By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our
Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our
Visitor Agreement.
Comments
I was just about to send you a message and let you know I was very pleased to see you and your Lab wearing seat belts this morning. My operatives reported in just a few minutes ago and I just got thru reviewing their tape. Keep up the good work and I can call them off soon !!
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
ODE TO THE USED CAR SALESPERSON
Gold Rings, Striped Tie and a Sharkskin Jacket,
The Uniform of choice in the car sales racket.
Ready to swindle & Negotiate,
Come to my store & tempt your fate.
Some guy pulls up, this should be fun,
His car is so old, I'll get this one done.
Put out my cigarette & shake his hand,
"Welcome to Used Car Auto Land!"
What's that you say?, you want to look for a car?
We have every model from near to far
We can take it for a spin, make sure it fits just right.
Just don't take too long, I haven't got all night.
Follow me back to my desk & we'll talk,
When I tell you the price, you'd better not balk.
We're asking twenty thousand, this price is a steal,
You'd better act now, you won't get a better deal.
You're not sure, You don't know, you want to check out the net-
Well friend let me tell you this car's your best bet.
What's that you say, you want to talk to your wife?
Why would you do that, who wears the pants in your life?
Now let's get down to the real nitty gritty,
My gout is flared up & I'm feeling [non-permissible content removed].
I'l offer it now for just nineteen two -
Still too high?! What are you trying to do?
I'll let him sweat for a minute or few,
I've seen this guys credit, he can afford two.
"Alright, I'm back - Now let's make a deal!
Eighteen Nine, now how does that feel?"
We have us a deal!, I'll get the paperwork,
Just don't get me wrong- I still think you're a jerk.
While you wait, would you like coffee or tea?
You'd better take advantage it's the only thing that's free.
Ok - Here are the papers, come on & just sign.
We'll fill out later what goes on that blank line.
What's that you say - you don't like that thought?
It's a good thing you paid extra for the rustproofing you bought.
There's nothing in life like that new car smell -
But you're buying used so you can just go to hell.
That's enough of this crap, on your way you go,
Just be sure to tell your friends about me though.
What you don't know is that I made a nice killing,
5 thousand on the front end, even more in the billing.
The doc fee, the taxes, the finance rate and more,
I screwed you more times than the local whore.
I couldn't care less if your car after leaving our lot,
After all it was held together with glue, gum and snot.
I wave you good-bye, thank god that you're gone.
Light another cigarette & the day carries on.
We took our little one shopping, but he was exceptionally quiet and easily occupied.
Recently helped friends who were shopping with a 5 and 2 year old. I would check on CarFax info and the reference book values while they were shopping (via cellphone).
They were going to buy a popular US brand product used which got good gas mileage as a small SUV. Four seats, some extra room. They drove it (used) and noticed their 2 year old could kick the seat in front of him. Very irritating on long drives (and short ones). The salesman had them drive another used US brand but slightly larger used SUV. The little bit of extra room to keep the munchkins away from kicking the front seats made all the difference. Good that they took them with them.
But the little guys got tired on the days when the parents were shopping. I'd suggest browing alone and serious decision-making trips take the kid(s). Maybe have a third person come pick them up and take them away while parents finish negotiating.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I assume that things like consumer rebates and 0% financing are paid for by the manufacturer but employee pricing must cut into the dealer's bottom line (and ultimately salesperson's). Now that I think about it there can't be any back-end money for 0% financing either.
Do the car makers offer any additional dealer cash to make up for this?
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
I remember during my Honda days, sometimes Honda would run a free gas/accessories/or $2500 discount on Accords lets say, but half of that $2500 would be manufacturer contribution, and the other half would be dealer's contribution, meaning $1250 out of the gross, meaning about $300 out my pocket on a full pop deal. I hated it because although it might have drven traffic up, people were still wanting to negotate on non existing gross.
I'd get smart alecs saying "Well Honda is giving me $2500 off, what are you prepared to give me?" :mad:
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
Amen
To be erected where he lies...
In fitting tribute to his wit...
A monument of solid s**t !
Pretty creative I have to say!
I would seriously argue that fact, alcohol was the straw that broke that camels back. The odds of the accident happening would have dropped dramatically if he was sober.
Unless it is done gently, it can redistribute the car's weight such that the rear end of the car no longer maintains traction, causing the car to enter an uncontrollable skid.
That normally happens when there is a fast decelleration that drops the front end and lifts weight off the back end. Normally that wont happen simply by taking your foot off the gas, braking needs to be involved.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Ha Ha It's never enough is it? BTW is Chrysler still doing employee pricing? I don't see it on Edmunds TMV.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
sitting in the passenger seat does remind me that the driver seat cushion is getting somewhat worn.
hearing that v8 start when warmed up still make my heart beat a bit faster.
still enjoy having it after 7 years.
would love to buy another one, but the next vehicle will be something less capable in many ways, except gas mileage. meanwhile, it's a keeper!
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
I wouldn't say there was anything "alec" about it. When it's advertised as a $2500 discount, how is the customer supposed to know that the dealer is contributing something in the deal? Why does it hurt for the customer to ask for more than what he see's being offered?
As good as the internet price was on the car I just bought, I asked for more. I didn't get it but I asked. Why wouldn't I? When I bought in 05' and 06' starting with an email quote both dealers did better when I asked.
I'd say that is just smart shopping by the customer. Aren't we supposed to find the floor at which you are willing to make the deal?
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
Agree, but it did happen, he was not sober, and seatbelts probably would have saved her life.
Normally that wont happen simply by taking your foot off the gas, braking needs to be involved.
You're right. Don't bother getting any safety equipment on your next car. Since you have superhuman skills and can avoid any accident situation you would be wasting your money on buying safety features. Buy a 1972 Pinto and save some cash.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Thats debatable. I have seen pictures of that accident and she very well have been killed with seatbelts.
Don't bother getting any safety equipment on your next car. Since you have superhuman skills
Do you actually read my posts or are you that dense in the head?
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Since I only live two miles from the airport, your operatives flew in from Kansas very quickly. Now I know why we call you Houdini.
Richard
Seatbelts probably would have saved her life.
The experts all agreed.
The rear passenger compartment was fully intact.
I've seen the pictures too.
Not sure how this can be debated.
1. An ode PRAISES a person, thing, or animal. You weren't exactly praising the typical car salesman.
2. An ode traditionally has no fixed rhyme schemes.
3. An ode usually consists of varying line lengths in order to bring about the expression of elevated thoughts.
4. The stanzas in an ode lend themselves to musical choral renditions, usually accompanied by a dance theme. A modern day example would be "Ode to Billy Joe".
Your poem WAS creative and I congratulate you. Keep up the good work, and join us here more often. As you may have noticed, many of our posters are very "poetic" at times.
Richard
Now as for you, I don't think that we have an ode OR a poem here. I think what we have is something that is funny as hell!
Richard
Richard
So, do I understand this correctly. The one person, arguably in the lease safest position in the vehicle, was wearing a seat belt and survived this
Two passengers in the rear seat, had no seat belt and did not survive.
Yet, you have theorized based on your skilled training and analysis of pictures that even with a seat belt she would have not survived?
Is that correct??
Actually I'm not so sure, if I remember correctly, she died of "I think" a ruptured aorta, which was caused by going full speed to the sudden stop. When that happens, regardless of wearing a seat belt, the internal organs are pushed against the skeleton with such force that there is rupturing inside the body, and if it's something critical like the aorta, then the person dies.
I know this happens because my wife was rear ended while sitting at a red light and had internal bruises on some of her organs as explained by the doctor and shown on x-rays. She ended up OK but had nasty pain for about a week.
This could be debated forever, but how can anyone argue that seat belts don't save lives?
I guess there are a few other people here who must be dense in the head too.
I haven't seen anyone agree with anything you said. You still didn't explain how you got into an accident and weren't able to avoid it.
Now you are an expert in accident reconstruction as well.
I read all your posts, I wouldn't miss them. Sometimes I wonder if you are serious or just putting us on !
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
1. The driver is the initial key component to safety. (Hush Snake. I know that was your original intent.)
2. The seat belt is an indispensable safety feature to insure the driver's safety. (Hush Driver. I know that was your original intent.)
3. An intoxicated driver impedes the goals of #s 1 and 2 above.
Now will you two agree to the above proposal? If so, both of you are correct and the debate is finished. PLEASEEEEEEEE!!! :P
Richard
i have a junior in hight school, so i am going to need something to haul their stuff to school and back for the next 5 years, not to mention vacations.
when they get to grad school, i am done. they can figure out how to get their stuff where they need to go. after all, they will have an 'official' college education by then.
Richard
No that is wrong. Reread what I said.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Yeah but the way some people were asking, the tone of it was, is like I owed them a discount.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
He went so far as to get rims at a junk yard to match the originals on his Altima and mounted his old tires so he didn't have to use his daily rubber. I'm going with him and I'll let you know how he liked it. Right now it is poring down pretty good but I don't think they'll call it off. Do you really think I'll be reporting any negatives about his first run?
How did it go? I find my students often learn more in the rain.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
I think he is or either doesn't read my posts simply because he attributes to me things I have never said nor implied.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
It did rhyme anyway....
The TBN was under 2.0, which means that the additive pack is almost depleted.
Does the car have sensors to take into account mileage, driver habits, dust, dirt, humidity, temperature etc, or does the light come on based on miles and a little driver habits?
BMW's original Service Interval Indicator System(SIA) took several factors into account- cold starts, engine temperature, rpm, etc. However, the engineers discovered that fuel usage alone was equally accurate(increased fuel usage results from such factors as short trips, stop-and-go driving, and increased engine speeds. In 2001 BMW began phasing in their Condition Based Service system, and there is now a sensor in the oil pan which monitors the electrical resistance of the oil. More information can be found here. It must be fairly accurate; I spent 90 minutes on the track in an Alpina B7, and the CBS informed me that my play time had subtracted 800 miles from the life of the oil.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
But the time interval over which the deceleration occurs varies. That's the purpose of certain safety devices, to extend the time period. Making the same change in velocity over a longer period of time reduces the forces on the internal organs and decreases the probability of a severed aorta, e.g.
When the front of the car hit the concrete, that part of the car started slowing and then the slowing moved through the front parts to the passenger cage. As soon as the passenger cage started slowing the seat belt would have started pulling against the passenger body to start it slowing. As the cage slowed more, the seatbelt stretches and the passenger is slowed even more--but it's not instantaneous. The maximum g-forces likely stayed below the 15-20 g danger area.
Instead when the cage started slowing, her body continued forward at the initial velocity until it hit the roof or the front seat backs and she bounced forward hitting the dash, windshield, which had decelerated greatly while she continued to move forward at initial velocity. It's not the fall that kills, it's the sudden stop at the end of the fall; same thing applies to forces in a crash.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
When I was in college a couple of buddies and I were out joy riding with me riding shotgun. For some odd reason I had my lap belt on... and a beer in my right hand.
The driver started to make a hard left turn and as he did, he handed his beer to me which I took in my left hand. So I am sitting there with a beer in each hand while we are making a hard left and the car starts plowing through a hedge.
Well the hedge was hiding a huge stump. When we hit the stump it was like hitting a brick wall. The two beers I was holding took off like rocket ships and so did I until the lap belt stopped me. It was kinda loose but It sure saved my life that night and I escaped with only a couple of cracked ribs.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Richard
Yes, it did. It was clever, wasn't it?
Richard
But here comes a guy with a poem that hits all the same hot buttons and everyone is falling all over themselves to say how clever and funny it is. :P
I'm not certain what kind of psychological sleight-of-hand had occurred here, but it most definitely is very funny.
PS. Snake, give it up. You are fighting a losing battle and making yourself look bad in the process.
Mercedes has long provided ETDs (Emergency Tensioning Devices) and belt force limiters on seatbelts in all front and outboard rear positions.
In the event of a collision exceeding a preset threshold, the ETDs use a pyrotechnic charge to instantly remove slack from the seat belts. Belt force limiters then allow a slight amount of give in the seat belts. This helps to more evenly distribute the forces and reduce the peak seat-belt forces on the occupant, offering the best protection possible.
Hope this helps answer your question.
Jaybar
Yeah, but you spilled TWO beers! Oh the humanity!
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I see that only because people are misrepresenting what I am saying,
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
That's very possible, especially me, because some days I get so busy I have to skim the posts...although I read them all.
So, why don't you start at the beginning and state what you are saying. :confuse:
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
That is lol funny!
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
It was a miserable day. Cloudy, cold, windy, but it didn’t rain while he was on the track. A few sprinkles when he was in the classroom and it even started to hail a little bit while he was in class and they pulled the drivers off the course that were running at the time. OK, so that’s the weather report, Now the good stuff.
He liked it, a lot. He said he learned a lot and was surprised how mentally draining it was while on the course trying to think of where he should put the car at all times, especially going into each turn so he’d be lined up for the straight away coming out of it. He did 5 runs with class time before each run. His instructor told him he was going to recommend that he be moved up to Level 2 even though you usually have to finish at least 2 sessions before they do that. I don’t know how he was able to get his helmet off when he was told that. His instructor said the next level instructor would have to bless off on this after he went with him at least once the next time he goes there. He also said his Altima did pretty good but no match for the Porsches’, Vettes and BMW 5’s he was running with. So, of course he feels he has to get something that is on a level equal to his skills.
He tells his instructor that I just bought a Genesis and his instructor said he’s heard about how well those things hold the road and that I should bring it up next time and if I didn’t feel comfortable running the course, there are plenty of instructors there that would do it for me and give me a first hand report. Yeah, right. :surprise:
More to come I’m sure.
jmonroe
'15 Genesis V8 with Ultimate Package and '18 Legacy Limited 6 cyl
How silly of them to think you would turn your pretty new ride over to a stranger for abuse when you have all your Edmunds poster buddies who would be more than happy to help you out.
BTW, I'm available on Friday.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I agree, I agree. Whatever! But it is very nice of you Richard to try to end this - for lack of a better word - debate :sick:
Roadburner: In 2001 BMW began phasing in their Condition Based Service system, and there is now a sensor in the oil pan which monitors the electrical resistance of the oil.
I thank you for that excellent answer that explains how BMWs actually do monitor the oil. That is amazing engineering. The dealer won't change my oil until 15,000 miles, so I'll go by that. After 50,000 miles I would do it more frequently.
Imidoza: it's the sudden stop at the end of the fall; same thing applies to forces in a crash.
Thank you for that excellent trip through the physical forces that take place in an accident. I did hear that the injuries aren't from the initial impact - the injuries come from the secondary impact of what the body hits, and that is where seatbelts and airbags help out, cushioning the blow of the secondary impact.
You explained though in nice plain language that even I can understand.
Houdini1: The two beers I was holding took off like rocket ships and so did I until the lap belt stopped me.
A good practical example of how seatbelts save you from serious injury and maybe worse. You couldn't have known the accident would occur, so you were fortunately wearing seatbelts just in case....which is all we can do. Be prepared just in case!
Gregon: PS. Snake, give it up. You are fighting a losing battle and making yourself look bad in the process.
I am glad to see I am not the only one. It could very well be me, I might have missed something somewhere. This isn't a full time occupation for me, but clarification would be helpful. I am willing to change my mind if it can be proved that someone can avoid being in an accident, and safety features like seatbelts don't necessarily work that well.
If Snake is saying drivers ability is the #1 factor in avoiding an accident, that is probably true.
Jwilliams1: . Belt force limiters then allow a slight amount of give in the seat belts. This helps to more evenly distribute the forces and reduce the peak seat-belt forces on the occupant,
Great information. I didn't realize the process was that complex, but there is a lot of science behind those seatbelts it seems. Excellent explanation.
Snake: Just tell me what your point is without name calling or insults. I might have missed what you are trying to say......I am not perfect...... only my dog thinks I am.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
Those were indeed the good old days when it comes to law enforcement. The local cops showed up, chewed us out and told us to go home and stay out of trouble...a friend picked us up and that was the end of that.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
In my opinion yes. BUT the damage has a high probability of being survivable and a much lower probability of occuring if the correct seat belt position was being used at the time. The correct lap belt position ideally uses the pelvis to apply forces to the skeletal structure but if mispositioned applies force to the soft abdominal area.
Those injuries in a severe accident are still much better than the brutal G-force applied to a head or internal organs with a quick stop at the end of flying forward in a car that's already decelerated greatly below your current velocity.
It's all probabilities of certain uncommon things occuring.
In my youth I was driving to visit a girl I was interested in. The country road had an accident where an older heavy car had hit the concrete abutement of a country bridge. The body of the car had separated from the chassis. The one young man had been ejected from the car probably badly injured from the impact inside the car. But as the car body came down the open car door edge laid its weight onto him. Nuf said. It's all in the probability of unusual things happening.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,