Maybe an American Institution can help poor Toyota with their terrible quality issues! But if their idiotic customers who apparently can't tell up from down keep buying these pieces of junk, they might be wasting their money!
Of course not, but then again, you don't see all smokers suddenly dropping dead because they get cancer / stroke etc...Some people DO smoke and live to a long long life, but do you want to count on it ? Because remember, these things happen at DIFFERENT times to different people.
Same with toyotas. Berserk toyotas don't all happen at the same time. And yeah, sure, not all toyotas will get the SUA virus and other insidious problems.
But considering all the crazy things that toyota as a corporation does, and the crazy things happening to their cars, still using a toyota is like smoking a few packs of cigarettes a day. Sure, you won't suddenly drop dead, you may even still live to 90. BUT do you REALLY want to take the chance ?
Better quit smoking, and quit toyota too ! Oh well, there is no such thing as a healthy cigarette, but there are many other car makers whose product quality is WAY much better than toyota today !
But considering all the crazy things that toyota as a corporation does, and the crazy things happening to their cars, still using a toyota is like smoking a few packs of cigarettes a day. Sure, you won't suddenly drop dead, you may even still live to 90. BUT do you REALLY want to take the chance ?
Easy, sport. You've posted so many vitriolic ant-Toyota messages that you're beginning to satirize yourself. I respectfully suggest that your efforts would be more effective if your posts (1) were fewer - a lot fewer - in number & (2) were more carefully worded. I have no great love for Toyota, but when you compare driving Toyota cars to smoking cigarettes, you're making it hard for others to take you seriously. I can say this because (a) I am an ex-smoker & (b) I have driven Toyotas. So I can safely say that this comparison doesn't work.
Believe me - I make this suggestion because I want to help you be a more effective poster & I would hate for others to view you as a clown. I've been a member here for more than 12 years - since the fall of '98 - & I've seen others cross that line. I'm sure that you don't want to do that.
Maybe an American Institution can help poor Toyota with their terrible quality issues! But if their idiotic customers who apparently can't tell up from down keep buying these pieces of junk, they might be wasting their money!
You call Toyotas junk, I wonder what you bought for the past 10-20 years. GM?! Now that would be funny.
With other excellent car makers around for you to choose from like Ford, Honda, Hyundai, Nissan, and they don't have toyotas massive problems
They don't?
Really?
Never heard of the Explorer/Firestone fiasco? It was much bigger. So were GM's side saddle gas tanks. So was the Mitsubishi hidden recall scandal (Toyota merely stalled).
No car is perfect, and every brand has had their share of problems.
Wow, a car purchased 13 years ago had a problem. That's news?
I wonder if the owner changed the oil at least twice a year like they were supposed to, especially given the unusually low miles/year. *If* they followed the usual 3k mile interval that means the oil change intervals were one full year - too infrequent.
>a car purchased 13 years ago had a problem. That's news? :lemon:
Yup. It's just a minor problem: engine blowing up as some others had done. toyota eventually decided they had to own up to the problem, after telling customers it was the customer's fault for years. I believe all that was needed for settlement was that oil had been changed _once a year_. Isn't that correct?
Are you saying toyotas aren't going to last. I thought they were good for 300,000 mi, at least.
I never cease to be amazed at the excuses that pop out when it's a favored car.
This is an extreme case. 3000 miles a year? How long did that oil sit? How often was it changed?
I bought an 8 year old Miata with 26k miles, she even gave me the receipt for the 30k service (done early). I changed all the fluids anyway, to establish a baseline. Guess what?
The rear differential oil looked like melted chocolate. The low miles did not matter. Fortunately I caught it.
The gear oil failed completely even with 10%+ fewer miles than even the severe maintenance schedule, which calls for a fluid change at 30,000 miles.
Toyota relaxed the requirement to one oil change per year (see they're not so bad after all, LOL), but the interval in their manual was more frequent than that.
Are you saying toyotas aren't going to last
Beyond a certain age the most important factor is care and maintenance, as I'm sure you'll agree.
Without knowing the maintenance history of this oddball, it's foolish to jump to any conclusions at all.
I'm surprised it's not bigger, more differentiated from the regular Prius. Looks like a Grand Prius.
Still, with 1 million Prius owners on the road, and what, about 60% owner loyalty? They only need to capture a small fraction of those trade-ins for this to be a huge hit.
I don't even like it that much (shoulda been bigger), yet I would not bet against it.
Juice, I must say that the Prius V for me was a major disappointment. I was expecting it more to be a minivan - probably sliding doors. Or atleast a 7 seater like Kia Rondo. If it had sliding doors or 7 seats- I would have been very interested in it in 2 or 3 yrs time. Also its EPA rating is not that great - 42city/38 hway compared to the regular Prius 50/48 I believe. Not great compared to Prius , but probably better than any CUV's or wagons out there. I dont think any CUV touches 30mpg+ in the city unless it's a hybrid. Not sure though. The only change looks to be increased cargo space. :surprise:
Dont know if it'll be a success but I think it may eat into regular Prius' sales. LOL !! How times have changed. Now the Prius is a "regular ' Prius as supposed to some geeky tech car. For me personally it doesnt interest me tremendously - might as well buy a regular Prius. Boy -50mpg - cant beat that!! But dont know 42mpg for a wagon/CUV is pretty good and certainly can change my thinking in a couple of years.Maybe, I was expecting too much though from the MPV . The new one is named Prius V- V for versatility. I would imagine it's tough to get 50mpg in a wagon like shape though . C concept looks interesting with even higher mpg rating. :P
What I want to see is Toyota's 50 mpg powertrain from the Prius in Honda's CRZ body with Honda's 6-speed manual trans (and maybe a shortened nose). For THAT I would pay GTI money, provided it had a factory moonroof.
Never going to happen. What will happen is Toyota will keep birthing new isolation-pods in various sizes and (weird) shapes and calling them Prius-xx. When will the FT86 be out - this year? It is the only thing even remotely interesting happening at Toyota. :-(
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Thanks for that link . Eating lunch,I watched the live show on Toyota's website. And the pictures are much better now. I just researched mpg's for suv/cuv 's and barely any touch even 25mpg. So 42mpg seems really good for this cuv/wagon. The thing I dont like - is that center dash. I hate it in my 04 Nissan Quest [junk - but got it for a great bargain used and use it on the weekends as a 3rd vehicle - other 2 being Lexus GX and 08 Camry!! :P ] , hated it in a Yaris rental and just dont like it. Dont know why Toyota persists with it.
But this Prius V sounds pretty good to me .2 or 3 years down the line - I am interested in it certainly. 2 or 3 yr old Prius V with 42/38 mpg and proven Toyota hybrid tech after the depreciation taken by the 1st owner - well, sounds like a real winner to me. :shades:
is supposed to be out in late 2011. We'll see, I somehow don't have a lot of confidence in Toyota/Subaru making the release that soon. Then again, the car was done over a year ago for design and they're just tweaking things now for perfection, so who knows.
Same here - gimme a Mazda5 without the ugly grin. Then again the Ford C-Max may fit the bill if we downsize next time around from a minivan.
it may eat into regular Prius' sales
Interesting point - it should create incremental sales. We should look at combined Prius + Prius V sales next year and consider the net increase. For sure it will cannibalize its little brother a bit.
They still appeal to geeks - note the EnTune, HD radio, and iPod integration (sans pesky proprietary adaptor cables).
I would imagine it's tough to get 50mpg in a wagon like shape though
The older VW Jetta TDI wagons were rated 50 MPG highway and the Sedan 49 MPG. They would easily top the EPA ratings. About the only vehicles on the road that compete with the Prius.
The Prius C, or whatever they call it, could be the pin in the Insight's coffin.
Remember, to these buyers, that magical MPG number means everything. The same Prius powertrain in a lighter/smaller package should make the MPG numbers go up.
For sure it'll sell, but again, the question is will it cannibalize its big brother, the original Prius?
I bet it's not significantly cheaper than the Prius. They will price it very, very carefully.
Toyota will keep birthing new isolation-pods in various sizes and (weird) shapes and calling them Prius-xx.
Remember - Prius succeeded while all the normal-looking hybrids failed.
50 hway. How about city ?? City rating is much more important. And how can u compare an older car to a newer one like Prius or for that matter any other new car-- much much more safety equipment like ABS,ESC , multiple airbags , power windows ,seats,keyless entry,push buttons-- and so much other tech. Also EPA crash results are tougher now. Without all those features , I can bet Prius can get maybe close to even 65 mpg or above in the city.. All those things add weight and reduce mpg. :shades:
VW is always ahead of Toyota on safety. The 2003 VW Jetta Wagon was 5 star safety rated. For me highway mileage is much more important than city. Different strokes. How much have you ridden in a Prius. I have and it is a noisy little beggar on our rough streets in San Diego. Transfers road noise pretty bad. No worse than the 2010 Honda Accord I rented for two weeks last year.
I would also like a high mileage SUV or maybe a CUV. I don't like being down flat on the ground in a Sedan. The Ford Escape hybrid is rated 34 MPG city 31 MPG highway. Nothing else close.
Keep in mind the EPA measures have been revised (downward) over the years.
The new TDI wagon is out - the auto is rated 30/42, 34 mpg combined.
At 42/38 the Prius V wins easily. I'm guessing that will mean 39 or 40 mpg combined.
That's even before you factor the higher price of diesel fuel.
I don't think I'd pick either of these, though. TrueDelta is still showing enough concerns with TDI reliability that I would shy away, and the Prius V is small and has the weird center-mounted gauges.
The Ford Escape hybrid is rated 34 MPG city 31 MPG highway. Nothing else close.
Yeah but that's in a lab. CR got 26mpg on the road. The Subaru Forester with a manual transmission managed 24mpg and cost them $10 grand less, plus it was quicker.
If you want to save money and fuel, learn to drive stick.
Not great compared to Prius , but probably better than any CUV's or wagons out there.
That's why my wife was reminding me a little while ago. The all time best our minivan ever got was 29ish, and usually the highway mpg was 25 or so, around 19 or worse in town. She'd be fine with the 42/38.
I could get used to center gauges ok I think, but I'd miss the sliders.
She's interested in the C-Max but didn't like the reports that said the seats aren't kitchen chair-like. She likes the minivan upright seating position. She liked the fit in a Prius II though.
VW ahead on safety ?? How ? Where?? Every automaker nowadays is pretty much good on safety including Chrysler. Different strokes - yes. But I am sure for a majority though city mileage is more important than highway. Otherwise we would not have seen the mad rush for fuel efficient cars both new and used when gas was $4+. I have driven a Prius and it is pretty good. Obviously ,not a highway luxo quiet cruiser like Camry or Avalon .. It is a fuel champion and that is what it is . And I think San Diego is one of the largest markets for a Prius along with NY. Road noise is good for its class. Hondas in general are noisier but are more driver oriented.:shades:
And from what I found mpg for Escape hybrid is : EPA Fuel Economy:City: 30 – 34 Highway: 27 – 31 . Not an absolute 34/31.. But real world numbers are quite less .Plus the Ford Escape hybrid is so noisy on the highways. And the Escape hybrid is mostly sold to rentals and fleets and its platform is an outdated 10 yr old one. Fusion hybrid is more recent and newer and much better. :P
Isn't that Warren Buffett's car company, BYD? I thought all cute utes looked like that. They all look alike to me. I wonder how far it will go on electric only?
And the Escape hybrid is mostly sold to rentals and fleets
Oh no, absolutely not - most of the privately owned Escapes in my area are the trendy hybrid model. If Toyota had pulled its thumb out about 8 years ago when they floated their (failed) promise of a gazillion hybrid models in 5 years, they could have produced a hybrid RAV4 to give Ford a run for its money (considering the Ford uses Toyota's HSD, tweaked for the Escape). Instead, Ford wins the green prize in the small crossover class.
Edit: well, unless you want to count the Jetta TDI wagon (throwing a bone to gagrice here! ;-)). And if VW would produce its small crossover (what's that thing's ridiculous name again?) with a fuel-efficient diesel, rather than the monster diesel in the Touareg, they could steal some sales from Ford there I'm sure....
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
VW Tiguan TDI is doing well in the EU. It is rated at 58.9 MPG IMP highway, which is 49 MPG US. Not bad for a CUV slightly bigger than the RAV4. Which by the way is also available with a diesel in the EU. It only gets 38 MPG US on the highway. So Toyota has some work to get their diesels both more efficient and clean enough for US soil. The Tiguan uses the same engine as the Jetta. The dealer says they are coming to America. All I can find says they are not. If I sell my Sequoia I may get the Touareg with V6 diesel. Very tough vehicle. Currently holding down the first 3 places overall in the Dakar race. I can't tell if any Toyota HiLux are still in it. So many have scratched. Just can't take the abuse of a tough race. :shades:
It looks like Toyota did start out with the most vehicles entered in the Dakar with 32. At least 13 have scratched half way through the race. No reports of SUA. :lemon:
I am talking about TODAY. What has happened decades ago does not interest me. Its like saying we should not buy Japanese cars because they used to bomb Pearl. Of course thats ridiculous.
TODAY, no other car maker have so much problems, big disturbing issues as toyota.
Easy ? There is no way I can go easy on toyota when their misdeeds are resulting in Americans dying in a ghastly way, and die worthless deaths because they send their hard earned paycheck to toyota.
Going easy on toyota is like, lets say, in 1941, after Pearl, President FDR instead of making his famous speech, he lifted the oil embargo on Japan, and sell the Japanese Iowa Class Battleships, Gato Class subs, and Enterprise class carriers.
What toyota had done is to me doing a pearl harbour raid on ALL car consumers here in the US and the world. For those with short memories, pls study these websites :
Benny boy - you are so outrageous that you end up being funny. Rational arguments and fact based opinions are fine. But just shooting in the dark - well you can say astalavista baby !!! :P
Easy ? There is no way I can go easy on toyota when their misdeeds are resulting in Americans dying in a ghastly way, and die worthless deaths because they send their hard earned paycheck to toyota.
Go back & reread my post. I didn't ask you to change your views about Toyota. I did point out that your frequent, over-the-top & breathlessly written posts aren't having the desired effect. IOW, I wasn't criticizing your views - I was critiquing your style, which is somewhere between cartoonish & hysterical.
You're beginning to sound like a 9-year-old who's using Daddy's computer without his permission. I'm saying this not to offend you but to help you. You're not changing any minds & you wouldn't if you wrote another 1,000 posts. The people who agree with you shared your views before they read your 1st post. Do you want to influence people's thinking or do you just want to vent?
I've noticed that this is apparently the only Edmunds discussion in which you participate. Spend some time in other discussions that have nothing to do with Toyota. Pay attention to how the oldtimers express their views.
Again, I'm not asking you to change your opinion of Toyota. I'm only pointing out the obvious: your style is hurting you. It's getting in your way. You would get more done with fewer but more polished posts that sounded as if a grown-up wrote them.
DETROIT (AP) -- It would be easy to think Toyota's biggest problem is its damaged reputation caused by sudden acceleration recalls, millions in government fines and massive lawsuits and settlements. But what's hurting the company most is an aging lineup of boring cars.
Over the past decade, Toyota and its U.S. dealers had it easy. Cutting edge design wasn't required because the cars sold themselves on reputation. Everyone knew Toyotas held their value, were safe and got drivers from point A to point B with little drama. Then came the recalls, which called all of that into question.
Ending the year on a low note, Camry sales fell 10 percent in December from a year earlier. Corolla sales plunged 35 percent. Unless things turn around quickly, Camry is in danger of losing its 10-year crown as the nation's top-selling car this year to the Honda Accord.
Ho hum cars are "probably the worst problem for them," says Jessica Caldwell, director of pricing and industry analysis for Edmunds.com. "They always had their (safety) reputation to fall back on, but now that's not the case."
They had their safety, reliability, and resale reputation on which to capitalize. Toyota hasn't had a truly exciting car since the Supra, so performance isn't an attribute. Lexus seems to play second fiddle to Mercedes and BMW, so luxury isn't an attribute. Toyota's being undersold by everybody, especially Hyundai, so price isn't an attribute.
I don't know - new Prius MPV, new Sienna, new Avalon sheet metal, face-lift on the Highlander, expanded RAV4, some truck tweaks, new Yaris models. Doesn't sound like a company on the ropes living off old product.
So Ben, please tell us what superior vehicles you own right now.
Notice the people bashing Toyota rarely do reveal what they drive - they don't want us to have a point of reference. No company is perfect, yet that's the standard they seem to hold for Toyota.
FINALLY an accurate criticism - it is indeed an aging product lineup that is their main problem. Compare Camry/Corolla to Sonata/Elantra and they've been leap-frogged.
Steve: you're right, but note that all the new products you listed that are out are selling very well (Sienna, 4Runner, updated RAV4, etc). It's just that the volume models are the old ones.
Car Talk is a radio show, correct? That means they never even saw that Toyota in person. To their credit they were smart enough to say it "can lead... " rather than "did lead".
Owner said the car was "maintained on a regular basis", but 3000 miles per year is highly irregular.
3rd, allow me to correct myself, the regular oil change interval for that car is 7500 miles, which could take two and a half years at her pace. Even the extreme interval was 5000 miles, so that's a year and 8 months. So it depends on the time between intervals, not the mileage, so a very irregular oil interval was called for.
Comments
Same with toyotas. Berserk toyotas don't all happen at the same time. And yeah, sure, not all toyotas will get the SUA virus and other insidious problems.
But considering all the crazy things that toyota as a corporation does, and the crazy things happening to their cars, still using a toyota is like smoking a few packs of cigarettes a day. Sure, you won't suddenly drop dead, you may even still live to 90. BUT do you REALLY want to take the chance ?
Better quit smoking, and quit toyota too ! Oh well, there is no such thing as a healthy cigarette, but there are many other car makers whose product quality is WAY much better than toyota today !
Easy, sport. You've posted so many vitriolic ant-Toyota messages that you're beginning to satirize yourself. I respectfully suggest that your efforts would be more effective if your posts (1) were fewer - a lot fewer - in number & (2) were more carefully worded. I have no great love for Toyota, but when you compare driving Toyota cars to smoking cigarettes, you're making it hard for others to take you seriously. I can say this because (a) I am an ex-smoker & (b) I have driven Toyotas. So I can safely say that this comparison doesn't work.
Believe me - I make this suggestion because I want to help you be a more effective poster & I would hate for others to view you as a clown. I've been a member here for more than 12 years - since the fall of '98 - & I've seen others cross that line. I'm sure that you don't want to do that.
Just some friendly advice.
You call Toyotas junk, I wonder what you bought for the past 10-20 years. GM?! Now that would be funny.
And I'm saying this as NOT a Toyota fan.
And very good advice it is.
They don't?
Really?
Never heard of the Explorer/Firestone fiasco? It was much bigger. So were GM's side saddle gas tanks. So was the Mitsubishi hidden recall scandal (Toyota merely stalled).
No car is perfect, and every brand has had their share of problems.
I wonder if the owner changed the oil at least twice a year like they were supposed to, especially given the unusually low miles/year. *If* they followed the usual 3k mile interval that means the oil change intervals were one full year - too infrequent.
Yup. It's just a minor problem: engine blowing up as some others had done. toyota eventually decided they had to own up to the problem, after telling customers it was the customer's fault for years. I believe all that was needed for settlement was that oil had been changed _once a year_. Isn't that correct?
Are you saying toyotas aren't going to last. I thought they were good for 300,000 mi, at least.
I never cease to be amazed at the excuses that pop out when it's a favored car.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I bought an 8 year old Miata with 26k miles, she even gave me the receipt for the 30k service (done early). I changed all the fluids anyway, to establish a baseline. Guess what?
The rear differential oil looked like melted chocolate. The low miles did not matter. Fortunately I caught it.
The gear oil failed completely even with 10%+ fewer miles than even the severe maintenance schedule, which calls for a fluid change at 30,000 miles.
Toyota relaxed the requirement to one oil change per year (see they're not so bad after all, LOL), but the interval in their manual was more frequent than that.
Are you saying toyotas aren't going to last
Beyond a certain age the most important factor is care and maintenance, as I'm sure you'll agree.
Without knowing the maintenance history of this oddball, it's foolish to jump to any conclusions at all.
http://www.autoblog.com/2011/01/10/toyota-prius-c-concept-detroit-2011/
Note the headlights at the base of the windshield. I don't think that's a first, to be honest.
Any how, it's a concept, so the design will be toned down. It will be a value-priced Prius, though, meant to compete with the Honda Insight.
I'm surprised it's not bigger, more differentiated from the regular Prius. Looks like a Grand Prius.
Still, with 1 million Prius owners on the road, and what, about 60% owner loyalty? They only need to capture a small fraction of those trade-ins for this to be a huge hit.
I don't even like it that much (shoulda been bigger), yet I would not bet against it.
Dont know if it'll be a success but I think it may eat into regular Prius' sales. LOL !! How times have changed. Now the Prius is a "regular ' Prius as supposed to some geeky tech car. For me personally it doesnt interest me tremendously - might as well buy a regular Prius. Boy -50mpg - cant beat that!! But dont know 42mpg for a wagon/CUV is pretty good and certainly can change my thinking in a couple of years.Maybe, I was expecting too much though from the MPV . The new one is named Prius V- V for versatility. I would imagine it's tough to get 50mpg in a wagon like shape though . C concept looks interesting with even higher mpg rating. :P
Never going to happen. What will happen is Toyota will keep birthing new isolation-pods in various sizes and (weird) shapes and calling them Prius-xx. When will the FT86 be out - this year? It is the only thing even remotely interesting happening at Toyota. :-(
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
But this Prius V sounds pretty good to me .2 or 3 years down the line - I am interested in it certainly. 2 or 3 yr old Prius V with 42/38 mpg and proven Toyota hybrid tech after the depreciation taken by the 1st owner - well, sounds like a real winner to me. :shades:
2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick
it may eat into regular Prius' sales
Interesting point - it should create incremental sales. We should look at combined Prius + Prius V sales next year and consider the net increase. For sure it will cannibalize its little brother a bit.
They still appeal to geeks - note the EnTune, HD radio, and iPod integration (sans pesky proprietary adaptor cables).
The older VW Jetta TDI wagons were rated 50 MPG highway and the Sedan 49 MPG. They would easily top the EPA ratings. About the only vehicles on the road that compete with the Prius.
Remember, to these buyers, that magical MPG number means everything. The same Prius powertrain in a lighter/smaller package should make the MPG numbers go up.
For sure it'll sell, but again, the question is will it cannibalize its big brother, the original Prius?
I bet it's not significantly cheaper than the Prius. They will price it very, very carefully.
Toyota will keep birthing new isolation-pods in various sizes and (weird) shapes and calling them Prius-xx.
Remember - Prius succeeded while all the normal-looking hybrids failed.
Same here. HATE those.
Deal killer for me, to be honest. But it was too small anyway.
I would also like a high mileage SUV or maybe a CUV. I don't like being down flat on the ground in a Sedan. The Ford Escape hybrid is rated 34 MPG city 31 MPG highway. Nothing else close.
The new TDI wagon is out - the auto is rated 30/42, 34 mpg combined.
At 42/38 the Prius V wins easily. I'm guessing that will mean 39 or 40 mpg combined.
That's even before you factor the higher price of diesel fuel.
I don't think I'd pick either of these, though. TrueDelta is still showing enough concerns with TDI reliability that I would shy away, and the Prius V is small and has the weird center-mounted gauges.
We need more options. :sick:
Yeah but that's in a lab. CR got 26mpg on the road. The Subaru Forester with a manual transmission managed 24mpg and cost them $10 grand less, plus it was quicker.
If you want to save money and fuel, learn to drive stick.
That's why my wife was reminding me a little while ago. The all time best our minivan ever got was 29ish, and usually the highway mpg was 25 or so, around 19 or worse in town. She'd be fine with the 42/38.
I could get used to center gauges ok I think, but I'd miss the sliders.
She's interested in the C-Max but didn't like the reports that said the seats aren't kitchen chair-like. She likes the minivan upright seating position. She liked the fit in a Prius II though.
And from what I found mpg for Escape hybrid is : EPA Fuel Economy:City: 30 – 34 Highway: 27 – 31 . Not an absolute 34/31.. But real world numbers are quite less .Plus the Ford Escape hybrid is so noisy on the highways. And the Escape hybrid is mostly sold to rentals and fleets and its platform is an outdated 10 yr old one. Fusion hybrid is more recent and newer and much better. :P
It is not a knock off - it is heavily "inspired " by RX - that's it. Not a copy !! :shades:
Oh no, absolutely not - most of the privately owned Escapes in my area are the trendy hybrid model. If Toyota had pulled its thumb out about 8 years ago when they floated their (failed) promise of a gazillion hybrid models in 5 years, they could have produced a hybrid RAV4 to give Ford a run for its money (considering the Ford uses Toyota's HSD, tweaked for the Escape). Instead, Ford wins the green prize in the small crossover class.
Edit: well, unless you want to count the Jetta TDI wagon (throwing a bone to gagrice here! ;-)). And if VW would produce its small crossover (what's that thing's ridiculous name again?) with a fuel-efficient diesel, rather than the monster diesel in the Touareg, they could steal some sales from Ford there I'm sure....
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
It looks like Toyota did start out with the most vehicles entered in the Dakar with 32. At least 13 have scratched half way through the race. No reports of SUA. :lemon:
http://www.dakar.com/dakar/2011/us/withdrawals/cars-page-1.html#ancre
TODAY, no other car maker have so much problems, big disturbing issues as toyota.
Going easy on toyota is like, lets say, in 1941, after Pearl, President FDR instead of making his famous speech, he lifted the oil embargo on Japan, and sell the Japanese Iowa Class Battleships, Gato Class subs, and Enterprise class carriers.
What toyota had done is to me doing a pearl harbour raid on ALL car consumers here in the US and the world. For those with short memories, pls study these websites :
http://www.uc2.blogspot.com/
http://www.mylexusisdefective.com/
I've seen at least one poster in these forums who has said exactly that. :surprise:
Go back & reread my post. I didn't ask you to change your views about Toyota. I did point out that your frequent, over-the-top & breathlessly written posts aren't having the desired effect. IOW, I wasn't criticizing your views - I was critiquing your style, which is somewhere between cartoonish & hysterical.
You're beginning to sound like a 9-year-old who's using Daddy's computer without his permission. I'm saying this not to offend you but to help you. You're not changing any minds & you wouldn't if you wrote another 1,000 posts. The people who agree with you shared your views before they read your 1st post. Do you want to influence people's thinking or do you just want to vent?
I've noticed that this is apparently the only Edmunds discussion in which you participate. Spend some time in other discussions that have nothing to do with Toyota. Pay attention to how the oldtimers express their views.
Again, I'm not asking you to change your opinion of Toyota. I'm only pointing out the obvious: your style is hurting you. It's getting in your way. You would get more done with fewer but more polished posts that sounded as if a grown-up wrote them.
Just a friendly suggestion.
Over the past decade, Toyota and its U.S. dealers had it easy. Cutting edge design wasn't required because the cars sold themselves on reputation. Everyone knew Toyotas held their value, were safe and got drivers from point A to point B with little drama. Then came the recalls, which called all of that into question.
Ending the year on a low note, Camry sales fell 10 percent in December from a year earlier. Corolla sales plunged 35 percent. Unless things turn around quickly, Camry is in danger of losing its 10-year crown as the nation's top-selling car this year to the Honda Accord.
Ho hum cars are "probably the worst problem for them," says Jessica Caldwell, director of pricing and industry analysis for Edmunds.com. "They always had their (safety) reputation to fall back on, but now that's not the case."
AP
Look at the profile - they must have made the mold from an RX's sheetmetal, literally. It's identical.
Probably about 90% of it is media hype and hysteria.
Notice the people bashing Toyota rarely do reveal what they drive - they don't want us to have a point of reference. No company is perfect, yet that's the standard they seem to hold for Toyota.
Let him - it's fun (and easy) to shoot him down.
Steve: you're right, but note that all the new products you listed that are out are selling very well (Sienna, 4Runner, updated RAV4, etc). It's just that the volume models are the old ones.
Car Talk is a radio show, correct? That means they never even saw that Toyota in person. To their credit they were smart enough to say it "can lead... " rather than "did lead".
Owner said the car was "maintained on a regular basis", but 3000 miles per year is highly irregular.
3rd, allow me to correct myself, the regular oil change interval for that car is 7500 miles, which could take two and a half years at her pace. Even the extreme interval was 5000 miles, so that's a year and 8 months. So it depends on the time between intervals, not the mileage, so a very irregular oil interval was called for.