whether one car is really another car or yet again some other car have to stop. Our topic is how the TL compares to the IS 350. If both of those cars are twenty-five other cars in disguise, so what? It does not matter to the topic.

The issue is how one vehicle in the subject compares to the other vehicle in the subject. We are comparing the features and attributes between the two of them as they are presented by the manufacturers under these two specific names.

We need to stick to that or wrap up this conversation - your call.

bullmonkey · April 2006

How much did it cost you to have your inverter replaced? I'm told I may need to have that done on my 2003 TL...

billyperks1 · April 2006

Nothing- my car is still under warranty,only 36,000 miles.

I think the four years run out in October but I am getting rid of it this summer.

bullmonkey · April 2006

That's lucky - mine is at 70K and looking like it'll cost about $1100.

bazookajoe · April 2006

Something else to consider... I have an '04 TL (270 horse) - for 2006 they have reduced the HP to 256. I saw it on the sticker of a new one and asked my service advisor about it and he confirmed. I am not sure how much that affects its performance as I have not driven an '06 but Im sure its noticeable. I put a cold air intake on mine and it helps a little on the low end, but to me it still needs a little more low end grunt (and Im not spending the 6k for the comptech supercharger for it)

dr_g · April 2006

The 2004 TL had 256HP as well (Acura just used a different measuring system to come up with the 270HP number). Per their specs, Acura updated it's 2006 numbers to the SAE measurement standard and consequently the numbers dropped from 270 to 256. Lots of other manufacturers were also "fibbing" with their numbers and were forced to standardize their story telling :P

Have you noticed any significant mileage improvement with the cold air induction? Gas is up to about $3.20 here in SoCal so if I could eek out just 5% more fuel efficiency it would pay for itself (although I do most short 10 mile commutes that don't allow the engine to warm up to it's potential).

pg48477 · April 2006

04 and 06 are identical, what change is the way they rate HP, so you too have 258 new HP, but 270 old HP. Power did not change, what changed is the number.

berlina · August 2006

The motor should be warmed up entirely before the 5 mile mark.

bearvp · August 2006

Isn't it a tad unfair to be comparing a TL and an IS350 since the 350 ends up being close to $10k more once you have normal options installed? I mean yeah the 350 is more refined, but for $10k more?...that takes it out of the entry-level luxury class in my book.

berlina · August 2006

I completely agree. They say it starts at 36,000...I would like to look into this more. I know Lexus has had some funky ways to wording Base Pricing without options in the past.

I must have been kind of confusing. People say the TL is competition with the IS350. It is in the fact that it is a V6 Sedan, but beyond that, I do not believe it is.

Check out the Lexus website, and build one. There may be a "BASE" price, and then the first package is selected (and not able to be deselected)...the price may not really be 36,000 base.

*update*
I just looked, and base pricing theoretically starts at 37,030 ish.

bearvp · August 2006

I just built one with upgraded audio system, lowest premium package, and Navigation and the price was over $40k. If I had chosen the higher premium package it would have been more like $42k. $5000-$7000 more for similar attributes puts the cars too far apart to be compared.

louiswei · August 2006

That sounds about right and that's including the 18" wheel and some other accessaries I think. When I bought my IS you can get one without the "mandatory" package (Lexus calls it the preferred package) but now it comes standard. However I think it is still possible to get an IS250 without the 18" wheel though.

When I was doing car shopping I had 2 cars on my list: TL and IS350 (was considering the baby Bimmer but that quickly changed after saw the butt ugly interior). I do think that in some ways the TL is comparable to the IS. They are both in the entry-level luxury performance sedan segment, both have high performance V6s and they are in the same price range (generally speaking). However, TL is often being criticized for being a FWD car and should not belong to the performance sedan segment. I personally believed that TL is extremely capable and sporty as a FWD car but in order to be competitive it'll have to adapt Acura's SH-AWD. Even with its shortcomings I still think that TL will give you the best bang for the buck in this segment considering that the new 335i sedan is pushing $40k based.

Many people compare TL to the ES and on paper that seems to be the best comparison but that's where it ends...on paper. Yes, they both have around 250+ HP, both are FWD but one drives like a sports car and one's a cruiser. For me, I think the TL is getting the best of both segments: being the best value in the performance sedan territory and being sporty in the entry-luxury FWD segment and that's why it is the best selling entry-luxury car right now. However, when the next generation TL comes out with SH-AWD and 300+ HP, its place in the entry-luxury performance sedan segment will be more solidified

louiswei · August 2006

Or you can get one with just the basic package like I did. All I really want is that kick [non-permissible content removed] engine and 18" wheel, everything else is just toys.

Say the MSRP is $37k and you get about 1500 to 2000 dollars discount which means it comes down to a little over $35k. Not too shabby in my opinion.

bearvp · August 2006

I like my toys too much to just get the base model I guess. The TL has most of the toys built into the base model which saves alot of thinking about what to cut to bring down the cost of the IS350.

louiswei · August 2006

I understand how you feel because I went through that just couple months ago. At the end, RWD and 300+ HP are just too much to resist. For me, I know I would lost interest to mess with the gadgets but I would never get tired with that engine.

bearvp · August 2006

Good point...you impress people with the engine, not what kind of headlights you have or how many speakers are in your car. I don't think I need navigation since it costs nothing to get directions from Google maps.

My budget right now is around 30k for a car, but knowing myself I will spend more for the new toy. I think I have all but ruled out a G35 due to their plain interiors and seeing everyone and their mom driving one.

I gotta ask, on your base model IS350, how is the basic audio system? Also, is the leather good quality or do they use leatherette for the base model?

berlina · August 2006

If you want a Kick [non-permissible content removed] engine an 18" Wheels, why would you get a Luxury Car. You could have an 03-04 Cobra with 390 Hp for 33,000 brand new. Now talk about a low mileage Cobra....

If american cars are not your cup of tea...Maybe something european like an .:R32 or something of the sorts?

louiswei · August 2006

You guessed it right...American cars are not my cup of tea and I like the Luxury car's refined interior. Also, I don't like coupes. So putting my eqution together:

kick [non-permissible content removed] engine + Luxury interior + No American + No coupe + Below $40K = Entry Level Luxury Performace Sedan

louiswei · August 2006

I gotta ask, on your base model IS350, how is the basic audio system? Also, is the leather good quality or do they use leatherette for the base model?

The audio system is good enough for me. During the test drive I drove the IS350 with basic audio and IS250 with ML and I had to concentrate really hard in order to hear the difference (ML is more crispier in my opinion). But given that I am not really into audio system my opinion might differ than yours. My suggestion is go to the dealer and see it yourself.

I think Lexus has the best leather seats in this class of cars (that's from my personal experience and mag reviews). All Lexus cars come with real leather as standard feature so you don't need to pay extra to upgrade from leatherette to leather like BMW does.

bearvp, like I said, the only difference that separates the base model and the loaded one is the gadgets.

My budget right now is around 30k for a car, but knowing myself I will spend more for the new toy.

Actually I am a lot like you. When I first started looking for a new car I first considered the TSX. Then after I got my offer and knew that I could afford a more expensive one I quickly jumped to the TL (I am a die hard Acura fan, my first car was a 90' Acura Legend). But after I found out about the IS350 that was the point of no return for me. I think I ended up going 2K over my budget. :P

Keep us updated on your car shopping adventure...

cruznsd · August 2006

I can get a 06 TL with navi and all the bells and whistles for 31K including destination charge, IS350 will run you 44.5K. The 13.5K difference you will have 18" wheels a power telescoping steering wheel automatic headlights and a rear window sunscreen. This is an apples vs. oranges comparison

louiswei · August 2006

That's why there's a trade off...

1. If you want performance and RWD and don't care about all the "bells and whistles" you can get the IS350 for about $35K.

2. If toys are your cup of cake and you are pefectly fine with FWD then by all means the TL is the best option.

3. However, you can always get both if "budget" isn't in your dictionary.

I understand that it's kind of an apples vs. oranges comparison but as long as they belong in the same segment it's unevitable that they'll be compare to each other.

ggesq · August 2006

"1. If you want performance and RWD and don't care about all the "bells and whistles" you can get the IS350 for about $35K."

For raw power- I would agree with you e.g. driving in a straight line.
RWD is great but the IS' main issue IMO is the fact that (1) you can't get it matched w/ a manual tranny (IS 350) and (2) you can't disable the traction control - yet.
The VSC keeps fighting the driver for control over the car especially during slalom testing if your into that sort of driving of course.
For a FWD, the TL can achieve 0.91 on skidpad performance and 62.5 mph lane change speed.
IMHO these cars are similar in performance but differ in terms of raw horsepower.

louiswei · August 2006

(1) you can't get it matched w/ a manual tranny (IS 350) and (2) you can't disable the traction control - yet.

Issue number 1 is fine with me since I don't want to shift it myself anyway. Just want an automatic with some giddyup which the IS350 is perfect for me.

As for the VDIM, yes you CAN disable it and yes you can do that on the 06' MY car. I do that all the time. The process might be more complicated than simplely push a botton but the bottom line is that you CAN disable the VDIM.

I agreed with you that TL is a very sporty car. However, call me old school or ignorant, a FWD performance sedan just doesn't sound that sexy to me comparing to RWD or AWD. Hopefully the next generation TL will come with the SH-AWD and 300+ HP so I can come back to Acura again.

ggesq · August 2006

I wouldn't call you old school or ignorant and your point in comparing a FWD to a RWD/AWD is well taken. However, my point is that even though the TL is FWD the RWD IS is really not impressive in terms of performance when comparing the two (other than 0-60 times).

Thanks for clarifying re: the traction control. I intended on clearing that up but was too lazy

Acura TL vs Lexus IS 350

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