Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

oldfarmer50 · August 2020

“Like I say $6000 CDN is equivalent to about $4000 USD, and I didn't check U.S. prices before.”

$4570 to be exact. I couldn't believe that the Canadian dollar was only worth 76 cents. But it is.

oldfarmer50 · August 2020

suydam said:

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:
If you do decide to get a home generator it will cost more than I was originally told. The electrician said a basic unit would be $4000, but that is just for the generator. He sent estimates for $14k for a basic one (heat, fridge, TV and lights.....hot water, stove I think) and $16k for one that will run a house.
Then i read don't use an electrician for this job, you need people who specialize in this....requires very specific knowledge....planning and getting approvals etc.
Nice fellow came on his motorcycle. Figured out it was easier to place the unit on the other side of the house hidden in the trees.....smart! He said normally a 2000 sq ft home should have a 20000 watt unit, but he could shave $1000 off using a 14000 watt unit....can do it because just 2 adults, and these days they can have a switch, so if for example we wanted to use the stove the unit will turn off the air conditioner. I understand Generac is #2, Briggs and Stratton #1, but this fellow does Kohler, not what I would choose but will probably be fine. They have installed over 500 units which is important to know. He planned it well really thinking through the best way to plan it...they look after all issues with gas lines etc.........$11000. I thought $5000 would be my top price or we would suffer through an outage, but Mrs D100 wants to have one.....and I am more on the fence, but starting to like the idea. Just have to remind myself it isn't my money....it's kids inheritance money.
Call it what you want, you’re being screwed. Like I said in a previous post, let the food spoil a dozen times or so and go to a hotel. Whether you want to admit it or not, putting up with you for years, your kids earned that money.

jmonroe

The last outage that lasted at least 3 nights was not pleasant. It was extremely cold, below freezing. The house held the heat for 2 nights...needed a coat to sleep on night 3. If the power didn't come on I was ready to go to a hotel, but some could have electricity, some not...and they tend to get filled up. Also, not a great way to live in a hotel room....two people and a dog. But, I think the threshold for me was $5000. But, if your electricity goes off for 3 days or more in freezing weather........who will be laughing then?
Wouldn’t a wood stove be cheaper with potentially unlimited fuel? (Think about using your neighbor’s trees). If it’s freezing put your food out on the porch.
Even counting just basic heating — and not all the other stuff that requires electricity— it is hard for a wood stove to heat many of today’s Large, high-ceiling homes. When we had our prolonged outage, combined with below 0 temps, the wood stove couldn’t come close to being sufficient. It was the holidays too so we had a full house. A friend who had power took our dogs, the vet took our cats, a couple of us with my 90 year old father camped in a hotel — one of the last rooms available — and the rest stayed in various college buildings that had power (about a third of the buildings did, including 2 dorms). It was crazy, but a great story to recount later, especially the heroic journey to pick up our daughter from the airport — normally a 45 minute drive that took 4 hours or more — and then she had to stay in a friend’s dorm room along with the friend’s parents! But it was a one-time thing, and other outages never lasted longer than a day, and never in such cold temperatures.

My grandfather had a very old house with one furnace located in the basement. Probably originally wood, then coal and finally oil by the time I came along. They heated two floors (10 foot ceilings) by having a series of grates in the floor/ceiling which hot air could rise up from the basement. No fans just convection. Probably uneven heating but I never noticed since I was busy getting yelled at for opening and closing the grates so I could spy on relatives from upstairs.

cdnpinhead · August 2020

I lived in a house like that back in the '50s in Grand Junction, CO. It was exactly as you described, and quite a few good memories there as well.

suydam · August 2020

We had one ranch style house with a walkout basement heated only with wood. 100 degrees in the basement near the stove, 60 degrees upstairs.

qbrozen · August 2020

ab348 said:

qbrozen said:

So $7749 for genny and switch... about $5425 USD.
My 14k generator and 200A ATS cost me $3200 total.
Sounds like quite a markup.
The costs driver quoted are in line with comparable estimates I’ve seen locally. Either you’re comparing apples to oranges or there is something else screwy in your numbers.

What I’m comparing, IMHO, is akin to buying your car parts online or buying them from the repair shop.

This is the place I got mine from. I don’t see mine there now, but here is an example that is even larger than the one quoted and is still about $1k-$1500 cheaper. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/briggs-stratton-40555-17kw-with-200amp-sed-service-entrance-disconnect-whole-house-symphony-ii-ats/

driver100 · August 2020

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:
If you do decide to get a home generator it will cost more than I was originally told. The electrician said a basic unit would be $4000, but that is just for the generator. He sent estimates for $14k for a basic one (heat, fridge, TV and lights.....hot water, stove I think) and $16k for one that will run a house.
Then i read don't use an electrician for this job, you need people who specialize in this....requires very specific knowledge....planning and getting approvals etc.
Nice fellow came on his motorcycle. Figured out it was easier to place the unit on the other side of the house hidden in the trees.....smart! He said normally a 2000 sq ft home should have a 20000 watt unit, but he could shave $1000 off using a 14000 watt unit....can do it because just 2 adults, and these days they can have a switch, so if for example we wanted to use the stove the unit will turn off the air conditioner. I understand Generac is #2, Briggs and Stratton #1, but this fellow does Kohler, not what I would choose but will probably be fine. They have installed over 500 units which is important to know. He planned it well really thinking through the best way to plan it...they look after all issues with gas lines etc.........$11000. I thought $5000 would be my top price or we would suffer through an outage, but Mrs D100 wants to have one.....and I am more on the fence, but starting to like the idea. Just have to remind myself it isn't my money....it's kids inheritance money.
Call it what you want, you’re being screwed. Like I said in a previous post, let the food spoil a dozen times or so and go to a hotel. Whether you want to admit it or not, putting up with you for years, your kids earned that money.

jmonroe

The last outage that lasted at least 3 nights was not pleasant. It was extremely cold, below freezing. The house held the heat for 2 nights...needed a coat to sleep on night 3. If the power didn't come on I was ready to go to a hotel, but some could have electricity, some not...and they tend to get filled up. Also, not a great way to live in a hotel room....two people and a dog. But, I think the threshold for me was $5000. But, if your electricity goes off for 3 days or more in freezing weather........who will be laughing then?
Wouldn’t a wood stove be cheaper with potentially unlimited fuel? (Think about using your neighbor’s trees). If it’s freezing put your food out on the porch.
Hard to run your stove, hot water, light bulbs or TV from a wood fireplace. Some refrigerated items may not do too well if they freeze....milk, eggs, possibly cheese, lettuce, tomatoes for example.
I agree, it is like ultra expensive insurance. Looks like we won't be going to Florida this winter, so that pays for about half of the generator....the rest is convenience, and it could be life saving....protection against severe cold and getting really ill.
On the contrary you can cook on top of a wood stove, heat water too. Use candles for light and tell ghost stories around the fire. As a kid when we would camp out in the winter we would put things like milk and eggs in an insulated cooler with a jug of water. The insulation and the latent heat of the water would keep things from freezing down to zero F. (-18 C).

Sounds like fun......might be able to heat a bit of water....not enough for a shower or bath unless you have one of those large kettles and make a fire under it.

driver100 · August 2020

qbrozen said:

ab348 said:

qbrozen said:

So $7749 for genny and switch... about $5425 USD.
My 14k generator and 200A ATS cost me $3200 total.
Sounds like quite a markup.
The costs driver quoted are in line with comparable estimates I’ve seen locally. Either you’re comparing apples to oranges or there is something else screwy in your numbers.
What I’m comparing, IMHO, is akin to buying your car parts online or buying them from the repair shop.

This is the place I got mine from. I don’t see mine there now, but here is an example that is even larger than the one quoted and is still about $1k-$1500 cheaper. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/briggs-stratton-40555-17kw-with-200amp-sed-service-entrance-disconnect-whole-house-symphony-ii-ats/

The one I see is discontinued and is marked down from $5000 to $4500. Nothing wrong with discontinued, but may not have the latest features like wi-fi. If ours goes on because the power was off....we get a cell phone message. The one in the link is only cheaper because of the dollar exchange rate.

driver100 · August 2020

oldfarmer50 said:
“Like I say $6000 CDN is equivalent to about $4000 USD, and I didn't check U.S. prices before.”

$4570 to be exact. I couldn't believe that the Canadian dollar was only worth 76 cents. But it is.

76 cents and expected to sink lower. When we bought the Florida place the Cdn dollar was 94 cents. A low dollar is good for the economy, you can make goods for a lower cost, and then export them and sell at a lower price....for example cars.

qbrozen · August 2020

driver100 said:

qbrozen said:

ab348 said:

qbrozen said:

So $7749 for genny and switch... about $5425 USD.
My 14k generator and 200A ATS cost me $3200 total.
Sounds like quite a markup.
The costs driver quoted are in line with comparable estimates I’ve seen locally. Either you’re comparing apples to oranges or there is something else screwy in your numbers.
What I’m comparing, IMHO, is akin to buying your car parts online or buying them from the repair shop.

This is the place I got mine from. I don’t see mine there now, but here is an example that is even larger than the one quoted and is still about $1k-$1500 cheaper. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/briggs-stratton-40555-17kw-with-200amp-sed-service-entrance-disconnect-whole-house-symphony-ii-ats/
The one I see is discontinued and is marked down from $5000 to $4500. Nothing wrong with discontinued, but may not have the latest features like wi-fi. If ours goes on because the power was off....we get a cell phone message. The one in the link is only cheaper because of the dollar exchange rate.

It is not just exchange rate. The quoted system is $7500 Canadian. At .76, that’s $5700. And we are still talking about 14kw for $5700. This one is 17kw for $4500. Is it really so hard to believe the installer is marking up the equipment? He’s not doing anything wrong. I’m merely pointing it out.

qbrozen · August 2020

If you’d prefer apples to apples, here is the Kohler 14kw with 200A ATS. It is $4k USD. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/kohler-14resal-200sels-w-200-amp-se-load-shed-ats/

imidazol97 · August 2020

About the Canada pricing... is there a sales tax on the Canadian purchase of the product and other parts? and on the service (labour) for installing same?

When we last visited Canada long, long ago, there was a 15% sales tax and then IIRC another low percent sales tax for the area where we were visiting, the province?

ab348 · August 2020

Where I live we pay a 15% sales tax on almost everything. Not sure what the % is in Ontario where Driver lives.

If those prices driver quoted include that it would explain part of the diff that qb is talking about but that aside, everything is more expensive up here. It is a pricey place to do business because of the higher minimum wage, the taxes on anything and everything, the govt bureaucracy being bigger and requiring lots of extra costs to comply with their regimes, and the smaller customer base compared to the US. I also do not know if there are any duties or tariffs on any of the items when they cross the border.

driver100 · August 2020

qbrozen said:
If you’d prefer apples to apples, here is the Kohler 14kw with 200A ATS. It is $4k USD. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/kohler-14resal-200sels-w-200-amp-se-load-shed-ats/

Exactly.....$6000 Cdn is as oldfarmer calculated $4500 USD....that one is $4000. But, these things aren't discounted up here, and we want to buy it from the guy who is going to install it. There are a lot of steps to coordinate, gas line has to be hooked up, a pad made, wiring in place etc., so I'd rather pay the guy installing it more so he is responsible for everything. I don't want to buy it from a discount place - which probably doesn't exist in Canada, and then try and coordinate the installation.

By the way, I like the way he quotes maximum pricing for gas hook up and electrical....it could cost less.

driver100 · August 2020

imidazol97 said:
About the Canada pricing... is there a sales tax on the Canadian purchase of the product and other parts? and on the service (labour) for installing same?

When we last visited Canada long, long ago, there was a 15% sales tax and then IIRC another low percent sales tax for the area where we were visiting, the province?

Yes, there is a provincial tax ( PST) and a federal tax (GST) and in most provinces these have been combined into Harmonized Sales Tax (HST) which in my province is 13%. Adds quite a bit to a $1000 item!

fintail · August 2020

CAD was at 70 cents and even marginally lower not long ago. It has gained ~10% on the USD in a short period, likely due to lame American covid response.

driver100 said:

76 cents and expected to sink lower. When we bought the Florida place the Cdn dollar was 94 cents. A low dollar is good for the economy, you can make goods for a lower cost, and then export them and sell at a lower price....for example cars.

fintail · August 2020

Hey, you get something for it though, right?

Here in WA sales tax is around 10%, and the cost of living is still yuuuge.

driver100 said:

Yes, there is a provincial tax ( PST) and a federal tax (GST) and in most provinces these have been combined into Harmonized Sales Tax (HST) which in my province is 13%. Adds quite a bit to a $1000 item!

qbrozen · August 2020

driver100 said:

qbrozen said:
If you’d prefer apples to apples, here is the Kohler 14kw with 200A ATS. It is $4k USD. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/kohler-14resal-200sels-w-200-amp-se-load-shed-ats/
Exactly.....$6000 Cdn is as oldfarmer calculated $4500 USD....that one is $4000.

Not sure what $6k Cdn is. Was that JUST the generator? It was $7500 for both genny and ATS, correct? I don't want to dig back through the posts just now. That $4k is both units.

You do what you gotta do, obviously. If it were me, I'd probably at least ASK if he'd be cool with me buying my own genny/ATS for him to install. That is, after finding out if you can even get it shipped to you in the first place.

isellhondas · August 2020

graphicguy said:

isellhondas said:
Up until about five yearts ago we had a wonderful old time Mom and Pop Hardware Store in the old part of town. they were friendly and knew everything hardware related. If you needed two screws for a project they would sell you TWO screws and not a box of 50 that you would never use!

Then Lowes came to town followed by Home Depot. They tried to stay in business and managed to hang on for quite a few years. Their "loyal" customers flocked to the Big Box stores while continuing to sing their praises of the Mom and Pop place that everyone loved. Singing and loving is just great but BUYING is something else.

Sadly they shut their doors. No more creaking wooden floors or a friendly person who not only had the parts to fix your lamp but took the time to show you how to fix it.

And the beat go's on.....
I think it’s more a factor of convenience.

I have two relatively close independent hardware stores. Do they have the selection as Lowe’s? No, but they carry Weber grills and not 6 brands of grills that essentially do the same thing as Lowe’s does.

Local hardware stores are easy to navigate and offer useful advice for any home repair or maintenance need I might have.

What I can’t do at my local hardware stores is buy 30 sheets of dry wall, or New flooring for the whole house, or get a new dishwasher.

But, for everything else, it’s easier and more convenient to go to my local store. Plus, they’ll actually walk you to the exact aisle or bin to find what you need. Try getting that at Lowe’s.

Each has their place!

I agree that each has it's place and I'm not knocking the big box stores.

Home Depot will be happy to sell you a Weber grill for less then the local guy will but when you need a new igniter for it Home Depot won't stock it or probably even know what it is but the local guy who lost the sale on the Weber because his was 15.00 more, HE will stock the igniter! Until he go's out of business anyway

oldfarmer50 · August 2020

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

jmonroe1 said:

driver100 said:
If you do decide to get a home generator it will cost more than I was originally told. The electrician said a basic unit would be $4000, but that is just for the generator. He sent estimates for $14k for a basic one (heat, fridge, TV and lights.....hot water, stove I think) and $16k for one that will run a house.
Then i read don't use an electrician for this job, you need people who specialize in this....requires very specific knowledge....planning and getting approvals etc.
Nice fellow came on his motorcycle. Figured out it was easier to place the unit on the other side of the house hidden in the trees.....smart! He said normally a 2000 sq ft home should have a 20000 watt unit, but he could shave $1000 off using a 14000 watt unit....can do it because just 2 adults, and these days they can have a switch, so if for example we wanted to use the stove the unit will turn off the air conditioner. I understand Generac is #2, Briggs and Stratton #1, but this fellow does Kohler, not what I would choose but will probably be fine. They have installed over 500 units which is important to know. He planned it well really thinking through the best way to plan it...they look after all issues with gas lines etc.........$11000. I thought $5000 would be my top price or we would suffer through an outage, but Mrs D100 wants to have one.....and I am more on the fence, but starting to like the idea. Just have to remind myself it isn't my money....it's kids inheritance money.
Call it what you want, you’re being screwed. Like I said in a previous post, let the food spoil a dozen times or so and go to a hotel. Whether you want to admit it or not, putting up with you for years, your kids earned that money.

jmonroe

The last outage that lasted at least 3 nights was not pleasant. It was extremely cold, below freezing. The house held the heat for 2 nights...needed a coat to sleep on night 3. If the power didn't come on I was ready to go to a hotel, but some could have electricity, some not...and they tend to get filled up. Also, not a great way to live in a hotel room....two people and a dog. But, I think the threshold for me was $5000. But, if your electricity goes off for 3 days or more in freezing weather........who will be laughing then?
Wouldn’t a wood stove be cheaper with potentially unlimited fuel? (Think about using your neighbor’s trees). If it’s freezing put your food out on the porch.
Hard to run your stove, hot water, light bulbs or TV from a wood fireplace. Some refrigerated items may not do too well if they freeze....milk, eggs, possibly cheese, lettuce, tomatoes for example.
I agree, it is like ultra expensive insurance. Looks like we won't be going to Florida this winter, so that pays for about half of the generator....the rest is convenience, and it could be life saving....protection against severe cold and getting really ill.
On the contrary you can cook on top of a wood stove, heat water too. Use candles for light and tell ghost stories around the fire. As a kid when we would camp out in the winter we would put things like milk and eggs in an insulated cooler with a jug of water. The insulation and the latent heat of the water would keep things from freezing down to zero F. (-18 C).
Sounds like fun......might be able to heat a bit of water....not enough for a shower or bath unless you have one of those large kettles and make a fire under it.

I like that modern take on the old cannibal joke.

omarman · August 2020

I like that modern take on the old cannibal joke.

"I Am Your Waiter Tonight, and My Name Is Dimitri"

driver100 · August 2020

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

qbrozen said:
If you’d prefer apples to apples, here is the Kohler 14kw with 200A ATS. It is $4k USD. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/kohler-14resal-200sels-w-200-amp-se-load-shed-ats/
Exactly.....$6000 Cdn is as oldfarmer calculated $4500 USD....that one is $4000.
Not sure what $6k Cdn is. Was that JUST the generator? It was $7500 for both genny and ATS, correct? I don't want to dig back through the posts just now. That $4k is both units.

You do what you gotta do, obviously. If it were me, I'd probably at least ASK if he'd be cool with me buying my own genny/ATS for him to install. That is, after finding out if you can even get it shipped to you in the first place.

Yes, $1749 for the ATS....I see, it is included in U.S. $4000. All kinds of problems getting it here though.....shipping, customs, paperwork....... It hurts that we pay so much more for the same goods in many cases, but, we have to work with what we got.

Just to give you one difference, the U.S. government minimum wage is $7.25 per hour, Florida's 2019 rate is $8.46. In Ontario the minimum wage is $14............almost double. Plus we pay more for universal medical. Don't want to get back on that one.....but, we definitely pay a lot more for most goods. I can get a can of tennis balls in the U.S. for $2.40, in Canada the same ones are $6! Life isn't fair. But, I won't complain, my best friend had a quadruple heart by-pass......medical bill $0!

driver100 · August 2020

fintail said:
Hey, you get something for it though, right?

Here in WA sales tax is around 10%, and the cost of living is still yuuuge.

driver100 said:

Yes, there is a provincial tax ( PST) and a federal tax (GST) and in most provinces these have been combined into Harmonized Sales Tax (HST) which in my province is 13%. Adds quite a bit to a $1000 item!

I'd say we pay more in sales tax and other taxes generally, but quality of life is good and universal medicare is definitely a big plus. Personally, I would rather pay more for goods and not get hit with a bill for a few $100000 for some operation I may need......but, that's just me.

fintail · August 2020

In general, you get what you pay for. I pay some, but relatively, not a lot. My medical coverage and potential bills speak to that - every time I skate, my deductible and coverage is on my mind. But I am sure it will all trickle down soon.

driver100 said:

I'd say we pay more in sales tax and other taxes generally, but quality of life is good and universal medicare is definitely a big plus. Personally, I would rather pay more for goods and not get hit with a bill for a few $100000 for some operation I may need......but, that's just me.

explorerx4 · August 2020

The other day I looked at the bills for my medical issue this year.
Total billed so far is just over 333k.
I've paid about 6k from my HSA.

qbrozen · August 2020

driver100 said:

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

qbrozen said:
If you’d prefer apples to apples, here is the Kohler 14kw with 200A ATS. It is $4k USD. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/kohler-14resal-200sels-w-200-amp-se-load-shed-ats/
Exactly.....$6000 Cdn is as oldfarmer calculated $4500 USD....that one is $4000.
Not sure what $6k Cdn is. Was that JUST the generator? It was $7500 for both genny and ATS, correct? I don't want to dig back through the posts just now. That $4k is both units.

You do what you gotta do, obviously. If it were me, I'd probably at least ASK if he'd be cool with me buying my own genny/ATS for him to install. That is, after finding out if you can even get it shipped to you in the first place.
Yes, $1749 for the ATS....I see, it is included in U.S. $4000. All kinds of problems getting it here though.....shipping, customs, paperwork....... It hurts that we pay so much more for the same goods in many cases, but, we have to work with what we got.

Just to give you one difference, the U.S. government minimum wage is $7.25 per hour, Florida's 2019 rate is $8.46. In Ontario the minimum wage is $14............almost double. Plus we pay more for universal medical. Don't want to get back on that one.....but, we definitely pay a lot more for most goods. I can get a can of tennis balls in the U.S. for $2.40, in Canada the same ones are $6! Life isn't fair. But, I won't complain, my best friend had a quadruple heart by-pass......medical bill $0!

So, why is that? I mean, if it all comes from China ... does Canada charge higher tariffs on Chinese imports and/or imports in general?

driver100 · August 2020

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

qbrozen said:

driver100 said:

qbrozen said:
If you’d prefer apples to apples, here is the Kohler 14kw with 200A ATS. It is $4k USD. https://www.nationwidegenerators.com/kohler-14resal-200sels-w-200-amp-se-load-shed-ats/
Exactly.....$6000 Cdn is as oldfarmer calculated $4500 USD....that one is $4000.
Not sure what $6k Cdn is. Was that JUST the generator? It was $7500 for both genny and ATS, correct? I don't want to dig back through the posts just now. That $4k is both units.

You do what you gotta do, obviously. If it were me, I'd probably at least ASK if he'd be cool with me buying my own genny/ATS for him to install. That is, after finding out if you can even get it shipped to you in the first place.
Yes, $1749 for the ATS....I see, it is included in U.S. $4000. All kinds of problems getting it here though.....shipping, customs, paperwork....... It hurts that we pay so much more for the same goods in many cases, but, we have to work with what we got.

Just to give you one difference, the U.S. government minimum wage is $7.25 per hour, Florida's 2019 rate is $8.46. In Ontario the minimum wage is $14............almost double. Plus we pay more for universal medical. Don't want to get back on that one.....but, we definitely pay a lot more for most goods. I can get a can of tennis balls in the U.S. for $2.40, in Canada the same ones are $6! Life isn't fair. But, I won't complain, my best friend had a quadruple heart by-pass......medical bill $0!
So, why is that? I mean, if it all comes from China ... does Canada charge higher tariffs on Chinese imports and/or imports in general?

Like the tennis balls....$2.40 in the U.S., $5.99 in Canada....hard to explain. Costs for everything are higher in Canada, shipping, wages, taxes, cost to advertise, rent a warehouse, etc. Economy of scale, the country has more land than the USA but the same population as California. The difference in the dollar is a big factor....30% off the top. Another is buying power....90% greater in the U.S. We have really bad relations with China too....so that is a hindrance. I believe Kohler generators are mostly made in the U.S. with parts from China and India....who knows what taxes and duties are added in.......and shipping these things to Canada costs a lot more.

Because there is less competition we don't have the low profit high volume dealers....I would imagine there is a branch office in Canada, they pay for the units, then add in their costs and profit margin. The same happens with TVs and computers, generally we pay the dollar difference plus a premium for being in a large lightly populated country, with major health benefits. It is the way it is, and nothing can be done about it. We buy most of our clothes in Florida because even with the exchange we probably pay half what we would pay in Canada. I do believe we buy fewer goods, and try to get by with things we really want or need.....have to be more selective.

imidazol97 · August 2020

I recall visiting buffalo 17 years ago and seeing all the boxes and clothing on the pavement at the shopping center on military road. We were told the canadians un pack what they bought to wear it back across the border. They made a mess of the parking lot. That way they didn't pay customs on the purchases.

abacomike · August 2020

@fintail

I applied the RainX and we had heavy rains today. The wiper blades skipped an chattered even worse than before. I guess Mercedes-Benz is hiding the fact that they have a problem with their design of the wiper system on E class cars. I got no help from their customer assistance or their MBUSA reviewers of problems. To say that my windshield wipers are performing as designed is a crock!!!

fintail · August 2020

That stinks. It almost makes me wonder if it could be a problem with the glass rather than the wipers - it seems blades along with adjustments would solve a wiper arm issue, but glass might be an issue no matter what. This winter when we have our long duration rains, I might try to make my own hybrid system (adapting aftermarket items) and see what happens - only thing holding me back is the expense, as I'll have to buy many blades.

Definitely a fail on MB's part, I think part of a massive design flaw, and typical corporate responsibility. Especially irksome as I love the car otherwise, and it has been virtually flawless save for this one irritant.

abacomike said:
@fintail

I applied the RainX and we had heavy rains today. The wiper blades skipped an chattered even worse than before. I guess Mercedes-Benz is hiding the fact that they have a problem with their design of the wiper system on E class cars. I got no help from their customer assistance or their MBUSA reviewers of problems. To say that my windshield wipers are performing as designed is a crock!!!

driver100 · August 2020

imidazol97 said:
I recall visiting buffalo 17 years ago and seeing all the boxes and clothing on the pavement at the shopping center on military road. We were told the canadians un pack what they bought to wear it back across the border. They made a mess of the parking lot. That way they didn't pay customs on the purchases.

The Outlet Mall in Niagara Falls N.Y. is busy with Canadians.....and if you wear the clothes back to Canada they probably won't realize they were purchased across the border. People go across every weekend to fill up with gas and buy groceries which usually aren't a problem. These days the laws aren't quite as stringent, so they probably wouldn't charge tax on $100 worth of clothes....definitely not for $100 worth of groceries.

Besides gas, clothes, generators and tennis balls we pay about double or more for alcohol too....ab knows a lot more about that. I don't mind, for the small amount I buy not a big deal, worth it to get others help pay for our medical system.

These days not too many would cross the border to shop....you have to quarantine for 14 days when you return....fines are up to $750,000!

roadburner · August 2020

I just got back from a week long vacation on Seabrook Island, SC. Nice condo, and our son joined us. He was going to ride back with us to KY because he had tickets for "Thurby"- the Thursday race date before the Kentucky Derby. Unfortunately it was announced on Friday that no fans would be admitted during the meet, so we dropped him off in Charlotte. The official cancellation excuse is COVID-19, but everyone knows that's not the actual reason, and I'll say no more about it.
As for cars in the Kiawah/Seabrook area, I saw very few domestic sedans or coupes, the ones I did see were mostly Cadillacs and the odd Lincoln. Some poor soul in the next condo over had a Chrysler 200(kill me now). Most every other sedan was either an Asian low-rent penalty box or an Audi. BMW, Lexus, or M-B. Most popular were CUVs/SUVs; the domestics were better represented in that group.
Nothing really unique or interesting; one X4 M CP was about it.
We drove the X1; here are the trip computer results for the week, including to and from our house:

Michaell · August 2020

Toyota Tacoma lease transfer:

https://forums.edmunds.com/discussion/57951/toyota/tacoma/2020-toyota-tacoma-lease-deals-and-prices#latest

oldfarmer50 · August 2020

driver100 said:

imidazol97 said:
I recall visiting buffalo 17 years ago and seeing all the boxes and clothing on the pavement at the shopping center on military road. We were told the canadians un pack what they bought to wear it back across the border. They made a mess of the parking lot. That way they didn't pay customs on the purchases.

The Outlet Mall in Niagara Falls N.Y. is busy with Canadians.....and if you wear the clothes back to Canada they probably won't realize they were purchased across the border. People go across every weekend to fill up with gas and buy groceries which usually aren't a problem. These days the laws aren't quite as stringent, so they probably wouldn't charge tax on $100 worth of clothes....definitely not for $100 worth of groceries.

Besides gas, clothes, generators and tennis balls we pay about double or more for alcohol too....ab knows a lot more about that. I don't mind, for the small amount I buy not a big deal, worth it to get others help pay for our medical system.

These days not too many would cross the border to shop....you have to quarantine for 14 days when you return....fines are up to $750,000!

Many European visitors stock up on products in the US that have heavy excise taxes back home too. But it’s not limited to foreign guests.

When we deliver cars to Brattleboro VT. there are always a few guys who insist on taking lunch across the bridge in New Hampshire where there is no sales tax on booze. Instead of grabbing a burger they go shopping for their favorite adult beverage. One guy was having a large house party (pre pandemic) and made inquiries on buying 40 gallons of whiskey. It was politely suggested that he come back in his own vehicle for that as the optics might not be too good.

abacomike · August 2020

fintail said:
That stinks. It almost makes me wonder if it could be a problem with the glass rather than the wipers - it seems blades along with adjustments would solve a wiper arm issue, but glass might be an issue no matter what. This winter when we have our long duration rains, I might try to make my own hybrid system (adapting aftermarket items) and see what happens - only thing holding me back is the expense, as I'll have to buy many blades.

Definitely a fail on MB's part, I think part of a massive design flaw, and typical corporate responsibility. Especially irksome as I love the car otherwise, and it has been virtually flawless save for this one irritant.

abacomike said:
@fintail

I applied the RainX and we had heavy rains today. The wiper blades skipped an chattered even worse than before. I guess Mercedes-Benz is hiding the fact that they have a problem with their design of the wiper system on E class cars. I got no help from their customer assistance or their MBUSA reviewers of problems. To say that my windshield wipers are performing as designed is a crock!!!

I feel the same way - I love the car except for this wiper problem on the windshield. It puts a sour taste in my mouth about Mercedes and how they handle consumer complaints that are truly flaws in their vehicles. They just put their head in the sand and make believe there is nothing wrong with their vehicles.

ab348 · August 2020

The chattering wipers really are a mystery. It makes me wonder if there is something about whether the linkage design or the torque of the motor is deficient. I would think that if both of those areas were robust enough, it would be impossible to have wiper chatter.

driver100 · August 2020

I doubt if any car maker would have treated your problem any different. These days companies don't care about long term customers - their only concern is the bottom line for the quarter. Customers aren't very loyal these days either, they switch brands instantly. I would still look for some kind of answer from the wiper manufacturer, it is really a problem they should be able to help with - I think they should investigate to see how they can improve wiper blades for MB and in general - if I was president of the wiper blade maker I would want to solve the problem - I'd send a rep/technician to your home! I may not be as particular but like I say, I don't recall ever having a problem with noise from wipers...chatter or squeal or anything.

roadburner · August 2020

It sounds like M-B has resurrected the BMW excuse that the old Service Managers would always parrot: “They ALL do that.”

ab348 · August 2020

driver100 said:

The Outlet Mall in Niagara Falls N.Y. is busy with Canadians.....and if you wear the clothes back to Canada they probably won't realize they were purchased across the border. People go across every weekend to fill up with gas and buy groceries which usually aren't a problem. These days the laws aren't quite as stringent, so they probably wouldn't charge tax on $100 worth of clothes....definitely not for $100 worth of groceries.

Besides gas, clothes, generators and tennis balls we pay about double or more for alcohol too....ab knows a lot more about that. I don't mind, for the small amount I buy not a big deal, worth it to get others help pay for our medical system.

(Skip this post now if you don't want to go down memory lane with Greg)

I remember when I was a kid in the '60s/early '70s and used to go with my parents on the annual road trip vacation to New England. Back then the value of what you could bring back across the border was $25/person unless you were in the US more than a week or 10 days, at which point it went up to $125 IIRC. It was exactly like what Driver talked about - we would buy clothes and then wear them immediately, so that they would be clearly used and/or dirty if they inspected our suitcases. The same with shoes, which were a really hot item to buy back then in Maine when Dexter and Bass shoe stores were doing well. Booze was about 1/3 of the price there than it was here in regular stores, forget about the New Hampshire and duty-free shops which were even cheaper. Same with tobacco.

The night before we crossed the border was when the parents did their strategizing in the motel room. Mom always found the US a good place to buy linens and towels in those days so those would get declared when you crossed the border. Anything else that could plausibly be deemed purchased in Canada or on a previous trip was not. You pretty much had to do it given the absurdly low allowance the Canadian govt allowed. I will never forget crossing back into Canada at Calais, ME/St. Stephen, NB one time with them when the agent decided to go through the car looking for whatever. He found nothing until he opened our Coleman cooler in the trunk and found a single can of Schlitz that dad had neglected to drink over the previous few days. He made him pour it out onto the pavement. Just petty.

imidazol97 · August 2020

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

imidazol97 said:
I recall visiting buffalo 17 years ago and seeing all the boxes and clothing on the pavement at the shopping center on military road. We were told the canadians un pack what they bought to wear it back across the border. They made a mess of the parking lot. That way they didn't pay customs on the purchases.

The Outlet Mall in Niagara Falls N.Y. is busy with Canadians.....and if you wear the clothes back to Canada they probably won't realize they were purchased across the border. People go across every weekend to fill up with gas and buy groceries which usually aren't a problem. These days the laws aren't quite as stringent, so they probably wouldn't charge tax on $100 worth of clothes....definitely not for $100 worth of groceries.

Besides gas, clothes, generators and tennis balls we pay about double or more for alcohol too....ab knows a lot more about that. I don't mind, for the small amount I buy not a big deal, worth it to get others help pay for our medical system.

These days not too many would cross the border to shop....you have to quarantine for 14 days when you return....fines are up to $750,000!
Many European visitors stock up on products in the US that have heavy excise taxes back home too. But it’s not limited to foreign guests.

When we deliver cars to Brattleboro VT. there are always a few guys who insist on taking lunch across the bridge in New Hampshire where there is no sales tax on booze. Instead of grabbing a burger they go shopping for their favorite adult beverage. One guy was having a large house party (pre pandemic) and made inquiries on buying 40 gallons of whiskey. It was politely suggested that he come back in his own vehicle for that as the optics might not be too good.

These folks are doing just what I would do if I lived in a place where costs were higher and I had the opportunity for a day trip into the US and shopping at a multifaceted outlet mall saving lots of money, then gasing up the car on the way back home. IIRC, the gas prices around that area were lower than other parts along I90 on our way up to Niagara FAlls.

I was, however, just stunned by the mess left. Many didn't bother trying to find a trash barrel for their castoff shoes and clothes and boxes. They just left them on the pavement. I'd never seen that at even a discount mall.

And many of the purchasers may not have been Canadians, because the tourist mix at the Falls area was yuuuuge as one might say.

imidazol97 · August 2020

ab348 said:
The chattering wipers really are a mystery. It makes me wonder if there is something about whether the linkage design or the torque of the motor is deficient. I would think that if both of those areas were robust enough, it would be impossible to have wiper chatter.

The problem may be MB puts a special coating on the windshield. I have trouble finding if the idea that they are giving their windows a special infrared or other coating on the surface or if that's just sizzle used to sell the steak.

In an earlier post I asked if MB used the same linkage setup for more than one model. That's a part that easily adapted to various applications since it's hidden except for the arms. The high ratio of the resistance over the force movement in the lever makes it susceptible to the static friction being much greater than the moving friction when the wiper successfully clears all the water and rubs on the glass. The moving end of the wiper goes a large distance compared to the small distance the lever arm hidden under the cowl moves.

I searched for "windshield wipers low friction" or similar words but decided not to post any of what I found. It would make for posts over 125 word limit.

Many have worked on various materials and patented the results.

But I still think it goes back to the linkage and the surface of the glass.

I'd try cleaning the windshield with a nice sudsy Dawn mixture, avoiding getting any on the painted surface because it's a great wax remover to use when using a clay bar.

Wipe the wiper blades with that or isopropyl alcohol.

I'd recommend Barkeepers Friend as a cleaner or very fine steel wool and soap, but some try to say there's a special coating "on" MB windshields to do something rather than a coating in the plastic layer between the two glass layers.

And wait for the next big rain.

There's hope, because if I recall correctly, Fintail found a type of wiper blade insert that solved the problem pretty much on his MB. However, different areas of the country may present different problems with the windshield and what's on it.

tjc78 · August 2020

I like the Dawn and alcohol idea. At least then you know there are no grease, oils or any other BS on there.

IMO car is too new to need steel wool or cleanser.

I know I’d be pretty upset with this especially on a high line car.

omarman · August 2020

When I lived in Maryland it was very common to make trips to the outlet stores in Pennsylvania where there was no sales tax on clothing. And smokers were making regular trips from Point of Rocks to Loudoun County Virginia to avoid the high taxes in Maryland. I remember when the governor at that time Parris Glendening threatened to have cars with Maryland plates crossing back from Virginia stopped and searched by the State Police for contraband cigarettes. Former governor Schaefer - also a democrat - called him the ayatollah. Hilarious!

abacomike · August 2020

roadburner said:
It sounds like M-B has resurrected the BMW excuse that the old Service Managers would always parrot: “They ALL do that.”

They said that to me on my first service visit to my dealer about the problem.

abacomike · August 2020

I posted the problem on MBWORLD.org and there are several posters there that are experiencing the same problem. Several posters stated that MB is coming out with a redesign of the wipers due to chattering and squeaking. So MBUSA lied to me knowing there is a design flaw but refuses to acknowledge that this is a design and engineering problem.

Pathetic!!!

jmonroe1 · August 2020

ab348 said:

driver100 said:

The Outlet Mall in Niagara Falls N.Y. is busy with Canadians.....and if you wear the clothes back to Canada they probably won't realize they were purchased across the border. People go across every weekend to fill up with gas and buy groceries which usually aren't a problem. These days the laws aren't quite as stringent, so they probably wouldn't charge tax on $100 worth of clothes....definitely not for $100 worth of groceries.

Besides gas, clothes, generators and tennis balls we pay about double or more for alcohol too....ab knows a lot more about that. I don't mind, for the small amount I buy not a big deal, worth it to get others help pay for our medical system.
(Skip this post now if you don't want to go down memory lane with Greg)

I remember when I was a kid in the '60s/early '70s and used to go with my parents on the annual road trip vacation to New England. Back then the value of what you could bring back across the border was $25/person unless you were in the US more than a week or 10 days, at which point it went up to $125 IIRC. It was exactly like what Driver talked about - we would buy clothes and then wear them immediately, so that they would be clearly used and/or dirty if they inspected our suitcases. The same with shoes, which were a really hot item to buy back then in Maine when Dexter and Bass shoe stores were doing well. Booze was about 1/3 of the price there than it was here in regular stores, forget about the New Hampshire and duty-free shops which were even cheaper. Same with tobacco.

The night before we crossed the border was when the parents did their strategizing in the motel room. Mom always found the US a good place to buy linens and towels in those days so those would get declared when you crossed the border. Anything else that could plausibly be deemed purchased in Canada or on a previous trip was not. You pretty much had to do it given the absurdly low allowance the Canadian govt allowed. I will never forget crossing back into Canada at Calais, ME/St. Stephen, NB one time with them when the agent decided to go through the car looking for whatever. He found nothing until he opened our Coleman cooler in the trunk and found a single can of Schlitz that dad had neglected to drink over the previous few days. He made him pour it out onto the pavement. Just petty.

I admit that’s pretty petty but did your dad really think he’d get away with the ole Coleman cooler hideaway trick? But, I guess that was better than your mother trying to smuggle monogrammed towels from the Motel 6 in there. Might still be waiting to hear from the parole board for doing that.

jmonroe

fintail · August 2020

Do you remember where the discussion was about the redesign? I'd be curious to know more about that.

This issue has been a thing for years. On my first W212, also my first new car, I took it in within 6 weeks of purchase for juddery wipers. They gave me a new set under warranty, no problem. A month later, juddery again, and again they gave me a new set. Third time, they told me pretty much the "they all do that" and to deal with it. To their credit, they also checked the wiper arm angle/tension etc. They probably did all they were allowed.

At least with that car, I was able to build my own solution, but it isn't possible on later models.

abacomike said:
I posted the problem on MBWORLD.org and there are several posters there that are experiencing the same problem. Several posters stated that MB is coming out with a redesign of the wipers due to chattering and squeaking. So MBUSA lied to me knowing there is a design flaw but refuses to acknowledge that this is a design and engineering problem.

Pathetic!!!

driver100 · August 2020

jmonroe1 said:

ab348 said:

driver100 said:

The Outlet Mall in Niagara Falls N.Y. is busy with Canadians.....and if you wear the clothes back to Canada they probably won't realize they were purchased across the border. People go across every weekend to fill up with gas and buy groceries which usually aren't a problem. These days the laws aren't quite as stringent, so they probably wouldn't charge tax on $100 worth of clothes....definitely not for $100 worth of groceries.

Besides gas, clothes, generators and tennis balls we pay about double or more for alcohol too....ab knows a lot more about that. I don't mind, for the small amount I buy not a big deal, worth it to get others help pay for our medical system.
(Skip this post now if you don't want to go down memory lane with Greg)

I remember when I was a kid in the '60s/early '70s and used to go with my parents on the annual road trip vacation to New England. Back then the value of what you could bring back across the border was $25/person unless you were in the US more than a week or 10 days, at which point it went up to $125 IIRC. It was exactly like what Driver talked about - we would buy clothes and then wear them immediately, so that they would be clearly used and/or dirty if they inspected our suitcases. The same with shoes, which were a really hot item to buy back then in Maine when Dexter and Bass shoe stores were doing well. Booze was about 1/3 of the price there than it was here in regular stores, forget about the New Hampshire and duty-free shops which were even cheaper. Same with tobacco.

The night before we crossed the border was when the parents did their strategizing in the motel room. Mom always found the US a good place to buy linens and towels in those days so those would get declared when you crossed the border. Anything else that could plausibly be deemed purchased in Canada or on a previous trip was not. You pretty much had to do it given the absurdly low allowance the Canadian govt allowed. I will never forget crossing back into Canada at Calais, ME/St. Stephen, NB one time with them when the agent decided to go through the car looking for whatever. He found nothing until he opened our Coleman cooler in the trunk and found a single can of Schlitz that dad had neglected to drink over the previous few days. He made him pour it out onto the pavement. Just petty.
I admit that’s pretty petty but did your dad really think he’d get away with the ole Coleman cooler hideaway trick? But, I guess that was better than your mother trying to smuggle monogrammed towels from the Motel 6 in there. Might still be waiting to hear from the parole board for doing that.

jmonroe

Motel 6 towels are good.....since they are free you don't pay any duty on them

driver100 · August 2020

ab348 He found nothing until he opened our Coleman cooler in the trunk and found a single can of Schlitz that dad had neglected to drink over the previous few days

I'll try to keep it short but it could get The Old JMonroe kind of long;

*About 6 years ago we drove to Sarnia Ont...picked up my SIL and BIL, going to cross the border at Port Huron Michigan, and take a train to Chicago for the weekend....just $50 round trip for seniors.
*Got to the border at 5:30 a.m., one line had about 6 cars, the other had a sign that said "Fast Lane". I asked if everyone had their NEXXUS cards....they did so I went to the fast lane which was empty.
*The U.S. customs guy didn't like that we used the Fast Lane...it was for trucks though there was no NEXXUS lane.
*He sent us inside. The customs guy was angry asking me if I had studied the rules in the 2 inch thick Nexxus rule book. He told me he was typing up a report and this had better not happen again. He could make it so none of us would ever get into the U.S. again - don't forget we have a home there, I didn't want to mention that.
*We had a train to catch, he told me to sit down next to the other 3 while he typed up his report - I am thinking this guy must have had a big argument with his wife this morning! BTW, if you don't know....they have absolute and total control, you can't win with them, they can do whatever they want, even take your car apart.
*He put on his latex gloves and that was really scary as he walked toward me. He walked past me thank goodness and went out to the car. My SIL was going to bring an apple to eat on the way....that would have got us barred for life if she did that, I didn't know if it was in the suitcase.
*He came inside, typed some more, called me over and lectured me again about reading the 2 inch thick manual and told me again how he could bar me from ever getting into the U.S. again. I had to fill out a document saying I wasn't bringing any produce into the country, I got this far so I said NO and hoped my SIL forgot the apple.
*We raced out to the car and I sped to the train station where we just made it to our train before it left the station. You could see he took everything out of our suitcases and threw it back in....a total mess.
*I asked my SIL why she would bring an apple across the border and she said they buy groceries in Port Huron so she bought the apple in the U.S., she should be able to return it to the U.S. I explained it doesn't work that way, they don't know where she bought the apple.

The incident has never been mentioned, haven't had problems at the border since....I wonder if they really try to scare you when you first get your NEXXUS card, to keep you in line.

abacomike · August 2020

fintail said:
Do you remember where the discussion was about the redesign? I'd be curious to know more about that.

This issue has been a thing for years. On my first W212, also my first new car, I took it in within 6 weeks of purchase for juddery wipers. They gave me a new set under warranty, no problem. A month later, juddery again, and again they gave me a new set. Third time, they told me pretty much the "they all do that" and to deal with it. To their credit, they also checked the wiper arm angle/tension etc. They probably did all they were allowed.

At least with that car, I was able to build my own solution, but it isn't possible on later models.

abacomike said:
I posted the problem on MBWORLD.org and there are several posters there that are experiencing the same problem. Several posters stated that MB is coming out with a redesign of the wipers due to chattering and squeaking. So MBUSA lied to me knowing there is a design flaw but refuses to acknowledge that this is a design and engineering problem.

Pathetic!!!

Here is the link I read - make sure you read all posts to determine those who indicated a redesign

https://mbworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=791625&goto=newpost

oldfarmer50 · August 2020

driver100 said:
ab348 He found nothing until he opened our Coleman cooler in the trunk and found a single can of Schlitz that dad had neglected to drink over the previous few days

I'll try to keep it short but it could get The Old JMonroe kind of long;

*About 6 years ago we drove to Sarnia Ont...picked up my SIL and BIL, going to cross the border at Port Huron Michigan, and take a train to Chicago for the weekend....just $50 round trip for seniors.
*Got to the border at 5:30 a.m., one line had about 6 cars, the other had a sign that said "Fast Lane". I asked if everyone had their NEXXUS cards....they did so I went to the fast lane which was empty.
*The U.S. customs guy didn't like that we used the Fast Lane...it was for trucks though there was no NEXXUS lane.
*He sent us inside. The customs guy was angry asking me if I had studied the rules in the 2 inch thick Nexxus rule book. He told me he was typing up a report and this had better not happen again. He could make it so none of us would ever get into the U.S. again - don't forget we have a home there, I didn't want to mention that.
*We had a train to catch, he told me to sit down next to the other 3 while he typed up his report - I am thinking this guy must have had a big argument with his wife this morning! BTW, if you don't know....they have absolute and total control, you can't win with them, they can do whatever they want, even take your car apart.
*He put on his latex gloves and that was really scary as he walked toward me. He walked past me thank goodness and went out to the car. My SIL was going to bring an apple to eat on the way....that would have got us barred for life if she did that, I didn't know if it was in the suitcase.
*He came inside, typed some more, called me over and lectured me again about reading the 2 inch thick manual and told me again how he could bar me from ever getting into the U.S. again. I had to fill out a document saying I wasn't bringing any produce into the country, I got this far so I said NO and hoped my SIL forgot the apple.
*We raced out to the car and I sped to the train station where we just made it to our train before it left the station. You could see he took everything out of our suitcases and threw it back in....a total mess.
*I asked my SIL why she would bring an apple across the border and she said they buy groceries in Port Huron so she bought the apple in the U.S., she should be able to return it to the U.S. I explained it doesn't work that way, they don't know where she bought the apple.

The incident has never been mentioned, haven't had problems at the border since....I wonder if they really try to scare you when you first get your NEXXUS card, to keep you in line.

That’s BS.

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