Jeep Wrangler

g0ldeng0pher · May 2004

To all of you who offered advice so far, thank you. After heading out today and seeing topless Wranglers all over, it's just pushing me more in that direction. However, I'm lucky enough to live very close to downtown and just about anywhere else I need to go on a daily basis, and have friends and family who I can borrow wheels from as needed. SO my next question is: what's the best time of year to buy a Wrangler? Should I be going for an 04, or is there anything that's going to change a little on the 05?

99tj · May 2004

The guy that owned my TJ before me, put a sticker right on the paint. It send chills down my spine just typing this. Putting stickers on the paint is a HUGE pet peeve of mine.

Any advice on how to remove it? I've heard using a hair dryer might do the trick?

-Dan

stever · May 2004

There's some other ideas in the archives in Badge/emblem removal techniques.

Steve, Host

tsjay · May 2004

I have never known of a better time to buy a new Jeep (or just about any other vehicle) than now. There are rebates galore out there, and Jeeps have a $2000 rebate. They have also increased the warranty to 7 year/ 70,000 miles as of the last couple years, and I think that was done as an incentive to buyers.

Gopher it , Gopher!

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

tsjay · May 2004

I don't know what, if anything, is going to be different on the Wranglers for the 05's.

All of us who love the Jeep Wrangler fear some future changes that might be in the works. We are afraid government safety regulations might some day force changes in the Wrangler that will make it no longer be the fun vehicle that it is now. For instance, could be we won't be able to remove the doors on the future Wranglers, or maybe not even the tops!

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

gman1259 · May 2004

"In a desert climate it wouldn't be an issue."

I remember coming home from Lake Havasu one summer when I was a teenager. We were caught in a flash flood with the top off. Although there are fewer rainy days in the desert, these flash floods can happen a few times a year, and I have not seen a harder rain.

gman1259 · May 2004

I suggest getting a Sport or Unlimited loaded with all the options. Get it with the duel tops and a back seat. Even thought you may run with the hard top 8 months out of the year you may find the soft top useful for part of that. As far as a back seat: I was single once and can tell youyou may need the back seat. The back seats on the newer (03-04) Wranglers are made to easily fold forward or remove with out the need of tools. I have not removed my seats to verify how easy it is, but I do run with it folded forward a lot and its madder of releasing one lever.

gman1259 · May 2004

I used the hair dryer to take a sticker of a car I owned and it worked. However, it was a factory emblem, not an aftermarket sticker so I am not sure how well it will work on them.

99tj · May 2004

thanks!

drosketer · May 2004

Yeah, I kept that protective cover too - thought it may come in handy sometime. Thanks, it's something to consider... Speaking of those windows though, wow, do they ever scratch easily. I pulled the rear window off the other night while trying a few things and lo and behold - we've got scratch!

Heck, I was even trying to be careful. Oh well, nothing lasts forever I suppose.

Andrew

drosketer · May 2004

Something you might want to consider... not sure how much larger the previous set of tires were, but if you went from something like 35" to 30", your speedometer might be out. Also, if they had the gears changed for the larger tires, the gear ratios might be somewhat out. Mac or Tom is probably the man to ask about that though.

Andrew

mtngal · May 2004

Get the back seat, even if you don't plan on using it much. Mine sits under my stairs most of the time, but it is nice to have once in a while. There are 2 cotter pins that hold it in place, take them out then lift the seat out, reverse the order to put it back in. No tools or special skills required.

I've found I do use it once in a while, so it is nice to have available.

dchristo1 · May 2004

Tom,

Made hotel reservations today for a Memorial weekend trip to Turkey Bay. I plan on staying in Murray Ky. I'd enjoy meeting up with you to do some wheelin.I'll have my family with so BP gulch would probably be out of the question. But I'm sure there are plenty of trails to ride.

Interesting story.
It hailed yesterday evening about dinner time. The weather report predicted the hail in advance as severe. I have a two car garage and our new Odyssey takes up one space. My wife wanted me to park our(mine) 1999 Jeep in the driveway and take the 03 Maxima (which I use for business) and put it in the garage.

So, what did I do...

The Jeep was moved into the garage.

My wife thought I was nuts and couldn't understand why.

My daughter summed it up best. "But Mommy, Sara is a Jeep".(yes she named our Jeep)

It definately is a Jeep thing, my wife dosen't understand.

Hope to see ya soon,

David

tsjay · May 2004

SUPER! It's finally gonna happen, huh? Man, I am truly anxious to show you around Turkey Bay.

We'll just do the stuff you are comfortable with. If I want to play around somewhere and do some of the riskier stuff, you can watch and take pics.

It will be crowded on Memorial Day weekend, but we can still have a good time. Might not hurt to get to TB early, cause last year they were turning people away. Think that had to do with the fact that camping was allowed, but they are not going to allow camping at TB this Memorial Day weekend.

Let's make our firm plans ASAP.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

dchristo1 · May 2004

Tom,

I'm a morning person so early should not be a problem. I plan on arriving Friday the 28th in the morning (9:00am-10:00am) and staying until Monday.We are staying in Murray and am guessing it's 15-30 min trip to TB from there.

How's the OHV area system at TB work? I assume you need a voucher, or is it show up and first come first served.

Also, I'll email you my cell phone number so we can meet up. To say I'm excited is an understatement!

David

tsjay · May 2004

There's no such thing as reservations, just show up. You will pay a $15 fee, which gets ya three consecutive days of wheelin'. Not bad, huh?

Think you will need to allow at least that half hour you suggested for the trip from Murray to TB.

I find that I can get there around 9:15 to 9:30 without too much trouble, and that should be plenty early.

So, I should plan on wheelin' with ya Saturday and Sunday? Or, will the family most likely want to do something different one of the days? Maybe we just play it by ear and see how it goes?

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

barresa62 · May 2004

to take out in order to get the rear seat out of the Wrangler from 03' on. There is a parallel bar on the bottom of the seat frame that you squeeze toward the frame as you are pulling out the seat and, voila, seat out. Also, as mentioned earlier, the seat folds up with just a release of the handle at the top of the rear seatback. The whole seat folds and tumbles forward.

Stephen

dchristo1 · May 2004

Just got off the phone with the DNR at TB and she mentioned what you have already told me. $15.00 is a deal and 9:00am is no problem.

Plan on at least Saturday, I'd love to do nothing but Jeepin but my family may have other plans. Also this will free ya up for some more serious wheelin!

I sent you an email with my contact info. and I will keep in touch as the date grows near.

I can't stop smiling......

David

mtngal · May 2004

They've done away with the cotter pins? That's great, because I've always been afraid of losing mine. They aren't very big, and I carry them in the pouch with my owner's manual. I would lose them for sure if I tried to tape them to the seat itself.

I did know about the change in the seat release. It is easier to release it than the release I have, though I've never had much of a problem.

goducks1 · May 2004

I already lost one of my cotter pins and just bought two new ones for all of 30 cents at the hardware store. New ones are stiffer, I doubt they will come out easy at least I won't lose them.

Mtngal, oh fellow 98 Sport owner, I wanted to ask you--have you had to replace your clutch yet? And when did you have to replace your brake pads? I'm guessing that will be coming up eventually, I'm at 67K miles now and still on the originals.

barresa62 · May 2004

the Wrangler, the running changes w/o completely redesigning the vehicle. It seems to me that most of the changes that have been made on the TJ thus far have been useful. I have a friend with an 02'Sport and we have compared most of the changes. Changes such as the aforementioned rear seat releases, vents on the hardtop being moved to the tailgate, more plastic interior covering around the windshield/A-pillar areas, front seat redesign, exterior mirrors, etc. I like that we all (YJ & CJ owners included) have a vehicle that's instantly recognizable. There is some kind of solace and comfort in all that. :-)

Stephen

goducks1 · May 2004

>more plastic interior covering around the windshield/A-pillar areas

That's the only place I'd disagree with you. I noticed this change when I sat in a new TJ at the dealer--I prefer the painted metal to the plastic in those areas. Gives it more of an old CJ look. Everything else is an improvement. God knows I'd like side mirrors that didn't have the paint flaking off.

barresa62 · May 2004

Sorry..mostly just listing the changes. I didn't mean to say that they those specific ones were all for the better. I would have been fine with the painted metal look also. In fact, didn't even notice the difference until I sat in my friend's 02' :-)

Stephen

mtngal · May 2004

I'm still on the original clutch. I think I've got about 116,000 on the odometer (haven't checked recently - I keep it on the trip odometer mostly). I'm on the original clutch in the Taco, and that is now over 156,000 miles, but it is almost all highway, while the Wrangler sees easy off-road stuff. I haven't been out really playing anywhere since my excursion in the snow this winter - that's been too long!

I replaced both pads and rotors last summer. I think it was somewhere just over 100,000 miles. One of the rotors was just out of spec, so I decided to replace them with the pads. They were not giving me any indication that they needed to be replaced, but the wear was picked up on a routine maintenance tire rotation.

By the way, I've never owned a vehicle long enough before to worry about the clutch. How do you know when it is time to replace it?

mac24 · May 2004

By the way, I've never owned a vehicle long enough before to worry about the clutch. How do you know when it is time to replace it?

When it starts to slip............ :--)

The first sign will probably be when going up a hill in fourth or fifth gear. The engine rpm will start to increase but you won't be going any faster, and you may even slow down. From that point on, you may have a few tens or a few hundreds of miles of life left in it.

mtngal · May 2004

Thanks for the info - I've always wondered what I should look for. Since I am almost always going up or down hill, I'll probably know quickly.

My first reaction on reading your description was to think of the Taco - (giggle, giggle) do you mean slowing down more than normal going uphill? That 4 banger has rarely been able to maintain 70 without downshifting to 4th on the first part of the Grapevine...

greta · May 2004

Greetings; As aerodynamically smooth and sleek, (ha, ha.:),) as the Jeep Wrangler is, going down the road, can the aftermarket bug/hood deflectors, attached to the front edge of the hood actually do any good? Has there ever been anything like wind tunnel, air flow experimentation done to document the usefulness of those deflectors? Thanks for any advice. greta

erickpl · May 2004

I have a 97 and the clutch is still running great. The tranny is rock solid!

Had the exhaust manifold replaced a while back (just after the warranty mileage expired no less!

.

As for the back seat, I have not tried it on my 97 for quite some time, but I can't remember what I have to do to remove it. I have my amp under it so I'm in no hurry to remove it just yet, but I'd like the idea of putting SOME type of false floor behind the seat so I can hide the amp but still use it for storage w/o setting stuff directly on top of it.

-Paul

mac24 · May 2004

Do they:

Improve the aerodynamics in any significant way?

I doubt it.

Keep bugs off the windshield?

Depends on the size and weight of the bug. Generally the effect is noticable.

Protect the leading edge of the hood from stone chips and other similar impact damage?

Absolutely, 100%.

gman1259 · May 2004

Ya, I know. I have scratches already too. Not too bad though. The car wash I take my cars to wash the rear window after I told them not to, the first time I put the soft top on, and put a few scratches on it to. Still, like I said the scratches are not to bad.

wheelsdown · May 2004

mac or anyone else that might know. I have always comlpained that I do not seem to get as good gas mileage as most other posters here. At 21,000 plus miles, 6 cyl, plus auto, I have gotten an average of 14.05 mpg (I know the miles plus the total gallons I have put in it since new). I do have the bad habit of topping off more often than not. I seem to remember a post way back saying this could cause problems by loading up fume filters or something. Does anyone know if this could be causing a problem? Would the OBD have a code if it did? If so, shouldn't the check engine light come on.

Maybe I'm just doomed to live with the mileage I get. This is the first vehicle I have had that I could not beat the sticker minimum mileage by a considerable amount.

mac24 · May 2004

What's your tire size and final gearing? Have you ever checked your speedo with a GPS?

If it helps, I also have the 6 cyl and auto (with 31s and 3.73), and I average between 14 and 15 mpg with a speedo that's spot on. The Jeep always has the a/c on, and like me, is a little overweight.

I drive briskly but smoothly, i.e. when the lights turn red I don't carry on accelerating up to them in the hope that they'll go to green as I arrive, then have to slam on the brakes when they don't. I'll hang back and keep it rolling so I can sweep through as they change. It takes a lot more energy to start from a standstill than it does to accelerate from a slower to a faster speed. Just watch a 'big rig' in traffic. They rarely stop, just slow down and speed up. Also, I rarely go above 65 mph. Speeds below 50 mph give the best fuel consumption, but aren't really a practical proposition for most people.

Oh, and if you have a purge pump in your evaporative control system, you might suck some gas into the charcoal cannister if you fill the tank to the neck. If that happened the MIL would come on and it would throw a code. However, I doubt that your '98 has the pump unless it's a California spec vehicle.

Anyhow, back to my first three questions.

;--)

wheelsdown · May 2004

2000 TJ, stock tires - P215/75R15, 3.07 final drive. Speedo is 2/3 mph fast. I have not checked the odometer.

My driving habits appear similar to yours. I probably don't get as much A/C time per year as you do. Don't know about the purge pump.

Thanks,
Terry

goducks1 · May 2004

Not sure what year your Jeeps are, but unless they're pretty new, the automatics don't have an overdrive gear, right? That would certainly be the main reason why the people with the stick shifts here get better mileage. I think I run about 17-19mpg with 30" tires on there.

jacknimble · May 2004

I got about 16 on the highway this past weekend with a 2001 and auto. I was pretty surprised that it was that good. Drove it about 60 -65 mph through mountains here in western Arkansas.

I need to check it, but around time I probably get about 12-14. I think it may need new plugs though.

mac24 · May 2004

Unfortunately, as the speedo and odometer are linked, that means that your gas mileage is slightly worse than you thought. Your tire/gear combo is a reasonable match.

:--(

mac24 · May 2004

When calculating gas mileage it's important that you either go from 'tank filled to the neck' to tank filled to the neck', or that you do it over a high gallonage figure.

It's equally important that you correct your calculations to allow for the innaccuracy of most Jeep speedos, or fit the correct speedo gear to allow it to read accurately.

Most Wrangler speedos read too fast, thereby giving the impression of better fuel consumption and showing the warranty to have expired prematurely. The easiest way to check is with a GPS.

tsjay · May 2004

Yeah, Thelma Jane's speedometer/odometer is actually MORE accurate with the 31" tires than it was with the factory 30" tires. It was showing more miles than I had actually traveled when I had the factory 30's.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

mac24 · May 2004

Yes, quite right, it's the best gear for most 31s. The speedo averages about 8% too fast for 30" GSAs as standard. That's a lot of warranty miles saved for DC!

gman1259 · May 2004

I share goducts1 mileage. The best I have gotten was 20 mpgs with a 2004 auto. However, I usually get between 16 + to 19 mpgs, depending on how much in town driving I am doing.

I worked with a guy (whos name was Guy) who drives a 2000 with auto. If memory serves me I think he was getting around 16 mpgs average.

mtngal · May 2004

The speedo/odo being off on so many vehicles with stock tires is interesting.

When I had the stock 30" tires on my mileage would match what the SoCal Auto Club maps said - I could navigate without any problem (and it matched a couple of speedo check markers I took it through - haven't seen any of those in a couple of years, come to think of it). I still had the dash gauge problem when I put the Dueller AT tires on (also 30") and the odo wouldn't work long enough off-road to see if it was still accurate. The only time I've tried to navigate by it since I fixed the gauges, I wasn't using as accurate a guide and it appeared like the odo was off - I missed the turn because my odo said I hadn't gone far enough. Guess this is going to be a good excuse to get a GPS device!

I haven't tracked my gas mileage recently (like since the dash gauge problem started being more off than on), but it seems like it is about the same as it has always been - about 20 mpg if there is no wind and I don't spend much time in the city or feel pressured to drive faster than 65. I have a 5 speed Sport.

We're going to take the Wrangler into work - a friend of my husband is going to look at the AC. He said something about the H block. Does anyone know what that is - I'm totally clueless!

wheelsdown · May 2004

Thanks for all the comments. I think I'm getting it that I just have to live with it. No more moaning about it.

Terry

gman1259 · May 2004

One more thing about using the new soft top cover use to roll the windows. I also kept the tube that came in the box the windows came in. I use it to roll the windows around.

drosketer · May 2004

One more thing to chime in with (from what I have seen debated to no end elsewhere) - seems that the speedo and gearing for the Rubi models was modeled on 33" tires as opposed to the nearly 31" that come stock... While I haven't changed my tires to 33" or measured the difference with a GPS, others have. So, if you happen to be a rubi owner, you can rest assured that almost certainly you're going slower than what the speedo shows, and that your mileage is in fact worse than you may have calculated.

On the bright side, you might not get as many speeding tickets. ;-)

Andrew

drosketer · May 2004

Unfortunately I wasn't thinking and chucked it... ah well, will get some soft cloth to go between all the windows when I put 'em in there.

A.

guy21 · May 2004

I have a 2004 X that has about 3,500 miles on it. Recently, I noticed a fairly loud ticking noise from the rear body area after first starting the vehicle in the morning. It is like a loud clock going "tic-toc" that lasts for about the first two blocks of driving and then goes away. At first I thought it might be related to the fuel pump. Today, while the ticking was present, the radio would cut out as well. Station indicator light would work, but speakers would cut out. Any ideas on these problems or if they are related?

PS - Checked my odometer against the mileage markers on the freeway into town today. In 10 miles of driving, it was 0.1 mile short. 10 miles on the highway = 9.9 on the odometer.

gman1259 · May 2004

I use old (but clean) sheets between the windows. Seems to work fine. However, I think a felt cloth may be better.

Glen

tsjay · May 2004

Man, that noise is a mystery to me. Does the Jeep have to be moving in order to make that noise, or can you hear it when the Jeep is just idling?

After only a couple blocks the noise goes away, and you don't hear it again until the next cold start?

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

guy21 · May 2004

The noise occurs on cold starts in the morning whether the vehicle is standing still idling or moving. Like a loud wind up clock sounds. Today I got out, opened the tailgate and it seems to be coming from the area around or under the passanger side rear corner. Went away after a couple of minutes. No radio problems today.

tsjay · May 2004

OK, it almost HAS to be your tail pipe vibrating against something. I can't think of anything else that could possibly make a noise in that area with the Jeep not even moving. Metal expansion may explain why the noise goes away after the tail pipe warms up.

Try moving your tail pipe around a little when the noise is occurring. See if you can make the noise stop by getting the tail pipe in just the right position.

Let us know how this turns out.

Tom

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

P.S.

Just thought of something else... the fuel pump. It's in your gas tank, so that kind of goes along with where you think the sound comes from. Since you mentioned that radio problems go along with the noise (sometimes), it could be an electrical problem that effects the fuel pump.

But, why would that go away when the engine warms up???? Still think the tail pipe is the culprit.

Jeep Wrangler

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