Lease Questions - Ask Here

CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Tomwannabmw, BMW will not publish money factors and residual values for the 2004 3-Series until they arrive in showrooms. For information on leasing this car, you are going to have to check back with me then.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Anonymousposts, are the advertised Ford leases that you saw in this weekend's newspaper being run through Ford Motor Credit? They have not published any 60 month lease money factors or residual values that I have seen. Perhaps the dealers that are advertising 60 month leases (manufacturers themselves rarely advertise leases of this length) are running them through banks other than Ford Motor Credit. There are lots of independent banks out there that offer leases on vehicles.

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anonymousposts · February 2003

I thought it said "based on Ford Credit approval". I also know a couple of people who leased for 60 months through what they say is Ford Credit but I (and they) could be wrong.

CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hello Patrick. I am glad that you find this discussion so helpful. In order for me to give you an idea of what the lease rates and residual values for the models that you are interested in should be like, I am going to need you to tell me how long you plan on leasing them for and how many miles per year you need to be able to drive without having to pay a lease-end penalty. Once I have those additional details I will post the information that you are looking for.

The relatively new, at least in some areas, Red Carpet Option program that Ford is running is essentially a balloon note program. Balloon notes are similar to leases in that they provide low monthly payments with an end of term purchase option, however with balloon notes the person who took out the loan has their name on the vehicle's title, rather than the bank. Balloon notes have completely different interest rates than leases do. Unfortunately, I do know keep tabs on balloon note programs because they are not that commonly used. However, Ford Motor Credit and a number of other banks have been making these loans much more readily available lately, especially in states such as Rhode Island, Connecticut, and New York where the vicarious liability laws have been exposing them to all sorts of frivolous lawsuits in connection with leased vehicles. If their popularity increases significantly enough I may have to start keeping tabs on balloon note program parameters as well and have to open some sort of "Balloon Note Questions Ask Here" discussion

.

Anyhow, once I have the additional info from you I can help you out. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hi cubby4. Hmmm, I've never heard of the 9-2, is is a new small car from Saab. Just kidding

, I know that you are talking about the 9-3. I would be more than happy to provide you with information on this car. As far as its price goes, you can look up its Edmunds.com True Market Value by clicking on the following link: 2003 Saab 9-3 Linear Pricing Page.

Saab publishes a new lease program every month. Given the fact that February has just started I have not had an opportunity to take a look at their newest lease program for this car yet. Please feel free to check back with me with a quick reminder towards the end of the week and I should have all of the details of their new program and would be more than happy to share them with you.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Squirrel, you've got questions and I've got answers. Nissan's residual values are different for every Altima trim level, but they typically only have two sets of lease money factors for this car, one set for the Altima 2.5 and one for the Altima 3.5. So if you change your mind on the exact Altima that you are interested in it is best to check back with me for the correct factors and residual values for the new model. If you have switched models, you may want to wait a few days before asking me for the new information because Nissan's January lease program is only scheduled to run through today. I should have the details of their new February program by late this week.

In answer to your second question, if the price that was used to calculate the sample lease payment in the ad that you saw is higher than the price that you would qualify for through the Supplier Purchase Program (which is most likely the case), then you will be able to get a lower lease payment on it than the one that is featured in the ad.

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bradlake1 · February 2003

Hi Carman:

My wife has decided on one of three vehicles. So I would be grateful if you could help me with MF/residual for the following:

2003 A6 2.7t(quattro)
2003 Mercedes Benz C320 Sports Coupe
2003 Mercedes Benz C320 Sport Sedan 4matic

We are in Atlanta and would like info for a 3&4 year 12&15 mile per lease. TIA

jpatrick4 · February 2003

Car_Man,
Opps. Sorry about that. Both cars are for 3 years lease with 12,000 miles per year.
The 2003 Focus SE, and ZX5
The dealer kinda sounded like Ford was only giving the Red Carpet Option as an option. Other Ford dealer websites in NY were only listing RCL factors and had no refrence to Red Carpet Option stuff.
Also, is possible to get Numbers for Toyota RAV4, 3 yr lease with 12,000 miles. And is Toyota running any special finance deal on purchasing. We've lease a couple of cars and it might be time to buy.
Thanks again,
Patrick

kywon · February 2003

Carman-

You helped me in August last year when I leased a Saab 9-5 Aero. Thank you for that. Now I have a friend who I'm helping lease a WRX Wagon. Could you please give me this month's money factor and residual in California on a 36-month, 12k mi lease. Also it appears that there's a rebate on the car. Can you give me the amount?

Thank you very much.

Ky-Won

mg330ci · February 2003

I'm currently on month 10th out of a 36 month lease and the following question has come to my mind!

Is it possible to pay in advance the rest of a lease and thus, avoid paying further interest and taxes on the interests?

Any advantages or disadvantages?

multiplechoice · February 2003

Hi Car_man,

I would like to get the MF and residual figures for the ES 300. Looking at 36 and 39mo programs at 12K/yr. I'm in Southern California. Thanks!!

rivertown · February 2003

Hi, Car_Man

I saw a post about a lease for $159/mo. for a '03 Civic EX sedan. That was for 5-speeds, 48 months, $1000 cap cost reduction, security deposit, TT&L. The poster thought it was low.

In terms of the mechanics of leasing, how do you think they did that? Discount on MSRP?

TY

CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hi bradlake1. Here is the information that you are looking for. If you were to lease a 2003 Audi A6 2.7T through Audi Financial Services this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual values should be .00110 and 52%, respectively. Their 4 year numbers for an otherwise identical lease should be .00120 and 46%, respectively. This car's 12,000 miles per year residual values should be 2% higher for leases with only 12,000 miles per year.

As far as the Mercedes-Benz models go, if you were to lease a 2003 MB C230 Sports Coupe through Mercedes-Benz Credit Corp. this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should be .00250 and 56%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical 4 year lease of this car should be .00265 and 48%, respectively. If you were to lease a 2003 C320W 4Matic through MBCC for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, their base factor and resid should be .00250 and 58%. The 4 year numbers for this car should be .00265 and 51%. All MBCC leases with only 12,000 miles per year would have residual values that are 2% higher than the ones that I just mentioned.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

No problem, Patrick. I believe that Ford is still writing leases in the state of New York, but they have threatened to quit doing so very soon if the laws that permit vicarious liability lawsuits do not change. If you were to lease a 2003 Ford Focus Sedan SE in your neck of the woods right now for 3 years with 12,000 miles per their base lease rate and residual value should be 6.25% and 43%, respectively. Their numbers for an otherwise identical lease of a 2003 Ford Focus Hatchback ZX5 should be 6.25% and 46%, respectively. These lease rates may be converted into approximate lease money factors for the purpose of calculating lease payments by dividing them by 2400. In addition to these special lease rates, Ford is providing $1,000 lease cash on the 2003 Focus that may be used to reduce its capitalized cost. As far as the RAV4 goes, I have not seen Toyota's February lease program yet, so you are going to have to check back with me in a few days. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Welcome back, Ky-Won. How do you like your 9-5? According to the informaiton that I have seen, if your friend were to lease a 2003 Subaru WRX Wagon through their captive finance company this month for 3 years with 12,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should be .00200 and 53%, respectively. I have heard that there is $500 dealer cash available on this model, but I do not believe that it may be used in conjunction with Subaru's special lease program.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hi mg330ci. Unfortunately is is not possible to convert a normal lease into an advance pay lease once you have signed your contract and have begun making payments. Even if you were able to do so, as strange as it sounds banks still charge interest on advance pay leases, just a slightly lower amount than they charge on regular leases so you would not be making out as well as you had hoped.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hey multiplechoice. Lexus' January lease money factors and residual values were scheduled to expire on February 3rd. I have not had an opportunity to take a look at their new program yet, but suspect that I will by late this week. Please feel free to check back with me then with a quick reminder and I would be more than happy to let you know what I have been able to find out.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hi rivertown. Actually Honda is currently advertising a $159 per month with $999 down lease (4 years, 12,000 miles per) on the 2003 Civic LX Sedan w/automatic transmission. They are able to provide such a low payment on this car because they just dramatically cut their lease money factors for it. This is a great deal on this car and if you were to comparison shop a little bit I wouldn't be surprised if you were able to get one for a little less than this advertised payment.

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icdchess · February 2003

Car_Man...
I was considering an X-type to replace my S-type
(need 4 WD). I called my dealer and he mentioned new lease rates good till April. Can you get me the new money factors and residuals (New York) on the 2.5 and 3.0 for 36 months and 15,000 miles? Thanks!!!
Steve

rivertown · February 2003

TY, Car_Man

bradlake1 · February 2003

Thanks Carman for the info. Are the rates the same for the NEW C320 coupe (vehicle I am seeking info for)as they are for the C230 Kompressor coupe? TIA

jpatrick4 · February 2003

Thanks Car Man for the lease info. Would you happen to know if on a Buy they are offering $2000 Cash Back or specila rates. If I take the $2000 what would the rate be? 3yr/4yr/5yr Buy?

Thanks, Patrick

troyy2k · February 2003

I will take delivery of an FX35 AWD with premium package this Friday. I would like to know what the lease figures would be if I were to lease this vehicle for 48 months at 12,000 miles per year. If possible, could you please tell me what the figures are for a 42 month lease? Thanks!

CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hey Steve. You should be able to get a pretty good deal on a Jag X-Type right now. Its sales have been brutal, which is interesting because I think that it is a pretty nice car. I know several people who own them and enjoy them very much. Here is the information that you are looking for. It you were to lease a 2003 Jaguar X-Type 2.5 through Jaguar Credit this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should be .00118 and 50%, respectively. The numbers for an otherwise identical lease of a 2003 Jaguar X-Type 3.0 should be .00076 and 51%.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

You're welcome, rivertown.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Actually Mercedes-Benz has different lease money factors available for the 2003 C230 Sports Coupe and the 2003 C230 Kompressor. The latter has slightly more lease support. It's 3 year factor is .00210 instead of the .00250 for the C230 Sports Coupe.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

No problem, Patrick. Ford is providing $2,000 customer cash on purchases of the 2003 Focus or 0.0% special financing for 3 to 4 years and 1.9% for 5 years. These two programs may not be combined, but Ford is offering around $1,250 customer cash that may be combined with 2.9% special financing for 3 years, 3.9% for 4 years, and 4.9% for 5 years. If you opt for the $2,000 customer cash then you would likely be best off financing this car through a bank other than Ford Motor Credit. Interest rates in general are very very low right now, especially on new car purchases. As long as your credit is in good shape, you should not have any trouble finding an independent bank with relatively attractive interest rates.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Congratulations on your new ride, troyy2k. You certainly are going to be one of the first ones on the block to have an Infiniti FX45. Unfortunately, I have not seen their February lease program, I am not even positive that it has been released yet. I will look around and let you know if I am able to find what you are looking for.

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bottgers · February 2003

My lease company called me and told me I could buyout my lease any time between now and the end of my lease, which is in June. They offered me a buyout price of $8900, which they said is negotiable. I went into as many web sites as I could find to come up with a retail value of my vehicle, and the average reatil is about $6500. I wouldn't mind offering them this amount for the buyout, because I could probably sell it for close to this, unless you know how I could talk them down more. Remember, I'm looking to get out of this car loosing as little money as possible. I know I'm not going to break even or make money on the deal. How do I go about geting them to accept my offer?

The next step is to avoid having to pay sales tax. I could probably get a dealership to work with me on this by agreeing to purchase a new vehicle from them after I sell this one. The problem is, I don't quite understand how it works. I know if the dealer purchases the vehicle, they don't have to pay sales tax, but how do I get ownership of the vehicle from the lease company through the dealership? Wouldn't I still have to pay sales tax when it goes from the dealer to me? I don't get how this works. Thanks.

'98 Intrepid (non-ES model)
Moonroof
CD
ABS brakes
63K miles
Fair condition

bradlake1 · February 2003

Carman:

Thanks for the info on the Audi / Mercedes Benz lease rates. Were the Audi rates you shared with me for January or Febuary? I received a call from my Audi dealer saying the rates expired yesterday and the new rates have not been posted. Basically, I am being told the "great" deal expires today. Thanks for any insight. As you can tell we are persuing the Audi.

kywon · February 2003

Carman-
Thank you for the info on the WRX.
I really like my 9-5 Aero. It's FAST! I got it after my lease on my Saab 9-3 Convertible expired. I was sad to see that car go, but I decided to get a more "practical" car due to having 2 kids, and I wanted an automatic.

Anyway, a friend at work just leased an Infiniti G35 but the dealer went through Wells Fargo, not the Infiniti finance company. 2 cars ago, I leased a Honda and it was also through Wells Fargo, not Honda finance. Also, my Saab 9-3 lease was through Chase.

In a case where the finance company isn't subsidizing the lease on a car, I would guess that there are certain times where it makes sense to go to a lessor other than the manufacturer one. Is there any downside to leasing from someone other than the captive finance company? The only one I can think of, from my experience, is that I didn't get the option to turn in my lease early.

Finally, I'd like to compare my friend's G35 lease through Wells Fargo to what you are showing for the Infiniti program. Could you please give me the money factor and residual on a G35 for a 4-year, 48k mile lease? Thanks Carman.

Regards,
Ky-Won

CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

You're welcome, remy725.

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ryoken · February 2003

Carman,

Since you're looking up G35's, can you throw in the numbers for a 3yr, 12k mi/yr? (Sedan.)

Thanks.

bottgers · February 2003

........no response to my earlier post?

cstabile · February 2003

I need some help....I'm looking for the Feb lease rates (money factor & residual %) for a VW Passat GLX Automatic - 36 months, 15,000 miles per year. Also, is the $500 dealer incentive or some other customer cash rebate really applicable to this car when leasing? My local dealer told me the $500 only applies to purchases, not leases.

bradlake1 · February 2003

O where, O where are you CARMAN? O where, O where did he go?

I am going to the Dealership this evening to lease an 03 Audi 2.7t, Auto, Premium, Luxury, Bose, Parktronic MSRP $45400 (not including destination). I am looking for 48mo /12mi. $551 per month (including tax). $0 down, just the mandatories.

Also, I have $600 Audi Loyalty money to apply to the deal.

Your thoughts??

CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

You're welcome, Brad. Audi's January lease program was originally scheduled to run through March 4th. Even though your dealer tried to light a fire under you by claiming that their attractive lease program was about to expire, late yesterday Audi actually enhanced their lease money factors on the majority of their models without altering their residual values. Under the new program, if you were to lease a 2003 Audi A6 2.7T for 4 years with 12,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should be .00120 and 54%, respectively.

It is difficult for me to evaluate the deal that you have been offered without knowing the price that they are charging you for this car. I can tell you that Audi revised their owner loyalty program this year so that all returning customers who get a new A6 now receive $1,000 cash. Let's work some numbers and calculate a sample lease payment for you. Since you have not provided me with this car's selling price, I will base its capitalized cost on a $2,100 discount from MSRP. According to the Edmunds.com True Market Value information on this site that is a typical discount for this model. So if you were to lease a 2003 Audi A6 2.7T (MSRP: $45,400 / Cap: $45,400 - $2,100 discount - $1,000 loyalty cash = $42,300) through Audi Financial Services this month for 4 years with 12,000 miles per, your zero down, pre-tax monthly lease payment should be right around $451 or so.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

No problem, Ky-Won. The 2003 Infiniti G35 is a great car. I especially like the looks of the coupe, but of course a 2-door vehicle is not very practical for people with families. Even though it is not as sporty looking, the G35 sedan is a nice ride as well. I am not surprised that the dealer that your friend got their G35 from ran the lease through a bank other than Infiniti Financial Services. Infiniti has not provided any sort of lease support on the G35 since it was introduced, and I don't expect them to in the near future. As is often the case with vehicles that do not have lease support, it would not surprise me if some independent banks were providing a more attractive lease program on the G35 than IFS is right now. There are many reputable independent banks out there that consumers lease through all the time. The only down side that I see to leasing through a non-captive bank is that they are occasionally a little tougher on excess wear and tear charges at lease end. Of course how strict they are will vary from bank to bank and I have not heard anything negative about Wells Fargo. If you have leased though them in the past without having any problems then I personally don't see anything wrong with doing so again. Unfortunately, I can not give you information on IFS' program for the sake of comparison because I have not seen their February numbers yet. I may have an idea of what they new program is like early next week if you would like to check back with me then.

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bradlake1 · February 2003

The actual selling price is $42300.

CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hey bottgers. There is no guaranteed way for you to get your bank to accept the offer that you make them to purchase your leased vehicle. The first thing that you need to do is to make sure that you are speaking with someone who has the authority to negotiate with you. Lessees' initial contacts at dealerships often can not work with them on their car or truck's price. If that is the case, work your way up the corporate ladder a few rungs until you find someone who does. It also is important to have a realistic purchase price in mind. It probably would be a good idea for you to hop on over to the "Real World Trade-In Values" discussion over on the Smart Shoppers Message Board and ask one of our most knowledgeable community members, Terry, if he would be hind enough to tell you what similar cars are going for at auction. As far as the sales tax issue goes, I am not sure how you can avoid paying sales tax on your car if you decide to purchase it at lease end. If you buy it directly from the bank that you are leasing it through you will have to pay tax on it. You would have to pay tax on it as well if you were to have a dealer buy it from your bank and then buy it from them.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

No problem, bradlake1. Good luck at the dealership tonight.

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CarMan@Edmunds · February 2003

Hello cstabile. Here is the information that you are looking for. If you were to lease a 2003 Volkswagen Passat GLX Sedan through VW Credit this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should be .00140 and 53%, respectively. In mid-January Volkswagen introduced $500 dealer cash on all of its 2003 models. This cash may be used in conjunction with their special financing rates on all 2003 VWs and in conjunction with their special lease program as well on the 2003 Volkswagen Jetta and Passat.

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cstabile · February 2003

Thanks Car Man. That's very helpful.

cstabile · February 2003

Every state is different of course. But I live in VA and when we lease a car, we get stuck paying the sales tax on the agreed upon price of the car (not just the sum of the lease payments). So, effectively, when I leased my wife's jetta, we had to pay the sales tax up front (I guess we could have rolled it into the monthly payments, but that is beside the point).

The point is, when we purchased her car at the end of the lease, we just brought the original lease paperwork with us to the DMV and showed them that we already paid the sales tax. They said OK and we just had to pay some small fees (less han $50) to title and register the car.

Here's a link to the VA DMV web site that deals with titling and paying sales tax. On this page there is another link whose page lists those circumstances when you are exempt from paying sales tax. See item #26 - it specifically deals with not paying sales tax when you purchase an auto at the end of lease.

http://www.dmv.state.va.us/webdoc/citizen/vehicles/sut.asp

squirreljam · February 2003

Car_Man the guru:

Are you able to share yet the MF's and RV%'s from Nissan's Feb program for an Altima? We're in St Louis Mo, looking for term of 36 mo. If it's ok, gotta couple permutations:
-2.5 SL 12 & 15k miles/year
-2.5 S 12 & 15k miles/year

This is for my wife's car; I'll probably be back for info on one for me soon... Thanks for all the good stuff,
Squirrel

bradlake1 · February 2003

"Under the new program, if you were to lease a 2003 Audi A6 2.7T for 4 years with 12,000 miles per, their base lease money factor and residual value should be .00120 and 54%, respectively."

Hi Carman:
Just returned from the Dealer w/o the 2.7t. I went in to the Dealership armed w/ all the info you provided. They were not aware of the loyalty cash amount but were adament that the residual had not changed from the 48% reported in January. I shared with them the present residual info of 54% that you reported above. Can you confirm for me the residual for 4 years / 12K miles for the 03 Audi 2.7t? I am wondering if they are trying to increase profit. THanks Again!!

bottgers · February 2003

......for any state to charge sales tax on a leased vehicle. You're not buying it, you're just renting it. We don't pay sales tax on monthly home rentals, why should we pay it for vehicle rentals? Makes no sense. I also don't see how states can get away with charging sales tax on a vehicle every time it's purchased by another owner. If a vehicle is sold and bought 20 times before it hits the junk yard, the state collects a sales tax each of those 20 times. This is ridiculous! The only time sales tax should be collected on a vehicle is when it's purchased new from the dealer.

cstabile · February 2003

live in Virginia. Seriously though, you should take a real close look at your states rules on the sales tax issue. The local dealers here in VA told me that there was no way to avoid paying the sales tax twice. They were definately wrong. Best part is, our end of lease purchase price was pretty low so we bought the car from VW and sold in in one week for $1200 more to a guy buying the car for his daughter who was going off to college. He got a good deal, I got some extra cash.

chrish11 · February 2003

Hi CarMan,

Please advise MF and res for Audi A6 Avant in PA 3yr/15k per yr.

Thanks!

chrish11 · February 2003

Hi CarMan,

Please advise MF and res for Town and Country in PA, 3 yr, 15k mi per year. Not sure of trim...EX, LX or LXi...?

Thanks!

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